I have a Flash application that requires ~130Mb of RAM and I want to run it on my Galaxy S
I've installed Froyo JPK with latest flash 10.1, but just before the end of startup procedure I always get the "exclamation circle" icon which is apparently the "out-of-memory" message in flash.
I have tried to free up the memory with task killers and memory boster, but can't get it above 175 Mb, which is obviously still not enough, since probably browser and other applications/services use it back before the flash application starts completely. Or might be also some limitation my browser in Galaxy S ? -> see EDIT below
On HTC Desire this same application works like a charm.
So I wonder...
Is there any way to get more free memory ? [EDIT: Yes, with "Chuck Norris mode" app killers, but i does not always help and it's lame]
Is there any way to get more than 311-322Mb RAM used for Applications ? [EDIT: Yes, when developpers will found out the way how to get less memory used for video codecs or even found the misterious 32Mb which are yet nowhere to be found]
Can we expect to this memory issue to be solved in future Froyo releases ? [probably only Samsung knows that, but for now it seems very unlikely]
EDIT: Found out that I get out-of-memory with every single application when it reaches 128Mb of RAM usage.
This is again specific to SGS. Looks like this is some internal max memory allocation size per application/VM
So here is another question:
Is there any way to increase this limit (might be android internal or dalvik VM related)?
no
no
no
sorry to say that...
flypubec said:
I have a Flash application that requires ~130Mb of RAM and I want to run it on my Galaxy S
I've installed Froyo JPK with latest flash 10.1, but just before the end of startup procedure I always get the "exclamation circle" icon which is apparently the "out-of-memory" message in flash.
I have tried to free up the memory with task killers and memory boster, but can't get it above 175 Mb, which is obviously still not enough, since probably browser and other applications/services use it back before the flash application starts completely. Or might be also some limitation my browser in Galaxy S ?
On HTC Desire this same application works like a charm.
So I wonder...
Is there any way to get more free memory ?
Is there any way to get more than 309Mb RAM used for Applications ?
Can we expect to this memory issue to be solved in future Froyo releases ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you need that amount of memory you should use a computer.
Its not the phone thats the probem here. its what you try to run.
//Damian
I would personally put up money to get the RAM issue resolved.
People keep saying that 324~ MB is enough. That's not the point though. The point is that Samsung advertised 512MB. Any reasonable person would assume that, like other phones containing 512MB of RAM, that the phone would have 400+MB available for general usage. 324 MB for such a power phone is dismal. I consider Samsung's claim to be a form of false advertising. Yes, technically the phone has 512MB of RAM, but not according to the reasonable expectations of a consumer. Almost half of the stated RAM isn't usable to the end user for applications. This is a problem with the phone from the standpoint of delivering the expected value to the consumer.
Dear XDA Developer Legends,
Do you think it is possible that you will be able to free up ram that is allocated to the ram disk?
Yours,
Concerned Customers
Hm, maybe its applicable for a lawsuit?
andars05 said:
I would personally put up money to get the RAM issue resolved.
People keep saying that 324~ MB is enough. That's not the point though. The point is that Samsung advertised 512MB. Any reasonable person would assume that, like other phones containing 512MB of RAM, that the phone would have 400+MB available for general usage. 324 MB for such a power phone is dismal. I consider Samsung's claim to be a form of false advertising. Yes, technically the phone has 512MB of RAM, but not according to the reasonable expectations of a consumer. Almost half of the stated RAM isn't usable to the end user for applications. This is a problem with the phone from the standpoint of delivering the expected value to the consumer.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
the phone has 512MB and you can use all. But the system use some of it.
Its only user that cant read and understand how it work hat keep asking about it.
And this phone has more ram that most have. So yes it is enough of ram.
'If you try to runt 50+ all time you will and up with low memory.
But its the same on a computer. none complain about that.
Only that you can only see 3.5GB on windows and use that on a 32.bit system. Well now you can see 4GB and all people are happy.. but they still cant use it, but its looks good.
