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Hi,
I just stuck here, cause I found a thread about fast usb charging. But there is no answers or solutions.
I have many htc devices. It seems that some of them has a problem with 3rd party usb chargers.
My most used device is Universal. It suck a lot of power. THis one doesn't enable usb charging at all, until you put it in sleep mode before pluging the charger.
Anyway, the same issue for Kaiser too.
The problem is, that it doesn't matter how much current is the charger able to deliver. They just use some kind of recognition of original chargers.
What I already measured: Original charger and universal running => takes 1200mA. 3rd party charger or my 5A PSU => Universal/Kaiser sucks just 500mA.
This is fast/slow charge. I found here discussion about 4 and 5 pins shorted??
But WTF which 4 & 5 pin?
http://www.tracyandmatt.co.uk/blogs/index.php/2006/09/10/htc_hermes_usb_connector_pin_config
According to this pinout. It would be 2 GND of Audio side? I'm not sure that original charger use extUSB audio side to charge...? It also could be D & A pins, but I'm afraid to connect 5V to Data- pin.
Anyway, someone here have to know it.
If not, in a few days I'll try all possible combinations and post the results.
Thanks
Shef
I'd also be interested to know about this. When I charge my TYTN II via USB, it takes much longer to charge than if I charge it via the mains charger (I prefer USB since I travel a lot and it's one less charger I need to carry around).
Better still, is it possible to buy a USB cable that will charge at the same rate as the mains charger rather than messing with a USB cable with the associated risks?
Best,
Gary.
Shef said:
Hi,
What I already measured: Original charger and universal running => takes 1200mA. 3rd party charger or my 5A PSU => Universal/Kaiser sucks just 500mA.
This is fast/slow charge. I found here discussion about 4 and 5 pins shorted??
But WTF which 4 & 5 pin?
http://www.tracyandmatt.co.uk/blogs/index.php/2006/09/10/htc_hermes_usb_connector_pin_config
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
a usb port only supplies 500ma, while the wall charger does 1200ma as the OP has measured (although it says 1A at the back of the charger). changing a cable is not gonna superpower up your usb port.
unless maybe you get hold of a forked USB cable, like the one that Seagate Free Agent drives come supplied with... you know, 1 mini USB splitting halfway down to two normal USB plugs.
Worth experimenting with, do you think?
wyrm said:
unless maybe you get hold of a forked USB cable, like the one that Seagate Free Agent drives come supplied with... you know, 1 mini USB splitting halfway down to two normal USB plugs.
Worth experimenting with, do you think?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
good call.......with a little googling i came up with this
http://www.universaluk.com/acatalog...2_x_Type_A_to_mini_B__USB_2_0__1m__Lindy.html
tried ebay, my brief search came up with lots of unrelated results, so i gave up
I got one of those leads, came with my portable 2.5" hard drive. Just tried the lead on my Tytn 2 and it does charge almost as fast as the mains plug
Success
Ok, so, I tried to experiment.
Here you go.
Usb simple cable 480ma charge.
The same result with Motorola charger.
Motorola charger pins A and B short circuit - 890mA.
That's much better, althrough I suppose it can suck more current then 890mA, but it's significantly better.
THere is also pins data+ and data- short circuited (I don't know if it has effect, but I can't disconnect it in this connector).
Apparently NC (not connected) pin on our pinout schematics definitely is connected.
With % of charged battery it suck less and less current....I suppose it's usual, this should be even driven by ROM.
So, update your cables
It works even with car charger, so no more charger problems...
Shef
Just to be clear - you took a Motorola USB cable and shorted pins A and B (which are which by the way?) and it provides a decent current....
How do you short the pins? I've looked in the end of cable and I can hardly see the pins, let alone short them! What's the trick here or have I missed something?
Thanks,
Gary.
Shef said:
Ok, so, I tried to experiment.
Here you go.
Usb simple cable 480ma charge.
The same result with Motorola charger.
Motorola charger pins A and B short circuit - 890mA.
That's much better, althrough I suppose it can suck more current then 890mA, but it's significantly better.
THere is also pins data+ and data- short circuited (I don't know if it has effect, but I can't disconnect it in this connector).
Apparently NC (not connected) pin on our pinout schematics definitely is connected.
With % of charged battery it suck less and less current....I suppose it's usual, this should be even driven by ROM.
So, update your cables
It works even with car charger, so no more charger problems...
Shef
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Also interested in how to short the pins. I use Navizon, bluetooth HSDPA tethering, and iGuidance while on the ambulance and even my iGo 3A max rated charger can barely keep up because the tilt wont accept all of the available current.
So have anyone found a way to fast charge our ppc through usb??
Yes, that is correct. Short pins 4 & 5 (4 is normally NC) to enable fast-charging. If you do it correctly, the phone shouldn't pick up tethering, and therefore should not say "PC Connected" or the like..
The TracyAndMatt pinout is wrongly numbered. The pin assignments are correct, but the number/letter scheme they used is incorrect. True ExtUSB pinout translation to their pinout is as follows:
T & M Real ExtUSB
-------------------------------
Pins E D C B A = 1 2 3 4 5
Pins 1 2 3 4 5 6 = 6 7 8 9 10 11
The way I remember is that the corner opposite the angled one is where pin 1 starts (where E is on the T&M pinout) - and they go like most IEC-standard connectors, in a clock-like circular numbering scheme.
