Yes, I've read (or skimmed) most, or all, of the threads on this topic.
My NC audio is...
1. too bright, sibilant
2. lacking in bottom end
3. harsh/hissy in the top end
not talking about playback over the built-in speaker. talking about listening with high-end headphones (in my case, some Shure SE315s and also ME Electronics M6).
I'm not talking about the audio jack behaving differently according to how you insert the plug. Not talking about trying to get bluetooth audio. Not talking about Pandora sounding bad, or a lack of an equalizer on the Google Music player, etc.
Has anyone found a solution that will just fix the actual audio quality (as in, tone balance) issues?
edit:
BTW, I did find that using DSPManager (on CM7.1) it gets much better with a custom EQ setting (each band):
+1.0 +0.5 0.0 -0.5 -1.0 -1.5
The top end is still harsh sounding, but at least it's not overbalanced in this case.
This makes me think this is likely a hardware issue... too small or the wrong type of coupling cap somewhere.
Perhaps you guys are not trying to listen to music on your Nook Color, thus the lack of discussion on this thread.
After comparing to my laptop and my HTC phone, I have discovered that at 100 Hz the NC is at least -10dB compared with my phone. This is extreme! I will try to do some FFTs of this over the weekend.
I think it's a hardware problem.
For the time being I have "bass boost" on DSP Manager turned on, along with some rather extreme EQ settings. It still sounds bad, but at least it's not ear-bleedingly bad.
I've noticed this too with other "lower end" devices, or devices where the engineers aren't too overly-concerned with its audio quality. They usually don't sound the best. I'm sure it's not just your imagination on this. And to think I was actually considering getting a nook as a cheap in-car entertainment device... ugh
NRGZ28 said:
I've noticed this too with other "lower end" devices, or devices where the engineers aren't too overly-concerned with its audio quality. They usually don't sound the best. I'm sure it's not just your imagination on this. And to think I was actually considering getting a nook as a cheap in-car entertainment device... ugh
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't think it's because it's "low-end".
I think one of a couple of things may be at play here.
1. the NC is intended to play only through the internal speaker and/or only play audiobooks (spoken word only). So they intentionally rolled off the bottom end (and most of the midrange as well).
2. audio was not even on the minds of the engineers of the NC, so they didn't bother to check what value coupling capacitors or filter components will work correctly
3. the software/driver is programming the audio device with an extreme HPF intentionally
The reason I don't think it's just because it's "cheap" is because a $20 MP3 player will get all of this right. In fact, it's almost trivial to get this more than good enough. The rest of the NC hardware is way more well-done than this. This screen would not be on a "cheap" device where they severely cut corners on audio by oversight.
So my suspicion is that the audio behavior of the NC is quite intentional. I don't know if it's HW or SW. I seriously hope it's SW.
Glancing at the datasheet for the audio chip (http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/slas671/slas671.pdf) I notice that the audio device has automatic headset detection. This does not seem to be implemented on the NC. Maybe that's the problem. It also has two audio inputs. The more I look at this, the more I want to crack open my NC. The datasheet suggests AC coupling the headphone outputs so there is some capacitor likely in series with each of these lines. IMHO this is the most likely culprit to the NC's crappy sound, if it is a hardware problem. In this case it's only two components to swap, should be a snap. But I don't really want to solder on my NC.
The DRC (dynamic range control) does have a HPF that might have the ability to cause this crummy sound in software, but I doubt it. However, it would not surprise me for the NC developers to turn on some DRC all the time.
I guess I really need to get at the source code of whatever the driver is for the audio device, or get a busted NC so I can trace the output circuit and determine if it's a hardware issue.
Or maybe I'll just not use this to listen to music and watch movies.
OK. This is quite strange.
For a quick experiment, I did a FFT on pink noise playback from my Nook Color, my HTC Aria phone, and my computer's sound device (in this case, Tascam US-144).
{
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"lightbox_start_slideshow": "Start slideshow",
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"lightbox_thumbnails": "Thumbnails",
"lightbox_download": "Download",
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Now, of course I am not playing this into HEADPHONES. In fact, the input of my US-144 "Line In" that I used to test this is AC-coupled and about 50K ohms.
Into that impedance, the output of the NC looks pretty freakin' flat. Moreso than my phone, in fact. So this is good news for you guys wanting to use a NC to plug into the Line In on some device. There is nothing wrong with the audio. It looks great.
However, since my ears, with my earphones, told me that the NC's output was anything BUT flat, I decided to do another test. This time I clipped in an 8 ohm load across the output, to see what the NC's frequency response looks like into an 8 ohm load. I did this also for my phone for comparison.
The NC's output is about -25dB at 100Hz going into an 8 ohm load (typical headphones are maybe more like 16 ohms). As you can see, this is hugely different from the 25K load output.
The verdict? The NC's output is very reactive according to what load you attach to it. Plugging in most headphones will result in a huge roll-off of the bottom end. You could plug it into a buffer or external headphone amp and it would probably sound just fine.
