Database Develop

State of the Forum/Newbies

Okay, this post is really intended as a comment and I am not going to pretend I have THE answer but I do have some suggestions to spark discussion.
Based on a lot of the recent comments and back and forth about newbies/tech support I think that the forum is trending the same way I have seen MANY other forums go. What happens is simple; a group of first adopters, who are by default, technically capable, get together on a forum and start to fill in the gaps in tech support, especially when it comes to 'modded' soft or hardwre. They spend a while helping each other out and a comfort level develops. Members know where to go, and when to ask questions.
Then what happens is that the hardware becomes much more popular. All of a sudden your average Joe can walk out a Cingular store with a 8125 for a couple hundred bucks. These folks are NOT early adopters. They are not necessarily tech savvy. They are the people that are most prone to 'keyboard to chair interface errors'. Since the early members did such a good job raising the profile of the forum it starts to come up every time someone does a Google search. and they all end up over their heads.
So then the folks that have been around for a while start to get frustrated. Why should they provide tech support? Why can't these newbies read? Why should they even try to help if they get barraged by stupid questions?
Well I think that takes us to where we are now, so the question is what do we do now? In my experience the only solution that I have seen is to have people equally dedicated to wiki and sticky writing as they are to writing ROMs and programs. The truth is that if you release something you WILL become tech support and a large part of tech support is writing documentation and then explaining it to others.
I have intended this post as something helpful and to spark discussion, not as a criticism of anyone in particular or any particular group. Hopefully it will be taken as such

I agree. I get the feeling that since the relaunch, for one reason or another, there appears to be a lot more"Why don't my apps close when I press X?" and "How dat I swtich this thing 0ff!!!!!!!" type posts.
I think that it's beholden on more experienced users to try to share their experience as they see fit, but it's absolutely essential that newbs and less experienced users use the search button and wiki.
I've been sponsoring a post in the moderators' forum regarding having a specific section for Tutorials etc, eg for the excellent posts that Menneisyys puts together. The wiki may not be the best place for them (due to the risk of negative edits), although it's certainly better then people never looking at them at all...
But as you say, it's pretty much predicted by psychohistory that all fora of dedicated people will eventually turn into a tech support. I don't mind, but less experienced must use the resources already online - quid pro quo.
V

As a new user on this forum i have noticed inconsitant information about G3 vs G4 devices and ROM upgrading. I've seen questions asked by people about G4 devices that go unanswered.
I think the problem with searching on this forum and many others. They do not allow you to search for 3 or fewer letter acronyms such as IPL, SPL, CID. There is no way to search for answers about these things. If there is a setting on the forum that can be changed to allow searching for these terms, then please fix it.
I think when people start posting info about how they did something they need to specify what hardware they are using G3/G4. Thankfully i havent done anything as far as modding my device, but i had seen posts where someone most likely with a G3 device says they figured out how to do this or that, Then someone with a G4 comes along and tried it, not knowing it was done on a G3 and ended up screwing up their device. We need to clearly specify what hardware we are doing mods on.
I still have no clear answer about CID unlocking a G4. I know there is no free utility to do it. Ive seen posts that say the imei-check site can CID unlock. Then i saw a post this morning that imei-check is only a SIM unlock. Can people please provide clear info?

d0ug said:
As a new user on this forum i have noticed inconsitant information about G3 vs G4 devices and ROM upgrading. I've seen questions asked by people about G4 devices that go unanswered.
I think the problem with searching on this forum and many others. They do not allow you to search for 3 or fewer letter acronyms such as IPL, SPL, CID. There is no way to search for answers about these things. If there is a setting on the forum that can be changed to allow searching for these terms, then please fix it.
I think when people start posting info about how they did something they need to specify what hardware they are using G3/G4. Thankfully i havent done anything as far as modding my device, but i had seen posts where someone most likely with a G3 device says they figured out how to do this or that, Then someone with a G4 comes along and tried it, not knowing it was done on a G3 and ended up screwing up their device. We need to clearly specify what hardware we are doing mods on.
I still have no clear answer about CID unlocking a G4. I know there is no free utility to do it. Ive seen posts that say the imei-check site can CID unlock. Then i saw a post this morning that imei-check is only a SIM unlock. Can people please provide clear info?
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I agree with you d0ug! It is rather confusing to navigate and find your way. Especially when you are a n00b, such as myself. I have been trying to mod my phone for 3 days now. I have tried many ways of unlocking my G3, but none of them have worked. I have listened to 3 different people tell me their "way" of unlocking the phone, and all 3 attempts failed in the end. I get flamed for not reading posts or searching, when i did, just nothing relevant popped up! This is not a whine fest, just saying that some people dont have phones that were built on a Wednesday, like mine that was probably built on a Monday and has issues!
Either way, i called Cingular and they are shipping me a brand new 8125 to test things out on!
Canon

Haven't been a wizard user that long although I've been in the ppc scene in about 5 years and quite active in several forums. The most successful solution that I've seen to this problem (witch enevitably always comes up) is to not let new users post for at least 7 days and/or forcing them to read various informational topics before getting access to the actual forum.
This will of course not get everyone but has in my experience improved the situation considerably.
Ah well, that's just my two cents

vijay555 said:
I agree. I get the feeling that since the relaunch, for one reason or another, there appears to be a lot more"Why don't my apps close when I press X?" and "How dat I swtich this thing 0ff!!!!!!!" type posts.
I think that it's beholden on more experienced users to try to share their experience as they see fit, but it's absolutely essential that newbs and less experienced users use the search button and wiki.
I've been sponsoring a post in the moderators' forum regarding having a specific section for Tutorials etc, eg for the excellent posts that Menneisyys puts together. The wiki may not be the best place for them (due to the risk of negative edits), although it's certainly better then people never looking at them at all...
But as you say, it's pretty much predicted by psychohistory that all fora of dedicated people will eventually turn into a tech support. I don't mind, but less experienced must use the resources already online - quid pro quo.
V
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Vijay, very happy to see that the mods are looking at this. I agree that Wiki's have their limitations especially given the validity of some of the comments about conflicting advice.
The search function definitely does have its limits as well, and people are less likely to go through searches that produce a 100 threads with 5 pages each.
I for one would feel a lot better about telling someone harshly to stop answering questions if I knew that I could also direct them to a single place for answers.

