Related
I have to say after having both phones for the last month I'm not that impressed with the Kaiser.
The lack of accelerated drivers alone is a disappointment.
Other things I don't like are:
No Infrared - I'm not sure what the justification for removing this is.. ok it may save a few pence off the cost - and maybe not many people use it.. but for those of us that do its an annoyance.
Keyboard is worse than the TyTN in every way, it feels worse and definitly doesn't work as well. It misses out more keypresses than the TyTN ever did. (I appreciate this could well be a ROM issue but i've tried a few and they all do it.)
Screen presses are ignored a LOT.. compared to the TyTN its absolutly hellish having to whack the screen sometimes for it to respond.
No light (ok it was crap for flash anyways but it was useful with VJCandela as a torch)
Autofocus isn't any better at focussing, its just slower. It's better for macro shots definitly.. and you dont have to manually twist the lever on the back of the phone.. but it certainly isnt up to sony ericsson AF camera standards.
The softkeys are absolutly stupid, if you have big fingers you press start call or end call half the time instead of the softkey purely because of the ridge that runs round the top of the softkeys from the call buttons being too high.
The internal softkeys are also now in a stupid place to make way for the blindingly bright caps lock lights that were not needed..
The phone slides the wrong way making it incompatible with cases and some accessories for the TyTN as well as frustrating to use for a TyTN user.
The stylus is crap compared to the extending one on the TyTN, and again means I cant use the spare ones id bought for the TyTN..
The extra memory and flash space are very nice.. and the GPS is fantastic.. but I'd rather have those 2 features alone bolted onto the hermes hardware..
Way to go HTC.. alienate one of the biggest markets.. I certainly wont be upgrading again in the future before I have a good look at competitors devices..
Some of your points on the touchscreen responsiveness etc are fair, but I think the design and overall build quality of the Kaiser beats the Hermes. The tilting screen is a really nice improvement, and while I can see how the change in orientation might be difficult for some Hermes owners to adjust to, I don't see how it's in any way inferior - just different. I prefer the solid stylus to an extending version too.
It's much better having all the buttons grouped together IMO - everything's within easy reach. I have (I'd say) moderate size fingers, and have no problem there.
Both camera and keyboard performance could be improved, but I think we're getting into the whole, wider driver issue there. I think the Kaiser still has the potential to be much improved, and I'm vaguely hopeful that those improvements will come.
sambartle said:
I have to say after having both phones for the last month I'm not that impressed with the Kaiser.
The lack of accelerated drivers alone is a disappointment.
Other things I don't like are:
No Infrared - I'm not sure what the justification for removing this is.. ok it may save a few pence off the cost - and maybe not many people use it.. but for those of us that do its an annoyance.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its an ancient technology that has been surpassed by both bluetooth and wifi, what could you possibly need to use infrared for these days?
sambartle said:
Keyboard is worse than the TyTN in every way, it feels worse and definitly doesn't work as well. It misses out more keypresses than the TyTN ever did. (I appreciate this could well be a ROM issue but i've tried a few and they all do it.)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I find the keyboard on the Kaiser, sooo much better than on the Hermes, with the Hermes I actually used the onscreen keyboard instead, it was that bad. The kaiser now has a very usable keyboard that is finally comparable with my P990i. With the only exception being the space-bar, which for some reason can press twice (left and right) which is slightly annoying.
sambartle said:
Screen presses are ignored a LOT.. compared to the TyTN its absolutly hellish having to whack the screen sometimes for it to respond.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't have an issue with this at all, screen seems to be the same as it was on the Hermes, perhaps take a look at KaiserTweak, there's a setting in there I think.
sambartle said:
No light (ok it was crap for flash anyways but it was useful with VJCandela as a torch)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agree with you here, a light would have been nice, but only for using it as a torch, useless for taking photos.
sambartle said:
Autofocus isn't any better at focussing, its just slower. It's better for macro shots definitly.. and you dont have to manually twist the lever on the back of the phone.. but it certainly isnt up to sony ericsson AF camera standards.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't really take many pictures, and even less since the camera (due to driver issue) is so bad on the Kaiser, but I will agree, that compared to my P990i, the autofocus is poor.
The softkeys are absolutly stupid, if you have big fingers you press start call or end call half the time instead of the softkey purely because of the ridge that runs round the top of the softkeys from the call buttons being too high.
sambartle said:
The internal softkeys are also now in a stupid place to make way for the blindingly bright caps lock lights that were not needed..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think the complete opposite, I always used to catch them stupid softkeys on the Hermes keyboard, so I am happy they've been moved now
sambartle said:
The phone slides the wrong way making it incompatible with cases and some accessories for the TyTN as well as frustrating to use for a TyTN user.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I prefer having the d-pad on the left (even though I'm right handed), and thus have no issue with the sliding of the phone, it doesn't take long to get used to, and I don't own any accessories affected by this.
sambartle said:
The stylus is crap compared to the extending one on the TyTN, and again means I cant use the spare ones id bought for the TyTN..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
FINALLY, HTC did something good, got rid of that god-damn awful stylus from the Hermes, that was the worst stylus I'd ever used. P990i and Kaiser, have much better non-extending ones.
I have to disagree with the OP.
The Kaiser is heads and tails and improvement over the Hermes.
Agreed, the keyboard is one step down in some respects, but umm...that is about it.
It is a solid device with a high end feel. The Tytn is the VW of smartphones, Kaiser is when you walked across the parking lot to the Audi dealership
sambartle said:
I have to say after having both phones for the last month I'm not that impressed with the Kaiser.
The lack of accelerated drivers alone is a disappointment.
Other things I don't like are:
No Infrared - I'm not sure what the justification for removing this is.. ok it may save a few pence off the cost - and maybe not many people use it.. but for those of us that do its an annoyance.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Like posted before me, it's an ancient technology. Why IR when you have bluetooth? Plus, you knew about the phone not having IR, so, technically, it's your fault for buying the device and complaining about not having an IR.
Keyboard is worse than the TyTN in every way, it feels worse and definitly doesn't work as well. It misses out more keypresses than the TyTN ever did. (I appreciate this could well be a ROM issue but i've tried a few and they all do it.)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't use the built-in keyboard much so I can't comment much but the times I have used it, I have felt no difference between 8525 and Tilt.
