Has anyone else noticed [significant] signal degradation when holding their device?
I saw a brief mention of this over on nexus4 sub-reddit where several people confirmed that they were also experiencing this problem, but can't find anything about it on the forums... Long story short, I've found that while the device is resting on my desk (or for later tests - on my bed) I typically have 2-3 bars of HSPA signal. As soon as I pick up the phone I drop to zero bars. Occasionally I'll even drop down into Edge coverage.
So once I noticed this problem I decided to run a series of tests. All tests were performed following a fresh restart of the device and speedtest was the only app I was running. The tests were performed with the device on my bed so that the phone would be 10+ feet away from any other electronic devices. The phone is in an I-Blaison gel case, but I ran speedtest earlier in the night with and without the case and it didn't seem to change the results.
Before/between each test I would let the device sit stationary for approximate 10 seconds to let the signal 'stabilize' and then I'd hit "begin test". Tests were all run off the same server. I ran 3 tests with the phone on the bed, and 3 tests with it in my hand.
Tests # 1, 2, and 3: With the phone flat on the bed I averaged 6.02Mbps down and 1.43Mbps up.
I then 'picked up' the device - I physically kept the phone in the exact same location, but just put it in my right hand with my fingers ever so slightly wrapped around the device. Note - One source I've read stated the problem was worse when the phone was in the user's left hand... but I'll retest some other time if necessary.
Tests # 4, 5, and 6: With the phone in my hand, I averaged 4.86Mbps down with only 0.15Mbps up. Note - The download speed during this test was actually very surprising. Not 5 minutes earlier I had been averaging download speeds in the 0.5-1.5Mbps range while holding the phone in the same physical location... I may have had a better "grip" on the phone during earlier tests (or something like that) so maybe that's why it was slower.
Screenshot of tests 1-6 results here
Test #7 - I also decided to show what would happen if I were to pick up the device in the middle of the upload test. Result screenshot here. You can see that as soon as I picked up the phone the upload rate plummeted (I guess you will have to take my word that I picked up the phone right before the speed plummeted, but that's what happened).
Regarding the 1000ms pings... not sure if that's indicative of anything. My APN settings match the ones that I've seen recommended for android devices on Tmobile. I've heard that some people have said that the high ping may be due to device hardware coming out of 'low power mode' when the test starts... but I'm not sure one way or the other. Regardless, the ping stayed fairly consistent through all tests so it may be a moot point.
Background info - I have Tmobile Prepaid and, according to their site, I'm located in a "good" coverage area where I should expect coverage "outdoors and in some buildings".
I have noticed the exact same issue. At my desk, if the phone lays flat on the desk I have 2 bars of hspa - picking it up drops to zero or edge.
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2
Laying on school desk - 2-3 bars. When i pick it up, 0-1.
>_>
ALL phones do this when you hold them its not a flaw its not a bug.
The iphone 4 design meant you were bridging the external antenna changing its tuning causing dropped cell reception that was abnormal because of design this is an isolated case.
when you touch any phone your causing more attenuation if you grip it tightly your making it even worse cause your blocking the signal; we see these threads every-time a new phone comes out time to stop and learn physics.
ITT people who don't know that objects block / diminish radio waves
/thread should be closed :\
noobdeagle said:
ALL phones do this when you hold them its not a flaw its not a bug.
The iphone 4 design meant you were bridging the external antenna changing its tuning causing dropped cell reception that was abnormal because of design this is an isolated case.
when you touch any phone your causing more attenuation if you grip it tightly your making it even worse cause your blocking the signal; we see these threads every-time a new phone comes out time to stop and learn physics.
ITT people who don't know that objects block / diminish radio waves
/thread should be closed :\
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No issues here. T-Mobile coverage is spotty enough at my house but I have never seen my signal fluctuate after picking it up. I only see noticeable changes in signal when I move around
Sent from my Nexus 7 using xda app-developers app
I noticed it too, just had for two days so far but seems to lower bars when I shift holding it but so far hasn't been too bad.
Sent from my Nexus 4 using xda app-developers app
Currently using it in my hand with full bars hspda ... And always runs like that here. No signal issues that I have seen.
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2
Full bars on desk and full bars in hand BUT double the down speed on speedtest when It's not being handled. Upload speed is the same regardless.
No issues like that with this phone. All phones reduce reception slightly when you pick them up but there's no super problem like the iPhone 4 here. You'd think apple would find other ways to damage the rep of new phones than paying people to come on forums and make stuff up lol
I was experimenting with this too. I have noticed that when I grip the lower half of the phone I get a 2 bar decrease. Contrary when I grip the top half of the phone I do not see this decrease.
This theory works in reverse for WiFi. Grip the top and it decreases WiFi, bottom it does not change.
Test it and see if anyone else cans replicate.
sent from my perfect 32GB Nexus 7
Same with any modern phone.
Cell antennas are at the bottom, as far away from your brain as possible.
WiFi/BT/GPS antennas are at the top. Which is why the above poster notes a drop in signal strength when holding the bottom, and a drop in WiFi strength when holding the top.
Where I work, the mobile signal is so borderline I have to hold any phone near the top to remain in signal, I am well used to this, hah! To type usually means holding the top of the phone with one hand and typing with the other. Normal behaviour when ones signal strength is -115dBm while holding the top!
Antennaegate!!! Nexus style.
I've had this problem with every thin phone since the nexus one. If you're in a really strong area it won't drop any bars. If just an on area it will drop. In my case at home I drop from 3 bars hspa top 0 to 1 when holding it at the bottom. In an area of really strong service I maintain full strength. Sad but true. I force ny phone to edge when at home or work which gives much better reception to help alleviate this.
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2
noobdeagle said:
ALL phones do this when you hold them its not a flaw its not a bug.
