Database Develop

What is the highest bitrate video the kaiser can handle?

I want to convert some videos/movies to put on my kaiser, and would like to know what is the best format to use, and highest quality/bitrate i can use. I know the ipod can play 1500kbps mp4 perfectly, but it certainly doesnt work as well on a kaiser. Is there another format perhaps, that it can decode better with a high bitrate? Divx, etc...
So far ive tried mp4 at around 500kbps and it plays pretty much fine. and i synced a movie using wmp to 384kpbs and that works fine as well, but doesnt look so hot...

I'd say stay under or at 500.. until they update the graphics and video drivers, anything over wont play too well. I tested a 700 WMV Top Gear episode (love top gear ) and it was ripping and freezing like mad..

I transfered a 300 from my friends iphone to my tilt via wifi (which by the way is freaking cool) which was 1500kpbs, it was just sad to watch it try and play. I figured dual core 400mhz proc could handle it... Guess not till drivers come out.

OK, now I KNOW the Apple PA department are performing a dark war...
Its a POWER PPC!!! video play is a basic extra to all the other stuff an Ispudge can't do!!!
Get an Ispudge and throw you 'Kaiser' away and don't come on this forum if you are not happy (or have the knowledge to use it to its capability)!
Stop moaning!!

haha. i would never trade my kaiser for an iphone. Those things suck other then the video playback. I know what my kaiser can do, and thats why I love the thing. I'm not complaining about the kaiser in general, just wish it played video a little better.
Notice i didnt mention anything about actualy wanting an iphone

Farsquidge said:
OK, now I KNOW the Apple PA department are performing a dark war...
Its a POWER PPC!!! video play is a basic extra to all the other stuff an Ispudge can't do!!!
Get an Ispudge and throw you 'Kaiser' away and don't come on this forum if you are not happy (or have the knowledge to use it to its capability)!
Stop moaning!!
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Lets see - I paid 700 Bucks for this phone .... and you dont think that entitles me to want it to do what it is advertised to do right on the box? Why dont you take your HTC fanboy mouth and go back to kissing their butt. This forum is to discuss issues and as far as 99.9% of the community is concerned. The video playback and graphics performance in general is an ISSUE!!!.
Personally I love my Kaiser ... but I recognize its shortcomings as well.

Bratag said:
Lets see - I paid 700 Bucks for this phone .... and you dont think that entitles me to want it to do what it is advertised to do right on the box? Why dont you take your HTC fanboy mouth and go back to kissing their butt. This forum is to discuss issues and as far as 99.9% of the community is concerned. The video playback and graphics performance in general is an ISSUE!!!.
Personally I love my Kaiser ... but I recognize its shortcomings as well.
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Sorry to disagree but this forum is not to discuss YOUR personal gripe!, it was developed for the enthusiastic DEVELOPMENT of this equipment! and solving problems ourselves (technically, not OH I can't do it...let me sue!!!.
Get your facts in place first and come up to date with the Broadcomm v Qualcomm lawsuit (still ongoing) and find out why US does not have d3d and your phones were late in deployment. Blame the US not me pal!

Farsquidge said:
Sorry to disagree but this forum is not to discuss YOUR personal gripe!, it was developed for the enthusiastic DEVELOPMENT of this equipment! and solving problems ourselves (technically, not OH I can't do it...let me sue!!!.
Get your facts in place first and come up to date with the Broadcomm v Qualcomm lawsuit (still ongoing) and find out why US does not have d3d and your phones were late in deployment. Blame the US not me pal!
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Well as it has been pointed out previously to this thread - the law suit between Qualcomm and Broadcomm affects only the US. Given that HTC is not a US company, and in fact I didnt BUY my phone in the US I bought it direct from HTC. Explain to me how the lawsuit affects them developing drivers for the chip? Also Why should I have to solve the issue myself - am I not entitled to support? If you bought a car with a 300 HP engine in it and found out they didnt provide a drive shaft and you had to install one yourself ... does that sound like a good deal. This is no different. We bought the HW based on the press releases/specs all of which mention the qualcomm chip and its capabilities.
I didnt mention suing - I am in fact for the most part against litigation. I simply want either HTC/Qualcomm/MS (but mostly HTC) to step up to their responsibilities. Sometimes an LS is the only way to get companies to do that - but I for one hope it doesnt come down to that.

Bratag said:
This is no different. We bought the HW based on the press releases/specs all of which mention the qualcomm chip and its capabilities.
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Have you actually looked and worked on this device at programming level or are you just one of the 'mob'??
Why do you think I am here??? The Qualcomm chip is working just as much as it is allowed to.!

Farsquidge said:
Have you actually looked and worked on this device at programming level or are you just one of the 'mob'??
Why do you think I am here??? The Qualcomm chip is working just as much as it is allowed to.!
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No - I am an end consumer. I shouldnt have to learn how to program driver code (which by the way I can do being a programmer of drivers under linux etc and a coder by trade - of course that would actually require HW specs which we also dont have - but back to the point).
Why in the name of hell should I be responsible for fixing this issue? To use the car analogy again. If you buy a car and its under warranty and the clutch breaks - should you have to learn how to replace its clutch or do you take it back to the dealer?
I know the chip is working as much as its allowed to - the problem is the allowed amount sucks, thats the goddamn issue. You dont hear me complaining about the GPS - I use my garmin software on it and couldnt be happier with it. This is about BAD DRIVER SUPPORT!!. Its no different to ATI or NVIDIA providing bad drivers for vista when it first came out. The community went nuts when everything that used to work well under xp stopped working well. Well quite frankly my graphic ssupport was better under my wizard and thats a 3 year old + phone now. What you see here is the community expressing its displeasure at bad drivers.
Oh and if you check the d3d thread you will see I am following it - And have added what little input I can given the total lack of communication from HTC. You can see in that thread that other windows mobile phones using the qualcomm chip seem to have 3d/graphics support, why exactly can LG ect manage it and HTC not?

