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Before i got HTC Tytn2 i had qtek9000. I had also Brodit car holder and instalation in car with cool hidden cable for charging qtek. After i bought Kaiser i also bought Brodit holder for Kaiser. I thought that this miniUSB should charge battery but it is very strange. Kaiser shows "charging" but battery is not charging. On normal 220v original Kaiser charger it works like charm. Are pin combinationfor these two smartphones different?
As far as I know the pinouts are the same.
There is a blog here which describes the HTC ExtUSB socket and also mentions that there are 2 charging modes. The faster charging, higher curent, needs 2 pins to be jumpered. Without this fast charge the current is limited and may not be sufficient to actually charge the device if you are actively using it. eg. GPS, 3g, Music etc. Try using the charger with the Kaiser in GPRS only mode, or Radio off, and with no apps running, this will enable you to see if in fact it is charging but at the slower rate. The Kaiser may need more power than your Qtek needed.
do you maybe know which two pins?
joe_s said:
do you maybe know which two pins?
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Click to collapse
Quoting from the blog...
As for the power pins question this is simple a case of juice.
If I plug the USB cable into a HTC device, then plug that usb cable into a usb port and just wire that up to a bench power supply... the device draws a few hundred milliamps. (As much as USB spec allows).
This device, much like other mobile devices I have used which USB charge, can barely draw enough power of the USB to run itself let alone charge the battery.
However, if you close the A/B pins you are telling the phone "This is not a USB port, its a 1A power brick" so the phone charges the battery at its maximum safe rate.
This behaviour is stop the phone frying your usb ports.
...
Hope this helps
I had problems with some cables and some car chargers. It turns out that when I use a cable for sync that is fully USB 2.0 compatible everything works. For charging in my car I bought a universal car 12v to USB converter. Then I am usinging the same USB 2.0 sync cable with it. It works.
When i first got my kaiser, i used the car-charger from my old MiO A701. For a period of 1,5 month, it worked just fine. After that, for some reason, kaiser shows that is charging but it really does not!
I thought it would be a charger malfunction, but after reading the posts above i have my doubts...
One of my Tilts suddenly won't charge on some chargers:
HTC AC charger - OK
USB to PC - charge and sync OK
HTC compatible car charger - no charge
Blackberry AC charger - no charge
My second Tilt is OK on all four chargers (as expected).
I am suspecting a problem with the usb connector but looking for a reason why some chargers work and others don't.
Any insights would be appreciated.
Thanks
I saw a few weeks back a thread on this very forum that examines this problem in detail -- keep searching
Problem Charging
I think I 've read everything relevant. I am looking for someone who has h/w insight into the Kaiser charging scenarios. I suspect mini-usb damage.
I am somewhat familiar with HTC's pin 4-5 implementation to detect a true charger as opposed to a usb connection that can also apply power.
I want to eliminate software possibilities.
How can a Kaiser charge from an HTC AC charger and also charge from a USB connection to a PC....but not recognize a car charger or a third party AC charger that does not implememt the pin 4-5 grounding technique to identify a charger (and not a generic USB connection).
That is where I am lost.
Looking for "inside-out" knowledge...not "outside-in", if you catch my drift.
charging problems
If the car charger worked before, you can do an easy test. Just put in the car charger and do a soft reset. If it starts charging than, its only a software issue. I did a modification on a charger myself. Because I have different chargers using a normal USB cable, my device didn't charge alway as well. I modified a standard miniUSB cable by connecting the 5th pin to ground. When I use this cable for charging I never have a problem anymore. Succes.
xboomer55 said:
I think I 've read everything relevant. I am looking for someone who has h/w insight into the Kaiser charging scenarios. I suspect mini-usb damage.
I am somewhat familiar with HTC's pin 4-5 implementation to detect a true charger as opposed to a usb connection that can also apply power.
I want to eliminate software possibilities.
How can a Kaiser charge from an HTC AC charger and also charge from a USB connection to a PC....but not recognize a car charger or a third party AC charger that does not implememt the pin 4-5 grounding technique to identify a charger (and not a generic USB connection).
