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Well been doing alot of study lately and it seems ALOT of apps on the market that are full versions and are "free" seem to have ad sponsored elements in them. Sending your GPS data to whoever or other various things. Now while if the dev mentions on the description that their "Paid" version is ad free. Least its up front and honest about it. However alot of Apps I found out hide this info it seems. Is this going to be the new "Kazaa" on the G1? Back when Kazaa came out, is when the influx of "Spyware" was increasing. Im worried is this happening to the G1 now? While I can understand devs choosing this to make their app free and gain from it a lil. Whats to say other devs wont use this for other intentions that may have some negative impact?
Just wondering tho.. for modded G1s. Is there some sorta firewall app or so yet that might be useful? Anyways just thought I would post for discussion case I am worried over nothing.
Install AdFree from the Market.
Cool ill try that. Still tho some discussion would be good. Cause I don't know if this should be something to start getting concerned on. Apps running in background draining battery, and reporting info possibly and so. Or am I getting concerned over nothing?
Mysticales said:
Cool ill try that. Still tho some discussion would be good. Cause I don't know if this should be something to start getting concerned on. Apps running in background draining battery, and reporting info possibly and so. Or am I getting concerned over nothing?
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A little paranoia is a healthy thing, too much is bad, but these ads collect all sorts of location information to profile you and provide relevent advertising, but who knows what else happens with the data etc etc etc
PS you need root access on your phone to use AdFree
Yea Im fully rooted, No worries there. =) Thanks for this heads up. I use host files as well on my PC.. since then never had a issue with spyware again. Any news on if he would let us update the host file ourselves? Id love to use the file I have on my PC. Heh.
Anyways as for discussion goes. Can these ads know your G1 email, or linked email account? Next off, is there a ability that these ads could read your personal data as text msgs, contacts (to spam phone calls) or anything like that? Android being a new OS.. not sure what devs and ads can do with access to a phone. Its like a new gateway has been opened.
Kinda wish a dev could comment if the G1 would even have this ability and if it could be a bad thing.
Edit: Good question, this Ad Free, is it like if you add a hosts file in a router? Like if I use the G1 to tether, is it blocking the ad banners even on tethered connections? Would be interesting to know for sure since imagine a built in firewall that protects tethered PCs too.
Mysticales said:
Yea Im fully rooted, No worries there. =) Thanks for this heads up. I use host files as well on my PC.. since then never had a issue with spyware again. Any news on if he would let us update the host file ourselves? Id love to use the file I have on my PC. Heh.
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You can use your own hosts file on your own phone, AdFree just automates the process, if you look at this thread it started off describing how to do things manually.
Anyways as for discussion goes. Can these ads know your G1 email, or linked email account?
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Possibly, I haven't looked into accessing the google credentials from the android APIs so I don't know for certain, might be a private API google only shares with it's own apps, that doesn't mean someone won't figure out how to access them however.
Next off, is there a ability that these ads could read your personal data as text msgs, contacts (to spam phone calls) or anything like that? Android being a new OS..
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When you install an app there is a screen displayed of the permissions the apps ask for, read/write contacts, calendars etc will all be displayed, you should be able to see the permissions an app will have access to after it's installed as well from memory.
not sure what devs and ads can do with access to a phone. Its like a new gateway has been opened.
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You should be more worried what google will do with all the info it collects to be honest, but that's another issue altogether.
Kinda wish a dev could comment if the G1 would even have this ability and if it could be a bad thing.
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You are prompted during install as to what the app will be able to access, google leaves it up to you to accept it or not.
Edit: Good question, this Ad Free, is it like if you add a hosts file in a router? Like if I use the G1 to tether, is it blocking the ad banners even on tethered connections? Would be interesting to know for sure since imagine a built in firewall that protects tethered PCs too.
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Depends how the tethered setup gets DNS info, if it uses the information from the hosts file then yes, but this is dependent on what the tether setup does.
Mysticales said:
Its like a new gateway has been opened.
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Only if you never bothered reading the permissions requests when installing an app. They clearly describe what permissions an app wants to use and you can cancel the installation if you feel you don't want to give an app the right to access your personal info. So if you install a game that says it wants access to your Google Account info (which would include your email and thus all your associated google services) then you have only yourself to blame if the dev sends you a ton of spam or sells your email address.
Bottom line is read the permissions requested carefully and decide whether you trust the company/entity that created the app before installing it. Also, i'd be very wary installing any root apps, since root apps by their very nature can operate outside of dalvik sandbox and do practically anything they want to your system. I'm only running two root apps right now: Market Enabler and Wifi Tether. They are both open source.
Well of course I read the permissions thing. However still I would still wonder about things.
