Did you know you can enable the GPS functionality in the new-generation Pocket PC phone, the HTC Trinity (HTC P3600) with a simple, easy, free ROM upgrade? Did you know the latest ROM upgrade offers a significantly lowered boot-in time and slightly decreased (albeit still very bad) A2DP CPU usage, more wireless icons (E for Edge) and, last but not least, SDHC compatibility? If you didn’t but would certainly enjoy the advantages of the built-in GPS unit and the other goodies of the new ROM, make sure you do the following:
download the SSPL-TRIN.zip utility linked in from the first post of this thread (note that you’ll need to register yourself in the XDA-Dev forums to be able to access the file)
download the new ROM upgrade from here (Pacific users may also want to give a try to this Chinese source to see if it’s faster)
decompress both files. From the first, transfer SSPL-TRIN.exe to your PDA and execute it there, after disconnecting your Trinity from your desktop. You’ll see the standard rainbow-color bootup screen.
now, start the large RUU_Trinity_DOPODASIA_WWE_1.23.707.6_6275_1.35.00.11_108_Ship.exe file on the desktop, press the OK / Update / Yes buttons until it gets to flashing the new ROM.
It worked for everyone so far. Note that if there is “Serial” at the bottom third of the rainbow bootloader screen of the Trinity, the desktop PC won’t likely to recognize it. Then, just reset the PDA and, after booting in, just restart SSPL-TRIN.exe. You’ll need to see “USB” for the PDA to be recognized.
Warranty issues
Note that, by upgrading, you MAY lose your warranty, depending on where you've initially purchased your Trinity from. However, as you can flash back a ROM of your operator any time (assuming they DO come out with any publicly available ROM version), this isn’t really an issue most of the time.
Also note that, as SSPL-TRIN doesn’t remove the CID lock (unlike with the older and expensive IMEI-Check service), you won’t have problems with the service folks because of the lack of the CID lock. This is also a huge advantage over the IMEI-Check method.
Advantages
I’ve already listed the major advantages of the new version; most importantly, the enabled GPS functionality. Having GPS support in your phone is just unbeatable. Note that you must use the port COM9:. Also note that you may not want to run for example iGo to find the GPS port automatically because it’ll spend a LOT of time in doing so – just give it COM9: right at the beginning, and you’re all set.
As has already been pointed out, the boot-in time has been significantly reduced between the initial HTC ROM version (1.15.405.5 dated 10/23/2006) and the this one (1.23.707.6, 02/08/2007); according to my tests, it’s 39 seconds now, as opposed to the original 45 seconds. Getting better and better (albeit still can't beat the 36 seconds of the AKU3 HTC Wizard!)
I’ve also made some serious benchmarks with the new version to see whether the problematic areas (digitizer handling, A2DP CPU usage) have been fixed. Unfortunately, they aren’t – read on to see what the problem is!
Acute problems with the HTC Trinity
The excellent XDA-Developers community, lately, has been complaining about two special issues regarding the HTC Trinity, the, in my opinion, best HTC 2.8” Pocket PC right now. Having just received a Trinity myself, I’ve thoroughly scrutinized these problems.
Touchscreen CPU usage issues
(Also see this thread)
Unfortunately, it seems all 2.8” WM5 HTC QVGA Pocket PC phones are particularly sensitive to long-pressing the touchscreen. While none of the other Pocket PC models I’ve tested (HP iPAQ 2210, HP iPAQ hx4700 running WM5, Dell Axim x51v , Fujitsu-Siemens Pocket Loox 720 and the HTC Universal) exhibited any increased CPU usage while constantly keeping the stylus down on the touchscreen, both the 2.8” WM5 HTC Wizard and the HTC Trinity did. The, otherwise, almost-zero CPU usage of gwes.exe raised, on the (non-overclocked) former, to around 17% and about 36% on the latter. This is why, for example, action games like K-Rally or Skyforce (Unlimited) will become next to unplayable when, as is recommended, played with the stylus.
This issue is the same in even the latest (Dopod) Trinity ROM version and should be addressed by HTC as soon as possible. It’s hopefully a driver issue and, therefore, can be fixed in software.
(Note that, again, different HTC phone models exhibit different level of excess CPU usage because of the problem. The new, quick Trinity suffers a lot from the bug, the older, “slow” Wizard suffers a lot less, particularly when it’s overclocked (when overclocked to 240 MHz, games like K-Rally become really enjoyable with the stylus). This, however, doesn’t mean ALL “old” (TI CPU-based) HTC phones fare much better than ALL “new” (Samsung CPU-based) HTC phones – other new, Samsung-based models may behave fat better in this respect.