Farsquidge said:
Have you actually looked and worked on this device at programming level or are you just one of the 'mob'??
Why do you think I am here??? The Qualcomm chip is working just as much as it is allowed to.!
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I could have sworn reading that it had 3d video drivers enabled listed in the specs.. maybe I read wrong

Bratag said:
No - I am an end consumer.
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Sorry didn't want to quote your whole message as it was a bit large but just took the relevant bit!!
As in the rest of your rant! you quote about buying a car!! If you bought a car, without test driving it first, how would the laws cover you in the US???
You are one of many who are jumping on this d3d lobby. If you dont like the phone, THROW IT AWAY!!! If you check (and I mean REALLY check)all adds for this device they are not claiming anything above what you have, you are following rumour) Don't moan about what you have spent on it as with anyone SENSIBLE enough to think WHY DID YOU PAY SO MUCH TO buy a phone that does not fulfill your requirements WITHOUT CHECKING what you want????
DOH!! You are embarrasing yourself...

http://www.htc.com/support/pdf/htctytnII/Kaiser_HTC_English_Manual_web.pdf
Check out page 219/220. See the supported video formats. Go ahead and try open a h.264 video in media player. The drivers cant even do the formats that they give in the user manual.
PS: A test drive has f**k all to do with the example I quoted. You can test drive a car and not have it break - but when it does should you be responsible for learning how to fix it? More to the point car manufacturers issue recalls to fix issues all the time. Even after a TEST DRIVE. I never said I didnt like the phone BUT IT HAS A GODDAMN ISSUE. Why can you not acknowledge that when 99.9% of the user base does. If you cant then just sod off and stop posting your htc fanboy crap in the threads. All you do is troll. I am out of this. You are the one embarassing yourself. So far you havent come up with a single valid argument - from the lawsuit to your rebuttal of my example.

hes not embarrasing himself.
you are just showing how much of an ass you seem to be.

Bratag said:
http://www.htc.com/support/pdf/htctytnII/Kaiser_HTC_English_Manual_web.pdf
Check out page 219/220. See the supported video formats. Go ahead and try open a h.264 video in media player. The drivers cant even do the formats that they give in the user manual.
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Again You are confusing HTC's quotation of WM6 OS of what it 'SHOULD' be able to do against what it 'CAN' do.... This has nothing to do with the Qualcomm chip and HTC as a whole, they are limited by the OS and its capabilities.
Check out my LinksysWVC54GC IP cam link thread. The downstreamed mjpeg video is excellent using TCPMP (OH BTW uses d3d!! as WM player in WM6 is still limited and can not!)
Go to basics and realise WM6 and its basic apps is still requiring major changes!!!
Soz if I upset, but just putting the facts.

I'm confused
Bratag... this is *NOT* the "HTC Kaiser Consumer Support" forum. If you have a problem with HTC's Support, I suggest you contact them directly.
This forum is for people that have the phone and want to develop their own programs for it etc.
To use your car analogy; this forum is like Fred down the road, he's replaced the windscreen wipers on his own car, in his own garage, with bright flash ones that the car manufacturer didn't make. He believes that makes his car a bit better than when he bought it...

Just a short fact on the topic, I have a library of movies encoded at around 475 kb/sec at 320x240 that I've used on Archos Players, PPCs, 8525, and now Kaiser with TCPMP and they play and look perfect.
I would like the correct drivers as well to increase general video performance, the Kaiser just cuts it close right now as-is.

GTRoberts said:
I'm confused
This forum is for people that have the phone and want to develop their own programs for it etc.
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I whole heartedly disagree
So the "xda-developers > General Discussion > Development and Hacking" is for??
Or the "xda-developers > Kaiser > Kaiser Upgrading" ?
And why are people getting all over Bratag anyway? He didn't intend to flame anyone, which can not be said by some other members.
Back on topic, I would be interested in what people's experiences are with encoding settings that DO work. It does su<& that I have to use two or more different encodings, and it is definitely disappointing that I can't even play a video file without intervention that my $150 camera can record and play, but if we get back to discussing encoding/transcoding to some particular formats and settings, we can actually help each other instead of bashing.
So for WM6, it sounds like bitrate is best to be <500. Does the fomat matter? I have heard Divx and/or AVI. Has anyone tried any others? Can a difference be seen between them?

I find some of the Freeware transcoders to be very 'hit n miss' such as PocketDivX and Pocket DVD, unable to keep audio/video sync on large files.
If you have all the necessary codecs for WM player on your PC so they will play on it (for most dowladed DivX files that end in .avi you will need latest DivX codec and an AC3 audio codec) then just sync them to your phone and they should play quite well in Pocket WM player and even better on TCPMP with RAW selected!

i think you need to calm down - its almost as if you dont want your device to support 3d or accelerated surfaces - what is wrong with you?