I really love this forum and it has helped me so much. I don't post much except to say "thank you" from time to time to the people who have made some program that has been helpful to me. And although I have been coming to this board every day for over a year I still don't know half as much as the majority of people here.
Some solutions to this problem are:
1) get frustrated and write a mean message to the noob
2) take a minute and just give the link to the page where the answer is
3) make it easier on this forum to find things

_Nomad_ said:
Haven't been a wizard user that long although I've been in the ppc scene in about 5 years and quite active in several forums. The most successful solution that I've seen to this problem (witch enevitably always comes up) is to not let new users post for at least 7 days and/or forcing them to read various informational topics before getting access to the actual forum.
This will of course not get everyone but has in my experience improved the situation considerably.
Ah well, that's just my two cents
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That could be nice... part of the things that had contributed to the bad search results are the tons of new threads asking the very same questions over and over and over again... is there anyway to disable these threads from showing up in the search results? Maybe it's time for us to out up another sticky thread specifically talking abóut G4 devices =)

vseehua said:
That could be nice... part of the things that had contributed to the bad search results are the tons of new threads asking the very same questions over and over and over again... is there anyway to disable these threads from showing up in the search results? Maybe it's time for us to out up another sticky thread specifically talking abóut G4 devices =)
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I would like to see a thread dedicated to G4 devices, with verified correct information in it.
It isnt just people asking the same questions over and over making the search junk. Its the inability to even search for simple short 3 letter acronyms like CID, IPL, SPL, AKU. These are all things I have tried to search for and get 0 results. If I were able to search for these terms I could probably turn up a wealth of information on my own.

_Nomad_ said:
Haven't been a wizard user that long although I've been in the ppc scene in about 5 years and quite active in several forums. The most successful solution that I've seen to this problem (witch enevitably always comes up) is to not let new users post for at least 7 days and/or forcing them to read various informational topics before getting access to the actual forum.
This will of course not get everyone but has in my experience improved the situation considerably.
Ah well, that's just my two cents
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Click to collapse
That would work me thinks!!!!!

Hi all,
I've been reading this forum for weeks now and still have not found enough answers to be secure enough and cid-unlock my G3 2.21 vario.
I HAVE indeed read most relevant threads, although navigating them can be somewhat confusing. However When I posted some -in my n00b opinion - valid questions I either got 1) no reply whatsoever 2) replies to read "the" threads....which wasn't really helpfull or I wouldn't have asked 3) contradicting advice .... like a 2.21 G3 Can be unlocked, or it Cannot be unlocked, you have to downgrade twice, you have to upgrade twice, you Can or Cannot flash a G4 rom to a G3 device so you won't have to downgrade and CID unlock your phone first, etc.
I believe that I am somewhat beyond the real n00b level right now but still I'd like information to be more consistent and easier to find, I've already tried to suggest making a stickied n00b FAQ or wiki for us where to find the basic answers in a easy and consistent manner so the sdame questions aren't asked over and over and ROM threads hijacked for support questions.
but that is just my cup of tea.
thanks for a good forum with vlauable info.
stefan.

Regular search
Personally, I find using google or yahoo, with site:xda-developers.com, works much better than the forum search. My personal pet peeve is the inability to use quotes to search for phrases. Quotes don't work.
A major problem with "read the threads" is the 800+ entry length of some of them. It would be nice to try to harness the power of those of us newly figuring things out and ask them to submit a wiki for something they just learned. If we had a submission point for the wiki, perhaps those of us who recently learned new things would do a how-to write-up and submit it to the wiki.
Finally, there are a lot of repeat threads, many with false or useless information. These threads stand in the way of a searcher. I would be happier if the moderators deleted more bad threads. Alternatively, we could use democracy -- add a "vote to delete" button to every thread not posted by a moderator and if a high enough percentage vote to delete, the thread is gone. I'd suggest 20% as a threshold -- more than that and the thread goes away.

Have been reading all your comments and completely agree with you guys... I see you have specific problems on G3/G4 on Wizards, as someone suggested a separate subforum for G4 devices would be ideal for you, and also for Prophet I guess.
About the search functions I'm also using google to search as a fallback when I can't find specific things using vBulletin's integrated search function, there's a thread on the mod forum where we discussed how to improve it, but seems is not very active now... will try to push Flar to do something about that.
Regarding the wiki, I think everyone should be less afraid to edit, if you look at the "recent changes" you see always the same people is editing. Have a look at the Hermes or BlueAngel wiki pages, these are good examples on how info has to be organized on the wiki, it's easy to find everything on the front page and information is well divided. Formating may seem a bit complicated at the beginning, but you don't have to care too much if you just want to add content, sure someone more experienced with wiki syntax will edit and correct any bad formating mistakes.

I do 100% agree with you that the wiki itself doesn't cover half of what it should. Yet if you take the time to read through it, and the links, you should be quite familiar with your device...
And oh yeah, sure, you can't search for keywords less than four characters, but that's not really an excuse... look at the thread containing the latest Faria ROM. Half... Half of what the thread contains is the same question over and over again... those ppl didn't even read the initial post of the thread... they found the download link, tried to install the ROM, got problem and went right to work, posting their (stupid) question all over again and again... The problem was never the limited search capabilities... It's always the ppl...
A board without limitations always get bloated with crap, whether it's unwanted commercial och just plain stupid posts...
So, unfortunatly this is going to continue unless you put constraints on the board... I'm sorry, but that's what's gonna happen.

Seems to me that since this was posted the situation has sorta escalated... Faria, Molski, risidoro and just now Dr P has announced their leave.
In this rate all that'll be left will be the newbies soon. Sad to witness

