Big question:
If I want a custom ROM that will run root Apps that modify /system, is S-OFF required? Or are there custom ROMs with non-secure kernels?
More minor questions:
When developers (for the M7 etc) put out a custom ROM...
Are all putting out a kernel? are some signed/unsigned? are some secure/insecure?
Must you use a stock-signed kernel if you support folks with S-ON?
Can you boot unsigned kernels with just HTCDev UNLOCKED (and S-ON)? I assume yes, isn't this what CWM and TWRP run on?
S-OFF defeats the secure-kernels ability to keep /system prestine?
Thanks so much!!!
syserr said:
Big question:
If I want a custom ROM that will run root Apps that modify /system, is S-OFF required? Or are there custom ROMs with non-secure kernels?
More minor questions:
When developers (for the M7 etc) put out a custom ROM...
Are all putting out a kernel? are some signed/unsigned? are some secure/insecure?
Must you use a stock-signed kernel if you support folks with S-ON?
Can you boot unsigned kernels with just HTCDev UNLOCKED (and S-ON)? I assume yes, isn't this what CWM and TWRP run on?
S-OFF defeats the secure-kernels ability to keep /system prestine?
Thanks so much!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yes you can flash custom rom's with s-on and an unlocked bootloader, this is basically why HTC gave you the ability to unlock your bootloader, even they know most users use custom rom's and most are better than their own.
S-off is not required, however, s-off (security off) gives you the ability to do things like backflash, flash different RUU;s, and change firmwares, radios etc, but if you don't know what you are doing or unsure of yourself, it will also no longer stop you from flashing something wrong, making it very easy to mess up or even brick your phone.
and to answer your first question, ive yet to find a custom rom that doesn't come already rooted and with an unsecure kernel, but always be sure to read the op of which rom your interested in as it contains important instructions, even down to which version of recovery you should be using to flash the rom, you'd be very surprised about how many people actually get this wrong and then require help because their rom isn't booting because they couldn't be bothred to read the instructions, it will also state what type of kernel it comes with.
on a different note, you don't you don't have to flash a custom rom, if your happy with your current stock rom, you can just unlock the bootloader, flash a custom recovery and then flash an unsecure kernel like elementalx or kangaroo kernel etc, TWRP recovery itself will set up root for you on exit.
Seanie280672 said:
yes you can flash custom rom's with s-on and an unlocked bootloader, this is basically why HTC gave you the ability to unlock your bootloader, even they know most users use custom rom's and most are better than their own.
S-off is not required, however, s-off (security off) gives you the ability to do things like backflash, flash different RUU;s, and change firmwares, radios etc, but if you don't know what you are doing or unsure of yourself, it will also no longer stop you from flashing something wrong, making it very easy to mess up or even brick your phone.
and to answer your first question, ive yet to find a custom rom that doesn't come already rooted and with an unsecure kernel, but always be sure to read the op of which rom your interested in as it contains important instructions, even down to which version of recovery you should be using to flash the rom, you'd be very surprised about how many people actually get this wrong and then require help because their rom isn't booting because they couldn't be bothred to read the instructions, it will also state what type of kernel it comes with.
on a different note, you don't you don't have to flash a custom rom, if your happy with your current stock rom, you can just unlock the bootloader, flash a custom recovery and then flash an unsecure kernel like elementalx or kangaroo kernel etc, TWRP recovery itself will set up root for you on exit.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you for your answer!
I'm beginning to think I don't need S-OFF. I want to be able to back flash and RUU back etc, but it's not necessary. I'm assuming you can back flash HBOOT, where as with S-ON you can never back flash HBOOT.
One thing concerns me... how are unsecure kernels made? (I believe ViperOne, was still secure when I was running it.) Do you have to compile from source? Or can your "unsecurize" a stock secure kernel? Or both?
Thanks!
syserr said:
Thank you for your answer!
I'm beginning to think I don't need S-OFF. I want to be able to back flash and RUU back etc, but it's not necessary. I'm assuming you can back flash HBOOT, where as with S-ON you can never back flash HBOOT.
One thing concerns me... how are unsecure kernels made? (I believe ViperOne, was still secure when I was running it.) Do you have to compile from source? Or can your "unsecurize" a stock secure kernel? Or both?
Thanks!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its my belief that all kernals are built from the stock kernel or the kernel files available from the HTC Dev site, but as im not a developer I cant say for sure, although I would love to learn things like this I just don't have the time and know that it also requires Linux to build a kernal, im clueless when it comes to Linux, and yes it is possible to "unsecurize" a stock kernel, ModPack 007 for lollipop comes with the option to do this very thing, however don't start thinking that an unsecure kernel is so people can hack into your phone, or your phone is going to crash every 5 minutes, its not like that, its unsecure so that you can modify and replace system files etc, ie write protection removed = unsecure kernals.
Kernals like ElementalX and Kangaroo take the modding further than just removing write protection, they add many other features, which can generally be found in the op of each kernel.
If you want to back flash anything, HBOOT, Firmware, RUU etc then you need S-off full stop, theres no other way to do it.
As for S-on, I hate it, I feel totally locked down, im a very big HTC fan and cant wait for the M9, ive owned many HTC's and pretty much the first thing I do after unpacking it and messing about with it for a couple of hours is s-off it, it free's the phone up for anything, however if your not careful and don't know what your doing, you can very easily kill it, s-off means security off, so your device is no longer protected from a bad flash, with s-on it will just error out and boot again in most cases, s-off however in the same situation will turn your nice phone into a paper weight.
when I first got my HTC one M7 it came with HBOOT 1.56, very hard to s-off, firewater was the only tool that could do it, and kept failing, I must of flashed 50+ (probably and exaggeration) rom and kernel combinations to try and get firewater to work, all failed, this was before sunshine s-off was about, thankfully I found a shop in Sheffield which did it by java card, as I travel up there quite a bit it wasn't an issue to get it s-off'd next time I went up there.
