So I am a professional developer at a company nothing to do with the mobile market.
In my spare time I am planning on learning android / playing around with it and publishing applications that I have written for myself that I find useful.
Are there any resources that describe how to setup a company etc for any payments received from Google Marketplace? I am not expecting to make any money at all, however there is a 0.000000001% chance that if I end the year with a small amount to reap that I don't want the tax man jumping down my throat and sending me to jail.
I am UK (England) based. I expect to release 90% of code that I do release as Open Source / Free, on the other hand there is occasionally the opportunity that only a fool would not turn down to make some financial gain even if I know its going to be slight.
Please don't flame about OSS / prop. I am asking a honest question if there is a how to guide anywhere or people can give there experiences.
(I have not signed up as developer yet so its possible that inside googles internals there is this information but quick google doesnt give me anything and I cannot find anything on the boards.)
Many thanks in advance.
Not sure but I'm sure you could just get a standard business license from your state or province and that should cover you till you make some real money. Then you could think about incorperating or going LLC.
I realise that this is very much a "how-long-is-a-piece-of-string" type question, but I'd really like to get some idea of the costs and time involved in developing an app for the Android market compared to the iPhone.
My understanding is that it doesn't cost developers to submit apps to the Android Marketplace (as opposed to the iPhone Developer’s Program which costs $99 a year). So there's a saving there.
But in terms of development costs, would you suggest that hiring a developer to create an Android app would be cheaper because the market's smaller? Would it make no difference at all? Would it be harder to find a developer to code for Android?
Basically, any thoughts anyone has on this would be really appreciated.
Cheers,
Why don't you try and find out? Ask some (android)developers what app x would cost and ask some (iphone)developers the same
for most applications it should be cheaper to hire an Android programmer because you develop in standard Java and this is the most widely used language in computer science education. Eclipse is also a standard development environment many young programmers are familiar with. Even I was able to code my first Android application in a matter of minutes.
Objective-C on the other side is a nieche language. Of course, every good progammer can learn that language in a couple of hours or at least days but there are definitly more experienced Java programmers out there and they can reuse code (snippets). Java code is so ubiqitous you can find for a lot of problems coded and tested solutions. So two reasons: there are much more Java programmers out there and they can develop faster. Specific Android experience is not needed as long as you don't want to program kernel extensions or things like that.
But I guess the Apple-market is still more profitable because Apple users are trained to spend money. So even as it may cost more to develop it also brings in more revenue. I hope the sheer amount of Android handsets out there will outweigh this advantage soon.
Humm .. i think this is a tricky question.
While it will definitely be cheaper to develop an application for android, the question you might want to ask (depending on what you want to do) is what is the ROI of an Android application versus and IOS application.
And even then, depending on the type of application & the demographic your app will be targeting (not to mention usability, design, general app quality) the response will likely vary quite a bit too.
But globally yeah, it's cheaper and less a hassle to make an android app i'd say. ..then again, i have an allergy to apples, and this is an android forum after all
robert_tlse said:
Humm .. i think this is a tricky question.
While it will definitely be cheaper to develop an application for android, the question you might want to ask (depending on what you want to do) is what is the ROI of an Android application versus and IOS application.
And even then, depending on the type of application & the demographic your app will be targeting (not to mention usability, design, general app quality) the response will likely vary quite a bit too.
But globally yeah, it's cheaper and less a hassle to make an android app i'd say. ..then again, i have an allergy to apples, and this is an android forum after all
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Hehe, I agree on that Robert.
ten chars!!!
You can also spend many months developing an iPhone app, only to have it rejected by Apple for no good reason. That's quite expensive.
It is, however, unescapable that there are a lot of iOS users who buy a lot of apps from the App Store, so the potential ROI is higher. There's also only a few platforms to develop for (although this is becoming increasingly less the case).
Would like for Android to have more focus though; it's getting there!
(The diminutive term "app" does irk me slightly - Apple have popularised it in relation to phones when they convinced everyone that the iPhone was the first phone to support third-party software. Guess it's stuck now though.)
then why are Android apps more expensive??