Can somebody pleace explain this?

ok, i've already signed the drivers perition for the kaiser on his forum but there is something that i do not understand. say htc does agre to give us the drivers, wont this be a hardware change or will it be a software on. if hardware thing then how wil they pull back all of the already sold kaisers? if it's a software change, cam' somebody here cook a rom that will get the drivers working? watching vids on the tilt isn't the greatest so can somebody please explain this to me. thanks

kareem9nba said:
ok, i've already signed the drivers perition for the kaiser on his forum but there is something that i do not understand. say htc does agre to give us the drivers, wont this be a hardware change or will it be a software on. if hardware thing then how wil they pull back all of the already sold kaisers? if it's a software change, cam' somebody here cook a rom that will get the drivers working? watching vids on the tilt isn't the greatest so can somebody please explain this to me. thanks
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Drivers are a set of instructions for the hardware...

In short:
Software

Well to explain it a little bit, the problem on the actual firmware/drivers is, that they aren't optimized enough for the video performance stuff... so they want htc to work on the drivers for that stuff, to use the full capacity of the current internal hardware!
So the hardware it self is good and has the capacity for improvements, but the htc frimware/drivers are not able to use it.
So if HTC works on the driver they can get a lot more power/performance out of the current hardware

Imagine someone selling computer chips without telling anyone how to use them. Chips need to receive a specific set of instructions and provide a specific set of results.
We are not mad that HTC sold us a device that is missing a chip, we are mad that HTC sold us a chip that doesn't fully function. They have sold us an engine without the timing computer and are telling us we should push our cars everywhere.

gthing said:
Imagine someone selling computer chips without telling anyone how to use them. Chips need to receive a specific set of instructions and provide a specific set of results.
We are not mad that HTC sold us a device that is missing a chip, we are mad that HTC sold us a chip that doesn't fully function. They have sold us an engine without the timing computer and are telling us we should push our cars everywhere.
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I'm so over this whole "HTC owes me", and so on... At the end of the day, it plays back videos. Not as well as it could, agreed - But it plays them. This is not the PRIMARY function of the device - please stop comparing it to the cars engine. Keep it in perspective... I'd say this function is more comparable it to say a cars factory stereo system.
HTC didn't sell you a video player, they sold you a phone, that also has HEAPS of other functions, video playback being ONE of them. So many things about the phone are great, but that doesn't seem to matter apparantly.
The Kaiser is a huge improvement in many ways over the Hermes, so I think it's a fantastic product
Sorry, but time for everyone to just get over that "I'm a victim" attitude already... Every second thread there's non stop whining about it.
I can't believe no one else seems to agree with me on this.... absolutely ridiculous.

greeek said:
I can't believe no one else seems to agree with me on this.... absolutely ridiculous.
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I do.. Wholeheartedly!

so youre moaning about people moaning?

fusi said:
so youre moaning about people moaning?
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Ha Ha.. ya got me there!! Good one.

Well then, can't some good rom cooker cook a rom with the included drivers that perfects the tilt?

kareem9nba said:
Well then, can't some good rom cooker cook a rom with the included drivers that perfects the tilt?
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Well, they can't cook in software drivers that don't exist yet.
Maybe when a product that uses the same chip that also has the proper drivers comes out.
Now I agree with the poster that says it's not a big deal, it is a phone after all. But if we can get it implemented even better. I wouldn't go crazy over it, but there nothing wrong with keeping the manufacturers honest so they give us the best product possible.

greeek said:
I'm so over this whole "HTC owes me", and so on...
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Sorry mate, but even when compared with a car stereo the lack of proper drivers is a major issue.
Imagine buying a new BMW E92 as an upgrade from E46, with a Pioneer/Kenwood/Sony/Altec Lansing/Sehnheiser speaker system installed and wired to a... TAPEDECK, which also happens to be out of sync with the cassete and does not have enough power to drive the speakers, at all, and I'm talking about whisper-level volume. Sure, it gets you around and looks bling-y and has a bundled GPS and audio playback is not a primary feature of a car, but for some reason your old E46 and your neighbours Toyota Corolla does a better job at it (not to mention that it runs longer on one gas refill).
You paid a big wad of cash for a device advertised and priced as "ultimate", yet it lacks a feature you got used to having on your previous one and the manufacturer doesnt even have the decency to admit its mistake, dont you think you have every bit of a reason to be mad at them?