_Nomad_ said:
And oh yeah, sure, you can't search for keywords less than four characters, but that's not really an excuse... look at the thread containing the latest Faria ROM. Half... Half of what the thread contains is the same question over and over again... those ppl didn't even read the initial post of the thread... they found the download link, tried to install the ROM, got problem and went right to work, posting their (stupid) question all over again and again... The problem was never the limited search capabilities... It's always the ppl...
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It's also very human.
_Nomad_ said:
A board without limitations always get bloated with crap, whether it's unwanted commercial och just plain stupid posts...
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There just should be enough moderators. Now what happens when you write something stupid is you also get useless answers like "don't do that" which just makes everything even worse. There should be a "FAQ"-section, there should be a "how-to"-section etc...but there isn't. The forum structure is FAR TOO SIMPLE to handle the amount of messages.
Two main things to handle this (just my opinion):
Re-designed forum structure
Moderators
(well, the structure should be designed in the first place so that it would be easy to extend it later...not an easy job)

prestonmcafee said:
...A major problem with "read the threads" is the 800+ entry length of some of them. It would be nice to try to harness the power of those of us newly figuring things out...
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I usually suggest to those asking questions to post the solution to their question in the first post. But I'm over at the Mio forums, and since we only have 4500 peps, the mods aren't overwhelmed. I can lock a thread, post the correct thread to post in, and a few days later, delete the thread. I spend 1/2 my time using the search function to consolidate questions into single threads. But like I said, that's not feasible here. I suggest a PM sent to everyone the registers, that is kind of a quick start guide. I understand why the 3 letter limit, because people type words like "the" and "and". I'm not sure how powerful the forum software is, but it would be nice to remove the size limit, and omit such words as mentioned above, from the search.
Regards,
Jason

mlehtola said:
There should be a "FAQ"-section, there should be a "how-to"-section etc...but there isn't. The forum structure is FAR TOO SIMPLE to handle the amount of messages.
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Ummm, have you ever taken the time to look at the Wiki?
This forum is being provided to us basically for free. (Except for voluntary donations.) I personally can't afford to donate $$$ to the community, or for that matter to individual developers, so I dedicate some time to post in the forums to share what I've learned. I have also donated time to updating the Wiki.
If the Wiki doesn't contain all you would like it to, just add it yourself! One brief tutorial could make a world of difference to a newbie, or even a more experienced user. It also helps to point out gaps in the general knowledge we have here in these forums.
If, for example, there isn't a sub-forum for the device you use, you don't have to wait for the moderators, etc. to create it. Just create a Wiki page, and get the ball rolling on your own!
Take the initiative! That's what these forums were founded on!
Just my opinion.
Now go have fun!

JKR said:
I suggest a PM sent to everyone the registers, that is kind of a quick start guide. I understand why the 3 letter limit, because people type words like "the" and "and". I'm not sure how powerful the forum software is, but it would be nice to remove the size limit, and omit such words as mentioned above, from the search.
Regards,
Jason
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First of all, you get much better, and more detailed search results by using a search-engine like Google. Their advanced search features do a fantastic job, and can be fine tuned to search only through a specific site. (i.e. http://forum.xdadevelopers.com )
Secondly, as opposed to a PM, possibly an email with a confirmation link after the introductory information.
Hope this helps....
Now go have fun!

I think it is more synonymous of the world today, do you read the manual when you buy a new stereo or mobile phone, or do you dig in saying 'nah i know how it works it'll be ok'. People just dont take the time to understand first, they think they know it all and then the proverbial hits the fan! As an experienced R&D firmware developer it doesn't matter how easy I make the interface you will always get those that stuff it up!
So not such an easy one to fix, you have given the masses a place to ask the ridiculous and the tools to stuff up easily, How do you fix that?
Riptos

Making the ATT Tilt Like the Unlocked HTC Kaiser

This is my first post.
I have owned a 8125 (wizard) for a year. I'm getting the tilt (399 from premier) soon. Before I do this I have a few questions if those who own can answer:
Is there a way to put the HTC Rom on the Tilt?
If so, How does it run?
Can you unlock the GPS? If so, does can you use Tom Tom? Can I use the GPS for free without using Telenav?
I really only care about the GPS, because my 8125 is pretty similar other than that.
Let me know please!
Wolfskin

wolfskinbjc said:
This is my first post.
I have owned a 8125 (wizard) for a year. I'm getting the tilt (399 from premier) soon. Before I do this I have a few questions if those who own can answer:
Is there a way to put the HTC Rom on the Tilt?
If so, How does it run?
Can you unlock the GPS? If so, does can you use Tom Tom? Can I use the GPS for free without using Telenav?
I really only care about the GPS, because my 8125 is pretty similar other than that.
Let me know please!
Wolfskin
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Just go to the Kaiser upgrading section to find the HardSPL unlocker and the Kaiser ROM to flash.
The GPS on the Tilt is already unlocked so you can use it with any software or data-based navigation program. . . no Telenav subscription needed.

Try reading the Kaiser forum before taking up space with questions that have already been asked about a million times...

austinsnyc said:
Try reading the Kaiser forum before taking up space with questions that have already been asked about a million times...
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Try being a bit kinder to the newbies. After purchasing a Kaiser I have been back on the boards for the first time in 2+ years and despite 5 straight days now (probably 20-25 full hours reading) this info was new to me.
What is also new to me is the elitist attitude of some members. This is a forum, and the last time I checked this meant it was a gathering place for people to share info. Some people will always be new and ask questios that others find pedantic. I see this pattern on every forum I have ever visited. If you can tell from the topic that it is something that has already been covered, don't read the post, but if you do go to the trouble to read it, AND make a comment, then at least make a helpful suggestion such as, "Try searching on XXX". This not only helps the OP, but others who happen to be "in the same moment" and would like more info too.

sorry but even as a new member I agree with austinsnyc...if the topic is already there, do a search on the forum first and look for maybe 5 minutes before you post redundant questions. This isnt about an elitest attitude, its about being considerate of everyone on the forum and not flooding it with crap that is already there.

austinsync++
doug2873++
The lazy and/or ignorant need to be schooled. And that even includes me on occasion!

perdurabo2 said:
austinsync++
doug2873++
The lazy and/or ignorant need to be schooled. And that even includes me on occasion!
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Yeah me too. But I usually do search.

It wasn't the suggestion to search that I found objectionable, it was the way is was said. It's just not a very nice way to welcome a new poster. I am sure we have all asked stupid questions from time to time. No need to be rude about it. That was the elitist part. If you have em, imagine of your kid's teacher said to your child on the first day of school. "That was a stupid question, stop wasting our time."
Sadly no one came to my defense. Still say I am making a bad call on the change in tone of the forum? Rhetorical question, not looking to start a flame war. My last word on this is to ask others to please be polite. Nuff said.

Unless someone is new to forums (and the internet) in general, they should know to search before asking something, but that doesn't mean older users need to be a jerk if they don't.
Also, sometimes information gets buried in large threads and even though you may use the search, it can be hard to sort through all of the results or a very large thread to pull together all of the information. Sometimes, it's really helpful if a knowledgeable user can paraphrase it all in one place.

Thank you newbie 2. Instead of searching through thread after thread i asked. Your answer on the unlocked gps part of the phone was all i needed !