Screen presses are ignored a LOT.. compared to the TyTN its absolutly hellish having to whack the screen sometimes for it to respond.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I do not have this problem at all.
No light (ok it was crap for flash anyways but it was useful with VJCandela as a torch)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Never cared for it (for taking pictures or flashlight).
Autofocus isn't any better at focussing, its just slower. It's better for macro shots definitly.. and you dont have to manually twist the lever on the back of the phone.. but it certainly isnt up to sony ericsson AF camera standards.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agree with you there, but, then again, I have my digital camera for taking pictures.
The softkeys are absolutly stupid, if you have big fingers you press start call or end call half the time instead of the softkey purely because of the ridge that runs round the top of the softkeys from the call buttons being too high.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No problems here!
The internal softkeys are also now in a stupid place to make way for the blindingly bright caps lock lights that were not needed..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am ok with the placements (better than 8525/Hermes).
The phone slides the wrong way making it incompatible with cases and some accessories for the TyTN as well as frustrating to use for a TyTN user.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Again, you knew about the design before buying it, so, you cannot complain.
The stylus is crap compared to the extending one on the TyTN, and again means I cant use the spare ones id bought for the TyTN..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The stylus is WAYYYYYY BETTEEERRR than the telescoping one in 8525/Hermes.
The extra memory and flash space are very nice.. and the GPS is fantastic.. but I'd rather have those 2 features alone bolted onto the hermes hardware..
Way to go HTC.. alienate one of the biggest markets.. I certainly wont be upgrading again in the future before I have a good look at competitors devices..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Completenutter2 said:
I prefer having the d-pad on the left (even though I'm right handed), and thus have no issue with the sliding of the phone, it doesn't take long to get used to, and I don't own any accessories affected by this.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Never thought about this really but now I've looked at it, the left handed D-pad when in landscape is more compatible with a gaming joypad and, as I am right handed, I dont have to shuffle the stylus around in my hand to use it!!
HTC and ergonomics...Whatever next!!
Overall I find the Kaiser an improvent on the Hermes, with a couple of notable exceptions:
-The slightly inferior keyboard (but I've adapted to it)
-The idiotic door on the mico-sd port. You need tweezers to open it. What was wrong with the spring loaded slot on the Hermes?
-The soft reset switch on the Kaiser is too close to the delicate mini USB port. It is very easy to accidentally jam the stylus into the USB port and render the phone completely worthless.
IMO the non-telescoping stylus is a HUGE improvement over the Hermes. Give it a few months and those telescoping styli become loose or end up expanding to their full length on their own for no reason. The Kaiser stylus sits nice and flush with the corner of the case, yet the 'nub' is big enough that you don't have to use tweezers or ruin your fingernails trying to dig it out of the silo.
lcohen999 said:
It is a solid device with a high end feel. The Tytn is the VW of smartphones, Kaiser is when you walked across the parking lot to the Audi dealership
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And paid more for the same car?
Sorry, I like Audi, but to me you don't get your money's worth over VW.
So I think your comparison is right on. The Tytn II, seems like it should be better, and you paid more for it, but after all is said and done, it's not really worth the extra cash.
my 8525 was free and so was my tilt so i feel the price was worth it. ha!
FWIW the Kaiser is streets ahead of the Hermes.
The Hermes was a huge leap forward from the Wizard, and the Kaiser is another leap forward again.
Of course if mine didnt scroll or actually do what I wanted when I wanted it to then I might feel differently...
jgermuga said:
And paid more for the same car?
Sorry, I like Audi, but to me you don't get your money's worth over VW.
So I think your comparison is right on. The Tytn II, seems like it should be better, and you paid more for it, but after all is said and done, it's not really worth the extra cash.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
A3 vs GTi
no comparison (I'm sure you can guess what I drive)
lcohen999 said:
A3 vs GTi
no comparison (I'm sure you can guess what I drive)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
OH..got an A3 as my business car last trip back to the UK...Was like Sh*t off of the preverbial shovel (as we say in Yorkshire!).
Loved that week...Mmmmm!
Soz, was drooling there...
Back to my basic Murano...
Eos vs A4 Cabriolet, $7,500 less + DSG and a hard top with sunroof (no quatro option though).
Guess which I drive?
jgermuga said:
Eos vs A4 Cabriolet, $7,500 less + DSG and a hard top with sunroof (no quatro option though).
Guess which I drive?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
SOD OFF!! hate these people with nice cars....
OOps..anyone think we have gone off topic a bit here...
sambartle said:
No Infrared - I'm not sure what the justification for removing this is.. ok it may save a few pence off the cost - and maybe not many people use it.. but for those of us that do its an annoyance.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Generally I love the Kaiser (as I'm sure some know from a certain thread!) and I have no way to compare it to the Hermes. But I do have to agree on the IR thing. It was great for quick file transfers and Activesync. OK so I have now spent a day fiddling with the Kaiser and got my laptop and it working just as well over bluetooth but it was still nice as a backup incase the USB ever failed as you can't establish a new partnership over bluetooth, only IR / USB. Another thing I did use IR for was as a remote shutter release for my camera. Bit of hacking and it saved me UK£25 on buying the proper remote. So there are still applications for IR.
Also the camera flash(light). I came from the HTC Universal which had these things too.
Overall, I knew what the Kaiser had, what it didn't and made my choice with that info so I can't complain, just agreeeing with the OP on a couple of points that I can relate too.
Oh, and I drive a Vauxhall (GM) car, never bought into buying a badge! (though you could buy a Skoda, it's the same car, just a lower purchase price!)
Steve-C said:
Generally I love the Kaiser (as I'm sure some know from a certain thread!) and I have no way to compare it to the Hermes. But I do have to agree on the IR thing. It was great for quick file transfers and Activesync. OK so I have now spent a day fiddling with the Kaiser and got my laptop and it working just as well over bluetooth but it was still nice as a backup incase the USB ever failed as you can't establish a new partnership over bluetooth, only IR / USB. Another thing I did use IR for was as a remote shutter release for my camera. Bit of hacking and it saved me UK£25 on buying the proper remote. So there are still applications for IR.
