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I'm pretty sure I saw that on the side of the box at an AT&T store (it was far from me behind the counter though), but I've have never heard this about this phone before. Is the performance increase over the Tytn very noticeable to this effect?
stpete111 said:
I'm pretty sure I saw that on the side of the box at an AT&T store (it was far from me behind the counter though), but I've have never heard this about this phone before. Is the performance increase over the Tytn very noticeable to this effect?
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There's nothing on the device, the HTC box or the Internets that leads me to believe that that's true.
I just saw a news.com story a couple of days ago (cant find the link though) about dual-core devices.
There's no noticible speed increas on the Kaiser.
Also, see this:http://www.pocketnow.com/index.php?a=portal_detail&t=news&id=4554
s
Nope, but there are seperate CPU's the 2nd one runs the radio. Doesn't help WM6 speed, mabe it unloads it a little.
The side of the box DOES say dual core
I would scan the side of the box "Att White label reads ...400 mhz dual core processor..."but i dont need to prove it, do the research...even though it is prob. a marketing scheme!
shaharprish said:
There's nothing on the device, the HTC box or the Internets that leads me to believe that that's true.
I just saw a news.com story a couple of days ago (cant find the link though) about dual-core devices.
There's no noticible speed increas on the Kaiser.
Also, see this:http://www.pocketnow.com/index.php?a=portal_detail&t=news&id=4554
s
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Regarding speed, you say there's no noticable speed increase on the Kaiser. I'd disagree there, the first and most enduring thing I have noticed is a speed increase (untweaked) compared with a heavily tweaked (for max speed) Hermes. That said though, that increase is not across the board in all applications.
Regarding whether it's dual core or not - well it just depends what you mean. Not perhaps dual core as we might normally think of it but rather a double processor function with seperate handling of some functions. That has advantages and dedicates processing to specific functions. In any case of course dual core is a much over hyped concept and for example a quad core can still be slower than a double or single processor. Much of this whole idea about cores is misleading and panders to those unenlihghtened folk who assume that the more cores you have the faster things will be. Very crudely put would you rather a dual 100 mhz core processor or a single 400mhz processor?
Mike
Its got one processor for PDA function and another for 3g... which actually means worse battery consumption... I heard HTC etc are working on a combined processor
And to answer the poster above, it actually depends what jobs I was asking the device to do...
unwired4 said:
And to answer the poster above, it actually depends what jobs I was asking the device to do...
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Exactly, a wise answer.
Mike
There's a lot of talk about this subject, and from an architecture standpoint it depends on how you define "dual core". In modern terms, it means two processors with identical functions packaged together. However, that's only true of the last couple of years.
Back in the days of the 386, a separate processor was required to do floating point math. This co-processor (the FPU) was built into the die of the 486 chip. In the days of the Pentium Pro, the cache chip and its supporting logic was on-die, then removed in the Pentium II, then re-integrated in the Pentium III. The Athlon64 chip took the memory controller, formerly in a separate chip, and put it on-die to increase performance. The next generation Intel mobile processors will have an integrated GPU chip in the CPU (and AMD/Cyrix did the same several years ago). In the strictest definition, all of these are "systems on a chip" (SoCs) and are "multi-core" processors, as they take the functionality of two chips ("cores"), and integrate them into one.
The question is, when does a processor that can accelerate multiple functions simultanesously stop being "multi-core" and start being a processor that has a function built in?
The Quallcomm 7200 and 7500 SoCs have several "co-processors" built in. There's one for graphics, one for GPS, one for the radio, etc. Saying it's "multi-core" by modern standards is a stretch, but it does indeed have dedicated processor acceleration for various processor tasks. It's more in line with how some of the above examples work than "true" multi-processing like a Core Duo or Athlon X2 work, but it's there.
He's right, the side of the Tilt box says "QUALCOMM(r) Dual Core 400 Mhz Processor"
Pretty misleading. 2nd core doesn't operate at 400 Mhz, either (290-something, I think)
DLD
well I can say that coming from a wizard (200 mhz) ran everything to my kaiser (260 or 290 for the phone and 400 for everything else) its an incredible diference. on the wizard hit the hang up button 20-30 times LITERALLY and then it wil finally disconnect hit the hang up botton on the kaiser no mater what ur running it disconnects instantly. and I know its definitely capable of running games much quicker than my my wizard. also keep in mind the wizard was overclocked 252 with every tweak and the kaiser is stock.