Anyone please feel free to correct me if any of this is wrong, like I said im not a dev and its all a learning curve.
Seanie280672 said:
... and yes it is possible to "unsecurize" a stock kernel, ModPack 007 for lollipop comes with the option to do this very thing, however don't start thinking that an unsecure kernel is so people can hack into your phone, or your phone is going to crash every 5 minutes, its not like that, its unsecure so that you can modify and replace system files etc
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for all the great info.
I should have clarified my concern about an unsecure kernel. Not that I was worried about getting hacked etc... More I was worried that my options would be limited to only ROMs with a limited number of unsecure kernels. If creating an unsecure kernel was difficult, I'd worry about a shortage. Booting into TWRP for unsecure kernel so I can modify /system is very restrictive to someone that is not used to it.
I compiled my first Linux kernel in 1995. I too want freedom. "Android" is a big field... but HTC and HBOOT are really outside of my Android experience -- it's great to learn so much. Thanks!
Related
So far I've had no luck using custom ROMs as it just stays on the htc boot screen and does not work. I can confirm that 'MiUi' does work on my phone - however it is buggy and I don't like it.
I want cyanogenod or either android revolution HD but none of these work.
I thinkit has something to do with the HBOOT being 1.16.000, and the ROM version i'm after is 2.34.981.1 (virgin or optus branded) - am with virgin though in Australia.
I have a custom bootloader/recovery whatever you call it, I wipe the cache, dalvik cache and factory wipe, before installing all ROM's. I can't update to stock ROM either because there is none for hboot 1.16.000
So right now my phone is pretty much a paper weight until I can get it working again.
I prefer custom ROM's if there is any that work, if not I atleast want the stock ROM to work for now so I can use my phone. If someone can help me through the process to get it working it would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.
jakeyo said:
So far I've had no luck using custom ROMs as it just stays on the htc boot screen and does not work. I can confirm that 'MiUi' does work on my phone - however it is buggy and I don't like it.
I want cyanogenod or either android revolution HD but none of these work.
I thinkit has something to do with the HBOOT being 1.16.000, and the ROM version i'm after is 2.34.981.1 (virgin or optus branded) - am with virgin though in Australia.
I have a custom bootloader/recovery whatever you call it, I wipe the cache, dalvik cache and factory wipe, before installing all ROM's. I can't update to stock ROM either because there is none for hboot 1.16.000
So right now my phone is pretty much a paper weight until I can get it working again.
I prefer custom ROM's if there is any that work, if not I atleast want the stock ROM to work for now so I can use my phone. If someone can help me through the process to get it working it would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hyun is looking for you at revolutionary irc channel.
Sent from my HTC Incredible S using Tapatalk
I know.. I have spoken to him.
jakeyo said:
I know.. I have spoken to him.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Any luck? still unable to flash anything?
jakeyo said:
So far I've had no luck using custom ROMs as it just stays on the htc boot screen and does not work. I can confirm that 'MiUi' does work on my phone - however it is buggy and I don't like it.
I want cyanogenod or either android revolution HD but none of these work.
I thinkit has something to do with the HBOOT being 1.16.000, and the ROM version i'm after is 2.34.981.1 (virgin or optus branded) - am with virgin though in Australia.
I have a custom bootloader/recovery whatever you call it, I wipe the cache, dalvik cache and factory wipe, before installing all ROM's. I can't update to stock ROM either because there is none for hboot 1.16.000
So right now my phone is pretty much a paper weight until I can get it working again.
I prefer custom ROM's if there is any that work, if not I atleast want the stock ROM to work for now so I can use my phone. If someone can help me through the process to get it working it would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you go to the development section of the HTC Incredible 2 forum, attn1 has a script tool that uses the latest Revolutionary/Unreovked exploit to downgrade the ROMand HBOOT to a version that is supported by Revolutionary.
If you look at the script, it is pretty simple. You would just need to use an older Virgin Mobile RUU.zip instead of the Inc2 version. It looks like the 2.12.981.2 would be the one to try.
Hang on a second, how did you S-off the Hboot 1.16?
I thought you need S-off to be able to flash a custom Rom...
How did you install Miui?
Am I missing something here?
Doesnt matter if you need S-ON or S-OFF, as long as you get permissions to access root files.
Someone installed a custom bootloader so I can install custom ROM's, and it just works.... apparently the radios are locked though.
So, another day gone by and my phone is still not working. I can use MiUi, but I ran out of data on my 3g sim and wifi doesnt work, so now I have no internet on it.
katu2006 said:
Hang on a second, how did you S-off the Hboot 1.16?
I thought you need S-off to be able to flash a custom Rom...
How did you install Miui?
Am I missing something here?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm pretty sure no soff will cause the issues he is experiencing, though he doesn't seem to be listening
no, you're all just noobs.
It was the boot.img, we swapped it with the MiUi then put back the original one, now it boots up on cyanogenmod7.1 and works completely fine.
Can access root files, can take screenshots, everything is normal.
and I have s-on.
jakeyo said:
no, you're all just noobs.
It was the boot.img, we swapped it with the MiUi then put back the original one, now it boots up on cyanogenmod7.1 and works completely fine.
Can access root files, can take screenshots, everything is normal.
and I have s-on.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes im a noob that has been using android since 2009..
You seem like a supreme douche.
Weren't you the one who was crying about wanting to go back to his iphone lol
jakeyo said:
no, you're all just noobs.
It was the boot.img, we swapped it with the MiUi then put back the original one, now it boots up on cyanogenmod7.1 and works completely fine.
Can access root files, can take screenshots, everything is normal.
and I have s-on.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're calling us noobs, but you don't even know what was done on your phone...
What's the following sentence supposed to say?
