Related
Hi,
Have been reading the forum for a number of hours now....
I have big problems with my XDAIIs locking up. I am pretty certain it relates to the rom / image supplied with the phone - It locks up far more when O2 active (v3.6) is running.
I have read the sections on which upgrades but am more than a little confused. Can someone point me at the correct ROM to use. I downloaded the Qtek 1.40 rom but get region errors when i try and install. I have being trying to get my head round how i avoid this but guess im being stupid.
Help
Paul.
my rom 1.31.00 WWE
radio 1.13.00 (managed to update this)
ext rom 1.31.139 WWE
Paul, if you can, try doing a hard reset and when it asks for corporate or personal select corporate and put in the code 0506. It will then not install the O2 active software. It stopped mine hanging.
Hope it helps mate.
Jim
cool. will try that...
i actually managed to get it on 1.40 rom now.... just wish i had written down the gprs settings for o2...
Oh also read this
http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?t=24480
but to be honest I tried that 1.40 rom and I had camera problems so I went back to the 1.31.00 WWE and it's fine for me mate (yes my radio is 1.13.00 as well now and my extended rom is an allsorts mix, but I'd read a lot more before fiddling with it!)
Ah, you've sorted it (I was typing as you replied). You could go back to the standard rom and then take note of the settings (I didn't as I'm too tight to pay for GPRS so I don't use it at all).
Let me know how you get on mate, especially try your camera.
Good luck.
http://t-mobile.iris-global.com/files/BA_TMUK_14200_112_11300_Ship.exe
Seems to have appeared as the FINAL offical release from t-mobile for uk users.
I've not tried it yet but the number does seem to suggest it is a slightly lower version than the Dutch one
EDIT MDAIIIUser
Added to wiki
no surprises
build of 2003se identical to Dutch rom previously released:
version 4.21.1088 (build 15159.2.6.4)
Extended rom just hasth changed regional settings (english UK default)
Added to wiki
Still a lot of echo.
Can't pair my Motorola HS820, BA sees the HS820, but error on connecting.
Anyone a fix for the echo and for the BT problem?
Use 1.40 before, was less a problem compaired to 1.42
Please help.
Regards,
Max
Report Back - T-Mobile Rom.. One week or so on..
Hi All,
Wanted to feedback my impressions of the new 1.42 T-Mobile UK Spec Rom..
Well, it's been interesting.. I now have (or have had) most of the faults that everyone else is experiencing.. I never used to get them at all with the i-mate 1.40 Rom or the NL 1.42 T-Mobile Rom.. I have listed the bugs below..
1 - One Hard-reset when inserted into GPS Car holder
2 - Several occasions where I've "lost" the Storage Card (when serching for it on the device AND through Active Sync)
3 - Interesting situation where I've started TomTom5 and I've suddenly had to go through the set-up process again only to be told that there's no maps (Can only attribute this to an occasion where the Storage Card is not seen by the PPC - See above).. Solved by remove Programs, soft-reset then re-install off SD Card.. (quite annoying as I was lost at the time!)
4 - Occasional failure for BT Headset being recognised on an in-coming call (I use the Logi-Tech Pro).. Solved by Soft-reset..
5 - Sometimes, after soft-reset, get a low performance from the Device.. ie, after soft-reset and switching to phone where it takes a few seconds to "build" the phone screen..
Strange but as I mentioned above, I don't recall getting these bugs on the 1.42 NL Rom or the i-mate 1.40 Rom.. I might try a hard re-set on Monday then re-install my tomTom, etc to see if it carries on.. If it does, I MIGHT switch back to the either :shock:
That's it really.. I have had the early T-Mobile 1.06, the i-mate 1.40, T-Mobile NL 1.42 and T-Mobile GB 1.42 and finally the WM5 Roms and from what I've seen, I place them in this order of preference..
1 - i-Mate 1.40
2 - T-Mobile NL 1.42
3 - T-Mobile GB 1.42
4 - WM5
5 - T-Mobile GB 1.06
Hi,
Updated to the dutch ROM, is better then this UK ROM.
Version number is also newer.
Regards,
Max
dazed and confused
sorry if I'm being simple but ....