I really hope HTC really soon addresses this issue as it’s almost completely renders some? several? of their models almost useless for stylus-based action gaming and unnecessarily increases the power consumption.)
A2DP CPU usage issues
Unfortunately, there is another major Achilles’ heel with all Trinity ROM’s released so far: the A2DP CPU usage.
While the built-in A2DP doesn’t consume much CPU cycles in the other HTC phones I’ve tested (for example, on the HTC Wizard, even at the original 195 MHz, it hardly exceeds 30%), the Trinity is an exception. When playing music via A2DP, the CPU usage when used in the default (mono) mode is 52.5%, in stereo mode, 49.5%. (With the original ROM version, the figures were 54% and 51%, respectively – as can be seen, the new version has slightly improved upon the situation, but it’s still much worse than with most other devices.) This is another issue HTC should look into as soon as possible, because it makes the device almost useless as an A2DP player.
(A quick note: the A2DP defaults to mono in this device. If you’re familiar with the Registry and have already read my older A2DP-related articles, you will know HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\ SOFTWARE\ Microsoft\Bluetooth\ A2DP\Settings\ UseJointStereo also introduced in my article The A2DP support & sound quality & power consumption of the Microsoft and Widcomm BT stack compared; a lot of new A2DP info. With the Trinity, it’s set to 1 by default; you’ll want to change its value to 0.
If you feel unsafe about editing the Registry, you can also use the excellent, free HTweakC tool. I highly recommend it for all Trinity, Wizard and TyTN users.)
Widcomm BT stack compliance?
Unfortunately, as was the case with the original HTC Trinity ROM, neither the Dell Axim WM5 x50/x51 / HTC Wizard nor the HTC Universal Widcomm Bluetooth stacks work with the new ROM. This is very bad news: first, the Microsoft Bluetooth stack as of AKU3 has still bad sound quality with a lot of Bluetooth stereo headphones; second, the Widcomm BT stack would consume considerably less power on the Trinity (I’d say the third of that of the current MS BT stack.)
Verdict
I’m really sorry about HTC’s leaving so bad bugs in the firm- and/or software of this model – the Pocket PC I, otherwise, recommend the most of today’s Pocket PC’s. While upgrading to the new ROM version is HIGHLY recommended for most people, you still won’t be able to play fast-paced action games and should think twice before using the built-in A2DP sound transfer.
Recommended links
My older A2DP-related articles. I also recommend the two reports I’ve posted today about the news: here and here.
Thanks for your excellent work here!
I really appreciate what you do for the Trinity communitiy!
Thanks for a great summary.... nice to have it all in one post, one of my disadvantages with the Trinity is the bad performance with xvid in coreplayer, due to the ATI graphic chip...
MP3/Audio quality
I've read that some users have experienced highly degraded audio quality after upgrading to the latest test Dopod ROM. Has this final ROM corrected this issue?
psargent said:
...MP3 quality is GREATLY degraded after upgrading to the test rom. Used to be rich with plenty of bass when plugged into my car aux input when I was using HTC rom, now it sounds like I am listening through a tin can!!! Sounds like most of the lower frequencies are not being sent out of the audio output...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
prsnow said:
I've read that some users have experienced highly degraded audio quality after upgrading to the latest test Dopod ROM. Has this final ROM corrected this issue?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've only checked it through (the crappy) A2DP, not via a wired headset - I couldn't notice any sound degradaton, iot sounded equally bad than with other MS BT stack A2DP implemenations.
Are you sure about SDHC being now supported? From other reports it seems that the problem with disappearing files and folders on 4GB SDHC cards is still there.
Menneisyys said:
Did you know you can enable the GPS functionality in the new-generation Pocket PC phone, the HTC Trinity (HTC P3600) with a simple, easy, free ROM upgrade? Did you know the latest ROM upgrade offers a significantly lowered boot-in time and slightly decreased (albeit still very bad) A2DP CPU usage, more wireless icons (E for Edge) and, last but not least, SDHC compatibility? If you didn’t but would certainly enjoy the advantages of the built-in GPS unit and the other goodies of the new ROM, make sure you do the following:
download the SSPL-TRIN.zip utility linked in from the first post of this thread (note that you’ll need to register yourself in the XDA-Dev forums to be able to access the file)
download the new ROM upgrade from here (Pacific users may also want to give a try to this Chinese source to see if it’s faster)
decompress both files. From the first, transfer SSPL-TRIN.exe to your PDA and execute it there, after disconnecting your Trinity from your desktop. You’ll see the standard rainbow-color bootup screen.
now, start the large RUU_Trinity_DOPODASIA_WWE_1.23.707.6_6275_1.35.00.11_108_Ship.exe file on the desktop, press the OK / Update / Yes buttons until it gets to flashing the new ROM.