That the same with this phone.
If samsung did show 512MB and did show how much that was free, all people that complain would be happy. but it dont change a bit what thay can use.
yaocheng said:
no
no
no
sorry to say that...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That make no sense
there is no reason to get less memory with the i9000 when comparable devices like the nexus one running the same OS version has 100mb+ more free ram
DamianGto said:
the phone has 512MB and you can use all. But the system use some of it.
Its only user that cant read and understand how it work hat keep asking about it.
And this phone has more ram that most have. So yes it is enough of ram.
'If you try to runt 50+ all time you will and up with low memory.
But its the same on a computer. none complain about that.
Only that you can only see 3.5GB on windows and use that on a 32.bit system. Well now you can see 4GB and all people are happy.. but they still cant use it, but its looks good.
That the same with this phone.
If samsung did show 512MB and did show how much that was free, all people that complain would be happy. but it dont change a bit what thay can use.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This misses the point of my original statement. The Nexus One is advertised (along with many other phones) as having 512MB of RAM. The N1 has 380-400+MB available of RAM available for applications, as do many other phones containing 512MB of RAM.
Yes, the system does reserve some for certain system functions. Even after those functions have been reserved on other 512MB models, the vast majority is still available to the end user. This is not the case on the Galaxy S series. This is evident by the original posters comment regarding his application.
To address your Windows example: Windows 32 bit actually states that only a portion of the 4GB is available for use. I don't see in the advertisements where Samsung states "Contains 512MB -- 324MB available for actual usage"
I think most consumers, like myself, would assume that the amount of RAM advertised is directly correlated to the amount usable for applications.
Otherwise, what's the difference between a phone advertised as having 384MB and the Galaxy S? They both could have the same amount of RAM available.
andars05 said:
Windows 32 bit actually states that only a portion of the 4GB is available for use.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But its not the case here.
+1 for the rest.
This is what i get if I run top command from adb from a freshly booted phone:
←[H←[JMem: 296300K used, 15048K free, 0K shrd, 6968K buff, 134720K cached
CPU: 1.3% usr 2.3% sys 0.0% nic 96.2% idle 0.0% io 0.0% irq 0.0% sirq
Load average: 0.99 1.33 0.59 1/351 3109
Wonder what this "cached" means.
Can somebody pls run this on HTC desire ?
I don't think our phone has 512mb of RAM physically available to the system. I think the phone has 512mb of RAM in total but it looks like 128mb of it is graphics RAM or something. Meaning we only have 384mb available to the system. The maximum amount of RAM I can ever get free is about 175mb so I don't think that it's reasonable that the system is using about 337mb of RAM. My desktop linux system uses less RAM than that on boot.
Isn't the memory allocation for graphics dynamic?
how often does the graphics really need all that ram?
any why aren't other devices affected by this? (doesn't the GPU on nexus or milestone for example need memory allocated?)
sionyboy said:
Do you think it is possible that you will be able to free up ram that is allocated to the ram disk?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Please explain. Which ram disk do you mean?
Also, since it runs on linux, cant we assign some space from the internal sd (or external) to make a virtual ram disk that would be used as ram when needed? some king a paging file that we know on windows...
And if this is possible, can we assign it to video so graphism will be a little slower but app will become faster?
I think there is something we can do if we can change assignation of ram, apps, and video to make this phone way much powerful.
(just an idea...)
franklin01 said:
Also, since it runs on linux, cant we assign some space from the internal sd (or external) to make a virtual ram disk that would be used as ram when needed? some king a paging file that we know on windows...
And if this is possible, can we assign it to video so graphism will be a little slower but app will become faster?
I think there is something we can do if we can change assignation of ram, apps, and video to make this phone way much powerful.
(just an idea...)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There's always Compcache..that worked like a charm on the G1 and Magic.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=724960
As you can see, all other Android phones reserve some memory to the system... It's just the way it is.
the sgs kernel creates amemory blackhole, that is, it starts using memory after a certain memory address.