I though this was the last offical rom
http://www.iris-global.com/t_mobile_download/download_manager_mda_com.html
MA_TMUK_11300_128_11200_SHIP.exe
Rather than
http://t-mobile.iris-global.com/files/BA_TMUK_14200_112_11300_Ship.exe
How did you maanage to find the link?
What is the diference between the builds - How can I find a change log?
What is the BA / MA?
:?:
See here:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?t=31360
No difference in UK and NL Rom..?
[email protected] said:
Hi,
Updated to the dutch ROM, is better then this UK ROM.
Version number is also newer.
Regards,
Max
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi Max,
The Rom is exactly the same and the only difference is the changes in the extROM that makes it either UK or NL Spec (ie, MMS settings, etc)
Hi Starfish - Perhaps you need to look at this for the answers to your other questions:
http://wiki.xda-developers.com/index.php?pagename=BlueAngel_For_Beginners
Oh, and BA is "Blue Angel" and MA is the "Magician" HTC Names for the devices..
Sorry I did'nt read close enough Magican vs Blue angel
starfish_001 said:
Sorry I did'nt read close enough Magican vs Blue angel
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's ok.. We all have to start somewhere.. 8)
Now, I'm not too sure how far advanced you are in Upgrading, etc but before you do, please remember the following that I put on another post on here..
MrPhilly said:
General Tips to you (and others)..
If you do want to update or upgrade then make sure you read everything through first.. Make sure you're happy in doing it.. Perhaps use the search function to read through others comments.. I would also recommend reading others comments about trying to downgrade from WM5 to WM2003SE to see what others have encountered
You will not believe the amount of people who end up posting questions when they've not followed the instructions from Wiki that I've pasted for you here..
Finally, if you are stuck, use the search command and describe your problem in the Keywords section, select Blue Angel from the Category and read through the posts relating to it before posting questions..
Hope this helps..?
Cheers!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How can I upgrade to a stable rom
I have tried the TMobile NL and UK version both give the Country ID eror with the extra numbers 17-17-38-38-38
How can I safely upgrade to the 1.42 version (I have read the Getting Started With The Blue Angel) .
Is that the way to go?
"I get the password error on the xda3nbftool for the nbf segment"
I would like to get rid of all the phonesound failure and systemhangs with TomTom5.10
My Qtek9090
PH20B 0 B
WWE E
DANGA001
1.40.00 0 0
1.40.556
1.13.00 13.00
Upgraded to this from the last O2 update (my BA is an O2 Xda IIs), and while for the most part it works fine, now if the device turns the screen off for power-save while out and about, the GPRS connection drops. I know the hardware is capable of keeping the GPRS connection alive in such a situation because, well, it didn't drop it under the previous two O2 ROMs I ran.
Anyone else had this problem, or know a fix? Hopefully it's something simple that I've overlooked...
I'm getting better Bluetooth support with this (whether through actual improvements in the stack or through sheer dumb luck), so I'd prefer not to downgrade if I can avoid it.
Upgrade for NON OEM/Carrier Blue Angel
I have an unlocked OEM i-mate PDA2K. Because of this I am unable to install the T-Mobile upgrade to 1.42.
Is there a way to get around this?
I tried using the MaUpgradeUt_noID.exe, but I was unsuccessful.
Any ideas on how to upgrade a non-T-mobile branded blue angel?
Thanks
problems upgrading a non-t-mobile branded PD2K
BELOW IS THE SCREENSHOT OF THE ERROR
Did you make sure you had the MAUpdate file in the same directory as the actual upgrade had been uncompressed into? Since it's missing the RUU.DLL file that is part of that package.
Basically, get the files out of the real upgrade, then copy the MAUpdate into that directory, then run it instead.
I can not unzip or unpackaged the shipped OS
When I double click on the file, it runs the file, when you right-click and select extract, it gives you an error.
How do you unpackage the ship package?
Me, I used WinZip, I think it was.
Can not unrar or unzip setup files from exe package
the instructions states:
Unrar or unzip all files in exe or rar into a new folder. I get an error when I do that.