Here's a better pinout: http://pinouts.ru/PDA/htc_extUSB_pinout.shtml
Hope this helps!
--W5i2
its the milliamps that is the problem even doubling up with a y splitter does not do much Find a charger with the most milliamps for a faster charge 1.2 amps works best and as far as i know no usb port puts out that much even if they are wired in a series. Many try to sell lower amp chargers they dont even know about it at att. if the screen is off they will charge but not well these phones are energy hogs. I must have at least twenty chargers and messed around with them... the original or one of highest amperage works for me.
Check winhlp.com/node/855 for the answer.
htc_battery_trout.c said:
/* A9 reports USB charging when helf AC cable in and China AC charger. */
/* Work arround: notify userspace AC charging first,
and notify USB charging again when receiving usb connected notificaiton from usb driver. *
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I find this annoying. I can't tell if my wall charger is fast charging or not because the G1 always says "AC"
hgmichna said:
Check winhlp.com/node/855 for the answer.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is not going to help HTC owners.
HTC charging cable
kiss_se said:
That is not going to help HTC owners.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
http://winhlp.com/node/855 was explicitly written for HTC smartphone owners.
hgmichna said:
[...] was explicitly written for HTC smartphone owners.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry, I meant to say: That is not going to help extusb owners.
hgmichna said:
Check winhlp.com/node/855 for the answer.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Is it possible to get one of the 'fast charge' enabled USB cables on eBay or elsewhere? I am not keen on doing the mod described.
What is the maximum mAh recommended for HTC devices? Is it still 1.2 A or more?
zurpher said:
Is it possible to get one of the 'fast charge' enabled USB cables on eBay or elsewhere? I am not keen on doing the mod described.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Check http://winhlp.com/node/855#qaes for the only buyable solution I know, besides compatible chargers. Your best bet is probably the original HTC charger, available for roughly $10.
zurpher said:
What is the maximum mAh recommended for HTC devices? Is it still 1.2 A or more?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There can be no recommended maximum mAh. There can only be a required current, which differs from device to device. Check Ohm's Law. The device determines how much current it draws. If the charger cannot deliver that current, then the charging process can fail in various ways, all undesirable.
hgmichna said:
Check http://winhlp.com/node/855#qaes for the only buyable solution I know, besides compatible chargers. Your best bet is probably the original HTC charger, available for roughly $10.
There can be no recommended maximum mAh. There can only be a required current, which differs from device to device. Check Ohm's Law. The device determines how much current it draws. If the charger cannot deliver that current, then the charging process can fail in various ways, all undesirable.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Could the USB Switching 2A Power Charger Adapter Convertor Plug be similar in function to the one that you've linked?
zurpher said:
Could the USB Switching 2A Power Charger Adapter Convertor Plug be similar in function to the one that you've linked?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't know, but probably not. Apple used to use a different signalling scheme involving resistors.
anyone found an alternative car charger, I dont mean using the wall charger with an inverter
but a charger that plugs into the lighter plug?
Contra1971 said:
anyone found an alternative car charger, I dont mean using the wall charger with an inverter
but a charger that plugs into the lighter plug?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I used this on my Palm Pre. It charges my Epic 4g, and I tried it out on the Nook Color this AM.
It worked just fine.
http://cgi.ebay.com/OEM-SPRINT-CAR-...Accessories&hash=item45f6ea76fc#ht_1484wt_905
There's qutie a number of cigarette lighter adapters available that offer a standard USB port. You'd supply your own cable. Here's an example:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Mini-Car-Cigare...053289?pt=PDA_Accessories&hash=item2a0eed35e9
No, AFAIK, none of these will charge as fast as the standard NC charger. For that, you'd need to go thru the hassle of getting an inverter.
Monoprice has cigarette lighter to female usb chargers for $1.16 that you can use your usb cable with.
Sent from my DROIDX using XDA Premium App
well I bought 1 from Wally World and it has a dual USB output abd says it is .5v and 1.5amp but when I plug in my NC it doesnt say charging
does the sprint charger?
Jgrimoldy said:
No, AFAIK, none of these will charge as fast as the standard NC charger. For that, you'd need to go thru the hassle of getting an inverter.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why is that any more of a hassle than getting a car charger?
Contra1971 said:
well I bought 1 from Wally World and it has a dual USB output abd says it is .5v and 1.5amp but when I plug in my NC it doesnt say charging
does the sprint charger?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, the Sprint charger says 'charging' As the others stated, it's not fast, but it works just fine...
it isnt more of a hassle, I have 4 inverters, but they all have fans and make noise I wanted to use a NO noise charger thats all
d.v said:
Why is that any more of a hassle than getting a car charger?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Larger, heavier, more cords, much more expensive (when compared to a $1 cig-to-usb)...
Just has to be able to push out the current needed. Otherwise it may not charge, or it will charge very slowly.
The Scosche reVIVE II Dual USB Car Charger for iPad has 2.1 and 1.0 amp usb outlets, I use this for plugging in my evo and nc. It definitely charges them both even while having all the wireless radios going and tethering with gps and both screens full bright.
