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Hey guys,
I'm in the very very early stages of my masters work and I was toying around with the idea of using an Android tablet for part of it. I want to ask you devs what can be done when modifying the Android OS itself specifically in terms of a few things.
1. Logins - I would like to implement a classic user/password combination with levels of access for user, administrator, and some sort of superuser.
2. Restriction of User account - I would like to lock the user into one particular application. It must be relaunched when the device is booted and if the application crashes (hopefully not!) it must be restarted. Additionally, no market access, web access, etc.
3. Remote management if possible
4. Data encryption if possible
5. Prevent anything from being introduced from USB ports, SD slot, etc if unwanted.
I guess this brings me around to - is Android even the most suitable platform for such an endeavor. I'm not sure, to be honest, but I would love to get into development myself and this seems like a great way to learn. This is all just one part of a much larger project that I don't want to discuss just yet so sorry for being lax on details.
Thanks guys!
Android runs a virtual machine system called dalvik, in which each application gets it's own insuranceof the machine. It's implemented in such a way that each application gets assigned a user id, which unfortunately for you means each app is a different user, at least to the system. That's going to be a major wrench in the multi user plans. taking that into consideration, to have the same level of control over your tablet you'd have to give even the most basic user level "root" access or else the apps will start crapping their collective pants. As far as unwanted usb, there are a few apps that implement this functionality freely available through the market. Same with remote management. What I haven't seen yet is total encryption and I don't know enough about it to say it's possible or not. Seems feasible though.
My advice: write a custom login screen widget and then bake all these features into a pretty rom.
Ok, if any place, this is the place to ask.
I still have one of those dreakspark accounts with a dev account. What do I need to unlock and side load apps or 3rd party tools on my HTC 8X ?
Is there a Interop unlock process for WP8 or full unlock with Root tools is it too soon for this ? Is there any other "unlock" options floating around that teams are working on ? I really just want Advanced Config to work on my phone because I miss custom colors but, it should work, right ?
I would love to be able get started with my dev account, what do I need to do ? I do have a partition with Windows 8 x64 on it.....
Is there any thing I should be reading ?
Thanks in advance !
Install WP8 SDK, unlock with phone registration tool.
mcosmin222 said:
Install WP8 SDK, unlock with phone registration tool.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yea, thanks...
Is there any type of advanced unlock or will any of the WP7.5 tools like root tools work on Windows Phone 8 ? That is what my post is really about, is there a Interop unlock or full unlock yet ?
I don't think anyone has cracked WP8 yet for interop unlock and I have been following this forum for awhile. There isn't even custom ROMs yet.
As far as the WP8 SDK, be aware you need Windows 8 on your PC. It will not install on Windows 7
I upgraded my PC to Windows 8 so I could load the SDK and use my Dev Account to unlock. But all you can do is side load apps that do not need root or interop access...but I keep hoping. At this point I have yet to side load anything because my old WP7.5 side loads all need root/IU.
At least WP8 offers enough additional configurability to keep me somewhat satisfied but I still have my old Trophy.
LiFePo4 said:
I don't think anyone has cracked WP8 yet for interop unlock and I have been following this forum for awhile. There isn't even custom ROMs yet.
As far as the WP8 SDK, be aware you need Windows 8 on your PC. It will not install on Windows 7
I upgraded my PC to Windows 8 so I could load the SDK and use my Dev Account to unlock. But all you can do is side load apps that do not need root or interop access...but I keep hoping. At this point I have yet to side load anything because my old WP7.5 side loads all need root/IU.
At least WP8 offers enough additional configurability to keep me somewhat satisfied but I still have my old Trophy.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yea, I am dual booting with Windows 8, so I installed it and Dev unlocked but, the dreamspark account I have has a limit of 3 apps Wish at least there was a way around this right now...
Anyone play with any tools from HTC days? I even saw that HTC Connection Setup is available in the marketplace. Getting MAX unsigned apps would be great right now to hold me out till the tools and custom roms can come.
I just miss Advanced Config the most, I HATE limit the factory colors, I need my custom colors back....Is this too much to ask from Microsoft to create custom colors ?
BTW...I wish the SDK could be installed on Win7x64, I am not a Win8 fan right now...
