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Hi there!
My brother just bought me a spare battery. Well it still needs to be charged after usuage. The thing is I have to swap the batteries everytime I used them both. The solution is to buy a cradle to charge it but these are kinda expensive.
My solution would be to build my own charging cradle. But I lack the knowledge of electricity skills to succesfully making such charger without blowing up my battery. Therefor I'm asking the community on XDA for help!
Well this is what I need:
- Battery has 3 connectors: + and - and on in the middle but i dont know what that is.
- I have a usb cable with 4 wires (black/red/green/white)
- I want to connect the usb connecter to my PC or AC adapter and the wires to my battery.
This way I can charge both my HD2 and the spare battery at the same time.
The question is, is this possible and if yes, can this be done just like that or do I need transistors or conductors (or whatever they may called). It needs to be safe, I dont wanna blow up my battery or my AC adapter nor my PC...
Do not even contemplate it.
It is clear that you do not know enough about batteries.
A quick google for desktop chargers came back with one for only £30
For 25quid i got a spare battery, desktop charger and 2 screen protectors from e-bay. Carnt go wrong at that price
I know that the AC adapter converts the input of electrical energy to my phone, I believe my phone does it to my battery too (thats where I'm not too sure).
All I need to know is if I can charge the battery safely when connecting the red wire to the + and the black wire to the - side of the battery... (The green and white wires are data)
I'm not to sure because the AC adapter has a different output than the PC USB output. Although the USB dilivers a tiny bit less voltage it delivers a significant less amount of Whats (or Amps) Basicly that means it just takes longer for the USB to charge as long as the voltage remains identical. (The USB delivers less voltage but the effect on damaging the battery is minimal because the difference is discardable)
My actuall question was: can I connect my battery directly to the AC adapter or do I need to convert the electical energy again (if my phone does a second convert after the AC adapter).
You can find chargers on eBay for less than 5usd. Buy one or you will fry your battery.
VerusAmos said:
I know that the AC adapter converts the input of electrical energy to my phone, I believe my phone does it to my battery too (thats where I'm not too sure).
All I need to know is if I can charge the battery safely when connecting the red wire to the + and the black wire to the - side of the battery... (The green and white wires are data)
I'm not to sure because the AC adapter has a different output than the PC USB output. Although the USB dilivers a tiny bit less voltage it delivers a significant less amount of Whats (or Amps) Basicly that means it just takes longer for the USB to charge as long as the voltage remains identical. (The USB delivers less voltage but the effect on damaging the battery is minimal because the difference is discardable)
My actuall question was: can I connect my battery directly to the AC adapter or do I need to convert the electical energy again (if my phone does a second convert after the AC adapter).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Watts not Whats
Simple answer: No you cannot connect your battery directly to the AC adaptor.
Detailed answer:
The USB port of a computer/AC adaptor provides approx 5V and a variety of currents depending on what the USB lead is plugged into.
This 5V goes to the phone.
Inside the phone is the battery charging circuit, this detects the level of charge in the battery, controls the voltage and current going to the battery to stop it releasing too much hydrogen which would cause the battery to swell and explode (look on youtube for lithium polymer battery fires).
If you think you can create a charging circuit (including selecting the right ICs and programming them) without burning yourself in a hydrogen/lithium fire, be my guest.
Incapable of making an external battery charger...
Here I am trying not to be a complete idiot and then I go and spell watts the wrong way...
But tnx for the replies, that was all I needed to hear... I guess I'll be swapping batteries after all untill I find a cheap external battery charger...
Cheers!!!
Amzer makes a very nice cradle with charging slot for your spare battery. I got mine for $28USD. I'm not going to provide the link to the outfit I bought mine from because they weren't the best of suppliers to buy from. But the Amzer cradle works very well. Downside is that you cannot use it if you have a case for your Leo that wraps around it, and is designed to stay on. Leo must be caseless to fit into the cradle. But even if you don't use the cradle as a cradle, it does have the ability to charge your spare battery.
I am very annoyed about the charging abilities of the gnote cause when it's charging It continues to use power only from the battery, can't even take out the battery that the phone turns off while connected to the charger.