Contra1971 said:
it isnt more of a hassle, I have 4 inverters, but they all have fans and make noise I wanted to use a NO noise charger thats all
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Same issue here, I have a road-trip coming up this summer and I'd love to load up my NC with music and dash-mount it but it'll be a 14-20 hour drive (depending on the number of whiz breaks the wife and kids need) and I don't think I could push the battery quite that long and the inverter when wired to the radio creates quite a buzzing.
jsw31 said:
The Scosche reVIVE II Dual USB Car Charger for iPad has 2.1 and 1.0 amp usb outlets, I use this for plugging in my evo and nc. It definitely charges them both even while having all the wireless radios going and tethering with gps and both screens full bright.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Are you using the Nooks specific cable on the 2.1A connection? I too am going on a trip soon, and would love a car charger that can actually CHARGE the nook while using it..
www.amazon.com/Scosche-reVIVE-Dual-Charger-iPad/dp/B003N7NO4Q
Is this the one you have? It looks nice and the price looks okay. Nice find. I also saw a wall plug dual usb version by same company on the same page, do you have any info on that one too? It would be nice to stream line travel chargers to a minimum, thanks.
It definitely charges both. Like I said in my previous post, I usually have both my Evo runniong and the Nook full bright display on for 50 minute commute, using TetherGPS, wifi hotspot, torque and bluetooth, google navigation pulling satellite imagery, and playing mp3s. Granted, it is slower to charge than without all that stuff running but my previous car charger would lose charge with my evo running just gps and no wifi hotspot previously.
I am using stock blackberry usb cables that I ordered from Amazon as well for $1.25 for a pair (google 'B001UC9NOQ', can't post links yet.) These are nice, thick cables that handle the charger great. I leave them plugged in inside the truck at all times. I have not used that Scosche wall charger, I use the stock chargers for travel that remain in my backpack, and I have other usb cables I use to charge at home. I would imagine it works just as well though.
jsw31 said:
It definitely charges both. Like I said in my previous post, I usually have both my Evo runniong and the Nook full bright display on for 50 minute commute, using TetherGPS, wifi hotspot, torque and bluetooth, google navigation pulling satellite imagery, and playing mp3s.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
http://www.amazon.com/Scosche-reVIVE-Dual-Charger-iPad/dp/B003N7NO4Q
Luckily I'm used to carrying extra USB cables around but the noise my inverter generated while charging was super annoying, went ahead and ordered this to try it out. Hoping it works for what I need, thanks for the tip
projektdotnet said:
http://www.amazon.com/Scosche-reVIVE-Dual-Charger-iPad/dp/B003N7NO4Q
Luckily I'm used to carrying extra USB cables around but the noise my inverter generated while charging was super annoying, went ahead and ordered this to try it out. Hoping it works for what I need, thanks for the tip
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Let us know if it works for you. An Amazon reviewer just reported that the Scosche reVIVE II didn't work on their Nook Color:
The nook color needs 1.9 amps, this can't do it. Scosche claims 2.1 amps but it isn't even close. It BARELY charges the nook if the machine is sleeping, when on, the battery charge goes down even while supposedly "charging." Playing video, it's even worse. On top of that if I try to charge a regular phone it puts out too much amperage on the 1 amp side and overheats the phone. Save your money, look elsewhere.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
However, the reviewer may not know what they're talking about. A charger cannot put out "too much amperage." Too much voltage perhaps, but not too much amperage (current). A device draws only the current it needs.
An iPad needs an amperage around 2 A also. I got the Belkin Charge 2.1 made for the ipod/ipad and it DOES charge the nook color. It has a 12V plug with one USB outlet at 2.1A. I used the cable from the nook color obviously...
See, part of my worry is not the current output, but if the nook can actually communicate with these chargers and get a full 1.9A draw, instead of the detault 500mA over non B&N chargers...
cybrdmn said:
An iPad needs an amperage around 2 A also. I got the Belkin Charge 2.1 made for the ipod/ipad and it DOES charge the nook color. It has a 12V plug with one USB outlet at 2.1A. I used the cable from the nook color obviously...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I bought the same Belkin iPad charger from Best Buy. Rated at 2.1A. I used it with the B & N USB cable that came with my Nook Color. I used the 'Battery Monitor' software mentioned earlier here or on another post to compare charge current readings against the stock B&N wall charger/cable. The Belkin was charging right at 500 mA (NC was using ~450 mA, software showing +36 mA current). So somewhere the B & N cable & charger must have a unique way of determining that it is a B&N charger / cable and to allow the full 2.1A charge. I used the Belkin 12V charger on my TomTom and it allowed just over 1A charge, so I know the Belkin iPad charger is fine.
Yes, it does charge the Nook Color, if you are at 800 Mhz and minimum brightness running non-intensive applications--and it barely charges at that ~50 mA. It does turn the charge indicator on the B&N cable orange, and the status indicates battery charge on the screen.
I haven't seen a thread that addresses this specifically:
After reading the threads in this section, it seems that the consensus is that the "fast charging" aspect of the NC is based on extra pins in the special NC cable. When connected to any charger with 1.9amps or greater, you will get the fast charge.
My experience is different.
