Hello,
I saw somewhere on some PocketPC application that was lowering down frequency of CPU if device was unused - because of saving battery.
(sorry for my poor english)
I'd like to ask you if:
- is it possible and working (saving energy)?
- isn't it unhealthy for CPU?
Maybe I am just wrong but it sounds cool to me.
Thanks for answer!
iv heard of that before, i think its called *speed stepping* dont quote me on tht.and intel use it on there cpu's but i dont knw if a phne would support such a thing.it does and would save enerrgy by reducing the clock speed of the cpu it can use less volts at the core etc
now that you have said that...i wonder if you could over clock the cpu on a ppc???
would void warranty and the usual but would be good for certain handsets.
sorry i havent actualy answered ur question though
D
4n60 said:
Hello,
I saw somewhere on some PocketPC application that was lowering down frequency of CPU if device was unused - because of saving battery.
(sorry for my poor english)
I'd like to ask you if:
- is it possible and working (saving energy)?
- isn't it unhealthy for CPU?
Maybe I am just wrong but it sounds cool to me.
Thanks for answer!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There is no way to Overclock the Kaiser so there will be no way to Underclock the Kaiser from what i have read.
4n60 said:
- is it possible and working (saving energy)?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes for some PocketPCs, but it's depending on the CPU, and there's currently no solution for the Kaiser.
4n60 said:
- isn't it unhealthy for CPU?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nope. I've over/underclocked most of my previous PDAs.
However I was more often overclocking than underclocking, as those devices are already slow enough. Unless you use it like an MP3 player for hours without doing anything else, with screen off, and where you know you need long battery life, it's just not worth having to put up with a device that is slow as hell for minor savings. There's not only the CPU drawing power there - even slowing it down by 2 won't save you much more than 10-20% power when in normal use with screen on... the backlight will already draw more than the CPU at normal speed.
Actually you might end up using more energy with the device underclocked, as you'll be staring at that lit up screen for longer while it *tries* to do what you asked it to
When "unused" as you mentioned in the title - which I understand would be when it is in your pocket doing nothing - the CPU is already in sleep mode and not running, so no such savings possible here.
Thanks for replying...
I was overlocking too some of my ppcs but it wasn't useful everytimes... (freezing etc...)
I was worried about underclocking - I don't have any experience with this...
Ok, now I got it.
Well - cool and fast PDA = daily charging...
Thanks again...
BTW: I can't turn off backlight in my kaiser. It isn't possible ?
4n60 said:
Thanks for replying...
BTW: I can't turn off backlight in my kaiser. It isn't possible ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No unfortunatly it's not possible. This is my first PDA which does not allow to turn off the backlight. You can just put it as low as possible.
You may not be able to shut off the backlight, but with S2U2, you can set it to lock when you shut off the screen, thus allowing you more power saving.
But as for idling saving you power, if you have TCPMP player, you'll notice that it can read the processor speed somewhere below 400MHz. The processor's designed to automaticly adjust to save power. I once saw mine running at 195MHz.
It may not be possible to manually control, but it does do it automaticly. And underclocking actually increases the life span of the CPU.
Hey everyone, there is an overclocking app in the market, anyone care to give it a try?
Edit: So I downloaded it lol. Here are some screenshots. BTW, is there anyway I can verify that the cpu freq is actually being adjusted?
*Just for fun I ran neocore to see if it would raise my FPS. lol.
just notice the difference in speed. If you notice please post. And its not overclocking its just clocking. Overclocking will be beyond 528 MHz
Gameloft said:
just notice the difference in speed. If you notice please post. And its not overclocking its just clocking. Overclocking will be beyond 528 MHz
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The app is called Overclock, you can argue with the developer about the name not me.
Anyways, I do notice a very nice speed increase.
For example, atrackdog would take me at least 20-30 seconds to load my full app list (184 apps)
After installing overclock, it loaded in under 5 seconds.
i'll run other programs, and post my results.
I ran droidgear (game gear emulator) before and after, and I can honestly say it was faster (not a placebo affect).
