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As the title suggests, I'm considering jumping from my HTC One to the Nokia Lumia 1020, and I have some questions. If this is the wrong forum, I'm sorry.
1. Is it possible (even through a hack) to set a homescreen background? I used to do this on the WP 7 themes on my iPhone, and it looked great with transparent tiles.
2. Has Google gotten into WP8? Voice, Gmail, Play Music?
3. Photo editing. What sort of post-processing options are there? I must have had 10gb of just photo apps on my iPhone, and I'm kinda struggling now on Android.
4. Keyboards? I've become a Swiftkey addict. Is there anything comparable to this in Redmond's garden?
5. Twitter and Facebook? My fiance has a Lumia 900, however her Facebook and Twitter apps look awful. Tweetbot was the best Twitter client I've ever used, so my standards are high.
Thank you in advance for any insight.
Start screen backgrounds are still not supported. There are pseudo-hacks to do it, using a large array of customized tiles, but there's still black or white behind them. The hacking scene or WP8 has been very limited.
Gmail works fine on WP8, as it did on WP7. There's no official app that I know of, though. Google has no official Music app for the OS, but there are plenty of third party ones (I cannot comment on the quality as I use Pandora and Zune/Xbox Music Pass). There's also Nokia's music app, which I don't use. Google Voice is similar; no official app but several third-party ones, and WP8 allows apps to integrate into the phone system and to continue calls when backgrounded (this is how Skype works).
Lots of photo editing apps, plus time-of-shot "filters". I have no idea of their quality as a PC is, and always will be, better at that task.
Sadly, custom keyboards are not currently supported at all. The built-in keyboard is excellent, with nice new features like next-word prediction, but it's not customizable or aimed at specific nich users, nor is it (yet) replaceable.
I don't use Twitter, even the integrated functionality. The new version of the Facebook app is excellent, though. It's much faster, has more features, and looks better than the old app.
GoodDayToDie said:
Start screen backgrounds are still not supported. There are pseudo-hacks to do it, using a large array of customized tiles, but there's still black or white behind them. The hacking scene or WP8 has been very limited.
Gmail works fine on WP8, as it did on WP7. There's no official app that I know of, though. Google has no official Music app for the OS, but there are plenty of third party ones (I cannot comment on the quality as I use Pandora and Zune/Xbox Music Pass). There's also Nokia's music app, which I don't use. Google Voice is similar; no official app but several third-party ones, and WP8 allows apps to integrate into the phone system and to continue calls when backgrounded (this is how Skype works).
Lots of photo editing apps, plus time-of-shot "filters". I have no idea of their quality as a PC is, and always will be, better at that task.
Sadly, custom keyboards are not currently supported at all. The built-in keyboard is excellent, with nice new features like next-word prediction, but it's not customizable or aimed at specific nich users, nor is it (yet) replaceable.
I don't use Twitter, even the integrated functionality. The new version of the Facebook app is excellent, though. It's much faster, has more features, and looks better than the old app.
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Thanks for the responses. With regards to music, I had a 64gb iPhone 4S and still have an active subscription to iTunes in the Cloud. So I could store most of my music on my phone, and have access to the rest as needed. My One is only 32gb, so I keep some music on it, and the rest I stream via Google Play.
As for Google, does WP8 integrate with Google Voice at all? Or is there at least an app?
With photos, there are some apps from iOS that I truely miss, and haven't seen any alternatives on Android as of yet. I fear my pickings will be even slimmer on WP8.
Does the built in keyboard have anything akin to Swype? I'm fairly certain my girls WP7 does not.
As my girl does have WP7, she can't upgrade to the newest Facebook and is thus stuck with the awful one she currently has.
Thanks again.
As I mentioned, there are apps for streaming music from Google. Nothing official, but the reviews say they work.
There's one app I can find in the store, "Spare Phone", which claims to integrate somewhat (and has the WP8-specific app capability to do so). However, it looks like it can't recieve GV calls directly (forward to your mobile number or take voicemail notifications only) when it's in the background. I'm pretty sure the dev could fix this with enough effort. The app costs $3.49 USD, so I can't easily test if for you. There's no OS-level integration with GV, which doesn't surprise me in the least. Google is Microsoft's biggest competitor in this space...
I have no real idea what the photo app situation is like. There are tons of them, some well-rated, plus some built-in features of the OS. I still prefer to do my photo editing with the power and precision of a PC, though, so I haven't tried. The photos are overcompressed as is (all smartphone photos are), so manipulating them tends to produce artifacts anyhow.
Nothing like Swype, sorry. Microsoft really needs to get with the picture there. It's especially sad/funny, considering that Swype was originally for Windows Mobile and (according to a guy I know who works there) they'd be happy to bring it to WP, but MS hasn't allowed it yet.
Most of my FB on the phone is just done using the built-in integration (People hub, Messaging hub. etc.), but the new WP8 app really is excellent.
1. No you can't set homescreen background. I hope it will be coming in WP Blue update.
2.Gmail works fine, Xbox music is very much better option.
3. WP store is full of lots of photo editing apps, 1020 itself has proshot app. I think you would be very happy in this department.
4.No, unfortunately but you can expect it in updates.
5. Both official apps are very very good. FB just got updated and it's very good. You can also have beta app which updates continuously so FB support from MS is very much active. Official twitter app has everything you want, same as its iOS & Android counter part.
Instagram has 3rd party app instance which is very good, even you can save photo in it. Official Vine app is coming till then 6 sec is available.
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 4 Beta
Google Voice is handled quite nicely by Metrotalk. It takes some work to get setup properly, but once setup works very seamlessly.
Google has no official apps (aside from a poor Google search app) on Windows Phone, and the only thing known on the horizon is an official YouTube app (a joint project between Microsoft and Google). Otherwise Google has been pretty anti-Windows Phone. If you want the quality and selection of Google apps and services that you find on an Android phone, you simply won't get it anywhere except Android. Windows Phone and even iPhone don't compare to what Google offers on it's own platform. There are third party apps, and some of them are decent.
