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Hi all,
1. I've got these applications (Smartone-Vodophone SV app, 5 days weather, google map, social hub and such) that would keep coming back, relaunching themselves even after I put them onto my task manager's autokill list. Seems like they would wait around for me to enable the wifi/3G connection and then launch themselves. I even installed other apps to disable autolaunch and they would still launch themselves in the background every now and then. I had to kill them every time I unlocked my screen and these "launching and killing" cycles eventually depleted my memory down to below 100MB, making the lag situation even worse. Does anyone know how I can stop them from launching, without having to uninstall these apps?
2. I haven't installed the lagfix and I understand that the fix has to do with reformatting the apps' partition with a faster file system to reduce the lag (probably by giving it faster I/O access to the program's binaries?) I'm still waiting for Froyo, which should be out in a couple of weeks in my country. Does anyone know if Froyo would take care of this file system problem? Even with the Froyo or one-click lag fix, it still would not solve the apps launching and memory leak problem, right?
3. I notice that after I've installed more apps, the lag situation got worse. I was playing some songs on the external SD cards and it choked once in a while. I made sure I killed all the other apps and that I still got 100+MB to run just this one song player app and yet it would still choke. This tells me that the lag has nothing to do with available memory. And the player app was stock that came with the phone so there shouldn't be any fragmentation issue (apps installed later might have?) that makes it run slow. And if its the bad file system, this app, running all by itself, should have all the I/O bandwidth to itself so the access to the app's binaries should not have any lag... and neither should the access to the songs on the external SD card. So what exactly is causing the lag then? I don't see how the lagfix would solve this problem either. I actually have read that the lags would come back after a period of usage even with the lagfix. Anyone got an insight to this problem? What exactly is causing the lag? and why installing more apps seem to make it worse? and would Froyo be able to fix all these problems?
Thanks a lot.
@boarder838
I think you really need to read a lot more about just how Android works as you seem to have some strange ideas about how it works.
To start with you need to realise that having 200mb or 100mb of free Ram makes zero difference to performance only when you have no free Ram is it a problem and even then the system will sort it out for you by closing the least used program. Free Ram is just wasted Ram as it's not doing anything and will not make your device respond or work faster using a Auto Task Killer is wasting your battery and slowing down your device not speeding it up and saving battery as you seem to think. As i have pointed out above stop obsessing over your free Ram amount as unless you have none its not a problem stop using a Task Killer and you will most probably see your device responds faster as its not constantly killing things and just leaves them open doing nothing in the back ground which doesn't use Ram or Battery so just leave them be.
Yes Froyo will bring many improvements to our devices but won't fix a problem that doesn't exist re memory leaks and apps launching that you seem to think you have. I don't know but some of those apps may be system apps that need to run all the time which is why they keep relaunching. As for a lag fix well that's what we are all hoping for but if not I'm pretty sure the great people of this forum will come up with an easy to apply fix to it.
I have absolutely no problem playing Music or even streaming it over Bluetooth no lag stutters or break ups at all although my Music is on the Internal SD card. Maybe you should look at the quality that you have encoded your Music in as that may be causing problem. maybe some of the apps you have installed are also causing a problem but its impossible to know as we all install different apps and have different set ups.
I don't know how much experience you have with Android devices or flashing Roms but if you read enough and understand it you have the possibility to flash custom Rom's and various tweaks and fixes to make your device how you want it. That's part of the beauty of Android but don't rush into anything you are not sure about as you can end up with an expensive brick so read things many times and make sure you understand step by step what you are doing if you are going to attempt any of these things.
If you look at my signature you will see i am running a Custom Rom that includes a lag fix and various other tweaks it also allowed me to remove some of the programs in the official Rom that i didn't want or need. For me my device runs nice and smooth and fast of course I'm looking forward to Froyo and all the improvements that will bring but I'm quite happy with my Galaxy S the way it is now. Oh and this is my second Android device and I've never used a Task Killer never mind an Auto Task Killer and have never seen an out of Ram message either.