The iphone 4 design meant you were bridging the external antenna changing its tuning causing dropped cell reception that was abnormal because of design this is an isolated case.
when you touch any phone your causing more attenuation if you grip it tightly your making it even worse cause your blocking the signal; we see these threads every-time a new phone comes out time to stop and learn physics.
ITT people who don't know that objects block / diminish radio waves
/thread should be closed :\
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Simply not true. Go try a galaxy s3. MUCH harder to lower its signal by gripping it than it is for the N4. In fact I can't even make mine lower at all regardless of how I hold it. Some phones are simply worse in this respect than others and the N4 seems to be pretty bad. My N4 supposedly shipped and should arrive next week, so I'll compare in person.
-Sent from my GS3 running CM10.-
Tried to cover the device with both my hands as much as possible, no degradation of signal, LTE or HSPA+ edit: Mind you, the LTE signal remained at 2 bars like it normally does. HSPA+ was Full bars
This is generally true for companies using the 1900mhz (T-Mobile/Sprint) and is true for all phones. 1900mhz doesn't penetrate objects so well which is why people say once they go inside stores in the mall the signal is gone when on those carriers. ON Verizon, being a 850mhz one, this doesn't happen as much because of the wave length of the frequency, which is why AT&T was also so aggressive about switching 3G to 850mhz. The 700mhz LTE thing being even lower should be better as well so that's why people were buying those up in the FCC auction.
noobdeagle said:
ALL phones do this when you hold them its not a flaw its not a bug.
The iphone 4 design meant you were bridging the external antenna changing its tuning causing dropped cell reception that was abnormal because of design this is an isolated case.
when you touch any phone your causing more attenuation if you grip it tightly your making it even worse cause your blocking the signal; we see these threads every-time a new phone comes out time to stop and learn physics.
ITT people who don't know that objects block / diminish radio waves
/thread should be closed :\
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I understand that all phones will do this to an extent. I also understand that because Tmobile uses a higher frequency signal, they won't be able to offer the building penetration that other carriers can offer with lower frequency signals... but I've just never experienced signal degradation anywhere near this bad, particularly from simply picking up the phone and more or less just resting it on my hand.
Going from a completely usable 6M down and 1.5M up to a fairly useless 0.15M up? That's quite a decrease in performance.
I mean, I also have Sprint and Verizon devices. Verizon is a work phone (blackberry) so I can't test much with that... but sprint only drops maybe one bar while holding the phone with the worst death group I could come up with (completely cupping the phone with both hands, only the screen was uncovered).
I ran this same test with Sprint on my Nexus S. Overall sprint was much slower than Tmobile but it was definitely a bit more resilient against performance degradation after simply picking the phone up... and I have terrible sprint coverage in my area.
phositadc said:
Simply not true. Go try a galaxy s3. MUCH harder to lower its signal by gripping it than it is for the N4. In fact I can't even make mine lower at all regardless of how I hold it. Some phones are simply worse in this respect than others and the N4 seems to be pretty bad. My N4 supposedly shipped and should arrive next week, so I'll compare in person.
-Sent from my GS3 running CM10.-
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Then you should be concerned with how much amplification is going on in the antenna and how close it is to your brain.
Lol.
Look at the diagram below, this is what was given to the FCC by LG. If you don't want to attenuate your cellular signal, keep your hand away from the blue part, which is the bottom of the phone. If you want to avoid throttling your wifi throughput, keep your greasy fingers away from the red part, which is next to the camera flash and power button. This isn't antennagate 2.0. There is nothing on the outside of this phone that will short the antenna, because it's all plastic and glass. Neither of those materials are electrically conductive.
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shotta35 said:
This is generally true for companies using the 1900mhz (T-Mobile/Sprint) and is true for all phones. 1900mhz doesn't penetrate objects so well which is why people say once they go inside stores in the mall the signal is gone when on those carriers. ON Verizon, being a 850mhz one, this doesn't happen as much because of the wave length of the frequency, which is why AT&T was also so aggressive about switching 3G to 850mhz. The 700mhz LTE thing being even lower should be better as well so that's why people were buying those up in the FCC auction.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
All else being equal, that's true, but in practice, AT&T/Verizon put up half as many towers in the sub-GHz range as they do in the AWS/PCS range to take advantage of the fact that sub-GHz signals travel roughly twice as far. Half as many towers is half as much money that needs to be spent on rent, maintenance, utilities, and laying cable. They build the towers are twice as far apart, and therefore penetrate buildings equally poorly in most areas. The sub-GHz will actually be worse because you can't fit as much data into a 850MHz signal as you can with something running at 1700MHz.
phositadc said:
Simply not true. Go try a galaxy s3. MUCH harder to lower its signal by gripping it than it is for the N4. In fact I can't even make mine lower at all regardless of how I hold it. Some phones are simply worse in this respect than others and the N4 seems to be pretty bad. My N4 supposedly shipped and should arrive next week, so I'll compare in person.
-Sent from my GS3 running CM10.-
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Which Galaxy S3? An LTE model? All commercially-sold LTE phones all have multiple receiving antennas, so when you attenuate one, the other is usually clear to receive without interference. You'll still suffer performance penalties, especially in high interference, low signal areas, but in most cases you probably won't notice it.
As you see from my diagram above, there is only one receiving antenna in the Nexus 4, which makes it easier to attenuate. It is, however, possible that there is another receiver, as there are some questions surrounding what LTE capabilities the N4 has and whether or not it's really designed to have LTE enabled OTA when T-Mobile launches it's Band 4 LTE Advanced network next year. However you can still have LTE even if it just has one transceiver, it's just that no one has sold a 1x1 device, and it won't work as well as the 2x2 devices on the market (download speeds will be capped not much higher than what DC-HSPA can manage on 1x1).