And for comparison, I did the same test with my HTC Aria, and the 8 ohm output looks pretty much exactly like the no-load output. The Aria is a teeny bit lower in the sub-100Hz range than the NC into no-load, ant it is pretty much exactly the same into an 8 ohm load.
After making this discovery, I am more inclined to think this is a hardware design problem, with the output coupling caps being too small.
Armed with the frequency response curves, I experimented with DSPManager EQ settings to try and come up with an EQ that gets it close to right into an 8 ohm load. It is impossible to do it.
However, with DPSManager's "bass boost" turned on, and "Moderate", and EQ settings of +10, 0, -10, -10, -10, -10 it gets to "flat" but not "pink". I am guessing it's distortion showing up at the top end.
In all, this kind of sucks.
Thank you for the info. I would look at the coupling capacitors as well. If they're Tantalum I would replace them with Aluminum Oxide and ensure the capacity is at least 220ufd. The problem would be finding the room. In some experiments I did years ago repairing a portable CD player, Tantalum did awful things to high frequency reproduction.
EDIT: here's a picture of the audio circuit on the motherboard (both from ZDnet):
NOOK COLOR
I cannot identify what I would think are the two headphone coupling capacitors. I suspect they are very small value. They *look* like ceramic (color, no polarity markings) and if so, they would be marginally suitable for a line out and sonically and electrically useless for headphones for music listening.
To contrast:
NOOK TABLET:
I am assuming the large two black capacitors side by side are the headphone coupling capacitors. I do believe these to be tantalum electrolytics (color, polarity markings, shape).
S 7 j e
Trying to interpret that code.
My best determination is 47uf @ 16v -- the "j" may be a tolerance code.
If that is the case then 47uf is way too small of a value for any strong bass output at low impedances (16-32ohm). Minimally acceptable at best.
Color and Tablet:
Both circuits seem to have a very small (pf) capacitor after each coupling cap as a high frequency roll off filter. Not unusual for portable equipment if the capacitor value isn't too large causing excessive rolloff.
You sir are a star! So an amplified set of headphones is the key?
Possibly. I still think there would be issues with Nook's coupling capacitor type and value but the input impedance of the headphone amp might overcome the frequency response issue. Sound quality and noise may be another problem that the headphone amp might not address. Tantalums are not good for sound. That is, garbage in, garbage out.
There may be other problems concerning the configuration of the sound chip in the firmware. The TI chip is capable of a lot of sonic "tricks" but based upon your graphs maybe the sound isn't too compromised in the firmware.
Hard to tell if those are the headphone output coupling caps without tracing the circuit or at least being able to see the alignment dot on the component package of the audio chip. However, if those are the headphone output caps, then they are followed by a ferrite bead and parallel caps most likely to trim off HF noise as well, evidenced by just looking at the pic.
The Nook Tablet pic definitely has bigger caps, probably tantalum, and who knows the value but that's not a 7343 package, so it can't be more than maybe 100uF.
Looking at the FFT, it looks like about a 1KHz Fc into my 8 ohm load, so I am guessing the caps in a NC are more like 22uF. 220uF still gives like 90Hz Fc into 8 ohms, down to 45Hz into 16 ohms. To get full bandwidth into 16 ohms is going to require about 470uF. Maybe compromise at 330uF and hope you have bigger impedance cans.
Those look like 1206 packages on the NC and 1812 package on the NT to me. Even a tantalum at 470uF is going to be a whole lot better, if this is in fact like 22uF. However, finding an 1812 cap at 220uF or 470uF may be extremely difficult. I am not going to argue about putting a different material cap in here because it's just way too small. A brief check of Mouser shows 7343 is the smallest 470uF caps even at 2.5V in tantalum. They have 6032s in 330uF. But those are way too big.
How hard is it to get the NC apart to the point at which this picture was taken? Do you have to unsolder any components to get there?
I wonder if there is any DC on those outputs, or whether these caps can just be jumpered.
The datasheet says the headphone outputs are rated to drive a 16 ohm load. I guess I was overloading them a little into 8 ohms.
After scanning caps, I think it's pretty much impossible to find a reasonable value cap that will fit into a 1206 or 1210 SMD space. Even the 1812s on the NT are not nearly big enough size-wise. So the only way to solve this with hardware mods is to either put caps somewhere in the wiring between the jack and the board, and jumper the caps on the board, or just jumper the caps on the board and hope for no DC on the outputs. Looks like a good time to use an external headphone amp, or noise-canceling headphones (have a built-in amp).
BTW, here's the cheapest, easiest solution to this problem:
http://www.amazon.com/Fiio-E3-BK-E3-Headphone-Amp/dp/B001MPWMDA
And if I were to crack open my NC, rather than doing any surgery or trying to cram different caps in there, I would do this: take the whole PCB from an E3 and shoehorn it into the NC in some open space, wire it between the headphone jack and the headphone output on the NC PCB, and pick up some power from the NC somewhere to run the E3.