Marc
exactly what he said ^
Hi Marc,
Thanks for spending time to read through my long post and reply to it. I probably didn't explain my problem clearly in my post.
There were a couple of reasons I wanted to kill/stop the apps from starting:
1. Even before I installed any of those apps killer, I noticed that the available memory kept going down after a couple days of usage and it went down to below 100M. I figured some of the apps would need 10's of MB to run so I thought I should at least keep 100MB around so that it wouldn't run out of memory and start swapping when I start those apps. I don't know enough about Android but I assume its just like linux or other OS, when it runs out of physical memory, it would start swapping and slow things down. Even after I started using task killer and killed all the other tasks, the memory level would still not recover. That seems to point to a memory leak problem but using "Memory Booster" to do garbage collection seems to help. Still, it would be nice to be able to stop them from launching in the first place. <-- my first question.
2. I do not want any jobs/processes/apps that I don't need to run in the background to drain my battery. I don't think I can say for sure that those apps are all just idling and not using much CPU/battery. There are quite a few of them so if each of them use some CPU time/battery, it will add up eventually. Note that these are not system processes (or daemons as in unix's init.d). They are crappy apps from the cellular provider so I'm pretty sure they don't have to be running (they're probably just collecting my personal data or smth). I just thought there would be a way to stop them from launching without uninstalling them.
Thanks for answering my question regarding Froyo. If they would do the filesystem lagfix then I'll just wait for that update.
As for the music stuttering problem, my songs are on the external SD card but my old Nokia E85 phone has no problem playing with those songs on the same SD card. As I have pointed out in my last question, I was only running one app and with plenty of memory so it had nothing to do with available memory. I also suggested that however bad the filesystem was, the I/O bandwidth should still be enough to run this one music player app (access the program binary/libraries?) and to retrieve data from external SD card to play the music smoothly. So applying the lagfix probably won't help this problem though I still haven't tried the lagfix. Now I'm thinking that one of the task killer might be killing some system processes which were needed by the music player. I probably should uninstall all these task killers and see if it would help.
I have gotten the phone for only a couple of weeks so I haven't gotten around to try flashing different roms or rooting my phone. There's so much info scattered around on the web and I can't seem to find a source that really has the authority or complete information. I'll see if I have time later to look into all the tweaks and such but for now its just a phone to me and I just want it to run smoothly without having to spend too much effort to tune it.
Don't get me wrong. I still love the flexibility and customization opportunities provided by the Android platform and I just love to show off my "Beautiful Weather Widget", "Live Aquarium Wall Paper" and my cool 3D scrolling "Launcher Pro" to my iphone4 buddies and make them drool.
Thanks for you comment and let's hope Froyo will bring us a smooth running and stable platform.
Dogmann said:
@boarder838
I think you really need to read a lot more about just how Android works as you seem to have some strange ideas about how it works.
To start with you need to realise that having 200mb or 100mb of free Ram makes zero difference to performance only when you have no free Ram is it a problem and even then the system will sort it out for you by closing the least used program. Free Ram is just wasted Ram as it's not doing anything and will not make your device respond or work faster using a Auto Task Killer is wasting your battery and slowing down your device not speeding it up and saving battery as you seem to think. As i have pointed out above stop obsessing over your free Ram amount as unless you have none its not a problem stop using a Task Killer and you will most probably see your device responds faster as its not constantly killing things and just leaves them open doing nothing in the back ground which doesn't use Ram or Battery so just leave them be.
Yes Froyo will bring many improvements to our devices but won't fix a problem that doesn't exist re memory leaks and apps launching that you seem to think you have. I don't know but some of those apps may be system apps that need to run all the time which is why they keep relaunching. As for a lag fix well that's what we are all hoping for but if not I'm pretty sure the great people of this forum will come up with an easy to apply fix to it.