It worked for everyone so far. Note that if there is “Serial” at the bottom third of the rainbow bootloader screen of the Trinity, the desktop PC won’t likely to recognize it. Then, just reset the PDA and, after booting in, just restart SSPL-TRIN.exe. You’ll need to see “USB” for the PDA to be recognized.
Warranty issues
Note that, by upgrading, you MAY lose your warranty, depending on where you've initially purchased your Trinity from. However, as you can flash back a ROM of your operator any time (assuming they DO come out with any publicly available ROM version), this isn’t really an issue most of the time.
Also note that, as SSPL-TRIN doesn’t remove the CID lock (unlike with the older and expensive IMEI-Check service), you won’t have problems with the service folks because of the lack of the CID lock. This is also a huge advantage over the IMEI-Check method.
Advantages
I’ve already listed the major advantages of the new version; most importantly, the enabled GPS functionality. Having GPS support in your phone is just unbeatable. Note that you must use the port COM9:. Also note that you may not want to run for example iGo to find the GPS port automatically because it’ll spend a LOT of time in doing so – just give it COM9: right at the beginning, and you’re all set.
As has already been pointed out, the boot-in time has been significantly reduced between the initial HTC ROM version (1.15.405.5 dated 10/23/2006) and the this one (1.23.707.6, 02/08/2007); according to my tests, it’s 39 seconds now, as opposed to the original 45 seconds. Getting better and better (albeit still can't beat the 36 seconds of the AKU3 HTC Wizard!)
I’ve also made some serious benchmarks with the new version to see whether the problematic areas (digitizer handling, A2DP CPU usage) have been fixed. Unfortunately, they aren’t – read on to see what the problem is!
Acute problems with the HTC Trinity
The excellent XDA-Developers community, lately, has been complaining about two special issues regarding the HTC Trinity, the, in my opinion, best HTC 2.8” Pocket PC right now. Having just received a Trinity myself, I’ve thoroughly scrutinized these problems.
Touchscreen CPU usage issues
(Also see this thread)
Unfortunately, it seems all 2.8” WM5 HTC QVGA Pocket PC phones are particularly sensitive to long-pressing the touchscreen. While none of the other Pocket PC models I’ve tested (HP iPAQ 2210, HP iPAQ hx4700 running WM5, Dell Axim x51v , Fujitsu-Siemens Pocket Loox 720 and the HTC Universal) exhibited any increased CPU usage while constantly keeping the stylus down on the touchscreen, both the 2.8” WM5 HTC Wizard and the HTC Trinity did. The, otherwise, almost-zero CPU usage of gwes.exe raised, on the (non-overclocked) former, to around 17% and about 36% on the latter. This is why, for example, action games like K-Rally or Skyforce (Unlimited) will become next to unplayable when, as is recommended, played with the stylus.
This issue is the same in even the latest (Dopod) Trinity ROM version and should be addressed by HTC as soon as possible. It’s hopefully a driver issue and, therefore, can be fixed in software.
(Note that, again, different HTC phone models exhibit different level of excess CPU usage because of the problem. The new, quick Trinity suffers a lot from the bug, the older, “slow” Wizard suffers a lot less, particularly when it’s overclocked (when overclocked to 240 MHz, games like K-Rally become really enjoyable with the stylus). This, however, doesn’t mean ALL “old” (TI CPU-based) HTC phones fare much better than ALL “new” (Samsung CPU-based) HTC phones – other new, Samsung-based models may behave fat better in this respect.
I really hope HTC really soon addresses this issue as it’s almost completely renders some? several? of their models almost useless for stylus-based action gaming and unnecessarily increases the power consumption.)
A2DP CPU usage issues
Unfortunately, there is another major Achilles’ heel with all Trinity ROM’s released so far: the A2DP CPU usage.
While the built-in A2DP doesn’t consume much CPU cycles in the other HTC phones I’ve tested (for example, on the HTC Wizard, even at the original 195 MHz, it hardly exceeds 30%), the Trinity is an exception. When playing music via A2DP, the CPU usage when used in the default (mono) mode is 52.5%, in stereo mode, 49.5%. (With the original ROM version, the figures were 54% and 51%, respectively – as can be seen, the new version has slightly improved upon the situation, but it’s still much worse than with most other devices.) This is another issue HTC should look into as soon as possible, because it makes the device almost useless as an A2DP player.
(A quick note: the A2DP defaults to mono in this device. If you’re familiar with the Registry and have already read my older A2DP-related articles, you will know HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\ SOFTWARE\ Microsoft\Bluetooth\ A2DP\Settings\ UseJointStereo also introduced in my article The A2DP support & sound quality & power consumption of the Microsoft and Widcomm BT stack compared; a lot of new A2DP info. With the Trinity, it’s set to 1 by default; you’ll want to change its value to 0.