"It was the boot.img, we swapped it with the MiUi then put back the original one"
To get a custom Rom, you actually have to INSTALL it...To get the custom Rom installed, you need CWM recovery. But if you have HBoot 1.16.000, you can't have a custom recovery yet.
In less your "friend" did a downgrade of the HBoot to 1.13.000, it's unlikely that you have CWM recovery on your phone. Even so, to my knowledge HBoot 1.16.000 does a version check and won't let you downgrade it.
So, the question remains, how did you get CWM recovery on your phone?
katu2006 said:
You're calling us noobs, but you don't even know what was done on your phone...
What's the following sentence supposed to say?
"It was the boot.img, we swapped it with the MiUi then put back the original one"
To get a custom Rom, you actually have to INSTALL it...To get the custom Rom installed, you need CWM recovery. But if you have HBoot 1.16.000, you can't have a custom recovery yet.
In less your "friend" did a downgrade of the HBoot to 1.13.000, it's unlikely that you have CWM recovery on your phone. Even so, to my knowledge HBoot 1.16.000 does a version check and won't let you downgrade it.
So, the question remains, how did you get CWM recovery on your phone?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This thread is awesome
no, if I hold down power down and power button I see S-ON and HBOOT 1.16.0000
He typed in commands to give it root permissions, not sure exactly as he remote controlled my computer and typed it in. Then yes, he flashes CWM onto the phone then I installed revolutionary.
Firstly, I went onto the HTC dev site (created an account) and followed the steps to unlock the bootloader. In the end, it was successful, and once it's finished it will wipe the phone (AND WILL STILL SAY s-on)
So then the bootloader is now unlocked, and he did various commands in fastboot. My guess is that he installed CWM from there and it just worked.
at first, cyanogenmod would not boot, so he copied the (boot.img that is working) from MiUi and repled it with cyanogenmod's. The phone booted up and worked. Then he put it back how it was and it now works. Strange, but something must've given it a kick.
I'll repeat myself.
HBOOT 1.16.0000
S-ON
Cyanogenmod &.1 (stable)
Full root access
Need I say more to prove it?
As far as I know, I just cannot flash radios, which actually require the S-OFF....
sorry if I come across as rude, just a long day..
Talk to aftab565 he has the same hboot as you and has arhd running. Sounds like your phone was temp rooted and flashed and I would advise against letting people you don't know take remote access of your pc.
Hopefully it works for him I couldn't help.
Just replied to his thread.
And I know I was aware. I had full control though (could press a certain key to disconnect the connection - and only gave a temporary password) He was only typing in CMD things to do with the phone that I've heard of before
(ADB shell, fastboot recovery etc) and in the end worked well. He said my job is done and disconnect himself, so good guy
Didn't take my eyes off the screen either.
jakeyo said:
Just replied to his thread.
And I know I was aware. I had full control though (could press a certain key to disconnect the connection - and only gave a temporary password) He was only typing in CMD things to do with the phone that I've heard of before
(ADB shell, fastboot recovery etc) and in the end worked well. He said my job is done and disconnect himself, so good guy
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You gotta give props to these guys for donating their time. Every day there's more talk about h-boot 1.16.0000 so I figure if devs want to keep devin there'll be a rev released eventually.
I really appreciate the amount of work hes done, in total I recon he's spent about 6 hours trying to help me getting it to work.
Never left me by myself, he always helped me through every step and was always there if I needed help. I've now got CM7 thanks to him. If he didn't fix it, I would have a useless phone because I couldn't even put on the stock ROM because of my HBOOT im guessing (I did an OTA update to get 1.16.0000 therefore too new to download)
I think SOME of the custom roms do have support for 1.16.0000 and what you only need is the boot file from them to boot up your non-booting ROM then you're all good.
ok, just to put some closure and sanity on this thread.
Firstly I'm probably bettery know as hyuh on #revolutionary, and it was me who was connected to his PC.
I use teamviewer to connect to people remotely, this allows anyone who doesn't like the look of *anything* I do to diconnect me...The user in front of the PC has full control of my session and I remind them to close teamviewer after we're done.
Secondly to those who think you need to be S-OFF to install a custom ROM or custom recovery, this is simply not true in the case of the 1.16 hboot. If you follow the HTC unlock procedure then you will have sufficient access to the phone to do this, it is not S-OFF just an unlock. Your phone will be in state "S-ON unlocked" This allows certain partitions on the emmc to be written to, and this sufficient for custom ROMs.
Really all that is requird is:
Code:
fastboot flash recovery <recovery.img>
then follow the normal flashing procedures.
In jakeyo's case CM7 would not boot, but MIUI would. When I say it would not boot I do not mean a boot loop here, I mean no boot period. At this point I had expected to need to rebuild a boot image for CM7 for him suspecting that HTC had done something different in the new hboot with paritions or the boot image offset.
The reason for flashing the MIUI boot image on top of CM7 was simple, to get to adb in the boot image. However seeing nothing particularly strange in the boot sequence ( other than the mismatch and resulting bootloop) I decided to reflash the CM7 boot image through fastboot.
The phone booted fully this time without issues.
It appears that the boot image simply did not flash properly from recovery the first time but I don't have a vivo to troubleshoot further.
A couple of things:
1. Don't take the OTA for 1.16 hboot if you haven't already done so.
There is currently no unofficial unlock/S-OFF
There is no RUU to fix the phone if you screw up.
There is nothing in the OTA you can't get in other ways.
2. If you're on 1.16 and want custom ROMs and aren't worried about warranty, go ahead and do unlock from HTC, but bear in mind:
There is no RUU, so you can't go back to stock
You can't flash radios
You can't superCID or similar ( but not needed since there is no RUU )
2a. You don't need any existing root method to exist, there is no exploit involved in any of this, this will work irrespective of the current status of a root expoit existing or not.