Mysticales said:
Well of course I read the permissions thing. However still I would still wonder about things.
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Google actually closed up some of the loop holes that apps were using on Android 1.0/1.1 to enable wifi etc.
jashsu said:
They are both open source.
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Unless you audit the code and compile it yourself, you have no idea what the binary is actually doing.
Location data is only used for serving the right banners and calculate the profits the banner view/click has depending on the location (country) of the viewer.
Its not anything malicious and you can easily see the permissions when installing.
People all like free apps instead of paying a few dollars, but when an ad is added people try to get rid of it... Havent you all ever wondered why the ads are there? Just like on a forum as the one you are on right now? Right they generate at least a little bit of money for a dev that doesnt want to charge the users directly by letting them pay, but spends almost all his free time to keep apps updated, write new once and answering questions.
As soon as there is virtually no way too make money on a market, the market will die as developers/companies will move over to an other platform of development.
delta_foxtrot2 said:
Unless you audit the code and compile it yourself, you have no idea what the binary is actually doing.
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It's not difficult to get the code from svn and compile it. Pretty effortless.
rogro82 said:
As soon as there is virtually no way too make money on a market, the market will die as developers/companies will move over to an other platform of development.
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Many people don't like to view ads on their computers, let alone their mobile phone. Thus if people can block the ads easily, they will. Content producers and software developers will simply have to find a new business model to pursue. Maybe that's a free/premium differentiation model or maybe its microtransactions. That or they will have to deal with a percentage of their userbase blocking ads.
Well I am sure most devs Block ads too, either on their mobile or pc.. no one wants any type of issue.
Now again, I said I understand why they are there for free apps. Its just that as a user myself.. I like to know Im protected from potential hazards. Also alot of devs like to make something hot to use on later resumes and projects. Ive worked with alot of devs in my time start with nothing and grow to get bigger jobs in RL cause of the project. =)
jashsu said:
It's not difficult to get the code from svn and compile it. Pretty effortless.
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I didn't say it was hard to get or compile it, but auditing the code to make sure nothing malicious is going on can be very difficult at times. There is a code obfustication competition each year and it's extrodinary what some can do and you'd never know unless it was pointed out to you.
Mysticales said:
Well I am sure most devs Block ads too, either on their mobile or pc.. no one wants any type of issue.
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It's not just "issues" too many ads tick a certain segment of the population off to the point that they go to these lengths to get rid of them.
This is of course before you factor in this segment of the population are usually the least to click on ads, usually for ethical/moral reasons, so them getting rid of ads is usually no big loss.
Last time I checked AdFree was downloaded less than 5,000 times, now compare this to a speedometer app I made which anyone can run and it's been downloaded over 10,000 times I highly doubt any dev relying on ads will actually loose out by the people that can and are blocking them.
rogro82 said:
Location data is only used for serving the right banners and calculate the profits the banner view/click has depending on the location (country) of the viewer.
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The meta data that can be gleened from this sort of advertising can have all sorts of flow on effects and unintended consequences.
I see the world and potential pitfalls in things differently than others, I don't know why, but the more data collected the worst things can be.
If you are interested in what country they are from/in just pull the country code from the SIM card, why narrow it down to within a few metres?
Well since I have been using Adfree. Let me say this. My G1 seems to be running faster! I dont get as many force close/wait errors. Certain apps like atrackdog for one RUN faster. I mean without the ads running, it seems my apps speed through their task and do what they are supposed to. Kinda interesting note oddly.
Also lets say a app you know would be using GPS to locate you on a map. Thus triggering "Give app permission to use your GPS" which you know why it needs it. But does the app also tell you that it uses the GPS for Ads? So I dont always trust what it says when it comes to permissions as it doesnt mean in the underline that its not using the same permission to do other things. Would be nice if the G1 had a notice that the app uses Ad support.
Linux is a wonderful and powerful operating system that can do just about anything you can possibly dream of.
First, the hosts file hack is a piece of crap since all it does is it points potentially malicious domain names back to self. It doesn't take into account connections that are ip address based... those will still go through and there is nothing that can be put in the hosts file to stop that.
iptables on the other hand.... included in 1.0 and 1.1, and several custom 1.5's, can do many strong things; block by ip address (including if it tries to lookup by dns), block by port, *BLOCK BY USER ID*.