If you feel unsafe about editing the Registry, you can also use the excellent, free HTweakC tool. I highly recommend it for all Trinity, Wizard and TyTN users.)
Widcomm BT stack compliance?
Unfortunately, as was the case with the original HTC Trinity ROM, neither the Dell Axim WM5 x50/x51 / HTC Wizard nor the HTC Universal Widcomm Bluetooth stacks work with the new ROM. This is very bad news: first, the Microsoft Bluetooth stack as of AKU3 has still bad sound quality with a lot of Bluetooth stereo headphones; second, the Widcomm BT stack would consume considerably less power on the Trinity (I’d say the third of that of the current MS BT stack.)
Verdict
I’m really sorry about HTC’s leaving so bad bugs in the firm- and/or software of this model – the Pocket PC I, otherwise, recommend the most of today’s Pocket PC’s. While upgrading to the new ROM version is HIGHLY recommended for most people, you still won’t be able to play fast-paced action games and should think twice before using the built-in A2DP sound transfer.
Recommended links
My older A2DP-related articles. I also recommend the two reports I’ve posted today about the news: here and here.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I upgreaded as instructed and put the new rom. My problem is I see no GPS icon in the Systems folder or anywhere for that matter to set it to Com 9. Furthermore, when I installed Tomtom it said i have no gps on my Trinity Can you help advise where my GPS icon is
Another thing that is bugging the hell out of me is the network configuration. how can I get it rid of it completely so that everytime i soft reset, i don't get that annoying message?
Second, please advise, if I remove My Connect, does it make a difference to the device? I live in Canada and do not own a dopod but a HTC unbranded Trinity instead.
Third, What is the CAM program. What does it do?
Many thanks for any help you can offer and best regards,
Gilbert
Gilbert said:
I upgreaded as instructed and put the new rom. My problem is I see no GPS icon in the Systems folder or anywhere for that matter to set it to Com 9. Furthermore, when I installed Tomtom it said i have no gps on my Trinity Can you help advise where my GPS icon is
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hold - one thing at a time
1) Once you have upgraded the ROM you have to configure TomTom to use the internal GPS, so start TomTom, go to "Change Preferences", go to "Show GPS Status" , then "Configure" to choose your new GPS. Select "Other NMEA GPS Receiver", baud rate = 115200, "GPS on COM9".
2) You will not see any "GPS setting" anywhere unless you hack the Windows Registry. You need a registry editor to do that. Go in HKLM->ControlPanel->GPS Settings: get rid of any DWORD there and make sure to add a new DWORD with the following values: "Group"/0x02. Once done SoftReset and you will have your GPS icon into Settings->Connections.
3) BTW, if you do that registry hack you will be able to map the GPS to other COM ports as well.
Hope this will help!
Anubis
anonimo said:
Are you sure about SDHC being now supported? From other reports it seems that the problem with disappearing files and folders on 4GB SDHC cards is still there.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes; unfortunately my 4GB Transcend SDHC card still behaves in this way with the new rom.
Anubis1965 said:
Hold - one thing at a time
1) Once you have upgraded the ROM you have to configure TomTom to use the internal GPS, so start TomTom, go to "Change Preferences", go to "Show GPS Status" , then "Configure" to choose your new GPS. Select "Other NMEA GPS Receiver", baud rate = 115200, "GPS on COM9".
2) You will not see any "GPS setting" anywhere unless you hack the Windows Registry. You need a registry editor to do that. Go in HKLM->ControlPanel->GPS Settings: get rid of any DWORD there and make sure to add a new DWORD with the following values: "Group"/0x02. Once done SoftReset and you will have your GPS icon into Settings->Connections.
3) BTW, if you do that registry hack you will be able to map the GPS to other COM ports as well.
Hope this will help!
Anubis
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I got:
GPS program port: COM9
GPS hardware port: COM6 (randomly chosen) with Baud rate 115200 (what does Baud rate mean?)
Access: automatically
In TomTom I use COM9, but when I switch the program with the hardware port, TomTom tells me that the GPS still has port COM9.. weird.
Anyways, is this correct? Thanks in advance!
BTW: this goes a looot quicker if you choose the other NMEA GPS Receiver than if you use "other external bluetooth" thanks!
BTW2: you can use "http://www2r.biglobe.ne.jp/~tascal/download/pocketpc/tre_e.htm to edit the register.
Thanks Menneisyys for the summary.