2b. The phone does not have to be listed by HTC as being supproted. Any phone with a suitable hboot can be unlocked.
if this:
Code:
fastboot oem get_identifier_token
returns an identifier code then the phone can be ulocked.
globatron said:
ok, just to put some closure and sanity on this thread.
Firstly I'm probably bettery know as hyuh on #revolutionary, and it was me who was connected to his PC.
I use teamviewer to connect to people remotely, this allows anyone who doesn't like the look of *anything* I do to diconnect me...The user in front of the PC has full control of my session and I remind them to close teamviewer after we're done.
Secondly to those who think you need to be S-OFF to install a custom ROM or custom recovery, this is simply not true in the case of the 1.16 hboot. If you follow the HTC unlock procedure then you will have sufficient access to the phone to do this, it is not S-OFF just an unlock. Your phone will be in state "S-ON unlocked" This allows certain partitions on the emmc to be written to, and this sufficient for custom ROMs.
Really all that is requird is:
Code:
fastboot flash recovery <recovery.img>
then follow the normal flashing procedures.
In jakeyo's case CM7 would not boot, but MIUI would. When I say it would not boot I do not mean a boot loop here, I mean no boot period. At this point I had expected to need to rebuild a boot image for CM7 for him suspecting that HTC had done something different in the new hboot with paritions or the boot image offset.
The reason for flashing the MIUI boot image on top of CM7 was simple, to get to adb in the boot image. However seeing nothing particularly strange in the boot sequence ( other than the mismatch and resulting bootloop) I decided to reflash the CM7 boot image through fastboot.
The phone booted fully this time without issues.
It appears that the boot image simply did not flash properly from recovery the first time but I don't have a vivo to troubleshoot further.
A couple of things:
1. Don't take the OTA for 1.16 hboot if you haven't already done so.
There is currently no unofficial unlock/S-OFF
There is no RUU to fix the phone if you screw up.
There is nothing in the OTA you can't get in other ways.
2. If you're on 1.16 and want custom ROMs and aren't worried about warranty, go ahead and do unlock from HTC, but bear in mind:
There is no RUU, so you can't go back to stock
You can't flash radios
You can't superCID or similar ( but not needed since there is no RUU )
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Get a mod to make a hboot sticky there will be floods of this crap further down the road.
So, my chain of events:
Unlocked
Rooted
Custom ROM (DarkRaider, stock kernel)
Used for a while
Then:
I used the technique here to try the KangBang kernel.
androidauthority.com/vivid-2-0-ghz-overclock-custom-kernel-kangbang-106636
Used same technique above to use DarkRaider install to install kozmikernel, which worked.
But I got tired of having to use USB, etc. So I:
Relocked
RUU'd
Unlocked
Rooted
S-Off (wire trick)
Custom recovery (ClockworkMod touch beta)
And now I'm having issues like I did before S-Off. Trying a custom kernel causes it to fail and have the WiFi connectivity issues everyone mentioned, and I've experienced before. So I'm wondering, did the S-Off not work? I have the custom HBOOT and it says radio S-Off. Is it the recovery I'm using? Is there a specific one that works with kernels that I missed? Or is it something with DarkRaider? I feel like I just have selected the incorrect recovery, but don't know enough to be able to determine myself.
Thanks in advance to all. If it's just the recovery, I'd love it if you could point me to the correct one. THANKS!
drummerdick said:
So, my chain of events:
Unlocked
Rooted
Custom ROM (DarkRaider, stock kernel)
Used for a while
Then:
I used the technique here to try the KangBang kernel.
androidauthority.com/vivid-2-0-ghz-overclock-custom-kernel-kangbang-106636
Used same technique above to use DarkRaider install to install kozmikernel, which worked.
But I got tired of having to use USB, etc. So I:
Relocked
RUU'd
Unlocked
Rooted
S-Off (wire trick)
Custom recovery (ClockworkMod touch beta)
And now I'm having issues like I did before S-Off. Trying a custom kernel causes it to fail and have the WiFi connectivity issues everyone mentioned, and I've experienced before. So I'm wondering, did the S-Off not work? I have the custom HBOOT and it says radio S-Off. Is it the recovery I'm using? Is there a specific one that works with kernels that I missed? Or is it something with DarkRaider? I feel like I just have selected the incorrect recovery, but don't know enough to be able to determine myself.
Thanks in advance to all. If it's just the recovery, I'd love it if you could point me to the correct one. THANKS!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, the good news is that your S-OFF worked if it says S-OFF in HBOOT!
I have heard that people have trouble with CWM. I never did, but these days I use TWRP, and it works great for me.
Trying a custom kernel causes it to fail
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Which kernel, what method, what error?
and have the WiFi connectivity issues everyone mentioned, and I've experienced before.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is usually caused by not having kernel modules installed in the correct place, or possibly having old kernel modules in the /system/lib/modules directory that don't belong there anymore.
Be a little more specific about your errors, and one of us will surely be able to help you out!
Cheers,
Sean
ess.boyer said:
Well, the good news is that your S-OFF worked if it says S-OFF in HBOOT!
I have heard that people have trouble with CWM. I never did, but these days I use TWRP, and it works great for me.
Which kernel, what method, what error?
This is usually caused by not having kernel modules installed in the correct place, or possibly having old kernel modules in the /system/lib/modules directory that don't belong there anymore.
Be a little more specific about your errors, and one of us will surely be able to help you out!
Cheers,
Sean
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, glad the S-Off worked. And thanks for the suggestion, I'll give TWRP a try and see if that helps before I go to more drastic measures.
As far as the kernel, it wasn't so much failing, as not doing what it was supposed to? I was only trying to install the kozmikernalb7 packaged with DarkRaider ROM, so it was through the aroma installer. It came up with some error when it first tried to install the Sweep to Wake, but I don't remember exactly what. But, it didn't install S2W, it wasn't overclockable, and the WiFi didn't work. I didn't really look into the wifi issues, I read somewhere on here it was that the kernel was still locked and not being overwritten properly. Whether that's true or not, I dunno. But it would work when I used the method described in that link. I don't know what was up with that special recovery they had, but I tried flashing it, and that didn't help at all. I'll update you on the TWRP when I have time to try it.