Using the OEM NC cable:
1. Connected to OEM charger, stock ROM - settings say charging, flashes an icon with charging percent on connection and removal
2. Connected to OEM charger, CM7 - settings say Charging (AC).
3. Connected to 2.1 and 2.0 amp chargers, stock - settings say Not Charging.
4. Connected to 2.1 and 2.0 amp chargers, CM7 - settings say Charging (USB)
Using the generic microusb cables (2 or 3 tried):
1. Connected to OEM charger, stock ROM - Can't remember, but not going back to stock!
2. Connected to OEM charger, CM7 - settings say Charging (AC).
3. Connected to 2.1 and 2.0 amp chargers, stock - settings say Not Charging.
4. Connected to 2.1 and 2.0 amp chargers, CM7 - settings say Charging (USB)
This seems to imply that the OEM charger is required to really use the extra pins in the NC OEM cable. Can anyone test and confirm this?
Alan
The nook charger puts out almost 2A of power, where normal usb chargers and ports on computer only put out 500mA. The cable that the nook comes with has some terminations in it that allow the nook to tell when it is connected to the nook charger. It will charge at a much faster rate when using the combination of the charger and cable that came with the nook. Replace either the cable or the charger with anything else and you get low power charging mode which is very slow.
Nook Charger
I keep seeing reports of people getting a fast charge using various other equipment, as long as the chargers are rated >= 1.9A.
Can anyone confirm or deny this? Any testing?
As long as a charger puts out near 2A of current, it should work. The charger itself is just a four pin USB charger. The cable itself... lots of pins in the connector to the NC.
FrayAdjacent said:
As long as a charger puts out near 2A of current, it should work. The charger itself is just a four pin USB charger. The cable itself... lots of pins in the connector to the NC.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's what everyone's been saying, but it doesn't work that way in my testing. I have tried 3rd party chargers that output 2.0 and 2.1A, using the OEM cable. None of them are recognized as an AC charger. If we knew how the NC knows when it's connected to the original charger, we could find a way to modify something available at WalMart to quick charge our NC's. There's plenty of Ipad chargers (2.1A) available. The one I have doesn't work, though.
Alan
Update to my previous post:
When I got home from work I tested my ipad charger (2.1A) with the nook color cable and it seemed to act like the nook charger. I did not think any charger but the nc one would work, but it seems it does.
I am jealous. My Ipad charger (OEM) paired with the nook cable shows Charging (USB) under Settings --->About Tablet--->Status. I would love know how to get it to say Charging (AC) .
Alan
Keep your eyes open people...as soon as I return to work and have extra cash I plan on ordering and tearing down a charger and cable. Many have noticed poor quality in the chargers..I'm gonna try to engineer an open DIY charger and cable replacement with better filtering components. Hopefully will be creating a thread with full details in 3 weeks...
Sent from my NookColor using Tapatalk
deadbot1 said:
Keep your eyes open people...as soon as I return to work and have extra cash I plan on ordering and tearing down a charger and cable. Many have noticed poor quality in the chargers..I'm gonna try to engineer an open DIY charger and cable replacement with better filtering components. Hopefully will be creating a thread with full details in 3 weeks...
Sent from my NookColor using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
YAY! I have my soldering station warming up.
Cheers,
kev
yep, this is overdue...plugged in last night...almost burned my hand after an hour of charging. I keep my charger by the bed and the hum is just annoying when I'm feeling a bit restless.
Is there a way to identify problem chargers?
There must be some real inconsistency in the charger build quality. I've never noticed mine gets more than just a tiny bit warm and no humming. I wonder if there was a bad lot of them made? I was trying to look at the charger to see if there is a lot # or such, but can't tell what half the darned thing says. I'm posting a pic of the text on my charger in the hopes we can figure out if there is some way to identify problem chargers.
Edit: My nc came from WalMart.
Well there is a difference in the markings at least...The area circled in red...On mine it is R1101.
Still made in China
Edit: BTW my unit came from Walmart. Not sure if there would be any accounting for things like that.
deadbot1 said:
Keep your eyes open people...as soon as I return to work and have extra cash I plan on ordering and tearing down a charger and cable. Many have noticed poor quality in the chargers..I'm gonna try to engineer an open DIY charger and cable replacement with better filtering components. Hopefully will be creating a thread with full details in 3 weeks...
Sent from my NookColor using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sounds great. The simple tests I have done have yielded more quetions then answers.
Looking forward to your data.
ive noticed i cant transfer data on anything other than the nook cable.
The NC cable is special. It wont fit other devices.
described over here....
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nook_Color
Charging the NC on a regular microUSB means much longer time.
swaaye said:
The NC cable is special. It wont fit other devices.
described over here....
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nook_Color
Charging the NC on a regular microUSB means much longer time.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, this much is well known...my plan is to find out if there are "brains" in the charger or if it's just a high amp USB adapter. If the latter is true( which I suspect), then it's easy peasy to make a high power port( or just buy a quality one). If it has special circuitry...then I get to try and replicate it( with better parts) and release the plans so others can make DIY replacements.
Edit: I'm willing to bet that the extra pins in the cable are just to increase contact surface...to handle the higher amperage.
Sent from my NookColor using XDA Premium App
boogerboy72 said:
ive noticed i cant transfer data on anything other than the nook cable.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is totally wrong, since other cables WILL transfer data just fine. I use an LG Micro USB cable from my old dare, and am able to ADB push, install, etc just fine.
