Related
Okay, this post is really intended as a comment and I am not going to pretend I have THE answer but I do have some suggestions to spark discussion.
Based on a lot of the recent comments and back and forth about newbies/tech support I think that the forum is trending the same way I have seen MANY other forums go. What happens is simple; a group of first adopters, who are by default, technically capable, get together on a forum and start to fill in the gaps in tech support, especially when it comes to 'modded' soft or hardwre. They spend a while helping each other out and a comfort level develops. Members know where to go, and when to ask questions.
Then what happens is that the hardware becomes much more popular. All of a sudden your average Joe can walk out a Cingular store with a 8125 for a couple hundred bucks. These folks are NOT early adopters. They are not necessarily tech savvy. They are the people that are most prone to 'keyboard to chair interface errors'. Since the early members did such a good job raising the profile of the forum it starts to come up every time someone does a Google search. and they all end up over their heads.
So then the folks that have been around for a while start to get frustrated. Why should they provide tech support? Why can't these newbies read? Why should they even try to help if they get barraged by stupid questions?
Well I think that takes us to where we are now, so the question is what do we do now? In my experience the only solution that I have seen is to have people equally dedicated to wiki and sticky writing as they are to writing ROMs and programs. The truth is that if you release something you WILL become tech support and a large part of tech support is writing documentation and then explaining it to others.
I have intended this post as something helpful and to spark discussion, not as a criticism of anyone in particular or any particular group. Hopefully it will be taken as such
I agree. I get the feeling that since the relaunch, for one reason or another, there appears to be a lot more"Why don't my apps close when I press X?" and "How dat I swtich this thing 0ff!!!!!!!" type posts.
I think that it's beholden on more experienced users to try to share their experience as they see fit, but it's absolutely essential that newbs and less experienced users use the search button and wiki.
I've been sponsoring a post in the moderators' forum regarding having a specific section for Tutorials etc, eg for the excellent posts that Menneisyys puts together. The wiki may not be the best place for them (due to the risk of negative edits), although it's certainly better then people never looking at them at all...
But as you say, it's pretty much predicted by psychohistory that all fora of dedicated people will eventually turn into a tech support. I don't mind, but less experienced must use the resources already online - quid pro quo.
V
As a new user on this forum i have noticed inconsitant information about G3 vs G4 devices and ROM upgrading. I've seen questions asked by people about G4 devices that go unanswered.
I think the problem with searching on this forum and many others. They do not allow you to search for 3 or fewer letter acronyms such as IPL, SPL, CID. There is no way to search for answers about these things. If there is a setting on the forum that can be changed to allow searching for these terms, then please fix it.
I think when people start posting info about how they did something they need to specify what hardware they are using G3/G4. Thankfully i havent done anything as far as modding my device, but i had seen posts where someone most likely with a G3 device says they figured out how to do this or that, Then someone with a G4 comes along and tried it, not knowing it was done on a G3 and ended up screwing up their device. We need to clearly specify what hardware we are doing mods on.
I still have no clear answer about CID unlocking a G4. I know there is no free utility to do it. Ive seen posts that say the imei-check site can CID unlock. Then i saw a post this morning that imei-check is only a SIM unlock. Can people please provide clear info?
d0ug said:
As a new user on this forum i have noticed inconsitant information about G3 vs G4 devices and ROM upgrading. I've seen questions asked by people about G4 devices that go unanswered.
I think the problem with searching on this forum and many others. They do not allow you to search for 3 or fewer letter acronyms such as IPL, SPL, CID. There is no way to search for answers about these things. If there is a setting on the forum that can be changed to allow searching for these terms, then please fix it.
I think when people start posting info about how they did something they need to specify what hardware they are using G3/G4. Thankfully i havent done anything as far as modding my device, but i had seen posts where someone most likely with a G3 device says they figured out how to do this or that, Then someone with a G4 comes along and tried it, not knowing it was done on a G3 and ended up screwing up their device. We need to clearly specify what hardware we are doing mods on.
I still have no clear answer about CID unlocking a G4. I know there is no free utility to do it. Ive seen posts that say the imei-check site can CID unlock. Then i saw a post this morning that imei-check is only a SIM unlock. Can people please provide clear info?
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I agree with you d0ug! It is rather confusing to navigate and find your way. Especially when you are a n00b, such as myself. I have been trying to mod my phone for 3 days now. I have tried many ways of unlocking my G3, but none of them have worked. I have listened to 3 different people tell me their "way" of unlocking the phone, and all 3 attempts failed in the end. I get flamed for not reading posts or searching, when i did, just nothing relevant popped up! This is not a whine fest, just saying that some people dont have phones that were built on a Wednesday, like mine that was probably built on a Monday and has issues!
Either way, i called Cingular and they are shipping me a brand new 8125 to test things out on!
Canon
Haven't been a wizard user that long although I've been in the ppc scene in about 5 years and quite active in several forums. The most successful solution that I've seen to this problem (witch enevitably always comes up) is to not let new users post for at least 7 days and/or forcing them to read various informational topics before getting access to the actual forum.
This will of course not get everyone but has in my experience improved the situation considerably.
Ah well, that's just my two cents
vijay555 said:
I agree. I get the feeling that since the relaunch, for one reason or another, there appears to be a lot more"Why don't my apps close when I press X?" and "How dat I swtich this thing 0ff!!!!!!!" type posts.
