Database Develop

Confusions about rooting and rom flashing

I've been doing a lot of reading and searching but still can't find a definite answer...
My understanding is that I need to root the device to flash a custom rom
But from the instructions for noobs, they don't usually specify that I have to root
I assume that rooting is a pre-requisite for everything...but then some roms advertise that they are rooted (for example, LeoFroYo)
So it the rooting process tied to the rom itself and I have to root everytime I flash a new rom (if the rom is not rooted)? Or is it universal like HSPL on WinMo?

Rooting is per rom. What is required to flash a custom rom is having an unlocked bootloader and a custom recovery image. From there you can flash a pre-rooted rom.
The root instructions assume that you're gonna keep using the stock version with root abilities added on top. Whereas if you're using flashing something like CM, that already has root and OS tweaks.

FaJu said:
Rooting is per rom. What is required to flash a custom rom is having an unlocked bootloader and a custom recovery image. From there you can flash a pre-rooted rom.
The root instructions assume that you're gonna keep using the stock version with root abilities added on top. Whereas if you're using flashing something like CM, that already has root and OS tweaks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks! So does that mean when I get my phone out of the box, I have to root it once over the stock rom before I can flash any custom rom?

You need to root the phone originally and flash a custom rom. The "pre-rooted" means the rom is rooted. So if you flash that rom then you wont lose root. If you flash an un-rooted rom then you will lose it. So go through the steps and unlock your bootloader then flash a custom recovery image. Then decide which rom you wanted and flash it. All the custom roms are rooted.

futango said:
You need to root the phone originally and flash a custom rom. The "pre-rooted" means the rom is rooted. So if you flash that rom then you wont lose root. If you flash an un-rooted rom then you will lose it. So go through the steps and unlock your bootloader then flash a custom recovery image. Then decide which rom you wanted and flash it. All the custom roms are rooted.
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Click to collapse
That explains it. Thanks for your answer

one more question:
I take it as when bootloader is unlocked, there's no way to lock it again? Not even flashing the stock boot image?

No, once you unlock the bootloader, it stays unlocked.

Just to be clear here you don't _have_ to "root your phone once"
On _most_ phones you need an exploit to be able to get to the bootloader, this exploit is often referred to as rooting. After the exploit you generally have superuser access until you reboot, on some phone this may allow you to get at the bootloader and write anything you want there (E.G. an OS that give you superuser access at boot time)
However the N1 lets you issue the command "fastboot oem unlock" that unlocks the bootloader, from there you can flash a recovery image that will allow you to flash the main OS without having access to Google's release signing keys. Hence you _could_:
1. Bootloader unlock
2. Flash Custom recovery
3. Flash Custom OS
Without ever actually having "root" access, it just happens that most Devs prefer having root access available in both recovery and any custom rom they cook up.

ROM Manager Won't Doesn't Work

I have an N1 that I unlocked and rooted and was running CM7 RC1 when I decided to try the stock Gingerbread. This switch went perfectly, but now I don't think I want to stay on the stock GB but I can't seem to get ROM Manager to boot into recovery to allow me to flash another ROM. Do I have to do something differently now? BTW, I do not have root on the 'new' GB.
Thanks.

Unless you flashed a pre-rooted version of Gingerbread, you will have lost root and your custom recovery...
If this is the case, you have two options:
1 - Flash a custom recovery through an unlocked bootloader.
2 - passimg back to an older version of Android and root again...
Sent from my Nexus One using XDA App

tsprks said:
BTW, I do not have root on the 'new' GB.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is your problem. ROM Manager installs a custom recovery, but only when your phone is rooted. You need to re-root GB.

Can I ask them how people flash custom recoveries without having root? I see threads all over the place that say that you don't have to root your phone to run these custom ROM's.

tsprks said:
Can I ask them how people flash custom recoveries without having root? I see threads all over the place that say that you don't have to root your phone to run these custom ROM's.
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Click to collapse
You have to root, but you don't have to unlock your bootloader.

You have to do one of the things:
1) Root.
2) Unlock the bootloader.
Rooting allows you to bypass security mechanisms from within the OS, and flash the custom recovery from there.
Unlocking the bootloader turns off the security mechanisms, and you can flash whatever you want directly from bootloader.
Both achieve the same thing, but in different ways.
Root privileges in OS are lost upon official upgrades.
Unlocked bootloader is never lost.
Unlocked bootloader allows for an easy way to gain root in the first place, regardless of the ROM.

How does an unlocked bootloader allow me to flash whatever ROM I want? ROM Manager won't run without root? Am I missing something? I've read the wiki's and threads about rooting an N1 and they all just seem to stop at unlocking the bootloader, well, my bootloader is unlocked but I can't get it to boot into CWM so that I can select another ROM. Is there another way to do this?