-Before: droidgear would take over 4 minutes just to get to the menu screen
-After: i was actually able to load a game in under 1 and a half minutes, I even let it sit to run the demo, and it is the fastest ive ever seen an emulator run on this device (compared to NesEmu, and GB emu)
It would probably actually be playable if tweaks were made to the application codebase, and android Open GL stack.
Also, the camera loads instantly after pressing the camera button and via the icon in the home screen.
well, i was too, and then i downloaded it and said "aahh, what the hell, if i break mine, ill just take my wifes haha..." probably not the best of plans but i installed it anyway
sooo i havnt burnt up my phone yet, but here is my issue with the app, does the app only work untill you reboot your phone?
because when i reboot my phone, it goes back to the default speed according to the app
also, my phone tends to hang up (stuck on the apps screen, no buttons work, screen wont rotate, power button wont shut screen off) when using the 528MHz
so far, i havnt found a reason to pay a dollar for it, but ill keep testing
[UPDATE]
resolution for all below tests is 320 x 480
i tried neocore like posted above, using the mid level setting, and i actually did raise my fps from
DEFAULT CPU (248 MHz): 20.5 (with sound off)
384 MHz: 25.0! (with sound off)
DEFAULT CPU (248 MHz): 14.5 (with sound on)
384 MHz: 20.8 (with sound on)
still havnt gotten the fast speed to work yet, but im still trying to figure that out, on another note, sweeter home does seem to load a little faster
[UPDATE]
Incase you didnt see my sig, im not running on a ADP1 phone, so that might by why the fastest setting doesnt work for me, but so far 384MHz is making a noticeable difference with NEOCORE and SWEETER HOME
andonnguyen said:
The app is called Overclock, you can argue with the developer about the name not me.
Anyways, I do notice a very nice speed increase.
Also, the camera loads instantly after pressing the camera button and via the icon in the home screen.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i use snap photo, which used to take FOREVER to load up on my g1 using the camera button, its significantly faster using the 384MHz setting, good observation
Ok, so so far here is a list of things ive noticed (using 384MHz vs 248MHz):
-FPS in NEOCORE increased on adverage 5 to 6 fps
-Sweeter Home doesnt lag NEARLY as much as it used to (ALOT less force closes)
-Snap Photo doesnt take a month to load using the camera button
-G1 Wakes up properly which was a issue my g1 (and others on this forum) had
-Even though the app says it will "kill" the battery, using 384MHz during normal use of the phone isnt "killing" my battery, however, doom (while runs better (even with sound on)) seems to be dropping my battery level faster, but the game is running faster, which is the trade off id expect when running these apps together
At this point is there really a need? My phone doesnt lag that much that I need to over clock not to mention my battery life sucks already.
speoples20 said:
At this point is there really a need? My phone doesnt lag that much that I need to over clock not to mention my battery life sucks already.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
all of our battery life sucks unless you have the extended battery, im not getting THAT big of a battery drain according to the system monitor app, and it DOES make a difference on g1's that have lag issues (running tons of apps like i do)
in other threads, people have complained about the g1 not waking up quickly sometimes, ive yet to have that issue since ive clocked mine up to the 384MHz setting
@woot, you do know that the default cpu freq on the G1 is ~384mHz. So you might want to change in your sig that you're overclocked to 384mHz lol.
The program installs a script on your sd card called ocx_tmp.sh and adjusts it that way, it'll write to /system as -rw (from what I've discussed with someone) would probably cause instability.
The program will reset the cpu freq back down to 384mHz after the phone sleeps. You can verify this in terminal emulator by typing:
$su
#cat /proc/cpuinfo
Try it before and after setting the cpu freq in overclock and you'll see what I mean =)
I thought the the CPU ran at 528 MHz by default? Or is it clocked dynamically and this forces it?
Gameloft said:
just notice the difference in speed. If you notice please post. And its not overclocking its just clocking. Overclocking will be beyond 528 MHz
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
andonnguyen said:
@woot, you do know that the default cpu freq on the G1 is ~384mHz. So you might want to change in your sig that you're overclocked to 384mHz lol.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
im not as familiar with clocking/overclocking so i wasnt sure if i was clocking it to 384, overclocking it to 384, or what, so what would be the proper thing to put in my sig? lol because according to my first quote, true overclocking wouldnt be untill i went beyond 528, so from the view of my first quote, im not OVERclocking, im clocking, wheras your saying im overclocked
andonnguyen said:
The program will reset the cpu freq back down to 384mHz after the phone sleeps. You can verify this in terminal emulator by typing:
$su
#cat /proc/cpuinfo
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
so is it infact the program thats changing the cpu freq or is it the phone? if its the program, is this to avoid overworking the cpu without the demand?
andonnguyen said:
.