Yes Mikeer... HTC the big fascist company that it is has robbed you and many others! Everyone is so hard done by, and it's not fair what they've done!
I'll contact 60 minutes, you contact the News, and we'll meet back here in an hour to discuss how we can get whats rightfully ours!!
Those bastards...

greeek said:
Yes Mikeer... HTC the big fascist company that it is has robbed you and many others! Everyone is so hard done by, and it's not fair what they've done!
I'll contact 60 minutes, you contact the News, and we'll meet back here in an hour to discuss how we can get whats rightfully ours!!
Those bastards...
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I see your point and I don't feel HTC owes me anything. HTC should at least, deliver on what they advertise.
My 1st generation Kaiser aka Tmobile MDA played back video without any stutters. I would expect that a successor device developed two hardware cycles later work better than it's little brother.

unorthodoxx said:
I see your point and I don't feel HTC owes me anything. HTC should at least, deliver on what they advertise.
My 1st generation Kaiser aka Tmobile MDA played back video without any stutters. I would expect that a successor device developed two hardware cycles later work better than it's little brother.
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And thats quite simply just one small disappointing factor in the device.
Myself, instead of petitioning and whatever other nonsense, put it down to an aspect of the device that wasn't as good this time around. Next device release, I'd look at it to see if I wanted to go down that path again... If it bothered me that much, I'd move on to a different brand and be done with it...
Build a bridge people...

greeek said:
HTC didn't sell you a video player, they sold you a phone, that also has HEAPS of other functions, video playback being ONE of them. So many things about the phone are great, but that doesn't seem to matter apparantly.
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Actually, it seems too me that its a Pocket PC first, a phone/messaging second .

greeek said:
And thats quite simply just one small disappointing factor in the device.
Myself, instead of petitioning and whatever other nonsense, put it down to an aspect of the device that wasn't as good this time around. Next device release, I'd look at it to see if I wanted to go down that path again... If it bothered me that much, I'd move on to a different brand and be done with it...
Build a bridge people...
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Another disappointing factor is the so-and-so quality of the 3 MP camera. About half of the photos I have shot with my TyTN II have turned out worse than what I got from my old i-mate JASJAM. Auto focus seems to be missing often on landscape shots and has difficulties with infinity:
(Click on image for full size photo.)
Compare the above TyTN II photo with the JASJAM photo I posted here.
Plus that the photo quality looks like 2 MP photos interpolated up to 3 MP size. So I usually keep the camera set to 2 MP :-(
(Apologies for side-tracking the topic of this thread.)
Overall I would say though that I am fairly satisfied but I doubt that my next smartphone will be anything produced by HTC.

abubasim said:
Overall I would say though that I am fairly satisfied but I doubt that my next smartphone will be anything produced by HTC.
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Cool, like I say... next time you may decide not buy HTC - thats the price a company can pay if you don't like their product. Doesn't mean that they are obligated to do anything for you now... At the end of the day, their product does what they said it would - even if it's not to the standard of some of these users...

what are the chances that we will get these drivers? high or low? will it be a whole new rom? maybe windows6.1 or just 6? If they're thinking of 6.1 then we probably wont get these drivers till mid next year. photon will almost be out by then. any chances we get them before the end of the year or no?

greeek said:
I'm so over this whole "HTC owes me", and so on... At the end of the day, it plays back videos. Not as well as it could, agreed - But it plays them. This is not the PRIMARY function of the device - please stop comparing it to the cars engine. Keep it in perspective... I'd say this function is more comparable it to say a cars factory stereo system.
HTC didn't sell you a video player, they sold you a phone, that also has HEAPS of other functions, video playback being ONE of them. So many things about the phone are great, but that doesn't seem to matter apparantly.
The Kaiser is a huge improvement in many ways over the Hermes, so I think it's a fantastic product
Sorry, but time for everyone to just get over that "I'm a victim" attitude already... Every second thread there's non stop whining about it.
I can't believe no one else seems to agree with me on this.... absolutely ridiculous.
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Did you forget about the crappy camera?

Comparing my Old Smartphone with The kaiser

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qbaDLzOU_Y
Comparing web-browsing. kaiser VS the first HTC smartphone model.
I know there are fixes for this @ Xda, but this shows, that everything is´nt alright with the Kaiser.
And HTC does nothing. - cause this is not a problem right? ^^
I Hope I get som reactions @ HTC.

Damn.. even with the IE fix posted on this site, it's still not as smooth as that.

disgusting!!!!!!!!!! i wanna get a TYTN 1 now!!!!!

Screw the TYTN1, give me that fugly 90's phone! I bet its Bluetooth stack actually works too!

Pretty ridiculous, they better get on it.

mindbeat said:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qbaDLzOU_Y
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Excellent video. Shows up the issue with IE scrolling right away
I doubt HTC will do anything though, they only care about shipping out old products whilst making new cash-cows.
I bet we'll soon hear rumours of the "Tytn III" with high speed video and slimmer design.
This is definitely my last HTC purchase, hell the iGroan looks way way better now (even though hardware limited, locked in, and costly)
Alas not having a video camera, I cant make a video. It would be nice if someone can post a similar video of the camera issues (comparing camera jitter at various resolutions, and speed)

The stockholders have our money, why the hell would they care about us?
Loyal customers asking for things to be 'set right' do not get the attention of chairmen and stockholders, quarterly profits do.
If enough loyal customers never buy an HTC product again, that MIGHT effect profit enough to grow a concern (but they will not know why, and will never connect it to those who begged for a fix.)
Based on their past response and handling of the situation, potential loss is the only thing that can grow attention.
I'd say
1) A lawsuit that could generate bad publicity
2) Very poor reviews for new products outlining issues like this.
Could work well on gaining attention from those in charge, neither of those has been done above. I do know of developers in HTC who would like to work on a fix, but the management will not devote resources on it. The development team IS aware of the issue from quotes and responses I've seen. It's up to us to somehow push the chairmen to want to devote resources on the development of a fix.
Sorry for poor sentence structure, I'm very tired.