I think that it's beholden on more experienced users to try to share their experience as they see fit, but it's absolutely essential that newbs and less experienced users use the search button and wiki.
I've been sponsoring a post in the moderators' forum regarding having a specific section for Tutorials etc, eg for the excellent posts that Menneisyys puts together. The wiki may not be the best place for them (due to the risk of negative edits), although it's certainly better then people never looking at them at all...
But as you say, it's pretty much predicted by psychohistory that all fora of dedicated people will eventually turn into a tech support. I don't mind, but less experienced must use the resources already online - quid pro quo.
V
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Vijay, very happy to see that the mods are looking at this. I agree that Wiki's have their limitations especially given the validity of some of the comments about conflicting advice.
The search function definitely does have its limits as well, and people are less likely to go through searches that produce a 100 threads with 5 pages each.
I for one would feel a lot better about telling someone harshly to stop answering questions if I knew that I could also direct them to a single place for answers.
I really love this forum and it has helped me so much. I don't post much except to say "thank you" from time to time to the people who have made some program that has been helpful to me. And although I have been coming to this board every day for over a year I still don't know half as much as the majority of people here.
Some solutions to this problem are:
1) get frustrated and write a mean message to the noob
2) take a minute and just give the link to the page where the answer is
3) make it easier on this forum to find things
_Nomad_ said:
Haven't been a wizard user that long although I've been in the ppc scene in about 5 years and quite active in several forums. The most successful solution that I've seen to this problem (witch enevitably always comes up) is to not let new users post for at least 7 days and/or forcing them to read various informational topics before getting access to the actual forum.
This will of course not get everyone but has in my experience improved the situation considerably.
Ah well, that's just my two cents
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That could be nice... part of the things that had contributed to the bad search results are the tons of new threads asking the very same questions over and over and over again... is there anyway to disable these threads from showing up in the search results? Maybe it's time for us to out up another sticky thread specifically talking abóut G4 devices =)
vseehua said:
That could be nice... part of the things that had contributed to the bad search results are the tons of new threads asking the very same questions over and over and over again... is there anyway to disable these threads from showing up in the search results? Maybe it's time for us to out up another sticky thread specifically talking abóut G4 devices =)
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I would like to see a thread dedicated to G4 devices, with verified correct information in it.
It isnt just people asking the same questions over and over making the search junk. Its the inability to even search for simple short 3 letter acronyms like CID, IPL, SPL, AKU. These are all things I have tried to search for and get 0 results. If I were able to search for these terms I could probably turn up a wealth of information on my own.
_Nomad_ said:
Haven't been a wizard user that long although I've been in the ppc scene in about 5 years and quite active in several forums. The most successful solution that I've seen to this problem (witch enevitably always comes up) is to not let new users post for at least 7 days and/or forcing them to read various informational topics before getting access to the actual forum.
This will of course not get everyone but has in my experience improved the situation considerably.
Ah well, that's just my two cents
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Click to collapse
That would work me thinks!!!!!
Hi all,
I've been reading this forum for weeks now and still have not found enough answers to be secure enough and cid-unlock my G3 2.21 vario.
I HAVE indeed read most relevant threads, although navigating them can be somewhat confusing. However When I posted some -in my n00b opinion - valid questions I either got 1) no reply whatsoever 2) replies to read "the" threads....which wasn't really helpfull or I wouldn't have asked 3) contradicting advice .... like a 2.21 G3 Can be unlocked, or it Cannot be unlocked, you have to downgrade twice, you have to upgrade twice, you Can or Cannot flash a G4 rom to a G3 device so you won't have to downgrade and CID unlock your phone first, etc.
I believe that I am somewhat beyond the real n00b level right now but still I'd like information to be more consistent and easier to find, I've already tried to suggest making a stickied n00b FAQ or wiki for us where to find the basic answers in a easy and consistent manner so the sdame questions aren't asked over and over and ROM threads hijacked for support questions.
but that is just my cup of tea.
thanks for a good forum with vlauable info.
stefan.
Regular search
Personally, I find using google or yahoo, with site:xda-developers.com, works much better than the forum search. My personal pet peeve is the inability to use quotes to search for phrases. Quotes don't work.
A major problem with "read the threads" is the 800+ entry length of some of them. It would be nice to try to harness the power of those of us newly figuring things out and ask them to submit a wiki for something they just learned. If we had a submission point for the wiki, perhaps those of us who recently learned new things would do a how-to write-up and submit it to the wiki.
Finally, there are a lot of repeat threads, many with false or useless information. These threads stand in the way of a searcher. I would be happier if the moderators deleted more bad threads. Alternatively, we could use democracy -- add a "vote to delete" button to every thread not posted by a moderator and if a high enough percentage vote to delete, the thread is gone. I'd suggest 20% as a threshold -- more than that and the thread goes away.
Have been reading all your comments and completely agree with you guys... I see you have specific problems on G3/G4 on Wizards, as someone suggested a separate subforum for G4 devices would be ideal for you, and also for Prophet I guess.
About the search functions I'm also using google to search as a fallback when I can't find specific things using vBulletin's integrated search function, there's a thread on the mod forum where we discussed how to improve it, but seems is not very active now... will try to push Flar to do something about that.