Regarding the cpu consumption I am not so sure everything is HTC related.
can you give me a device which is performing very well with this samsung cpu?
it is fast: 400 Mhz. ok, on paper. but in real life it needs a lot of cycles to do things...
40% if you press the screen.
85% for 320*240 simple divX with tcpmp (more than the OMAP 200 from Wizard)
55% to encode A2DP stream.
and it gets on and on, and does not improve with new ROMs.
I start to wonder why nobody is blaming samsung there. Is there proof somewhere of its effectiveness?
I have HTC-P3600 purchased in US. So far I have no problem using Cingular service and I like the phone.
But why I am posting. I want to update to the latest ROM with the GPS activated.
When I run SSPL-TRIN I get only "SERIAL" in third line.
I have tried three times and same result. I there a something else I need to change to get "USB" activated.
Thanks in advance Peter Simek
psimek said:
I have HTC-P3600 purchased in US. So far I have no problem using Cingular service and I like the phone.
But why I am posting. I want to update to the latest ROM with the GPS activated.
When I run SSPL-TRIN I get only "SERIAL" in third line.
I have tried three times and same result. I there a something else I need to change to get "USB" activated.
Thanks in advance Peter Simek
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You have to have it connected to USB when you run SSPL-TRIN.exe.
mdacfan said:
@chenchon
my way:
1. extract RUU_Trinity_DOPODASIA_WWE_1.23.707.6_6275_1.35.00. 11_108_Ship.exe with WinRAR to XP PC (NewFolder)
2. connect phone to windows XP PC (activesync status green)
3. copy the SSPL-trin to the device ie. \temp (memory) - not storage card
4. run the SSPL-trin (Trinity Display must then show "USB" at the bottom) - wait until XP detects a new USB device
5. run from the extracted file on XP PC (NewFolder) the file "ROMUpdateUtility.exe"
6. Pass all Upgrade questions and wait about 10 Minutes to finish the upgrade from 0% to 100%
7. Softreset Trinity after the successfull upgrade
No SuperCID required if you use SSPL !!
good luck,
Gerhard
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Worked well for me.
Tomtom 6.03 freeze
hi,
does anyone with tomtom 6.03 as any problem of freezing while u r navigating?
i think the problem was when i selected the gps in tomtom config... i selected "use own gps" (the built in gps) but now i choosed another cable gps nmea on com9 and with 115200. Tomorrow i'll feedback
another experiences with tomtom 6.03 are welcome.
best regards,
aprt
Lost Voice Dialing
Hi All,
I have done the ROM upgrade, but seem to have lost voice dialing. Is this something available only on the original HTC ROM? Can I download this seperately?
Thanks
Small Problem
I have updated both the test and final rom,I have noticed a strange problem. As I am using a third party keyboard because of the arabic language i can not switch the keyboard to any installed one rather than the preinstalled SIPs.
I tried two different arabic software plus Resco keyboard all the same. som times it works and many other times it does not.
Any Idea?
I started noticing problems too.
When I soft reset, Pocket Informant always start automatically and hangs the phone.
Before that, the Network guide started and hung, every reboot, so that I had to hard reset.
It works for about one hour, regardless of which programs I install.
GPS works though..
NOT Blaming Samsung
meroupow said:
Thanks Menneisyys for the summary.
Regarding the cpu consumption I am not so sure everything is HTC related.
can you give me a device which is performing very well with this samsung cpu?
it is fast: 400 Mhz. ok, on paper. but in real life it needs a lot of cycles to do things...
40% if you press the screen.
85% for 320*240 simple divX with tcpmp (more than the OMAP 200 from Wizard)
55% to encode A2DP stream.
and it gets on and on, and does not improve with new ROMs.
I start to wonder why nobody is blaming samsung there. Is there proof somewhere of its effectiveness?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In the case of TCPMP it is not anything todo with solely the Samsung chip itself but more todo with the Imageon Chip being not properly utilised in the ROMS and also TCPMP not being able to make use of the Imageon with the Samsung/ATI combo.
I did a small test once where I had one video that didn't cause screen flicker with the Imageon being used in TCPMP and I got a MASSIVE improvement - posted the benchmark results in another post I will look for them.
The A2DP Stream in my opinion is more todo with the Bluetooth Stack i.e if it were WIDCOMM then we woudn't have these problems.
As for the screen press I am hoping it is down to the Samsung Chip and ROM combination as a pose to just the chip being flawed.
And yes they should put more effort in tweaking these flaws and provide fixes for software and ROMS faster - but these are money making corporations that like to take shortcuts.
The joys of early adoption!