Have you installed Dalingren's Nook Tweaks from the market? You can adjust audio settings using this app, specifically increase DAC, adlust headphone gain, speaker gain. Warning! Increasing DAC too high will damage your speaker. I have my DAC setting about 5/8 inch from the left under the a and s in the word "increasing".
hwong96 said:
Have you installed Dalingren's Nook Tweaks from the market? You can adjust audio settings using this app, specifically increase DAC, adlust headphone gain, speaker gain. Warning! Increasing DAC too high will damage your speaker. I have my DAC setting about 5/8 inch from the left under the a and s in the word "increasing".
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, this is not a volume problem. It's a frequency response problem, related to the impedance of the device connected. Please see the plots.
I posted earlier about my solution to this. By no means cost effective or portable. FiiO E7 USB DAC and CM7. I stream and download 320 bit from MOG. Great for me working hours at desk. Download is unlimited and can listen offline. The audio quality with this little rig is superb. As in unbelievable. I also use good headphones.
Sent from my NookColor using Tapatalk
22jjones said:
I posted earlier about my solution to this. By no means cost effective or portable. FiiO E7 USB DAC and CM7.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You using this with USB Host Mode? Is it drawing power from the USB?
Certainly this will sound good but like you say, it's hardly portable. Now, if it were bluetooth rather than USB...
I think a FiiO E3 or E5 headphone amp will mostly fix the main problems, while not improving the DAC or noise performance any. It will definitely fix the reactivity of the output stage. Plus an E5 is cheap + rechargeable and an E3 extremely cheap and extremely compact, barely noticeable and perfectly portable.
I plan to use my NC to read, listen to music and watch movies while on long plane rides, which are all too frequent with my job. Long battery life is key (so drawing power on USB host mode may be bad) and noise performance is not critical. For this kind of thing, I think a small external headphone buffer amp is the ideal solution.
No power drawn from USB, the FiiO has it's own rechargeable battery, one charge will last much longer than the Nook. You have to turn charging off on the FiiO while plugged in to Nook. It is using USB host mode. Add Sennheiser CXC 700 ear buds, and the rig is entering into the audiophile zone.
I think you're right, a small headphone amp, and some EQ will be good. I just did my setup as kind of a quest on how far I could go with Nook audio!
mr72 said:
BTW, here's the cheapest, easiest solution to this problem:
http://www.amazon.com/Fiio-E3-BK-E3-Headphone-Amp/dp/B001MPWMDA
And if I were to crack open my NC, rather than doing any surgery or trying to cram different caps in there, I would do this: take the whole PCB from an E3 and shoehorn it into the NC in some open space, wire it between the headphone jack and the headphone output on the NC PCB, and pick up some power from the NC somewhere to run the E3.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That E3 also notes it's for 16+ ohm devices. How does that fix it if you are using your 8 ohm headphones?
The two pair of earphones I will be using are 16 ohms and 23 ohms. I tested the NC's audio output into an 8 ohm load simply because that's the practical lower limit for headphones. They are much more commonly 16 ohms or more.
However, to answer your question specifically, it probably doesn't matter, but it's not worth getting into here. The LM4917 amplifier used in the FiiO is rated at 95mW into a 16 ohm minimum load. Running into a smaller load will just limit the maximum voltage swing or increase distortion when the amplifier is running on max.
FWIW, I think I could probably dead-bug a LM4917 into a NC easier than cramming big output coupling caps in there. That'd fix it as well.
Related
I am loving my Nook Color. Using it to replace a laptop and books I take with me on plane trips for movies and reading.
I am running 1.1 Stock and Auto Nootered. I have my file re-encoded for playing on the Nook and they look great. Problem is with sound all the way up and using my noise canceling headphones, the sound is not quite as loud as I would like.
Is there a way to increase the sound output to the head phone jack?
shaxs said:
I am loving my Nook Color. Using it to replace a laptop and books I take with me on plane trips for movies and reading.
I am running 1.1 Stock and Auto Nootered. I have my file re-encoded for playing on the Nook and they look great. Problem is with sound all the way up and using my noise canceling headphones, the sound is not quite as loud as I would like.
Is there a way to increase the sound output to the head phone jack?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
See this is an entirely different science.
Often, both noise canceling headphones and high quality headphones require a certain about of ohm's to power them. Many people even use headphone amplifiers to amplifier the amount of ohms the headphones recieve, which in turn boosts the volume.
Most players(like ipod) have artificial amplifiers built into the DAP(digital audio processor)
The Nook was made as an ereader. it doesn't have a powerful DAP. On some phones they have a dedicated headphone/headset amp which you can crank up.
The nook doesn't.
Therefore, the sound is quiter on these headphones.
comdei said:
See this is an entirely different science.
Often, both noise canceling headphones and high quality headphones require a certain about of ohm's to power them. Many people even use headphone amplifiers to amplifier the amount of ohms the headphones recieve, which in turn boosts the volume.