In wolfs, defense....I've been pouring through the kaiser upgrading sections and just when I think it is safe to put the HTC rom upgrade in my tilt, I read posts like "when will they make this for the tilt?". I'm relatively sure that this upgrade works on the tilt, but am even more sure that I would never know what to do if it didn't...nor would I know what to do if I had to put the AT&T rom back on if I needed to get warranty work done - like I might, since mine absolutely will not beam files via bluetooth right now. I've put a bunch of tweaks on my tilt and love em...thank you everybody sooooo much! But currently am 'ascairt' to put the HTC rom on.

Tilt/ATT general 3G Questions

I'm running:
ATT Tilt
Alex's UltraClean v5.WM61.HTC.302.beta2 (3.02.405.0 WWE)
KAISER Radio 1.64.08.21
I've had my Tilt about 8 months, and 3G has finally come to my area and I've got a few questions/problems.
The first (and most important) is that I can't make phone calls while on 3G. On EDGE if I tried it would pop up an error about having a data session and a call session. On 3G it just pretends to connect but never does. It goes to H mode when I've got an active data session. (HSDPA is on.)
The second is why is everyone capped at ~700-900kbit/s? At least I seems that way to me and some of my coworkers. I could have sworn I was in a city once (Richmond) and I was getting ~3200kbit/s.
The last thing is that I haven't been keeping up with ROM development very well. I've been looking for something that has most of the fixes, upgrades, and tweaks but doesn't have anything or hardly anything installed. I like the ATT roms, but I can use the Operator Config if need be. I have UC set up for anything else.
Any comments or suggestions?

sounds like someone needs to introduce you to the search function. The 3G problem was discussed last week so the thread isn't far behind, I have no idea about the cap, and you need to go look at the 50 million roms out there.

Searching for:
"tilt 3g phone call"
"tilt 3g voice and data"
"tilt 3g phone call while data connected"
And any other number of queries didn't produce any results for me. I think I'll browse around general some more, but I'd not seen it mentioned. What query would you use to produce the intended results?
Also, I've browsed around the ROM forums a lot. They're confusing at best. I was hoping someone could make a suggestion off-hand about something they new and liked.

Dutty's Rom
Very rarely will you get a good answer from a senior member on this site. All they say is search. Kind of hard to find a real good answer in a search if it turns up 10000 results. There a lot of helpful people on here but it seems to me that the most likely response will be search...it's out there.
I use Dutty's 6.1 ROM and really like it although I haven't tried any of the others yet.
Not to sure about the 3G cap you are talking about. I didn't notice it in any of the previous posts. I've only been fortunate enough to use 3G in one are so I don't know how it compares with out places. I only average about 750k or so.
Good luck!

wmg76 said:
Very rarely will you get a good answer from a senior member on this site. All they say is search. Kind of hard to find a real good answer in a search if it turns up 10000 results. There a lot of helpful people on here but it seems to me that the most likely response will be search...it's out there.
I use Dutty's 6.1 ROM and really like it although I haven't tried any of the others yet.
Not to sure about the 3G cap you are talking about. I didn't notice it in any of the previous posts. I've only been fortunate enough to use 3G in one are so I don't know how it compares with out places. I only average about 750k or so.
Good luck!
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Jebus Pot Smoking Cries. You know why we say Search? It's not because we don't like giving the answer, we don't like giving the same answer over and over and oever. By not searching and creating usless threads it makes the Search results turn up 10000 results.
So don't act like you are better than us. Your only going to make people mad. We say Search, because it is out there. I know I personally, with a few other people, worked hard on formatting the Kaiser FAQ Wiki. If there is something not on there that you would like to be, you can PM me or add it yourself.
Just remember without senior members you wouldn't have Custom ROMs or Diamond Keyboards or HardSPL. So don't act holier then thou, because in the end we are here to foster learning by doing, not feeding by spoon.

JimmyMcGee said:
Jebus Pot Smoking Cries. You know why we say Search? It's not because we don't like giving the answer, we don't like giving the same answer over and over and oever. By not searching and creating usless threads it makes the Search results turn up 10000 results.
So don't act like you are better than us. Your only going to make people mad. We say Search, because it is out there. I know I personally, with a few other people, worked hard on formatting the Kaiser FAQ Wiki. If there is something not on there that you would like to be, you can PM me or add it yourself.
Just remember without senior members you wouldn't have Custom ROMs or Diamond Keyboards or HardSPL. So don't act holier then thou, because in the end we are here to foster learning by doing, not feeding by spoon.
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Not at all acting holier then thou. Just stating the obvious. I've found a lot of help here without having to ask any questions. By doing the right thing and searching and browsing but if that fails and you can't find what you are looking for...you come here and ask the question usually the only response from most users are SEARCH...it's out there. Well heck I've already done that...I've asked for help and still don't have a solution. It kind of sucks sometimes for us "newbies".

I've read the FAQ and I've read the GWENI thing just now. No dice on either of my questions. I've also read like the first 5 pages of Kaiser general.
I'm not pleased with the assumption that I didn't or have not searched. I just haven't found. I appreciate people who take the time to do these things and answer questions and catelogue and keep the answers. I just can't find where my answer lives.
I think I'm going to try out the HyperDragon III rom and/or the dutty newest one. But neither of them satisfy my requirement of not being pre installed with other things.
We'll see how they go.
Also: look at the join date, I may not post but I've been around since my 8125 and done a lot of flashing and reading. I've just not found the answer yet so I came to see (directly) if anyone else had.

#1 31-05-2008, 12:12 PM
ericiu
Junior Member Join Date: May 2006
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 9
H --> 3G --> E --> nothing! help!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So, I've lived in an area with just EDGE and my TyTN II for a year now without probs. I've changed the ROMs after using HardSPL from Olipro, etc. without probs. I went over the weekend to Ft. Lauderdale, which is a 3G area, and my pho
ne went crazy. It first shows an H with full strength... then when I try to make a call, it either won't connect or the signal goes completely dead. Other times if I just watch it, it will switch between H, 3G, E, and even G. Sometimes it'll even lose the signal altogether. What is going on?!? I've tried different radios (1.65.20.29 with WM6.1, 1.27.12.11 WM6.0, etc.) and they all do the same thing.
Interestingly, if I go to phone settings and change my band detection things from Auto to GSM and the data to 4 U.S. GSM frequencies, it goes right to Edge and all phone calls go through fine (but now I don't have 3G/H data)
Any ideas guys?
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Does that sound anything like your problem?

wmg76 said:
Not at all acting holier then thou. Just stating the obvious. I've found a lot of help here without having to ask any questions. By doing the right thing and searching and browsing but if that fails and you can't find what you are looking for...you come here and ask the question usually the only response from most users are SEARCH...it's out there. Well heck I've already done that...I've asked for help and still don't have a solution. It kind of sucks sometimes for us "newbies".
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whoa whoa whoa, listen here friend. None of us really has a problem with people doing the searchs and coming back for help (if they really did search), it's when people really don't search or search for a few minutes that makes us say that.
If I can search the problem and find it within 5 minutes, I'll say go search.
See what I'm sayn.