I used my Trophy the other day after having the 8X for a few days, I just can't go back... I think I have to sell mine, the screen is just too small and not as pretty
I tried my Trophy again too and understand. I can't switch back. And no news on the sideload limit as that needs reg edit (but haven't thought about Connection Setup; no one is looking as far as I know).
If someone is working on cracking WP8 they are not saying much. It is pretty dead in the hacking section and WPH/Jaxbot isn't doing anything. Waiting....
P.S. If you have to use Win8 much get Stardock's Start8 and Decor8 apps ($5 each). You get a start button back and can set to boot right into the desktop. Decor8 let's you pick custom colors for your tiles and background! Just need a "Decor8" app for WP8.
Has there been ANY rumor or anything on a exploit for Windows Phone 8 ? I have been following every site I know of and I have not seen anything. It's been months and there has been nothing at all.
Are any of the major players even working on this or have they moved on to other phones ? It's normaly a little more when people are looking into it..
There is the problem of this security chip that checks both the kernel and the bootloader for authentic signatures. This chip is "hard coded" and can't be avoided at startup. Therefore, it is extremely difficult to make a rooted windows phone 8 OS boot on these devices. If either the bootloader or the kernel have been tampered with, said chip will restore them (sometimes even with complete device wipe), thus any modifications are very hard to do.
I have no doubt that the chip can be overridden somehow, but there is a long way till there, requires a lot of effort and the benefits are really not that big.
mcosmin222 said:
There is the problem of this security chip that checks both the kernel and the bootloader for authentic signatures. This chip is "hard coded" and can't be avoided at startup. Therefore, it is extremely difficult to make a rooted windows phone 8 OS boot on these devices. If either the bootloader or the kernel have been tampered with, said chip will restore them (sometimes even with complete device wipe), thus any modifications are very hard to do.
I have no doubt that the chip can be overridden somehow, but there is a long way till there, requires a lot of effort and the benefits are really not that big.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oh, Crap....Dam, nothing easy huh ? I really hope someone can unlock this to a point, I would like to side load more, yea but, I am more interested in Advanced Config so I could have more colors... sick of the default colors on WP8...
I am a hardcore Google user. I have an android phone and tablet and lots of google stuff online. My phone is getting old, and I was thinking of trying out something new.
Couple questions:
1. Whats the equivalent of "rooting" on wp8, if any?
2. How would you go about "rooting" your phone.
3. Are there any recommend phones for general use+development?
Julian90090 said:
I am a hardcore Google user. I have an android phone and tablet and lots of google stuff online. My phone is getting old, and I was thinking of trying out something new.
Couple questions:
1. Whats the equivalent of "rooting" on wp8, if any?
2. How would you go about "rooting" your phone.
3. Are there any recommend phones for general use+development?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
1. There is no equivalent of rooting at this time, as Windows Phone is much more locked down than Android (comparable to iOS) and there aren't as many devs working on it
2. Nothing yet, but its very easy to developer unlock it to side load custom made apps
3. You are probably best off getting a Nokia, either a cheap (~$100) Lumia 520 or a higher end like the Lumia 920/925/928 (I'd go with the 1020 if you can afford it). Windows Phone is very efficient, and runs almost as well on lower end hardware like the 520 as it does on higher end.
If you are really a hardcore Google user you are likely to find Windows Phone lacking as Google is intentionally keeping their programs and services off the platform (at least first party, nearly everything can be accessed through third party apps).
I made the switch, and I love it, but Windows Phone is not for people that want to constantly tweak everything because it is locked down. I used to love to tinker, now I love that I can't.
Yeah... WP7 was eventually broken wide open, but WP8's lockdown has been harder to bypass. There's a few devices (Huawei W1?) for which people have reported being able to edit the stock ROM somewhat, which is probably usable for "rooting" the phone, but none of the high-end devices have a known working exploit yet.
Developer-unlock, which will allow sideloading low-permission (no special capabilities, just the standard public ones) apps, is available for free, but you have to use PC tools to do it. Get the WP8 SDK from Microsoft (free, but a big download) and run the Windows Phone Developer Registration tool. Unless you pay for a developer account, there will be a very low limit on the number of apps you can sideload.