It does that because many things in the hardware are using fixed memory addresses to allocate their own memory which is not managed by the kernel itself and the kernel will never touch or see it.
what you call "system memory" is usually memory used and seen by the kernel, for the OS's functionality: various applications, services, daemons, kernel daemons, kernel memory itself (its not much) and some time some ramdisks.
Every phone also uses that of course, which amounts for like 80-130megs. They also often use small black holes of like a couple of megs, but that's so little that no one will notice.
The sgs makes a big blackhole. To me it's more of a design fault, but not much you can do about it I guess. It would need someone who's going to read the complete hardware sheets to bypass that, if at all possible, lol. Or samsung.
I bet they fixed the design issue in the galaxy tab and either the chip has separate dedicated memory either there's no blackhole.
Another theory why the blackhole is necessary is that there's a bug in the chip and it's messing up a portion of the memory, so this portion is left unused (blackhole'd - never seen by the kernel) for stability reasons.
i hope this gives some insight.
reference from the previously linked post:
- Galaxy S [2.1] RAM = 512 MiB | Linux = 325 MiB | Reserved = 187 MiB (with I9000XWJM2 firmware)
notice the huge black hole here (187 megs)
I used to have more than 300mb free after reboot with nexus one...
DamianGto said:
the phone has 512MB and you can use all. But the system use some of it.
Its only user that cant read and understand how it work hat keep asking about it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, *we* can't use it all , because we != system. The debate is not whether or not there is 512MB of physical memory; there could be , since Samsung advertises as having 512MB, but its not all user accessible memory. We don't know for what the system is utilizing that memory, I don't think its for loading some of the core system components; otherwise we should be left with more free RAM like other devices with 512MB of RAM (i.e Nexus One). Its more likely that 188MB is used by either the GPU and other hardware or as a Ram disk.
In contrast, other phones having 512MB of RAM don't use user allocated memory for system or hardware use (at least not the same way Samsung does). They are somehow handling it differently, maybe their GPU's and Other hardware software counterparts have dedicated memory. Whatever said, at the end of the day in the user's point of view, Galaxy S DOES NOT have 512MB of RAM as what we were all led to believe . That is pure deception !!
If they knew this was the case then they should have alerted this to the users. For-example a spec sheet for Samsung Fascinates says 512MB Flash/384MB RAM they should have advertised Galaxy S like that instead of lying through their teeth.
Related
After fixing some lags with I/O system by using filesystem LagFix I still have a Lag problem in my system and I think it's not related to Samsung.
I think this could be an Android problem.
After a fresh reboot I get 124MB of free RAM.
BUT... every day I need to reboot the phone because after 3 hours it became laggy.
Now I analysed this and read a bit about the memory management on several forums and was able to reproduce the lag 2minutes after reboot.
I just need to use much applications one after another to raise the RAM usage for every application.
When the free RAM reaches 40MB I think the system clears some pieces for using it for the app I now want to use and there is the LAG.
Is there any fix for Android not caching every activity of an application in the RAM?
Now for me Android feels like: Usage -> Full RAM -> Lag
Sorry for the new thread but after 2 hours of research I didn't find anything useful over search function.
Yea, every program should have as much ram available as their size. 2gig for program storage on sgs, so there should be the same amount of ram ;D Anyway, theres still less memory for programs on the sgs than for example in the N1. I'd say there is about 384MB of ram total on the sgs and not the 512 claimed.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App
Not just the RAM for the apps... there's much more...all mails from internet, all google talk conversations, the wather I checked out from internet with any widget, feels like every interaction is cached into the RAM until it reaches the 40mb mark and after that every interaction on my system is laggy... for example: opening the notification bar needs 2-3 seconds.
I already talked to N1 users with the same problem
DasLeo said:
I already talked to N1 users with the same problem
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Heading out the door in a minute so can't comment on the rest, but I strongly disagree with that part of your statement.