Added it to the wiki:
http://www.htcwiki.com/page/HTC+TyTN+II+Video+Issues
BTW does anyone have a link to that fix? Haven't heard of a fix for the poor scrolling yet.

Great work, actually the first video showing that the performance is actually worse than on older devices.
Hopefully it results in more awareness of the video driver issue on the tytn ii.

undac said:
Added it to the wiki:
http://www.htcwiki.com/page/HTC+TyTN+II+Video+Issues
BTW does anyone have a link to that fix? Haven't heard of a fix for the poor scrolling yet.
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Thanks!
here is a link:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=337521

IE-Explorer Scrolling
Use Kaiser Tweaks to get the IE-scrolling right. PocketIE, D-Pad Scroll Navigation. Enable it to scroll with the D-Pad. (Default behavior tabs between form fields and hyperlinks).

Heh, I was just playing with an old Wizard, and even that is faster

It's so sad .
I have an old wizard too, just replaced that for my tytnII.
If I didnt really like the built in GPS and HSPDA functions I'd go back for now...

If you guys are interested I can post a video of my Linux phone running Opera. It's extremely smooth.

I called the HTC support, cause wanted to provide them with my youtube video, but he said they where aware of the issue, and looking into it right now, and was not intersted in the youtube video,

Should I Not Buy New Kaiser Because of Video Problems?

Hi All,
I currently own an HTC magician. I want a new phone with everything the magician has plus GPS, WIFI, more RAM, and a keyboard. The only phone I found that comes close is the Kaiser, but I've heard such bad things about the video driver problem.
Video is not the biggest issue for me, but should I not buy the phone and support HTC who refuses to cooperate?
Do I have any other options with those specs?
Thanks,
Daniel

I have a Kaiser and I am very happy with it, because I can do so much with it. However if a bit of lag annoys you greatly it may not be for you.
Surur

NO. Wait some time whether the issue get resolved. Its not only the video - the whole phone is slow. You can not browse, rotating you screen. If i make a call with skype, the phone is really very slow and if i slide the keyboard and the screen orientation switches it can take up to minute to be updated - with nothing in background and free mem - only skype running. And until it switches you cant hang up, change the volume...nothing.
To be honest, i regret buying the Kaiser. And if i see how fast a cheap HiPhone can be, omg!
I wonder how HTC can have this on their webpage: More powerful than anything you've seen before, the HTC TyTN II takes communications to the next level.
You have to be blind a live 5years back, for the slogan to be true...
I bought it mainly because of the 3g and wifi and wm6... but there are better solutions then this for 520 euro...
Beware!

wait for kaiser fix

If video is not heavily used, buy it now. I bought it recently and like it very mcuh. But higher performance is still demanded...

fredbred said:
I bought it mainly because of the 3g and wifi and wm6... but there are better solutions then this for 520 euro...
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better device with 3g, wifi, and wm6? like what?
get the kaiser...it's no slower then any other wm6 device out there and although yes it would be nice if we could play more games, normal res video runs perfectly fine.

fredbred said:
NO. Wait some time whether the issue get resolved. Its not only the video - the whole phone is slow. You can not browse, rotating you screen. If i make a call with skype, the phone is really very slow and if i slide the keyboard and the screen orientation switches it can take up to minute to be updated - with nothing in background and free mem - only skype running. And until it switches you cant hang up, change the volume...nothing.
To be honest, i regret buying the Kaiser. And if i see how fast a cheap HiPhone can be, omg!
I wonder how HTC can have this on their webpage: More powerful than anything you've seen before, the HTC TyTN II takes communications to the next level.
You have to be blind a live 5years back, for the slogan to be true...
I bought it mainly because of the 3g and wifi and wm6... but there are better solutions then this for 520 euro...
Beware!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This may all be true if you're still using the stock ROM. There are some really smokin' cooked ROMs out there that really speed things up and make the Kaiser a truly enjoyable device.
One other thing, show me a PC that doesn't slow down once in awhile. That's what defrag is for.

Delta_flyer said:
One other thing, show me a PC that doesn't slow down once in awhile. That's what defrag is for.
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So you equate flashing a cooked ROM with clicking the "Defrag" button? One is a feature built into the operating system, the other can void your warranty and potentially brick your device. They're nowhere near the same thing.
I'm telling everybody I know to avoid HTC like the plague. Not so much directly because of the video issues, but because of their lack of accountability. They deliberately released a crippled device in hopes that nobody would notice, and are now working on some half-assed "fix" only because of the publicity that was generated by the XDA community.

Get one. I was in the same boat hesitating about the drivers. I am glad i made my decision. I upgraded from a 8525. Glad i did i have everything i need in one device. GPS Wifi, processing power. Im not sure what the full potential of this chip is supposed to be but its fast. I actually got mine refurbished from att about a month ago. After using it i ended up buying another one today for my wife and paying full price. Im not disatisfied. Definatly waht i would expect out of a 400 dollar phone.