This leads to the battery discharging even when connected to the charger under heavy load usages such as playing 1080p through MHL, at least to me that happens, I wonder if same thing happens to other gnote owners? (I tried a 2A charger with the MHL and it doesn't discharge as fast, but still does, and I haven't tried yet cause i didnt find the Y cable on sale to do it, but i wanna get a Y microusb cable to connect 2 chargers at same time, one to MHL device and another to the gnote to see if that helps).
So i was doing some light reading on the gnote's smb328 charger circuit and according to their diagram (and from what I understand of it and their datasheet, I can be wrong ofc) the system should indeed be able to be powered by the charger alone.
The smb328 has a missing battery detect function and loads of settings that can be programmed on the fly through the kernel (I think) and through a windows program.
Now i don't know if it's that missing battery function or some other similar thing that doesn't allow the phone to remain on while connected to charger without battery, but whatever it is I guess if that could be circumvented it would also mean that the phone would also be powered by the charger instead of the battery alone.
So does anybody more knowledgeable in these things know if there's any setting to change the behaviour of the charger circuit to allow removal of battery while connected to charger or simply allow the system to be powered at the same time by the charger and battery so that under heavy load circumstances the battery wouldn't actually discharge?
Or is it the way that Samsung physically assembled the hardware that doesn't allow it?
Just throwing and idea to the air, but could a mod, like shunting 2 of the battery's pins or something similar allow to share the charger's power to the system?
Regarding the windows summitmicro smb328 program, you think it would have access to the smb328 circuit in the gnote if we tried?
Hi Elusivo,
I'm busy to fix my Note's charging circuit and R619 seems to be shorted. I've bveen all over and cannot seem to get the value for this register.
The datasheet I found from he summit site (from your link) does not help at all. Do you have a data sheet with an application note which specifies this value?
Help will be appreciated
Dion
It's seems that when I'm trying to charge my phone with my original charger or another wall charger, the battery doesn't getting charge above random number, the original battery was charged firstly to 70% and than to maximum 55%, I used a solar charger that maybe have output voltage which is higher or that giving more current (which I don't think it is).
I replaced my battery on aother one and now it's seems that I can charge it for more and stuff, but still the original charger can't, and when I'm charging through my PC or a portable charger, it's charging to the maximum.
My micro usb socket in the device is unstable and moving, there is maybe a connection between?
or maybe the chip who responsible to charging got ruined?
edit 22:13:
after more tests I feel the source of the problem is low voltage on the battery, which telling me that the problem is on the connector.
I changed cables, changed chargers, and checked every time the voltage on the battery that the device is sampling.
Try wiping battery stats and if it doesn't work go to your local electronic store and ask them to send your phone to mainentance and replace the connector
I tried wipe, and I bought already a connector and I will replaced by my self.
orenzah said:
It's seems that when I'm trying to charge my phone with my original charger or another wall charger, the battery doesn't getting charge above random number, the original battery was charged firstly to 70% and than to maximum 55%, I used a solar charger that maybe have output voltage which is higher or that giving more current (which I don't think it is).
I replaced my battery on aother one and now it's seems that I can charge it for more and stuff, but still the original charger can't, and when I'm charging through my PC or a portable charger, it's charging to the maximum.
My micro usb socket in the device is unstable and moving, there is maybe a connection between?
or maybe the chip who responsible to charging got ruined?
edit 22:13:
after more tests I feel the source of the problem is low voltage on the battery, which telling me that the problem is on the connector.
I changed cables, changed chargers, and checked every time the voltage on the battery that the device is sampling.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sometimes on my phone if i charging to 70% say to me it's full charged, but it's still charging to 100%.
When it comes to 70% or 55% or 60% and the phone says its full, you must load and not unplug charger.
Sorry because my bad English.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using xda app-developers app
vinogradska5a said:
Sometimes on my phone if i charging to 70% say to me it's full charged, but it's still charging to 100%.
When it comes to 70% or 55% or 60% and the phone says its full, you must load and not unplug charger.
Sorry because my bad English.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
it's because you are using stoch GB...
that's not the issue here...
Background
Hi all, I, for a very short period of time was suffering from the problem of my phone DISCHARGING while it was charging. This made no logical sense to me until I did some research, which I will detail below.