As an N1 owner I've NEVER seen lag like I suffer on the SGS. Never seen the absolute FREEZE in the GUI like the SGS gets.
I'm running FroYo on the N1 now, so can't compare side-by-side to the SGS things like memory usage, but I don't think that's the issue here if you're going to use the N1 as a comparison, despite other users complaining of lag.
You might try Autokiller or the free memory manager app from the Market and see if that improves thing, they'll keep more or less memory free depending on settings. You could test how soon lag comes with default, minimal, and aggressive settings.
I never testet Froyo because everyone said, it's unstable but for me it seems like froyo has other RAM management than Eclair when you said you can't reproduce this problem.
I'm already using a task killer... I have my main apps ignored or excluded and most time there are 2 or 3 apps which will be killed after lock or time or what else.
What's the problem here... if I would use a PC with 512MB RAM and use only 10 small applications, it won't cache everything in the ram until it's full.
Hi, didn't read all the posts, but u should look into the RFS file system, which is samsung proprietery file system. It has a very bad implementation on android (i could be wrong). As for ram, the phone has 512 mb, but 128 are reserved for Gsm/data connection. Just think if you had an incoming call and all your ram was in use, u had to wait for the system to clear up some memory before being able to receive the call physiclly. That would be a long wait.
I could be wrong and sorry for the bad english.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App
Have you ever tried "Minfreemanager" app?
It can change the minimum available memory level in different app usage.
The device must be rooted first.
Then select "Aggressive" preset and see the result.
rkantos said:
. I'd say there is about 384MB of ram total on the sgs and not the 512 claimed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If this turns out to be true, samsung is up for a massive lawsuit from MANY angry customers who've been mislead due to false marketing
tra33372 said:
Have you ever tried "Minfreemanager" app?
It can change the minimum available memory level in different app usage.
The device must be rooted first.
Then select "Aggressive" preset and see the result.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
DAMN!!! Nice app... it does exactly what I need cleans my RAM so I'll get 120MB and after that loading of apps is much faster than starting apps with Android included RAM cleaning.
It just cleans my RAM like a reboot but without the reboot
This should be a temporary solution until someone finds a better solution or until froyo is released.
I would like to have an application like this with an autoclean option on 2 hours
Guys please,
Getting off-topic here. Here is Android Development.
Not Q&A or General.
Please post in the right section.
Here is getting too many off-topics that pose no relation to Android Development.
Too cluttered.
Thanks
DasLeo said:
DAMN!!! Nice app... it does exactly what I need cleans my RAM so I'll get 120MB and after that loading of apps is much faster than starting apps with Android included RAM cleaning.
It just cleans my RAM like a reboot but without the reboot
This should be a temporary solution until someone finds a better solution or until froyo is released.
I would like to have an application like this with an autoclean option on 2 hours
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Auto killer is better.Its exactly the same as minfreemanager but can be made to apply at boot.Minfree manager resets itself at boot.
I use Memory Booster Lite (free version) app to free up memory, must do that manually but it works very well, if you buy the app it free up memory automaticly.
Pika007 said:
If this turns out to be true, samsung is up for a massive lawsuit from MANY angry customers who've been mislead due to false marketing
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The phone does have 512mb of ram. It just isn't used properly.
MOJO783010 said:
Hi, didn't read all the posts, but u should look into the RFS file system, which is samsung proprietery file system. It has a very bad implementation on android (i could be wrong). As for ram, the phone has 512 mb, but 128 are reserved for Gsm/data connection. Just think if you had an incoming call and all your ram was in use, u had to wait for the system to clear up some memory before being able to receive the call physiclly. That would be a long wait.
I could be wrong and sorry for the bad english.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, wrong. The reserved ram is in the form of a ram disk, which seems to be a bit oversized. Not really sure why a ram disk is needed at all, personally.
sammy555 said:
Auto killer is better.Its exactly the same as minfreemanager but can be made to apply at boot.Minfree manager resets itself at boot.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is the correct solution. the JF* series of firmwares have very bad default settings for killing unused apps. Use this app to set them a bit better and you shouldn't have any problems.