The latter is particularly interesting since each program installed on android is assigned its own userid. That means that with the correct iptables rule, you can block all network traffic for THAT PARTICULAR PROGRAM. Or you can blacklist/whitelist servers for that program, etc.
http://www.cyberciti.biz/tips/block...ingle-user-from-my-server-using-iptables.html
http://www.cyberciti.biz/tips/linux...ng-access-to-selectedspecific-ip-address.html
For example, when I issue this command:
iptables -A OUTPUT -o tiwlan0 -m owner --uid-owner 10017 -j DROP
My browser is no longer able to connect (since it is uid=10017) using wifi (tiwlan0 is wifi). Note: leave out the entire "-o tiwlan0" argument and it should block all outgoing on all devices for that userid.
To find the userid for a particular program, do "ls -l /data/data/program'sdatadirectory"
So on JF 1.51 is this ability already there? Yea I know Linux is great for iptables. Always is, even in routers hehe.
If its not in there already, Debian, how well does that work on the G1?
Hi,
I searched but couldn't find in this forum the answer of my question.
So, is an antivirus software necessary for Android? i can see a many of them on the market.But i don't want to install something that only "appears" do a lot of things but actually does nothing.
i personally think antivirus is essential, you have it for your pc right ? why not for your phone ? especially since android is open source, its easy for someone to make a virus and pretend its an amazing app.. even so our phones have everything on them.. contacts. passwords, personal info. email messages, saved bank details. i highly recommend antivirus for your phone.
i use lookout mobile security, its free ( or 30day free trial for pro ) and it scans every new app installed, it updates regularly, and best of all, if you ever lose your phone or have it stolen. you can go on to mylookout.com and block the phone / wipe all data / even track it down thru gps (even if gps is disabled ) all via your pc. its well worth it..
Thanks for the reply !
Actually i was wondering if Android is linux based, it could not be affected by a virus.
What you are talking about is more of a malware/spyware related problem (like stealing passwords, CC numbers etc.).
But if a software can prevent that kind of stuff , its well worth it.
Just wanted to know does Lookout mobile security makes your SGS( I am Assuming) slow ?
You can try avg pretty fast.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App
Superuser_x said:
Thanks for the reply !
Actually i was wondering if Android is linux based, it could not be affected by a virus.
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Sure it can be, the scale of viruses written for Linux is just smaller than is for Windows OS (imagine how many people use Windows), but since Android is growing at a really fast pace, I think that AV programs will be needed in the future if not now (at least for average users).
Superuser_x said:
Just wanted to know does Lookout mobile security makes your SGS( I am Assuming) slow ?
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Not, that I have noticed it. It's pretty light weight...
I don't think so, not yet at least. Android is designed so that when you install apks or market apps, you are shown the permissions they require. This goes some way to helping you decide whether an app is trustworthy or not.
If in future, we get a spate of viruses/fake apps hitting android, then it might start becoming a standard feature. If you follow sites like xda or android websites daily, you will probably hear about any viruses before you even get the chance to download them (imo).
In the meantime, antivirus apps probably just reduce your battery life and performance...
No not at the moment. If your phone isnt rooted then apps wont have full access to system files, so in that sense i guess your protected to an extent.
If you only install apps from trusted sources then you should be fine. Perhaps over the coming months you may wish to implement a security solution as threats emerge more often.
Personally im awaiting a solution from ESET if ever. If it is somewhat similar to their desktop sloution but optimised for android then im hoping it will be just as light on resources. Avg just slows my phone right down. In any case im sure that you can expect a slight decline regarding phone performance with a security solution implemented.
every one has their own opinion, personally i cant see what harm it can do having a antivirus, lookout for me doesnt slow down my phone at all, and its reassuring knowing that all my apps get scanned regularly, some think its easy to get a virus, some say different, least if you do have an anti virus, you know your covered just incase,,, plus the extra benefits of lookout are superior...
Hmm.. Appreciate you all replying
As for AVG , i never trusted it to be working(on PC).So i am going to lookout for something else... like Lookout
Seems it is still a debatable issue that is an antivirus really effective on android platform.May be some hardcore developer can answer it more clearly.
I see some paid Antivirus softwares on market, can't make out there worth.
So the question still remains the same....Is an antivirus necessary on android ?
well looks like you will have to make your own conclusion on that one... there are free anti viruses out there, so you cant go wrong
Hey Again!
I´m wondering if I´m not able to use the searchfunction in a useful way (*g*) or if it´s just the fact that WP7 is still a baby...
There´s no NetCounter (Data Traffic Counter) available for WP7, right? Doesn´t this fact bother anyone except me? I would really appreciate monitoring my traffic due to the fact my data volume is limited (500 mb)...
Any ideas?
Need this also!
I also need a net counter / usage counter for Wp7, as currently, i have no idea how much data i am using?
Anyone?
I think this is hard to realise. Due to the architecture of Windows Phone 7 you cannot run an application, like a traffic analyzer in the background.For example you download an app from the marketplace, you have to run the traffic counter AND the marketplace app.