Regarding the wiki, I think everyone should be less afraid to edit, if you look at the "recent changes" you see always the same people is editing. Have a look at the Hermes or BlueAngel wiki pages, these are good examples on how info has to be organized on the wiki, it's easy to find everything on the front page and information is well divided. Formating may seem a bit complicated at the beginning, but you don't have to care too much if you just want to add content, sure someone more experienced with wiki syntax will edit and correct any bad formating mistakes.
I do 100% agree with you that the wiki itself doesn't cover half of what it should. Yet if you take the time to read through it, and the links, you should be quite familiar with your device...
And oh yeah, sure, you can't search for keywords less than four characters, but that's not really an excuse... look at the thread containing the latest Faria ROM. Half... Half of what the thread contains is the same question over and over again... those ppl didn't even read the initial post of the thread... they found the download link, tried to install the ROM, got problem and went right to work, posting their (stupid) question all over again and again... The problem was never the limited search capabilities... It's always the ppl...
A board without limitations always get bloated with crap, whether it's unwanted commercial och just plain stupid posts...
So, unfortunatly this is going to continue unless you put constraints on the board... I'm sorry, but that's what's gonna happen.
Seems to me that since this was posted the situation has sorta escalated... Faria, Molski, risidoro and just now Dr P has announced their leave.
In this rate all that'll be left will be the newbies soon. Sad to witness
_Nomad_ said:
And oh yeah, sure, you can't search for keywords less than four characters, but that's not really an excuse... look at the thread containing the latest Faria ROM. Half... Half of what the thread contains is the same question over and over again... those ppl didn't even read the initial post of the thread... they found the download link, tried to install the ROM, got problem and went right to work, posting their (stupid) question all over again and again... The problem was never the limited search capabilities... It's always the ppl...
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It's also very human.
_Nomad_ said:
A board without limitations always get bloated with crap, whether it's unwanted commercial och just plain stupid posts...
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There just should be enough moderators. Now what happens when you write something stupid is you also get useless answers like "don't do that" which just makes everything even worse. There should be a "FAQ"-section, there should be a "how-to"-section etc...but there isn't. The forum structure is FAR TOO SIMPLE to handle the amount of messages.
Two main things to handle this (just my opinion):
Re-designed forum structure
Moderators
(well, the structure should be designed in the first place so that it would be easy to extend it later...not an easy job)
prestonmcafee said:
...A major problem with "read the threads" is the 800+ entry length of some of them. It would be nice to try to harness the power of those of us newly figuring things out...
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I usually suggest to those asking questions to post the solution to their question in the first post. But I'm over at the Mio forums, and since we only have 4500 peps, the mods aren't overwhelmed. I can lock a thread, post the correct thread to post in, and a few days later, delete the thread. I spend 1/2 my time using the search function to consolidate questions into single threads. But like I said, that's not feasible here. I suggest a PM sent to everyone the registers, that is kind of a quick start guide. I understand why the 3 letter limit, because people type words like "the" and "and". I'm not sure how powerful the forum software is, but it would be nice to remove the size limit, and omit such words as mentioned above, from the search.
Regards,
Jason
mlehtola said:
There should be a "FAQ"-section, there should be a "how-to"-section etc...but there isn't. The forum structure is FAR TOO SIMPLE to handle the amount of messages.
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Ummm, have you ever taken the time to look at the Wiki?
This forum is being provided to us basically for free. (Except for voluntary donations.) I personally can't afford to donate $$$ to the community, or for that matter to individual developers, so I dedicate some time to post in the forums to share what I've learned. I have also donated time to updating the Wiki.
If the Wiki doesn't contain all you would like it to, just add it yourself! One brief tutorial could make a world of difference to a newbie, or even a more experienced user. It also helps to point out gaps in the general knowledge we have here in these forums.
If, for example, there isn't a sub-forum for the device you use, you don't have to wait for the moderators, etc. to create it. Just create a Wiki page, and get the ball rolling on your own!
Take the initiative! That's what these forums were founded on!
Just my opinion.
Now go have fun!
JKR said:
I suggest a PM sent to everyone the registers, that is kind of a quick start guide. I understand why the 3 letter limit, because people type words like "the" and "and". I'm not sure how powerful the forum software is, but it would be nice to remove the size limit, and omit such words as mentioned above, from the search.
Regards,
Jason
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Click to collapse
First of all, you get much better, and more detailed search results by using a search-engine like Google. Their advanced search features do a fantastic job, and can be fine tuned to search only through a specific site. (i.e. http://forum.xdadevelopers.com )
Secondly, as opposed to a PM, possibly an email with a confirmation link after the introductory information.
Hope this helps....
Now go have fun!
I think it is more synonymous of the world today, do you read the manual when you buy a new stereo or mobile phone, or do you dig in saying 'nah i know how it works it'll be ok'. People just dont take the time to understand first, they think they know it all and then the proverbial hits the fan! As an experienced R&D firmware developer it doesn't matter how easy I make the interface you will always get those that stuff it up!
So not such an easy one to fix, you have given the masses a place to ask the ridiculous and the tools to stuff up easily, How do you fix that?
Riptos
Hi Everyone,
We've received some requests to split this forum into a ROM Development section (WM) and an Android ROM Development section, please let us know what you think by voting. Feel free to post any additional comments in this thread.