How USB Power works (Roughly)
Firstly let's discuss USB power provisioning. Strictly speaking, the specifications say that any given USB port should provide a maximum of 500mA (or 0.5A) at 5 volts. *Don't shoot me electronics guys, I'm simplifying for ease of explanations sake*. Imagine that ampage as the actual force of the charger, how quickly it can ram power into your phone. Like the rate of flow on a pipe.
The beginning of the problem
This was all fine and dandy when all USB was really used for was Keyboards, Mice, Memory, etc, low current draw devices. Something else I should mention here is that the Ampage that a port CAN provide is not the Ampage it DOES provide - the device draws a certain Ampage and if the USB controller agrees it outputs said Ampage. Later, when USB was beginning to be used for more power hungry applications, ie External hard drives, these required more power than the port could (In theory) provide. However, most more modern motherboards/USB controllers were more than capable of supplying plenty more Ampage if it was requested. This was breaking the specification but not in any massively dangerous way so as such nothing bad happens.
This is where we get to the actual issue people are experiencing here. The Nexus 4 is a standards compliant device in the respect that it seems to only draw 500mA from any USB port no matter what it's potential, unless it's an AC Wall wart. If you're experiencing problems with wakelocks (see XDA) and other things, this causes your phone to draw more than 500mA which means your phone actually discharges while it's charging! Terrible!
This is quite easy to get around, but again I'm going into detail so let's explain how the phone tells the difference between a dumb wall wart and a USB controller. Easily! The USB controller obviously makes use of the data pins found within the USB cable, whereas a wallwart just (almost always) shorts them out. The Nexus 4 can detect this short, and as such draw more power *While still in quotation marks staying in spec*.
The root problem is not with how the N4 is charging, it's with the wakelock you're experiencing which is causing the phone to draw so much power while the screen is off. While the screen is off and the phone is in Deepsleep (A CPU state where it uses very little power) - it should draw no more than 50mA leaving 450mA for charging the battery, but you guys are probably experiencing a wakelock of some sort.
Solutions to the problem or How to break a specification for the good of mankind
The simple solution is to install this app: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.rootuninstaller.batrsaver
This forces the device into a Deep sleep when the screen goes off by killing applications and turning off all internal chipsets that have wakelock capability, most commonly networking on the Nexus 4. This will allow your phone to charge (slowly) off USB without an issue. Another common wakelock is when the device is picked up by your desktop as a media device. The USB controller inside the Nexus 4 forces a wakelock which keeps it from charging. Stupid design, I know.
* A more hackish solution is to install Francos kernel, buy his app, and tick the Fast charging option in the kernel settings dialog. This will force the phone to think that everything is an AC adaptor and will force the phone to draw as much current as it can from the USB port (which on most modern motherboards is fine, and results in extremely quick charging).
* An even simpler solution than all this is to just use a 'USB Charging cable' - this is simply a cable that does not have the Data pins, and as such does exactly the same as what enabling USB fast charge above does. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Micro-USB...487076?pt=PDA_Accessories&hash=item51a465d124
If you live near a Poundland store here in the UK they sell a 4 in one USB cable type thing which turns 1 USB port into Ipod sync connector, Nokia connector, MicroUSB and MiniUSB, and this doesn't have the data pins and as such is excellent.
One final point, an excellent app for monitoring whether your device is actually charging or not and how quickly is Current widget: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.manor.currentwidget&hl=en
This widget will tell you how much Ampage is going into or leaving your battery. If the battery icon is green, then it's discharging, if it's black/white then it's charging. The bigger the number, the faster the discharge/charge. This is an extremely easy way to test speed of chargers too.
Recommendations
Another solution, just use an AC Wall wart - they're cheap as hell and the one supplied with the Nexus 4 is an extremely fast charging one. Shame I've gone and lost mine.
A way to roughly monitor charging current draw
I'd also recommend you install https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.manor.currentwidget&hl=en and monitor, if the battery is green while charging it's discharging and you need a more powerful charger/to figure out what's causing your phone to use so much power.
General good values in Current Widget
I generally saw a max draw of about 750mA for charging (not including draw for powering the device, the Nexus 4 can draw more power to charge and power the device) on my old Rev10 first generation Nexus 4. On my new Rev12 board I'm noticing this increase to about 850mA.
Are higher amperage chargers any benefit to anyone?