I also noticed that the instructions states:
First Method (Quick/Easy) (TYPE II), but there is another method Second Method (Slower/Harder) (TYPE I)
I am going to give that a try
O2 XDA IIs
Hi from Greece,
A friend bring me to Greece from Singapore one O2 XDA IIs but it has a old versions:
rom 1.31.00 wwe
rom date: 12/13/04
radio v:1.02.00
protocol version: 1337.32
ExtROM version: 1.31.920 wwe
sorry but I'm newbie here, can you tell me what (and where can i find) I must download in order to update to the latest versions.
I allready download the latest version from O2.UK for O2-XDA IIS but I do not want to lock my device to any network and that's the reason who asked you and I do not install this I allready download.
I allready see http://wiki.xda-developers.com/index.php?pagename=BA_Upgrades but I don t now what I must download.
thk u
I've got a Cingular SX66 that I upgraded to http://wiki.xda-developers.com/index.php?pagename=BA_5.1.1700_build_14343_Upgrade]WM 5 Build 14343 from the XDA Wiki.
Windows Mobile 5 has been running pretty crappy - not letting me answer calls, running slowly, it just isn't worth upgrading to (for me, anyway).
I really want to go back to WM2003, but I've read that the http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?p=91465#91465]ROM doesn't work - can anyone help me out?
Is there a way I can downgrade back to WM2003 and have everything working? If you know how to do this or (preferably) have done it yourself, I'd really appreciate at least somewhat detailed instructions. Thanks.
Excuse me but did you do ANY research at all on this before you upgraded? Every other post here states " READ THE WIKI".... A couple minutes worth of browsing the forums here and you would have had enough first hand user accounts of WM5 and then maybe you could have made an intellegent decision regarding possibly turning your device into a "brick" and positively voiding your warranty.
If you look around just a little more you'll find that the downgrade is very painless. Mamaich and others have painstakinly documented the complete downgrade procedure. It's on the same page that you dl'ed the upgrade from ... the quick link is http://wiki.xda-developers.com/index.php?pagename=BA_Downgrade_WM5
Good luck!
SX66 (PH20B1) [Cingular]
ROM: 5.03.02 WWE
ROM date: 03/02/05
Ext ROM: 1.1.9.106
Radio: 1.15.00
Wow. Did I do any research? Yes, I linked to a page with a discussion about people doing the downgrade and having their Radio completely not work.
I guess you made the exact same totally intelligent decision as I did when you yourself upgraded the exact same device to WM5?
If *you* take 10 seconds to check the link that you posted, you'll see that in step #2, the only ROM available for the SX66 did not pass their tests and that, oh, what's this? The Radio doesn't work, just like the discussion I linked to.
Please don't assume I'm an idiot. Hacking handheld ROMs is not something you should get all offensive and riled up about.
Thanks for nothing. Does anyone have any other info?
hmmm... I have pda2k and I upgrade and downgrade all teh time... is the problem you are talking about specific to sx66?
FedoraPunk I never meant to call you an idiot, just curious on why you did an upgrade after discovering that many people had problems going back? Yes I have the same device. And the first time I did the downgrade, back in July, there wasn't a step 2 ... I took a big chance when Buzz, Mamaich and company started this particular forum knowing that I could very well blow up my device. I'm not riled and I apoligize if I'm offensive to you, I just didn't understand your decision to upgrade after learning the facts.
I personally have upgraded and downgraded my device at least 15 times since then, with no problems going back to WM 2003 excepting an ocassional ActiveSync issue downgrading to 3.8
What I suggest is to use Chris' SX66 (Blue Angel) Standardization Project at http://sx66-blueangel.home.comcast.net/
Replace the Standard and Extended Roms with his cooked ROM's. Any problems just ask and I'll be happy to help.
SX66 (PH20B1) [Cingular]
ROM: 5.03.02 WWE
ROM date: 03/02/05
Ext ROM: 1.1.9.106
Radio: 1.15.00
I have (personally) upgrade & downgrade SX66 myself using the link provided above and did not run into any issues.
What exactly are not working after downgrading? Maybe I can check (if I decided to downgrade again)
Ok, I got the right ROM from Chris's site (I chose the 1.33.51 because it's 2003 with WMP10) but I don't know which Radio ROM to flash - can I use 1.15.00? Or is there one that 2003 likes?
I'm using 1.15 with no problems. I personally use the 1.40 but that's me.
Good luck.
Steven
btw, I just went back to WM 2003 less than an hour ago ......