Thanks again!
drummerdick said:
Well, glad the S-Off worked. And thanks for the suggestion, I'll give TWRP a try and see if that helps before I go to more drastic measures.
As far as the kernel, it wasn't so much failing, as not doing what it was supposed to? I was only trying to install the kozmikernalb7 packaged with DarkRaider ROM, so it was through the aroma installer. It came up with some error when it first tried to install the Sweep to Wake, but I don't remember exactly what. But, it didn't install S2W, it wasn't overclockable, and the WiFi didn't work. I didn't really look into the wifi issues, I read somewhere on here it was that the kernel was still locked and not being overwritten properly. Whether that's true or not, I dunno. But it would work when I used the method described in that link. I don't know what was up with that special recovery they had, but I tried flashing it, and that didn't help at all. I'll update you on the TWRP when I have time to try it.
Thanks again!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't know about the kernel being "locked" (what is locking it?) but I had something similar happen to me when I first flashed a new kernel on this phone. No matter how many times I "successfully" flashed a new kernel through recovery, with S-OFF, it wouldn't overwrite the original stock kernel. I ended up having to install the S-ON version over fastboot, and from then on I haven't had any issues. Maybe give that a try. Try flashing the Holics or Faux kernels (S-ON method first), and if you can get them to work, go back to Kozmik's, or whatever you want.
ess.boyer said:
I don't know about the kernel being "locked" (what is locking it?) but I had something similar happen to me when I first flashed a new kernel on this phone. No matter how many times I "successfully" flashed a new kernel through recovery, with S-OFF, it wouldn't overwrite the original stock kernel. I ended up having to install the S-ON version over fastboot, and from then on I haven't had any issues. Maybe give that a try. Try flashing the Holics or Faux kernels (S-ON method first), and if you can get them to work, go back to Kozmik's, or whatever you want.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The "locked" kernel: from what I've read (and tried to understand) the HTC bootloader unlock removes the NAND lock on everything BUT the kernel (boot partition?). I may be mistaken on that (looks like), but that was what I got from everything I've read. I remember something similar with my Aria, things I couldn't do without S-Off, but I didn't have any issues with the Aria after S-Off. So I dunno.
I'll try the S-On method first, and see how that goes. Thanks for all your help!
drummerdick said:
The "locked" kernel: from what I've read (and tried to understand) the HTC bootloader unlock removes the NAND lock on everything BUT the kernel (boot partition?). I may be mistaken on that (looks like), but that was what I got from everything I've read. I remember something similar with my Aria, things I couldn't do without S-Off, but I didn't have any issues with the Aria after S-Off. So I dunno.
I'll try the S-On method first, and see how that goes. Thanks for all your help!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
S-OFF for the Vivid unlocks the boot partition. You can flash unsecured kernels from Recovery, no problem. That's half (or more) the reason you'd S-OFF in the first place.
I have had an issue before where for some reason my kernel got "stuck" and I couldn't flash any other kernel over stock. I had to relock, run the RUU, unlock, then flash. Ever since then (the first week I had the phone, several months ago now) I haven't had a single problem.
Well, that was my goal S-Off, and also why I'm confused I can't flash kernels from recovery.
Did you do the re-lock, RUU, unlock, all already S-Off?
Sent from my HTC PH39100 using xda app-developers app
drummerdick said:
Well, that was my goal S-Off, and also why I'm confused I can't flash kernels from recovery.
Did you do the re-lock, RUU, unlock, all already S-Off?
Sent from my HTC PH39100 using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's right. You won't have to S-OFF again. S-OFF will stay through the process.
You might also be able to install a different kernel via fastboot (the S-ON method) first, and then if that works, you should be able to flash from recovery. If that doesn't work, try the lock, RUU, unlock.
ess.boyer said:
That's right. You won't have to S-OFF again. S-OFF will stay through the process.
You might also be able to install a different kernel via fastboot (the S-ON method) first, and then if that works, you should be able to flash from recovery. If that doesn't work, try the lock, RUU, unlock.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ok, I'll give those a try when I get a chance, thanks.
Part of what I don't understand: the recovery image that the S-On method uses, why can't that just be flashed as the recovery on my phone? It looks exactly like the clockworkmod recovery that was on my phone. I'm loving the TWRP by the way, thanks for the tip. The file browser alone saved me from that stupid AT&T software update... (long story, and not all that interesting )
drummerdick said:
Part of what I don't understand: the recovery image that the S-On method uses, why can't that just be flashed as the recovery on my phone?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think that recovery image you're talking about IS CWM, in which case, you could use it, no problem. I prefer TWRP for the touch interface, and the fact that it can restore backups larger than 2GB (which that version of CWM can't).
Well, check your bootloader.
If it says Unlocked, then you will still have the problem with flashing the kernel.
Flash the Juopunutbear hboot from http://unlimited.io/jbhboots.htm
Your bootloader should say = Juopunutbear = where it says LOCKED or UNLOCKED.
You should be able to flash kernels through recovery without any problems after that.
kgs1992 said:
Well, check your bootloader.
If it says Unlocked, then you will still have the problem with flashing the kernel.
Flash the Juopunutbear hboot from http://unlimited.io/jbhboots.htm
Your bootloader should say = Juopunutbear = where it says LOCKED or UNLOCKED.