Like most answers, it lives in the question.
"Because of Video Problems". Do you need or want to view videos not converted to 320x240 resolution? If you do need or want that that from your new expensive mobile device, then pass. ---- NO KAISER FOR YOU!
If you want a snappy interface and quick file browsing experience, then wait for the HTC "fixes". But still forget lag-free video at source resolutions above 320x240. ---------- > Get a Kaiser, and hope you can fix it.
Do you want fancy graphical VGA games or anything 3D? Forget the Kaiser.
Do you want a Windows Mobile 6 device that has real GPS, WiFi, 3G, Edge, 2 cameras (one for video calls, one for decent pics), querty keyboard, and bluetooth? And are able to put up with the device doing NONE of those things particularly well, then ----> Get a Kaiser.
I have a Kaiser. I live through its quirks. Its a fun device depending on your definition of "fun".
Do I regret paying $850+ for my device even knowing I was an early adopter? Yes. The device advertised was not the device delivered.
Would I discourage others from buying it at a $200 USD price point? No.
But then again, its up to you and what you expect from your device.

With Schap's ROM (4.31) and Coreplayer 1.2 i needn't a fix for "video pb"
I don't play 3D game.

Do not listen to most of what the naysayers have to say here. I have an iMate K-Jam and now I have an HTC TyTN II. I have done many comparison tests between the two devices. The TyTN II wins HANDS DOWN!!!
Driver problems? What driver problems? I have yet to find any lag on any video except maybe a bit on the camcorder app, but that's not a big issue. I watch full feature movies on Coreplayer and I have used TCPMP and WM Player with wayyyyyyyy BETTER performance than on my K-Jam!!!
Don't even think about it, go right ahead and buy a TyTN II, you will not regret it. Problem is most people drag these devices through their backsides and then they complain about this and that. They replace roms, install and uninstall all sorts of crap and then they wonder why it's acting up!!!
I have had my TyTN II since the 15th January this year and I have not experienced any of the so-called problems mentioned by some in this forum. OK, the battery does get used up quicker, but then again it has so much packed in and you can get 3000 mAH batteries now!!!
This sub-forum (Kaiser) is more like the Cheese & Whine forum!!!
BUY IT!!!!

Hey is this a HTC deHey is this a HTC dealer Thread?
The TyTN isn’t a finished device. There are much more bugs and “features” which should be avoid.
1 Video – its really slow. I don’t mind games, I even don’t watch video , because I have other devices for this, but if I wan to scroll the internet page, that’s not the speed I have never seen before! Why takes it so long to switch between portrait and landscape?
And the video from the camera I also pretty slow.
2 Speed – I have used a Fujitsu siemens n560. It was MUCH faster even if it was older and has 64mb ram.
3 The keyboard – this was one of the features why I have chosen tytn. But why they do not think if the do anything. Omg where is the ctrl key? How can you copy and paste? I have always to use the pen for it. No they put rather a key for opening the explorer, which I have used twice so far. And why have I to use the fn key to write a comma? And do you like the style of the keys? Its not even possible to write comfortably the last row of keys if you bent the display? And why are the functions of the keys doubled? Its for disabled people or maybe if you bite off some finger bored from waiting? I would expect that I can configure every key not to have three key for OK two for enter…
And maybe try to write any non-English letter – no we are in the world where no others languages exist.
I tell you, they are not selling what they are telling – What you have been told is not what you get.
What is good – the speed of gps starting, If you use quick gps.
Have a look how fast a under $200 device can be! Put Hiphone in youtube and you will know how fast the screen should react and switch.
Its not only about the damn driver, the parts of the phone are not finished. Not if the producer tells you: It’s the best you can get...

fredbred said:
Hey is this a HTC deHey is this a HTC dealer Thread?
The TyTN isn’t a finished device. There are much more bugs and “features” which should be avoid.
1 Video – its really slow. I don’t mind games, I even don’t watch video , because I have other devices for this, but if I wan to scroll the internet page, that’s not the speed I have never seen before! Why takes it so long to switch between portrait and landscape?
And the video from the camera I also pretty slow.
2 Speed – I have used a Fujitsu siemens n560. It was MUCH faster even if it was older and has 64mb ram.
3 The keyboard – this was one of the features why I have chosen tytn. But why they do not think if the do anything. Omg where is the ctrl key? How can you copy and paste? I have always to use the pen for it. No they put rather a key for opening the explorer, which I have used twice so far. And why have I to use the fn key to write a comma? And do you like the style of the keys? Its not even possible to write comfortably the last row of keys if you bent the display? And why are the functions of the keys doubled? Its for disabled people or maybe if you bite off some finger bored from waiting? I would expect that I can configure every key not to have three key for OK two for enter…
And maybe try to write any non-English letter – no we are in the world where no others languages exist.
I tell you, they are not selling what they are telling – What you have been told is not what you get.
What is good – the speed of gps starting, If you use quick gps.
Have a look how fast a under $200 device can be! Put Hiphone in youtube and you will know how fast the screen should react and switch.
Its not only about the damn driver, the parts of the phone are not finished. Not if the producer tells you: It’s the best you can get...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
which is why you should try a cooked rom. the internet scrolling thing u mention? its a bug in pie, there;s a fix for that......if you decide to stick to pie, cause lets face it, pie is a pile of **** anyways. try opera mini or mobile. oh and btw......i did get my tilt for under $200
as for the OPs question, there are tons of posts here about the performance of these devices (you might also want to look in the upgrading section to see the performance of cooked roms) and I'm not gonna dd anymore to it. At the end of the day, you are the one who has to make the decision, and you are the one who will be using this device, my advice to you is just choose wisely......i took the jump and got it even after hearing about the video issues, and i never regretted it.