Pika007 said:
If this turns out to be true, samsung is up for a massive lawsuit from MANY angry customers who've been mislead due to false marketing
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It does have 512 of ram, but some is partitioned off for the phone, so that you can always receive phone calls. Just about every device does this, because users would be more upset if they couldn't pick up the phone until they had closed a bundle of running programs. Don't you think that people here would have noticed earlier if the SGS physically had less ram than claimed ?
As far as the OP is concerned, sounds like you are just running too many programs at once. Its not an android problem, its user error.
Any task manager, but particularly an auto-killer will set you right, although alternatively you could try not leaving every app open when you're finished with it. You think your PC would run ok if you left one game open while you opened another ?
DasLeo said:
I never testet Froyo because everyone said, it's unstable but for me it seems like froyo has other RAM management than Eclair when you said you can't reproduce this problem.
I'm already using a task killer... I have my main apps ignored or excluded and most time there are 2 or 3 apps which will be killed after lock or time or what else.
What's the problem here... if I would use a PC with 512MB RAM and use only 10 small applications, it won't cache everything in the ram until it's full.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I wasn't comparing a N1 on FroYo to the SGS on Eclair. My comments were in regard to when I was on Eclair, which was several months...FroYo's only been available for a couple of months. What I said was since I'm on FroYo now, I can't compare side-by-side, but my experience with an N1 on Eclair was never any lag problem or GUI freezes.
Anyways, I also suggested you try Autokiller, and you missed that or misunderstood it by saying you already run a Task Killer (which is generally considered a bad idea, but I see you picked up on Autokiller after someone else suggested it. Enjoy.
Pika007 said:
If this turns out to be true, samsung is up for a massive lawsuit from MANY angry customers who've been mislead due to false marketing
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nah, all phones advertise the actual chip size in it, not the amount the system actually lets you use.
tra33372 said:
Have you ever tried "Minfreemanager" app?
It can change the minimum available memory level in different app usage.
The device must be rooted first.
Then select "Aggressive" preset and see the result.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you. This removes almost all lag I'm experiencing.
Hello!
Welcome all galaxy s and android owners Im quite new to this hardware and software, in fact i spent all weekend trying to understand this machine...
Eventually, i fixed 3-combo bug, updated android from 2.1 to 2.2.1 JPU and applied speedMod from here:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=822756
And im wondering, do i really have so much ram? I have system info widget, it shows only about 150-190, on android 2.1 it was about 120-160, everything looks like my galaxy s has only 256 MB of memory (i just cant believe that) :O How can i check it more accurately?
Hey mate,
The reason why you can only see 339mb (or there abouts) of ram free is because the OS reserves some space for critical system apps.. Imagine if you couldn't receive calls because your live wallpaper and that game you are playing was using up all your ram.
Hope this answers your question,
Alex
Remember: If I have helped you please click on the "Thanks" button on my post
Sullson said:
Hello!
Welcome all galaxy s and android owners Im quite new to this hardware and software, in fact i spent all weekend trying to understand this machine...
Eventually, i fixed 3-combo bug, updated android from 2.1 to 2.2.1 JPU and applied speedMod from here:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=822756
And im wondering, do i really have so much ram? I have system info widget, it shows only about 150-190, on android 2.1 it was about 120-160, everything looks like my galaxy s has only 256 MB of memory (i just cant believe that) :O How can i check it more accurately?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
By right our phone has 512MB.
However, some of the memory needs to be use for critical applications (e.g. running the phone etc.) therefore we are not able to unlock all 512mb for our use.