Hello,
Everyone seems to talk about 115200 baud but in Tomtom the highest you get is 57k+ for baud speed. I read once that it should remain on 9600 baud to work well. Where do you all see the 115200 baud? is it through the hack of the registry to enable the GPS icon? Hope someone can help me here.
Best regards,
Gilbert
Without meaning to sound defeatist, I have been looking into alternative devices, given the current issues
The Eten X800 is fairly similar in specs to the TyTN2. Has GPS, WiFi, Bluetooth, no keyboard though (but VGA screen). But reading reviews, users are very criticial of the build quality, stability, usability, and customer support/ update frequency. The recent M800 has similar specs but with Qwerty keyboard. Again, I am reading bad reviews about stability and poor quality - apparently the key markings is rubbing off within days.
Other similar specced device is Toshiba G900. Again, seeing a lot of negative reviews, and lots of users sending theirs back. Apparently the interface and usability are appaling.
These seem to be the most directly comparable devices. There is the Samsung Imate range but I'm not too keen on the clamshell form factor for a PDA.
From what I am reading, HTC's devices are actually the most stable and well built devices with this sort of feature set. I realise there are huge issues with support and implementation of some features, but overall there is a reason why HTC stills keeps coming up again and again in "Top 10/Most wanted/ Most popular lists". Of course, they know that too, which is probably why they don't really care about the issues we are trying to highlight. They know that they are at least equal to any direct competition, even if no better.
Which is why I am sticking to my TyTN2 for now. It certainly does most of the things I want it to do, and does them fairly well, if sometimes (graphically) slowly. Put it this way - I bought my TyTN2 in October 2007 and have only ever soft reset it after installing cabs etc, never due to system freeze or crash. And I have certainly never had to hard reset. Have never had a device of any class I could say that about before. (course, guess what's going to happen in the next 24hours....!)
Anyone got any other comparable devices I missed out? As happy as I am with the TyTN2, if there was another device with same features but proper display drivers, there would be no question about swapping.
The at&t tilt is another name and the T-Mobile MDA Vario III.
+1 from me. Add the tilting screen, I'm not sure any other device has this and it's very practical. Likewise the QWERTY keyboard, limited competition for that. True you could get a bluetooth, or external keyboard, but that kinda defeats the all in one nature. Videos are fine with re-encoding (Ican live with that), sat-nav, perfect for the applications I run, I have tried TomTom now, and the jumpy screen really isn't that bad (IMHO) (however route calculation requires a bit of work, my 8yr old Garmin gives better, more direct routes. The Kaiser is quicker on calculation, but still has the same map errors the 10yr old map set on the Garmin has)
fisha21 said:
(course, guess what's going to happen in the next 24hours....!)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Optimistic ain't ya?! I'd be surprised if you lasted the day....
Hey,
just found this very interesting board and read through many of the articles here so that i may finally be able to pose my questions.
I'm currently using a old brick, a Nokia 6310. Since this thing is slowly falling apart I thought about moving to a new device. Normally I would take the cheapest thing availabe, because I don't really do lots of phone calls a month. But I miss my old Palm 1050 and instead of buying two seperate devices I thought of buying a smartphone.
The Kaiser seems to combine everything I want. Its quite uptodate, GPS UMTS and all this stuff included plus the hardware QWERTZ (and I think I want this thing, those touchpad-versions are just not fast enough). In addition it seems to be quite easy to modify this thing to fit your own special purpose (adding all these new ROMs, progs etc. pp.). The only problem is this damn video driver thing you read about everywhere.
So, my question is: How much of a problem is the driver situation? How bad is it, considering that I want to use the phone from web surfing over office use to multimedia and games (those Duke 3D videos are really cool, you know ), will it really bother me or is the phone still very useful (not as fast as it could be, but fast enough)?
If no, where are the alternatives? The Hermes seems to be faster, but it lacks GPS. Even if the Touch Pro is coming soon, it may cost far more than the current Kaiser. Same with the Xperia. Is there any other device which is as well equiped as the Kaiser and also good to customize?
Thanks for your help and maybe some recommendations
I think that the Kaiser should be able to suit your needs.
As a business phone it should very easily be able to handle almost anything you throw at it. And as a multimedia phone it lacks, to some in gaming performance, 2D/3D rendering and such, but as for viewing videos and surfing the web, these can be quite easily solved through tweaking and using the right apps. A combination of coremedia and a good ROM should have video working just fine.
i have had my tilt for almost 6 months now and have fully customized it to suit my needs. Everything works exactly the way I need it to. Take time to customize your kaiser and it will be able to handle just about everything you throw at it.