The Twitter and Facebook apps for WP8 now very closely match the functionality and look/feel of their official counterparts on iOS and Android. They still aren't as awesome, but thankfully, because of the tight OS integration, they aren't necessarily needed as much as you would need them on iOS or Android.
Nothing close to Swype and I'm gonna take a guess and say that it won't be coming anytime soon. There just isn't a demand for it. Clearly there is one here on this site (and other enthusiast sites), but this is a site made up of hardcore tweakers and enthusiasts. In the real world, most people do not know what Swype is and simply don't bother to learn it even if it is available to them. The Windows Phone keyboard is an excellent stock keyboard, and with some of the improvements being seen in Windows 8.1, you can expect it to get better as time goes on.
Almost any kind of configuring, tweaking, or hacking you may be used to on Android goes out the window with Windows Phone 8. For the most part, the operating system just works, so you don't always need it (like iOS), but some people still have that itch to tweak, and if that's you, Windows Phone 8 may not make you happy. But then again, I used to be that type of person, but once I got used to a platform that just worked and didn't need me to go ROM hunting every week, its just became so much better. The operating system is just so much more secure than WP7 or Android, so there isn't much of a development/hacking community for it.
As with any upgrade, new line, or purchase, you should have an opportunity to try it for a bit before you go past the point of no return. So your best bet is to try it as your main driver for a week and see how it works for you.
prjkthack said:
The operating system is just so much more secure than WP7 or Android, so there isn't much of a development/hacking community for it.
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You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.
Security, in the context of operating systems or really anything else, is about granting or revoking authorization for access or activity. The key point, there, is "authorization". Authority is a property of ownership. However, I actually have relatively (compared to other OSes) little ability to authorize, *or* revoke authorization for, actions occurring on what is nominally my phone. So, which of the following is true?
A) It's not my phone; it's actually owned by Microsoft, the OEM, and the operator (but mostly Microsoft).
B) The OS is "so much more" locked down than WP7 or Android, and is actually pretty meager on security features.
Did you know that on some Android ROMs, you can do things like prevent apps from making using of certain capabilities while still using the app? That on WP7, you can disable the "Microsoft, may I install or run sideloaded apps?" check that the OS makes periodically without your authorization? Now *that* is an increase in security!
GoodDayToDie said:
You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.
Security, in the context of operating systems or really anything else, is about granting or revoking authorization for access or activity. The key point, there, is "authorization". Authority is a property of ownership. However, I actually have relatively (compared to other OSes) little ability to authorize, *or* revoke authorization for, actions occurring on what is nominally my phone. So, which of the following is true?
A) It's not my phone; it's actually owned by Microsoft, the OEM, and the operator (but mostly Microsoft).
B) The OS is "so much more" locked down than WP7 or Android, and is actually pretty meager on security features.
Did you know that on some Android ROMs, you can do things like prevent apps from making using of certain capabilities while still using the app? That on WP7, you can disable the "Microsoft, may I install or run sideloaded apps?" check that the OS makes periodically without your authorization? Now *that* is an increase in security!
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Whether the product is yours or not does not matter much here. At its base level, all the platforms are "locked down" to a certain extent, some more than others, and what you can do is limited by what the OEMs (Microsoft, Apple, or Google) say you can do. Now you can go ahead and throw hacks at it, tear it apart, or throw money at it to completely change it, but that's going beyond the scope of this discussion. They choose what permissions you may alter or ask for. Finding loopholes to get around permissions or authorization goes beyond what the original manufacturer intended, but its pretty fair to say that its far easier to circumvent security on Android than on any other platform. Android's inherently more "open" platform allows for greater risk at times because it isn't as locked down as iOS or Windows Phone.
That being said, being more locked down inherently offers more security or at the very least, piece of mind, whether that be protection from scripts or hacks, viruses, financial security, or just preventing errors/crashes. Denying or granting access to certain activities, or just flat out not having the option to deny/grant certain activities can be the base for a safer, more reliable, more secure operating environment. "Security" and being "locked down", in some cases, go hand in hand. Of course it can mean many different things to many people.
Now you could also be referring to other "security" features like corporate encryption policies or secure NFC or stuff like that, but that wasn't part of the original discussion, so my use of the word security does not include any of that, but I understand that certainly those types of security features may or may not exist between platforms.
So I have another question.
I've been quite spoiled by 64gb of storage on my 4S combined with iTunes in the Cloud and lately been forced to stream from Play Music due to my One only having 32gb of storage.
Does WP8 have any sort of set up where I upload my music collection to the cloud and can download/stream from there? I do have a 50gb AT&T Locker account, but I'd rather use something that's a little more polished.
OGhoul said:
So I have another question.
I've been quite spoiled by 64gb of storage on my 4S combined with iTunes in the Cloud and lately been forced to stream from Play Music due to my One only having 32gb of storage.
Does WP8 have any sort of set up where I upload my music collection to the cloud and can download/stream from there? I do have a 50gb AT&T Locker account, but I'd rather use something that's a little more polished.
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Yes, you have 7GB of skydrive space for free, can be increased for additional cost.
mcosmin222 said:
Yes, you have 7GB of skydrive space for free, can be increased for additional cost.
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I have over 60 gigs of music alone.
OGhoul said:
I have over 60 gigs of music alone.
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I doubt anybody is going to give you 60 gigs of storage for free (ATT does not count, since you pay for it anyway)
There are apps which can stream from Google Music.
Alternatively, get a phone that has a microSD slot; my ATIV S has 80GB of total local storage, never mind the amount I have in my butt.
mcosmin222 said:
I doubt anybody is going to give you 60 gigs of storage for free (ATT does not count, since you pay for it anyway)
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iCloud.
OGhoul said:
iCloud.
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so then what's the problem?
I mean, you can stream it the same way you did on your HTC one.