I have absolutely no problem playing Music or even streaming it over Bluetooth no lag stutters or break ups at all although my Music is on the Internal SD card. Maybe you should look at the quality that you have encoded your Music in as that may be causing problem. maybe some of the apps you have installed are also causing a problem but its impossible to know as we all install different apps and have different set ups.
I don't know how much experience you have with Android devices or flashing Roms but if you read enough and understand it you have the possibility to flash custom Rom's and various tweaks and fixes to make your device how you want it. That's part of the beauty of Android but don't rush into anything you are not sure about as you can end up with an expensive brick so read things many times and make sure you understand step by step what you are doing if you are going to attempt any of these things.
If you look at my signature you will see i am running a Custom Rom that includes a lag fix and various other tweaks it also allowed me to remove some of the programs in the official Rom that i didn't want or need. For me my device runs nice and smooth and fast of course I'm looking forward to Froyo and all the improvements that will bring but I'm quite happy with my Galaxy S the way it is now. Oh and this is my second Android device and I've never used a Task Killer never mind an Auto Task Killer and have never seen an out of Ram message either.
Marc
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oh I found the problem with stuttering music. It was the "beautiful weather widget"! I tried removing all the task killers and aquarium etc and it still wouldn't work. As soon as I removed the weather widget there was no problem with music playback anymore. Anyone has the same problem that pretty weather widget?? I've already set the refresh period to every 3 hours but it still wouldn't help?!
Hey folks,
I understand that Android keeps apps in available ram and frees them up as needed, but what I don't understand is how come when I run adv. task killer, there are always apps running that I never loaded (like social hub, email, etc.).
Does the galaxy s load up particular apps based on previous usage history or something?
shadoslayer said:
and frees them up as needed,
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
that was the original idea, but in reality it doesn't work that way
chances are you run out of RAM before it frees up anything if at all
the only certain way is to use AutoRunKillers apps and Task Managers apps to keep the software under control
I agree with AllGamer. Yes its supposed to load and unload tasks and services as it needs and thinks it needs but as AllGamer pointed out it doesn't work so well.
The best thing ive found so far and i'm sure it was AllGamer who put me on to this in his recommended apps list, is to use Autokiller Memory Optimizer. You will need to be rooted though, the program tweaks how the already built in task manager works in android. Ive set mine to moderate in the presets of the program, been running it for about a week and its been absolutely great.
The main thing to remember with good task managers and android is that you are not trying to 'free up ram' but to use it more effectively
Can't see why this is the case (but it obviously is) as long as I have lots of free disk space and not many apps running at the same time. Any logic in this?
I've been experiencing the same issue and wondering the same thing...
Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S GT-I9000 using Tapatalk Pro
There seems to be several things causing this, but the two key issues are:
The moviNAND (the internal flash drive/"SSD") firmware seems to have an issue with fsync() taking extremely long. E.g., it slows down whenever a file is written/updated on the internal storage.
RFS, the file system used by Samsung is buggy as hell and corrupts data after a while.
There are several topics on these issues in the Android Development forum. There are also several "lag fixes" trying their best to overcome these issues. Go check them out
Einride said:
There seems to be several things causing this, but the two key issues are:
RFS, the file system used by Samsung is buggy as hell and corrupts data after a while.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We have no idea if that is ACTUALLY true.. Just because fsck picked some things up on 1 phone, doesn't mean it happens everywhere.. Furthermore, it doesn't mean the problems detected affect operations
that has no truth at all about more apps slowing down the phone, my phone is the prove
Before jpk i didn't noticed slowdowns with aprox 100 apps, now i do on jpk =/
Prolly that all pictures/links/info stays in his workmemory?
probably cause some of them run in the system memory or run at startup
KaliKot said:
probably cause some of them run in the system memory or run at startup
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Bingo!
and that is what most people does not realize
they need to Optimize the phone, most people take it for granted
the phone is not a phone, the phone is a mini computer that fits in your hands
just like your big desktop PC it can go crazy if you don't take care of it
AllGamer said:
Bingo!
and that is what most people does not realize
they need to Optimize the phone, most people take it for granted
the phone is not a phone, the phone is a mini computer that fits in your hands
just like your big desktop PC it can go crazy if you don't take care of it
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Can you tell me why with the same apps installed on the Nexus it doesn't lag like the SGS?