That is where I am lost.
Looking for "inside-out" knowledge...not "outside-in", if you catch my drift.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
xboomer55 said:
One of my Tilts suddenly won't charge on some chargers:
HTC AC charger - OK
USB to PC - charge and sync OK
HTC compatible car charger - no charge
Blackberry AC charger - no charge
My second Tilt is OK on all four chargers (as expected).
I am suspecting a problem with the usb connector but looking for a reason why some chargers work and others don't.
Any insights would be appreciated.
Thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I had exactly the same problem after I tried to re-set my device by poking the stylus in the mini-usb port instead of the re-set hole (tryng to do three things at once!). The port was mangled, and once i'd pushed it all back it wouldn't take a charge from the genric car charger. I bought an HTC branded car charger and it charges as good as a wall adapter.
I imagine that your suspicion of USB port damage is correct.
I have a friend who is visting the US (I'm from Canada) and I asked him to pick me up a nook. Not finding clear info in some of the reviews, mainly concerned about charging.
This charges over usb when hooked up to your computer right? Just want to make sure it doesn't use a proprietary cable for charging. I read on the ipad side, that older computers don't give out enough power to charge over usb, is that an issue with the nook?
What adapters/cables does it come with exactly? And is it just a standard mini-sub for the charging?
Also, this has a headset jack correct? I've read no bluetooth, I guess there's no way to get a mic working on this then.
Micro USB, will charge VERY slowly using a computer. Includes a 2amp wall socket and special cable to quick charge (still micro usb, just more pins). Has a headset port but does not come with a headset.
I've only had a few mobile devices. I read the ipad can charge over usb if the mobo supports giving out that extra juice. Some mobo's have a new firmware update to enable this.
The connector is micro-usb but just more pins. Hmm. so if the cable breaks or I misplace it no other micro-usb will charge it?
edit: i read a little more and found that it's 30 pin proprietary cable to speed up charging. I also read the galaxy tab does something similar.
Does anyone know if they use the same pin configuration? probably not, but I can get tab usb cables here.
I know you didn't ask for it but I'll tell you anyway
In case you are worrying about registering your device (mandatory at initial setup).
I'm NOT in the US and it worked fine.
Good to know. Thanks.
But I'm more concerned about charging it and relying solely on their cables.
I read the ipad can trickle charge on newer computers but some wouldn't provide enough power. Asus et al have released utilities to increase the power to the usb ports.
I can't post the links but endgadget has an article about it providing links to those utilites. They just talk of apple devices but does this work with the nook?
It comes with a charger for US-type sockets and only if you charge your nook with this (and yes, it is proprietary ) it'll charge quickly. It does seem to charge when you connect it to a standard PC USB port but at an extremely low rate.
On the device Micro-USB (not Mini) is used.
You say it does seem to, do you mean from personal experience? How slow? It sounds like that if you do own one it was so slow you didn't let it finish.
Like if it's 8hrs overnight, I can live with that, but I want to confirm that there is a plan b and not solely rely on their cables.
And as I mentioned asus and others released utils to give more power output to the usb (although these seem like their were only created for ipads). Wondering if those utils speed things up.
for ex, google asus ai charger to see what I mean.
I received my nook Color a mere few hours ago so I can't tell you a lot about its charging behavior It "seems" to load slower via standard USB... if you want to know about the details check one of the large threads on the NOOK and its rooting. I remember reading some information about the USB connector and its peculiarities there.
Ah you just got it. I see.
I found this on the root thread:
'
"There are 12 pins coming off the connector. It looks like there are no pins for the standard micro USB portion, only the extended 12 pins. 2 pins are used to bring in +5V, 2 pins are for signal ground providing a hefty circuit for the 2A charging. USB takes up two pins, and as far as I can tell 2 more are for each LED via current limiting resistors. Two more pins go to discretes that I haven't identified, and two more pins are unconnected. I'll take my scope to them when I have some time."
Not sure what he means when he says no pins for the standard micro portion...
Maybe the plug doesn't have standard USB pins, but the NOOK itself does have standard USB pins as well as the proprietary ones. Because I have trouble inserting the original B&N plug, I went out earlier today and bought a standard Micro USB cable...