As it is, the large end of the Nook's USB cable is normal; this means that if the nook is communicating, it is doing so over the standard USB data ports, and not through some special connection. Keep in mind that some of the extra pins from the micro side are for the status light that is built in.
Hmm R1102 here showing 1.9A output
I'm curious.. some people have talked about warranty replacements. What R versions are those?
Divine_Madcat said:
That is totally wrong, since other cables WILL transfer data just fine. I use an LG Micro USB cable from my old dare, and am able to ADB push, install, etc just fine.
As it is, the large end of the Nook's USB cable is normal; this means that if the nook is communicating, it is doing so over the standard USB data ports, and not through some special connection. Keep in mind that some of the extra pins from the micro side are for the status light that is built in.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hmm....hadn't thought of that...that charger almost has to be dumb...just higher output...the smarts all have to be in the USB/power management chip in the nook. Those extra pins must be for the led and maybe a few for handling the higher amperage. Need to check out the spec sheet for that chip again...
Sent from my NookColor using XDA Premium App
Why does it HAVE to be dumb? I mean, the charger needs to do nothing more than respond to a ping, saying "Hey, im a Nook charger, take me for a 1.9A ride!". I guess that makes it dumb, but no reason said technology won't be in the charger.
I am hesitant to buy something like this since I have read that the USB Micro on the NC is non-standard.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Barnes-and-...?pt=US_Tablet_Accessories&hash=item19c71f2149
You're smart to worry about these. This one is a simple microUSB cable, not the Nook Color compatible cable which has a longer tip. It will still allow you to transfer data and trickle charge but because of the shorter tip it will not allow a quick charge.
The part that is also important is the plug/brick you plug this cable into. You have to make sure it outputs 1.9 amps so that it is capable of quick charging your Nook Color if you have the correct cable to use. Most usb plug/bricks (like the ones for your phones) will only output about a quarter or maybe half of that. Some Apple iPad/iPhone usb plug/bricks will put out more though.
sjmoreno is right, be wary on these. It shows it is shipping from the inside the United States, but that doesn't mean much as they buy these in bulk from China at a lower price and raise it a bit here. I have ordered a few of these micro USB cables from china eBay listings with varying luck. Some will actually fit, and others won't - some charge REALLY slow and I actually had one that melted on me because it was pulling too much current.
Hey,
If you are still under warrantly, you can call B&N or chat with them on the website and get a new cable, adaptor or a power kit with little or no trouble. Just tell them your current one is not working. You can also go to a Barnes and Noble store and speak to one of the nook guys and you can get a free one there too.
sjmoreno said:
You're smart to worry about these. This one is a simple microUSB cable, not the Nook Color compatible cable which has a longer tip. It will still allow you to transfer data and trickle charge but because of the shorter tip it will not allow a quick charge.
The part that is also important is the plug/brick you plug this cable into. You have to make sure it outputs 1.9 amps so that it is capable of quick charging your Nook Color if you have the correct cable to use. Most usb plug/bricks (like the ones for your phones) will only output about a quarter or maybe half of that. Some Apple iPad/iPhone usb plug/bricks will put out more though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Chargers (wall or vehicle) made for Apple products will only charge at the slower rate. The NC looks at the resistance on the USB data lines to see if it should charge at the fast rate. The resistance set on chargers for Apple products is different than for the NC. The only chargers I've come across for the NC that charge at the higher rate are those made by B&N. Other chargers can be modified to work, but that's a different topic.
wrong...
mrmark93 said:
Chargers (wall or vehicle) made for Apple products will only charge at the slower rate. The NC looks at the resistance on the USB data lines to see if it should charge at the fast rate. The resistance set on chargers for Apple products is different than for the NC. The only chargers I've come across for the NC that charge at the higher rate are those made by B&N. Other chargers can be modified to work, but that's a different topic.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wow, you actually sound like you know what you're talking about. (I kid... I kid...)
Here's a photo of my Apple USB plug which I've highlighted puts out 2.1A. I could use this plug with the official B&N Nook Color cable and it will get the quick charge since the extra length of the tip on the B&N NC cable will allow it to reach the 12 pins that are further inside the Nook's outlet. Although I wouldn't do it since it could (maybe, might, don't want to chance it) send too much current to the battery and possibly damage it or over-heat it.
I also have a Motorola usb plug for my Droid X and Atrix phones but that only puts out 850 mA (.85 Amps) which could trickle charge regardless of the cable I use.
Hope this explained it well enough.
sjmoreno said:
Wow, you actually sound like you know what you're talking about. (I kid... I kid...)
Here's a photo of my Apple USB plug which I've highlighted puts out 2.1A. I could use this plug with the official B&N Nook Color cable and it will get the quick charge since the extra length of the tip on the B&N NC cable will allow it to reach the 12 pins that are further inside the Nook's outlet. Although I wouldn't do it since it could (maybe, might, don't want to chance it) send too much current to the battery and possibly damage it or over-heat it.
I also have a Motorola usb plug for my Droid X and Atrix phones but that only puts out 850 mA (.85 Amps) which could trickle charge regardless of the cable I use.
Hope this explained it well enough.
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right back at ya!