Can you stop blaming users when is the phone which doesn't work as expected?
Oletros said:
Can you tell me why with the same apps installed on the Nexus it doesn't lag like the SGS?
Can you stop blaming users when is the phone which doesn't work as expected?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
utter ****e -i have well over 100 apps on my sgs and experience NO lag whatsoever!
bonehooch said:
utter ****e -i have well over 100 apps on my sgs and experience NO lag whatsoever!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Utter ****e? Why?
it was mentioned many many times
just install autorunkiller and a good task manager then all the problems will be gone
stock ROM is very fast when you maintain the phone
AllGamer said:
it was mentioned many many times
just install autorunkiller and a good task manager then all the problems will be gone
stock ROM is very fast when you maintain the phone
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
With autokiller the phone is still laggy.
And please, stop thinking I'm stupid or I don't know a **** about smartphones, ROM's changing, firmware or knowing how a phone must run.
AFAIK this topic and its responses are for the OP
I have about 190 Apps installed and do not experience any diferene in overall speed of the phone. But only because i know that a lot of the programms start on boot and stay in background.
I have more than 15 apps turned off with the full version of autorun killer to prevent the auto restart of the apps. Otherwise the phone would definetaly slow down.
It´s really incredible what apps start on the boot!
TMReuffurth said:
I have about 190 Apps installed and do not experience any diferene in overall speed of the phone. But only because i know that a lot of the programms start on boot and stay in background.
I have more than 15 apps turned off with the full version of autorun killer to prevent the auto restart of the apps. Otherwise the phone would definetaly slow down.
It´s really incredible what apps start on the boot!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Do you need to be rooted ti use all of the functions in autorun killer? I am not rooted.
Can you compile a breif list of the "biggest culprits" to stop with this utility to gain back the most speed and efficiency? I am a bit nervous that I will stop the wrong items and somehow damage my phone...
Autokiller and task killers are not the solution here! Quick lesson on Android, and why having even A SINGLE BAD APP is going to ruin your whole phone!
Android has something called an 'Intent'. In order to start an app, an intent is made by your launcher or a button you press, and the Android system reads this intent and works out what app it needs to start up.
There is a second type of intent though, called a 'Broadcast Intent'. This is an intent that is sent out to anything that is registered to listen to it. This means that an app can register to listen to all sorts of events, such as battery level changed, application start, or a tons of other things. Even if the application is closed, if it is registered as a listener, Android will start it right back up so it can deal with the intent. If the intent comes every 5 seconds, Android will run this app every 5 seconds even if you have a taskkiller killing the app.
The only real solution is to not install apps which are bad! Finding bad apps is a real mission, too. Hopefully in the future, utilities will be available to let us track down these terrible apps, but till then, you'll have to work it out yourself.
yiannisthegreek said:
Do you need to be rooted ti use all of the functions in autorun killer? I am not rooted.
Can you compile a breif list of the "biggest culprits" to stop with this utility to gain back the most speed and efficiency? I am a bit nervous that I will stop the wrong items and somehow damage my phone...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No need for Root to use all features of Autorun Killer. I would disable only the apps you know and which you do not need at startup and running in background, such as (in my case) Paypal, App Center from Androidpit, Daily Briefing, Photoshop Express, Word Press, TweetCaster, etc.
Every of these apps works normal, even when deactivatet on startup.
So unless you do not disable system apps (must be previously set enabled in settings) you are safe.
RyanZA said:
(...)There is a second type of intent though, called a 'Broadcast Intent'. This is an intent that is sent out to anything that is registered to listen to it.(...)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Is there any possibility/app to show what is registered for which app?
watching the apps
Samga said:
Is there any possibility/app to show what is registered for which app?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There is an app called Autostarts at 0.95$.