I connected it to the nook and it said "not charging", so I went out to do some shopping (10-20 minutes max) and left it at 89%... when I came back it was at 93 %.
So it DOES in fact seem to charge albeit slowly.
Thanks. It's weird, lots of comments of its own cable not fitting properly.
As long as it charges with a normal cable I'm good.
I guess it is charging... however there is a slight chance, that it's NOT charging and the battery charge display is lying (de-calibrated). I don't think so, but I'll only know for sure after a few more days of using only the standard USB charger cable.
Just reading up on USB chargers, and I found somewhere in a thread here about phones defaulting to smaller ma when charging via USB if the connector didn't have the data pins shorted or something.
So, I was wondering a couple of things:
1) If the default charger supplies 700ma, do you think that is the most the Nexus S can draw? Does anyone have one of these shorted USB chargers? Does it charge the NS faster?
2) If it does charge faster, how hard would it be to do something similar to shorting the data connections? I have a generic AC-USB cable which I currently use for my iPod touch.
3) Is there a way to check if it is already shorted out? The USB charging port looks similar to ones on my computer, but I'm not sure what to look for.
Thanks for any help! Maybe if we can sort out this stuff, we can provide a solution for those looking for faster charging!
it does work safely, i'm using a 1000 mAh charger at home, and a 2000 mAh charger in the car both are from aftermarket eBay/DealExtreme charges.
no overheating
and charges faster than stock
AllGamer said:
it does work safely, i'm using a 1000 mAh charger at home, and a 2000 mAh charger in the car both are from aftermarket eBay/DealExtreme charges.
no overheating
and charges faster than stock
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ok thankyou for that AllGamer, I'll think of possible ways I could mod the charger now
The only reason it is slow is because of the USB charging brick instead of just a charger.
Sent from my Nexus S using XDA App
I know it's a wrong thread, but anyone has any pointers as to how to short a regular USB cable to make the phone think it's a power adapter cable?
XBOHDPuKC said:
I know it's a wrong thread, but anyone has any pointers as to how to short a regular USB cable to make the phone think it's a power adapter cable?
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Click to collapse
Nah it's not the wrong thread that was one of my questions! I'm not sure exactly where you would do it, but maybe if you skinned the wire, then cut the data lines it would work?
Not sure which end you would do it on however, but that may not matter. Any other ideas?
The two center pins in the USB carry the data. If you pull them out, the cable won't be able to connect to the computer.
Sent from my Nexus S
Wow - you don't need to do this and you wouldn't want to in a computer anyway.
The USB specification says that 500ma (@ 5v) of current should be available from a computer's USB port. Of course, the actual wires can carry much more than this, so manufacturers can tell their phones to takes as much current as is offered.
Almost all computers limit their USB power output accordingly - this is why some opld usb-powered external hard drives needed 2 USB plugs to get enough power. The only computers that I am SURE emit significantly more than 500ma on their USB ports are first and second generation MacBook Airs.
Some phones, the N1 and every other HTC specifically, look for a specially shorted cable to "know if they are plugged into the wall adaptor" as opposed to a computer USB port. In reality, this is just a way to make you specifically buy HTC chargers as opposed to third-party off-brands, because plugging one of these phones into an off brand charger will limit the current draw to about 450ma.
If you want to know if your Android phone thinks that it is in "USB" mode or in "AC" mode, just plug the phone in, open the dialer, enter *#*#4636#*#* and then select battery info. If your phone is one that cares (not all do), it will say USB if it thinks it should be in USB charging mode, or AC if it thinks it should be in AC charging mode.
I would not try shorting out the middle pins in a cable and then plugging it into the computer. First, most will probably just disable the USB port completely, shutting off even power you could draw. Second, if it doesn't shut down, you run the risk that a badly-built USB port might not properly limit the current to 500ma - and since they are not designed to furnish more current than that, you might melt something expensive or start a fire. third, if you make a mistake, you risk shorting out either your phone or your computer, which might ruin your day, week or month, depending on your financial means to replace the system that cooks itself.