But unless you want that camera badly, there is no real reason to get the lumia 1020.
lumia 820 or Ativ S are probably better for you.
mcosmin222 said:
so then what's the problem?
I mean, you can stream it the same way you did on your HTC one.
But unless you want that camera badly, there is no real reason to get the lumia 1020.
lumia 820 or Ativ S are probably better for you.
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The camera is the reason I'm considering a WP. Don't get me wrong, I like the Metro UI. I would usually install a Metro theme on my iPhone when I had it. I'm tremendously underwhelmed with Android and in particular, the camera in my One, which is what prompted my questions.
Basically, if I can get WP8 to do things close to as seamless as they are on iOS, I'd really consider switching. If I'm reading this correctly, SkyDrive offers automatic syncing of photos to my PC from my phone, the way iCloud does?
OGhoul said:
The camera is the reason I'm considering a WP. Don't get me wrong, I like the Metro UI. I would usually install a Metro theme on my iPhone when I had it. I'm tremendously underwhelmed with Android and in particular, the camera in my One, which is what prompted my questions.
Basically, if I can get WP8 to do things close to as seamless as they are on iOS, I'd really consider switching. If I'm reading this correctly, SkyDrive offers automatic syncing of photos to my PC from my phone, the way iCloud does?
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Yes windows phone will upload full res images to skydrive. Great feature actually. BTW have you looked at Xbox music? Its similar to Google play music and iTunes streaming. Take a look, it might be what your looking for: http://www.xbox.com/en-US/music
Sent from my Nexus 7 using xda app-developers app
Xbox music, Pandora, Nokia Music all work great on my 1020. And something new in WP8, it can sync from your iTunes library. (new WP8 desktop app, no more Zune app like used for WP7)
Did you ever get the 1020 and what were your thoughts?
Sent from my XT1058 using Tapatalk 4
Is there an application that can password protect certain apps that I choose?
And please do not say Kids Corner as it does not do what I am asking.
It's probably possible (though far from easy), but I'd actually be more inclined to help if you hadn't opened a duplicate thread about this.
Only made second thread about this to attract some attention, 7 months passed since that guy opened his thread and nobody could give a good answer.
To me it's weird that nobody tried to make an app like this still, it would be very popular and help users very much.
Anyways, thank you for replying.
Really, just bumping the other thread was enough, but since we're here anyhow... my idea for how to approach it (and this would take a *lot* of hacking) goes something like this:
1. Create an app (call it X) that has the capability to launch other apps, and filesystem write access.
2. Have X take another app (call it Y) and encrypt its binaries. This prevents anybody from launching it by any means.
3. Tweak the app database to make it so that when you try to launch Y, it instead launches X and passes the id of Y as a parameter to the launcher.
4. X prompts the user for a password to Y. On getting the right one, it decrypts Y's binaries and writes them back to the correct location, then launches Y.
5. When the user (or OS) closes Y, a background process of X notes that Y is closed and re-encrypts it.
Currently we know how to do... well, some of #1, and we think the rest is possible. Given that, #2 isn't too hard. #3 is something I don't have the least notion how to do *right now* but I'm sure it's possible. #4 shouldn't be too hard given #1 and #2. #5 will be a trick - currently, apps have no way to know what other apps are running - but I'm sure it can be done.
It's a large engineering problem blocked by an even bigger research and hacking problem, though. Nothing we'll have soon. You'd never be able to publish it in the store, either, and it would only work for people with hacked phones. It's exactly the kind of *useful* thing that would be possible if Microsoft were willing to let up the restrictions on third-party developers a bit, of course, But for the time being, there are *reasons* nobody has done it yet.
Well the word that I actually was thinking after reading your post was "crap".
It seems only with time (and a whole [email protected]#$ing lot of it) will wp become a true competitor to android, but to be honest I don't think it will come to that.
Thanks for replying GoodDayToDie, I'm freakin' sad that there is no app that can suit my needs, I even tried with kids corner but the screen still needs the password entered like the normal one. Nothing really can make up for what I have in mind.
Cheers mate.
as soon as we can interop unlock all WP devices, it will be pretty easy... if you're able to provide the XAP (uncrypted of course )
i'll be able to "mod" this in for you... which app are we talking about?
@GoodDayToDie: i do'nt think he is looking for real data security here, so encrypting the whole thing shouldnt be required... i think it's more about preventing his gf to read his private messages or something like that
oh btw.: you would need a dev-unlock to deploy the modified XAP then...
tfBullet said:
as soon as we can interop unlock all WP devices, it will be pretty easy... if you're able to provide the XAP (uncrypted of course )
i'll be able to "mod" this in for you... which app are we talking about?
@GoodDayToDie: i do'nt think he is looking for real data security here, so encrypting the whole thing shouldnt be required... i think it's more about preventing his gf to read his private messages or something like that
oh btw.: you would need a dev-unlock to deploy the modified XAP then...
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You're right tfBullet! I need it for whatsapp, photos, message and games app, mostly to prevent from friends but gf too.
I was thinking it might be possible to mod an app and add password before it can be accessed, although I have no experience in this domain. Many apps in store have this function, like wallet or prive photo apps.
My phone is dev-unlocked as I started a few days ago to study and try to create a simple app for me and my friends.
Modding an app like that would actually be quite hard, because it would break the signature and prevent the app from running. The encryption thing really isn't too hard, although you could skip it anyhow too.
If there was a way to run a program in the background that monitors when certain apps are selected and then prompts when its activated would work, but it would need an unlocked phone. And even under home brew I don't know if its possible to run apps in the background. Yet.
Sent from my Nokia 521 using XDA Windows Phone 8 App
The encryption thing really isn't too hard
Yea, but that's a little extreme. If you can create that password program that runs in the background you could probably have it watch files, apps or pretty much anything. You'd have to password protect the cofig file. And maybe if you can't remember the password after so many attempts you can have the program email the passwords to your email. Just some ideas.