What you are able to see (since you're using SpeedMod kernel, it will be 339MB) is the memory available for OUR use. Do note that our phone needs to use part of that 339MB RAM to load up applications/boot up therefore you would not get 339MB free (rather about 120MB free ++ out of 339)
SXTN said:
Hey mate,
The reason why you can only see 339mb (or there abouts) of ram free is because the OS reserves some space for critical system apps.. Imagine if you couldn't receive calls because your live wallpaper and that game you are playing was using up all your ram.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually, that's a common assumption I hear which gets thrown around here but has never actually been proven. Apparently it's a memory hole, which means devices are using it. If it were reserved for apps, it would probably still show up in total RAM. Remember, Android is smart enough to kill apps as needed when more ram is required. Furthermore, freeing RAM doesn't take much work. So this explanation doesn't make much sense imho.
The reality might actually be that Samsung haven't had time to dynamically allocate the space with their drivers, so they took a shortcut until they had time to optimise.
Regardless of amounts I can say that 2.2.1 is the first firmware where memory management does not appear to be an issue.
Ok i found out that i actually have 339 Mb of memory. The problem is that all the time at least 130 mb are in use. I think that all the stand by android and samsung apps should work on the memory that stands in 512-339 and it shouldnt take my memory space. I saw 339 in task manager, also over there i see that samsung "steals" from it about 130. In addition it process running i see only about 30/40 memory in use. Android takes 16 mb. Any1 can explain this to me?
my phone showing only 304MO of RAM. Why?
Read what i did. U dont have speedmod. But what about my 130 lost memory...
The following query is from a novice user, please regard any ignorance as recognized, and thank you for your time in advance.
My question is, does anyone understand how the ram is mapped. Is the ram loaded from flash to volatile, filling portion of it, resulting in a remap of the remainder to use as /ram? or is there flash store and volatile as separate chips?
I ask this possibly stupid question because I am attempting to learn ways of improving the mile-droid performance/memory to ultimately run a debian-dist on. Questions i have a plenty, but this one will do for now.
Feel free to volunteer any useful information about the hardware, relevant and irrelevant yet interesting software to aid me in my Desktop to "pocket"top miniaturization cause.
I wish there was a way to add, or replace the chip to 1 GB....
My D1 shows 225 mb total....
I am sure that we could replace the chip, but someone said something like our Milestone's CPU or Chipset (i don't exactly remember) cannot handle more than 256 Mb of memory. I am not very sure about the affirmation, but it would be amazing if somebody with enough phone hardware knowledge would add more RAM.
Phones do not use chipsets, there is not enough room. Everything is highly integrated. The CPU is in a "system on a chip" (SoC), containing a lot of the "peripherals" that were once separate components on a PC e.g boot ROM/Flash, RAM and RAM controller, storage Flash, GPU and display controller (with LCD and/or DVI output), UART's, I2C, PWM, MMC/SD interface, USB, etc. What's more, the RAM and Flash are packaged together with the SoC in a "package on package" (PoP) arrangement. This is all in something about the size of your thumbnail. Like I said, it's highly integrated.
For this reason, you can't simply add RAM. You'd have to exchange the "chip" for one with more RAM. Then you'd have to reflash the bootloader and setup a bunch of other settings, but why not put on an open bootloader instead of Motorola's locked one? I suppose that's one possibility, but the "chip" is likely in a BGA package, which is very difficult to work with.
just to point out - OP wasn't asking any of this. go read the first post.
he was asking about some low-level-crap-i-dont-really-understand, however I do understand he wasn't asking "where can I plug this 2gb ddram stick in my droid?"
Hello fellas... I had a Moto E2 some years ago, it was based on a firmware called Juix, its a Linux software firmware based rom, there you can mount ext2 partitions as extra RAM, nowadays I'm still learning about Android, but as I see, "ext" extentions are cappable to be used as ROM, RAM and storage, so If some one of the developers can talk to us about that possibilities, I'd thank that
Hi!
tardisguy said:
My question is, does anyone understand how the ram is mapped. Is the ram loaded from flash to volatile, filling portion of it, resulting in a remap of the remainder to use as /ram? or is there flash store and volatile as separate chips?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's all the same on modern smartphones you got RAM and you got non-volatile memory such as NAND Flash.