Also the camera flash(light). I came from the HTC Universal which had these things too.
Overall, I knew what the Kaiser had, what it didn't and made my choice with that info so I can't complain, just agreeeing with the OP on a couple of points that I can relate too.
Oh, and I drive a Vauxhall (GM) car, never bought into buying a badge! (though you could buy a Skoda, it's the same car, just a lower purchase price!)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Totally agree with all your points on the Kaiser Steve, as to be honest, I TOO miss the IR for its compatibility to Vcard transfer to people with older phones.
A Skoda???
Audi A4 £23k, VW Passat £19k, Skoda Octavia £14k. Same floorpan, engine, errr everything really. Is a badge really worth £9,000?! (And the Skoda comes with a flappy paddle gearbox as standard...) Off topic...nah!
IMO the d-pad is muuuuch better than the tytn's. the only thing i was missing when i've started using Kaiser was the comm-manager button,
but with Hbutton it's no big deal to map another key to Comm-Manager.
I never liked the Email and Internet button at the top...now i'm quiet happy with all buttons in one place...
No need for flashlight...never used, and if i ever use, plamp would be enough bright i think.
And the Keyboard feels much better with the fingers...just love it...
my car: opel omega..... no further comment...
My biggest form factor nit compared to the 8125 is that the stylis needs to be retrieved from the left side while the keyboard is open, which makes it difficult to pull out if you are right handed as your left hand is in the way. On the 8125, it was in the upper right hand corner while the keyboard was out and pulling the stylis was very handy. Not sure how the 8525 was set up, but I think it was the same as the 8125, right?
Besides that, the 8125 had stereo speakers, which I sometimes used for music but really made the most difference when on a speaker phone call. And the normal 2.5" headphone jack was a plus. Why HTC does not include a USB adapter (which csot more to ship than the purchase price) is beyond me. It's like someone said, "Hey, let come up with a proprietary headphone jack so that no one can use a third party headset without buying an adapter, which we don't even sell???
Do they think they are Apple or sumthin?
I knew that would be a controversial post..
I actually agree that the D-Pad on the left is better... However.. the phones crap for playing games anyways.. and once they had ruined it on the hermes i'd have preferred it to stay how it was as I was used to it and my accessories would have worked.
I'm now wondering if the reason my screen is so poor compared to the hermes is something to do with the screen protector then if no one else sees it as a problem, I used a custom crystal-clear harder more plastic one on the hermes.. on the kaiser I used the one supplied with the phone (the crappy rubbery plastic one supplied in the box - im not sure if it comes with all tytn2's or if Orange add it), maybe that is in some way affecting the screen?
The stylus I might get used too.. but at the moment I definitely prefer the thicker one from the tytn and never had any problems with it coming loose (though I lost a few from putting them down and walking off)
Infrared is useful for all kinds of things.. I can use it to talk to older phones, older laptops for a modem connection, servers for a terminal.. all sorts of stuff. Its almost essential. I didn't actually know until the first time I tried to use it that it wasn't there!! Its a shocking ommission in my eyes.
Its like removing the dvd drive from every pc and saying yes dvd's are old you should all burn and use hddvd or bluray now.
The build quality is better, or feels it.. but I think time will tell how robust the hinge is, it certainly doesn't look as strong as the hermes fixing..
I recently purchased a Sprint Samsung Galaxy Tab 7 and whenever I try to draw anything other than a horizontal or vertical line it is very wavy. It makes using a handwritten note taking app that works fine on my Viewsonic G Tablet almost unusable on the Sansung GTab. Can any of you draw angled lines reasonable straight or do I possibly have a bad tablet? If I try to draw a line at a 45 deg angle it is extremely wavy regardless of how careful I am in trying to make it straight. It does this on various programs I've tried. Attached is an example from 'Note Everything'.
Can't somebody tell me if their Tab behaves the same or differently than mine? I guess I may have to make the trip to a store to see if a demo unit does the same thing as mine.
Hi,
You are not alone with this problem. This is the good news but unfortuately I bad news is there is no known solution. Make a search with screen shaking you will find more people complaining about this.
Cheers
altugk said:
Hi,
You are not alone with this problem. This is the good news but unfortuately I bad news is there is no known solution. Make a search with screen shaking you will find more people complaining about this.
Cheers
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for your response. That is unfortunate. One of the main reasons I purchased the Galaxy Tab was to take notes with a stylus using TabNotes and the screen doesn't work well with either finger or stylus. It works very well on my Viewsonic G Tablet but the 10.1" screen is a little to big and the portrait viewing angles are really bad. Thanks for the tip on searching for 'screen shaking', I tried a bunch of other terms and couldn't find anything so I'll give that a try.
tjrhine said:
Thanks for your response. That is unfortunate. One of the main reasons I purchased the Galaxy Tab was to take notes with a stylus using TabNotes and the screen doesn't work well with either finger or stylus. It works very well on my Viewsonic G Tablet but the 10.1" screen is a little to big and the portrait viewing angles are really bad. Thanks for the tip on searching for 'screen shaking', I tried a bunch of other terms and couldn't find anything so I'll give that a try.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's what I thought I will do to, take notes...
Here is a quick sample from my tab...
ahmadshawki said:
That's what I thought I will do to, take notes...
Here is a quick sample from my tab...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Your sample looks a little better than mine. I think I will try to find a store in my area that has a demo unit so I can do a side by side comparison.
Have you had good success using your tab for note taking?
tjrhine said:
Your sample looks a little better than mine. I think I will try to find a store in my area that has a demo unit so I can do a side by side comparison.
Have you had good success using your tab for note taking?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No. I tried like 7 different apps, but no one worked like I hoped. I even tried two different styli but still, I find swype to be easier and faster.
I'm running Overcome Gold 2.0 by the way, may be that's why it is a little bit different.
I just got my refurb sprint tab from woot. I have the same problem. Bummer.
Hi all,
I was wondering how frequently everyone is using their S-pen here and if they feel its actualyl helpful/gimmick, as I never had a note before and soon be getting the note 4.