You should be able to flash kernels through recovery without any problems after that.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I did flash the Juopunutbear HBOOT, and it does say it on the HBOOT screen. This is also part of my confusion why I'm having trouble
I think that recovery image you're talking about IS CWM, in which case, you could use it, no problem. I prefer TWRP for the touch interface, and the fact that it can restore backups larger than 2GB (which that version of CWM can't).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I tried just flashing the .img file from the S-On method in fastboot, but I don't think that worked. I thought I'd try that since that was supposed to be the one that was able to flash kernels. I think I ended up with a bootloop after that, lol, so I switched it back.
drummerdick said:
I did flash the Juopunutbear HBOOT, and it does say it on the HBOOT screen. This is also part of my confusion why I'm having trouble
I tried just flashing the .img file from the S-On method in fastboot, but I don't think that worked. I thought I'd try that since that was supposed to be the one that was able to flash kernels. I think I ended up with a bootloop after that, lol, so I switched it back.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Verify that the MD5sums for the downloaded files matches the ones provided in the respective threads.
So, I received my replacement HTC One from HTC today and it's pre-updated to 4.4.2 Android and Sense 6.0. From what I've read, that is a problem when it comes to wanting S-Off in the future.
My question is, what do I do from here to get back to being Unlocked, Rooted, SuperCID, S-Off, etc. I want my phone fully up to date to the best of it's capabilities with all of this. (I never updated firmwares, radios, etc when I had my phone before and I'm not sure if that held me back any).
It's been over a year now since I've done any of this stuff and all of my confidence is gone due to the absence. Where do I start nowadays? Any particular order so I don't have to re-lock my bootloader to S-Off or to install a firmware update or blah blah.
What order of things do I do and what do I do from here? Fully stock at the moment with Hboot 1.57
Note:
I'm not a huge fan of Sense roms, so my goal is to probably use ARHD 6.1 (GPE) for my stable rom and use CM11 for my unstable AOSP rom. I want to be able to freely switch between the two without issues if possible, like I was able to before.
Leather Sock said:
So, I received my replacement HTC One from HTC today and it's pre-updated to 4.4.2 Android and Sense 6.0. From what I've read, that is a problem when it comes to wanting S-Off in the future.
My question is, what do I do from here to get back to being Unlocked, Rooted, SuperCID, S-Off, etc. I want my phone fully up to date to the best of it's capabilities with all of this. (I never updated firmwares, radios, etc when I had my phone before and I'm not sure if that held me back any).
It's been over a year now since I've done any of this stuff and all of my confidence is gone due to the absence. Where do I start nowadays? Any particular order so I don't have to re-lock my bootloader to S-Off or to install a firmware update or blah blah.
What order of things do I do and what do I do from here? Fully stock at the moment with Hboot 1.57
Note:
I'm not a huge fan of Sense roms, so my goal is to probably use ARHD 6.1 (GPE) for my stable rom and use CM11 for my unstable AOSP rom. I want to be able to freely switch between the two without issues if possible, like I was able to before.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can try firewater s-off before you unlock bootloader, if that doesn't work you can go the conventional route by HTCDev unlock first, then custom recovery and root then firewater s-off. If you can not get s-off with firewater, then you might be able to get it with Sunshine. Which ever way you go before flashing a custom ROM, do a nandroid backup and save it to your PC.
majmoz said:
You can try firewater s-off before you unlock bootloader, if that doesn't work you can go the conventional route by HTCDev unlock first, then custom recovery and root then firewater s-off. If you can not get s-off with firewater, then you might be able to get it with Sunshine. Which ever way you go before flashing a custom ROM, do a nandroid backup and save it to your PC.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So I use Firewater and that makes me S-Off even though my bootloader isn't unlocked and I don't have root? I know it says it uses a "temp" root option but if I use this, will I not have a rom anymore or does it just do it in the background until I unlock the bootloader and stuff?
Leather Sock said:
So I use Firewater and that makes me S-Off even though my bootloader isn't unlocked and I don't have root? I know it says it uses a "temp" root option but if I use this, will I not have a rom anymore or does it just do it in the background until I unlock the bootloader and stuff?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The second method will using a temporary root get you S-OFF with an UNLOCKED bootloader. You will still have to flash a custom rom and gain root. It should not effect your rom, in fact it works best on stock roms. As it says in the OP it doesn't work on all phones. You may have to use the first method. It is an option, it is your choice.
majmoz said:
The second method will using a temporary root get you S-OFF with an UNLOCKED bootloader. You will still have to flash a custom rom and gain root. It should not effect your rom, in fact it works best on stock roms. As it says in the OP it doesn't work on all phones. You may have to use the first method. It is an option, it is your choice.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Okay, so I should be able to follow all of those steps in the second option with TempRoot and my phone will still function and behave like it does right now? Reason I ask is I need my phone for work and I plan to sleep in 2 hours. I have enough time to do the bootloader unlocking + S-off, but not the rooting/custom rom right now.
If I can do this in bits and pieces, it'll be very helpful. I just need to make sure my rom will be working after
Leather Sock said:
Okay, so I should be able to follow all of those steps in the second option with TempRoot and my phone will still function and behave like it does right now? Reason I ask is I need my phone for work and I plan to sleep in 2 hours. I have enough time to do the bootloader unlocking + S-off, but not the rooting/custom rom right now.
If I can do this in bits and pieces, it'll be very helpful. I just need to make sure my rom will be working after
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why not wait until you have ample time just in case something goes sideways on you! If you are rushed for time, that is when mistakes happen so wait until the weekend.
majmoz said:
Why not wait until you have ample time just in case something goes sideways on you! If you are rushed for time, that is when mistakes happen so wait until the weekend.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, I suppose. I just feel so...messy with this stock ROM. I'm so used to using a ROM completely based off of what I want installed on it that doesn't use Sense at all. Oh well.
I'll get Nova launcher on there and clean it up a little bit.
Let's not get into the whole debate that millions of others have about sunshine.
Anyway, I have seen conflicting information, and am somewhat confused. Many say you can still install custom roms with S-On and even install custom recoveries, while others say you can't install some roms unless you are S-Off.