The program will reset the cpu freq back down to 384mHz after the phone sleeps.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
by sleep do you mean turning the screen off using the power button? because i saw no change in my cpu freq when doing so using your commands
ivanmmj said:
I thought the the CPU ran at 528 MHz by default? Or is it clocked dynamically and this forces it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
dont know, but i found this over at the android community:
Technical Features
Supports WCDMA/HSUPA and EGPRS networks
Multimedia Broadcasting Multicast Service (MBMS)
Integrated ARM11™ applications processor and ARM9™ modem
QDSP4000™ and QDSP5000™ high-performance digital signal processors (DSP)
528 MHz ARM11 Jazelle™ Java® hardware acceleration
Support for BREW® and Java applications
Qcamera™: Up to 6.0 megapixel digital images
Qtv™: Playback up to 30 fps VGA
Qcamcorder™: Record up to 24 fps QVGA
Up to 4 million triangles per second, and 133 million depth-tested, textured 3D pixels per second fill rate
gpsOne® position-location assisted-GPS (A-GPS) solution
Support for third-party operating systems
Digital audio support for MP3, aacPlus™ and Enhanced aacPlus
Integrated Mobile Digital Display Interface (MDDI), Bluetooth® 1.2 baseband processor and Wi-Fi® support
maybe that info will help? if not sorry
I remember reading somewhere by someone that it runs at 384 by default, and I think the post above confirms that...
ivanmmj said:
I thought the the CPU ran at 528 MHz by default? Or is it clocked dynamically and this forces it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
no, it runs at 384 by default, and clocks down even lower in the idle loop.
i am curious how this program works, as the normal cpufreq interfaces are not compiled in the kernel.
i've been running my phone for several months now at 528mhz, at a fairly minimal detriment to battery life.
i did however notice that without modifying the idle loop, the amount of cpu frequency switches even while the phone is not sleeping drops your average clock within a 10 second period to somewhere closer to 400mhz.
after modifying the idle loop to not switch frequency so often, i was able to get 27.4fps out of neocore w/o sound, and 22.7fps w/ sound.
my overall caffeine benchmark score was 582.
battery life impact is there, but fairly small. phone lasts for about a day and a half now where it used to last for sometimes 2. under heavy use, this is of course dramatically reduced.
gui fluidity is definitely increased, and sluggishness between app switches and when the translucent app drawer opens up is gone. i like it, but to the average person there probably is no need to do it.
keep in mind this is also not overclocking the cpu, it's clocking it to its default spec. as it is an embedded arm, it is designed to run hot, so i guarantee you are in no danger of hurting your phone.
also, do not listen to people that claim there could be no gain from overclocking, just because the bus speed is slower than the cpu speed does NOT mean there will be no improvement in system performance. if that were the case, there'd be no use for 4ghz desktop processors.
cache still runs full speed, and common execution paths stay in cache meaning no prefetch from system memory, meaning BIG improvement in many cases. (that's why cache exists.)
damnoregonian said:
no, it runs at 384 by default, and clocks down even lower in the idle loop.
i am curious how this program works, as the normal cpufreq interfaces are not compiled in the kernel.
i've been running my phone for several months now at 528mhz, at a fairly minimal detriment to battery life.
i did however notice that without modifying the idle loop, the amount of cpu frequency switches even while the phone is not sleeping drops your average clock within a 10 second period to somewhere closer to 400mhz.
after modifying the idle loop to not switch frequency so often, i was able to get 27.4fps out of neocore w/o sound, and 22.7fps w/ sound.
gui fluidity and responsiveness is greatly improved. sluggishness if app switching and the translucent app drawer are completely gone.
for many i imagine this means there isn't really any reason to clock the cpu up to its stock speed, but to each their own.
my overall caffeine benchmark score was 582.
battery life impact is there, but fairly small. phone lasts for about a day and a half now where it used to last for sometimes 2. under heavy use, this is of course dramatically reduced.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
care to write up a how-to for getting the 582 consistantly and changing the idle loop?