Most players(like ipod) have artificial amplifiers built into the DAP(digital audio processor)
The Nook was made as an ereader. it doesn't have a powerful DAP. On some phones they have a dedicated headphone/headset amp which you can crank up.
The nook doesn't.
Therefore, the sound is quiter on these headphones.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the great feedback! So it seems like something like http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2732095 should work well? I need local-ish as I am heading on a plane Saturday.
I was suffering the same problem. I could barely hear my NC when playing a movie while on the treadmill at my local gym. I bought a tiny little amp about the size of an iPod nano (Amazon for about $20). It turns out that it doesn't bump the volume up all that much. It's enough for my needs, but would not be enough for a plane trip. The little Radio Shack amp you linked to should work. As long as it you only turn it up to say, 5 or 6 (out of an assumed 10), and it's VERY LOUD (while sitting on your couch), that should give you sufficient headroom for a plane trip.
I recall reading a thread at this site about a kernel that would allow you to bump up the native volume. There's been sooo many kernels and updates that I can't recall which one did the trick...
Jgrimoldy said:
I was suffering the same problem. I could barely hear my NC when playing a movie while on the treadmill at my local gym. I bought a tiny little amp about the size of an iPod nano (Amazon for about $20). It turns out that it doesn't bump the volume up all that much. It's enough for my needs, but would not be enough for a plane trip. The little Radio Shack amp you linked to should work. As long as it you only turn it up to say, 5 or 6 (out of an assumed 10), and it's VERY LOUD (while sitting on your couch), that should give you sufficient headroom for a plane trip.
I recall reading a thread at this site about a kernel that would allow you to bump up the native volume. There's been sooo many kernels and updates that I can't recall which one did the trick...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I was thinking about this one: http://www.amazon.com/FiiO-E5-Headphone-Amplifier/dp/B001P9EQH8/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top
Is that the one you got by any chance?
So, music was one of the things I was hoping my NC could do, but haven't had much occasion to try out in the month I've had it. Today I devoted a little time and attention to it:
My only headphones at present are some worn-out Apple earbuds, and I used them once to listen to an audiobook--the only thing I noticed was that the volume was quite low, but otherwise I won't base any impressions on that experience.
Today, however, I decided to compare some music player apps for sound quality, and tried out the NC on three different sound systems in the process:
The Nook Color's speaker.
Lined in to an iPod dock with an unshielded 3.5mm-to-3.5mm cable.
Lined in to a shelf stereo system with a 3.5mm-to-dual-RCA cable.
Okay, the built-in speaker is crap, obviously. It's tiny, points backwards, and there's only one. My cell phone speaker can drown it out, though the sound is marginally better on the NC. It's actually halfway impressive the sound quality they get out of the tiny speaker, but I still couldn't imagine using it for music. It's serviceable for tv shows, but I would probably still pop in earbuds if I had them handy.
Connecting to an outside sound system was what really underwhelmed me. For the two systems I tried, the NC produced drastically lower volume than anything else I've ever plugged into them. At what would be a loud volume for my phone, iPod, or an instrument, the NC's output (at its maximum volume) was barely audible. With the systems cranked to achieve an ambient volume, the sound was tolerable, but washed out in comparison to other sources.
There was also occasional skipping or stuttering in playback, which is really odd considering how well the thing handles video.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Is this consistent with everyone's experience? Is there any difference between stock and CM7 output?
I've seen threads here and there about improving volume and disappointment with output through the headphone jack, but I had no idea. I guess I've been sheltered using iPods and/or at least somewhat music-optimized phones (SE Walkmans), because I did not realize that audio output on a device capable of playing MP3s could be this bad.
the sound on my nook is good, the speaker isnt the best but its decent and audio with my panasonic headphones sound is awesome.
EDIT: i use cm7 and cant remeber much of when it was stock rooted, as that only satisified me for a whole 2 days before i went to nookie froyo then cm7.
I have no idea how sound works on the stock or rooted stock Nook since I put CyanogenMod on my Nook as soon as I got it. The sound seems to work fine on my headphones. I can almost reach the threshold of pain with a few tweaks of the DSP settings.
I do not use the built in speaker for much, but even it is better than nothing.
I'm running phiremod 6.1 on mine. I have found that the volume was inconsistent between versions, but I'm pretty pleased with the current setup. I do however have a different issue, which is related to the headphone jack. When I plug in my headphones, it seems like 75% of the time they don't work quite right. The obvious symptom is that one speaker is noticeably louder than the other, and generally the audio sounds like crap. Unplugging them and plugging them back in a few times will get things back to normal, but its a little annoying. This has been the case on every OS I have run on it.
there are terrible impedance issues with NC. If you buy this:
m.crutchfield.com/mt/www.crutchfield.com/p_127SNI135/PAC-SNI-1-3-5-Noise-Filter.html?tp=2653&osid=969403309&un_jtt_redirect
they will all go away. I know it says it is a "noise" filter, but it fixes impedance too. I own two of them, they keep me from pulling my hair out. Hint: if it doesn't work one way with a certain device, plug it in backwards using a M/F adapter.
i run cm7. using dspmanger... the nook color sounds awesome. I hook it up to my logitech thx speakers and cry.... because it sounds a helluva lot better than the $160 sound card in my pc.
without dspmanage... it sounds like garbage.
have fun.