Yes and no. You will not notice faster charging unless you use your device while charging. Your nexus will draw as much power as it needs to power the phone while charging at the fastest rate. For example on the stock 1.2a charger
1200mA | 800mA goes to charging 400mA goes to powering the phone idling
Let's say you start a stability test. Your phone will obviously be using a lot more power so this will happen
1200mA | -600mA goes to charging and 1800mA goes to powering the phone stability testing
That minus value above may look strange! Let me explain. If the phone needs more power than the charger can supply, it will draw from the battery. That's the minus number.
If you have a higher ampage charger like for example a 2.5a charger
2500mA | 800mA goes to charging 400mA goes to powering the device
Stability testing
2500mA | 700mA goes to charging 1800mA goes to powering the device
Can you see the difference?
DISCLAIMER: I am not an electronics engineer nor do I claim to be, I am simply a hobbyist and this is what I've found to be the case. Please correct me if I've made any mistakes, I want to learn.
Thanks!
Thanks so much for this post. It's very helpful.
kn100 said:
Another common wakelock is when the device is picked up by your desktop as a media device. The USB controller inside the Nexus 4 forces a wakelock which keeps it from charging. Stupid design, I know.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This isn't true for everyone then as mine connects and charges just fine off of my laptop and desktop when connected as a media device. In fact its on my laptop right now charging, gone from 68% to 81% in about 30 minutes and it shows connected as a portable media player.
Great info! Thanks for writing this!
In certain use cases the Nexus4 discharges faster than it charges and this is a very useful guide.
I use my phone for navigation in my car and having the GPS on and the screen at high brightness
drains the battery faster than the 0.5A car chargers can supply. Car chargers rated for 2.0A work well.
I haven't tried a 'USB charging cable' with the data pins shorted, it may work as well.
-Mindroid- said:
Great info! Thanks for writing this!
In certain use cases the Nexus4 discharges faster than it charges and this is a very useful guide.
I use my phone for navigation in my car and having the GPS on and the screen at high brightness
drains the battery faster than the 0.5A car chargers can supply. Car chargers rated for 2.0A work well.
I haven't tried a 'USB charging cable' with the data pins shorted, it may work as well.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
was over in Nexus 7 forums and the 4.2.x kernel should have solved the problem at least for having to use shorted cables. have to wait and see if 4.2.2 brings any more changes.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1984838
Section 6 in this link is about power supplied through USB
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_Serial_Bus
I can't tell if we have an updated kernel allowing faster usb charging as I'm limited by the power output of the usb port in my laptop. The output (5V at 500mA max) is controlled by the laptop (USB Standards) and it doesn't matter what the phone or cable is capable of as that's the max it will give out and that's about what I'm charging at. If I had a dedicated charging port in my laptop then it would be different and I could see if its able to draw more power. I have a 1.0 amp port in my car and it does charge at the higher amperage, I would assume it would do the same thing if I had a 2 amp usb port in the car. So I think the stock kernel has the fast usb charge built in it just depends upon if you have a usb port capable of providing a faster charger, it has nothing to do with the cable as I'm using a standard unmodified micro usb cable and its able to draw the max a usb device is able to put out.
thanks
thanks for a great detailed post!!!
I have the same trouble with my N4 when I was charging while using my phone...
I find it very slow... I guess I've been spoiled by my previous iPhone (which charges fairly fast)....
i might be stating the obvious but I find the phone charged "a lot" faster when it's OFF
if you are running low with your battery and need a quick 10 min charge, just do yourself a favour by turning off your phone...
the difference is quite significant!
kzoodroid said:
This isn't true for everyone then as mine connects and charges just fine off of my laptop and desktop when connected as a media device. In fact its on my laptop right now charging, gone from 68% to 81% in about 30 minutes and it shows connected as a portable media player.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yup, me too. It only discharges while charging when I am playing like NFS most wanted.
Sent from my Nexus 4 using xda app-developers app
The issue with cables is with the LG usb wall charger as the one supplied isn't capable of getting the 5 volts at 1.2 amps that the charger is rated at, mine is getting around 300 - 400 mA. The micro usb cable I have in my car and use with my laptop (for charging and data transfer) is able to handle the higher amperage, it gets around 1 amp with the LG plug. There are no specs on these cables so I can't list a definitive difference and I would assume that the cable mod in the OP might help with the LG cable. It also might just be simpler to only buy those cables capable of handling higher amperage as obviously they are out there from my experience.