Furthermore, how useful do you find fingerprint scanner note 4 compared to the iphone button one.
feedback will be appriciated!
I used to think it was gimmicky until I got my note 12.2 tablet where the s pen is invaluable.
Which tempted me to this phone and again I find myself using it all the time purely because it is so much more accurate than my finger.
Only thing is mine seems to be so sensitive that I can't type with it using googles keyboard without typing multiple letters at a time, minor annoyance.
Sent from my SM-N910F
love to use the S Pen . It's So accurate and easy to use. | likto write with it because in landscape I'm faster with writing then with typing
soulfrigger said:
love to use the S Pen . It's So accurate and easy to use. | likto write with it because in landscape I'm faster with writing then with typing
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
During the day, I virtually never use it, especially if I'm in a rush, but at home I've found value in it.
0k while I'm driving I can't use it =D
Definitely a gimmick, but a really well made and presented gimmick at that.
I've found myself using s-note every time now to write lists and memos, pinning them to the homescreen, so the gimmick has come to life although previously I was happy with Google Keep (which is s-pen friendly) and will probably drift back to that for lists especially.
oursoul said:
Definitely a gimmick, but a really well made and presented gimmick at that.
I've found myself using s-note every time now to write lists and memos, pinning them to the homescreen, so the gimmick has come to life although previously I was happy with Google Keep (which is s-pen friendly) and will probably drift back to that for lists especially.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not a gimmick. Use it a lot more than when I had the Note 2 3 and 8., I use it for business.
I use the pen for everything. Hardly ever use my fingers.
I couldn't live without it. I use it for making notes and I use it for sketching and painting.
For me it's essential. I've had Note 10.1 for years now and wrote hundrends on pages (notes at university and at work) on it. I bought Note 4 because of the stylus and I have already moved to it for taking notes. I recommend LectureNotes - it takes a bit of configuration to work great on such high resolution screen (you have to make the default pens much, much thicker) but then it is better than S Note (it has folders for example).
Never use the Pen... even on my Note Pro. You can't really write with it like a normal pen, and I can't think of a use outside of that.
The fingerprint scanner works if you register the same finger 3 times, and you're not in a hurry or haven't been swimming/shower.
If you're calm the success rate is 80%, as soon as you're in a hurry to unlock the phone success rate goes down to 40%.
Personally, I was quite surprised at how much it IS like a normal pen, particularly with the palm rejection on most Samsung apps. Plus putting a Spigen Crystal screen protector on gave it a little bit more drag and made it even better. In terms of writing quality, my handwriting is not as neat as on paper, but for scribbly notes that doesn't matter!
There are two reasons I bought the Note 4:
1. I just started Uni a month ago, and I didn't want to spend half of my living funds on paper. Plus its handy having literally all of your notes on you, all the time.
2. I am the kind of person that thinks of something that I need to do later, but rather than get a piece of paper and write it down, I just tell myself that I'll remember. Obviously my memory isn't that good so I always forget, but with a pen attached to your phone its really satisfying to add it to an S Note.
No regrets moving from a stock Nexus 5 to TouchWiz!
I use the Spen almost all the time, it is far more accurate than my fat fingers and using the handwriting recognition is getting better every day as I use it, it also gives me a way to work on my handwriting to make it legible as until recently even I couldn't read my own writing.
And the Fingerprint scanner works all the time unless I have something on my finger
I don't use it much, but I really like it when I need it. I mainly find myself using it on non mobile websites that have hover menu's. It's also good for the odd time I need to make a quick 'note' or maybe grab a picture from something.
For clarity I use the S Pen for UI and multi tasking but taking notes for hours I use the Wacom Bamboo Feel pen. Also if you don't know Microsoft OneNote works well on Samsang Galaxy Note devices for viewing as well as input.
---------- Post added at 09:42 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:38 AM ----------
See here for thread on stylus option http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2910462
rayone said:
Never use the Pen... even on my Note Pro. You can't really write with it like a normal pen, and I can't think of a use outside of that
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually you can. I wrote hundreds of pages on my Note 10.1. If you are finding it difficult to write make sure: 1) you use the rubber ending (default in newer Notes), 2) try using a larger pen (although they are pricy).
This is yet another very subjective question, with thousands of variables... for me, I use the S-Pen more every day. I don't work at a desk most of the day. I have lots of random thoughts and lots of small little notes that I take. IE, jotting down a quick note every time I see a small project I want to add to one of my staff's work list for that day (I find writing it down when I notice it, rather than trying to recall it when I am actually leaving my directions for the next shift to be a huge benefit). I also do a lot of jotting down of things to find in the stockroom. I used to write notes on my hands with item numbers, etc. Short little notes I might only need for a few seconds. The ability to jot them down and have them at the ready has saved me lots of time... (I also found that the writing notes on your hand, or on the back of another note, or even on a box, doesn't work when you don't have a pen in your pocket!)
So for me, it has value and would definitely be missed without it. Its a decision making feature for me that will keep me with the Note line so long as it exists.
Calibrated for right handed people. That's crap, if you're leftie, and no way to switch or recalibrate. Really messes with my writing and drawing
Sent from my SM-N910W8
I use s-pen all the time for navigation but not for handwriting though. It is sooooo nice to have s-pen sensitive back and menu buttons! Any tip on using s-pen for home or invoking dock/apps?
I never used the S-Pen before, but now, with the Note 4, I use it very frequently! It kinda acts like a mouse for Web browsing, which is fantastic!
Sent from my SM-N910F using XDA Free mobile app
960 FPS video showing OnePlus 5 display refreshing inverted compared to Pixel XL &S8+
The 57 second video is scrolling with the OP5. Notice how it refreshes bottom-to-top, opposite of how it should be refreshing.
The 35 and 34 second videos are the Pixel XL and Galaxy S8+, refreshing top-to-bottom, as they should be.
https://goo.gl/photos/mEWJenLE6hDy1ZWt5
XDA confirmation:
https://www.xda-developers.com/conf...ay-upside-down-likely-reason-jelly-scrolling/
Into the trash the OP5 goes!