ROM Manager is only one, and not the most successful nor most powerful, way to flash ROMs or recovery. ROM Manager was made for non-understanding people to make the process look and feel easier. The most powerful way is directly from bootloader - which needs to be unlocked to allow it.
If you read all the threads, you'll see that unlocking the bootloader is just a first step - you can look carefully at "installing custom ROM" guide in Wiki. Or, for example, here:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=636795
Read the Wiki, look for recovery installation instructions using unlocked bootloader, execute. I suggest Amon_Ra's.

[Q] Rooting Question

Do you have to change the N1 RECOVERY to enable ROOT?

No.
You can root with superoneclick (http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=803682) or unlock your bootloader and root it by hand (http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=13446089)
Ferran

Excellent! Just what I wanted to hear!

C64c said:
Do you have to change the N1 RECOVERY to enable ROOT?
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Click to collapse
Actually, it's the opposite: You have to root to change recovery, unless you unlocked bootloader.

Unless something has changed in the past few days, you DO need to change recovery to root. The only way to root stock GRJ22 is to flash SU.zip, and you can only do that with non-stock recovery.

GnatGoSplat said:
Unless something has changed in the past few days, you DO need to change recovery to root. The only way to root stock GRJ22 is to flash SU.zip, and you can only do that with non-stock recovery.
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Click to collapse
Yes, correct. But how are you going to flash a custom recovery without root?
As was said before, if you are on GRJ22, you only have two options to root:
1) unlock the bootloader, install a custom recovery and flash ChainsDD's Superuser update;
2) downgrade to Froyo by flashing one of the leaked Froyo shipped ROM (FRG33 or FRG83) via the bootloader, root that and update to Gingerbread the proper way...

I agree, you need root before you can flash a custom recovery.
Your option #2 is what I used. I downgraded to Froyo, then upgraded to 2.3.3, then rooted with Gingerbreak, installed custom recovery using clockworkmod app, and THEN upgraded to 2.3.4 with stock recovery folder removed which allows you to install SU.zip.
It's a few extra steps over unlocking the bootloader, but it doesn't take long and may be worth doing to not have to unlock the bootloader.

GnatGoSplat said:
I agree, you need root before you can flash a custom recovery.
Your option #2 is what I used. I downgraded to Froyo, then upgraded to 2.3.3, then rooted with Gingerbreak, installed custom recovery using clockworkmod app, and THEN upgraded to 2.3.4 with stock recovery folder removed which allows you to install SU.zip.
It's a few extra steps over unlocking the bootloader, but it doesn't take long and may be worth doing to not have to unlock the bootloader.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yup. Sounds good.
Or, you can just unlock your bootloader and never have to worry about losing root ever again... and besides, I haven't heard of any individual saying that HTC refused warranty service because of an unlocked bootloader...

My bootloader has been unlocked for months!

[Q] Rooting and OTA

Hi,
I know this has been discussed in several ocassions, and I have read several threads but none of them answer my question.
I am wondering if I root my HTC One and keep the device with the stock rom (I only want to root for some apps that needs su) will I be able to get OTA updates?
If not, if I also do S-OFF will I be able to? Please keep in mind that I do not want to flash a custom rom, where then the answer I believe would be to unroot and apply the OTA.
Thank you

buzmay said:
Hi,
I know this has been discussed in several ocassions, and I have read several threads but none of them answer my question.
I am wondering if I root my HTC One and keep the device with the stock rom (I only want to root for some apps that needs su) will I be able to get OTA updates?
If not, if I also do S-OFF will I be able to? Please keep in mind that I do not want to flash a custom rom, where then the answer I believe would be to unroot and apply the OTA.
Thank you
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, and youll need a custom kernel with disabled write protection for the root to stick, which will not allow OTA's to work. if you really want root, download a custom stock rom

IINexusII said:
No, and youll need a custom kernel with disabled write protection for the root to stick, which will not allow OTA's to work. if you really want root, download a custom stock rom
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But what about S-OFF not even with it it would work? I am confuse because I saw a guide here in XDA saying the following:
Rooting stock ROM
What you need to know before rooting stock ROM:
You can "un-root" it easily.
As long as you won't change any files on system partition, you still will be able to download and install official OTA updates.
Download Rooting Tools
Boot your device in recovery mode (power off the device and turn it on using power + vol down buttons and select "RECOVERY")
In main menu, select "install zip from sdcard" and "choose zip from sdcard".
Navigate to the location of Rooting Tools (zip) package and confirm flashing procedure.
After flashing process is complete, reboot the device. Your device has now SuperUser.apk, su binary and busybox installed.
So is this not true?
Link to this guide:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2265618