I'm actually personally pretty happy with the Samsung ATIV S phones; they have the best hardware in many ways (biggest battery, biggest and nearly highest-resolution displays, biggest internal storage that also has an SD card slot, best currently-available-in-WP8 CPUs) and you can install many of the Nokia apps anyhow (you can also install the Samsung apps on Nokia phones, same for HTC, etc.) using a proxy to modify the store requests. However, for a budget phone, the Nokia Lumia 52x line is hard to beat, and for camera quality, the Lumia 1020 is the best smartphone available, bar none.
There's plenty to do if you like to tinker with the phone... the problem is, you have to find it all yourself. There's not that much, aside from things like using a proxy to get apps intended for different OEMs' phones, that we've found to work so far. I've written a neat app that lets you browse the visible parts of the WP8 file system and registry from your PC (see my signature, it's the webserver app) which I hope will help people find something exploitable to get full Admin privileges on the phone, but so far, that hasn't happened. There's lots of other potential exploit vectors too; people just need to find them and make them usable!
Like GoodDayToDie said, it's NOT rootable. End of story.
As an experience goes, though, I switched iOS -> Android earlier this year because I was firmly in camp Google. I seemed to have problems that most other users did not, but all in all it was a miserable experience. After about 4mo switched to WP8.
For reference, on the phone; I use Google Maps, Google Voice, GMail, Contacts, Calendar, and search.
Contacts, Calendar, and mail all sync smoothly with built-in stuff. Search is an app, and it can't take Bing's place on the search button.
There's not an official Google Maps app, but there are apps in the Store that offer it. After about 6w now, I'm mostly using Nokia's Here stuff for mapping though.
Google Voice is available as a third party app. I was using Metrotalk. It was better than GV on iOS but inferior to GV on Android.
For what it's worth.
Except, you know, the part where it's nothing at all like a desktop OS.
No support for arbitrary applications or running as Admin. No file browser or registry editor. No command prompt or built-in scripting engine. No third-party background services (officially, at least; unofficially it's possible if you can work with the low permissions) or multiple windows at once. No task manager or management console. No device manager or third-party drivers. No user installer or recovery tools. No way to uninstall updates or make disk backups. No way to pass a file directly to another application (it must go through a registered extension handler, which the other app must be selected as the handler for). No multi-user support. None of the standard Windows power management tools. No OpenGL support, or ability to manually update the drivers. No support for external mice (or really for any mice, properly speaking). No support for USB host mode (that I can see, at least not in the base OS). No support for Windows networking or VPNs. No (built-in) support for remote desktop. No printing. The included version of Office is very limited compared to the full thing. No way to change the default web browser, email client, or several other such things. No support for installing new system media codecs or fonts. No way to choose what store a certificate is saved into, to export a saved cert, or to delete a saved cert.Browser has a limit of six tabs, no Flashplayer, and no Tracking Protection [Lists] feature.
Windows Phone 8 has about as much to do with Windows 8 as Android has to do with Ubuntu. In fact, it has significantly less, from the user's perspective.
some Noob's experience with WP8/ Nokia 928
Some other problemsthat i have stumbled on while trying WP8 for past 2 days, Nokia 928.
1. Ringtones and txt messages are changeable but notifications sounds for other programs are not (i.e. metrotalk - client)
2. Using public wifi that requires a comfirmatory click on their acceptable use page - Broken - works first time for me, then every time after it constantly loads up "w w w.msftncsi.com/nsci.txt" and the phone is constantly asking if I want to continue connecting to that wifi hotspot - Annoying.
3. Internet explorer is the builtin browser ( with some 3rd party UC browser, Surfcube 3D browser) but NO chrome nor firefox, - some pages load weird, especially if you choose desktop mode.
Images that appears in the browser search in IE 10 or UC browser, using bing or google comes back blurry, until you choose to open that one pic in full size image , but then you can't scroll through the result of images until you go back, at which time the images will sometimes not load, mind you this is on wifi.
4. No native Google voice apps - Metrotalk is good but you have to go through some hoops to setup push notification (ie having the app be able to notify you of txt and voicemail without actually having that app open), and you can't change the notification sound of Metrotalk as stated above
5. No file browsers
As I said, this is my experience with the phone and WP8 for the last 2 days, YMMV
Hello - I am doing a pen test for a customer. They are not giving me the xap files like they did last time. Is there a way to pull the xap file off the phone and on to your PC? I have a dev unlocked phone which I can sideload apps using power tools. I have done some research and it doesn't sound like this option is available, but I wanted to ask.