Thanks in advance!
Flar
Site admin
I've stickied this till poll is closed
Right now there doesn't seem to be a ton of Android threads, but I imagine that will increase as it is perfected. As the number of threads increase there will start to be more and more confusion.
Ways to alleviate the confusion is by separating the threads or by people standardizing their thread titles. As it is right now there's enough variation in thread titles to make it a little confusing to figure out what ROM is what. Although I have to admit that cooks are getting much better over time with this process thankfully.
If thread titles were standardized I don't think there would be a need for a separation of ROMs really, although it wouldn't hurt besides the pain to moderators that have to monitor and move threads.
[ROM or KITCHEN][Languages (WWE, etc)][ROM type (WM 6.1, WM 6.5, Android)][Path-optional (28014)][ROM name and version (Flashmore V2.2)][Special key points (Sense 2.5, Manila 2.1, etc.)][Date (29-Jan-2010)]
Just as an example, maybe order of things should be different such as the date being second or something. But the order should then be standardized (including format of Date for instance DD-MMM-YYYY to avoid confusing among countries that do MM-DD-YYYY instead) and all cooks should follow this without adding all sorts of other advertising and special symbols, etc. The title should tell users exactly what the ROM is and only that. The message body is where you can make things fancy and advertise other things.
sschrupp said:
Right now there doesn't seem to be a ton of Android threads, but I imagine that will increase as it is perfected. As the number of threads increase there will start to be more and more confusion.
Ways to alleviate the confusion is by separating the threads or by people standardizing their thread titles. As it is right now there's enough variation in thread titles to make it a little confusing to figure out what ROM is what. Although I have to admit that cooks are getting much better over time with this process thankfully.
If thread titles were standardized I don't think there would be a need for a separation of ROMs really, although it wouldn't hurt besides the pain to moderators that have to monitor and move threads.
[ROM or KITCHEN][Languages (WWE, etc)][ROM type (WM 6.1, WM 6.5, Android)][Path-optional (28014)][ROM name and version (Flashmore V2.2)][Special key points (Sense 2.5, Manila 2.1, etc.)][Date (29-Jan-2010)]
Just as an example, maybe order of things should be different such as the date being second or something. But the order should then be standardized (including format of Date for instance DD-MMM-YYYY to avoid confusing among countries that do MM-DD-YYYY instead) and all cooks should follow this without adding all sorts of other advertising and special symbols, etc. The title should tell users exactly what the ROM is and only that. The message body is where you can make things fancy and advertise other things.
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I much as I agree with your recommendations, most if not all have already been mentioned in first post of this thread. We just need all chefs/devs to follow it
Hi Flar,
I think admins should split the forums at least by WM6.X and Android sections, and create a new section for WM7 in the future easily.
I think a split is a great idea. It's way to busy to find what you need.
A split between 6.1, 6.5, 7 (LOL) and Android would really clean things up.
Waste of time...
You can split it and get it lovely and tidy and 48 hours later, folks will ruin it...
I can't stand the mess, but I learn to live with it... and I think most folks do.
You can post rules, explain everything in plain English, tattoo it on their heads, and still "can you help me with my iphone?" appears.
Admit defeat already! it's like a wife... surrender to it for an easy life
I voted yes, because i think it helps to keep things clear.
But i don't know if there are actually enough androids developers and users to keep it going.
So i would say split up, and see what happens. If it turns out to be a bad idea then change it back
would reccomend this if android get more useable - but doesn't seem to be far...
But for now i'd like to see a "rom release" section and one for "rom related questions" - so it just gets a bit more useable.
best would be in my oppinion:
Touch HD:
- WM ROM release
----> here every dev opens 2 threads for his ROM - 1 for "release,bugtracker,solutions" and another for "general questions,thanks,..."
- WM ROM questions
----> all general questions wich are currently here in ROM section (Radio,SPL,and the rest)
- ANRDIOD (perhaps also split later)
----> all android related stuff
would love to see this - would make if much more readable.
Especialy the 2 thread thing for ROMs would save much time in my opinion (if used right ...)
greetings
Logicalstep said:
I think a split is a great idea. It's way to busy to find what you need.
A split between 6.1, 6.5, 7 (LOL) and Android would really clean things up.
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Organization is key in any website. More categories will improve search times and should create better overall experience if done right. With the onset of Windows 7 coming which may have completely different set of instructions like Android, they certainly required there own place. But I don't believe 6.1, 6.5 should be separated as the stickies serve all these Roms the same.
Just my thoughts..
I think that we have to split in:
1. questions and solutions (WM and android)
2. ROM's from ROM builders
Ya I Agree too... we should have split WM and Android threads so that it is much organised and easy access
+1 for splitting.
Right now there are 4-5 threads about Android, which isn't much, but they're just going to increase as it is perfected and made into a flashable ROM.
My thoughts:
Personally I think the splitting itself is a good idea, it helps the users to track of the OS that they want to use or want to use.
But come to think of it, Android OS isn't much in-need to have its own sub-category. It cannot even stand on itself as ROM yet. It still works on WiMo as background.