Holy crap. Used this @528MHz with Haykuro's version 4.5 apps to sd ROM and the osk works SO MUCH BETTER!!!! Also I got 25.6 fps on neocore... very smooth
wootroot said:
care to write up a how-to for getting the 582 consistantly and changing the idle loop?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
writeup? no. it's a big process involving the android dev environment, a modified version of mkbootimg and unyaffs.
i will gladly post the kernel modifications for those who want to recompile the kernel to do so.
the bootloader sets the clock speed, and the idle loop simply clocks down to a preset and back up to whatever it was previously after x milliseconds of inactivity (not to be confused with sleep) it's kind of a poor man's cpufreq arbitrator.
so on top of tweaking the idle loop to not drop down as often, you also have to explicitly set the frequency in the kernel upon bootup, or it will bet set at what it thinks is full speed, which is 384.
A modded version of JF's ROM would ROM.
I DO notice the sluggishness and it bugs the heck out of me. (I switched from a WING with a 200MHz CPU, and although it IS faster than the wing, it doesn't seem significantly faster and seems to much slower when I open up the camera...
damnoregonian said:
writeup? no. it's a big process involving the android dev environment, a modified version of mkbootimg and unyaffs.
i will gladly post the kernel modifications for those who want to recompile the kernel to do so.
the bootloader sets the clock speed, and the idle loop simply clocks down to a preset and back up to whatever it was previously after x milliseconds of inactivity (not to be confused with sleep) it's kind of a poor man's cpufreq arbitrator.
so on top of tweaking the idle loop to not drop down as often, you also have to explicitly set the frequency in the kernel upon bootup, or it will bet set at what it thinks is full speed, which is 384.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
that involved eh?
thanks for this post though, now i understand more about the idle loop and why the cpu freq resets with each reboot
maybe someone can take this stuff further like he said, that kind of stuff would be worth the dollar, imo more than a dollar
well... i don't mind providing basic procedure and source, i just don't want to get dragged into level 1 support of the procedure.
i'll go ahead and package up some source, prebuilt boot images based on JF's RC33 (which is what i run) and a basic procedure.
Subject says it all, 200MHZ sometimes doesn't cut in, if we need the speed, what is the best app out there ?
Thanks in advance
Found the solution...
Thanks for looking at the thread ... It was shinny isn't it.
Don't waste your time, PPC CPU can't be overclocked
No?!?! look this!
xhtc said:
Don't waste your time, PPC CPU can't be overclocked
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You really need to do some research my friend.
Alright, let me save your time. Just search for Omapclockkeep, you'll clear your old taboo.
Just for the information, i have happily cruised my VIVA's CPU at 250MHZ, battery life is ok, not much affected.
Battery lasts 2 days with occasional WIFI plus Bluetooth.
3 apps
I've seen 3 apps so far that promisses the posibility to OC ppc...
Omapclockkeep
(posted in this thread)
Speed Booster
_www .teksoftco. com/index.php?section=speedbooster_
Pocket Hack Master
_www .wizcode. com/products/view/pocket_hack_master_
and pocket hack master even says it can prolong battery life (they also have another app called Pocket Battery Analyzer that seems good)
Anyone tried the apps? do they really work?
su8044 said:
I've seen 3 apps so far that promisses the posibility to OC ppc...
Omapclockkeep
(posted in this thread)
Speed Booster
_www .teksoftco. com/index.php?section=speedbooster_
Pocket Hack Master
_www .wizcode. com/products/view/pocket_hack_master_
and pocket hack master even says it can prolong battery life (they also have another app called Pocket Battery Analyzer that seems good)
Anyone tried the apps? do they really work?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am using Omap keep cause you can keep the default speed at ideal and as soon as you start using it, you can set the speed like 250 and gain the extra performance through overclocking...