I found this thread discussing NC audio in a little more depth:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=864064
I haven't heard the hissing they're talking about so much as a slightly washed-out sound and the crazy low volume. Someone else testing the NC with external speakers found that yes, it was considerably quieter than their Sansa MP3 player and iPod Touch, but the newest Kindle is quieter still.
technicalsquash said:
I do however have a different issue, which is related to the headphone jack. When I plug in my headphones, it seems like 75% of the time they don't work quite right. The obvious symptom is that one speaker is noticeably louder than the other, and generally the audio sounds like crap. Unplugging them and plugging them back in a few times will get things back to normal, but its a little annoying. This has been the case on every OS I have run on it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've had this issue with my crap Apple earbuds in my iPod before, and rather than yanking them out and jamming them back in, I found turning them in the socket and/or moving them in or out just a couple millimeters let me 'tune' them to where I was getting the best sound from both speakers. I actually found the same thing with my NC lined-in to my iPod dock via 3.5mm male-to-male cord.
If you are having trouble with low volume or hiss i suggest you use my app here:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1104039
It requires kernel support so only my kernel works with it for now until the next CM7 nightly.
Note: My kernel works with both B&N 1.2 Froyo and CM7.
Taken directly from my Imgur account dscf0000. All (or close to all) my XDA pics are hosted there. I used to use my own web server, but FTP was such a pain and one of the servers were shut down so some of my older posts have broken image links that I'm too lazy to track down. Speaking of lazy, that's why I just copy and pasted this.
{
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This is the Ronin "Nomaster" Wireless headphones. They are usually $48, but were half price when I got them. The headphone itself is terrible; the all-plastic build is very low quality. The hinges feel like they will break every time you snap them into place for use. The speaker drivers are indeed 40 mm in diameter, and technically the range is 20-20,000 Hz, but to be honest they sound like absolute crap.
The cushions are the type typically found on dollar shop headphones - they are kinda soft, but they're kinda not, if you know what I mean. Half of the muddy low-and-high-less sound coming from the speaker drivers is escaping through the gap between your ears and the cushions.
Now moving onto the visual aesthetics, the headphone bears a striking vague resemblance to the previous generation Beats headphone line (think Studio, Solo). Glossy plastic (comes in a few different colors such as blue, red, white and 'salmon'), foldable design, cushioned headband etc. In comparison, they make Beats look and sound like the best headphone ever. The only thing that it has that the Beats doesn't have is Bluetooth functionality, really. Until now.
No pictures of the process; sorry. It's boring anyway - just some soldering and burning of plastic with my trusty soldering iron. Essentially, all that I did was swap the Beats Studio's original ANC circuit board with the Ronin's Bluetooth board. The Ronins could only operate using Bluetooth, so when the battery's out of juice, you're out of luck. There was no wired alternative, but now there is.
Speaking of battery, the Studios now has a rechargeable Li-ion battery in place of its 2 x AAA battery compartment. As seen here, I've made a few adjustments to accommodate for the new square 400 mAh cell. When this runs out, I can simply plug in a cable and use the headphone passively.
The new Bluetooth circuit board is surprisingly appropriately sized to fit into the Studio's right earcup. The diameter of the board is nearly identical to the Beat's original board. However, the inefficiently designed Bluetooth circuit board, with the awkwardly placed Bluetooth radio chipset protruding from the side. made the board just not fit into the earcup. So I had to file down both sides of the board and remove some of the plastic inside the earcup to squeeze the new board in.
Due to the chip being wired to both the two speaker drivers and the headphone jack (originally used for input), the headphone jack also doubles as an audio output from the Bluetooth circuit when it is active. This was actually an unexpected development, as I only planned to directly wire the right channel from the headphone jack to the right channel out contact from the Bluetooth circuit board. I only expected the right channel to work from Bluetooth when another earphone was connected to the headphone jack, but in the end, both channels worked flawlessly.
This is the stealthily located circular charging port for the 400 mAh rechargeable battery.
The finished product looks more or less exactly the same as before. The charging port is hidden when the earcup is bent downwards.
The wireless Ronin headphones are now wired using an old earphone cable. Specifically, it was from this earphone: http://i.imgur.com/0E5TeWs.jpg
*XDA Exclusive!!
What can be done using this unoccupied Beats ANC circuit? You shall see soon.