Android apps aren't more expensive. They have by far the largest proportion of free apps on any mobile platform and even those that do cost are comparatively cheap.
Android will probably be easier and cheaper to develop for..the only concern people have with Android is fragmentation...aka when developing you gotta decide which versions and up to develop for and choose the appropriate functions for the documentation. Of course in the end all the old devices will upgrade eventually and be compatible anyways..
My hope is though Apple lets 3rd party development tools back in...cause that way you can use Adobe AIR and make an App for both Android and iPhone at the same time....How I wish for cross platform app development...but Apple will fight it till the and cause if they don't they will loose one of their biggest advantages...
In my opinion Android is just now getting to the average joe especially in the United States. Older people are even trying the droid line of devices since there are so many to choose from now on all carriers (vs 1 iphone on AT&T forever just revised of course) So yeah, even people here in hicksville, MO USA are even trying it out go figure. If everyone hasn't heard of HTC or Android, they're definitely being introduced to it now through the Galaxy S series since it's on almost all carriers and has some snazzy media buzz.
With all these new cells and tablets coming out I give it a mere 2-3years and everyone will know our lil green droid dude globally, and use it on multiple devices around the house. Just my theory. I'm sure the Marketplace will grow 10/fold in that time, peace!
I guess there are a few things to keep in mind:
Politics:
1) Apple tries to regulate what is permitted to be installed on their phones. They don't provide any real guidelines, nor do they tell you in advance if your application will be accepted. You'll only discover after submitting your app that it isn't permitted. So they waste your time, and numerous high end projects have developed their application only to discover Apple blocks them because "they are duplicating functionality" *cough competing*. Yes, lots of money has been lost.
2) Apple is Non-Disclosure Agreement overload. Send an email to apple and it always says "this information is confidential". Basically, Apple's agreement is so bad (unless it's changed recently) that they can cancel the account/sue you any time they wish. That increases your risk further.
3) iPhone's can be jail-broken to install 3rd party apps, but many people wont. Even if the Google store wont accept your app, they can manually install it, or you can use another store... Without jailbreaking.
4) Many developers often complain of long delays getting their apps approved, and when removed from the store by Apple, they have to flood Apple with emails for reason's why. On android, you don't even need to use the App store, in fact, Android has the benefit of allowing paid apps to be sold in countries with export restrictions (because they can sell it via other means).
5) Piracy is possibly more rife on Android, however, Google are apparently implementing an API which allows apps to check if they were purchased for that phone, which should strongly reduce piracy once available (because it means that dodgy stores will need to actually crack the programs). Once this is implemented, hopefully it will stop the jackass spammers from selling pirated stuff.
Development Process:
1) iPhones use objective C, Android uses Dalvik. Dalvik is VERY similar to java, one simply needs to learn the differences. Objective C is also quite easy to learn though, but it probably takes more experience to do well (because c++ doesn't have the idea of selectors). If you try creating apps on the iPhones without using objective C originally though, your app might be removed. On android, frankly, Google doesn't give a damn provided, it works.
2) Big win for Android here, the Android SDK works on Linux,Windows AND OSX. It integrates with eclipse which already has a large user-base. Whereas, you need to buy a mac for code for the iPhone, and the SDK is OSX only.
3) That being said, you can make a cross-platform webapp that can be sold for both, but the user needs to be online.
4) Objective C is compiled code, whilst Java is bytecode. Bytecode can run as fast as compiled (with some initial overhead). Native sounds great, but if Apple ever does a processor change for their phones, it might be a world of hurt. If massively-multicore mobile processors are released, Android is probably better suited. That being said, by then, you'll probably need to fix some things in your app anyway because of API changes.
Actual sales:
1) Apparently in the past, you would have sold more in the Apple market. However, in the past, Android mobiles were actually quite rare because Android stunk. Froyo is probably the first Android OS that can compete against iOS effectively because it now supports JIT. There is also a much greater emphasis on Android these days in advertising, and I see more Android advertising than iPhone. Possibly inaccurate predictions suggest they will overtake the iPhone in 2012 too.