Your Apple unit is rated at 2.1A, but will only 'put out' whatever the NC draws from it, up to a theoretical 2.1A (I never measured over ~1850mA during any of my testing). Have you measured the charge rate on your NC? How? Did you load the battery monitor widget, does it report 'AC Charge' with the Apple charger? Are you using the Nook Tweeks app and forcing the fast charge mode? Just curious.
You made some other comments that are misleading, so I'll say my 'opinion' on those:
You could hook your NC to a 5V, 10,000+Amp power supply and not hurt it. The NC regulates the rate of charge with an on-board charge controller, and even if it didn't, it still wouldn't harm the battery. USB is 5V by specification. Apply 5V to a battery currently holding a charge of less than 5V and it will be charged to 5V. When you first start charging, it will charge at the highest rate available (by supply restraint, charge controller, wire size, connector conductivity) and as the battery becomes more & more charged, the charge rate (current flow) will drop, and when fully charged, the current drops to zero (0). The chargers are rated at what they can safely supply, 1A, 500mA, 2.1A, 850mA, etc without damaging the charger itself-some chargers are smart and limit the current, others will supply what they can and suffer damage if more current is drawn than the charger is rated for (ex: Harbor Freight unit with shorted data pins put out 1.1A (rated 0.5A) and started melting parts before I shut it off). I tested an 'Apple compatible' charger rated at 2.1A and it would only charge at around 600mA unless I shorted the data pins, then it put out whatever the NC would draw, up to a measured max of ~1850mA.
Oh, Snap!
mrmark93 said:
right back at ya!
Your Apple unit is rated at 2.1A, but will only 'put out' whatever the NC draws from it, up to a theoretical 2.1A (I never measured over ~1850mA during any of my testing). Have you measured the charge rate on your NC? How? Did you load the battery monitor widget, does it report 'AC Charge' with the Apple charger? Are you using the Nook Tweeks app and forcing the fast charge mode? Just curious.
You made some other comments that are misleading, so I'll say my 'opinion' on those:
You could hook your NC to a 5V, 10,000+Amp power supply and not hurt it. The NC regulates the rate of charge with an on-board charge controller, and even if it didn't, it still wouldn't harm the battery. USB is 5V by specification. Apply 5V to a battery currently holding a charge of less than 5V and it will be charged to 5V. When you first start charging, it will charge at the highest rate available (by supply restraint, charge controller, wire size, connector conductivity) and as the battery becomes more & more charged, the charge rate (current flow) will drop, and when fully charged, the current drops to zero (0). The chargers are rated at what they can safely supply, 1A, 500mA, 2.1A, 850mA, etc without damaging the charger itself-some chargers are smart and limit the current, others will supply what they can and suffer damage if more current is drawn than the charger is rated for (ex: Harbor Freight unit with shorted data pins put out 1.1A (rated 0.5A) and started melting parts before I shut it off). I tested an 'Apple compatible' charger rated at 2.1A and it would only charge at around 600mA unless I shorted the data pins, then it put out whatever the NC would draw, up to a measured max of ~1850mA.
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You sound more invested in this. I'll go sulk in a corner now...
sjmoreno said:
You sound more invested in this. I'll go sulk in a corner now...
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Just trying to be helpful
Mess of technical crap from the 'car charger' thread:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=16505252&postcount=47
I spent half a day measuring crap to satisfy my curiosity. the reuslt: B&N should have standardized with normal (i-device) charging standards
Background: (feel free to skip this)
In my search to get a good car charger for my Nexus 10 (that would also be good on my Galaxy Nexus), I checked out a bunch of sites and manufacturers and reviews for the perfect charger. I also wanted it to be dual port for two phones at the same time in case my girlfriend is in the car.
So many 2A chargers are not actually 2A, they may be 1A to each port max or they may only work as 2A on an iPad. Android devices look for shorted out data connections in order to pull more than USB power (500ma). So a charger has to both offer 2A or more and have the data pins shorted in order for us to get maximum current to our Nexus 10's. The Apple/iPad chargers work differently. They either have smart chips or specific resistances between the data pins in order to specify current draw.
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What you came here for:
After the long search, the BEST while still very affordable car adapter, is the *drumroll*:
Bracketron Universal Dual USB Car Adapter
2 ports like I wanted. 2A like I wanted.
Contrary to the "Universal" listing, the adapter was likely made for the iPad. So charging out of the box is USB (500ma). But it's easily fixed in under 3 minutes!
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Instructions:
1. Pop off the round silver plate on the front (with your finger/nail).
2. Unscrew the silver part in the back. Don't lose the spring hidden inside.
3. Slowly pry open the black plastic. It's fairly rigid and you'll hear some clicks. If you don't open it like a crazy monkey, you won't damage or break any plastic.
4. You'll see by each USB port 4 wires going to the port from the circuit board. The 2 middle pins are the data lines, the 2 outer ones are the power lines.
5***. You want to short the data (two middle) pins. All that means is you want them touching electrically. Takes about 10 seconds to do with a solder iron (once it's hot ). Just flow some solder between the two pins, no wire needed. Do the same for the other USB port on the other side.