Just get a Kaiser and wait till end of March when the drivers will be released.

MACkjam said:
Do not listen to most of what the naysayers have to say here. I have an iMate K-Jam and now I have an HTC TyTN II. I have done many comparison tests between the two devices. The TyTN II wins HANDS DOWN!!!
Driver problems? What driver problems? I have yet to find any lag on any video except maybe a bit on the camcorder app, but that's not a big issue. I watch full feature movies on Coreplayer and I have used TCPMP and WM Player with wayyyyyyyy BETTER performance than on my K-Jam!!!
Don't even think about it, go right ahead and buy a TyTN II, you will not regret it. Problem is most people drag these devices through their backsides and then they complain about this and that. They replace roms, install and uninstall all sorts of crap and then they wonder why it's acting up!!!
I have had my TyTN II since the 15th January this year and I have not experienced any of the so-called problems mentioned by some in this forum. OK, the battery does get used up quicker, but then again it has so much packed in and you can get 3000 mAH batteries now!!!
This sub-forum (Kaiser) is more like the Cheese & Whine forum!!!
BUY IT!!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you buy this phone you'll be taking a risk. It may be a small risk depending on what you'll have to pay, but a risk nonetheless of not being satisfied. At least you will have made your choice in good conscience and aware of the situation. Truth is we shouldn't have to compare this device to much older ones and say it's better. It shouldn't warrant a comparison at all but since it does there is obviously a problem. There are those that will tell you their TyTN II is "SUPER ACCEPTABLE!" but that's hardly the point. I didn't buy this thing believing it would have acceptable performance. This device is supposed to kick ass and we believe it would if it used the complete architecture of the chip inside. I got mine for $700 and my plan here on out is to just grin and bear it. There isn't an alternative device available yet and HTC has us over the fence on this thing. The anticipated fix is not going to address our concern of enabling the second core of the chip we paid for. I can confirm for you my experiences with the TyTN II and keep in mind this is before I 'dragged it through my backside' by flashing the ROM. (By the way why in the world would it matter whether it's been flashed or how many times programs have been installed/uninstalled?)
- Video playback is fine if my source is 320 X 240. I have always re-encoded my video anyway in an effort to save space and optimize everything. For this reason I didn't know there was a video playback problem right away.
- The camera is almost unusable. I have turned on the on-screen fps display and in sunlight I get ~18fps, in ambient light make that ~4fps and if it's semi dark forget about it. This effects taking pictures and taking video. The video I shoot ends up looking like a blurry mess and any picture I take better be of a stationary subject or else I will usually miss the shot. Interestingly enough the device takes great photos though.
- Screen rotation is a sore subject. I want the thing to be fluid but instead I have to watch it redraw slowly and in seperate pieces.
- Scrolling - it isn't certain that scrolling problem is a result of the missing drivers. I have to say that scrolling isn't very good but there is a fix on this forum to make it more reasonable.
- GPS works great, I've never had an issue with it although it kills the battery fast. Especially fast when using Google maps or live search because then you have the active GPRS data session combined with the gps.
- Battery life - I have a 1600mAH bat and I have to charge it every day but then again I auto download podcasts and such so I am partially to blame. As I understand it the drivers would increase battery life.
That's about it from me. Sorry this post is so long, let me wrap it up. I don't think anyone can tell you to buy or not to buy. You'll just have to make a decision yourself. At least it will be an informed decision, unlike mine.
word

"Video is not the biggest issue for me, but should I not buy the phone and support HTC who refuses to cooperate?"
With all due respect to all you guys complaining about video drivers.. STFU! already.
No one complained until one geeky ass dude bought it up. I have no problems playing my movies on my device or streaming it via orb.com. I get no lag and for god sakes it's a mobile phone not a computer. It surpasses most devices to date. I have no complaint about this phone. This is like my 40th something phone that I've had being that I work for AT&T and they provide me with devices. When the update comes people will still be *****ing about the video drivers. What exactly are you guys trying to watch? Live video feeds from Mars!?
Seriously get the phone you will not be disappointed. For the record my device does not lag when I slide the screen, etc. I've installed Schaps 4.31 best looking ROM to date. Haven't found another ROM that made me want to change.

even with no video drivers, it's still the best branded phone in the US. theres nothing better. (yet)

gqstatus0685 said:
"Video is not the biggest issue for me, but should I not buy the phone and support HTC who refuses to cooperate?"
With all due respect to all you guys complaining about video drivers.. STFU! already.
No one complained until one geeky ass dude bought it up. I have no problems playing my movies on my device or streaming it via orb.com. I get no lag and for god sakes it's a mobile phone not a computer. It surpasses most devices to date. I have no complaint about this phone. This is like my 40th something phone that I've had being that I work for AT&T and they provide me with devices. When the update comes people will still be *****ing about the video drivers. What exactly are you guys trying to watch? Live video feeds from Mars!?
Seriously get the phone you will not be disappointed. For the record my device does not lag when I slide the screen, etc. I've installed Schaps 4.31 best looking ROM to date. Haven't found another ROM that made me want to change.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
AMEN TO THAT BROTHER!!!!! I couldn't agree more with you!!!
I think that people expect to dial to Pluto with live feeds from the nethergalaxy and back!!!

gqstatus0685 said:
...I work for AT&T...
I've installed Schaps 4.31 best looking ROM to date. Haven't found another ROM that made me want to change.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Awesome! So it is the official AT&T position that we should all install cooked ROMs on our Tilts? Is that what you tell your customers? And it won't void the warranty? That's fantastic news.
Can you please post your store number and employee ID number so your statement can be confirmed with AT&T corporate? Thanks!

day by day review of diamond.