ChumleyEX said:
Does that sound anything like your problem?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nope
My problem is that I can make a call OR I can browse the internet. I can't / couldn't do both.
I'm now using :
ROM: Hyperdragon IIIm
Radio: 1.63.16.25
And I can do 3G internet and phone calls. The new rom is... decent for now. Its not as responsive as I'd like but it has the new D3D stuff built in to it. I'd really like to know what the root cause of my problem was. For now I'll settle with this as the fix.
Also, nobody else had data rate cap stuff with AT&T?

One week since I got my Diamond...

... and I must say I'm pretty impressed. Unlike what appears to be general consensus, I'm pretty much sold on Touchflo 3D, bút I still have some problems and questions some might be able to answer. Some of the questions I know are still unanswerable, some have already been answered, but I'm just writing them down for completeness. The ones that have been answered have been edited in for future reference.
- Can Opera be removed or can the Browser globe on the Internet page of TF3D be linked to Internet Explorer?
According to KukurikU, the answer to this question remains no for now. Probably, a modified ROM can change this behaviour. NChief says that using Opera some more would be a better idea, as he feels its a more capable browser.
- Can the background of TF3D be changed on all pages, instead of only the Home screen?
Not yet. This might be in future updates.
- Can we add custom cities to the TF3D Weather application?
No, according to a thread about this question, for now it appears HTC is using a DNS referral to forward our weather inquiries to AccuWeather in a special layout. Using any city in this script that is not listed in the normal list yields no result as the whole thing just reverts.
- Can you set the SMS/E-mail pages in TF3D to only display unread SMS/E-mail?
Not yet. This might be an option when TouchFlo 3D is more heavily modded.
- Can I have the battery indicator show at the top of the screen while TF3D is running?
According to most people, it should already be there. Sadly, it is not for me. I'll investigate this some more to find out if there is a particular reason for this.
- Can anyone tell me whether the bottom USB connector on the Diamond is a modified 5-pin USB mini connector, and whether such a plug can be used to charge the phone (in case I lose my original powercable).
Again, according to KukurikU, the original cable is a modified 5 pins mini-USB adapter, I'm going to take the guess that the remaining pins are used for audio/feedback purposes.
- What are generally accepted must-have games, and generally accepted must-have applications for WM6 / Diamond?
Sadly, KukurikU felt he was not intelligent enough to answer this question. Until now, I've found that Advanced Configuration is one handy utility to have (especially in combination with the quite useful tweaks topic), and that alternate GPS software (ie besides Google Maps) is much lighter on the battery.
I also have some remarks and comments:
- Hard-SPL Dev + TLR's ROM are on my Diamond and they're great improvements. They stopped me from returning my Dutch, crippled ROM without handwriting support, slow, laggy stuff.
- Overall impressed. Good battery-life, fast, responsive, uncluttered, very broad range of possibilities, wow.
In case I asked any stupid questions: yes, I'm new. Sue me.

Why, I'm glad to see so many enthusiastic replies . Let me add another question then:
- Is it possible to minimize TT7 while still having it use the voices to indicate the route (ie. to listen music and TT7 at the same time), and if not, does another navigation program support this?
It appears this should be possible, and in some cases I find it does work, in some cases it doesn't. If I find out what way to get both running is best, I'll edit it in.

- Learn to use opera and you will notice that it's WAY better than IE
- The background can not be changed on all TF3D pages (yet?)
- You can not add custom cityes to the TF3D Weather application
- I have learnd that I can use any mini-USB cabel for chargeing(don't think its recomended tho)
That's the questions I can answer, hope I got them right.
btw, try searching the forum

tha_rami said:
Why, I'm glad to see so many enthusiastic replies
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Click to collapse
Many of your questions have been asked and answered a thousand times over. Perhaps people have got sick of answering the same question to people too lazy to read what has already been written?

mr_Ray said:
Many of your questions have been asked and answered a thousand times over. Perhaps people have got sick of answering the same question to people too lazy to read what has already been written?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I already stated in the first post that many of these have already been answered, but that I'm listing them for completeness. Please, if you want to point the finger at anyone not reading, please point it at yourself. Especially for you, I've been so free to bolden the text I'm referring to in my first post.
Besides that, I must say the search function on this forum is pretty useless - thanks to people posting those same questions over and over. For one of my questions, I ended up going back to page 13. I'm glad this forum is so inviting to people with questions, I mean, after all, a forum is not for asking things, is it now? Of course not, that would be absurd. Especially seeing that to find the answers to some of these questions, you have to spend almost an hour digging through multi-page threads in a 50-page topic list. It would be extremely hard to answer those questions for someone who knows the answer to these, I know, but honestly, I take it someone can put in the heroic and epic effort to at least try? Now, if there were a sticky with questions answered too often, that'd be a first step in the good direction. A bit like the, may I add, excellent list of tweaks. Do you hear anyone ask for tweaks besides in that topic? Of course not, there's a practical resource for going through that.
Nevertheless, I would like the answers on the questions not answered yet. There are at least three I know have not been answered yet, or of which I could not find the answer. At least, thanks for the ironic reply.

tha_rami said:
Why, I'm glad to see so many enthusiastic replies . Let me add another question then:
- Is it possible to minimize TT7 while still having it use the voices to indicate the route (ie. to listen music and TT7 at the same time), and if not, does another navigation program support this?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
you are funny (not going to say ridiculous).
maybe you don't get answers because your questions are not of so great importance? ... games, applications, tt7 voices (is this a navigation programs forum? and btw, in igo8 this is an option of the program and not of the pda)? and so on...
Can I have the battery indicator show at the top of the screen while TF3D is running?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
this is a good example of life-death question. here is an answer: you should have it all the time, it is already there! duh!? look again...
i think you didn't notice that the great majority of posters here are fighting with really technical issues or waiting for help in critical issues, not to mention the ones that are developing tools and applications to make our diamond more reliable and fast. the forum is full with "after 1 week", "i have it for 2 weeks" complains and reviews. don't want to be mean or sarcastic (and it is hard for me not to) but could wait a little more or search a little more here and in other places?