I'm using Homescreen++, which has a great overclock utility called CPU Scaler. It dynamically overclocks the CPU when the phone actually requires it, therefore saving lots of battery life. It also reduces the speed when it's idle to save even more. You just give it a min, max and boost value(when apps are really demanding) and it does the rest. It also monitors power consumption(maH, mW) and CPU temp. Good stuff.
zuperxtreme said:
I'm using Homescreen++, which has a great overclock utility called CPU Scaler. It dynamically overclocks the CPU when the phone actually requires it, therefore saving lots of battery life. It also reduces the speed when it's idle to save even more. You just give it a min, max and boost value(when apps are really demanding) and it does the rest. It also monitors power consumption(maH, mW) and CPU temp. Good stuff.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have used it and my personal experience of using PPC for last 5 years says anything that monitors eat battery...
haha, yeah obviously, but every bit counts, no?
.
..
I use setcpu to do this.
Look into the governors, choose one.
Then choose the appropriate thresholds (in the advanced menu) for what you do.
It doesn't allow you to tweak per app, but tells the cpu governor at what %of cpu to move to the next cpu speed (up or down).
I set mine very low, as i care more about battery than performance. So my up threshold is like 95% or something.
But my down threshold is a lot more agressive.
But you do the opposite.
MuF123 said:
Hello,
my question is regarding dynamic overclocking. I've used the ones that raise the speed when under a load - but my question is -
Is there a way to return to stock clocks after certain time?
Explanation:
situation1: I want to check new single mail or open new single IM or check university's website for some news, I want the device to be FAST as possible, nevermind the battery.
situation2: I want to use maps/navigation/IM/games/web browsing for longer period of time (hours?) with the screen on. I don't need all the power when I play solitaire, text on IM or browse not-so-important news websites.
I think when I've seen the realtime clock displayed on my phone it jumped to max clock right after I've clicked almost anything on the screen. I want the speed-up, but after certain period of time to stop doing this in favor of the battery life-time.
Any ideas how to do this? Thanks!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
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Yes, just throttle the cpu to give you more power when you are sluggish. That could work for you.
Me? I have my droid do 110 when screen is off (works quite well!), and then I FORCE the unit to 1000 when plugged in. Besides that i throttle the cpu based on battery power: more cpu power with more battery life. Makes my droid last longer.
I might want to add a throttle up when sluggish and not in my personal battery red zone and a throttle down when the cpu gets too hot period.
Any cpu frequencies that you all would suggest?
..
MuF123 said:
Thanks for the reply, but - think about this, I will start a 3D game, it will use 100% of the cpu so it would always stay at the highest possible frequency (+highest voltage). I don't want that.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I dont get it?
You dont want max speed in game? Why do you overclock?
If the game requires 100%, the it will (and should) clock up.
As soon as the game doesnt, it will clock down (depends on your threshold).
The only other i could see, is to change the max clock rate in setcpu before you play the game. This will ensure it doesnt clock higher than your choice, but requires a manual step.
But seriously, if your cpu is pegged at 100, why would you not want it to step up the higher speed?
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..
MuF123 said:
exactly - I don't want minimum battery in game, that's why I don't want to overclock.
actually from the nature of 3d rendering I think every game will run at 100%, but the situation when the game hits the frame limiter (not likely on milestone).
I want snappy performance while doing few quick tasks:
e.g.: new IM comes, I want to unlock, load the application, get to the IM, reply, lock. (40seconds)
or
taking phone from cradle - I want the phone to load homescreen fast, rotate the screen, open phone app, to look at last missed call and call back (20seconds).
Battery life won't be affected by 40 or 20seconds of ~1100mhz, okay.
And then I start a game for a prolonged time. It will run smoothly even on 550MHz, the additional frames I see are just waste of battery = I don't want that.
So now I have two options - either run at max speed and it will be always fast and it will drain my battery when I decide to play for an hour.
OR
I can use default speeds for longer battery life for everything and I will wait an hour to rotate the screen in browser or IM app.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You could compromise and find a max speed that you could undervolt to make it drain battery like stock. My 800mhz vsel is less than the default vsel @550. So the battery drain is less...
It requires some trial and error, but most "slight" overclocks (700,800; depends on the phone) can be configured to drain less than stock.
Of course, if you feel you need 1000 or 1100, this wont work as it requires increasing the vsel (or at least not decreasing it).
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