Steve Jobs
The fanbois will be all over this if it "gets out"
Related
Title says it. Contemplating purchasing this phone because I want a sick Android device but its plagued with bad 3g reception stories. Is it that big of a deal? Does anyone regret buying the device over it? Is it a design flaw as i have read or software?
mrbox23 said:
... Is it that big of a deal?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No
mrbox23 said:
Does anyone regret buying the device over it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't
mrbox23 said:
Is it a design flaw as i have read or software?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is neither. It is the wireless networks you guys have here in the US that sucks... (At least in El Paso, TX)
I'm tired of people blaming the wireless network, because that's just plain wrong in most cases.
I am a big N1 fan but I will be the first to admit that there's a 3G problem. But here is what I've observed:
- The problem is less evident on the AT&T model, as 3G runs on the same frequencies as 2G, and in general AT&T uses 850/1900, which are lower frequencies (better penetration) than T-Mobile.
- If you're in a very strong 3G area (like on the streets of NYC), you aren't likely to have any problems no matter how you hold the device.
- If you're in somewhat of a sketchy 3G area, and use the T-Mobile version of the phone, it's very possible you're going to drop to edge, if you cover the bottom portion of the phone with your hand. If you have the AT&T version in a sketchy area (low signal overall), it's possible you'll kill your signal entirely if you hold the phone a certain way...but I would say this is very rare.
There's probably a combination of a software and hardware issue causing the 3G issue. With future updates to the radio firmware, I'm sure there will be some improvements, but I don't know if it's going to be as good as some of the other phones available (especially in the case of T-Mobile, where the G1 tends to be fair a lot better 3G wise).
Having said all this - do I regret purchasing an N1? Definitely not - everything else about the phone makes up for the 3G issues, and I still have hope for future improvements.
Reception isn't "deal breaker" bad, and you'll notice there are much less complaints from AT&T users about it. If you are normally in areas with good coverage everything will will be great, but fringe areas might be frustrating. Weak signals are the phones kryptonite.
My question to anyone on the fence is usually, "name a better GSM phone" and then when they say "iPhone" I call them a fanboi. There's nothing worse than being an Apple fanboi.
its not a deal breaker at all. I still hold by my theory that the signal bars are just calibrated less conservatively than other phones, cause I've made and held calls for 15 min with zero bars of 3g showing. even my nokias had trouble doing that.
Sent from my Nexus One using the XDA mobile application powered by Tapatalk
PrawnPoBoy said:
Reception isn't "deal breaker" bad, and you'll notice there are much less complaints from AT&T users about it. If you are normally in areas with good coverage everything will will be great, but fringe areas might be frustrating. Weak signals are the phones kryptonite.
My question to anyone on the fence is usually, "name a better GSM phone" and then when they say "iPhone" I call them a fanboi. There's nothing worse than being an Apple fanboi.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just cause they say the iPhone, doesn't make them an Apple fanboy.. people can have legitimate reason why they like the iPhone more than the Nexus...
There could be something to the theory that the phone just reports reception more conservatively. But then again I can easily drop a call in a low signal area by moving my hand around. This is the first phone I've had that does that.
Just cause they say the iPhone, doesn't make them an Apple fanboy.. people can have legitimate reason why they like the iPhone more than the Nexus...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Spoken like a true fanboi.
PS: I was actually joking. I have a jailbroken iPhone as well and its also awesome.
PrawnPoBoy said:
There could be something to the theory that the phone just reports reception more conservatively. But then again I can easily drop a call in a low signal area by moving my hand around. This is the first phone I've had that does that.
Spoken like a true fanboi.
PS: I was actually joking. I have a jailbroken iPhone as well and its also awesome.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
see i have always had the same problem with my other phones in low signal areas, they would ALWAYS drop the call if i moved my hand over it. but they all had antenna in the bottom, like the nexus. i think if your previous phone had the antenna in the top, then you never would have experienced this before.
my nokia n95 was the last phone i had with a top antenna, it was internal at the top near the camera, and that thing was superb with RF.
but then i got the e71 and the bottom antenna dropped calls when i covered it. no service, all the time. i trained myself to hold at the top ever since.
so the nexus doesnt seem abnormal to me. i just thought it was common knowledge though...
PrawnPoBoy said:
There could be something to the theory that the phone just reports reception more conservatively. But then again I can easily drop a call in a low signal area by moving my hand around. This is the first phone I've had that does that.
Spoken like a true fanboi.
PS: I was actually joking. I have a jailbroken iPhone as well and its also awesome.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I also hope you were joking about the fanboi thing, as the nearest I've come to owning and iPhone was using family members ones for a few hours. My previous phone was a G1, and your misconceptions of me (if your words were not taken out if context) for stating something that is quite true is quite sad.
As stated before, people can have legitimate reasons as to why they favor the iPhone more than the Nexus. If I was sucked in to the iPhone when it was released, I would probably also be an iSheep - luckily I was only 12 at the iPhone's release. Phone technology wasn't really all that interesting yet.. I didn't care about touch screens etc. Now though, I still don't care about the phone much - but it was definitely brought unneeded hate in the internet towards those who adore it.
I love my Nexus One. No 3G issues on ATT, this actually has much better reception than my HTC Tilt2 with the best custom radio rom for my area. Flashing the radio of your Nexus will help a ton if you experience any of these issues so if you plan on flashing your phone don't worry about it. I love my Nexus and I spend much less time screwing with how the phone works and a lot more time using it.
about nexous one
I have never had any 3g problems ever and i bought this phone right when it came out
i love it get it you will to
This is really simple.
1. Buy the phone. If you have bad reception,
2. Flash to the newest radio. If you still have bad reception,
3. Return the phone.
You most likely won't get to step 3.
The phone legitimately does not get great reception.