Oh no... I was hoping for a software fault but that... [emoji47]
If you watch some disassembly videos you will see that the screen on the OP5 sits upside down comparing to OP3 and other manufacturers.
Between all the statement and confirmations I am still not sure what to do I have 4 days left to send it back. I am still love this phone for all other part but the jelly one is just annoying and we still don't know if this is fixable in any way. In one way OnePlus says it's natural and normal and in the other way we hear from the support that they "work" on it !. It is getting me more and more on my nerves.
CroW_D said:
Between all the statement and confirmations I am still not sure what to do I have 4 days left to send it back. I am still love this phone for all other part but the jelly one is just annoying and we still don't know if this is fixable in any way. In one way OnePlus says it's natural and normal and in the other way we hear from the support that they "work" on it !. It is getting me more and more on my nerves.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
FYI return period begins when you actually received the device in the mail. :good:
CroW_D said:
Between all the statement and confirmations I am still not sure what to do I have 4 days left to send it back. I am still love this phone for all other part but the jelly one is just annoying and we still don't know if this is fixable in any way. In one way OnePlus says it's natural and normal and in the other way we hear from the support that they "work" on it !. It is getting me more and more on my nerves.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
support words cannot be 100% taken..
the official statement from oneplus says clearly that nothing will be done to deal with the issue..
so its decision time indeed..
Ascertion said:
FYI return period begins when you actually received the device in the mail. :good:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Really I thought from the day that I purchase ! Is there on the official site a statement that it begins with the receive of the device ?.
I don't have this issue at all on my Phone... it's likely that you guys got a defective unit. Return and get another one!
CroW_D said:
Between all the statement and confirmations I am still not sure what to do I have 4 days left to send it back. I am still love this phone for all other part but the jelly one is just annoying and we still don't know if this is fixable in any way. In one way OnePlus says it's natural and normal and in the other way we hear from the support that they "work" on it !. It is getting me more and more on my nerves.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There is a possibility of fixing it i.e if Oneplus decides to ask Samsung for a different fw for the displays, unlikely it's going to happen though.
i'm glad i dont notice/have this issue on my OP5 - love the device so far, coming from a note 3
Do u have to pay the shipping costs if u return the device?
Nitemare3219 said:
The 57 second video is scrolling with the OP5. Notice how it refreshes bottom-to-top, opposite of how it should be refreshing.
The 35 and 34 second videos are the Pixel XL and Galaxy S8+, refreshing top-to-bottom, as they should be.
https://goo.gl/photos/mEWJenLE6hDy1ZWt5
XDA confirmation:
https://www.xda-developers.com/conf...ay-upside-down-likely-reason-jelly-scrolling/
Into the trash the OP5 goes!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've posted a thread of the OP5 and OP3 with a photo taken through polarised sunglasses where the 5 has all the whites separated into colours and the 3 does not (nor has any other amoled I've owned)
Also, the comparison you show is excellent. There's something up with this phone and I am certain to return it (mainly as I can't look at it wearing sunglasses!)
What's annoying for me is that I haven't received the phone cause I love in Trinidad and I'm getting the phone next two weeks
I don't understand this issue. Whether you refresh from top to bottom or bottom to top, depending upon which direction you are scrolling to, you will see a slight repaint of the screen as the text from previous paint faints. What's the problem? The slowmo videos from OP show the same effect for Samsung galaxy phone. So, all phones will show this depending on which direction you scroll (as long as its the opposite of the repaint direction). Are you telling me that you only scroll in one direction on your phones?
Has anyone tried speeding up/slowing down animations (in developer options) to see if this effect is reduced/increased?
devsk said:
I don't understand this issue. Whether you refresh from top to bottom or bottom to top, depending upon which direction you are scrolling to, you will see a slight repaint of the screen as the text from previous paint faints. What's the problem? The slowmo videos from OP show the same effect for Samsung galaxy phone. So, all phones will show this depending on which direction you scroll (as long as its the opposite of the repaint direction). Are you telling me that you only scroll in one direction on your phones?
Has anyone tried speeding up/slowing down animations (in developer options) to see if this effect is reduced/increased?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Our phones are designed in a way that most of the scroll is done from top to bottom because informations are listed from top to bottom. So yes, it will be a lot more noticeable with a refresh from bottom to top than with one from top to bottom.
It could also be linked to the fact that our brain are used to devices refreshing from top to bottom.
Nitemare3219 said:
The 57 second video is scrolling with the OP5. Notice how it refreshes bottom-to-top, opposite of how it should be refreshing.
The 35 and 34 second videos are the Pixel XL and Galaxy S8+, refreshing top-to-bottom, as they should be.
https://goo.gl/photos/mEWJenLE6hDy1ZWt5
XDA confirmation:
https://www.xda-developers.com/conf...ay-upside-down-likely-reason-jelly-scrolling/
Into the trash the OP5 goes!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Maybe it is just me but what does the placement of a screen has to do with this.
If I use a iPad etc I use it in all ways upside down on the side and I never notice it . Having that said if I use my phone upside down it should work normal?
I also have a oneplus 5 and I come from a oneplus 3 and I never notice a thing what is mentioned here. If the problem was that obvious don't you think everybody would complain and the media would burn oneplus ?
Also asked my wife and she owns a s7 edge and does not feel or see any difference.
snippem said:
Maybe it is just me but what does the placement of a screen has to do with this.
If I use a iPad etc I use it in all ways upside down on the side and I never notice it .
I also have a oneplus 5 and I come from a oneplus 3 and I never notice a thing what is mentioned here. If the problem was that obvious don't you think everybody would complain and the media would burn oneplus ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not sure how you think they haven't been burned. Tens of thousands of people have read and seen the issue on here, Reddit, and OnePlus forums. I pretty much guarantee your device has it. You're just not sensitive to the issue.
Nitemare3219 said:
I'm not sure how you think they haven't been burned. Tens of thousands of people have read and seen the issue on here, Reddit, and OnePlus forums. I pretty much guarantee your device has it. You're just not sensitive to the issue.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And how sensitive do you have to be to notice this so called bug.
What do I have to do to notice the yelly bug.
I find this one of the weirdest comments ever assuming I have it to but I am not sensitive enough.