It shows what is launched au startup, when you enable/disable wifi etc.
It think it gives insight on how apps seems launching out of nowhere.
I also reccomend Watchdog Task Manager Lite, the free version.
It does not kill anything, but notifies and logs the bad apps that consumes over a certain CPU percentage.
So after some great help by gregbradley and others, I have a rooted T and now have an OTA 195 update.
However I have a couple of questions (apart from my continued quest to find a way to get the phone to save camera output in less compressed fashion.
1) Is it usual for mediaserver to be the 2nd great drain on battery after the screen and ahead of android system?
(there appear to be many web discussions on this, but I could not find a definitive answer. Mine has always been like this even before I tinkered with it, or before I put the sim in (I didn't put the sim in until after I had rooted and updated. I do not have an SD card in there yet (64Gb on order) and I have not added any new pics or movies to the stock provided ones.
2) Can you change where apps are installed? Can this be changed for Google Play apps (like xda) Is the default to install to "phone memory" rather than "internal storage". Given that "phone memory" is only ~ 2Gb, it would be good to install to "internal storage"
3) Are apps on the home screens (eg Walkman) always running, even when not in use (the walkman example is the app 4x1 icons wide and has basic controls on it)?
Many thanks as always!
icstm
some clarification I should have added yesterday...
1) quite simply I would be keen to know what type of apps call on the mediaserver process
2) I know that from the "apps" in settings" some apps can be moved, but that appears limited and no default can be set
3) when I say apps, I mean widgets and the like, not the simply shortcut icons
icstm said:
some clarification I should have added yesterday...
1) quite simply I would be keen to know what type of apps call on the mediaserver process
2) I know that from the "apps" in settings" some apps can be moved, but that appears limited and no default can be set
3) when I say apps, I mean widgets and the like, not the simply shortcut icons
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
1) Anything that needs to scan the sdcards for contents will call on the media server. After a fresh flash many apps will be collating their cache so the mediaserver may have a high battery drain, you should never worry about battery drain untill you have run a ROm for at least 3-4 days to let it settle
2) Yes, use apps such as link2sd or app2sd, free in the market. However I have not yet felt the need to do this with a 16gb internal memory
3) Thos e widgets are just shortcuts, e.g. I have a weather app set to refresh every 2 hours...it will be woring in the background whether or not the homescreen widget is on the homescreen or not.
However, do not worry about task killers, since android 2.1 the best task killer is the one that comes with the OS. The only other exception is if you install init.d scripts and supercharge scripts etc, but you may want to leave that for a bit and get used to the phone first.
So I am on the xda app, much better way to view the site than mobile browser .
However, I cannot see what you wrote when I reply.
But it relates to your last point on making customisations. And not just keyboard which prefers US spellings over UK ones .
I am thinking of tinkering with the OS files as I am very upset with the compression of photos. So I am keen by what you say just below number 3.
Sent from my LT30p using xda app-developers app
AW: [Q] Couple of days in - a couple of Qs...
Change your keyboard or even better your whole phone to UK in language and keyboard setting and it'll propose BE instead of USE.
Greg is correct, the media server goes nuts the first two to three days after (re)flashing or taking up a device. You can improve the situation by keeping your folder structure clean and neat and trash out left over files, old garbage and file system junk.
Thanks for your posts in both threads.
As for mediaserver, yes all is quiet now.
Not sure about which system files to delete at this stage, but I sure do keep a neat folder structure for my content.
Am running PA 3.60 which is great. I've now run some additional script that culls out and slims down the ROM and gapps. Again, everything runs great. I probably have a lot more memory free now than before. But I'm not sure what good that is.
Traditionally, we want to free up memory so we can install more apps - a2d and other methods help to keep things clear.