I lined up, side by side, my BB Bold 9000, my Motorola Milestone, and me Nexus One, all just sitting on the desk, all with Orange (France) 3G SIMs.
The Bold and the Milestone get about the same signal. The Nexus gets consistently -4 to -10 dBm worse signal in any given placement. Wrapping your hand loosely around the phone will cut the signal by from -6 to -10 dBm on the Nexus, and by around -2 to -6 on the other two.
HOWEVER, the statistics don't really matter - I still get good enough signal at my desk on all three of them to download applications, use GTalk/SMS/telephone/browser all day, etc. Yes, a speed test shows generally better speeds on the Milestone, but it is more than good enough on both Android phones.
AND the Nexus is much faster in day-to-day operation. It scrolls faster, loads faster, runs faster, etc. It is almost sure to get updates from Google faster, and the dev community really does rock.
If I was in the US, I would have to consider some of the other phones out there, simply because the other networks are better than GSM networks, but here in France, the Nexus is fine and dandy.
If I were you, I would consider the network as well as the product, because it makes such a huge difference in the US. But once past that point, if you decide Nexus: buy it, test it, if you don't like it, sell it or return it. Easy.
I carried around my iPhone 3G with me the last few days and any time I had bad or no reception with my N1 I would swap the sim card and try the iPhone and without fail the iPhone would alway have more than enough signal strength.
The phone's reception is simply not as good as other phones, but it not enough for me to want to return it. I just hope that HTC learns from this like they did with the recent change to the atmel touchscreen instead of the clearpad component. I'm sure they will.
I've never had a problem with dropping 3G signal exactly, just the occasional instance where it'll get stuck on "uploading." Not sure if that's a T-Mobile issue or a phone issue. Either way, it happens only rarely and lasts no more than 10 seconds or so each time, so not a dealbreaker.
Other than that, the phone is fantastic. Incredibly fast and customizable. People complain that Android isn't user-friendly, but I honestly find everything quite intuitive (with the exception of a few badly designed 3rd-party apps).
I get the same (even better in a few places) 3G reception on my Nexus then I did with my iPhone 3GS
The OP needs to take note of all the people complaining about reception issues have also NOT mentioned whether or not they have updated the radio.
Everybody sitting with the stock radio from the models released in January/early-February are going to have a lot more complaints than someone who has either updated their radio or bought a newer model that has the updated radio preinstalled.
i still say its just a conservatively calibrated signal meter! seems to match my other phones just fine even if the actual bars are showing zero bars, its still making the call and receiving the data. me thinks its just a software calibration difference...
gsvnet said:
I'm tired of people blaming the wireless network, because that's just plain wrong in most cases.
I am a big N1 fan but I will be the first to admit that there's a 3G problem. But here is what I've observed:
- The problem is less evident on the AT&T model, as 3G runs on the same frequencies as 2G, and in general AT&T uses 850/1900, which are lower frequencies (better penetration) than T-Mobile.
- If you're in a very strong 3G area (like on the streets of NYC), you aren't likely to have any problems no matter how you hold the device.
- If you're in somewhat of a sketchy 3G area, and use the T-Mobile version of the phone, it's very possible you're going to drop to edge, if you cover the bottom portion of the phone with your hand. If you have the AT&T version in a sketchy area (low signal overall), it's possible you'll kill your signal entirely if you hold the phone a certain way...but I would say this is very rare.
There's probably a combination of a software and hardware issue causing the 3G issue. With future updates to the radio firmware, I'm sure there will be some improvements, but I don't know if it's going to be as good as some of the other phones available (especially in the case of T-Mobile, where the G1 tends to be fair a lot better 3G wise).
Having said all this - do I regret purchasing an N1? Definitely not - everything else about the phone makes up for the 3G issues, and I still have hope for future improvements.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Bro, you're entire post actually supports the claim that the carriers need to build out their networks more in this country! Obviously if the phone works great in an area like NYC or Chicago, but not so great in "sketchy" places like where I live (Toledo, OH), then IT'S THE NETWORK!
PrawnPoBoy said:
I carried around my iPhone 3G with me the last few days and any time I had bad or no reception with my N1 I would swap the sim card and try the iPhone and without fail the iPhone would alway have more than enough signal strength.
The phone's reception is simply not as good as other phones, but it not enough for me to want to return it. I just hope that HTC learns from this like they did with the recent change to the atmel touchscreen instead of the clearpad component. I'm sure they will.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, I have had the exact opposite experience. I always have a better signal with my N1 than my wife does with her iphone in the same places.
My wife and I used to have identical Nokia handsets, and her signal was always significantly better than mine. Minute manufacturing variations in low power RF devices can make huge differences, and such manufacturing variations are a normal part of any manufacturing process, including cell phones.
Comparing one phone to another and declaring a problem exists with an entire line of phones is just silly.
Basically, there is no real evidence of a unilateral "Nexus One" 3G problem, even if some handsets have less than expected performance.
So if you want a Nexus One, get it, and chances are that if you are happy with your network, you will be happy with your Nexus One.
http://shopping.yahoo.com/articles/...why-consumer-reports-cant-recommend-iphone-4/
I hate to defend the iphone but....
Most phones have similiar issues. Even on the nexus we all love. I lose 3G/cell signal all the time when I cover the lower half of my phone. This is something common on all nexus unless you have 100% awesome signal.
I think this is why this has not been discussed on this part of the forum
1) This is supposed to be about the Nexus One, not the iphone
2) All of us N1 owners know the N1 also has radio problems.
That being said, I'll still say the nexus is the overall best phone there is.
jz9833 said:
I hate to defend the iphone but....
Most phones have similiar issues. Even on the nexus we all love. I lose 3G/cell signal all the time when I cover the lower half of my phone. This is something common on all nexus unless you have 100% awesome signal.