Now, I know I can't flash a custom radio while S-On, or "convert" it into a play or dev or whatever edition.
I am fine with that (I assume I can still flash official radios released for it?), I don't want to convert it into a different type of M8 or switch carriers or anything. I just want to have rooted custom roms.
In that regard, just what would I be limited to exactly? Again, half the posts say you can still flash custom and rooted roms with S-On, and others say you need S-Off for custom roms, do they mean custom roms that are for dev/play/etc editions would require S-Off? Or are there custom roms designed for a regular Sprint M8 that would still need S-Off? Or am I even limited to only stock versions/mods of the Sprint rom? What about installing recoveries?
S-off isn't required to flash a ROM, but in some cases you have to flash the kernel separately from the ROM.
Do you mean that I won't be able to flash a kernel separately with S-on? I don't get that, won't roms flash the kernel and other key files to the system partition (which I assume you need to format first before flashing the rom) anyway?
Cyber Akuma said:
Do you mean that I won't be able to flash a kernel separately with S-on? I don't get that, won't roms flash the kernel and other key files to the system partition (which I assume you need to format first before flashing the rom) anyway?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hit the second link in my sig and read the section pertaining to S-on kernel flashing.
I don't understand, what do you mean that you can't write to the /system partition permanently if you are S-On? Wouldn't you need to be able to write to the system partition in order to flash a custom rom your phone?
Cyber Akuma said:
I don't understand, what do you mean that you can't write to the /system partition permanently if you are S-On? Wouldn't you need to be able to write to the system partition in order to flash a custom rom your phone?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Meaning any changes that you make are only temporary and won't survive a reboot.
Though again, changes like installing a custom ROM? Or do you not need access to /system to install a custom rom?
It certainly helps to have S-OFF, but I haven't found it all that necessary. I'm currently on the ViperOneM8 3.2.1 with S-ON, and I'm not having any issues. Nothing that cannot be fixed anyway. At one point, I had ran into some trouble when I installed Sense 6 Toolbox (Xposed Mod), played with some settings and then uninstalled it. The trouble was with Venom Tweaks, it just wouldn't run. Thankfully I had a back-up, loaded it up, and it's all good. Other than that, no problem. And I'm not even sure if S-ON was the problem, but I'm assuming that the reason why Venom couldn't boot up was because it had no permission to overwrite some stuff that the xmod sense 6 toolbox left behind. I'm just guessing of course, I'm probably wrong.
But yeah, I would give ViperOneM8 a try, though be careful. Make sure you have all the right firmware installed BEFORE you start doing any rooting. It will save you a lot of headache.
Amer28 said:
At one point, I had ran into some trouble when I installed Sense 6 Toolbox (Xposed Mod), played with some settings and then uninstalled it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Amer28 said:
I'm assuming that the reason why Venom couldn't boot up was because it had no permission to overwrite some stuff that the xmod sense 6 toolbox left behind. I'm just guessing of course, I'm probably wrong.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry to keep going on about this, but I am still confused. If you can't permanently write to the /system partition, how were you able to install tools that modify system files? You mentioned that you think the reason was that the Toolbox software you installed left some modified files behind, if S-On means you can't permanently modify those files then how did they survive a reboot?
Would I be able to install a security application like avira onto the system partition with S-On? It has an option to install itself, and it's settings, into a rooted phone so the application (and it's settings) cannot just be wiped from a factory reset. Wouldn't it need to write to the system partition in order to do that?
Come to think of it, I know you can install another bootloader and/or recovery once you are rooted, but wouldn't you also need to be able to access the system partition in order to be able to do that?
I don't get what this unable to permanently write to the system partition while S-On entails since it seems like many things do permanently write to it still.
Cyber Akuma said:
Sorry to keep going on about this, but I am still confused. If you can't permanently write to the /system partition, how were you able to install tools that modify system files? You mentioned that you think the reason was that the Toolbox software you installed left some modified files behind, if S-On means you can't permanently modify those files then how did they survive a reboot?
Would I be able to install a security application like avira onto the system partition with S-On? It has an option to install itself, and it's settings, into a rooted phone so the application (and it's settings) cannot just be wiped from a factory reset. Wouldn't it need to write to the system partition in order to do that?
Come to think of it, I know you can install another bootloader and/or recovery once you are rooted, but wouldn't you also need to be able to access the system partition in order to be able to do that?
I don't get what this unable to permanently write to the system partition while S-On entails since it seems like many things do permanently write to it still.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not hundred percent sure on this. I don't do any modding or anything myself, but it is my understanding that you actually 'can' write to the system partition. Just not 'some' stuff. It's essentially like having safe mode on, it just ensures that you don't completely brick the phone.
Again, please do not quote me on any on this. I'm merely humoring the subject, not an expert in any sense of the word.
You can flash virtually any custom ROM with S-On as long as you unlock your Bootloader at HtcDev... I can explain details later on, I am just busy atm...
---------- Post added at 11:09 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:19 PM ----------
Some more details:
Basically you have 2 options to enable Custom Roms on the HTC One M8
1. Unlock bootloader at http://www.htcdev.com/bootloader/
2. Gain S-Off
For 99% of the ROMs it makes no difference which way you go. You can flash a custom recovery with both ways and you can flash custom ROMs with both ways. There is no such thing as a limitation during writing /system.
The difference is that with S-Off you can change your device IDs (e.g. CID) and in consequence you can flash firmware (like radio firmware, adsp firmware, etc.) that is not meant for your device. So playing with S-Off is quite "risky" you can "easily" achive a brick.
With S-On, you can only flash firmware which is signed for your device.