The cable I'm using is an RCA coiled charging/syncing cable model AH732CBR (has data pins). The maximum I'm getting from this is about 870 mA regardless of the amperage of the usb port, I've tried a 1.0, 1.2 and 2.1 and they are all around 870 mA on current widget. I would suppose if I could find a strictly charging cable I could get higher (link to ebay in OP is outdated) but this is still 2x that which I'm getting from the LG cable supplied with the phone which only puts out 300-400 mA. Our phone also has Qualcomm's quick charge which is supposed to improve battery charging times by 40%.
http://www.droid-life.com/2013/02/1...allows-your-device-to-charge-up-to-40-faster/
How do you measure how much mA the device draw from the charger?
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2
omrij said:
How do you measure how much mA the device draw from the charger?
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
current widget, link is in the OP
kzoodroid said:
The cable I'm using is an RCA coiled charging/syncing cable model AH732CBR (has data pins). The maximum I'm getting from this is about 870 mA regardless of the amperage of the usb port, I've tried a 1.0, 1.2 and 2.1 and they are all around 870 mA on current widget. I would suppose if I could find a strictly charging cable I could get higher (link to ebay in OP is outdated) but this is still 2x that which I'm getting from the LG cable supplied with the phone which only puts out 300-400 mA. Our phone also has Qualcomm's quick charge which is supposed to improve battery charging times by 40%.
http://www.droid-life.com/2013/02/1...allows-your-device-to-charge-up-to-40-faster/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Bit of a late reply but please bear in mind the Nexus will NOT draw anything more than about 800mAh from the wall for charging alone. That is the absolute max and is a hardware limit - If the cable is transmitting that and it's showing in current widget you've got a good setup. See the added section in OP for more info on higher amperage chargers.
Hello, I forget to read the DK31 manual and use my DK31 connect to PC USB port. (the manual said do not connect to that port, use only AC adapter). I use it for a week, and I concern about bad effect with my z1. Is my device will damage or have any problem? What is the bad effect that will happen to my phone? To think about this, it make a crazy. Please help me!!!
sorry my bad english
iammop said:
Hello, I forget to read the DK31 manual and use my DK31 connect to PC USB port. (the manual said do not connect to that port, use only AC adapter). I use it for a week, and I concern about bad effect with my z1. Is my device will damage or have any problem? What is the bad effect that will happen to my phone? To think about this, it make a crazy. Please help me!!!
sorry my bad english
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thats because the USB port does not have the enough power to supply the charger, the charger works with 1500mAh and the USB port 3.0 "only" with 900 max, that means that it will take longer to charge your phone and the dock and phone could over heat. Besides doing this often you will be decreasing the battery life of your Xperia Z1
juliospinoza said:
Thats because the USB port does not have the enough power to supply the charger, the charger works with 1500mAh and the USB port 3.0 "only" with 900 max, that means that it will take longer to charge your phone and the dock and phone could over heat. Besides doing this often you will be decreasing the battery life of your Xperia Z1
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank for you reply. But I have another question.
So, you mean that charging via usb port connect to PC (mini usb port not the magnetic) is not recommend too?
And I confuse about this --> I think, Charging with High current will be hotter, so AC adapter with 1500 mA must be drain my battery life more than USB (via PC)?.
iammop said:
Thank for you reply. But I have another question.
So, you mean that charging via usb port connect to PC (mini usb port not the magnetic) is not recommend too?
And I confuse about this --> I think, Charging with High current will be hotter, so AC adapter with 1500 mA must be drain my battery life more than USB (via PC)?.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In USB charging mode, your Android device charges slowly, only drawing a maximum of 500ma from the USB host device, even if that device is a USB charger that is capable of supplying much more power, this means that your phone will take longer to charge, but there are cases where this process makes your phne overheat
there are several opinions about USB charging, the 2 most commons are. 1 your phone takes longer to charge and the battery charges better, and 2. the battery takes longer to charge and the battery life decreases.
So, in my opinion, I use the dock and the battery life is great, almost 18 hours with 4.5 hours on screen,
maybe you should make some test and post how was it
PS in all opinions some says that the battery life increases and other says that decreases, in both cases i think you will never notice
regards