Thanks in advance.
First of all, the phone doesn't store the XAP files (PLEASE search before posting! This question gets asked a lot). I assume all you really care about is the app binaries and manifest file, though. (You can rebuild an installable XAP from these if needed.)
There's a complicated series of hacks for doing it on 8.1 via the ability to install apps to the SD card. If you don't have 8.1, don't have an SD card, can't install the relevant versions of specific apps, or if the app is marked to not allow installation to SD, then that method won't work for you.
The other approach, which in my experience is standard in the pentesting world (which is my field as well), is to use a hacked/jailbroken/unlocked phone. Samsung (unless it has the very newest firmware versions) and Huawei phones can be unlocked by flashing modified ROMs. The unlock lets you sideload apps with vastly more privileges, such as the ability to read and write the install directory of any app. Using that, it's pretty easy to get the files you want. Such unlocks are also possible with some Nokia phones via JTAG, and possibly some other models too, but the Samsung unlock (which I and -W_O_L_F- found) and the ability to flash customized ROMs for Huawei are the easiest approaches.
On the offhand chance you're part of NCC group, PM me and I'll send you my work email address. If you're with one of our competitors... well, I actually don't mind helping a competitor that much either; some Deja Vu folks gave me a good tip lately though, and I've got friends at SI as well.
GoodDayToDie said:
First of all, the phone doesn't store the XAP files (PLEASE search before posting! This question gets asked a lot). I assume all you really care about is the app binaries and manifest file, though. (You can rebuild an installable XAP from these if needed.)
There's a complicated series of hacks for doing it on 8.1 via the ability to install apps to the SD card. If you don't have 8.1, don't have an SD card, can't install the relevant versions of specific apps, or if the app is marked to not allow installation to SD, then that method won't work for you.
The other approach, which in my experience is standard in the pentesting world (which is my field as well), is to use a hacked/jailbroken/unlocked phone. Samsung (unless it has the very newest firmware versions) and Huawei phones can be unlocked by flashing modified ROMs. The unlock lets you sideload apps with vastly more privileges, such as the ability to read and write the install directory of any app. Using that, it's pretty easy to get the files you want. Such unlocks are also possible with some Nokia phones via JTAG, and possibly some other models too, but the Samsung unlock (which I and -W_O_L_F- found) and the ability to flash customized ROMs for Huawei are the easiest approaches.
On the offhand chance you're part of NCC group, PM me and I'll send you my work email address. If you're with one of our competitors... well, I actually don't mind helping a competitor that much either; some Deja Vu folks gave me a good tip lately though, and I've got friends at SI as well.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks again for all your help. So my situation is this: I am doing pen testing for a client (and I'm sure we are competitors some what). The have provided me a Nokia Lumia phone running 8.0 and another Lumia running 8.1. The app is installed by their dev team (app is not avail from the store). They are reluctant to provide my the XAP file as they consider it proprietary info. I have done a dev unlock on the phone, but my primary goal is to view the isolated storage/dlls for the app to make sure they are not storing sensitive data. I am using the standard tools for viewing the isolated storage, but for these to work (best of my knowledge) they require you to sideload the application which I cannot due (not XAP file). I am proxying the traffic, but without looking at the file system there is not much I can do. As an aside, they are using MDM with jailbreak detection.
Whoa, somebody actually got around to writing jailbreak detection for WP8? Crazy. I wish I could see that; I'm sure it's trivial to bypass (at least for interop-unlock, the difference between locked and unlocked is changing a registry value and it would be easily possible to re-lock it, launch the app while keeping the editor app open in the background, switch back to the editor, and unlock/jailbreak again) but I'm amused that anybody even bothered trying. Also, the APIs you would need to do the detection aren't even available on 8.0, officially; you're in violation of the store rules if you use them. Then again, maybe this is an internal, "Enterprise" app; those have permissions to do stuff that typical third-party apps do not. Are you sure they don't just mean they have jailbreak detection for iOS? I see something about Office365 MDM offering JB detection, but while I suppose they could have written something for WP8.x as well I feel like I probably would have heard of it?