I think this is why this has not been discussed on this part of the forum
1) This is supposed to be about the Nexus One, not the iphone
2) All of us N1 owners know the N1 also has radio problems.
That being said, I'll still say the nexus is the overall best phone there is.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree with everything you said, including the last part about the overall superiority of the N1.
table: -75dBm
hand in front of me: -85dBm
next to my ear: -79dBm
That's my N1
But the news is for iPhone not for Nexus so not relevant dor this part of the forum (or any else i guess)
I dont know why people keep saying "this is common among all phones"
No its NOT.
1. You are never in direct contact with the actual antenna on other phones.
2. It usually takes a full grip to replicate this on other phones. Even then loss is not as significant as you are still merely muffling a signal not physically shorting the antenna process.
The iphone merely needs the gap bridged for it to dramatically lose signal to the point of dropping calls almost instantaneously.
The issues the N1 had were getting and maintaining a fix on 3G signals. A far cry from dropping endless calls because you were holding it wrong.
xManMythLegend said:
The issues the N1 had were getting and maintaining a fix on 3G signals. A far cry from dropping endless calls because you were holding it wrong.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, there are plenty of reports of a dramatic drop in signal strength when you cover the back of the N1 with your hand. Not exactly the same thing as iPhone 4, but still a signal issue caused by antenna placement, so definitely in the same ballpark.
bigmout said:
No, there are plenty of reports of a dramatic drop in signal strength when you cover the back of the N1 with your hand. Not exactly the same thing as iPhone 4, but still a signal issue caused by antenna placement, so definitely in the same ballpark.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Again, it's not even close to the same issue. On the N1, you can muffle the antenna a bit; on the iphone 4, you can actually electrically short it out.
MaximReapage said:
Again, it's not even close to the same issue. On the N1, you can muffle the antenna a bit; on the iphone 4, you can actually electrically short it out.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This smacks of rationalization to me. People report dropped calls as a result of how they hold the phone. Whether it's because the antenna is "muffled" on the N1 or "shorts" on the iPhone, the result is the same from the user's perspective. In fact, the iPhone issue is arguably less of a problem because you can solve it with a case. I love my Nexus One, but I don't think we do ourselves any favors as consumers by rationalizing the phone's shortcomings.
Ummm...how is this related to Nexus One general?
jz9833 said:
I hate to defend the iphone but....
Most phones have similiar issues. Even on the nexus we all love. I lose 3G/cell signal all the time when I cover the lower half of my phone. This is something common on all nexus unless you have 100% awesome signal.
I think this is why this has not been discussed on this part of the forum
1) This is supposed to be about the Nexus One, not the iphone
2) All of us N1 owners know the N1 also has radio problems.
That being said, I'll still say the nexus is the overall best phone there is.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The issue with the iPhone isn't that it has signal attenuation when held normally. All phones do indeed have that problem. The issue is the amount of attenuation. The iPhone 4 loses about 20 decibels of signal when held normally, the N1 loses 5-10 decibels, which doesn't mean that the iPhone loses 4 times as much signal. Decibels are an exponential metric, 10db loss is a tenfold increase/decrease, 20db is a hundredfold increase/decrease. If you use the "death grip" on the iPhone, you might see a 30db loss, yeah that's 1000x. That's why a lot of people didn't even realize that phones did this until now, the iPhone is particularly bad at this phenomenon.
There's a workaround to avoid losing signal when talking, and it's applicable with ALL phone with antenna at the bottom:
Just hold the phone top part when talking and keep hand off the bottom, but it's not possible when doing internet or messaging, or email.
When holding the phone for messaging, try to spread out fingers.
Sounds like Apple is trying to start a new FAD LoL...hope it doesn't catch on!
mingkee said:
There's a workaround to avoid losing signal when talking, and it's applicable with ALL phone with antenna at the bottom:
Just hold the phone top part when talking and keep hand off the bottom, but it's not possible when doing internet or messaging, or email.
When holding the phone for messaging, try to spread out fingers.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
which is ridiculous and something a consumer shouldnt have to do. Its very annoying to not be able to hold my phone how it naturally feels to while watching/listening to anything streaming.
its really not that hard to fix this, just make a vertical antenna that way you address the heath hazard of an antenna next to your ear, and still not sacrifice much signal.
Wow, another feature that Apple will try to pass off as being first. HTC was the first to have dropped signal, dammit!!
(Tongue in cheek, guys. I realize the seriousness of the iP4's reception woes is much worse than the N1's.)
ATnTdude said:
The issue with the iPhone isn't that it has signal attenuation when held normally. All phones do indeed have that problem. The issue is the amount of attenuation. The iPhone 4 loses about 20 decibels of signal when held normally, the N1 loses 5-10 decibels, which doesn't mean that the iPhone loses 4 times as much signal. Decibels are an exponential metric, 10db loss is a tenfold increase/decrease, 20db is a hundredfold increase/decrease. If you use the "death grip" on the iPhone, you might see a 30db loss, yeah that's 1000x. That's why a lot of people didn't even realize that phones did this until now, the iPhone is particularly bad at this phenomenon.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There are reports of a 20dBm loss in signal strength from the way you hold the Nexus One:
If you go to Settings -> About Phone -> Status you will see a display for "Signal strength". When my phone is sitting on the desk, the signal stays consistent. However, the second I touch my phone, the signal drops up to as much as -20 dBm. I am able to replicate this test every single time, whether the signal is incredibly strong or weak.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Google's "solution" was basically the same as Apple's -- i.e., hold the phone differently.
Weird, my Nexus One is just fine...........................
WRONG FORUM. Who cares.