Awesome write up! I love DIY threads Actually, what a coincidence because I was just browsing head-fi.org to get details on converting my ATH-M50 from hard-wired cable to pluggable (http://www.head-fi.org/t/553483/ath-m50-removable-cable-mod/45#post_8075357). The mod itself looks easy, but I'm worried about soldering those braided wires and how it will affect the sound quality.
Btw, I think its great that you post it in here but I still believe it will not get as much attention as it would in Accessories section or in head-fi forum. Maybe more views in Note 2 section, but not quite sure if people are as interested? Not a negative reply, just that you put so much work into this - I think it deserves a bigger audience who will appreciate it.
One question I have. How did you implement play/vol/track controls in your current setup hosted inside of Beats? Also, really neat how you have a hidden charging port, I really like that.
vectron said:
Awesome write up! I love DIY threads Actually, what a coincidence because I was just browsing head-fi.org to get details on converting my ATH-M50 from hard-wired cable to pluggable (http://www.head-fi.org/t/553483/ath-m50-removable-cable-mod/45#post_8075357). The mod itself looks easy, but I'm worried about soldering those braided wires and how it will affect the sound quality.
Btw, I think its great that you post it in here but I still believe it will not get as much attention as it would in Accessories section or in head-fi forum. Maybe more views in Note 2 section, but not quite sure if people are as interested? Not a negative reply, just that you put so much work into this - I think it deserves a bigger audience who will appreciate it.
One question I have. How did you implement play/vol/track controls in your current setup hosted inside of Beats? Also, really neat how you have a hidden charging port, I really like that.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you for your consideration, @vectron. I'd like to seek a larger audience who would be more interested in my works in the audio genre. As I've mentioned before, I'm not much of an audiophile, but I simply love modifying audio hardware.
Speaking of braided cables, I've noticed that when I'm using the Beats via Bluetooth, the left channel has considerably more audible noise than the right channel. I'm guessing it's because the multi-core cable running through the headband is not shielded or braided in any way. And because the left channel needs to travel through this cable from the circuit board, which is in the right earcup, it shares the same unshielded cable that the li-ion battery uses to provide power to the circuit.
This was worse in the Beats' original configuration, where both channels shared the same unshielded cable, as the stereo input from the left earcup needed to travel to the circuit in the right.
I've actually done a detachable cable conversion to headphones a few times already. One time, I salvaged an audio port from a computer motherboard for parts! Speaking of which, I think the ATH-M50 mod won't affect the audio quality much. If you're worried though, just wrap the individual (insulated, of course) channel connections with alfoil, then wrap the whole jack as well.
Separating the power cable from the audio cable gives me an idea...
I will make a Head-Fi account under the same username soon, then post all of my headphone stuff there.
I'll tell you about the media controls soon. I'm on my Note 2 and out for dinner, away from all my stuff so I'm also away from my headphones.
Can't wait to find out about media controls! I could only image you retrofitting original buttons into Beats, how else would you trigger those control push buttons? Take some pics Btw, another way for you to get exposure is with YT video. Just get a tripod, a camera (even can use Note 2 with tripods like those gorilla pods I reviewed), and start a channel. I would subscribe to it for sure. With head-fi, don't get intimidated by these guys. I don't consider myself audiophile either; don't have free time or patience to train my ears for that. But I notice a lot of the people visit that site not just to show off but to learn. So any audio related contribution will be appreciated in there.
Regarding pluggable cable mod, as much as I'm itching to do that, I decided to put it on-hold for now. The whole purpose of that mod is to make headphone more portable and/or to add detachable cable remote control. M50 is too bulky to walk around outside, and it will be weird make phone calls with these cans. I absolutely love them for everyday use with my laptop or watching movies on Note 2. That 11' cable is just wrapped around and I just ordered a few fancy velcro straps for a dollar (http://www.ebay.com/itm/171095544775?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649) to manage cable. I really don't want to chop it off, after all its OFC litz wire. Maybe that's a reason people had problem soldering it. A number of people reported that after that pluggable cable mod the volume between L/R became uneven or the sound changed a bit. M50 are fantastic studio headphones with an amazing value for $100. Not exactly perfect audiophile sound quality, but damn close.
And just to put all this in perspective of Note 2, it's always a challenge to get headphones that integrate perfectly with our phablet. In-ear headphones usually have i-control where multi-function button works great with Android, but volume only works for apple devices. You can get a custom 3.5mm male-to-male cable with Samsung controls (I'm waiting for it now from Luna shop), but in general going Wireless is the only way to have full transport and volume control with your Note 2 because its part of universal Bluetooth protocol.
Only the center play/pause button works with the cover on. Long pressing it for 3 seconds turns it on/off, and pressing it for 5 seconds kicks it into pairing mode.
On the inside of the button, I superglued two pieces of rubber band on the bottom of the button, so it reverts to its original position after being pressed. I might relocate the microphone to where the power switch used to be because it has a hole that allows sound to go through. I might not, because I would not use an apparently disconnected Beats headset to make phone calls in public.