2) Sales figures don't represent profit though (so whilst iOS may generate more still, it's less than Apple claims). A google market account costs $25, whereas an Apple iPhone development account costs $99. Furthermore, you need Apple equipment to code for the Apple market (which can be significantly more expensive than PC's), and there is no estimates done to determine profits lost by being rejected from the Apple app store (there have been major projects which cost thousands to develop which have been rejected). So greater overheads on the Apple store, which means for cheap/quick apps, you are probably safer developing for Android (especially if you don't already own a mac).
My opinion:
For me, developing major apps is too high risk for iPhones. Although, if your app is approved, there are potentially bigger payoffs than Android. For small apps which don't have a predictable further, you may earn more on Android because of lower overheads. If you app is rejected for iPhone though for competing, you wasted weeks/months of your life, and need to use a 3rd party store (since only hacked phones can use them though, you dramatically decrease your sales instantly).
Anyway, my thoughts are that by the end of the year, everyone will know what Android is, and you may start to see manufacturers getting together to launch MAJOR campaigns to promote Android, especially since they now all have a common enemy (Apple basically took a cheapshot at other major manufacturers to justify their design flaw). Apple is only a small guy when it comes to manufacturing phones, and so it's as though they threw a few tiny pebbles at a team of football players to show off. Of course, some of those football players have already started retaliating, and it just depends on how annoyed they got.
Personally, I think iPhone would be great if they didn't do the "anti-competitive" thing they always do, but as it stands, I am now doing my Oracle/Sun SCJP, and hope to get into Android coding soon. If Apple starts acting less evil though, I will take another look in their direction, but they are mistreating the users they need the most, the developers. It's a pity, because Apple really has potential.
Source: I haven't sold any apps on either market yet, but I have mostly decided on developing for Android.
Developing new iPhone app looking for developer
I have a cool iPhone app idea it's a very simple game that I could like to create I am looking for a developer in the Los angeles area I am new here so please if your interested or can redirect me to the right person I would appreciate it thank you...email me with any info
I was reading an article today about the hottest jobs in IT for 2012 and "Mobile Application Developer" was one of the 3 careers listed as a hot field.
Over the past decade I have felt that IT Development has been a tough job market because of all the global outsourcing.
I realize there are many devs in this forum, some do it as a hobby, some create apps to sell through Android Market etc for either money or ad revenue, and some work at the enterprise level and are also involved here for hobby or for other business/personal reasons
When I am thinking career in Android Dev I am thinking enterprise level... working in corporate supporting/developing mobile apps for employee/client/customer productivity, to basically improve business processes
http://www.metro.us/newyork/life/article/1029481--the-hottest-it-jobs-for-2012
I created this post hoping to get some feedback from devs... on their opinion of mobile application dev as a career prospect - would you recommend it to someone in college, someone later in their career etc?
Thanks.
Although I don't currently possess the skills contribute to the development of a custom OS or update patches, I do plan to learn and am very willing donate to those who are willing to keep our Pebbles alive and relevant well into the future.
Kudos to all that are ready, capable and willing to tackle the challenge. I am almost certain that I am not alone in these sentiments.
Update (2016-12-16):
A former Pebble employee has created a script to all the mass export of folk's apps and will, once the servers go down, start a new instance to allow the bulk import of all that app development. (Bulk CloudPebble Project Export - https://www.reddit.com/r/pebble/comments/5h61om/bulk_cloudpebble_project_export/)
Also, a free PDF of "Learning C with Pebble" is available and I hope to dive into it soon. (Pick up your free copy of the Book "Learning C with Pebble" - https://www.reddit.com/r/pebble/comments/5h6s1s/pick_up_your_free_copy_of_the_book_learning_c/)
All the best!
Hear hear... I'm sure the fans and users will keep the pebble alive.
jmunr017 said:
Although I don't currently possess the skills contribute to the development of a custom OS or update patches, I do plan to learn and am very willing donate to those who are willing to keep our Pebbles alive and relevant well into the future.
Kudos to all that are ready, capable and willing to tackle the challenge. I am almost certain that I am not alone in these sentiments.
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I'm hoping that pebble users will fight back by keeping our pebbles alive for a long time.