Thread moved to OT.
what i specifically want to know is WHY is the nexus' antenna so sensitive compared to other phones. all my nokia phones would lose signal too when covering the antenna, but it seems like nokia and other phones use a moving average to calculate signal strength, over a period of the last 10 secconds or so. so that when the signal is blocked, it takes a few seconds to even start to drop. but the nexus almost seems to give dBm in real time, with no moving average at all. cause the dBm can drop intantly when blocking the antenna.
this is why i try to say that HTC just uses different bars, but the signal reception is no worse than other phones. it just shows in real time.
anyway i was at ATT store yesterday, and all 4 iphone 4's drop from 5 bars to 1 bar just by touching the lower left side. not even squeezing, just lightly pressing it. all 4 units. so what are these new phones doing with antenna that causes them to be so sensitive?
also, about the nexus, we have to think that because the nexus is only 9mm thick, the internal antenna is only seperated from our hand by barely 1 mm or so. so we too are detuning the antenna. its not a short like iphone, but close to it.
Consumer Reports confirms iPhone 4 antenna problems
By Nilay Patel posted Jul 12th 2010 1:30PM
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
http://www.engadget.com/2010/07/12/consumer-reports-confirms-iphone-4-antenna-problems-and-so-do/
Enough about the iPhone in the Nexus forum. Please!
1. The phone sings "I AM SEXY AND I KNOW IT". It's very elegant. My favorite looking device has been the white HTC One X. In my opinion, this black N4 is sexier.
2. If you like having haptic feedback on and you're upgrading from a Galaxy Nexus, you'll be pleased with the N4. I can't count the times I missed calls and important notifications with my GNEX on vibrator mode. I don't know if it's the way the vibrator module is installed or the "solid" body of the N4 that makes vibrations much better than the GNEX. You feel it as soon as you type on the keyboard to setup the phone for first use.
3. I was hoping that one of those early N4 reviewers would check if the N4/Android 4.2 supported SIM hot swapping like iPhones. I know if I remove the back cover of my GNEX and replace the SIM, I get a message that a new SIM is detected but I need to restart the phone. I deliberately powered on the N4 without a SIM installed at first then inserted it after it booted up. I did not get any messages but it did not pick up signal either, had to restart.
4. Having upgraded to the Nexus 4 from a Galaxy Nexus, I'm never going back to an AMOLED screen again. To me, all the colors look better on the N4 than on the GNEX except for black and green, but then again, the GNEX has a greenish tent over everything. Now I find myself preferring the better whites of the N4 much over the combination of ultra-vivid greens+greenish/bluish whites nature of the GNEX display. You notice the difference as soon as you power up an N4 in the status icons if you're upgrading from a GNEX. No wonder many call that color of the Holo theme "ICS Blue". It's looks like blue on the GNEX while it's true to being "Cyan" on the N4.
5. The power button is a little higher on the N4, I wish it was a bit longer or in the same place as the GNEX.
6. The silver rim around the screen isn't luminous as I thought it would be when I held it to my face. The glass curves on the sides help at making it look discrete when held directly for operation.
7. Using the speedtest app, I got 16Mbps down, 1.7Mbps up using t-mobile's H+ network with the N4. My GNEX has an AT&T SIM in it now, It's got 2.15Mbps down, 1.1Mbps up only.
8. There's a spot in my garage that is dead to the GNEX from my home WiFi signal. Have always hated it because that's where I always sit to smoke. Not only the N4 is fine there, it pulled 24Mbps when I tested using the speed test app.
9. Coming from a Motorola phone to the GNEX, I missed that instant GPS lock my Motorola had. What is it those Moto guys do to make their GPS locking so fast?! While the GNEX GPS locking speed was improved with updates, I found the N4 is be much faster at locking and rerouting when navigating.
10. The Galaxy S III notifications LED is a bit brighter than the one in the GNEX. I was hoping the N4 will have something similar, it doesn't.
11. All the time I was reading the N4 reviews, I thought they were saying the glass curves outwards on the sides. I was surprised to see it curves inward. Sorry I couldn't explain it better. And yes, it makes a difference in the feel when you swipe screens.
12. The external speaker of the N4 is a little bit louder than the GNEX, but still on the quiet side. Don't expect Motorola (I know it's a lot phones, but they usually do good in this regard) or iPhone 4/4s/5 loudness.
13. Battery life is acceptable. It's comparable to the GSM Galaxy Nexus with the stock 1750mAh battery, but not as good as the GNEX+the OEM 2000mAh battery. It's kinda puzzling how the LG Optimus G has a better battery life based on it's reviews. The only difference is the OS? right? So, is it a software/kernel issue in Android 4.2? I don't know.
14. The Nexus 4 is my first Android phone with a non-removable battery. I was thinking what do I do in those nasty cases that require a "battery pull". I just tried holding the power button for few seconds and indeed it did shutdown.
15. I mentioned it before but I also did further testing. The GPS performance of the Nexus 4 obliterates that of the Galaxy Nexus it's not even funny. Accuracy and speed is excellent on the N4. Happy to see that since I use Google Maps/Navigation quite often. Testing indoors in my house, the N4 found 19 satellites, the GNEX only 3.
16. Some speedtest.net results:
AT&T SIM - GNEX:
{
"lightbox_close": "Close",
"lightbox_next": "Next",
"lightbox_previous": "Previous",
"lightbox_error": "The requested content cannot be loaded. Please try again later.",
"lightbox_start_slideshow": "Start slideshow",
"lightbox_stop_slideshow": "Stop slideshow",
"lightbox_full_screen": "Full screen",
"lightbox_thumbnails": "Thumbnails",
"lightbox_download": "Download",
"lightbox_share": "Share",
"lightbox_zoom": "Zoom",
"lightbox_new_window": "New window",
"lightbox_toggle_sidebar": "Toggle sidebar"
}
T-Mobile SIM - GNEX:
The same T-mobile SIM - N4:
Thanks for sharing!