And how many are tens of thousands I read a lot on XDA and a bit on the oneplus forum.
And I see a lot of the same users posting messages about this.
But anyway luckily I am not as sensitive as you and no I do not feel offended more blessed haha
Few minutes before seeing the videos in this thread I was already thinking about the fact that it is probably an issue with screen scanning and the fact that, because of the extra code in the driver, some sort of inverted screen scanning (similar to what you have in CRT displays) is happening.
On another note, I noticed the same effect with my Sony Z5 compact when rotating the screen 180 degrees and it's not that bad. I actually like the effect! If gives the interface a funny extra animation.
Just my two cents...
Nitemare3219 said:
The 57 second video is scrolling with the OP5. Notice how it refreshes bottom-to-top, opposite of how it should be refreshing.
The 35 and 34 second videos are the Pixel XL and Galaxy S8+, refreshing top-to-bottom, as they should be.
https://goo.gl/photos/mEWJenLE6hDy1ZWt5
XDA confirmation:
https://www.xda-developers.com/conf...ay-upside-down-likely-reason-jelly-scrolling/
Into the trash the OP5 goes!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Watching carefully, i can notice jelly on the pixel and s8, too!
Dear XDA community I am very tempted to buy the tab s8 but i may need your help to understand whether this device is for me.
I bought a Tab S 8.4 waaaaay back in 2014 and I have been using it happily ever since. Before buying a tablet i thought that tablets were mostly productive devices rather than glorified phones with a bad camera. The tab s was an amazing device for what it was (especially at 350€) but i quickly found out that it couldn't do most things that I wanted it to do.
It couldn't be truly used to write documents due to the castrated mobile office apps
It couldn't be used for true multitasking (multi window worked only for selected special apps which most of the time where not the one I used)
External monitors could go only up to 1080p 30Hz and had way worse colors and i couldn't charge my device while displaying something on a TV
There is no concept of "running apps" infact every app except for the one i was using was just closed after a while, it has happened to me to actually loose edits on documents or comments.
Laggy alt tab and more in general laggy UI (yes even when it was new. In fact I'm quite sure it's more responsive now without all the Samsung bloats)
Instant throttling due to extremely poor thermal solution
Updated only twice and each update gave me worse and worse performance.
Now the reason why I didn't upgrade so far is because tablets just didn't inspire fun anymore. I tried iPads but they were not even capable of coping some files in background without errors. Windows tablets unfortunately have just eighter bad performance or impossible prices (really you could spend 3000+€ on a flimsy quad-core just to have as little as 16gb of ram, which truly i the minimum for windows). Chrome os tablets just don't exist, most have 4gb of ram and the ones with a decent build qualty like the HP x2 have massively under-powered internals. This is a shame because they are now supported for 8 years and i really value long term support. Then i took a look back at android and saw a graveyard of devices built to be trashed after one year and never updated.... except for one that suffered from chronic underfuned development: the tab S. Even that though was not as impressive as the original version. It had barely more ram, extremely inflated price, still no decent apps.
Now i wonder has all of this changed for the Tab S8?
I write less documents so may be able to withstand a crappy office suite.
8gb of ram finally a decent size although the phone i have in my pocket already has 8gb of ram and i bought it 6 years ago so i wonder if that little amount of ram will doom the tab S8 to be trashed in a couple of years.
External monitors seems to be decently handled by dex but I've read that it supports only 1440p60....... which seems strange because 4k monitors are very cheap..... like I litterally bought mine for 250€ to replace an old 1280x1024p75 and the difference is amazing. That alone if it is true is a reason to not buy the tab. I don't pretend to do video editing on it but device that costs as much as a semi decent laptop and cannot fulfill basic computer tasks like browsing on a big screen would be a no go. Also it is not clear whether dex supports window snapping, fast alt tab, and persistent applications that don't close without my permission.
Is the UI still bloated? I've read some reviews that when switching from one app to the other the animation can drop a lot of frames and the alt tab stutters. I was really hoping that after so many years that would not be even thought to be possible anymore.
Also about throttling: i've read that samsung gave up on not making it throttle so they under-clocked it to keep the thermals within a controlled range.
For what concerns the 4 years of support i wonder: does that mean true support and updates or i will receive updates 9-10 months later than google devices with a final bloated update that cripples the device?
NO HEADPHONE JACK? really? on a device that is supposed to be productive?
16/9 aspect ratio..... so they put a screen to watch cat videos on a 700-1200€ product....it makes me wonder why not a more normal 3/2 or 4/3.
Also it seems that if i want a screen that is not worse than the one i already have in my very old tablet I need to pay 200€ more and have a bigger device that is heavier and less confortable to hold. Also i've seen online that when you activate the night mode on the TFT display the colors become way worse.
One thing that really interests me is the S pen.
The idea of properly taking notes and drawing on a device like this puts me in a position where I am very willing to try and see how the experience of using it is.
Are there some decent drawing apps? Paid ones as well as long as it is a one time payment and not a lifelong rental.
Do you know if there are some programs that recognize hand writing to transform it to computer words?
Guys sorry if I am criticizing a bit. I really don't want to offend anyone. I was just looking for some help to select a decent device. Thank you, i hope you understand.
Hello! use S8 ultra.Everybody think is the best tablet.
Well s8 ultra is really good, I own one and I can even run desktop mode of dex straight onto my s8 ultra. Without needing tv or so.
Also screen is biggest one ever as a OLED one. Next I like is that it's smooth and hardly lags for me at all.
I use the Tab S8+ as an upgrade over my Tab S4 from a few years ago and I'm just saying that I'm never looking back. The bigger screen is amazing for media consumption, drawing, editing (whether it's photo or video), multitasking, etc. I don't output to a monitor or TV very often, but if I do, the experience is pretty good. Dex has come a long way over the past couple of generations and device revisions and is almost good enough to be a laptop replacement (for some, not for all though). I'd only recommend the Ultra if you SERIOUSLY need double the ram, a bigger screen ( 2.2" bigger than the S8+, 3.6" bigger than the S8), and the second forward-facing camera. The performance is practically the same for all three Tab S8s, the only difference being the size, cameras, and ram. 8GB is enough for most people, but if you genuinely need more, then I'd spring for the S8U, but if not, then either the S8 or S8+ is perfectly fine. I chose the S8+ for the bigger, more vibrant, super AMOLED screen. After daily driving a device with an OLED screen, I can't go back to LCD, but I've heard the TFT LCD on the S8 is pretty good for being an LCD. You do miss those deeper blacks and some color fidelity though.