The other 4 buttons I never use anyway. The volume controls are independent of the Android volume level, and my custom ROM allows me to long press the volume up/down buttons to go to the next/previous track respectively. I only really need the button in the middle to play/pause and toggle the power.
You guessed it - the orange sticker on the inside of the button is actually a home button sticker for an iPhone 5. It is convex, so it is an ideal shape to press the button on the circuit board.
Well, I must say that the Beats Wireless have a much more accessible and convenient button layout than my DIY mod. But mine is an over-ear design, so that makes up for everything in my book.
http://www.isimplesolutions.com/charge/jamport-streaming-charging.html
Anybody here ever play with one of these?
It says it works with the GS4, it seems to be just a USB DAC. From what I remember, our N4's work on this type of device, right?
From the user manual:
IS3301 uses Android Open Accessory Protocol. Accessory mode is ultimatley
dependant on the devices hardware, and not all devices support accessory mode
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This is pretty much exactly the device I've been looking for. I've got a really good head unit, it's just that it's pre-BT/USB/anything else useful. It'd cost me pretty big bucks to replace with a equivalent "modern" HU. I currently use a 3.5mm->RCA->HU aux input setup right now that is lacking in quality.
I just can't find anything about this thing online.
I'm not sure about that particular device, but most if not all USB DACs work with the N4 (on 4.x at least, LP reportedly broke compatibility with some previously working units ). I have an Asus Xonar U3 ($40 when I bought it from Amazon), and it's really FAR surpassed my expectations. As long as you plug it in before launching your (any, afaik) music player, it should produce a very noticeable improvement on sq. If you do end up getting a USB DAC, I'd highly recommend at least checking out the 14 day trial of USB Audio Player Pro... it bypasses the system's drivers and uses it's own, and IMO the sq is untouchable! If you listen to a lot of music from your N4 (a great output source in itself, x100 with UAPP) I can say pretty confidently that investing in a DAC will greatly increase your enjoyment! :good:
i use my nexus 7 as my in dash, how would this help ? currently just using 3.5mm port to rca to get the audio out...
does it charge the tablet at the same time?
I should have mentioned in my post above that portable USB DACs are primarily intended to be used with headphones. They will generally improve sound output to speakers as well, but a car-audio specific device like the one the OP posted may be better for that application... however, the only immediately apparent difference are the RCA plugs vs. aux. Worth the price difference? Not having heard that device as well as the lack of info/reviews (possibly a bad sign), my guess would be "no". With a device like mine or the Fiio usb models, you get the bonus of versatility: carrying it in your pocket and using headphones and then just using it in your car via an aux input (as long as your receiver has one). A caveat to using a portable USB DAC is that they actually drain your battery significantly faster (I found it odd that mine would only work with a "regular" micro usb to usb adapter cable, no sound when I tried it with a powered micro usb hub).
There may very well be better products if the intent is just to use it for car audio... I'm just not personally aware of any. I'm sure there are better forums (similar to head-fi.org but specific to cars) where you could probably find or get better answers re: good DACs for car audio
masri1987 said:
does it charge the tablet at the same time?
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The one I posted says it does charge @2A.
My other question is: What controls the audio volume when you use a DAC?
My biggest issue is even with the volume maxed on my N4, my h/u sees very low input volume, and I have to nearly max out my h/u's volume to get anywhere, which induces a lot of clipping and distortion.. Which is bad.
jazzmachine said:
I'm not sure about that particular device, but most if not all USB DACs work with the N4 (on 4.x at least, LP reportedly broke compatibility with some previously working units ). I have an Asus Xonar U3 ($40 when I bought it from Amazon), and it's really FAR surpassed my expectations. As long as you plug it in before launching your (any, afaik) music player, it should produce a very noticeable improvement on sq. If you do end up getting a USB DAC, I'd highly recommend at least checking out the 14 day trial of USB Audio Player Pro... it bypasses the system's drivers and uses it's own, and IMO the sq is untouchable! If you listen to a lot of music from your N4 (a great output source in itself, x100 with UAPP) I can say pretty confidently that investing in a DAC will greatly increase your enjoyment! :good:
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I hear you on the lack of reviews/info on it being a bad sign, but I'm guessing the vast majority of people have no idea wtf a DAC even is..
ummduh said:
The one I posted says it does charge @2A.
My other question is: What controls the audio volume when you use a DAC?
My biggest issue is even with the volume maxed on my N4, my h/u sees very low input volume, and I have to nearly max out my h/u's volume to get anywhere, which induces a lot of clipping and distortion.. Which is bad.
I hear you on the lack of reviews/info on it being a bad sign, but I'm guessing the vast majority of people have no idea wtf a DAC even is..
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i use a line-driver before i route the audio to my amp to make it sound like a pioneer deck , but that's wit a 3.5 mm to rca plug... imagine with this product.. i'm concerned about overheating because it's constantly charging and i live in phoenix and it's hot as you know what
and viper4android of course
It looks like the charge wiring is separate, you could always switch it on/off as required.