I don't want to do that - I want to be able to run more than one or two apps at the same time. But I don't know which memory types to clear up to do that.
The ROM is in, well, ROM, so making it smaller may not help free up memory if there's fixed 512MB used for it.
I know Android is actually running a lot of processes at once. What I mean is that if I load an app, say Candy Crush, then run another app, say Grindr, I can switch back and forth pretty much ok and each app resumes where it left off without any noticable reloading/refreshing. But if I then run another app, say Scruff, then as soon as I try to switch back to one of the others, it has to reload/refresh/restart. So clearly, there wasn't enough memory available to keep all 3 resident and it swapped some out or simply released it.
Logically, if I have more of a certain type of memory free, this will not happen as often. I know it depends on how much memory and other resources an app requires, but I don't need to get into that level of analysis yet. First and foremost, what sort of memory should I try to make as much of as possible to let me swtich between apps without so much reloading?
douginoz said:
Am running PA 3.60 which is great. I've now run some additional script that culls out and slims down the ROM and gapps. Again, everything runs great. I probably have a lot more memory free now than before. But I'm not sure what good that is.
Traditionally, we want to free up memory so we can install more apps - a2d and other methods help to keep things clear.
I don't want to do that - I want to be able to run more than one or two apps at the same time. But I don't know which memory types to clear up to do that.
The ROM is in, well, ROM, so making it smaller may not help free up memory if there's fixed 512MB used for it.
I know Android is actually running a lot of processes at once. What I mean is that if I load an app, say Candy Crush, then run another app, say Grindr, I can switch back and forth pretty much ok and each app resumes where it left off without any noticable reloading/refreshing. But if I then run another app, say Scruff, then as soon as I try to switch back to one of the others, it has to reload/refresh/restart. So clearly, there wasn't enough memory available to keep all 3 resident and it swapped some out or simply released it.
Logically, if I have more of a certain type of memory free, this will not happen as often. I know it depends on how much memory and other resources an app requires, but I don't need to get into that level of analysis yet. First and foremost, what sort of memory should I try to make as much of as possible to let me swtich between apps without so much reloading?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Try enabling zram, I haven't tried it personally but its supposed to allow for more multitasking.
Sent from my Nexus One using xda app-developers app
Moved To Q&A
You may of considered it dev based, but its a question so belongs in the Q&A section.
I've tried ZRAM now for a couple of days but makes no difference. I also have the problem on another Android device. I'm convinced its some sort of design limitation of the opsys or something. When I start up Grindr, it takes a long time to load all the images, make connections, etc. Then I start of Gruff, and it does the same. As long as I don't try to go to another app, I can flip between the two of them without them restarting/reloading/reinitialising themselves. That is clearly because their pages didn't get swapped out of memory or flagged for deletion and deleted.
But if I do something else, or even try to use additional functions within either app, its too much and the next time I try to flip to the other app, it has to reload and reestablish connections etc.
Its not just those apps either. The same with a game like Candy Crush. Or many many apps.
So either my devices don't have enough memory of some form to allow many concurrent apps to run without being swapped out, or Android can't handle it and unnecessarily swaps out or deletes a process's memory pages to make room for the next process, >>> even if the device has plenty of memory<<<.
I don't know which type of memory the opsys needs if this is the case. I'd like to know so that i can make sure there's ample available so that this constant restarting doesn't keep happening. It seems stupid to me that Android does this if the device has got "heaps" of available memory (no pun intended). Newer devices will continually have more and more built in memory, so if Android is doing this arbitrarily and not because of space issues then its, well, stupid.
I have to assume its my devices that are the problem. They're both old (Nook Color, Nexus One). But with the NC, I'd assume we can partition some of that 5GB for use as main memory to run lots of processes concurrently, without this annoying swapping/page deletion/forcing re-inits all the time.
I'm also having problems figuring out where in XDA to post this question - its not NC specific, or dev specific, but I need answers from people that know the Android architecture so I can work out if its possible to stop this from happening.