Edit: I thought I should answer a few of your questions and address some of your concerns.
- The UI is still pretty bloated (especially if you have an S8 with 5G capabilities like Verizon), but it's a lot more manageable than before. You can disable a lot of apps that you don't plan on using, as well as uninstalling their updates, not allowing them to change system permission or have any permissions at that, or even straight-up hide them from the app drawer if you're using the OneUI Home launcher. You can even remove them via ADB commands if you hook your tablet to a PC as long as you input the right commands.
- The aspect ratio of all Tab S8s is 16:10, not 16:9. The tablets are a little wider to account for that. As a result, it's not going to cover the entire screen when outputting to an external display, and yes, it'll only be at 60hz.
- The Tab S8 line will continue to receive software updates for the next five years (until 2027), so we will probably get the next two or maybe three next versions of Android, as well as semi-frequent security updates and patches. We'll be up to date for quite a while, at least until the next Tab line comes out.
- Not having a headphone jack is one of the main reasons why I didn't spring for the Tab S6 line back in 2020, but times have changed and now I've found pretty reliable alternatives to continue using wired headphones, use the mic attached to those headphones for calls and audio recordings, and to charge at the same time. I'll use the ANKER USB-C Hub mainly for displaying to an external display, but I did use it for simultaneous wired headphones and charging until I got the Stouchi USB-C 3.5mm Headphone and Charging Adapter. This dongle has served me well for some months now and while it can give me some occasional charging issues (mainly due to my poor positioning), it's a quite durable and serviceable dongle. Not to mention that if you ever have issues with it, customer support responds via email very quickly, and has a quite friendly staff team that'll help you out.
- The tablets really aren't as large and unwieldy as many people try and make them out to be. Maybe it's just because I have big hands or have no problem carrying reasonably heavy things, but it's genuinely not that bad. With the specs that are in these newer tablets, I'm surprised that they're not heavier. The S8+ is 1.25 lbs (around 0.6 kg) and is quite thin and quite lighter than it should be given what's inside and how well they perform. Adding the cover case included with the official keyboard for these tablets (not the slim one, as those are one piece as opposed to being made of a magnetic back cover with an S-Pen cover and a keyboard attachment) does add a bit of weight to it, but not enough to cause any sort of strain.
- I use Sketchbook for drawing, but I've been recommended Medibang quite a few times since it has a lot more creative tools that you can use. Both are free as far as I know.
- Samsung Notes has a feature where it can turn words you've written down with the S-Pen into regular text. I believe there's also an S-Pen related app that you can use in its little sub-menu (when you press the button on the S-Pen close to the screen), but if there is, I don't use it very often. I just stick to Samsung Notes since it seems like a dedicated app for exactly this purpose. You can even backup notes you've made to the cloud if you log in to your Samsung account. Quite the handy application if I do say so myself.
It may be a lot to read, but I hope I helped you in your decision a little bit. These are some pretty great (if a little pricy) devices, and any of them would be a great upgrade over your previous (or I suppose current) Samsung tablet.
Also another thing I want to add is that s8 ultra is durable. Since jerryrigeverything did a durability test and even he failed to snap the s8 ultra in half. Like he could with first Ipad pro gen 1 when it was first biggest tablet on the marked.
The Ipad pro broke in half like paper, but when he tried to do same with s8 ultra 14.6 inch he couldn't bend it at all, even if he took all his strength. Yet it wouldn't bend and he was impressed on samsung on managing to build a 14.6 inch tablet that is impossible to bend. He was expecting some bend or breaks on first tablet that big.
Ops double posted my bad.
Was trying to edit post above and for some reason it went double post.
SavXL said:
I'll use the ANKER USB-C Hub mainly for displaying to an external display, but I did use it for simultaneous wired headphones and charging until I got the Stouchi USB-C 3.5mm Headphone and Charging Adapter.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
FYI, I think both your links are borked somehow. Thanks for all the info, though!
Massive thanks to all of you for your replies, especially to @SavXL for the detailed reply.
In the end I decided to give it a try and see what happens.
I choose the 10.4'' size because it is definetly a bump in dimensions and weight compared to the 8.4 i was using. The main bummer is that the screen is a literal downgrade from the one i was using before. Still as you said for an LCD is not bad at all and the colors are decent. It is however true what it was told online in a couple of other places: "turning on the blue light filter totally destroys the screen"... such thing would not happen with an oled.
I went with more storage and with the keyboard cover because there was a 50% discount on both the upgrade and the keyboard. What can I say, the device feels solid however I was worried to scratch the lens without the cover as it is literally rubbing on every surface without a cover. The keyboard is surprisingly nice to type on for what it is, keep in mind that still if used as a desktop attached to a monitor it makes sense to have a 20€ membrane or 60€ mechanical keyboard at least. The difference with the official tablet keyboard is massive. The track-pad is just trash. unfortunately there is no better way to put it. A thinkpad or dell from 2007 will have a better track-pad. With a bluetooth mouse and the touchscreen thankfully the trackpad can be ignored. The software keyboard improved a lot to the point where for now I'm not replacing it with my normal "Swiftkey".
The pen is surprisingly natural to use and surprisingly.... small. It is strange to say because it seems massive from the pictures. But I've noticed it slips while writing a bit more than a normal pen. Maybe i find a "case" for it that increases the diameter and grip but still fits in the space dedicated in the cover. Pen gestures in the air are just a meme so I will not talk about them. Still it is a joy to use.