These a physically two different parts of hardware, though they are placed in the same package (see below).
The speed an over all operation of OS mostly depends on size of RAM and how it could be managed by the kernel.
IanTester said:
Phones do not use chipsets, there is not enough room. Everything is highly integrated. The CPU is in a "system on a chip" (SoC), containing a lot of the "peripherals" that were once separate components on a PC e.g boot ROM/Flash, RAM and RAM controller, storage Flash, GPU and display controller (with LCD and/or DVI output), UART's, I2C, PWM, MMC/SD interface, USB, etc. What's more, the RAM and Flash are packaged together with the SoC in a "package on package" (PoP) arrangement. This is all in something about the size of your thumbnail. Like I said, it's highly integrated.
For this reason, you can't simply add RAM. You'd have to exchange the "chip" for one with more RAM. Then you'd have to reflash the bootloader and setup a bunch of other settings, but why not put on an open bootloader instead of Motorola's locked one? I suppose that's one possibility, but the "chip" is likely in a BGA package, which is very difficult to work with.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good explanation and nothing to add.
See attachment for an example of such a PoP device.
There's no slot or similar to add just RAM.
From my point of view it's worthless to discuss about the possibility to add more RAM on Droid or Milestone.
Even if someone would do an excellent job on soldering a new PoP device, you'll need to find a way to program the first stage loader (mbmloader) right into place.
I never heard of mounting ext2 partitions as extra RAM and AFAIK this simply won't work.
The only technique you could speak of increasing RAM virtually is using a swap partition.
I suggest to read some basic books how things work in the linux world.
Have fun!
scholbert
IanTester said:
Phones do not use chipsets, there is not enough room. Everything is highly integrated. The CPU is in a "system on a chip" (SoC), containing a lot of the "peripherals" that were once separate components on a PC e.g boot ROM/Flash, RAM and RAM controller, storage Flash, GPU and display controller (with LCD and/or DVI output), UART's, I2C, PWM, MMC/SD interface, USB, etc. What's more, the RAM and Flash are packaged together with the SoC in a "package on package" (PoP) arrangement. This is all in something about the size of your thumbnail. Like I said, it's highly integrated.
For this reason, you can't simply add RAM. You'd have to exchange the "chip" for one with more RAM. Then you'd have to reflash the bootloader and setup a bunch of other settings, but why not put on an open bootloader instead of Motorola's locked one? I suppose that's one possibility, but the "chip" is likely in a BGA package, which is very difficult to work with.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Correct you are my friend and thankyou for adding your savvy, more simply stated for the lame is:He said mobile integrated devices are geared to provide as much speed with as little power in as small a space as possible. The way to do that is to build your "graphics card" "central processor" and "device IO 'usb, reader, etc...'" together. Less distance = less resistance=less power + faster relay for better throughput. For those whom are curious but haven't a clue.
However my knowledge being somewhat dated, I recalled earlier devices having a powered volatile shared ram. You see early WinMob devices had a battery that powered ram all the time, with a backup battery so your data wouldnt wipe out, because thats how ram works when you power it off. But with how long the droid takes to load, I thought maybe (more like hoped) the directories were /mounted with memory shares on volatile "powered ram", but appearlently thats not the case.
You can map memory manually with links, but it wouldnt be very useful, and extremely slow.
Possible: yes.
Practical: No
Theoretically: aux store ~ ram speed
Just wondering cos this will influence my next decision, so should i get a phone with 256, or 512 or 1GB.
Lets just say - the more, the merrier, u get me?
More RAM means more tasks can be done simultaneously in less time. So go for the highest amount of RAM possible.
miodrage said:
Lets just say - the more, the merrier, u get me?
More RAM means more tasks can be done simultaneously in less time. So go for the highest amount of RAM possible.