I'm thinking about giving this a go and see what happens. It's still a TON cheaper than replacing my h/u.
ummduh said:
The one I posted says it does charge @2A.
My other question is: What controls the audio volume when you use a DAC?
My biggest issue is even with the volume maxed on my N4, my h/u sees very low input volume, and I have to nearly max out my h/u's volume to get anywhere, which induces a lot of clipping and distortion.. Which is bad.
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Re: volume control, it depends. Some have some kind of volume control on the DAC, but most don't. With most music players you just control the volume as usual from the phone. Usually the output is louder than it would be otherwise, but particularly clarity at high volume. Considering your description, I think you'd notice even more of a benefit from using UAPP - the volume is controlled by a slider on the "now playing" screen (there's a setting to use the physical volume buttons also, but warns that it will drain much more battery) and it can definitely play music louder overall.
gonna try this as well..
Does a USB OTG kernel capable is required for this?
---------- Post added at 06:34 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:33 PM ----------
http://www.amazon.com/iSimple-Charg...e=UTF8&qid=1427909651&sr=8-1&keywords=JamPort
is this the same product? damn cheaper too.
According to the specs on that page, yes, it's the same product; "IS3301".
And thanks for finding it! I'll pick it up and give it a try and post back, eventually.
Well, got it and installed it.
A few things:
1) Was wrong on being able to switch power. If you don't hook up the power wires, the DAC doesn't power up.
2)Won't work on the Note4 with a stock /rooted Tmobile ROM. Just can't do it. Why? No idea. The USB Audio Pro app doesn't work either.
3)DOES WORK and sounds great with both a Nexus 7 (2012) 4.4.4 and an ASUS ME173X., 4.2.2.
4)Even working on those 2 tablets, it pops up a dialog box saying something to the effect of "No apps that are compatible with this device are installed". Still works anyways, every app I tried played properly through it.
5)Audio is basically ON/OFF. If you adjust the audio volume on the tablet it's all or nothing, no in between.
I'd still like to figure out how to get it working on the Note, tethering the tab to my phone is less than elegant, the ME173x tablet is pitifully slow and horribly unresponsive, and it seems Samsung in their infinite wisdom have also removed BT tethering.
Also not working with Note 4 and the canadian 5.0.1 ROM (chenxiaolong). Argh. Going to try some different cabling, possibly a data only cable, I've read some Samsung phones do weird stuff with USBOTG and charging.
Does anyone have a loose headphone jack? I just got my V40 the other day and when I went to plug in multiple pairs of headphones, they all slipped in easily without any resistance or noticeable click. It produces audio, however if it is slightly moved or rotated, it is enough to pause any playing media. I'm assuming it thinks it's disconnected at that point. Audio is one of the most important features for me. It's a shame I'll probably have to RMA it. Any thoughts on the matter guys? Thanks!
Edit: There is no problem. Apparently I had had to exert more force than I thought should be required. I tried without a case on and was able to fully insert the jack with a fair amount of pressure. After doing so, I put back on the case and was able to use all my headphones. There isn't a lot of clearance, however being firm with the pressure exerted, all my headphones were able to be fully seated. That's one tight Jack! Also, I'll leave a quick review with the headphones I currently have available. On another note, I wish that the audio settings would provide information regarding if the dac/amp is providing high or low gain, as well as offer the ability to toggle it on or off. If you have any questions, feel free to ask.
Tested Headphones (Hi-Fi Quad DAC Enabled):
Meze 11 NEO IRIDIUM (IEMs): Easy to drive (Energy Efficient) - Loud, yet comfortable at volume 50*
Audio-Technica ATH-M50x: Easy to drive (Energy Efficient) - Loud, yet comfortable at volume 50*
Sennheiser HD 6XX: Easy to drive (Energy Efficient) - Loud, yet comfortable at volume 50*
HIFIMAN HE4XX: Harder to drive (Not Energy Efficient) - Still sounds absolutely amazing regardless - Volume at 65 is comfortable, 70 loud, 75 uncomfortably loud
*Recommended highest level of safe listening volume is 50. Once exceeded, you will receive a non-intrusive warning (not a dismissive window) each time saying that higher volume can damage your hearing. Volume limit is 75.
I have been having loose headphone jack issues. I am caseless now and fully seated. I pushed quite hard and am getting a stereo signal. Still quite loose and gets knocked out of the jack with even slight movement with the headphone cable... Quite annoying and not sure if there is a fix for it.
Take a pair of pliers, and flatten the end of a toothpick (I find it helpful, but not really necessary). Then dig around in the jack for lint with the toothpick. I had the exact same problem after about a year, use wired high end phones all the time...apparently over time I packed some pocket lint in there. I had lost the noticeable click and also easily dislodged enough to pause the playback. No problems since cleaning it out. (also might help to turn it upside down while cleaning). I like the toothpick because you can dig around without much risk of damage to the inner components of the 3.5mm jack.