I didn't try dex in a real way so maybe I write an additional message in the next weeks after I thoroughly try it. For that I will source an adapter and try it on a 4k monitor, I really hope the tab S8 has improved resolution handling..... being limited to HDMI1.4 bandwith in 2022 will not be funny. For what concerns the multi window the limit went from 4 of the original tab S to 3 of the S8 ...... now I get that we have a small screen and it may be stupid to use more than a couple of applications in parallel... but I would like to be the one deciding that on my device. One major annoyance with the split screen support is that when resizing windows the content blurs... hopefully I can find a way to disable that crap because it truly slows down the interaction with the device. In general the multi window behaviour improved a lot, but the way i interact with windows is still strange as if we were still in the windows 3.1 days where we hadn't figured out a way to properly grab windows, resize them, move them, snap them. This awkwardness is a lot reduced by enabling the multiwindow line even on full screeen windows. That helps to feel the environment less forced.
Speaking of slowdowns: I was shocked that after 8 freaking years Samsung didn't manage to have a fluent interface. Don't get me wrong it is mostly fluent but full of small hiccups that I may accept on a cheap underpowered device but not at this price range. There is a lot of preinstalled bloarware, most of it can be removed or disabled so for now I'm accepting it.... after I get more confident with the device I will definetly debloat it.
Alt tab between the last 2 applications takes ages. It takes literally seconds. By disabling all the animations in the developer options the situation becomes a lot better but still the point is that the alt tab works correctly when you want to alt tab between several applications but not when you want to alternate between the last 2. Try on your normal computer. You shouldn't see the list of applications when quickly alt tabbing. If you see that, it then becomes distracting and slows the workflow because then you need a couple seconds more to focus on what you were doing in that app. Continuing with the alt tab I have to find a way to make the recents smaller and/or vertical and/or fit all in the screen. I have no use for big previews that show the content of the app. I opened that app, I am already aware of what I am doing with it. Another problem with the alt tab is that there is no text. If i have 2 documents that look very similar to one another you can bet that they have a different name so I'd rather be able to identify them at a glance rather than squeeze my eyes and play "spot the differences".
The sidebar to quickly open applications in split or floating mode is very handy. I have to use it more to get used to it but for now i can say that i wished the icons were smaller, that there was more compact content, and less "pages". If it takes me more than a couple of seconds to scroll through the pages then I might just as well go to the home screen and do there what I wanted to do. Maybe there is a way to customize it more than what I noticed so far. This seems very much a phone app ported to a tablet rather than a proper tablet app.
I was almost forgetting the fingerpint. It's fast. I'm glad I chose the smaller device for that as well. Under-screen sensors in the past have been slow, though I don't know how much they improved in the past couple of years.
Video calls are great. The front facing camera has a decent contrast and dynamic range, obviously better than windows devices that cost twice as much. It is also positioned as close to my eyelevel as it can be on a small device. I have yet to try the microphone in a proper way but considering I didn't have to raise my voice too much to be heard on the other side it seems good.
On the software side I'm happy. I had a couple of issues with skype where i cannot move the automatic floating window that appears when I go home during a call, dropbox decided to limit me to 3 devices all of a sudden so I will just use google drive from now on. I've downloaded a bunch of drawing apps including the ones suggested by SavXL. so far so good.
In conclusions: Is this device worth it? Yes if you use the pen. Everything else on this device is excellent but not unique. Otherwise If you have a decent phone you could just grab a cheap lapdock or tabdock and you will have an amazing experience. If you want more proper windows or a more proper browsing experience you can grab a chromebook. It will still have the same hikkups in the interface but at least is because you saved some money. What makes this tablet unique is the pen, which is amazing.
Just as a comparison: A modern wacom pen on the left vs the S-Pen on the right. I can assure you that the diameter difference makes it slip more.
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knosso said:
Just as a comparison: A modern wacom pen on the left vs the S-Pen on the right. I can assure you that the diameter difference makes it slip more.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's ironic since I only had one S-Pen before - from the Note 10+, so when I bought the Tab S8 Ultra as my first Samsung tablet, I was surprised it was that big, but what you say definitely makes sense. I would be afraid that putting anything around it semi-permanently would interfere with either the magnetic sticking to the back of the Tab and/or the wireless charging of the S-Pen.
Also with at least the Ultra's Keyboard Cover, it might not allow fully closing the top-hinged portion of the back cover where the S-Pen is.
Of course, an easily removable solution would beat these concerns.
knosso said:
In conclusions: Is this device worth it? Yes if you use the pen.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've been meaning to ask this question: What do people use the pen for? No real guidance in the manual. All I've done with it is keep it charged.
lloydsw said:
I've been meaning to ask this question: What do people use the pen for? No real guidance in the manual. All I've done with it is keep it charged.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I haven't fooled with the Tab S8 Ultra's S-Pen much yet, just experimented with both Samsung's and Google's implementation of handwriting to text conversion. On my Note 10+ which got rid of, I would occasionally sketch out rough ideas for building things or rearranging furniture, etc. I rarely play games but with some games, the S-Pen came in handy as well.
My wife plans on using handwriting to text conversion.
Edit: I'd like to add that from research I've done in the past, Samsung owns patents on several aspects of their styluses which prevent other styluses from being quite as good.
lloydsw said:
I've been meaning to ask this question: What do people use the pen for? No real guidance in the manual. All I've done with it is keep it charged.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Personally I think that literally any function other than the pen can be done by another device better than an android tablet (chromebooks have a real browser, phones are always in your pocket and have good cameras, computers have real applications to do real work) but if you want to paint, sketch, and take notes you don't really have any other option aside from the tab S line and the iPads.
The Remakable is wonderful to take notes but you cannot paint on it. Wacom tablets are amazing to paint but are to do creative work at home with a computer, it would be cumbersome to use them in a park.
If you are in classes or in a meeting and want to take notes but then also be able to sketch something on your free time in a park or cafè then a tablet is a must have.
Personally im not an artist but I'm having tons of fun with medibang paint, ibis paint, sketchbook, and other apps. When i become a bit better at drawing I will invest in Clip Studio Paint.
I wish there was something like premiere rush but for davinci resolve available for our tab s8. Starting my video editing on the tablet with dex to then finish it on a real computer would be amazing. I would hands down pay for that app instead if being forced to rent the adobe suite. If it existed I would be forced to use my pc 10 times less.