Maybe I can help you out a little. Being a user of both the Hermes and the Kaiser, the Kaiser wins but it's a close race. Both devices are similar in form and function with the Kaiser navigation and function buttons in a slightly better layout. The Kaiser and the Hermes have 400mhz processors but from different suppliers, The Kaiser is a little faster and beats the Hermes in opening and running applications, not by much but it is noticable. The Kaisers built in GPS works fine for me, but then so is the Bluetooth receiver I use with the Hermes.
On the other hand the Hermes was easier to customize initially, one step to Hard SPL and CID unlock the Hermes, plug in the USB, Activesync, and run the RUU, in 10 to 20 min it's done. With the Kaiser, well it's not as easy, as there are a few extra steps and 4 or 5 different Hard SPL's to to choose from. After the Kaiser is Hard SPL'd, upgrading ROMs is a simple task.
ROMs, the Kaiser was built to run the WM6/6.1 ROMs and the Hermes WM5/6. Almost all the WM6.1 ROMs for the Hermes are based on the Kaiser ROMs.
As for customizing, both will run pretty much any WM5-6 programs and/or applications.
For me tho, the Kaiser is the better device, with the built in GPS and slightly faster performance being the deciding factor.
Hope this helps you and good luck with whichever device you choose.
So you think there should be no problem with the right amount of tweaking?
Because in some videos on the tube I even saw it lagging when scrolling up and down a list or a website whereas other vids of Duke or Quake looked absolutely playable and in the range of 30-40fps.
Edit: Thanks to both of you for your opinions. I'm just a bit worried how much this driver thing will affect the overall useability of the Kaiser when processing anything with graphics, from simple site layouts to vids or games. And in addition my head is still working on the whole ROM thing right now, at least I got the differences between SPL, Radio and ROM finally
Okay, just have to push this up again as there came up some new questions (before I can finally order this thing here):
1.) Graphic Drivers
I'm still a bit confused about those. HTC did not implement real drivers for hardware acceleration, that's what I already got. But then there are some roms like the HyperDragon III WM6.1 WWE (which seems to be ported from the Diamond) that has "Direct3D Mobile Display Drivers", there's the "26_Kaiser_Diamond_V8" release with some ATI Drivers and there is the OpenGL project which seems to get into the hot phase right now. So what is the real deal here, where is the difference between those drivers and which impact do they have, compared to an untouched Kaiser.
2.) Roms
Also, just to get it clear: Roms are a user "cooked" combination of a tweaked OS (Windows Mobile with drivers or registry changes) together with a mostly changed interace and a cleaned up program package (removed and/or added), right? But I will still be able to configure the whole unit by myself, maybe not on the driver/OS level but on the program or interface level (for example: enable slide to unlocked if not already included, or disable a touchFlo feature, add or remove other software and so on).
Again, thanks for your help.
Skirr said:
Okay, just have to push this up again as there came up some new questions (before I can finally order this thing here):
1.) Graphic Drivers
I'm still a bit confused about those. HTC did not implement real drivers for hardware acceleration, that's what I already got. But then there are some roms like the HyperDragon III WM6.1 WWE (which seems to be ported from the Diamond) that has "Direct3D Mobile Display Drivers", there's the "26_Kaiser_Diamond_V8" release with some ATI Drivers and there is the OpenGL project which seems to get into the hot phase right now. So what is the real deal here, where is the difference between those drivers and which impact do they have, compared to an untouched Kaiser.
2.) Roms
Also, just to get it clear: Roms are a user "cooked" combination of a tweaked OS (Windows Mobile with drivers or registry changes) together with a mostly changed interace and a cleaned up program package (removed and/or added), right? But I will still be able to configure the whole unit by myself, maybe not on the driver/OS level but on the program or interface level (for example: enable slide to unlocked if not already included, or disable a touchFlo feature, add or remove other software and so on).
Again, thanks for your help.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ok, the driver issue is a pretty complicated thing, to some it completely cripples the device, and others get annoyed by all the "buzz" created by such a "small" issue. It really varies from user to user how big of a problem the missing drivers are. Normal use of the phone, excluding 3d and some 2d games, is very good. As you may be aware there have been, and still are many focused on creating and implementing drivers, and if you take a look at the htcclassaction.org website you can get a lot more info on the subject, 3D drivers will not do much for the normal wm6 interface or any other uses as they are not 3d applications. take a look at the website i listed and you should have all of the information you need. Keep in mind that this is a very good phone and pda. If you want a phone with a smooth iphone like interface, take a look at other HTC devices or maybe even the new iphone, these are both good alternatives.
As far as the issue with ROMS, there are many different ROMS out there by many different chefs, if you decide to get the Kaiser you should try out anything that you think looks interesting until you find something you like. wanting to customize your phone is easy through ROMS as well, take a look at clean, or lite roms which have the registry changes and small driver implementations from chefs but no "extra" apps. There are a few new drivers floating around, some do make the device a little snappier but are not 3d or even 2d acceleration drivers.