I agree with tha-rami, the search function doesn't always provide the results you want and this is a forum i.e. a medium for a free and open exchange of views. Yes, a search is most peoples' first option but I for one simply don't have the time to spend hours and hours trawling through each page and topic.
Have a little patience and don't assume that a poster hasn't searched - two days ago the search function didn't work at all for me. If you can't be constructive in a reply then you have to question why you're replying at all!
Regards
Skier641

tha_rami said:
Why, I'm glad to see so many enthusiastic replies . Let me add another question then:
- Is it possible to minimize TT7 while still having it use the voices to indicate the route (ie. to listen music and TT7 at the same time), and if not, does another navigation program support this?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
On my previous Touch and Touch Dual and also Ameo devices ive had Tom Tom Navigator 6 minimised with music playing and the Voice directions have still worked.
I have John Cleese as the Voice on my device and its great listening to him chatting all over some dance music! hehe!
Regarding the custom city in Weather, see this thread... http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=397599
I agree with both sides of the argument.
It took me a few seconds to search for Custom City part of the Forum, but ive also had problems searching for items.
It would be nice if there was a thread started, that literally was edited and updated with all the common questions. (I suppose thats what the Wiki's for, but i never look at it as its never usually up to date) no other posts were added just 1 long 1st post that had a list of all the useful threads in it and what they were.
It can be hard trawling through many pages of threads trying to find what you want, but in my experience its worth it! Some of the replys to people asking questions can be a bit sarcastic tho...
eg
Search the Forum
Try Searching
or
Have you thought about Clicking on Search?
But i understand where these people are coming from, they have all searched through the forums and looked for what they want. Maybe it does take a little longer but im hoping that moderators will begin to tidy things up on here as there are alot of duplicate posts and information.
I think maybe the Forum should have a "Diamond Reviews" or "Reviews and Experiences" section added in. That way all the people that want to voice their opinions can do in their own part of the forum, plus this will free up some of the General Diamond discussions. Just an idea, please dont flame me for my opinion.
Anyway, I agree that XDA Developers is an excellent source of information for all things Diamond. All good! Glad its here and glad there are so many helpful people on here. Nice one!

tha_rami said:
I already stated in the first post that many of these have already been answered, but that I'm listing them for completeness.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you already knew the answers and were really interested in "posting for completeness", you'd have posted the answers too. More to the point, how exactly is the community here best served by posting the same old questions yet again, under yet another post with a completely nondescript title?
tha_rami said:
Besides that, I must say the search function on this forum is pretty useless
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Click to collapse
Someone should come up with some internet service dedicated to searching this big ol-internet thingy we've got going on. they could call it "Google" or "Live Search". Something like that. They can even limit your search to just the site you want!
tha_rami said:
thanks to people posting those same questions over and over.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
LMAO!!! So you admit yourself that the search becomes useless because of people posting the same damn questions over and over - and to fix this... you post the same damn questions again! Nice logic you got going on there.
tha_rami said:
For one of my questions, I ended up going back to page 13.
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Click to collapse
Oh no. Thanks to your and your kind you had to go through the monumental effort of going back a whole 13 pages??? Firstly, stop posting these kinds of pointless posts and maybe you'll only have to go back 3 pages. And if even that's too much, those fancy interweb search engines should still ease your troubled journey.
tha_rami said:
I'm glad this forum is so inviting to people with questions, I mean, after all, a forum is not for asking things, is it now?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Is it now? Is it now? Is it now? Is it now? Is it now? Is it now? Is it now? Is it now? Is it now? Is it now? Is it now? Is it now? Is it now?
I just asked your question several times. How did that help more than asking it just once? Most people don't have a problem with genuine questions. The same questions ad nauseum just wastes everyone's time though. you admit that yourself with your "i had to go to page 13!!!" rant.
tha_rami said:
Especially seeing that to find the answers to some of these questions, you have to spend almost an hour digging through multi-page threads in a 50-page topic list.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Again, your own fault, and those good search facilities help. they'd help even more if your thread had a meaningful title that was actually related to the question!
tha_rami said:
I take it someone can put in the heroic and epic effort to at least try?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So the smart people are supposed to put in a heroic effort to answer every single one of your questions, but you can't put in a heroic effort to search? Figures.
tha_rami said:
Now, if there were a sticky with questions answered too often, that'd be a first step in the good direction.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You should have started one instead of posting this nonsense.
tha_rami said:
A bit like the, may I add, excellent list of tweaks. Do you hear anyone ask for tweaks besides in that topic? Of course not
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hahaha. Right. Actually, you're wrong there.

lol! and i thought i am evil!? i am angel!
mr_ray, you are my hero!
pity, you wasted yr time and i may say yr literally talent....the spammers are stubborn, they don't quit easily.. they want their answers to their useless (i didn't say stupid) posts and they insist they have the right to pest this place.
you can explain to them, you can beg, you can ridicule them you even can insult .....no results..they'll never quit.
they just don't get it. they don't know that there are rules or maybe they know but don't give a f...