buzmay said:
But what about S-OFF not even with it it would work? I am confuse because I saw a guide here in XDA saying the following:
Rooting stock ROM
What you need to know before rooting stock ROM:
You can "un-root" it easily.
As long as you won't change any files on system partition, you still will be able to download and install official OTA updates.
Download Rooting Tools
Boot your device in recovery mode (power off the device and turn it on using power + vol down buttons and select "RECOVERY")
In main menu, select "install zip from sdcard" and "choose zip from sdcard".
Navigate to the location of Rooting Tools (zip) package and confirm flashing procedure.
After flashing process is complete, reboot the device. Your device has now SuperUser.apk, su binary and busybox installed.
So is this not true?
Link to this guide:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2265618
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Having S-off won't effect OTAs but having a custom recovery will. Best to go all stock, rom and recovery to receive the OTA updates. You can root after.
Note: Do the S-off procedure before you update. If your hboot gets updated, you're outta luck.

farang4u said:
Having S-off won't effect OTAs but having a custom recovery will. Best to go all stock, rom and recovery to receive the OTA updates. You can root after.
Note: Do the S-off procedure before you update. If your hboot gets updated, you're outta luck.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ok, but now for instance I do have 4.2.2 so if I root and then there is an update 4.3 then what? I am interested in being only root and being able to get the updates. So every time an OTA comes I shall unroot and then root? This option is not as optimal as I would have though it would be.
Thanks

buzmay said:
Ok, but now for instance I do have 4.2.2 so if I root and then there is an update 4.3 then what? I am interested in being only root and being able to get the updates. So every time an OTA comes I shall unroot and then root? This option is not as optimal as I would have though it would be.
Thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As long as you have a stock recovery and rom, you should be able to receive OTAs on a rooted phone. Not %100 certain though.
Note: An OTA update could break the root and other mods you made to the rom and cause some other issues.

farang4u said:
As long as you have a stock recovery and rom, you should be able to receive OTAs on a rooted phone. Not %100 certain though.
Note: An OTA update could break the root and other mods you made to the rom and cause some other issues.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But how can I have a stock recovery and be root? Dont I need a custome recovery to root?

buzmay said:
But how can I have a stock recovery and be root? Dont I need a custome recovery to root?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You need custom recovery to run the rooting process. After your system is rooted you can then flash back to the stock recovery. You should still have root access but I could be wrong. Download "Root Checker" from the play store, run it to see if your device is still rooted. You still need a stock recovery to receive OTA updates though.

The reason you need stock recovery is that you can't install an official update with custom recovery. The type of recovery you have doesn't affect root access.
The reason you have to keep your system files perfectly stock is that an OTA is a patch, meaning it doesn't necessarily replace entire files but mainly snippets of code. If the system files are not stock, it can't do this properly. So it checks /system before running and stops if things are not perfectly stock.
You can get OTAs being rooted, you just can't install them unless you have stock recovery and a fully stock rom.
If you're stock on 4.2.2 right now, you can't s-off, so don't worry about that.

You don't have to flash a custom rom, but you can flash a stock rooted rom. With OTAs, you play the cat-and-mouse game. Can I root it? Did the HBOOT update and kill current S-OFF procedures?
If 4.3 does come out, all you would have to do is wait for a few days for a dev to cook a stock rooted 4.3 rom. AT&T always lags with updates, yet I have a fully functioning 4.2.2 M7 with LTE and no AT&T bloat all thanks to the devs who cook stock rooted roms.

First timer XT1096 Root Help

So I've tried to do my due diligence researching but as a noob a lot of this is very confusing. My main goal is to have verizon unlimited tethering (currently ota 5.0) I installed and ran Kingroot thinking I could just edit the system/build.prop file and be on my way, that doesn't appear to work. So anyways I was wondering if I buy sunshine unlock my bootloader would I need to buy mofo to enable use of TWRP or would the KingRoot temp root work for that? Don't have much money at the moment and am trying to see if I can just pay for the Sunshine. Any thoughts or help would be greatly appreciated?

Root with Kingroot and unlock with Sunshine. Mofo not needed. Install a recovery to your liking.

Sorry if this is really basic but I'm just really nervous about missing something. So I ran sunshine unlocked my bootloader and have root, installed busybox and TWRP. I'm currently on 5.0 verizon OTA and want to flash this stock rom http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=62785699&postcount=781 with G-apps. Don't I need to update my bootloader to 5.1? I'm assuming I do but most of the directions I've found are for doing that through mofo. Do you know where there is a bootloader img for 5.1 that I can flash through TWRP? Again sorry if this is really basic and thanks for any help. Also is there anything else I'm missing/forgetting that I would need to flash?