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true, but will i miss out on anythig if i get a phone with 512mb ram?
i am wondering between the lumia 720 vs the 820. but i am interested in the hd front camera of the 720, which the 820 lacks. i know it will work, but will i have to close apps and stuff? anyone ever run an emulator of windows phone 8 and seen how much ram it actually "needs"?
On 512 MB devices Apps can use up to 150 MB of Memory. If they exceed that treshhold the App will be killed by the OS. On 1 GB devices it's up to 350 MB. This does not mean that the OS is taking up all the rest but there is reserved space for Background Tasks like a Navigation App running in the Background or Skype waiting for incoming calls.
There are no WP8 256 MB devices. Those were only possible with WP7 and had severly limited background processing due to the low Memory.
Certain Apps can't run with only 150 MB of usable Memory - especially games, so developers set a flag in the App so it can't be installed on low Memory devices. Of course most will try to get their Software running on as many devices as possible but sometimes it's just not possible.
The 820 would still be the safe bet.
Apps can use 90 mb on 256 ram devices, 346 on 512 and around 700/800 on 1GB device.
If an does not have enough memory to run but does not exceed the above limit, system automatically tombstones older apps to free memory.
cool, thanks for the info guys, appreciate it
EDIT: just a sec, the vales by StevieBallz & mcosmin222 are quiet different...? am confused.
nstream said:
cool, thanks for the info guys, appreciate it
EDIT: just a sec, the vales by StevieBallz & mcosmin222 are quiet different...? am confused.
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My info is based out of the DeviceStatus API from the SDK.
The system holds around 130 MB for background tasks.
Here is Microsoft's documentation on the Topic in MSDN: http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windowsphone/develop/jj681682(v=vs.105).aspx
It depends on wether you use WP7 or WP8. I was talking about WP8 only - WP7 is somehow different because there is no fixed Limit enforced by the OS until it actually runs out of Memory. In WP8 those are hard Limits. For WP7 there were 256 MB devices, for WP8 the Minimum requirement is 512 MB.
Well, that's kinda funny, that WP8 has more memory and can't use it.
The Memory is reserved. The reason is that the System should work predictably - both for users and for Apps. If I have a Navigation Software running in the Background it Needs a guarantee that it will have enough Memory available. I can't just stop Navigation because the Facebook App is loading a big Image. Or if I receive a Skype call I want to talk to someone but perhaps would not want my currently active App to just be closed down because it takes too much Memory. So: no, the Memory is not unused. If Apps don't use their alloted share it is also used to Keep several Apps available for fast switching (e.g. Twitter is still in Memory but asleep).
That actually is an improvement over WP7 were an App was regularly only allowed to use 90 MB of Memory. This was not enforced by the OS so you could go above it if there was enough space available. The Problem was that at some Point it would run out of Memory and then would be killed. That would sometimes happen at 90 MB, sometimes at 150 MB. So a developer could test his App on his device without background Music, etc. and see it crashing all the time on people's devices. This Situation can no longer occur.
The Basic Problem is that Smartphone OS's don't use virtual Memory like on a PC. There if you run out of physical Memory Little used data is swapped out to the hard drive (which slows the System considerably). This normally isn't done on Smartphones because it is taxing on the Flash Memory. 256 MB WP7 devices still implemented it to allow them to even run 90 MB big Apps and Background process were completely deativated on those devices. WP8 also Needs more Memory for the OS itself than WP7 did.
Yay, thanks again guys
It is normal that the system use about 2 gb of ram??
Here is the attachment
I'm on latest stock and not rooted
And i have a lot of user apps does this affect the ram used by system?
Kind of, sort of normal.
The phone is configured for maximum number of apps running at the same time, not for maximum size of usable memory. I think the limit is 32,but that depends on the rom you are running. So if the memory footprint of your apps is small, you end up with unused memory.
The justification I heard from the devs is that it's more battery friendly this way. If you want my opinion: they chose to go overkill with 6 GB RAM, but maybe they got a good deal from their supplier. Anyway, there's no harm, and the phone is more future proof this way.