The arrogance is outstanding! There are just three sub-forums here for the Diamond so if you super smart phone geeks want to have your own sub-forum I suggest you start one - 'uber geek' or similar. This is a forum as previously stated and some seem to spend a great deal of time putting an individual down rather than pointing them in the right direction. Don't mention the search facility, it's poor. This evening I searched for 'GPS latitude' (I wanted to see if I could get raw lat & long without installing TomTom, Co-pilot or something similar). The result of the search pointed me to a thread of multiple pages - I got to page 13 before I gave up without any mention of anything relevant.
I give up quite a bit of my time suporting people via the Microsoft newsgroups for Vista, Outlook and wireless networks in the full knowledge that most posters don't have the knowledge that I do in these areas but, not once have I arbitarily decided that I'm smarter than them. No doubt in some cases I will be and in some cases I won't. But for your information, if qualifications are any measure of 'smartness' (and they're not!), I have a Bachelors and two Masters degrees and the next time your aircraft takes off late flying you to wherever it might just be because I'm searching a forum for the umpteenth hour.
Relax and help others, you may find that others will help you one day!
Regards
Skier641

- Can Opera be removed or can the Browser globe on the Internet page of TF3D be linked to Internet Explorer?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
not yet
- Can the background of TF3D be changed on all pages, instead of only the Home screen?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
not yet
- Can we add custom cities to the TF3D Weather application?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
most certainly not
- Can you set the SMS/E-mail pages in TF3D to only display unread SMS/E-mail?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
no
- Can I have the battery indicator show at the top of the screen while TF3D is running?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
you already have it.
- Can anyone tell me whether the bottom USB connector on the Diamond is a modified 5-pin USB mini connector, and whether such a plug can be used to charge the phone (in case I lose my original powercable).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
it the most common usb cable. charging yr diamond this way is going to heat it a little bit. i recommend the original wall charger.
- What are generally accepted must-have games, and generally accepted must-have applications for WM6 / Diamond?
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Click to collapse
lost at this one. i think only somebody with two masters can answer you to that. i only have a bachelor degree and only one master (electrical engineering...geek).
try and convince sky641 to answer you to that. he loves you and ppl like you no, wait, he is one of you. he didn't bother to answer to none of yr highly challenging questions but he did join you in complaining about the search feature and he keeps defending yr right to post..whatever you post.
now i hope that no plane is going to take off late....
signed,
a defeated, broken but relaxed ubergeek
regards
P.S.
i am and i was relaxed. staying in front my pc and reading posts like this one is more relaxing than watching a George Carlin show. Just laughing my a...off.

KukurikU said:
not yet
not yet
most certainly not
no
you already have it.
it the most common usb cable. charging yr diamond this way is going to heat it a little bit. i recommend the original wall charger.
lost at this one. i think only somebody with two masters can answer you to that. i only have a bachelor degree and only one master (electrical engineering...geek).
try and convince sky641 to answer you to that. he loves you and ppl like you no, wait, he is one of you. he didn't bother to answer to none of yr highly challenging questions but he did join you in complaining about the search feature and he keeps defending yr right to post..whatever you post.
now i hope that no plane is going to take off late....
signed,
a defeated, broken but relaxed ubergeek
regards
P.S.
i am and i was relaxed. staying in front my pc and reading posts like this one is more relaxing than watching a George Carlin show. Just laughing my a...off.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why, thank you. I'm not even going to reply further to Mr Ray, as I've had quite some fun reading his reply. He seems to indeed be quite literal, and he appears very good at ignoring the very cause of a forum and for indeed seems to love using that to put 40 minutes into trying to make fun out of someone (which ended up in a fail, although I did chuckle at the "Is it now?" thing, which was, admittedly, rather funny). Now, you, you are pretty horrible as well, but luckily, you posted some answers.
I'm glad to see people agree with me, and I know why. I know that they know that even Mr Ray and you both started one day by asking a question here. I know that most likely, you've been treated the exact same way, or that you were so lucky running into a normal person who has more to do than wasting 40 minutes putting someone down. Well, try someone else for that, I usually just skip those posts.
Oddly, I have a problem with one of the questions - and the problem is: there is no battery indicator, and if there were, why in gods or any deity's name would I ask for it? I'm using TLR's ROM 1 on a Dutch Diamond. I play to flash it to TLR's ROM 2 as soon as I get Outlook on this PC to at least not lose my contacts, and will report whether or not it shows up then.
Glad to know that the battery charger is indeed an USB 5-pin connector. Also glad to know that there are sane people around. I was thinking of spending some more time on these forums, and seeing that the most active posters around seem to be half-intelligent morons that spend days lurking for threads that contains anything they can flame (a common problem amongst the more 'elite' users of forums, of whom some feel they're too important to waste time reading topic-titles of subcritical questions, but feel new people should click through all 50 pages to find an answer tucked away on page 27 of the topic because the search engine in vBulletin forums sucks big time. I studied some internet- and social psychology, no master in that, though), I think I actually should may I find some spare time. There are probably lots of people around with subimportant questions and the best way to help them, is to help them.
Luckily, there are people like Skier641 around, people who maybe do not know the answer, but do voice their opinion against those of the 'elite' who feel they're exactly that, effectively rendering them useless to both community and forum. Luckily, my questions have been answered rather satisfactory. I'll edit the answers into my first post for further reference. Maybe, some day, the search engine will actually work and yield someone this thread, after which they can quickly and easily find the answers on page 1.
I'm spending too much time on this. For your information, this took 6 minutes to write. I hope that Mr Ray and whatever-his-name-was-again are having 20 minutes of great fun using their reverse psychology on this subject. It's amazing how most likely, they'll spend tens of minutes writing a witty reply to this one, instead of taking the five minutes it would've taken to answer my questions. Or maybe, after I posted that line, they'll act smart and reply in one line. Alternatively, after that line, they may not post at all.
That makes 7 minutes.

ROM upg for tilt?

New to pocket pc's so sry for the n00be questions. Have ATT tilt through ATT with CPU Q 7201 & ROM ver: 1.62.502.0. First I am wondering how I can tell what version of win mobile I have? I want to upg to ver 6.1. I have Windows Mobile 6.1 For HTC Touch (U.S. Cellular) package ... would that work on my phone and with my carrier? Also wondering how I can save and restore current ROM version and where I can find good ROM packages (for my phone) for novices?
Thank you

Welcome,
Do a bit of research read stickys in ROM section, maybe even a bit of the wiki...
And never flash a\ROM meant for another device....
All info is here on XDA.
Peac3,
stylez.

There are volumes of information and most of it is confusing since this is my first experience with pocket PC's. I have done hours of research and cant get a strait answer. Thank god for forums. But thanks for at least answering one question. I thought for some reason that the HTC touch was for my device but I guess the touch is different than the tilt.
Another issue with the searches is that it comes up with nothing productive regarding my specific questions. Below are my search strings:
tilt rom upgrade "6.1" title only
tilt rom windows mobile "6.1" entire post
tilt rom "6.1" entire post
Sorry - no matches. Please try some different terms.
When I go to the ATT site they say that there is no 6.1 update available. Where can I get the update for my specific phone and carrier? Does the carrier even matter?
EDIT: Think I found the update at one of the logical places: HTC's site.