SX66 (PH20B1) [Cingular]
ROM: 1.40.00 WWE
ROM date: 03/102/05
Ext ROM: 1.40.125 WME
Radio: 1.15.00
Aright, I got 2003 back on there no sweat.
I wanna put radio 1.15, but the directions I'm getting are confusing me. I've got an SX66, unlocked. Could someone send me the deviceinfo or whatever it is? I've got the ROM and the Update app, I'm just fuzzy on what else to do.
Simply replace the radio rom file (radio.nbf) with the new radio rom and run MaUpgradeUt_noID. Being that you've already installed the Rom of choice simply rename / move that file from the install directory on your PC. I personally have never lsot any data or configuration settings by upgrading the radio this way.
Steven
SX66 (PH20B1) [Cingular]
ROM: 1.40.00 WWE
ROM date: 03/102/05
Ext ROM: 1.40.125 WME
Radio: 1.15.00
I tried that, and got the device ID error. I need some file to tell the updater what device or something?
I have the same problem with that. I used to uninstall AS 4.1 and put 3.8 back on. However now I've gone back and forth so many times with AS that 4.1 won't entirely uninstall. I have to run AS 4.1 now. I use 2nd computer, install AS 3.8, do not configure sync. Place device in bootloader mode and the run the MaUpgradeUt_noID.
Steven
SX66 (PH20B1) [Cingular]
ROM: 1.40.00 WWE
ROM date: 03/102/05
Ext ROM: 1.40.125 WME
Radio: 1.15.00
Hell yeah - I had to figure out which radio 1.15 file to use, but I got this thing working and signal strength does seem better.
Hi,
Ever since upgrading to 2.17 (official QTEK version) I can no longer get a stable WiFi connection - I get poor signal displayed even though I am next to the AP and it can take anything from 5 to 20 attempts to get connected.
The 9100 came with 1.6.7 installed which not perfect more or less connected first time, but I hoped the later ROMs would fix some other stability problems.
I have tried AKU 2.3 and I still get the same issues (plus I miss the battery indicator in the top bar).
Also, I cannot get back to 1.6.7 (I managed to get the OS back to it but the other 2 were stuck at 2.4) as every time I try I get vendor ID is wrong.
Any ideas?
Cheers,
Taomyn
I have the same problem, but even worse. I see the network after connecting it says it is connected but I cannot browse or do anything on the "socalled Internet" DHCP says that it found an adress in my case at home 192.168.1.33.
I am not sure if an upgrade would help.
My wifi version is 01.04.10
I am looking for any idea too.
Just an update, though the problem remains.
I have downgraded the OS to 2.17 as it seems better than the later ones posted and is at least a QTEK one.
Still hit and miss with the WiFi
Does anyone know if there are any later QTEK ROMS available?
search this forum to find a solution to downgrade the rom version to 1.x then do CID unlock using aWizard.
or you should try upgrade to cingular 2.25WWE rom to see if there is any improvement.
huangyz said:
search this forum to find a solution to downgrade the rom version to 1.x then do CID unlock using aWizard.
or you should try upgrade to cingular 2.25WWE rom to see if there is any improvement.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I did try various of the downgrade tips but none seemed to work even though I've got a G3, so hopefully the LokiWiz will be updated soon to work on v2 ROMS.
The Cingular 2.25 ROM didn't work very well either and I hated the extra rubbish it comes with. The radio ROM I happen to be using was from that same one.
I suppose I could go for the 2.25 OS but not the Extension - would that leave behind the Cingular crap?
Taomyn said:
I did try various of the downgrade tips but none seemed to work even though I've got a G3, so hopefully the LokiWiz will be updated soon to work on v2 ROMS.
The Cingular 2.25 ROM didn't work very well either and I hated the extra rubbish it comes with. The radio ROM I happen to be using was from that same one.
I suppose I could go for the 2.25 OS but not the Extension - would that leave behind the Cingular crap?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I now run 2.25rom without its original Extrom. It works perfect for me.
huangyz said:
I now run 2.25rom without its original Extrom. It works perfect for me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks. I have now loaded the following but with the QTEK 2.17 Extension ROM:
IPL: 2.24
SPL: 2.24
GSM: 02.25.11
OS: 2.25.11.1
I will have to wait until tonight to try the wireless at home.