I would just run out to your local store, pay 15 bucks for a 2A third-party usb charger brick, and go to town. That will work perfectly - this is what I use, and it probably cuts the charge time by 30-40%. Obviously, this indicates that the NS is not capable of drawing a full 2A - I have not put a meter on it, but I would bet that it limits itself to somewhere just under an amp in.
I have recently bought both a 2A wall charger and car charger and my phone does not recognise either of these as anything more than a 500mA source.
Is it really just a case of opening the car charger up and shorting out pins 2 & 3? they are currently not connected to anything in the charger.
If it's indeed a matter of shorting the data lines, then I think you can skin the wire as suggested by others, but then cut the data lines, short the end that leads to the phone, leave the end to the computer open. I think it's the phone that tries to determine whether the data lines are shorted.
Edit: Can someone measure the continuity between the data pins with the stock charger? I wonder if they are shorted. I'm still waiting for my Nexus S to arrive, so can't test it.
Yup, the data lines in the stock Nexus S charger ARE shorted.
I just modified a cheap 1A car charger by popping it open, soldering the 2 data lines together and putting it back.
The report on the Nexus S before I did this (*#*#4636#*#*) said "USB", and afterwards it now says "AC".
I will report back after I make a road trip if this improves the GPS + Pandora + Screen in car situation. I suspect it will.
----------------
Yup, the car charger seemed to actually maintain and increase the battery this time. Seems good.
The NS supports chargers output to a max of 1000mA, as it says on the back of it, where the battery resides.
Background
Hi all, I, for a very short period of time was suffering from the problem of my phone DISCHARGING while it was charging. This made no logical sense to me until I did some research, which I will detail below.
How USB Power works (Roughly)
Firstly let's discuss USB power provisioning. Strictly speaking, the specifications say that any given USB port should provide a maximum of 500mA (or 0.5A) at 5 volts. *Don't shoot me electronics guys, I'm simplifying for ease of explanations sake*. Imagine that ampage as the actual force of the charger, how quickly it can ram power into your phone. Like the rate of flow on a pipe.
The beginning of the problem
This was all fine and dandy when all USB was really used for was Keyboards, Mice, Memory, etc, low current draw devices. Something else I should mention here is that the Ampage that a port CAN provide is not the Ampage it DOES provide - the device draws a certain Ampage and if the USB controller agrees it outputs said Ampage. Later, when USB was beginning to be used for more power hungry applications, ie External hard drives, these required more power than the port could (In theory) provide. However, most more modern motherboards/USB controllers were more than capable of supplying plenty more Ampage if it was requested. This was breaking the specification but not in any massively dangerous way so as such nothing bad happens.
This is where we get to the actual issue people are experiencing here. The Nexus 4 is a standards compliant device in the respect that it seems to only draw 500mA from any USB port no matter what it's potential, unless it's an AC Wall wart. If you're experiencing problems with wakelocks (see XDA) and other things, this causes your phone to draw more than 500mA which means your phone actually discharges while it's charging! Terrible!
This is quite easy to get around, but again I'm going into detail so let's explain how the phone tells the difference between a dumb wall wart and a USB controller. Easily! The USB controller obviously makes use of the data pins found within the USB cable, whereas a wallwart just (almost always) shorts them out. The Nexus 4 can detect this short, and as such draw more power *While still in quotation marks staying in spec*.
The root problem is not with how the N4 is charging, it's with the wakelock you're experiencing which is causing the phone to draw so much power while the screen is off. While the screen is off and the phone is in Deepsleep (A CPU state where it uses very little power) - it should draw no more than 50mA leaving 450mA for charging the battery, but you guys are probably experiencing a wakelock of some sort.
Solutions to the problem or How to break a specification for the good of mankind
The simple solution is to install this app: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.rootuninstaller.batrsaver
This forces the device into a Deep sleep when the screen goes off by killing applications and turning off all internal chipsets that have wakelock capability, most commonly networking on the Nexus 4. This will allow your phone to charge (slowly) off USB without an issue. Another common wakelock is when the device is picked up by your desktop as a media device. The USB controller inside the Nexus 4 forces a wakelock which keeps it from charging. Stupid design, I know.