6. Put the plastic and screwed pieces back together. Plug it in and you should see AC charging! :victory:
***If you're poor at soldering, don't worry - you're doing this on pins in the air, not directly on the board, so it's an extremely easy soldering job. If you've never soldered in your life, you can possibly use some wire instead of solder to connect the two and find a way for it to hold in place. But seriously it's an easy solder job and you should probably learn how to solder anyway.
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Reading the instructions I wrote takes longer than making the modification.
Why this adapter if you have to solder? It's the only one I can find with dual ports that can actually give 2A to an ANDROID device. Why this of all the other adapters you can attempt to solder? It comes apart extremely easily so you don't break any plastic like many of the other ones. And the adapter is really small so you don't have a huge piece of plastic hanging out of your power port.
Fair note: it looks like it may give 2A max, so charging both my 1A phone and my 2A tablet will actually be slower. But it's perfect for charging the tablet at full speed when by itself or two phones at full speed.
Also, credit to Amazon reviewer 'K. Crawford' for suggesting this adapter as a good one to mod.
If anyone needs help during the process, I'm more than happy to help!
Very nice info, thanks.
Niiice! I heard though even if you hook up the tablet to a 2A charger, the tab will still only take a reduced amount, is that true?
From my measurements, the tablet will draw around 750 ma, so soldering it will help, just not for the full 2A.
rp181 said:
From my measurements, the tablet will draw around 750 ma, so soldering it will help, just not for the full 2A.
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You measured 750 ma with the bracketron I linked post-mod?? It should be much higher.. What did you use to measure?
nice instructions, royal.
did I do it right?! check the details beneath one of the photos. you will see some solder popped and landed on the circuit board on the top right. it is touching one of those little enclosed boxes on its own and nothing else. you think this is gonna pose a problem?! if so, any fix? I tried to pull it away, but im not a mastersolderer.
bummer about the picture rule. I think I got some good shots that could help some people. I guess I'll be back to post the pics.
This charger is dearer but supplies dual 2.1A with the correct cables/
http://www.expansys-usa.com/expansys-expansys-dual-car-charger-adapter-5v-4-2a-219640/
Gaugerer said:
This charger is dearer but supplies dual 2.1A with the correct cables/
http://www.expansys-usa.com/expansys-expansys-dual-car-charger-adapter-5v-4-2a-219640/
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It doesn't state if it's "shared" or not. Meaning is that 2.1A total for both or 2.1A each. Lot of them are shared even at 3.1A.
wptski said:
It doesn't state if it's "shared" or not. Meaning is that 2.1A total for both or 2.1A each. Lot of them are shared even at 3.1A.
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It says 5v, 4.2A so that is 2.1A each.
Gaugerer said:
It says 5v, 4.2A so that is 2.1A each.
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Ah! My bad, I see that at the top now!
slippy steve said:
nice instructions, royal.
bummer about the picture rule. I think I got some good shots that could help some people. I guess I'll be back to post the pics.
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Are you able to post pictures yet? I'm happy to take a look and help out. If it won't let you attach pictures, you can try linking to an album on imgur, for example (if it allows links).
Gaugerer said:
This charger is dearer but supplies dual 2.1A with the correct cables/
http://www.expansys-usa.com/expansys-expansys-dual-car-charger-adapter-5v-4-2a-219640/
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Click to collapse
With the iPad designation, it's a sure thing that this will need modification. If I'm understanding you correctly, I think you're trying to suggest modified (data-shorted) cables rather than modified adapter. I prefer having a modified adapter so I can use and replace cables at a whim. But if you purchased that one already, you can see if it comes apart and can be modified just as easily.
Royal2000H said:
Are you able to post pictures yet? I'm happy to take a look and help out. If it won't let you attach pictures, you can try linking to an album on imgur, for example (if it allows links).
With the iPad designation, it's a sure thing that this will need modification. If I'm understanding you correctly, I think you're trying to suggest modified (data-shorted) cables rather than modified adapter. I prefer having a modified adapter so I can use and replace cables at a whim. But if you purchased that one already, you can see if it comes apart and can be modified just as easily.
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I purchased a Kensington car charger packaged for an iPad and all that meant is that it came a iPad type cord but still a standard USB port which worked on my Android device.
Some people have said that the cable used also has a lot to do with what the tablet pulls. Some saying a Motorola brand USB cable they had gave much more current. If there is any truth to this then in conjunction with doing this mod to the charger it might be a good idea to buy a cable with 22AWG power conductors:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16812189234
wptski said:
I purchased a Kensington car charger packaged for an iPad and all that meant is that it came a iPad type cord but still a standard USB port which worked on my Android device.
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The question isn't whether the port is USB. It's always going to be USB supplying 5V. The question is how much current the device can pull from the charger. A normal USB port (like a computer) can only supply 500mA by spec. The N10 needs 2A. The ones designated for ipad will usually charge your N10 but at a max of 500mA (even if they're rated higher - because the data pins aren't shorted).
Royal2000H said:
The question isn't whether the port is USB. It's always going to be USB supplying 5V. The question is how much current the device can pull from the charger. A normal USB port (like a computer) can only supply 500mA by spec. The N10 needs 2A. The ones designated for ipad will usually charge your N10 but at a max of 500mA (even if they're rated higher - because the data pins aren't shorted).
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If the data pins aren't shorted, it won't draw more than 500ma, if that's so, how can it be rated at 2.A? I haven't tried my PS with the Nexus 10 yet but did with my other device, had no problem but it has a much smaller battery and I don't remember the details.