One thing I've noticed is that I don't have a battery indicator at all now, neither in the Today window or the bar at the top. I'll dig around more to see why this has happened.
Taomyn said:
huangyz said:
I now run 2.25rom without its original Extrom. It works perfect for me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks. I have now loaded the following but with the QTEK 2.17 Extension ROM:
IPL: 2.24
SPL: 2.24
GSM: 02.25.11
OS: 2.25.11.1
I will have to wait until tonight to try the wireless at home.
One thing I've noticed is that I don't have a battery indicator at all now, neither in the Today window or the bar at the top. I'll dig around more to see why this has happened.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
it looks a little strange that you have a 2.25OS with 2.24IPL/SPL. :?
you could put a bat. icon on task bar by running Windows\Init_Tray.exe
Ok so I still can't get WiFi working :-( but at least I've sorted the the battery indicator out (thanks to a reg tweak for AKU2.2)
Which leads me to this AKU stuff. I keep reading about 2.3 but I'm not sure if this is an official release or something that someone has put together. I'm willing to give it a try but not if it's just 2.2 with some tweaks or something like that.
Can anyone shed some light on the AKU releases? Mine definitely says 2.2 at the moment.
Oh and can I simply create an upgrade file with just the 2.3 OS file in it?
TIA
Ok, my WiFi is still borked, it sees AP's all over the place but the ones I know it should connect to the phone just will not lock on to - it tries for a few seconds then simply says "Unavailable".
Currently I have on the phone a combination of:
IPL: 2.24
SPL: 2.24
GSM: 02.25.11
OS:2.24.10.1 WWE
Protocol: 4.1.13.12
ExtROM: 2.17.7.102
WM5 5.1.95 (14955.2.3.0)
I've actually tried what should have been a later OS, 2.25, but the AKU was 2.2 and the copyright message shows 2005 where as this one is AKU 2.3 with 2006 displayed.
I'm thinking now that perhaps the Extended ROM which is from the latest QTEK build I could find. Can anyone suggest a good replacement for it that doesn't have a load of baggage and only useful customisations?
As a last resort I'd like to try downgrading back to full 1.x ROM (QTEK 1.6.7 I think) but as I understand it this may not be possible. If it can be done, can anyone point me in the right direction i.e. which downgrade ROM to try? Yes, I have gone through this forum but it's almost "information overload" and very confusing,
TIA
if you update to shipped Cingular 2.25WWE rom, you can bypass all the extrom and see if wifi works normal (before you install other apps.)
Mine is ok.
the AKU2.3 one is a custom test rom which may cause slightly unstable.
while this still doesn't work, i think there's no means except sending your device back for checkup and repair.
Thanks, but how do I "bypass all the extrom"? Is there a clean extrom I can use with it?
Ok, I'm making progress.
I followed the instructions for downgrading, which although says it won't work for 2.21 or above, sort of does.
I downgraded to the custom 1.5.4 which succeeded but left SPL still at 2.24 but everything else had changed. I then ran the LokiWiz v0.2b and that seemed to succeed too at least there were no errors.
I then tested WiFi and it locked and connected first time - yay!!
Next I have taken the 1.6.7 QTEK ROM (which the phone originally had) and when that finished both IPL/SPL were downgraded to v1.x - WiFi still working.
At least now I know that WiFi is not borked but it's some strange ROM issue.
I'm going to try QTEK's 2.17 ROM and see what happens - at least I know I can get back to 1.x if it still doesn't work.
This is fun - not!!
Taomyn said:
Thanks, but how do I "bypass all the extrom"? Is there a clean extrom I can use with it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
after the RUU completed and restart automatically, after those init setting you must follow(eg. align screen, select time zone, etc.), at the moment when u see "customize within 3 seconds", poke the reset hole as quick as you can. Then you Bypass the extrom installation.
Thanks - you are being a great help, it's much appreciated.
I went back to 1.6.7 then added the Cingular 2.25 OS ROM but with the QTEK 2.17 extended ROM. What a mixture that is! WiFi would not work. I then hard reset and used your bypass technique - WiFi now works.
It seems that an extended ROM application is screwing up WiFi so I need to get everything up to the latest and greatest, bypass the extended ROM then one by one run them to see which is the culprit.