Coolsmartphone are doing a day by day review with a guy using it for a week. At least we'll find out about things like battery life!
days 1 and 2 are up, and u can ask quesions in the forum post for each day.
http://www.coolsmartphone.com/

Great review

Thx! Really Really nice review! Take a look ppl!
I for one have confirmed to buying this phone after watching this video. The video
showed that the keys are very responsive when dialing numbers, which is really important I think.

yeah, and you can ask him questions to answer in the next days review. If you can't be bothered to register to add a question, just ask here and i'll post it there.

I don't think he has been asked, what Version Tomtom Navigator he tried on it, and if this was delivered with the device or did he install it on his own?

lots of people have already asked that in day3..
Check here first:
http://www.coolsmartphone.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=12471

Day 4
Day 4 has just been uploaded...

@ someone1234,
Could you ask the following questions on my behalf, many thanks...
1. During your day 4 video you COPIED a picture into a subdirectory called new folder and though it showed up in the TouchFlo 3D app. However you should have MOVED the picture rather than COPYING it as the app will have picked up the original, or you should have seen the image twice. Could you re-do the test as a MOVE rather than COPY.
2. Could you try some games on the screen to see how they behave under VGA, try worms world party from jamdat if you can download the demo, and see if its easy to aim, you should have 6/7 steps between horizontal and vertical aim.
3. Using TomTom could you compare the calculating route time between two devices calculating the same route. Also brows the map on the diamond, and zoom fully out from street level to the whole of the map (UK or Europe) to let us see how quickly it re-renders the map.

Did anyone else notice the HORRIBLE video playback? I did. It looks just as bad as the Kaiser. WTF!?

juiceppc said:
Did anyone else notice the HORRIBLE video playback? I did. It looks just as bad as the Kaiser. WTF!?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You need a media player that can utilise the hardware acceleration of the Qualcomm chipset, such as Core Player 1.2

posted!
btw did everyone notice in day 4, it seems all 5 UMTS bands are supported
Did they manage to put the correct antenna's in or maybe its just because its a test handset.
imranbashir_uk said:
@ someone1234,
Could you ask the following questions on my behalf, many thanks...
1. During your day 4 video you COPIED a picture into a subdirectory called ......
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

juiceppc said:
Did anyone else notice the HORRIBLE video playback? I did. It looks just as bad as the Kaiser. WTF!?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, but as imranbashir_uk said, Windows Media Player is not the best software to use. Does anyone know if the phone in these reviews has the same software as the version that will be sold? If it does, that video problem might put the most lazy consumers off getting it.

nope
havent u seen the splash screens, or video 1, it says test rom, not for sale on it
some athenas were shipped with test roms, but that was only by compusa who were closing down i think.
but shipping what is their biggest release so far of 08, with great new enhancements without being complete would be utterly stupid [wait isnt that what happened with kaiser video drivers? ]
Rory

No that was test firmware only. It says so when he powers up the device. Also I don’t think the full firmware is going to be any better unless they can somehow hack windows media player to utilise the hardware acceleration of the chipset.
To visualise what I’m talking about think about windows just after a fresh install, the resolution is VGA, and the colour depth is only 16-Bit, its only after you install the drivers for your graphics card (Radeon) that you get to actually utilise the hardware.
In terms of the Diamond, Core Player 1.2 recognises the enabled graphics acceleration within the Qualcomm chipset and the software is able to fully utilise it.

yep and its worth paying whatever it costs because it utilised my athenas imageon too.. [i dont think that has drivers either]

rorydaredkign said:
nope
havent u seen the splash screens, or video 1, it says test rom
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, obviously those would be changed (and yes, I did see them, so please stop treating me like a retard - why would I have asked that question if I had not seen them?), but I'm not familiar with how much these ROMs change between test and final versions. For some companies that change is very small, whereas for others (Planetside) there can be a lot of change.
Also, I've finished watching day 4 now, and I think the Touch Diamond did fairly well in the battery test. Obviously it lost, but it only used roughly 33% more battery power than the other phone and he was using them pretty heavily.

Won’t change that much unfortunately, most of HTC’s software is modular hence the reason it can be easily ported. The main difference I guess would be that the latest AKU of WM 6.1 will be incorporated.
If you think about it, its not in HTC’s interest to send out poor quality software to reviewers as most peoples judgments will be based on these reviews until they get to play with a mates version who was a early adopter.

Meh. Sendo sent out a phone to reviewers and subsequently went bust.

well another example is debug builds of all the exe's which spam logs with information about which functions are running, and contain extra structures to hold debug info. So you never really can be sure.
I'm sure that HTC will continue to tweak the rom with updates for a few months after release at the least.

Generally agree that they will continue to tweak the ROM, but would they really send debug builds to reviewers? Hmmm not too sure about that one...