But I`m not sure, though....
Any sort of 3rd party data counter would need multitasking. WP7 will have multitasking in Q3 2011. So no data counters until then
I guess MS made the OS with unlimited data plans in mind...
I´m not quiet sure, but as far as I know there aren´t REAL unlimited data plans available here in europe, are they? In the very most cases it is some kind of a flatrate but with bandwith restriction after 250mb-5GB of usage (amount depends on provider & plan)
Exactly. But you can look online how much traffic you have used an how much minutes you have left. I think most people here in germany don't need a traffic counter.
Patric1972 said:
Exactly. But you can look online how much traffic you have used an how much minutes you have left. I think most people here in germany don't need a traffic counter.
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I can´t check anything online, my provider doesn´t support such a service...so in this case: not true! (sorry ) I really do NEED a counter...
Ok, I got your point...
I think there's no other way as to wait for mango update in Q3/2011.
Mango is on phone, traffic counter?
After some googling I found, that the "Transfer my data" app can transfer SMS only from Lumias and Symbian phones.
Anyone got an idea how to do it?
syddd said:
After some googling I found, that the "Transfer my data" app can transfer SMS only from Lumias and Symbian phones.
Anyone got an idea how to do it?
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I was wondering the same thing... I'm sure it's possible for the interop-unlocked phones, but that doesn't include Lumia phones (yet)
merwin said:
I was wondering the same thing... I'm sure it's possible for the interop-unlocked phones, but that doesn't include Lumia phones (yet)
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I think its possible in a very awkward way. The Transfer my data app has special privileges, so it can write SMS to your phone. The problem is, that it can only import from Lumias and Symbian phones.
Now you you make an app for PC/iOS/Android, that fakes this protocol you are set. The problem is to decode this protocol, as I see there are 2 choices:
- Mess with the Symbian emulator. Ive downloaded it, but its kinda hard to get it to use the bluetooth of my laptop. if I manage to do this, I need to sniff the traffic to figure out the protocol.
- Download the Symbian source code and find the part which sends this data. Im now about to try this method, ill post an update if I find anything. If someone i a Symbian+bluetooth expert could help would be great, but I doubt such people are common.
Guys...all you have to do is keep the back up option turned on. Everything else from there is MS's problem. I recently hard reset my wife's 720. All the messages, every single one, comes back the moment you sign in with the SAME ID you have taken a back up with.
Uh, GH0ST, I think you missed an important point... this is from *ANDROID* to WP*, not from WP* to WP8.
@syddd: I'm sure it is, indeed, possible to transfer the messages to the app from an Android phone, but I don't know the wire format. You might get lucky if you search and find an app on the Android side that is compatible with Transfer My Data, though.
Is there an application that can password protect certain apps that I choose?
And please do not say Kids Corner as it does not do what I am asking.
It's probably possible (though far from easy), but I'd actually be more inclined to help if you hadn't opened a duplicate thread about this.
Only made second thread about this to attract some attention, 7 months passed since that guy opened his thread and nobody could give a good answer.
To me it's weird that nobody tried to make an app like this still, it would be very popular and help users very much.
Anyways, thank you for replying.
Really, just bumping the other thread was enough, but since we're here anyhow... my idea for how to approach it (and this would take a *lot* of hacking) goes something like this:
1. Create an app (call it X) that has the capability to launch other apps, and filesystem write access.
2. Have X take another app (call it Y) and encrypt its binaries. This prevents anybody from launching it by any means.
3. Tweak the app database to make it so that when you try to launch Y, it instead launches X and passes the id of Y as a parameter to the launcher.
4. X prompts the user for a password to Y. On getting the right one, it decrypts Y's binaries and writes them back to the correct location, then launches Y.
5. When the user (or OS) closes Y, a background process of X notes that Y is closed and re-encrypts it.
Currently we know how to do... well, some of #1, and we think the rest is possible. Given that, #2 isn't too hard. #3 is something I don't have the least notion how to do *right now* but I'm sure it's possible. #4 shouldn't be too hard given #1 and #2. #5 will be a trick - currently, apps have no way to know what other apps are running - but I'm sure it can be done.
It's a large engineering problem blocked by an even bigger research and hacking problem, though. Nothing we'll have soon. You'd never be able to publish it in the store, either, and it would only work for people with hacked phones. It's exactly the kind of *useful* thing that would be possible if Microsoft were willing to let up the restrictions on third-party developers a bit, of course, But for the time being, there are *reasons* nobody has done it yet.
Well the word that I actually was thinking after reading your post was "crap".