Yeah, can't wait for mine to arrive. Come on Google!
CyberPunk7t9 said:
7. Using the speedtest app, I got 16MBs down, 1.7MB up using t-mobile's H+ network with the N4. My GNEX has an AT&T SIM in it now, It's got 2.15MB down, 1.1MB up only.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Can you clarify if you are using megabits or megabytes? Mbps is the unit for megabits per second, and MB/s denotes megabytes per second. Your usage is ambiguous, but I would assume the numbers are Mbps. Also, what city are you in?
CyberPunk7t9 said:
11. All the time I was reading the N4 reviews, I thought they were saying the glass curves outwards on the sides. I was surprised to see it curves inward. Sorry I couldn't explain it better. And yes, it makes a difference in the feel when you swipe screens.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
With the screen facing up, do you mean the glass slopes downward at the edges? Is that what you mean by "inward?" As in, into the phone?
Nice job. I'm coming from a GNex too and my N4 is scheduled to be here tomorrow afternoon. Can't wait. This bit of info helps answer some questions I also had.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
Hung0702 said:
Can you clarify if you are using megabits or megabytes? Mbps is the unit for megabits per second, and MB/s denotes megabytes per second. Your usage is ambiguous, but I would assume the numbers are Mbps. Also, what city are you in?
With the screen facing up, do you mean the glass slopes downward at the edges? Is that what you mean by "inward?" As in, into the phone?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
- 16Mbps. Thanks for the note. I'm in St. Paul, MN.
- Correct! Thanks again.
We should have an N4 party in the twin cities, lol. Im getting mine on Tuesday. I ordered a Nexus 7 3G, which may have slowed my order down a little bit. I changed my plan to unlimted 4G on Tmo. What plan do you have? If you have the unlimted 4G, can you test to see if tethering still works to your Gnex? I supposedly have unlmted 4G which says that tethering doesn't work, but I can still tether to my N7 just fine.
I can't wait until UPS drops mine off tomorrow
I agree, i am loving this thing. I've had it since Friday and i cant find one thing to complain about.
Can you put the AT&T SIM in the N4 and do a speed test? Would it be the same as the Gnex?
I think I may be the only one that likes the GNnex AMOLED screen better. Colors seem washed out compared to the GNex. I think I just need to get used it but yeah I love this phone though! LOVE it!
Sent from my Nexus 4 using xda app-developers app
For the past couple days I have been wanting my N4 to arrive but not to the point where I'm cursing google for their questionable release. I currently use a nexus s and am happy with that until it finally arrives. your post single handily has made me super anxious and excited for my N4 to arrive. If only I knew when it would arrive :/
CyberPunk7t9 said:
Snipped to save space.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the detailed review!
I've read a lot of complaints about the touch screen sensitivity. People are saying it's not picking up light taps because it's not sensitive enough. This causes typing mistakes and frustration in general. Have you noticed anything like this?
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2
bleuiko said:
Can you put the AT&T SIM in the N4 and do a speed test? Would it be the same as the Gnex?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry can't do that. Because the N4 uses a micro SIM and I had to cut the T-mobile SIM I have to use it. The AT&T will remain in my GNEX. I don't know, I might decide on cutting it to do the test you're asking for and then use a converter to put it back in the GNEX. Stay tuned.
Darn it can't wait til the order page goes live again, I refuse to go to tmob and shell out five bills.
Sent from my HTC One X using Tapatalk 2
bleuiko said:
Can you put the AT&T SIM in the N4 and do a speed test? Would it be the same as the Gnex?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I use AT&T with my Nexus 4. I can do a speed test tomorrow.
Sent from my LT30at using xda app-developers app
whittikins said:
I've read a lot of complaints about the touch screen sensitivity. People are saying it's not picking up light taps because it's not sensitive enough. This causes typing mistakes and frustration in general. Have you noticed anything like this?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't notice any difference between the N4 and the GNex in regards to sensitivity. To me it is actually a bit more sensitive, or maybe that's just perceived because the phone is faster, who knows.
I'm in love with this phone.
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2
whittikins said:
Thanks for the detailed review!
I've read a lot of complaints about the touch screen sensitivity. People are saying it's not picking up light taps because it's not sensitive enough. This causes typing mistakes and frustration in general. Have you noticed anything like this?
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The glass of the Galaxy Nexus screen allows smoother glides when you swipe over it but I also did not experience issues of unregistered touches or any awkward behavior in that regard using the N4.
Maybe those people are talking about the far edges of each side where the glass curves. The curves start right over the bezels, which makes it easy to think you're touching the usable screen while you're actually just starting to touch the glass. I personally like it this way, both the curves and the slightly rougher feeling glass. Like when I use the gesture typing feature in the 4.2 keyboard, I tend to make more mistakes with the GNEX than I do with the N4 because the glides are more controllable on the N4 glass, at least for me.
dbdynsty25 said:
I don't notice any difference between the N4 and the GNex in regards to sensitivity. To me it is actually a bit more sensitive, or maybe that's just perceived because the phone is faster, who knows.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But you notice something like the screen of the GNEX being smoother when you glide your fingers over it? I think I do.
Thank you.
Hey -
I'm having issues with call quality (other side says I'm breaking up, calls dropping, etc.).
When I compare my signal strength, I'm usually 6-10 dbm lower signal strength than my wife's Galaxy S5. I also compared it to my son's G3, and had a similar variation in signal strength.
Do I just have a bad phone, and should I swap it?
I'm worried that if I swap it, I end up with a refurb that has a partially used up battery for my brand new phone.
Thoughts?
Jim
jbresee said:
Hey -
I'm having issues with call quality (other side says I'm breaking up, calls dropping, etc.).