Sent from my Nokia 521 using XDA Windows Phone 8 App
Running software in the background is actually shockingly easy. The trick is getting it to run with better-than-app-sandbox privileges. We're still working on that one. In the meantime, apps can't even read, much less write, to the install location of other apps.
GoodDayToDie said:
Modding an app like that would actually be quite hard, because it would break the signature and prevent the app from running.
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@GoodDayToDie: actually these .NET apps are pretty easy to decompile, if you're willing to fix the bugs that the decompiler leaves you with...
so there is not really a need for a valid signature, if you're able to compile & sideload the app yourself
the only thing is: you need the decrypted XAP, as far as i know these get decrypted while installation and can be pulled from a interop unlocked device?!
It would be nice to get my fingers on some OEM (Nokia etc..) XAPs, to see if we can find any exploit in them
I know better than probably 95% of this forum what it takes to decompile managed code; I have reverse engineered huge numbers of apps. However, you are missing several important points.
1) Modifications like you suggest are very complicated to automate. It's certainly possible, but it's not simple.
2) Re-installing the app would be a pain. You would really want to do this as an in-place modification, and that means (for store apps) that it would still be signature-checked.
3) Not all apps are managed code; WP8 supports purely native code.
4) Even with managed code, obfuscation can make tinkering with the binary nigh-impossible.
It's just so incredibly stupid that WP is so limited. I know it's under Android big time, but I think even iOS more customizable, right?
Also, is there a message app in the store that has pass option? I searched but found nothing...
I don't believe iOS is any more customizable, no. It has some feature that WP lacks (it ought to; it's been out for years longer and Apple completely controls the hardware it runs on) but it's also missing some features that WP8 offers. In any case, this isn't the thread to have that discussion in.
GoodDayToDie said:
I don't believe iOS is any more customizable, no. It has some feature that WP lacks (it ought to; it's been out for years longer and Apple completely controls the hardware it runs on) but it's also missing some features that WP8 offers. In any case, this isn't the thread to have that discussion in.
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But with the jailbreak and MobileSubstrate, iOS is extremely customizable, and there are tons of tweaks, that's where Apple gets its new features from
Back to topic, I think the OP would be happy with a solution that locks the "normal" user of his phone out of some apps, so it wouldn't be necessary to modify anything of it, just making the standard launcher (I don't know how it's called, but I mean when you launch the app via home screen or with a toast) ask for a password should be enough.
[Challenge] Why is "because X phone won't work with Gear Manager" acceptable?
I find this hard to believe and a slightly lazy answer to a common problem. There is obviously code in the APK that refuses to work on any non-Samsung device. Dozens of threads exist with people offering up the entire Gear APK catalog, some trying to get it to work on Nexus & and others.
fOmey and others have reverse engineered the entire ROM, but no one has figured out a way to "fix" one single app to allow it to work with all phones?
Is this not a work-in-progress somewhere? It's certainly not in any thread I have found.
What are the limitations to such a venture? Has it been tried? Is there a copyright issue? What reason has this not been attempted?
Our community has done some amazing things over the years and this site is the go-to place for rooting and hacking. There has to be one sole out there willing to give this a shot.
I am, by no means, a programmer or coder. I would take this up, but I do not have the skillset. Best I can do is go through XML files and the like hoping to find "if X=Z then A" and remove it.
Ultimately this would give us the missing companion to null_ that allows notifications and interactivity (i.e. Music player controls, etc)
So-- any takers?
I have a Nexus 5, even with the app fully running, I can only get the phone call part to work - talk/listen/incoming caller contact name
The way to get around unsupported device is with the GearManagerStub apk
I've had a bit of a search through most of the code, and from what I can tell all the apks are included so can only conclude there must be something in tw framework. Or I missed something...
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2549058
Brendo said:
even with the app fully running, I can only get the phone call part to work - talk/listen/incoming caller contact name
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This is not helped by the app. I have mine tethered to an iPhone 3gs(not by choice) and it works fine with no software at all.
styz said:
This is not helped by the app. I have mine tethered to an iPhone 3gs(not by choice) and it works fine with no software at all.
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To load the gear manager app, it is.. You simply connected your gear via bluetooth.
The gear manager app pushes notifications to the gear.
Without the GearManagerStub.apk it fails to load, its depends on this particular app.
It's pretty simple actually - and the same reason Sense doesn't run (well) on non-HTC devices. Samsung's got a huge proprietary framework on their phones that their proprietary apps expect to be in place and depend on. So plopping Gear Manager on a phone that doesn't have the expected underlying s/w causes it to fail or deliver bits and pieces of functionality. Someone could probably figure out which pieces of Samsung's framework need to be in place but if there are a ton of them adding useless bloat (outside the Gear functionality) wouldn't it be easier just to use the Gear with a Samsung phone? And the design point Samsung's chosen (dependency on proprietary Samsung code on the phone for the Gear to work) pretty much tells you that, at least for now, they are happy with restricting Gear sales to owners of Samsung devices. Hell, the SGS4 GPe doesn't even support the Gear.
Just a personal thought, at $299 (I know, it was 30% less at T-Mobile) the Gear's a questionable investment (AKA: a "play thing") as it is. Accepting that key features (of the few provided) are missing to get it to work on a non-Samsung phone seems like a great garage project but not a very good use of $299. Just my opinion of course.
BarryH_GEG said:
It's pretty simple actually - and the same reason Sense doesn't run (well) on non-HTC devices. Samsung's got a huge proprietary framework on their phones that their proprietary apps expect to be in place and depend on. So plopping Gear Manager on a phone that doesn't have the expected underlying s/w causes it to fail or deliver bits and pieces of functionality. Someone could probably figure out which pieces of Samsung's framework need to be in place but if there are a ton of them adding useless bloat (outside the Gear functionality) wouldn't it be easier just to use the Gear with a Samsung phone? And the design point Samsung's chosen (dependency on proprietary Samsung code on the phone for the Gear to work) pretty much tells you that, at least for now, they are happy with restricting Gear sales to owners of Samsung devices. Hell, the SGS4 GPe doesn't even support the Gear.