I disagree with the suggestion to split into WiMo 6.1, 6.5, 6.5.x, 7 or whatever else are coming out. It's definitely unnecessary and the chefs should state the version on the title of the thread, and they're doing it alright. It's also to keep members from starting new threads at the wrong sections. If we split into different WiMo versions, the next demand we can expect is that to split in each section into the-good-old TF3D, Manila 2.1, Sense 2.1, Sense 2.5 etc.
Furthermore, I think the admins are doing great jobs in trying to keep things in good shape, especially Fallen Spartan; we can see him closing down unnecessary/solved threads everyday. They're not earning money from this and they have their own lives to deal with each day, I don't think we want to burden them more by having so many sub-categories to look after, no? It's like children, the more you have, the harder for you to look after.
So I think it's unnecessary to split now. In the future when Android is ready to stand on its own, we can consider back this issue, but now is absolute unnecessary.
I think the forum should be split up and sub-splits applied within the splits...eh ROMs, How to do stuff etc.....ROMs then subsplits into Android and Blackstone and further down ( sub - sub split!) Blackstone etc etc. Is subsplit a word?
I especially would like WM split into 6.1 and 6.5 forums
zyonuf79 said:
I especially would like WM split into 6.1 and 6.5 forums
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+1, it would be great!
pinx said:
+1, it would be great!
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i agree to it as well. there arent much threads related to Android at this point. organised(its a wishful thinking i kno)6.1 and 6.5 sub forums will b a gr8 change
In support
I am in support of spliting the forum.....as suggested by other, it will keep the forum organised.....
I think separate categories/sub categories are definitely needed as it stands most forums on this site are a complete and utter mess and really disorganized.
If you was to have a simple category under each mobile device for roms/os versions etc it would organize things allot better here is a quick example..
Blackstone-->ROMS----WM
------>6.1
------>6.5
----Android
-------xxxx
-------xxxx
Obviously that is just a quick example but the current way of just chucking everything in one thread just doesn't work and is a ball-ache trying sort though when specifically looking for a 6.5 or a 6.1 rom. It would be nice to browse a version specific forum.
Also if the admins are not keen on having more subcategories why not just enforce some kind of uniform tagging rule for the releases that way we could have all the WM in one category and they will be clearly and uniformly tagged because at the moment it is really random and hard to follow, If all releases where tagged in same way it would make searching for specific rom versions/builds etc much more easily.
Ok. I don't know if this will get stickied or not, I hope it will. Mods can feel free to change the title of the post if need be. Here's a stab at answering a few questions which are asked repeatedly.
First and foremost:
CLICK THE SEARCH BUTTON BEFORE ASKING ANYTHING WHATSOEVER.
Secondly:
IF YOU HAVE ROOTED YOUR PHONE, MAKE A NANDROID BACKUP BEFORE YOU DO ANYTHING ELSE...THEN SAVE A COPY OF IT TO YOUR DESKTOP
Don't even bother asking for help if you've screwed up a ROM install and don't have a backup. The only advice you'll get is to use the RUU (which can be found here).
Having gotten that out of the way here are some of the typical questions and answers.
#1. What's the fastest/best/most interesting/etc ROM out there.
Answer: Try them all and see. If you read the first page of each ROM thread the bugs/fixes are posted. If you see a thread without the bugs/fixes, READ THE THREAD FOR THAT ROM AND ASK YOUR QUESTIONS IN IT. Do not create a new thread to ask questions like: Does everything work in <INSERT ROMNAME HERE> rom?
#2. How do I...?
Answer: The answer to your question is probably http://wiki.xda-developers.com/index.php?pagename=CDMA%20Hero%20Guides. If it's not there, it's almost definitely under search. Stop asking. Stop creating new threads. It just makes people mad and clutters up the forums.
#3. I think I bricked/broke/messed up my phone
Answer: Did you flash a GSM radio on top of a CDMA phone (or vice versa)? Then probably not. Pull your battery, restore from the NANDROID BACKUP I'm certain you made when you first rooted your phone and try again. Almost all bad ROM flashes can be fixed by wiping and reinstalling your ROM. Check your battery level. Never flash a ROM if the level is below 30%.
#4. I'm getting an error after using the RUU (110, etc)
Answer: Check the wiki guides above. There is a thread which tells you how to recover. If you are too lazy to read through the fixes, here is the thread.
#5. The Sprint 2.x upgrade is coming soon! I have pr00f!
Answer: No, you don't. Stop posting new threads to draw attention to yourself. The ROM upgrade will be out when it's out and not before Sprint is ready to release. Any release date you might have heard is tentative at best and flat out wrong in most cases. Stop creating threads about it, we don't care where you got your information.
#6. Audio doesn't work in my custom 2.x ROM
Answer: Try here. There are two fixes in this thread for it.
#7. I just flashed <INSERT ROMNAME HERE> ROM and everything's all screwed up.
Answer: Wipe everything and start over. In your nandroid recovery, select 'Wipe Data/Factory Reset'. When that's done wipe 'Dalvik-Cache'. Then when that's done (if you have installed a2sd (apps2sd)) wipe SD:EXT. Then reflash the ROM. 9 times out of 10 this will fix it. The 10th time, ask in the ROM thread, do NOT create a new thread for your issue.
#8. My battery life sucks. Or: What's the battery life on this ROM?
Answer:
Search. There are a lot of threads about battery life already. If your answer's not there, ask in the ROM thread (after searching that thread of course).