I'm saddened immensely. ?
I got the very first pebble. I loved it and I was a Kickstart backer for pebble time.
I was in total shock when I first learned of pebble discontinuation. I was in shocked.
Why was this. It makes no sense.
So we will have a watch and it won't be supported. Essentially we'll have a device that will be frozen in time and will no longer be updated and that's it. Done.
This totally sucks.
I'm never going to purchase anything from Kickstarter period there's no sustainable value to back them up.
Very upset, and disheartened
KP
Fitbit has got most IP of Pebble software, it depends on them to release or not the source code for Pebble hardware, I think?
Fitbit bought Pebble precisely to kill it. There won't be any pebble development, source code or anything else. Pebble does not exists anymore, Fitbit only acquired some brains and intelectual property, not the brand, the products or commitments to existing customers. Effectively yesterday, there is no pebble. Even the app, if you reinstall clean on a new phone, you will notice there is no login to pebble account, because there isn't any. It will configure as a local app with google fit sync, but int's only one way sync, from the app to google fit, not the other way arround.
It is sad, but as many things in tech world today, you are not buying a product, you are buying associated services, and these can disappears unexpectedly. Then the product becomes just a piece of black plastic or, if lucky a pretty expensive electronic watch.
crisagatie said:
Fitbit bought Pebble precisely to kill it. There won't be any pebble development, source code or anything else. Pebble does not exists anymore, Fitbit only acquired some brains and intelectual property, not the brand, the products or commitments to existing customers. Effectively yesterday, there is no pebble. Even the app, if you reinstall clean on a new phone, you will notice there is no login to pebble account, because there isn't any. It will configure as a local app with google fit sync, but int's only one way sync, from the app to google fit, not the other way arround.
It is sad, but as many things in tech world today, you are not buying a product, you are buying associated services, and these can disappears unexpectedly. Then the product becomes just a piece of black plastic or, if lucky a pretty expensive electronic watch.
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I respectfully disagree that there won't be any development. There is a strong community of users to find new innovative ways to keep legacy devices alive. It's the driving force of XDA and what brings a lot of us here.
Here's an exchange that I had with a Pebble app developer after I just donated to him for his watchface.
I wrote, "Please keep writing apps for Pebble! It can use all the developer support it can get now. Thanks so much!"
And he replied, "Thank you so much for your support! And yes I won't stop! Like Katharine (former head of Pebble dev team) put it: "We will keep coding for these Pebbles until batteries die!""
TL;DR - there's still a future for Pebble watches.
Sorry, I meant official development. Of course community will keep things going for as long as possible. But already is a thread on Reddit and users report devs withdrawing apps from pebble app store. The store will probably be gone soon, as nobody will pay for cloud services and server side functionality will phase out. It will not be instant, but unless some entity will not see the business benefits of keep going (and that means money), it will eventually die.
crisagatie said:
. Even the app, if you reinstall clean on a new phone, you will notice there is no login to pebble account, because there isn't any. It will configure as a local app with google fit sync, but int's only one way sync, from the app to google fit, not the other way arround.
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I installed the Pebble app 2 days ago, for the first time. It let me create an account, no problem
^ this. created new account and logged in fine.
kparikh82276 said:
I'm never going to purchase anything from Kickstarter period there's no sustainable value to back them up.
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Don't you think that's a little extreme? They had a good, long run, and then they were acquired by another company. Neither you nor they nor anybody else could have predicted how this went down back when they got going. I hope you do continue to support new technologies - it's the only way we'll move forward.
bradyarz said:
Don't you think that's a little extreme? They had a good, long run, and then they were acquired by another company. Neither you nor they nor anybody else could have predicted how this went down back when they got going. I hope you do continue to support new technologies - it's the only way we'll move forward.
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It may be extreme, but they developed a movement then sold it. So now the pebble os is more..
In few months to years.... What am I going to do with my pebbles.... They won't be useful with newer versions of OS
It just was very disappointing. So that is why I will not hold my breath for a Kickstarter company. Pebble was a trailblazer but how they fizzled.... I'm still trying to wrap my head around this