bengeo31 said:
Sorry if this is really basic but I'm just really nervous about missing something. So I ran sunshine unlocked my bootloader and have root, installed busybox and TWRP. I'm currently on 5.0 verizon OTA and want to flash this stock rom http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=62785699&postcount=781 with G-apps. Don't I need to update my bootloader to 5.1? I'm assuming I do but most of the directions I've found are for doing that through mofo. Do you know where there is a bootloader img for 5.1 that I can flash through TWRP? Again sorry if this is really basic and thanks for any help. Also is there anything else I'm missing/forgetting that I would need to flash?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You absolutely do not want to upload your partition table (the gpt.bin file). Your Sunshine unlock is based in part on the original partition table in your phone and you may/will lose root if you update to the 5.1 gpt.bin. The post you are referencing is to upgrade the first release of 5.1 to 5.1 with the stagefright patch. You need to follow the upgrade instructions in the first post of that thread to be on 5.1 v23.32-25-3 before using the info in post 781 to patch that version to 23.32-25-5.
The short version of the process is to download this file: 5.1bins.7z Extract the files from the archive and then use these commands:
Code:
fastboot flash logo logo.bin
fastboot flash boot boot.img
fastboot flash modem NON-HLOS.bin
fastboot erase modemst1
fastboot erase modemst2
fastboot flash fsg fsg.mbn
You will not flash the recovery.img file because you already have TWRP as your recovery.
After you do the above steps then select the option to go into recovery, when TWRP launches flash this file: xt1096-5.1-stock-20150820.zip After it flashes use the clear cache/dalvik button and then reboot the phone into 5.1 v23.32-25-3
Then you can use the instructions in post 781 to upgrade to 23.32-25-5, the current version. You have to do the first one, because the files in post 781 are patch files that only work with the -3 version. Clear as mud?

mikeoswego said:
You absolutely do not want to upload your bootloader (the gpt.bin file). Your Sunshine unlock is based in part on the original bootloader file in your phone and you will lose root if you update to the 5.1 bootloader. All the bootloader does is start up the phone, tell it to load the kernel and then it exits. It also handles fastboot flashing but there is no functional difference in the newer bootloader except to stop you from having root.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Are you absolutely certain about this? I'm under the impression that once your bootloader is unlocked root is a simple matter of installing TWRP and SUPERSU.

mbkintner said:
Are you absolutely certain about this? I'm under the impression that once your bootloader is unlocked root is a simple matter of installing TWRP and SUPERSU.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're correct that your bootloader must be unlocked to install TWRP and SuperSU which is all that is needed for root.
Unless you've gotten an unlock code from Motorola, you paid money to get your bootloader unlocked. If you flash a new bootloader, the verification bypass that allows you to run TWRP will no longer work. If you fastboot flash the new bootloader before upgrading the rom you would lose root because you would no longer be able to use TWRP to flash SuperSU for the new ROM. If you waited to flash the bootloader after flashing the new ROM, you could keep root but still not have TWRP to flash future updates. IF there becomes a way to unlock the new bootloader, then you can pay again to unlock that one to regain the ability to run TWRP. I've never tried to go backward on bootloader versions, there seem to be a lot of warnings about bricking phones by doing that.
If you have an unlock code from Motorola, lucky you, don't worry about any of this.

bengeo31 said:
Don't I need to update my bootloader to 5.1?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can run 5.1 ROMs and kernels while staying on the 5.0 bootloader and partition table.

mikeoswego said:
You're correct that your bootloader must be unlocked to install TWRP and SuperSU which is all that is needed for root.
Unless you've gotten an unlock code from Motorola, you paid money to get your bootloader unlocked. If you flash a new bootloader, the verification bypass that allows you to run TWRP will no longer work. If you fastboot flash the new bootloader before upgrading the rom you would lose root because you would no longer be able to use TWRP to flash SuperSU for the new ROM. If you waited to flash the bootloader after flashing the new ROM, you could keep root but still not have TWRP to flash future updates. IF there becomes a way to unlock the new bootloader, then you can pay again to unlock that one to regain the ability to run TWRP. I've never tried to go backward on bootloader versions, there seem to be a lot of warnings about bricking phones by doing that.
If you have an unlock code from Motorola, lucky you, don't worry about any of this.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I double checked with jcase and others in the official Sunshine thread and can confirm that upgrading to the latest release, to include your bootloader, will not cause your bootloader to relock. Sunshine is not a bootloader bypass, it is a permanent unlock. You will lose root but as stated, simply install TWRP and SuperSu to regain it.
Start reading here to see the discussion. http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=62893130

mbkintner said:
I double checked with jcase and others in the official Sunshine thread and can confirm that upgrading to the latest release, to include your bootloader, will not cause your bootloader to relock. Sunshine is not a bootloader bypass, it is a permanent unlock. You will lose root but as stated, simply install TWRP and SuperSu to regain it.
Start reading here to see the discussion. http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=62893130
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Another bit of internet lore shot down. Thanks for the info!