If the app was sideloaded by the dev team, then you can see its isostore using the official tools or using Windows Phone Power Tools. If it's an enterprise app and the app was installed that way, then things get more difficult (especially if the phone they gave you doesn't have an SD slot). Not giving a pentester access to the binary they're testing is silly on a number of levels; if you succeed in breaking in then you'll get it anyhow, and an attacker will have a lot more than a week or two to poke at it so they're wasting your presumably-paid-by-the-hour time if they want you to see how good their security is without actually examining the app. I bet they used obfuscation, too... Some people just don't get it. "Security" by obscurity... isn't. Sorry, end of mini-rant. Anyhow, there's a guy on the forum who claims to have a non-JTAG unlock for Lumias, but no idea when or if it'll see the light of day.
treat me like an idiot if these are obvious..
I want to put Samsung stock nougat on my rooted SM-T810, and I have some general questions. if all this info is gathered somewhere else, please point me there. maybe I used bad search terms?
1) for US, I use the XNZ country code, correct?
if there's an update thread already, consider this an apology for wasting your time. please stop reading now and point me to it. otherwise:
2) Use Odin 3.12, correct?
3) Can I just use twrp to update?
4) will I lose root?
5) if yes to above, could you please point me to a rooting guide (SM T810)
6) other than the ROM itself, what do I need?
yeah - so i'm an idiot. I see the 'no questions' posting now. guess I jumped the gun
Is your current s2 Tab working smoothly? If so, why risking an update?
why not? I like to play around and keep current. Besides, IMHO, Android s**** as an OS, still unable to do things Windows was doing in the early 90s. I keep hoping someday it will grow up... I know Android and Windows have different purposes, but until I can network at the OS rather than app level (built in), and until it is fully 'self-contained' and doesn't require a PC for changing OS versions (w/o 3rd party apps), etc., I'm going to consider it 'not ready for prime time'. Just my opinion.
"Keep it current" what does this mean?
You do realize that the lastest software versions often come with the most current bugs and issues at hand.
If you need to network, install Kali Linux, I'd suggest.
'keep it current' = keep all apps and the os to the most recent version possible
bugs: yeah, but it also comes with the latest features
Linux: on the tablet? there's a version? but that's sort of beside the point - Android lacks a functionality that's been in every other OS on the planet since at least the early 90s. it may be by intent, but it still ain't there, and it would sure make my life easier if I could map a drive from my nas and have it's contents available to all apps: music player, movie player, ebook reader. for work, I've used it to process data in the field using Octave. Getting the data on and off is always a pain - better if I could map a share and go from there.
not trying to argue - you asked, i'm elaborating. too much, maybe.
Keep all apps and the os to the most recent version possible. But what for?
Why trying desperately to fix a working car?
Updates eat storage and in most cases performance. Worse, introduce new bugs and so on.
I do not get this: update mania. Sure, it certainly assures that the Superclass can easily spy on every single user but besides that.. it makes no sense IMO.
Certainly, Android is Linux based after all. So yes, you could root your Tab and install Linux.
Drive access. That's already possible. You can connect an external SSD drive or HD drive via USB. Or NAS,
http://www.techrepublic.com/google-...o-help-you-connect-to-network-storage/?espv=1
I feel you. No arguing here either, just trying to understand your viewpoint.
just want a fully functional 'computer' where I can access files without having to use one app to copy the files over from the nas and another to use them. step one is the OS's responsibility, IMO. want access to network drives and otg drives to be identical to access I get on the internal memory.
and if you really want to get me going, start up on selinux, the "god i'm so afraid to go outside" solution. yeah - let's punish everyone because that guy over there is being bad. and lack of automatic root access? these are children's toys? unfortunately, my favorite ebook reader is only on android. as is the best music player I've found.
fun discussion, but I gotta get some work done
Msamp said:
just want a fully functional 'computer' where I can access files without having to use one app to copy the files over from the nas and another to use them. step one is the OS's responsibility, IMO. want access to network drives and otg drives to be identical to access I get on the internal memory.