Android Terms:
a2sd/apps2sd: The process of moving user installed applications from internal storage to the SD card
Rosie: Typically used as a term describing certain graphical characteristics of the Android operating system, primarily the 'bottom bar' of the phone. Example: Stock Rosie is curved, espresso Rosie is not, with rounded edges.
Also:
"For the record, with 2.1 we CAN NOT just alter the rosie launcher or the taskbar or the HTC lockbar. The files are all tied up together. This means that, if you have installed someones taskbar mods, and then later you decide you want a different rosie, when you flash the new rosie it WILL undo some of the taskbar mods....UNLESS you have a themer do a custom just for you and provide them a link to the taskbar that you are using. I cannot stress the part about providing them a link enough. That is just common courtesy. There are plenty of folks out here willing to help you. Many will even help you learn to do it yourself. Just ask nice and be patient. This is a hobby for us, too, and we often have our own projects that we are working on." - tejasrichard
There is a way to do both, however:
"And a little correction about changing only the rosie or taskbar, you can if you use metamorph [/QUOTE]
You can find metamorph in the Android Market." -danaff37
JIT: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dalvik_virtual_machine Also see the following URL: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Just-in-time_compilation.
LWP: Live Wallpapers. Animated wallpapers that run on your home screen. Until recently, not available in the HTC Sense UI.
MNS: Mobile Network Sharing. The act of using your cell phone as a USB or WIFI connected internet router. Example: Connecting your desktop/latop to the internet via your cell phone's mobile internet.
AOSP: Android Open Source Project http://source.android.com/
PRI: Profile of your phone. Used by your carrier to set up your network/internet settings.
PRL: Preferred Roaming List. List of cell towers close to your present location. This allows the phone to roam more easily since it has a built-in database of towers, rather than having to search for one.
This is getting too long, so I'm going to summarize:
No one likes reading the same questions over and over. If you can't be bothered to at least search for the answers, do us all a favor and don't say anything.
Stop saying things like 'I didn't feel like reading 300 pages of <INSERT ROMNAME HERE>'s thread. How do I?'...USE THE SEARCH FUNCTION TO SEARCH THAT THREAD.
If you don't read the guides, and instruction posts, then screw up your phone, don't whine about it. It's your own fault. It's not the fault of the ROM dev, or the ROM, or anything else. It's YOUR FAULT. Accept responsibility.
Did someone at the Sprint Store piss you off by not accepting your water damaged phone for replacement? Are you mad because they gave you a refurb instead of a brand new phone? We don't care. This is a DEVELOPMENT FORUM. It's for development of roms/themes/etc and discussions of roms/themes/etc. It's not a place to whine that you're being treated badly by Sprint. Post about it on Sprint's forums.
I think that covers the basics. If you're new here, do us all a favor and read this post, follow what's inside it. If you're not new and are a chronic whiner, read this post, follow what's inside it. Just stop cluttering the forums and making it impossible to find any information in it at all.
EPIC!!!!
Touche'
Ok, so I am fairly new and broke 4 out of the 7 rules... But I am behaving now, and actually appreciate the basis of this Thread. That said. I didn't know what I didn't know and having this Thread at least gives new folks clear and pointed fair warning.
Great POST!!!!
lol
It wasn't aimed at you specifically, or at anyone really. It's just a general set of guidelines designed to curb repetitive posting.
word
10 char
Thank you! Honestly it's sad you have to make a thread like this, but it was definitely needed. Wayyy too many noobs come here asking questions that have been answered many many times over.
great read! But you know the only ones who actually read this are those of us that actually follow the guidelines and it will simply pass by the 'others' without a second glance lol
yeah, maybe edit the title to official 2.1 sprint download... haha
nighteyes_wolf said:
great read! But you know the only ones who actually read this are those of us that actually follow the guidelines and it will simply pass by the 'others' without a second glance lol
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Perhaps. But if those of us who follow the guidelines refuse to ANSWER the noobs who don't read this, except for maybe a link to this thread, there will be fewer BS threads to have to deal with.
smw6180 said:
Perhaps. But if those of us who follow the guidelines refuse to ANSWER the noobs who don't read this, except for maybe a link to this thread, there will be fewer BS threads to have to deal with.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+10000000 Don't respond to threads just paste links to this thread good idea.
J/K. Good idea.
Just bookmarked it to make linking easier!
How about this noob question? where can I find a dummies guide to terms? A really good one stop shop. Stuff noobs like me don't know like rosie, apps2..., you name it. If its out there I Want to know what it is. P.S. I checked both wiki s and did a search for the word "terms" in titles.
T.I.A
Yamus
Re: Answers for Noobs who like to ask questions. READ THIS BEFORE ASKING ANYTHING.
There is already a thread like that actually... lol
Sent from my HERO200 using the XDA mobile application powered by Tapatalk
yamus08 said:
How about this noob question? where can I find a dummies guide to terms? A really good one stop shop. Stuff noobs like me don't know like rosie, apps2..., you name it. If its out there I Want to know what it is. P.S. I checked both wiki s and did a search for the word "terms" in titles.
T.I.A
Yamus
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What terms specifically? I'll add them to the OP.
Edit: Added the two you listed.