A good discusion, if you look at Intel's roadmap they are heading in the direction of having 'core acceleration'. Theye are designing seperate cores for different tasks, so if you want a sql server you would have a core that's dedicated to windows, one dedicated to storage, and one that's dedicated to sql... or something like that...
But hey when you have 80cores in a processor you can specialise them I suppose.
Yeah, finally picked up the Tilt yesterday and what I thought I saw is what I definitely saw, as confirmed by exzist and RacerX earlier in the thread. Definitely an interesting discussion as to what that really does mean.
Title says it all. Pershoot et al seem to be keeping o.c'ing to 1113 whilst wildmonks has a test kernel at 1190. Can the snapdragon on our little phone go beyond this? Was just wondering as on face of it the milestone is oc'd to over twice its original spec speed.
You could give it a shot, though it could render your system unstable. The overclock speeds used by kernel devs are within the range of what has been identified as stable. I think there have been kernels which have been overclocked to 1.3Ghz, but people using those reported stability and overheating issues. 1.1Ghz is by far the safest overclock speed for the snapdragon.
Judging by reports, most devices can't go above 1150-1170, but selected few have been able to achieve 1267 on stock voltages.
Not all silicon is created equal...
For some simple benchmarking and testing purposes, I'd have my super-over-clocked N1 infront of a breezy A/C vent.
My phone was over 100*F one time, while driving a long distance and the GPS was on. It quickly cooled to under 80*F, as I held it in front of the A/C vent in my car.
I'm sure with some frigid air cooling, some amazing benchmarks can be achieved.
ONLY TEMPORARILY THOUGH, as I'm sure it would probably damage something.
I just overclocked my droid using the tazkern 1.1 Besides being miserably slower than before when I boot up, It doesn't even give me the option to go up to 1.1 ghz. Any suggestions?
suggestion:
and don't take this wrongly in any way..
Stop overclocking so much!! It's a damn phone, not a gaming rig. That and also you really risk of damaging of your CPU and other internals...
My Milestone is running stock. It stays cool and is fast enough. This is after i tried some weeks running it on 800 Mhz. It gets too hot and that also during conversations.
I get where you're coming from but still, I was just getting a lil tired of the the thing lagging every time i opened the app drawer or market. I actually fiddled with it a little after I posted that and got it to run perfectly. And I think Im fixing to try out a 1.2ghz kernel just to see what happens. So far there's been no overheating or crashing.
ECC is kicking in and making your phone slower. Use a lower clock, your phone doesn't support it.
Actually its running quite smoothly so far. Ive been running it for around 30 mins now and its super fats, smooth, and appears stable. Ive tested it on youtube tho and its getting pretty warm.
Mines runs all day, every day at 1.2ghz. The quirks are not from the overclock. Thbey were always there.
Thats what Im on now. I think Im using the slayher 1.2ghz kernel.
Droid or Milestone?
If Droid, you're in the wrong forum. This is the Milestone one.
I have mine at 720mhz overclocked and it works fine,i dont have any heat problems,i always check the battery tempeture via SETCPU app,always is at 30C to 32C,not more than 32C!!!
I love it more tha my iphone
I think people need to learn the risks of overclocking.
You may say its stable and running fine and "just a little warm" but you are infact destroying your CPU.
If you touched your computer case and "it was a little warm" you would be worried.
Consistently hot systems aren't expected to last anywhere near as long a cooler systems. Thermal fatigue in silicon results in cracks in transistors, and transistor mounting failures, in particular. Of course, just one transistor failure on a complex system such as a motherboard or graphics card can result in the entire system failing. And a replacement board being an appropriate fix.
Source: http://ezinearticles.com/?The-Effect-of-Heat-on-CPUs-and-Computer-Systems&id=2310508
For computer CPUs, but you get the idea.
Oh dont worry. I turn my phone by the time it burstsinto flames. And btw i apologize but i did post this in the wrong forum. Oops.
droid doesnt equal milestone. development is different due to locked kernel / bootloader..
but saying that. i use 1.2ghz with 70 vsel, or 1ghz with 60 vsel.
its a little lower voltage, but i assume it saves battery.
might not be stable for you, but i've been running it for 8 days straight now..
i dont use a lower voltage cuz i heard it damages the cpu. i stay within safe tested voltages
Link to german oc voltage testing
milestone users have to rely on a kernel module to overclock.