and if you really want to get me going, start up on selinux, the "god i'm so afraid to go outside" solution. yeah - let's punish everyone because that guy over there is being bad. and lack of automatic root access? these are children's toys? unfortunately, my favorite ebook reader is only on android. as is the best music player I've found.
fun discussion, but I gotta get some work done
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I guess you are not really understanding the role smartphones and tablets play in the computing world. They are more communications terminals designed to be usable without mice and keyboards rather than stand alone computers. Your recurring references to what computers could do in 1990 is a little off. All you had (at most) was windows 3.0. That did not include networking out of the box, but relied on device-specific drivers and utilities (i.e. Novell) to access a thin-net ethernet coax cable or IBM token ring network. If you want to get online, be prepared to use a serial terminal and a But I digress...
Android is not Windows. It is a cut down and specialized version Linux. Linux/Android is not a single monolithic OS like Windows. It does not do SMB out of the box, but needs a Samba client to do SMB to your windows-ish NAS. It does not try to be all things to all people, but rather gives you the basics and lets you, Joe User, add on the things to make it do what you want. In short they don't bloat it down with stuff only 10% of users will want to use.
To access your NAS, there are Samba (SMB) and ftp clients that let you do it. In fact I have a couple Android streamer boxes on my TVs around the house. They connect directly to my NAS video libraries and pull movies and other videos directly from there using a variety of protocols. Do I need to do that on my phone? No, but hey, I can install KODI on that phone and do just that. I can also put KODI on my windows box and do the same thing. But if I want to disconnect, I can copy these movies to my Tablet/Phone and play them any time I want off line. This is all things I would challenge you to do using Windows 3.0 in 1990 (don't even think of doing full touch screen support with Windows 3.x).
But well, if you really want your phone or tablet to work like Windows, you should run Windows on it
not '1990' - 'early nineties'. big difference. Win 3.1 (or WFW?) had an add-on, but still OS level tcp/ip stack
paragraph 2: I don't count real networking as an option. I should be able to access my ebooks on my nas usung ebookdroid, not have to move trhem to the tab using ESfilemanager THEN read them. I have a HUGE library of pdfs, movies, music, more than will fit on my 128 gig sd card (or a 256 g card for that matter), and i'd like access to the WHOLE THING from any appropriate app I choose. all the smb apps suck green worms, by the way.
I don't want to have to install a freakin client - it should be part of the os. imho, of course
btw: this discussion has become pointless. I have my preferences, you have yours. that's the way it should be. and as far as their 'role' goes: give them a bigger one - they're capable.
'bye
I totally understand your gripe. And I do wholeheartedly agree there should be a *root* toggle in the **Developer Option**.
But here is the thing, how are greedy conglomerates, and the gov puppets, supposed to spy on each and every single citizen if they just uninstall all spyware?
Moreover, most consumers are just too *untechy* and they would probably lose all their bank account, credit card and online shopping data to third parties and eventually blame the OEM. I smell lawsuits of the retard.
Auto updates are there for a reason. Control.
For instance, Samsung's new high-tech TVs record audio 24/7. Same for all these assistant devices.. Amazon Echo, Google Home etc. Seriously, 1984 isn't that far away anymore.
Msamp said:
treat me like an idiot if these are obvious..
I want to put Samsung stock nougat on my rooted SM-T810, and I have some general questions. if all this info is gathered somewhere else, please point me there. maybe I used bad search terms?
1) for US, I use the XNZ country code, correct?
if there's an update thread already, consider this an apology for wasting your time. please stop reading now and point me to it. otherwise:
2) Use Odin 3.12, correct?
3) Can I just use twrp to update?
4) will I lose root?
5) if yes to above, could you please point me to a rooting guide (SM T810)
6) other than the ROM itself, what do I need?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Use Odin AND the rom... i think you will lose root but you can always go back in twrp to install supersu.
I did something similar, i used Samsung Smart Switch to do an emergency reset on mine and it installed the latest firmware (nougat).
That will unroot and remove twrp.
I wouldn't (and didn't) reflash TWRP and root because you lose OTA updates, and right now there's some bugs in Nougat that , for me, were fixed in an OTA update. But once you flash with Smart Switch, you could always re-install TWRP and root again if you want.
Don't mind Niii4, he ranted about the same things in my thread and to others too...