It seems only with time (and a whole [email protected]#$ing lot of it) will wp become a true competitor to android, but to be honest I don't think it will come to that.
Thanks for replying GoodDayToDie, I'm freakin' sad that there is no app that can suit my needs, I even tried with kids corner but the screen still needs the password entered like the normal one. Nothing really can make up for what I have in mind.
Cheers mate.
as soon as we can interop unlock all WP devices, it will be pretty easy... if you're able to provide the XAP (uncrypted of course )
i'll be able to "mod" this in for you... which app are we talking about?
@GoodDayToDie: i do'nt think he is looking for real data security here, so encrypting the whole thing shouldnt be required... i think it's more about preventing his gf to read his private messages or something like that
oh btw.: you would need a dev-unlock to deploy the modified XAP then...
tfBullet said:
as soon as we can interop unlock all WP devices, it will be pretty easy... if you're able to provide the XAP (uncrypted of course )
i'll be able to "mod" this in for you... which app are we talking about?
@GoodDayToDie: i do'nt think he is looking for real data security here, so encrypting the whole thing shouldnt be required... i think it's more about preventing his gf to read his private messages or something like that
oh btw.: you would need a dev-unlock to deploy the modified XAP then...
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You're right tfBullet! I need it for whatsapp, photos, message and games app, mostly to prevent from friends but gf too.
I was thinking it might be possible to mod an app and add password before it can be accessed, although I have no experience in this domain. Many apps in store have this function, like wallet or prive photo apps.
My phone is dev-unlocked as I started a few days ago to study and try to create a simple app for me and my friends.
Modding an app like that would actually be quite hard, because it would break the signature and prevent the app from running. The encryption thing really isn't too hard, although you could skip it anyhow too.
If there was a way to run a program in the background that monitors when certain apps are selected and then prompts when its activated would work, but it would need an unlocked phone. And even under home brew I don't know if its possible to run apps in the background. Yet.
Sent from my Nokia 521 using XDA Windows Phone 8 App
The encryption thing really isn't too hard
Yea, but that's a little extreme. If you can create that password program that runs in the background you could probably have it watch files, apps or pretty much anything. You'd have to password protect the cofig file. And maybe if you can't remember the password after so many attempts you can have the program email the passwords to your email. Just some ideas.
Sent from my Nokia 521 using XDA Windows Phone 8 App
Running software in the background is actually shockingly easy. The trick is getting it to run with better-than-app-sandbox privileges. We're still working on that one. In the meantime, apps can't even read, much less write, to the install location of other apps.
GoodDayToDie said:
Modding an app like that would actually be quite hard, because it would break the signature and prevent the app from running.
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@GoodDayToDie: actually these .NET apps are pretty easy to decompile, if you're willing to fix the bugs that the decompiler leaves you with...
so there is not really a need for a valid signature, if you're able to compile & sideload the app yourself
the only thing is: you need the decrypted XAP, as far as i know these get decrypted while installation and can be pulled from a interop unlocked device?!
It would be nice to get my fingers on some OEM (Nokia etc..) XAPs, to see if we can find any exploit in them
I know better than probably 95% of this forum what it takes to decompile managed code; I have reverse engineered huge numbers of apps. However, you are missing several important points.
1) Modifications like you suggest are very complicated to automate. It's certainly possible, but it's not simple.
2) Re-installing the app would be a pain. You would really want to do this as an in-place modification, and that means (for store apps) that it would still be signature-checked.
3) Not all apps are managed code; WP8 supports purely native code.
4) Even with managed code, obfuscation can make tinkering with the binary nigh-impossible.
It's just so incredibly stupid that WP is so limited. I know it's under Android big time, but I think even iOS more customizable, right?
Also, is there a message app in the store that has pass option? I searched but found nothing...
I don't believe iOS is any more customizable, no. It has some feature that WP lacks (it ought to; it's been out for years longer and Apple completely controls the hardware it runs on) but it's also missing some features that WP8 offers. In any case, this isn't the thread to have that discussion in.
GoodDayToDie said:
I don't believe iOS is any more customizable, no. It has some feature that WP lacks (it ought to; it's been out for years longer and Apple completely controls the hardware it runs on) but it's also missing some features that WP8 offers. In any case, this isn't the thread to have that discussion in.
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But with the jailbreak and MobileSubstrate, iOS is extremely customizable, and there are tons of tweaks, that's where Apple gets its new features from
Back to topic, I think the OP would be happy with a solution that locks the "normal" user of his phone out of some apps, so it wouldn't be necessary to modify anything of it, just making the standard launcher (I don't know how it's called, but I mean when you launch the app via home screen or with a toast) ask for a password should be enough.