DannyDroid said:
words
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overclocking damaging the phone? please.. the omap 3430 has the same CPU as the 3630
3630 is upclocked to 1.2ghz and is in the droid 2. i suggest you checking out T.I.'s website. our cpu is clearly capable of reaching these speeds without damage.
Besides. i've had my milestone ever since it came out. I've been overclocking it since it became an option and my phone has never died.
but saying all that. an inexperienced user playing with voltages can seriously damage their phones if they dont know what they're doing. too high or low of voltage or speed can result in a brick.
EDIT: sry for bringing up the droid/milestone thing again, i didnt read the post above me lol
1xinfusion said:
droid doesnt equal milestone. development is different due to locked kernel / bootloader..
but saying that. i use 1.2ghz with 70 vsel, or 1ghz with 60 vsel.
its a little lower voltage, but i assume it saves battery.
might not be stable for you, but i've been running it for 8 days straight now..
i dont use a lower voltage cuz i heard it damages the cpu. i stay within safe tested voltages
Link to german oc voltage testing
milestone users have to rely on a kernel module to overclock.
overclocking damaging the phone? please.. the omap 3430 has the same CPU as the 3630
3630 is upclocked to 1.2ghz and is in the droid 2. i suggest you checking out T.I.'s website. our cpu is clearly capable of reaching these speeds without damage.
Besides. i've had my milestone ever since it came out. I've been overclocking it since it became an option and my phone has never died.
but saying all that. an inexperienced user playing with voltages can seriously damage their phones if they dont know what they're doing. too high or low of voltage or speed can result in a brick.
EDIT: sry for bringing up the droid/milestone thing again, i didnt read the post above me lol
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The OMAP 3430 is a 65nm chip while the 3630 is a 45nm chip. Newer smaller manufacturing processes = cooler chips. They are NOT the same chips by far.
Furthermore, you realize that many memory chips are made equally. Then the memory manufacturers go and test out different batches. The ones that clock higher can be stamped as higher clocking or faster timing memory. They may be made the same, but usually the better made batches go to the higher end parts. The same goes when Intel makes CPUs. The crappy CPUs with some problems become Celerons. It might've been a Core 2 Duo or i7 or whatever, but Intel goes and disables cores/cuts off memory if it was not a good batch.
You can't look at models and go "well that CPU can do it, why can't mine."
If people have knowledge of CPU overclocking here where you understand that people look for certain serials/batches of Core i7s for best overclockability. Even though to Intel they all meet i7 930 specifications, there's still separation within the i7 930 crowd. Certain batches are better. Maybe not good enough to be an i7 950, but still better than the worst i7 930.
The other question is: What is stability? How do YOU determine what is stable? apps not crashing? In the overclocking world we run Linpack tests for like 24 hours before calling computers stable. Just because you can boot into Windows or Android or play Angry Birds for 3 hours doesn't mean much. It doesn't mean you don't suffer from bugs from overclocking. It's hard to say unless you do a full stress test on your CPU.
The 3600 OMAP is clearly superior to the 3400 series, but I do think that the latter is more overclockable.
I've had no overheating issues at 900MHz, 56 vsel, don't feel the need for higher frequency.
Will, this is all starting to go over my head. I'll just sit in the corner n twiddle my thumbs.
Just think of the 3600 as a 2010 Intel i7 chip and the 3400 as last year's i7 CPU...same platform and architecture but smaller manufacturing process and (probably) a bit faster at the same clock speeds, with the same features.
applebook said:
Just think of the 3600 as a 2010 Intel i7 chip and the 3400 as last year's i7 CPU...same platform and architecture but smaller manufacturing process and (probably) a bit faster at the same clock speeds, with the same features.