I would give the recommendation as follows: If you decide to go with S-On (which I would do if you have no specific reason for S-Off) then after flashing a custom recovery, take a backup of your stock ROM. Then, when you need a update of the firmware components, you can restore that backup, flash stock recovery, relock bootloader and use stock OTA to update all firmware components consistently.
elandroido said:
Then, when you need a update of the firmware components, you can restore that backup, flash stock recovery, relock bootloader and use stock OTA to update all firmware components consistently.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wait, so I can't flash an updated radio if I am on a custom rom even if that radio was officially released for my device? I thought even with S-On you would still be able to flash a radio if it was officially released and signed for your device?
Well you can flash a radio which is signed for your device. But the safer way imho is to go the OTA way, because that really dates up everything. There might be other firmware components that can receive an update and when you go OTA everything stays consistent. But oft course you can also take the manual way, if you find a proper firmware zip.
Cyber Akuma said:
Wait, so I can't flash an updated radio if I am on a custom rom even if that radio was officially released for my device? I thought even with S-On you would still be able to flash a radio if it was officially released and signed for your device?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can flash the full, signed firmware such as what OMJ provides in his RUU thread, but you cannot flash unsigned firmware to your device while S-on. You can still update your radios, you just have to jump through a few more hoops to do so, unlike those who have S-off.
You might want to take a look at the first post in the thread linked below for more info:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1680928
Hey everyone,
It's been several years since I've done any rooting and I want to root 2x HTC One M7's I have so I can a better version of Android on there and maybe a cleaner ROM (any recommendations?).
I've seen a few tutorials on here, but most are dated back to 2013 (I know the phone is old) but want to make sure those are still the best methods? There is a video stickied at the top to a toolkit install, is that the go-to right now?
Also, keep reading about S-On and S-Off. How can I check this and what does it mean?
Thanks for the help!
gamingneeds said:
I've seen a few tutorials on here, but most are dated back to 2013 (I know the phone is old) but want to make sure those are still the best methods? There is a video stickied at the top to a toolkit install, is that the go-to right now?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Unlock bootloader
Flash twrp
Flash latest supersu or margisk
Dont use toolkit, you only need fastboot/adb
Also, keep reading about S-On and S-Off. How can I check this
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Code:
fastboot getvar security
will output ON or OFF
Or you can check directly from the bootloader screen at 2nd line "M7_UL PVT SHIP S-ON(or S-OFF) RH"
and what does it mean?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
S-OFF = Write protection disabled for all partitions. You are free to edit anything you'd like and nothing will prevent you to make mistakes that will permanently brick your phone.(great power comes great responsibility)
Bootloader unlocked + S-ON = Write protection & signature verification disabled for /system, /boot, /recovery and /radio partitions only so you can flash custom roms/recovery/radio/kernel
Bootloader locked + S-ON = Write protection & signature verification enabled for all partitions (except the user data partition ofc), only signed files form HTC can be flashed, i.e: RUU.
@alray Thanks for the reply!
I unlocked bootloader. I have yet to flash TWRP as I need to find an up-to-date tutorial as I read I need to make sure I backup the stock ROM. I also want to put an Oreo ROM on, and I'm sure one will be available in the coming weeks.
As far as S-ON, my phone is S-On, but I guess there are ways around it. I found this method here, albeit it seems like it might be outdated now:
https://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2236849
What are your thoughts?
Also, been reading about kernels and placing kernels and I have no idea what this does. Any good links for reading about them and why they are needed?
Thanks again!
gamingneeds said:
@alray Thanks for the reply!
I unlocked bootloader. I have yet to flash TWRP as I need to find an up-to-date tutorial as I read I need to make sure I backup the stock ROM. I also want to put an Oreo ROM on, and I'm sure one will be available in the coming weeks.
As far as S-ON, my phone is S-On, but I guess there are ways around it. I found this method here, albeit it seems like it might be outdated now:
https://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2236849
What are your thoughts?
Also, been reading about kernels and placing kernels and I have no idea what this does. Any good links for reading about them and why they are needed?
Thanks again!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What version is your HBOOT, any idea?
gamingneeds said:
@alray Thanks for the reply!
I unlocked bootloader. I have yet to flash TWRP as I need to find an up-to-date tutorial as I read I need to make sure I backup the stock ROM.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You need a custom recovery to make a backup of your rom so TWRP you need to flash now. You don't need any guide, it's as simple as:
Code:
fastboot flash recovery filename.img
fastboot erase cache
fastboot reboot-bootloader
then you can make a backup of your rom from twrp using the backup menu. Don't forget to copy the backup files from your phone to your computer.
As far as S-ON, my phone is S-On, but I guess there are ways around it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
A way round what? Why do you want S-OFF for? Do you understand the difference between s-on/off ?
I found this method here, albeit it seems like it might be outdated now:
https://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2236849
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Totally unrelated to s-on/s-off. This guide is to disable stock kernel's /system write protection. S-On/S-Off doesn't have any effect on stock kernel write protection, neither on /system at all.
Stock kernel write protection = When using the stock kernel on your phone, /system will be write-protected (when booted in the rom only)and any change made to this partition will not persist after a reboot (even with root & s-off). So you either need to make your desired changes to /system from a custom recovery (stock kernel is not booted in recovery so write protection to /system is not active) or you must flash a custom kernel with /system write protection disabled (will make possible to change /system even from the rom). Most custom roms comes with a custom kernel with the protection disabled, so it's only a concern if you plan to use the stock rom & kernel.
Also, been reading about kernels and placing kernels and I have no idea what this does. Any good links for reading about them and why they are needed?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
To simplify, kernel is the software making the link between the OS and the hardware. With a custom kernel you have more control over your phone with for example the possibility to change cpu frequency, have the touchscreen always "listening" for input --> making possible to have the the DT2W option (double tap the screen to wake the phone) and much more. You must use a custom kernel compatible with your rom type (i.e: Sense based rom vs CM rom) and with your android version. The custom rom you'll flash will already come with a compatible kernel (it's flashed automatically when flashing the rom), if you want to flash one with more options, you'll have to make sure it's compatible.