Just a personal thought, at $299 (I know, it was 30% less at T-Mobile) the Gear's a questionable investment (AKA: a "play thing") as it is. Accepting that key features (of the few provided) are missing to get it to work on a non-Samsung phone seems like a great garage project but not a very good use of $299. Just my opinion of course.
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I am purchasing home automation items and bluetooth adaptors for my vehicle so I don't think of this as a toy. I consider it a great step forward.
fOmey said:
...Without the GearManagerStub.apk it fails to load, its depends on this particular app.
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I installed the stub and the gearmanager apks and it still gave me a 'unsupported device' message. *sadface*
therealduckie said:
I am purchasing home automation items and bluetooth adaptors for my vehicle so I don't think of this as a toy. I consider it a great step forward.
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Just because you can doesn't mean you should. Why would an underpowered device with a 315mAh battery, 512MB of RAM, and a 1.63" display be the best "tool for the job" you described? Especially when it requires a host in near-by proximity for the majority of its functions? It's great what people are doing with the Gear outside the mission Samsung released it for but, like I said before, you're talking about parlor tricks more for sport than serving a function unachievable by better means; some of which are more practical. And if you're trying to use the Gear while driving, especially if you've shrunk the DPI with a launcher, good luck. It's hard enough using the basic functions and S Voice while driving without ending up in another lane. I'm not criticizing everyone's ingenuity and cleverness just pointing out how impractical some things can appear when you take in to account what the Gear really is; a shamefully low-spec, low functionality Android "phone" with a tiny screen that happens to have a wrist band.
BarryH_GEG said:
It's pretty simple actually - and the same reason Sense doesn't run (well) on non-HTC devices. Samsung's got a huge proprietary framework on their phones that their proprietary apps expect to be in place and depend on. So plopping Gear Manager on a phone that doesn't have the expected underlying s/w causes it to fail or deliver bits and pieces of functionality. Someone could probably figure out which pieces of Samsung's framework need to be in place but if there are a ton of them adding useless bloat (outside the Gear functionality) wouldn't it be easier just to use the Gear with a Samsung phone? And the design point Samsung's chosen (dependency on proprietary Samsung code on the phone for the Gear to work) pretty much tells you that, at least for now, they are happy with restricting Gear sales to owners of Samsung devices. Hell, the SGS4 GPe doesn't even support the Gear.
Just a personal thought, at $299 (I know, it was 30% less at T-Mobile) the Gear's a questionable investment (AKA: a "play thing") as it is. Accepting that key features (of the few provided) are missing to get it to work on a non-Samsung phone seems like a great garage project but not a very good use of $299. Just my opinion of course.
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That's why this is a challenge
Im intrigued.. I want to figure this out, I prefer to use AOSP. Iv been forced to go back to TouchWiz since owning a gear.
I might have to do some more digging around.
therealduckie said:
I installed the stub and the gearmanager apks and it still gave me a 'unsupported device' message. *sadface*
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Depends how you do it? I moved the apk to system/app and then had to install it (so that it was in data/app as com.whatever as it looks for apk based on that name). May not need it in system app anymore
Which phone?
---------- Post added at 11:08 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:07 AM ----------
fOmey said:
That's why this is a challenge
Im intrigued.. I want to figure this out, I prefer to use AOSP. Iv been forced to go back to TouchWiz since owning a gear.
I might have to do some more digging around.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Do you know how much touchwiz is in google edition roms? Does gear fully work with ge roms?
Brendo said:
Depends how you do it? I moved the apk to system/app and then had to install it (so that it was in data/app as com.whatever as it looks for apk based on that name). May not need it in system app anymore
Which phone?
---------- Post added at 11:08 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:07 AM ----------
Do you know how much touchwiz is in google edition roms? Does gear fully work with ge roms?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sadly I was able to test extensively using GE, although I did find all the initial APK's installed & completed successfully.
I didn't get a chance to pair up completely, the base keeps randomly rebooting (nothing related to the gear). This could be due a modified gearmanagerstub.apk on the GE base, I'm not entirely sure.
I could easily upload a version of the stub APK, you can give it a go on your nexus ?
EDIT: GearManagerStub.apk : From KitKat Google Edition (i9505) & (Uninstall existing GearManager.apk before testing).
BarryH_GEG said:
Just because you can doesn't mean you should. Why would an underpowered device with a 315mAh battery, 512MB of RAM, and a 1.63" display be the best "tool for the job" you described? Especially when it requires a host in near-by proximity for the majority of its functions? It's great what people are doing with the Gear outside the mission Samsung released it for but, like I said before, you're talking about parlor tricks more for sport than serving a function unachievable by better means; some of which are more practical. And if you're trying to use the Gear while driving, especially if you've shrunk the DPI with a launcher, good luck. It's hard enough using the basic functions and S Voice while driving without ending up in another lane. I'm not criticizing everyone's ingenuity and cleverness just pointing out how impractical some things can appear when you take in to account what the Gear really is; a shamefully low-spec, low functionality Android "phone" with a tiny screen that happens to have a wrist band.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Gear, with null_, requires no host. It can also connect to bluetooth enabled devices other than a phone.
I was motivated but this: http://daisyworks.net/btgarage.html
It's brilliant and exactly what i have needed for years.
Other interesting links:
http://www.smarthome.com/android_apps.html
http://www.instructables.com/id/Home-Automation-using-Arduino-Android-Phone/
Fact is, this is not a toy when something like null_ is used. It offers a great deal more functionality in a much smaller and more portable/handy package.
Your bias against the device is obvious so it begs the question: why are you here? Just to raise your post count and stir drama in an otherwise peaceful sub-group? Or, do you own it and you are so disappointed that you refuse to see its potential?