The plot thickens......
Well it looks like *any* v2 ROM screws up the WiFi on my phone and I have no idea why :x I have tried various combinations of ROM parts (proving the phone is most definitely CID unlocked :wink: ) and I either have no WiFi or some which progressively gets worse as time goes on to the point it stops connecting again.
I'm back to the original 1.6.7 QTEK WWE shipped ROM and WiFi works flawlessly but I'm now missing all the nice tweaks of v2 and I'm sure my BT headset doesn't work as well as before.
Maybe the next release will be better :?
Just to conclude this thread. The 2.26 ROM recently released seems to have cured my WiFi woes and it has made my phone run so much better than before.
I recommend it to anyone
Taomyn said:
Just to conclude this thread. The 2.26 ROM recently released seems to have cured my WiFi woes and it has made my phone run so much better than before.
I recommend it to anyone
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Cheers!
wifi probs with 2.26
i just upgraded my MDA USA to this ROM. My wifi now doesnt connect. It was working fine with ROM 1.08. Any suggestions? I havent tried bypassing the ext ROM, will this work? thanks
Same problem here as above
I got same wifi problem when upgrading from 2.25 to 2.26 .
i am going to revert back to 2.25 which is from the imate website. and hope it sorts it.
will get back to you when done.
Hi,
I upgraded a Cingular SX66 unit using maupgradeut_noid and the latest AKU 3.5.2 WM5 ROM. Afterward, I had no radio ROM so I updated to the 1.15.00 release. However, my phone is still unable to make/receive calls or data (with multiple good SIMs.) It appears the radio ROM is having issues with this WM5 package because sometimes on hard restarts the boot screen lists R: and G: as NONE, but after a soft reboot they usually show the correct versions.
I searched and can't find any postings about this type of behavior. Nothing useful to report from the phone other than it says "phone is not ready" and "no service" with a good SIM.
I have several of these PDAs that I want to distribute to my internal staff with WM5 so they don't have to learn WM2003 (all of our other devices are WM5 or WM6.) Any recommendations on a procedure to test the radio ROM or a different combination of OS and radio ROMs?
Thanks for the help.
PS. running getdevicedata.exe yields the following:
PH20B1 WWE A %CID? 5.35.05. 1.15.00 % 4
downgrade to wm2003 and try to flash again radio 1.15 and post the results
sandimashsfootballrules said:
Hi,
I upgraded a Cingular SX66 unit using maupgradeut_noid and the latest AKU 3.5.2 WM5 ROM. Afterward, I had no radio ROM so I updated to the 1.15.00 release. However, my phone is still unable to make/receive calls or data (with multiple good SIMs.) It appears the radio ROM is having issues with this WM5 package because sometimes on hard restarts the boot screen lists R: and G: as NONE, but after a soft reboot they usually show the correct versions.
I searched and can't find any postings about this type of behavior. Nothing useful to report from the phone other than it says "phone is not ready" and "no service" with a good SIM.
I have several of these PDAs that I want to distribute to my internal staff with WM5 so they don't have to learn WM2003 (all of our other devices are WM5 or WM6.) Any recommendations on a procedure to test the radio ROM or a different combination of OS and radio ROMs?
Thanks for the help.
PS. running getdevicedata.exe yields the following:
PH20B1 WWE A %CID? 5.35.05. 1.15.00 % 4
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Take it easy
all BA HAVE THE SAME PROBLEM AS YOU DESRIBLE
IF YOU USE WM2003 THE PROBLEM WILL DISAPPEAR~ SO，JUST SOFT RESET
YOUR PHONE EVERY TIME YOU CHANGE YOUR BETTERY！！
just one softreset, and when you need to charge, charge it when it reaches the 40%, etc, just don't take out the battery, or you will have to softreset it again for the radio work.
it is just the same with mine sx66, and i don't care at all.
Thanks for the notes...I kind of learned the soft reset 'fix' on my own, a little disappointing but I guess we're stuck with it. Why would I want to downgrade my phone to 2003? The whole point was to move to WM5 so my users and support team all work with the same interface.
Of course...my next project is to find out why SMSplus works on 8525 phones and not 8125 (standard Cingular OS load.) Might have to upgrade the 8125s to WM6 (sigh)