* A more hackish solution is to install Francos kernel, buy his app, and tick the Fast charging option in the kernel settings dialog. This will force the phone to think that everything is an AC adaptor and will force the phone to draw as much current as it can from the USB port (which on most modern motherboards is fine, and results in extremely quick charging).
* An even simpler solution than all this is to just use a 'USB Charging cable' - this is simply a cable that does not have the Data pins, and as such does exactly the same as what enabling USB fast charge above does. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Micro-USB...487076?pt=PDA_Accessories&hash=item51a465d124
If you live near a Poundland store here in the UK they sell a 4 in one USB cable type thing which turns 1 USB port into Ipod sync connector, Nokia connector, MicroUSB and MiniUSB, and this doesn't have the data pins and as such is excellent.
One final point, an excellent app for monitoring whether your device is actually charging or not and how quickly is Current widget: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.manor.currentwidget&hl=en
This widget will tell you how much Ampage is going into or leaving your battery. If the battery icon is green, then it's discharging, if it's black/white then it's charging. The bigger the number, the faster the discharge/charge. This is an extremely easy way to test speed of chargers too.
Recommendations
Another solution, just use an AC Wall wart - they're cheap as hell and the one supplied with the Nexus 4 is an extremely fast charging one. Shame I've gone and lost mine.
A way to roughly monitor charging current draw
I'd also recommend you install https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.manor.currentwidget&hl=en and monitor, if the battery is green while charging it's discharging and you need a more powerful charger/to figure out what's causing your phone to use so much power.
General good values in Current Widget
I generally saw a max draw of about 750mA for charging (not including draw for powering the device, the Nexus 4 can draw more power to charge and power the device) on my old Rev10 first generation Nexus 4. On my new Rev12 board I'm noticing this increase to about 850mA.
Are higher amperage chargers any benefit to anyone?
Yes and no. You will not notice faster charging unless you use your device while charging. Your nexus will draw as much power as it needs to power the phone while charging at the fastest rate. For example on the stock 1.2a charger
1200mA | 800mA goes to charging 400mA goes to powering the phone idling
Let's say you start a stability test. Your phone will obviously be using a lot more power so this will happen
1200mA | -600mA goes to charging and 1800mA goes to powering the phone stability testing
That minus value above may look strange! Let me explain. If the phone needs more power than the charger can supply, it will draw from the battery. That's the minus number.
If you have a higher ampage charger like for example a 2.5a charger
2500mA | 800mA goes to charging 400mA goes to powering the device
Stability testing
2500mA | 700mA goes to charging 1800mA goes to powering the device
Can you see the difference?
DISCLAIMER: I am not an electronics engineer nor do I claim to be, I am simply a hobbyist and this is what I've found to be the case. Please correct me if I've made any mistakes, I want to learn.
Thanks!
Thanks so much for this post. It's very helpful.
kn100 said:
Another common wakelock is when the device is picked up by your desktop as a media device. The USB controller inside the Nexus 4 forces a wakelock which keeps it from charging. Stupid design, I know.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This isn't true for everyone then as mine connects and charges just fine off of my laptop and desktop when connected as a media device. In fact its on my laptop right now charging, gone from 68% to 81% in about 30 minutes and it shows connected as a portable media player.
Great info! Thanks for writing this!
In certain use cases the Nexus4 discharges faster than it charges and this is a very useful guide.
I use my phone for navigation in my car and having the GPS on and the screen at high brightness
drains the battery faster than the 0.5A car chargers can supply. Car chargers rated for 2.0A work well.
I haven't tried a 'USB charging cable' with the data pins shorted, it may work as well.
-Mindroid- said:
Great info! Thanks for writing this!
In certain use cases the Nexus4 discharges faster than it charges and this is a very useful guide.
I use my phone for navigation in my car and having the GPS on and the screen at high brightness
drains the battery faster than the 0.5A car chargers can supply. Car chargers rated for 2.0A work well.