When I compare my signal strength, I'm usually 6-10 dbm lower signal strength than my wife's Galaxy S5. I also compared it to my son's G3, and had a similar variation in signal strength.
Do I just have a bad phone, and should I swap it?
I'm worried that if I swap it, I end up with a refurb that has a partially used up battery for my brand new phone.
Thoughts?
Jim
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I take it you have a US Nexus 6 XT-1103? What carrier do you have, are you on a stock/custom rom, rooted. stock/custom kernel, what radio are you using?
jbresee said:
Hey -
I'm having issues with call quality (other side says I'm breaking up, calls dropping, etc.).
When I compare my signal strength, I'm usually 6-10 dbm lower signal strength than my wife's Galaxy S5. I also compared it to my son's G3, and had a similar variation in signal strength.
Do I just have a bad phone, and should I swap it?
I'm worried that if I swap it, I end up with a refurb that has a partially used up battery for my brand new phone.
Thoughts?
Jim
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
first off, they are completely different devices with completely different hardware. so you cant compare the n6 to the ither devices when looking for issues. secondly, the n6 antenna is supposedly a little shorter than samsungs, which could have slightly worse signal reception, if you live in or near the country (as opposed to being in a city).
jbresee said:
Hey -
I'm having issues with call quality (other side says I'm breaking up, calls dropping, etc.).
When I compare my signal strength, I'm usually 6-10 dbm lower signal strength than my wife's Galaxy S5. I also compared it to my son's G3, and had a similar variation in signal strength.
Do I just have a bad phone, and should I swap it?
I'm worried that if I swap it, I end up with a refurb that has a partially used up battery for my brand new phone.
Thoughts?
Jim
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just to be clear, when you say "6-10 dbm lower" you actually mean higher? Like your phone is 100 and hers is 90.
Sorry - should have provided more details:
1. It's a Verizon Nexus -not sure what that translates to for a model number.
2. By higher dbm, I mean that if I'm seeing -107 dbm on my phone, my son's LG3 and my wife's GS5 are seeing -96dbm. I guess the point is, both my wife and son can complete a call standing in the same location where I cannot.
Jim
N6 vs Note 4 dbm
This is by no means concrete proof, just showing that the radios in the Nexus 6 are no slouch...
jbresee said:
Sorry - should have provided more details:
1. It's a Verizon Nexus -not sure what that translates to for a model number.
2. By higher dbm, I mean that if I'm seeing -107 dbm on my phone, my son's LG3 and my wife's GS5 are seeing -96dbm. I guess the point is, both my wife and son can complete a call standing in the same location where I cannot.
Jim
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What radio are you running? Im running the M preview radio and it seems to be a little stronger than then 98r(verizon stock model radio) ones.
mademan420 said:
What radio are you running? Im running the M preview radio and it seems to be a little stronger than then 98r(verizon stock model radio) ones.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am running the stock Verizon ROM. I loaded the M radio last night, and I'm not seeing a noticeable difference in signal strength or call quality.
Jim
jbresee said:
I am running the stock Verizon ROM. I loaded the M radio last night, and I'm not seeing a noticeable difference in signal strength or call quality.
Jim
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As @simms22 and @gee2012 said, there are several factors involved. I will admit, the Note 4's in-call sound quality is better than the N6's imho but by no means have I ever had problems with calls on it. I will admit, it does seem lower, but I found a thread yesterday that would increase the in-call volume. I applied it but havent actually tested this yet.
Updated: Im also running a 5.1.1 stock based ROM LYZ28E
As Apple once said, "you're holding the phone wrong." Notice the change in dBm while holding the phone normally (with the hand covering the bottom of the phone) and when you hold the phone just by the top edges.
stevemw said:
As Apple once said, "you're holding the phone wrong." Notice the change in dBm while holding the phone normally (with the hand covering the bottom of the phone) and when you hold the phone just by the top edges.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually, Steve, I do notice a drop of a few dbm's when I take the bumper case off. But my tests with other phones are with them sitting side by side, not touching. And the dbm measurements are not really the issue. The issue is that calls on my N6 suck, but the LG3 and S5 are great in the same location.
In case you hit this thread with a search engine - here's another thread with people who are experiencing reception issues:
https://forums.motorola.com/posts/f7b51bd9bf?page=6
Ok -
Took the phone back to the Verizon store. I set my phone next to the display model - mine showed 1 bar, the display showed full bars.
The tech took my phone and turned off Advanced Calling, and my signal strength matched the display model. I'm going to play with it at home, but it looks like there is an issue with advanced calling and the N6.
jbresee said:
Actually, Steve, I do notice a drop of a few dbm's when I take the bumper case off. But my tests with other phones are with them sitting side by side, not touching. And the dbm measurements are not really the issue. The issue is that calls on my N6 suck, but the LG3 and S5 are great in the same location.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think the antenna is on the rim of the N6.
https://forums.motorola.com/posts/5b145d5570
Hey guys yesterday i upgrade to 4g sim card and got 4g signal for the first time in my life lol. However after using for a few minutes using phone i start to feel nausea tired dizzy. Dont kniw why. I guess the reason is the signal from the phone is too strong. My tel service provider use 1800mhz band. Does anyone experience similar issues or is it just my imagination lol
Probably just your imagination! Lol. The SAR values of these phones are within the acceptable levels and aren't harmful in majority of cases. People who set these guidelines and standards go through a lot of research so that we end consumers don't have to. So it is safe to say that it is just your imagination that 4G is the cause. Your mind is just trying to associate two different events; getting 4G for the first time and a random episode of fatigue or a headache. Considering you also mention that 4G signal is quite strong in your area, your phone only requires very less power to lock to the network, meaning very low or negligible radiation.
But it would be best to visit a doctor who may be able to help you with the symptoms.