Hope i answered your questions, good luck with what ever you choose!
Thanks, indeed this is a help. So all this ATI stuff coming from the Diamond is not the real deal, maybe a small improvement but nothing more since they are just ported. For sure I already read the site you proposed, but I especially wanted to be sure about those drivers the Diamond roms carry with them. I don't think they are mentioned there, or did I miss something?
Anyway, I think I will just have to try and see for myself if the Kaiser would be "crippled" or "absolutely useful" for me. The new iPhone is cool, but for my needs it will be far to expensive, same with the Touch Pro. And I still want to have the QWERTZ-keyboard, so the other HTC devices are not really satisfying either.
Did it, now the Kaisers on the way, for the cheap price of 350€ unlocked etc. pp. Thanks guys, now I'm going to get everything I need in advance for pimping up my new phone
I want it badly on my X1!!!!!!!
it is not even release yet. READ BE4 ask.
Chances are it'll make your X1 really slow
Your X1 will explode if you attempt to put WP7 in it.
WP7 is not written for the X1 hardware.
X1 is slow with the WM6.5 and you want WM7???
If we are not sure tha HD2 gets WM7 update, imagine about the X1.... No chance, at all!!
Well, in the first place, if these are the minimum required specs, even X2 (not to say X1) can't run Windows 7.
- Large WVGA screen with a single aspect ratio (which means BlackBerry-style devices won't be readily available to begin with)
- Five specific hardware buttons required: Start, back, search (a dedicated Bing button), camera button, and power -- no more, no less
- Capacitive multitouch
- CPU and GPU requirements (beginning with Qualcomm's Snapdragon as the go-to processor)
- WiFi
- AGPS
- Accelerometer
- FM radio
- High resolution camera
I have also been hearing that there isn't a MSM7200 BSP for WM7, only QSD, so it's likely that we won't be able to get anything working at all.
ipporek said:
Well, in the first place, if these are the minimum required specs, even X2 (not to say X1) can't run Windows 7.
- Large WVGA screen with a single aspect ratio (which means BlackBerry-style devices won't be readily available to begin with)
- Five specific hardware buttons required: Start, back, search (a dedicated Bing button), camera button, and power -- no more, no less
- Capacitive multitouch
- CPU and GPU requirements (beginning with Qualcomm's Snapdragon as the go-to processor)
- WiFi
- AGPS
- Accelerometer
- FM radio
- High resolution camera
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In the past 3 months I've seen 8 different versions of the WM7 system requirements. Is that the real, honest-to-goodness, final one?
harveydent said:
In the past 3 months I've seen 8 different versions of the WM7 system requirements. Is that the real, honest-to-goodness, final one?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
all these versions include some hw-specs the x1 simply doesn't have. (acc-meter for example)
but doesn't matter. all the drivers are closed-source (wifi, keyb, graphics, screen etc etc), they're directly available only to OEMs. ever noticed the problems on android-development? so unless SE delivers a firmware-version built for WP7, it will always just be reverse-engineering resulting in bad performance. (wait a sec, SE updating the x1? i think there was an official statement concerning that? )
to the thread-starter:
there's a german saying, "there are no dumb questions, only dumb answers." well sorry, but in your case the question is very dumb. WP7 hasn't been delievered to the manufactures yet, it's a work in progress inside MS. think again?!
edit:
just remembered the update-schedule for the x2, where it's clearly stated at the the end:
"(ps. Before anyone asks, no it won’t ever go onto Windows Mobile 7, it won’t support the hardware.)"
so, if the x2 can't run it, neither can the x1.
There's also the Windows Phone Starter Edition..?
Maybe that's 'lite' enough for X1's hardware.
After reading about it, I don't even want WP7 OS. I want the hardware, so my phone is like a rocket, but I don't get the excitement over "hubs." Guess it's because I'm not into games and Facebook.
Tremayne024 said:
There's also the Windows Phone Starter Edition..?
Maybe that's 'lite' enough for X1's hardware.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
isn't that windows phone 6 starter edition? also from what's been said about it, it will be a downgraded version, not capable of hdspa and without office, for example.
and even IF there is a starter edition of winpho 7 - the driver problem persists.
caliban2 said:
isn't that windows phone 6 starter edition? also from what's been said about it, it will be a downgraded version, not capable of hdspa and without office, for example.
and even IF there is a starter edition of winpho 7 - the driver problem persists.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i know of lite versions..atleast in comps, they are no-frills..so lets hope and pray we have one no-frills WinMo7 for X1 also.....