Nothing specifically, at this very moment but, I come across new ones all the time when reading different posts. If it's cool, I'll just keep posting them here as I come to them and, if you think they should be in the op you can add them there or, if not, maybe just reply back down in the thread.
BTW. I know that I can google most terms and find them, and I have no problem whatsoever doing that, it's just nice when someone coming here to learn can expedite the process a lil with the help of some of the seniors.
well i'm a noob, i had no idea what the hell lwp was... it means live wallpaper right?
bigems said:
well i'm a noob, i had no idea what the hell lwp was... it means live wallpaper right?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'll answer to keep this thread on page 1...yes
MNS = mobile network sharing
JIT = Just-in-time compiler WIKI
tstack77 said:
I'll answer to keep this thread on page 1...yes
MNS = mobile network sharing
JIT = Just-in-time compiler WIKI
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Me too...
well i'm a noob, i had no idea what the hell lwp was... it means live wallpaper right?
REALLY????? 3 P I C F A I LLMGTFY.COM, Try That One....
Noob Tube
I am a noob, i like finding and searching for things, its awesome, thats ok though, i wont be a noob for long,...................
MagnusRagnarok said:
Me too...
well i'm a noob, i had no idea what the hell lwp was... it means live wallpaper right?
REALLY????? 3 P I C F A I LLMGTFY.COM, Try That One....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not helpful. The point here is not to create a thread full of *****ing, but to create a SINGLE thread so that we don't have 15000000 posts of the same thing. So if you can't help, stfu.
I'll add the other terms listed to the front page.
Hi all,
I'm quite new to this android stuff, and especially modding. And I have to tell that I feel a bit lost.
After a few days browsing this forum and other places on the internet, I think I know what a ROM and rooting are. But here I see things like kernels, radio, bootloaders... could someone explain me what those are and how they are related together? Or show me an url that explains all this.
Thanks a lot!
Bricolo_fr said:
Hi all,
I'm quite new to this android stuff, and especially modding. And I have to tell that I feel a bit lost.
After a few days browsing this forum and other places on the internet, I think I know what a ROM and rooting are. But here I see things like kernels, radio, bootloaders... could someone explain me what those are and how they are related together? Or show me an url that explains all this.
Thanks a lot!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Im not real sure how to explain all this stuff in great detail but i will try and tell you all that i know. I think a kernel has to do with the drivers and things like that. A radio has to do with the everything that uses connections, i guess you would call it. Like your phone's network, wifi, bluetooth, etc. And for the bootloader i don't really know how to explain it but press and hold the power button and the trackball at the same time. thats the bootloader.
This should help some... http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=619153
Bricolo_fr said:
Hi all,
I'm quite new to this android stuff, and especially modding. And I have to tell that I feel a bit lost.
After a few days browsing this forum and other places on the internet, I think I know what a ROM and rooting are. But here I see things like kernels, radio, bootloaders... could someone explain me what those are and how they are related together? Or show me an url that explains all this.
Thanks a lot!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi Bricolo!
Welcome to the forums!
I'll help you out here, but you're going to have to do some work too.
How about I do two, and you do two?
[Google]: android "what is a rom"
http://forum.androidcentral.com/hacking/6037-general-rom-faq.html
If you’re new to the Android platform (don’t be bashful, all of us were not too long ago), you’ll see terms floating around the forums that you might not be familiar with. “ROM” is one of those terms. A ROM image is a data file that contains information used on a Read Only Memory chip. For our purposes, that means a complete system image of an Android device. Each Android device has it’s own ROM image that contains files and code needed to boot the device up and run Android on it. But this is only part of a ROM. A ROM also contains a GUI (graphical user interface), required and useful applications, support files for those applications and the kernel. Let’s have a look at the parts that make a ROM.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
http://www.droidforums.net/forum/droid-general-discussions/37418-what-rom.html
"ROM" is just a generic term for the software that makes up the OS, and a bit of a misnomer. This term could easily be changed to "OS sofware" or "system software". It does mean Read Only Memory, but ROM likely comes from that part of the system memory, since you dont want to be able to write over the system files (easily).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
[Google]: android "what is a kernel"
http://androidforums.com/developer-101/62548-what-kernel.html
A kernel is basically the bridge between applications and the data processing at the hardware level. It serves as a level of abstraction for communication.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
http://www.applematters.com/article/how-long-will-apple-keep-the-mach-microkernel/
The easy answer is a kernel is the core of any operating system. DOS, Windows, UNIX, OS X and Linux all have some type of kernel. The implementations change but the basic concept remains the same. A kernel interfaces directly with the system’s hardware and is the lowest level of software. There are two types of kernels, micro-kernels and monolithic-kernels.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
[Google]: android "what is a radio"
Your site(s) here.
[Google]: android "what is a bootloader"
You can do it!
[Google]: android "what is a X"
Google: It really is that easy
Good stuff Paul, it's refreshing to see someone go out of their way to help a newbie every once in a while
There are more polite ways to respond to this guy. Some people learn through interaction. I'm glad someone went out of their way to explain things to this guy. It's a shame how cut throat this community can be sometimes.
I agree, the attitude and lame jokes are really immature at times. Thanks paul for putting a lil effort and explaining few of the key points than cracking the usual radio is a fm/am joke here, the extreme nerdism almost kills me! lol.