I'll try to check it out on the Nexus 10 and post the results.
EDIT
I thried my Kensington or this one: http://www.amazon.com/Kindle-PowerB...158903&sr=1-7&keywords=kensington+car+charger.
I first tried it using a POGO cord and it wouldn't charge. It did using a micro-USB cord over 500ma also.
wptski said:
If the data pins aren't shorted, it won't draw more than 500ma, if that's so, how can it be rated at 2.A? I haven't tried my PS with the Nexus 10 yet but did with my other device, had no problem but it has a much smaller battery and I don't remember the details.
I'll try to check it out on the Nexus 10 and post the results.
EDIT
I thried my Kensington or this one: http://www.amazon.com/Kindle-PowerB...158903&sr=1-7&keywords=kensington+car+charger.
I first tried it using a POGO cord and it wouldn't charge. It did using a micro-USB cord over 500ma also.
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I explained it all in the Original Post, but I'll try to clarify. If a charger is rated at 2A but doesn't have data pins shorted, the Nexus 10 will only pull 500mA. The manufacturer isn't necessarily lying about the 2A, it likely is capable of giving 2A. However, the Nexus 10 checks for shorted pins before pulling at 2A. This is because USB spec is rated for 500mA and if the Nexus 10 tried to pull 2A from a computer, it would overload the circuits of a computer's USB port and potentially damage the USB hub or computer. So as a somewhat universal decision (though really it's not standardized), most manufacturers did something like this: if data pins are not shorted (as in a computer) - take upto 500mA. If data pins are shorted (as in the charger provided with the device) - take upto what's necessary. This is actually a somewhat problematic solution because a 2A-requiring Nexus 10 plugged into, say, a Galaxy Nexus charger (shorted data but only 1A) could potentially cause damage from overloading.
Therefore, Apple didn't go along with the whole shorting the data pins solution. They came up with their own solution, which I actually don't know enough about to speak of in accuracy. But their solution allows the device to basically "sense" the capabilities of a charger, so it knows whether it can charge 1A or 2A or 3A, etc. This is I imagine is either done with resistors specifying discrete values or with some sort of "smart chips".
So, as you see, the Apple ones don't have shorted data pins. Therefore a manufacturer of a car charger has to decide: Support Apple devices or support other devices? And some manufacturers do such a bad job, they provide the high current (like 2A) but then don't do Apple's "solution" or the data shorting, thereby rendering their high current useless.
Royal2000H said:
I explained it all in the Original Post, but I'll try to clarify. If a charger is rated at 2A but doesn't have data pins shorted, the Nexus 10 will only pull 500mA. The manufacturer isn't necessarily lying about the 2A, it likely is capable of giving 2A. However, the Nexus 10 checks for shorted pins before pulling at 2A. This is because USB spec is rated for 500mA and if the Nexus 10 tried to pull 2A from a computer, it would overload the circuits of a computer's USB port and potentially damage the USB hub or computer. So as a somewhat universal decision (though really it's not standardized), most manufacturers did something like this: if data pins are not shorted (as in a computer) - take upto 500mA. If data pins are shorted (as in the charger provided with the device) - take upto what's necessary. This is actually a somewhat problematic solution because a 2A-requiring Nexus 10 plugged into, say, a Galaxy Nexus charger (shorted data but only 1A) could potentially cause damage from overloading.
Therefore, Apple didn't go along with the whole shorting the data pins solution. They came up with their own solution, which I actually don't know enough about to speak of in accuracy. But their solution allows the device to basically "sense" the capabilities of a charger, so it knows whether it can charge 1A or 2A or 3A, etc. This is I imagine is either done with resistors specifying discrete values or with some sort of "smart chips".
So, as you see, the Apple ones don't have shorted data pins. Therefore a manufacturer of a car charger has to decide: Support Apple devices or support other devices? And some manufacturers do such a bad job, they provide the high current (like 2A) but then don't do Apple's "solution" or the data shorting, thereby rendering their high current useless.
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If you were to use a PS limited to 1A, it "should" have a saftey to limit that. I used my above mentioned 2.1A PS with a 110VAC>12VDC adapter which was has a 1A max. and it did limit the output. Not saying that all PS would do that without damage though.
While poking around in files, I did find one that lists the power source by name but I forget as to what it showed for the OEM PS. I wonder what it'll show for a car PS?
Sv: Best 2A car charger: Bracketron
I doubt there are phone chargers without current limitations as safety feature. If designed well the charger should limit the current at its max current. Otherwise a lot of chargers would burn.
But I am not sure this is the reality
Skickat från min HTC Desire via Tapatalk 2
Royal2000H said:
...Apple didn't go along with the whole shorting the data pins solution. They came up with their own solution, which I actually don't know enough about to speak of in accuracy. But their solution allows the device to basically "sense" the capabilities of a charger, so it knows whether it can charge 1A or 2A or 3A, etc. This is I imagine is either done with resistors specifying discrete values or with some sort of "smart chips".
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I believe Apple use a pair of different value resistors to create a voltage divider, passing a different voltage to D+ and D-. The presence of this differential voltage on the data pins is what triggers the high power charge capabilities.