Either way, your negativity will not sway me or change my mind. I know it has potential and I plan to use it fully. The fact that it has a wristband is a feature and a plus.
Oh, and I don't consider something that has multiple times the computing power of the original Apollo moon landings "low specs". <3
fOmey said:
To load the gear manager app, it is.. You simply connected your gear via bluetooth.
The gear manager app pushes notifications to the gear.
Without the GearManagerStub.apk it fails to load, its depends on this particular app.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Maybe i wasn't clear in my post. I was responding to the phone call portion of the gear. Even without the software installed it still allows the phone calls to be taken and shows the contact information on the watch just like it did on the g4s with the app. All i was saying is that he commented that he was only able to get the phone portion working with the app and i was explaining that you can do that without the app.
fOmey said:
EDIT: GearManagerStub.apk : From KitKat Google Edition (i9505) & (Uninstall existing GearManager.apk before testing).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Tried it. Same result. 2 gear manager apps still refuse to install - music and weather (I believe because they reply on specific apps?). Nfc setup connection still works. App still works, but no details get sent to watch. Perhaps tw framework hooks in and serves data to gearmanagerstub, then stub sends to manager, which sends to watch?
---------- Post added at 11:48 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:47 AM ----------
styz said:
Maybe i wasn't clear in my post. I was responding to the phone call portion of the gear. Even without the software installed it still allows the phone calls to be taken and shows the contact information on the watch just like it did on the g4s with the app. All i was saying is that he commented that he was only able to get the phone portion working with the app and i was explaining that you can do that without the app.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, from what I understand, the Bluetooth headset part is the only 'generic' part of the watch. It receives data just like a car headset when it displays contact info etc
Just installed that STUB with both the 1.5 and 1.2 GM and both still showed me a 'device not supported" error message.
I spent about 2 hours with Samsung one night and they told me it had to do with baseband version...or that mine was a 4.1 baseband (even though I am running CM 10.2 with 4.3 OS).
Perhaps there is a lockout on older baseband versions?
This is an SG3 phone, by the way.
therealduckie said:
Just installed that STUB with both the 1.5 and 1.2 GM and both still showed me a 'device not supported" error message.
I spent about 2 hours with Samsung one night and they told me it had to do with baseband version...or that mine was a 4.1 baseband (even though I am running CM 10.2 with 4.3 OS).
Perhaps there is a lockout on older baseband versions?
This is an SG3 phone, by the way.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How did you install? Try deleting; move to system/app; installing from system/app
Brendo said:
How did you install? Try deleting; move to system/app; installing from system/app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry, I should have been more clear...
I installed them both fine. It's when i try to pair the Gear that I get that message.
therealduckie said:
Sorry, I should have been more clear...
I installed them both fine. It's when i try to pair the Gear that I get that message.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Did you delete the touchwiz launcher off your gear ? That will cause a unsupported device error also.. learnt this the hard way !
Brendo said:
Tried it. Same result. 2 gear manager apps still refuse to install - music and weather (I believe because they reply on specific apps?). Nfc setup connection still works. App still works, but no details get sent to watch. Perhaps tw framework hooks in and serves data to gearmanagerstub, then stub sends to manager, which sends to watch?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you can narrow down which two of those APK's dont install, I can try figure out why.. First step on getting this working is simply identifying what exactly is not working and why.
Once we can get gearmanager running on other branded phones, I'm confident the notifications may work.. or atleast the "more notifications".
fOmey said:
Did you delete the touchwiz launcher off your gear ? That will cause a unsupported device error also.. learnt this the hard way !
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm using Nova Launcher as my launcher on my phone. TouchWiz doesn't even load on boot, that I am aware of.
fOmey said:
Did you delete the touchwiz launcher off your gear ? That will cause a unsupported device error also.. learnt this the hard way !
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Really? I still have tw on my gear :s
If you can narrow down which two of those APK's dont install, I can try figure out why.. First step on getting this working is simply identifying what exactly is not working and why.
Once we can get gearmanager running on other branded phones, I'm confident the notifications may work.. or atleast the "more notifications".
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I still have to install all the extra apks manually
- SAMusicProvider_signed.apk
- SAWeatherProvider_signed.apk
In order from most annoying:
Cannot whitelist k9 mail (and other things) from power saving (this is a deal breaker, I'm taking it back)
Long press to select text instead of double click (vanilla android allows both) (almost a deal breaker)
Media volume cannot be increased without acknowledging warning when BT connected
Can’t disable bixby button without samsung account
No root (needed to run webserver on 80 and change iptables)
Fingerprint sensor hard to find, hard to touch (compared to nexus 6p)
Default phone app sucks and can’t be changed
-Notifications for blocked numbers calling
-Hard to block numbers
-Hard to add recent calls to contacts (uses wrong account or something)
Volume buttons hard to find, on wrong side of phone
Samsung sms app is ugly and horrible (replaceable)
Samsung calendar app does not allow multiple default reminders (replaceable)
Lock screen time is on multiple lines with no way to change it
Thats nice. Enjoy.
swooperstar said:
bleh bleh bleh
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Where is the question? Wrong forum, maybe you should tell someone who cares?
Um, what phone is this, half the things you complain about can be done by the note 8, so must be another phone. Maybe he got the wrong forum...
Sent from my Galaxy Note8 using XDA Labs
Incorrect, but whatever. Pixel2 XL coming next week to replace this samsuck. This site used to be more help less fanboy.
...more help less fan boy
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not about fanboys, you didn't ask for any help, just listed complaints. No one cares about personal complaints.
lol once again the user is the problem not the device... you can do all of those things either with an app from the play store or with root. maybe stick to something more simple? try iOS.
Not sure how moving to another Android device will help you. :laugh:
Being that the OP has a total of 9, count them 9 posts and is a junior member, I'm guessing he's referring to the old days on the site when we were more help and less fanbois
Mr.Ash.Man said:
lol once again the user is the problem not the device... you can do all of those things either with an app from the play store or with root. maybe stick to something more simple? try iOS.