Hi,
Sorry for the bad reception. People around here seem to think their time is too valuable to help a newcomer. Bad comments invited, my skin is thick. They must have forgotten what it is like to be new. And I have found that the search function on this site is often less than helpful.
You can find your OS Version by going to Settings and clicking on Device Information. It should be on the first line.
It very much matters that you use the right ROM as the others won't work. OEM ROMS are picky about where they get installed.
You are on the right track at the HTC site. There used to be a link to it from ATT but I couldn't find it the other day.
Good luck.

TracyD said:
Hi,
Sorry for the bad reception. People around here seem to think their time is too valuable to help a newcomer. Bad comments invited, my skin is thick. They must have forgotten what it is like to be new. And I have found that the search function on this site is often less than helpful.
You can find your OS Version by going to Settings and clicking on Device Information. It should be on the first line.
It very much matters that you use the right ROM as the others won't work. OEM ROMS are picky about where they get installed.
You are on the right track at the HTC site. There used to be a link to it from ATT but I couldn't find it the other day.
Good luck.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Despite the chastising of senior members by our learned member with ten whole posts. What new members need to realize, is that this is a developers forum first and foremost. It is a library of knowledge accrued by the study of these phones and the hard work of it's members.
As I said, it is a library for all to access, not an HTC help line. As with all libraries, you do not walk up to the librarian and say " give me all you have on world history " the response you will get is, " go to the world history section and search it out yourself " Much like newer members here are told to go to the wiki.
When seniors suggest that you search, it is an attempt to train you to be productive , contributing members of the this community. If that's all you want is an HTC 24hr helpline, there are plenty of those other places online.
If you want access to the most knowledgeable people in the WinMo world , then do your homework, read the Wiki, do your searches, and then respectfully ask for help with concise well thought out questions, and you will find this one of the most friendly sharing sites on the net.
That being said, Welcome and here is the latest rom update for the Tilt
http://www.htc.com/us/supportdownloadlist.aspx?p_id=67&act=sd&cat=all

I agree with denco7. I researched for 3 days before I got the courage to try to unlock and flash my Tilt. Even then, it took me 5 hours. My MDA only took about 10 minutes. There is a reason for the wikis and stickies: they should be read first. If you don't find answers to your questions there or don't understand, ask for help and give a detailed description of what you have tried. Don't expect everything to just be handed to you.

i agree with what the senior members are saying...
also, i would like to add that the initial process (that can last for several DAYS) of doing the reading and searching to try to understand the basics of your device has been a thoroughly incredible learning experience. it will take time and some effort on your part but think of it as an investment...these devices may be simple to USE but CUSTOMIZATION steps like ROM upgrading deserve your full attention and understanding, particularly because of the likelihood of "bricking" your very expensive device.
at the very least, the wiki should be THE place to go to, to build your concepts, read about the various tips and tricks and customization possibilities and what not.
all the same, the builtin search does suck but nearly everybody recommends using google to perform your search...simply append "xda" in the keywords of your search and google will give you remarkably good results.

TitusCicero said:
There are volumes of information and most of it is confusing since this is my first experience with pocket PC's. I have done hours of research and cant get a strait answer. Thank god for forums. But thanks for at least answering one question. I thought for some reason that the HTC touch was for my device but I guess the touch is different than the tilt.
Another issue with the searches is that it comes up with nothing productive regarding my specific questions. Below are my search strings:
tilt rom upgrade "6.1" title only
tilt rom windows mobile "6.1" entire post
tilt rom "6.1" entire post
Sorry - no matches. Please try some different terms.
When I go to the ATT site they say that there is no 6.1 update available. Where can I get the update for my specific phone and carrier? Does the carrier even matter?
EDIT: Think I found the update at one of the logical places: HTC's site.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just a side note.... There are 2 search buttons on the forums. One is for the Thread ( which it appears to be the one you were using ) and the other is a google forum search. The one on the very top of the screen is the one you want. Or do as everyone else has suggested and use google but add xda to the search string. I like how Denco put it........ this is a knowledgebase ( or a library if you will ). A librarian can help point you in the right direction or even teach you the dewey decimal system, but they will never hand pick all of the relative books for you. Learn the system and you will love it here. Goodluck!!!!

Now you've gone and hurt my feelings. I may not post again for another year. Oh well. Honestly, I support the need for folks to search, but I think you guys are a little extreme. It is my thought that forums like this are places where people go to get help, some need more than others. You are welcome to not respond or to respond helpfully, however, what value is a negative post but to raise people's hackles. Fortunately for you poor spirited folks, I have decided to ignore your rudeness and continue to lurk looking for tidibits of fun info.
As far as being a senior member goes, so? I have been lurking on forums since back in the 300 baud modem and bulletin board days. I just might be senior enough for my purposes. I help when I can and try to enjoy the commentary. I just don't like to see such rudeness as I often see here. Perhaps some "seniors" need to grow up a little and not take this stuff so seriously.

well........if you're senior enough, then you should know better than to start a thread asking a question that is answered countless times, which is an extreme no-no here. because of that we will now have to display extreme hatred towards you......its in the rules somewhere.
here is an excellent post from the most good looking xda-mod (i've heard rumors) describing what xda-devs is about
What is XDA-Devs

TracyD said:
Now you've gone and hurt my feelings. I may not post again for another year. Oh well. Honestly, I support the need for folks to search, but I think you guys are a little extreme. It is my thought that forums like this are places where people go to get help, some need more than others. You are welcome to not respond or to respond helpfully, however, what value is a negative post but to raise people's hackles. Fortunately for you poor spirited folks, I have decided to ignore your rudeness and continue to lurk looking for tidibits of fun info.
As far as being a senior member goes, so? I have been lurking on forums since back in the 300 baud modem and bulletin board days. I just might be senior enough for my purposes. I help when I can and try to enjoy the commentary. I just don't like to see such rudeness as I often see here. Perhaps some "seniors" need to grow up a little and not take this stuff so seriously.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
lol, infact your response was the only rude one, stating about senior members and there attitude towards noobs after my first post to which was giving direction and spoken very softly without a "go search" etc, infact i even welcomed him\her to the forum & directed towards the most relevant threads including saying not to brick there device.
Welll in future i shall just post "Use the search!!!"
In response to how many years online i imagine we all been about for along time online but not to say "we" know it all about the subject matter in hand.
"Any way the book you are after is in the second isle, if you need any more assistance there is a computer in the corner that can help find what you need"