I haven't tried a 'USB charging cable' with the data pins shorted, it may work as well.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
was over in Nexus 7 forums and the 4.2.x kernel should have solved the problem at least for having to use shorted cables. have to wait and see if 4.2.2 brings any more changes.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1984838
Section 6 in this link is about power supplied through USB
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_Serial_Bus
I can't tell if we have an updated kernel allowing faster usb charging as I'm limited by the power output of the usb port in my laptop. The output (5V at 500mA max) is controlled by the laptop (USB Standards) and it doesn't matter what the phone or cable is capable of as that's the max it will give out and that's about what I'm charging at. If I had a dedicated charging port in my laptop then it would be different and I could see if its able to draw more power. I have a 1.0 amp port in my car and it does charge at the higher amperage, I would assume it would do the same thing if I had a 2 amp usb port in the car. So I think the stock kernel has the fast usb charge built in it just depends upon if you have a usb port capable of providing a faster charger, it has nothing to do with the cable as I'm using a standard unmodified micro usb cable and its able to draw the max a usb device is able to put out.
thanks
thanks for a great detailed post!!!
I have the same trouble with my N4 when I was charging while using my phone...
I find it very slow... I guess I've been spoiled by my previous iPhone (which charges fairly fast)....
i might be stating the obvious but I find the phone charged "a lot" faster when it's OFF
if you are running low with your battery and need a quick 10 min charge, just do yourself a favour by turning off your phone...
the difference is quite significant!
kzoodroid said:
This isn't true for everyone then as mine connects and charges just fine off of my laptop and desktop when connected as a media device. In fact its on my laptop right now charging, gone from 68% to 81% in about 30 minutes and it shows connected as a portable media player.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yup, me too. It only discharges while charging when I am playing like NFS most wanted.
Sent from my Nexus 4 using xda app-developers app
The issue with cables is with the LG usb wall charger as the one supplied isn't capable of getting the 5 volts at 1.2 amps that the charger is rated at, mine is getting around 300 - 400 mA. The micro usb cable I have in my car and use with my laptop (for charging and data transfer) is able to handle the higher amperage, it gets around 1 amp with the LG plug. There are no specs on these cables so I can't list a definitive difference and I would assume that the cable mod in the OP might help with the LG cable. It also might just be simpler to only buy those cables capable of handling higher amperage as obviously they are out there from my experience.
The cable I'm using is an RCA coiled charging/syncing cable model AH732CBR (has data pins). The maximum I'm getting from this is about 870 mA regardless of the amperage of the usb port, I've tried a 1.0, 1.2 and 2.1 and they are all around 870 mA on current widget. I would suppose if I could find a strictly charging cable I could get higher (link to ebay in OP is outdated) but this is still 2x that which I'm getting from the LG cable supplied with the phone which only puts out 300-400 mA. Our phone also has Qualcomm's quick charge which is supposed to improve battery charging times by 40%.
http://www.droid-life.com/2013/02/1...allows-your-device-to-charge-up-to-40-faster/
How do you measure how much mA the device draw from the charger?
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2
omrij said:
How do you measure how much mA the device draw from the charger?
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
current widget, link is in the OP
kzoodroid said:
The cable I'm using is an RCA coiled charging/syncing cable model AH732CBR (has data pins). The maximum I'm getting from this is about 870 mA regardless of the amperage of the usb port, I've tried a 1.0, 1.2 and 2.1 and they are all around 870 mA on current widget. I would suppose if I could find a strictly charging cable I could get higher (link to ebay in OP is outdated) but this is still 2x that which I'm getting from the LG cable supplied with the phone which only puts out 300-400 mA. Our phone also has Qualcomm's quick charge which is supposed to improve battery charging times by 40%.
http://www.droid-life.com/2013/02/1...allows-your-device-to-charge-up-to-40-faster/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Bit of a late reply but please bear in mind the Nexus will NOT draw anything more than about 800mAh from the wall for charging alone. That is the absolute max and is a hardware limit - If the cable is transmitting that and it's showing in current widget you've got a good setup. See the added section in OP for more info on higher amperage chargers.