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I was just trying to get at the same idea
I might have been too exact in my words but this is what i meant
and something fyi is that the OC capability of both chips are "capped" at 1.2ghz ... its just dangerous and unstable after that.
heat wise ? I'm inclined to believe that heavy wifi / 3g usage provides a higher source of heat than our petty oc-ing. Our cpus are clearly capable of this. true you make a good point. smaller architecture = cooler and less power. but the heat is probably out of the question. i use setcpu to display my temp. it never goes past the rated temperature. in fact it always stays at around 35c
when using wifi/3g on the other hand.. no need to say. the fact that these chips have no thermal barrier between them and the fact that the heat is able to be felt on the surface on your phone... in such close proximity to the radio chips, the cpu is not going to be heated by oc but by these other factors.
its safe to say you should lower your 3g / wifi usage to reduce thermal stress on your phone
stability wise... I'm not the one to stress test or w.e for long periods of time, but the link i've attached to my previous post shows a lot of people who have.
maybe you should check that out. I'm just here to relay information.
I have mine overclocked to 800 and it stable and quicker than stock its not all cpu its the amount of free memory you have at any given time
here is another very interesting page. this time regarding the droid
http://www.droidforums.net/forum/droid-hacks/20406-max-temp-while-overclocking-12.html
be aware that a lot of the temperatures are in fahrenheit.
highest temps of these guys average around 40-50 Celsius, way below the rated temp
Actually, mine has been running smooth this past week or so with no abnormal heat or crashes.
Sent from my Droid using Tapatalk
Technically speaking all TouchPads, black or white ones have the same SoCs, the APQ8060. It's factory clock should be 1.5GHz, which the white TouchPads are set on, but the black ones are all clocked at 1.2GHz.
So if we treat it as a 1.5GHz base shouldn't we 'technically' have more overclock head room, ignoring the fact that we don't have proper kernels for that anyways?
I'm just curious on why the CM7 builds didn't use the SoC factory clock and instead followed the HP settings. Because with the kernel as it is, we can get to a maximum of about 1.8GHz using any basic overclocking program which is only about 20% over the factory speed.
they might have lowered the voltage in addition to running it at 1.2 as opposed to 1.5G. that means even if you want to set it back to 1.5G, settings still need to be looked at closely. running it at default 1.5G does not give you more overclock head room either, as the final speed that your particular touchpad cpu can run does not depend on that.
iamsamsamiam said:
Technically speaking all TouchPads, black or white ones have the same SoCs, the APQ8060. It's factory clock should be 1.5GHz, which the white TouchPads are set on, but the black ones are all clocked at 1.2GHz.
So if we treat it as a 1.5GHz base shouldn't we 'technically' have more overclock head room, ignoring the fact that we don't have proper kernels for that anyways?
I'm just curious on why the CM7 builds didn't use the SoC factory clock and instead followed the HP settings. Because with the kernel as it is, we can get to a maximum of about 1.8GHz using any basic overclocking program which is only about 20% over the factory speed.
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HP most likely turned them down for battery life concerns (a rather common practice, Apple used to do this on the iPhone before they started making their own chips) and then undid it to justify a higher price on the white models. CM most likely is keeping it so that battery life will be comparable once its issues are worked out.
For now 1.2ghz is fast enough for me, i would rather have the better battery life.
Well, if i remember correctly, in WebOS there was no battery or heat issues changing the clock speed to 1.5GHz. Basically, the battery life was the same and the system temperature was about 2 degrees higher, and was well within the safe range. It just seemed like there was no benefit in clocking it down.
Maybe there are a battery benefits in Android, but as it stands the battery expectancy in Android is about 30-40% less than the WebOS usage range.
Moving the clock speed to over 1.5 might raise the temperature a bit, but even in WebOS people didn't see that much of a usage change (but that could be because there's nothing really to run on WebOS).
There is another thing to consider, all chips are not born equal, every fabricator of chips does what they call binning and I'll quote an article that can describe it better than I can
from - http://www.edn.com/blog/Between_The_Lines/35926-Karma_for_MPUs_is_chip_binning_burning_up_.php
"Chip binning has always been fascinating to me on many levels. What is it? It’s essentially a practice in which chip manufacturers design a chip to hit a targeted speed grade, say for example 2GHz, but after the chips are manufactured and tested, manufactures find some of the chips perform at the targeted speed grade of 2GHz, some perform at higher than 2GHz, and even more perform at lower speeds than that targeted specification number (some of those lower performing chips may perform at 1.8 GHz, others at 1.5 GHz and some at 1 GHz…and lower). But instead of throwing out the chips that didn’t hit the targeted performance specification, some semiconductor vendors, especially microprocessor vendors, sell most of them to us, the consumer. They simply put them in bins according to speed grade and price them accordingly."