Not sure how moving to another Android device will help you. :laugh:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
He is already using IOS!
Ryland
Now we know from authoritative source that volume button is on the wrong side all those years, imagine that.
There are ways to adjust pretty much all of these points. Some are android specific - assume you are new to Android??
Did you even review the phone/play with it before spending on something you have chosen to dislike? To be fair you've come to a forum where 99.9999% of people are note enthusiasts so you will be whacked with a great big stick with a post like this :silly:
Ok how do you whitelist from power saving in a way that actually works? The settings interface for that is much different than stock android and doesn't actually let stuff run all the time like it does on my 6p. k9 always says syncing disabled (and works fine on 6p with stock nougat or oreo).
How do you get double-tap to select a word in text? Works by default in stock android.
After asking twice before to confirm increase volume while BT connected, it didn't ask this last time I increased it. I guess it is magically ok now.
How do you disable bixby button without creating a samsung account? There is an app that used to work using accessibility but no longer works in latest update.
How do you get root? The rooting page itself says "2.Enable OEM Unlock from developer option (Currently no workaround for those who doesn't have this option)" and I don't have this option.
How do you change the phone app? I tried downloading and installing one from apkmirror and got an error when installing.
How do you prevent notifications when blocked callers call?
How do you get normal time on the lock screen? Not the always on screen.
swooperstar said:
Ok how do you whitelist from power saving in a way that actually works? The settings interface for that is much different than stock android and doesn't actually let stuff run all the time like it does on my 6p. k9 always says syncing disabled (and works fine on 6p with stock nougat or oreo).
How do you get double-tap to select a word in text? Works by default in stock android.
After asking twice before to confirm increase volume while BT connected, it didn't ask this last time I increased it. I guess it is magically ok now.
How do you disable bixby button without creating a samsung account? There is an app that used to work using accessibility but no longer works in latest update.
How do you get root? The rooting page itself says "2.Enable OEM Unlock from developer option (Currently no workaround for those who doesn't have this option)" and I don't have this option.
How do you change the phone app? I tried downloading and installing one from apkmirror and got an error when installing.
How do you prevent notifications when blocked callers call?
How do you get normal time on the lock screen? Not the always on screen.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
A respectful suggestion if I may.
Your first post was..... confrontational? Not the way to have your teething problems answered or supported.
Many of us, in all forum's, experience teething problems. I suggest you ask questions preferably one at a time so a peer can offer you some advice.
I have yet to ask for help here and not receive it. You will find there are some amazingly smart guys and gals here who will help IF you ask a palatable question. I am afraid what you have done is cause bad feeling and that's not the way to get help with your problems. Just food for thought. :good:
Ryland
I agree with the fingerprint sensor placement, for me being left handed, I have ot align it perfectly for it to work. Luckily the iris scanner is fast.
One issue I am coming across is my phone would random reboot and some settings would be changed to stock. For example, the font size would be change to default instead of everything tiny. My quick shortcuts layouts are stock and I have to re-login into some apps.
It happened about 3 times since i got the phone the first week of September. Hopefully I'm not alone. Sucks if I am though...lol
There is no help for those issues. That is why there is no response, and why the phone is going back. I am surprised anyone can stand the samsung interface and that is why it might sound confrontational. The apps that samsung replaces default apps with are really awful.
swooperstar said:
There is no help for those issues. That is why there is no response, and why the phone is going back. I am surprised anyone can stand the samsung interface and that is why it might sound confrontational. The apps that samsung replaces default apps with are really awful.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The only issue or possibly even an advantage is Samsung is edging it's own ecosystem in more and more. , basically it encourages one to buy another Sammy device and stay on board with them.
Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
UberPishy said:
Where is the question? Wrong forum, maybe you should tell someone who cares?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I care. Thanks to the original poster for critical analysis.
Anybody can fan-boy and circlejerk, that takes no skill.
It takes skill to spot issues and courage to speak out on them.
Every phones has its issues, these do not make Note 8 useless, but buyers can more easily decide if it is for them, when they know its particular failings.
vasra said:
I care. Thanks to the original poster for critical analysis.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So which of the OP's claims do you really care about, because most are false, many are non issues for the majority and a few are valid. But the point remains that they were posted in the wrong forum.
vasra said:
I care. Thanks to the original poster for critical analysis.
Anybody can fan-boy and circlejerk, that takes no skill.
It takes skill to spot issues and courage to speak out on them.
Every phones has its issues, these do not make Note 8 useless, but buyers can more easily decide if it is for them, when they know its particular failings.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's not a critical assessment...it's a misleading one.
A few observations.
The volume button on the left side is the more ergonomic position and also makes it less likely you will drop the phone while changing volume making it an objectively better placement. The fingerprint scanner? Yeah, it's poor ergonomics at best and your complaint there is well justified.
Root is something you knew going in you wouldn't have, if it mattered you should have bought something else. I do agree in general that the trend toward taking root access from us is one I hate. That's why I bought an international version and rooted it.
The Samsung calendar app is less well featured than the stock app but it uses no resources when not used and you can always use the google app or one of the several better than stock google calendar apps on the play store. You don't get to complain about not having an app you can put on you phone in seconds which isn't even close to the best app of its kind anyways. I BTW didn't use the stock app on my 6P, didn't meet my needs.Samsung's stock SMS app is awful, IMO someone should be fired there because it falls below even a minimum level of functionality. But then while Googles does manage to get to at least a minimally functional feature set it isn't much better and both are a long way from what can be had in seconds for free that work better than either on the market. You don't get to complain about this one either though, the stock google app is a few clicks away and a few seconds will give that stock google experience if that is your preference.
Same number of clicks with Samsung to add a recent callers to contacts. Hard to do so is dismissed.