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So the 1.5GHz units may very well be of greater quality than the chips that ended up in our 1.2GHz units and by raising the base to 1.5GHz many people could end up with unstable Touchpads.
Hey Everyone, I just wanna know if I Can OC My SGS to 1.2GHz Without any problems, Because I heared that OC SGS is not stable and It's dagerous for my Phone's Life, I that True ?
-Thanks For Replying-
Shadow Life said:
Hey Everyone, I just wanna know if I Can OC My SGS to 1.2GHz Without any problems, Because I heared that OC SGS is not stable and It's dagerous for my Phone's Life, I that True ?
-Thanks For Replying-
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Yes you can, depending on the kernel you use, oc your phone even up to 1.5 ghz.
Flash Glitch, MNICS, Devil or Semaphore Kernel for ICS roms
Do so with care as OCing WILL degrade your processor faster.
It depends a bit on your luck. Processors aren't all the same (variance in quality during manufacturing), the 1 ghz that is the default is considered a 'safe' level and every processor will be able to do that frequency. Usually though, there's a fair amount of buffer, so most processors can go beyond 1ghz to say 1.2 without any issue.
As the frequency increases, stability decreases. This means your phone will become more prone to crashing. Some people are lucky and can go very high (1.5, 1.7?), while others might start facing instability at 1.2. Won't know until you try. It's unlikely to cause permanent damage anyway, just change back to 1.0 if it's unstable
It probably does increase wear and tear of processor somewhat, but considering people will buy a new phone within 1-2 years, there's really no problem
Oc SGS 1.2Ghz
nwsk said:
It depends a bit on your luck. Processors aren't all the same (variance in quality during manufacturing), the 1 ghz that is the default is considered a 'safe' level and every processor will be able to do that frequency. Usually though, there's a fair amount of buffer, so most processors can go beyond 1ghz to say 1.2 without any issue.
As the frequency increases, stability decreases. This means your phone will become more prone to crashing. Some people are lucky and can go very high (1.5, 1.7?), while others might start facing instability at 1.2. Won't know until you try. It's unlikely to cause permanent damage anyway, just change back to 1.0 if it's unstable
It probably does increase wear and tear of processor somewhat, but considering people will buy a new phone within 1-2 years, there's really no problem
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I Have "[email protected]" Kernel Up to 1.3Ghz, I Don't face any problems When i OC to 1.2GHz,, Games run smooth (Real racing 2) And the phone is Very responsive,, But when i play about 2 Hours My phone's temperatur increase (Just a Little Bit) but i don't know if it may Effect my Phone's Life,,
Shadow Life said:
I Have "[email protected]" Kernel Up to 1.3Ghz, I Don't face any problems When i OC to 1.2GHz,, Games run smooth (Real racing 2) And the phone is Very responsive,, But when i play about 2 Hours My phone's temperatur increase (Just a Little Bit) but i don't know if it may Effect my Phone's Life,,
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Being electronics' worst enemy, heat can and will kill your phone. But that's only if it reaches those temperatures. Overclocking your phone naturally will increase heat from the processor. Check your phones temperature. If you're reaching 50C or over, you're getting too hot. The general rule of thumb is this: if it's uncomfortable to the touch, your phone is too hot.
Most phones should get to 1.2 GHz without a problem. Keep in mind that LiveOC is NOT THE SAME as adding another frequency step, which was the traditional way of overclocking. Some kernels do one, some do the other, and some do both. Adding an additional frequency step to get to 1.2 GHz should be capable by most if not all phones. LiveOCing to 1.2 GHz won't be nearly as compatible, as it overclocks the bus, GPU and CPU.
upichie said:
Being electronics' worst enemy, heat can and will kill your phone. But that's only if it reaches those temperatures. Overclocking your phone naturally will increase heat from the processor. Check your phones temperature. If you're reaching 50C or over, you're getting too hot. The general rule of thumb is this: if it's uncomfortable to the touch, your phone is too hot.
Most phones should get to 1.2 GHz without a problem. Keep in mind that LiveOC is NOT THE SAME as adding another frequency step, which was the traditional way of overclocking. Some kernels do one, some do the other, and some do both. Adding an additional frequency step to get to 1.2 GHz should be capable by most if not all phones. LiveOCing to 1.2 GHz won't be nearly as compatible, as it overclocks the bus, GPU and CPU.
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+1