Hard to copy because you have to long press instead of double tap? Seriously? lol That's a fairly lame complaint without even taking into consideration the S-pen which opens up a whole world of options that you don't have on the 6P, one of which is using the S-Pen in the first place.
I like the default dialer and it has features which Google's does not. Regardless it can be changed as well as which dialer is the default, where did you get the idea you couldn't change dialers?
I don't have the media volume warning with my phone unless I'm on headphones, not sure why you do?
The Bixby button can be disabled, it can be disabled without signing into Samsung. Just an FYI, it can also be slaved to another function. All without root.
You can white list any app from power saver, just takes a few clicks, assuming of course you know which clicks. You have in an oblique way a real gripe here, Samsung's menus are getting better but they are still too bloated. The search menu function is your friend in pursing hard to find settings.
Who uses lock screens in this day an age? You've get bio-metrics and AOD, leaving the lock screen as an artifact of what was once the best we could do but isn't anymore. Think of it this way, I'm a pathetic old man and I've been able to understand that lockscreens are now just an extra step. Your complaint in this regard reminds me of my friends who cant handle new tech and are still trying to hang on to their flip phone.
At this point you probably think I'm busting your balls a little bit and you're right. On the other hand your complaints are largely groundless. The only real objective gripe you have is the fingerprint sensor location. Your assessment of the volume button location is subjective, not objective, and objectively is incorrect. Your complaints about the stock apps can be applied to google apps in the same way and most of which I changed on my 6P just as I have here. The impression I get is that the main problem you have is you need to learn how to shop better. There is no reason to buy a phone that does not have root if you know you want root. There is no reason to buy a phone well known for it's rather overbearing GUI and menu bloat if you know you are going to hate it. Why do that to yourself?
https://www.xda-developers.com/android-q-storage-access-framework-scoped-storage/
... Looks like porting old pie roms to new phones is going to become a thing
According to what I've read, it would be very easy to build a workaround for it, especially considering Google already has a workaround in place until Q apps are enforced in Google Play.
Also looks like it might be a pain in the ass
I cannot believe what I just read. I wasn't aware this was coming and I couldn't despise the decision more.
Proper access to the file system was for me one of the main advantages Android offered over iOS.
Way to go, Google...
I think this is the best move Google made for security thus far. Too many apps ask for full unfettered access to my storage. I will be happy when apps get a little bit more locked down in this aspect.
Scott said:
I think this is the best move Google made for security thus far. Too many apps ask for full unfettered access to my storage. I will be happy when apps get a little bit more locked down in this aspect.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's not even just storage, it's to everything these days. Why does the app for my Apex Fusion interface on my reef tank need access to contacts and text messages?
On topic, I agree 100% with you.
Those tears in my eyes... yeah not because of the blue light in the middle of the night here... because of what I read... agree +1
I personally think it's a good move. I don't use a lot of apps because of their required permissions.
Well if you can disable Q's "scooped storage" on per app basis with adb shell then it's easy to write a script that enables general storage for every app.
Sent from my OnePlus 6T through Tapatalk
hank81 said:
Well if you can disable Q's "scooped storage" on per app basis with adb shell then it's easy to write a script that enables general storage for every app.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
True, but I'm sure eventually, just like with most every other special permission these days, you will wind up having to enable it on every boot.
Yes, the entire bug report is atrocious, but let's not get our pitchforks just yet. Google effectively punted on this for Android Q, by making it possible to contribute business as usual. It's quite possible that these issues will be resolved by Android P, or even that the whole idea will be scrapped in favor of something else.
The fact of the matter is that storage permissions in Android are terrible, Trying to address that is not in and of itself a bad thing, in fact I would argue that part alone is a good thing.
Attempting to read the tea leaves a little, this whole project reeks of "new hotshot product manager with poor (at best) understanding of the technical complexities at play forces bad decision into product because he needs to make 'highly visible' changes to the product to demonstrate his worth or get himself promoted". Especially given that the general idea at play isn't the part people are complaining about, just the fact that it's currently technically unusable as a posix api replacement, but the fact that the current one they have is terrible/slow/etc I find the above scenario to be highly likely
partcyborg said:
Attempting to read the tea leaves a little, this whole project reeks of "new hotshot product manager with poor (at best) understanding of the technical complexities at play forces bad decision into product because he needs to make 'highly visible' changes to the product to demonstrate his worth or get himself promoted". Especially given that the general idea at play isn't the part people are complaining about, just the fact that it's currently technically unusable as a posix api replacement, but the fact that the current one they have is terrible/slow/etc I find the above scenario to be highly likely
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thats deep!
Scott said:
Thats deep!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Lots of adult beverages to come up with this ?
Ayahuasca ?
Scott said:
I think this is the best move Google made for security thus far. Too many apps ask for full unfettered access to my storage. I will be happy when apps get a little bit more locked down in this aspect.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't get this. Correct me if I'm wrong, but can't you already disable specific permission for every app through system settings? Unless something like a wallpaper app refuses to work without access to your phone's contacts or something. Do you get what I'm saying?
roaduardo said:
I don't get this. Correct me if I'm wrong, but can't you already disable specific permission for every app through system settings? Unless something like a wallpaper app refuses to work without access to your phone's contacts or something. Do you get what I'm saying?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not exactly. Storage access in the current world is a binary yes/no decision (well, 2 binary yes/no decisions if your device has a SD card slot), either "yes here is access to all of /sdcard" or "no you can't read or write to anything outside your specific app data folder". Using something like the API gives you the ability to do much more fine grained access like "give Poweramp access to my normal music collection in /sdcard/Music, but not my keepassxc password file.", Or "let photos index all the pics it finds on my machine, except for the ones in a 'certain' telegram folder".
The cause for pitchforks in the bug report isn't that people are in love with the posix apis for file access, just that the current Android API implementation is something like 50x slower in Android Q, making it essentially useless for file manager apps that need to do things like directory listings and maintain indexes of all shared storage, etc.