As for the cutthroat and "nerdism" out there in this community, you have to remember, most of us that are regulars are ones that have been on this forum for a loooooooong while and not just in the Nexus One sections. I have migrated from WM to Android and see these posts time and time again.
There are Stickied "Noob" guilds galore, there is a search feature, there are TONS of resources out there for someone who puts in a MINIMAL effort can get this BASIC information.
When I first came here, I didn't just open a new post on "what is a ROM and ..." I read, I researched and when something wasn't clear and needed more information that wasn't out there, THEN I posted.
Those of us that may seem like we have an attitude aren't mean people, we don't expect everyone to come here with all the answers an NO questions, we just have an expectation that they at least put forth a LITTLE effort on figuring something out.
Paul did a great job in searching, but you have to wonder why the OP didn't even TRY and google anything or search here?
The impression I got is that it is not worth the OP's time to even try, so they put up a post asking these questions and expected the community to do all the work for them and compile some massive resource into a post that the OP most likely won't read and then start asking questions that were already answered in replies or links.
I have seen this happen time and time again on this board and others, so yeah, I am a bit of a jerk when someone puts forth no effort of their own.
Thanks a lot, Paul and the guys that helped
About me asking, and being new here... I DID search on this forum, but didn't find everything I needed. I used the search function, read the sticky threads, googled... After this, I still had questions, meaning that the information I got was not sufficient and that the additional information I was seeking wasn't accessible enough here. So that's why I asked.
If you don't like new people asking questions, but only expect new members to be experienced ones that will arrive with software/tricks/roms/etc "gifts" for you,you should reconsider your lifes. Maybe as sultans or something similar I agree with the remark about nerdy attitudes. Do you really think this is needed? If my topic is unwanted here, some people called moderators will lock or delete it, it seems it hasn't happened so far...
Back to the initial topic...
Well, maybe I did not make things clear enough. I'm not a complete computer noob. I know what a ROM is (not being specific to android devices), what an OS is, how to write a few lines of code, etc...
From what I understood, the bootloader can be see as the bios in a PC. It can execute a few tasks (diagnostics, rom flash, starting the OS...). The ROM contains the OS, software, config, etc...
As I said, what I don't really see is how all the things are related to each other. On this forum (and other places) I see a lot of alternative ROMs. I do understand what they are and their use. However I also see topics about kernels and radios, and that got me a bit lost. Aren't they already included in the ROMs?
Also, I'd like to learn a bit about how alternative ROMs are created. When additional features (applications?) are added to a ROM (features that were existing on other devices), is it "simply" the application files that from the other device that have been included to the ROM? When new features are added (not coming from other devices, like trackball led), how is that made? I assume it is added to the code somewhere, so is all the code available?
Thanks for helping
I'm going to move this thread to the Q&A section, and also clean up the noob bashing. Remember, not only is bashing discouraged throughout the entire site, but doing it in the Q&A section will likely earn you a short vacation from XDA.
Thanks,
NATF
Hi,
Firstly, I don't want to sound unrespectful to developers. It is just a few complains but I admire the time each one spend for creating new roms. There are lots, lots of roms/kernels in the android development section. It's a complete jungle! For a non technical user, I find it really difficult to choose a rom because:
There are no standard table stating what is different with the other. The list described by each developer is not always clear. Especially when he or she sees "aroma", "CRT", "ram hack", "zipalign" without explication. Wouldn't one nice and small sentence be sufficient to explain these terms?
The issues for each rom are not tracked. I think there should be a tracking system like JIRA so that we can confirm if a bug is already described and if it is still present in future release.
It should be clear if a rom is based from stock or AOSP rom (edit: it's not always obvious).
There is no centralized topic explaining the differences. But I have seen there is topic listing roms.
To my mind, there should be in each rom description something like a history, a short sentence like "I have based this rom on this other rom because I feel it lacks this and that." (not always the case), instead of just throwing "hi, [screenshot], how to install this rom?". ^^
I believe what happen is that one user will check the 3 or 4 first roms and will get confused.
Generally speaking, I feel that when you read a rom description from the author, it is addressed to technical people. I think a centralized JIRA (each rom = one project) idea would be very helpful to compare but I don't know if it is easy to implement.
What do you think?
ergosum said:
Hi,
Firstly, I don't want to sound unrespectful to developers. It is just a few complains but I admire the time each one spend for creating new roms. There are lots, lots of roms/kernels in the android development section. It's a complete jungle! For a non technical user, I find it really difficult to choose a rom because:
There are no standard table stating what is different with the other. The list described by each developer is not always clear. Especially when he or she sees "aroma", "CRT", "ram hack", "zipalign" without explication. Wouldn't one nice and small sentence be sufficient to explain these terms?
The issues for each rom are not tracked. I think there should be a tracking system like JIRA so that we can confirm if a bug is already described and if it is still present in future release.
It should be clear if a rom is based from stock or AOSP rom (not always the case).
There is no centralized topic explaining the differences. But I have seen there is topic listing roms.
To my mind, there should be in each rom description something like a history, a short sentence like "I have based this rom on this other rom because I feel it lacks this and that." (not always the case), instead of just throwing "hi, [screenshot], how to install this rom?". ^^
I believe what happen is that one user will check the 3 or 4 first roms and will get confused.
Generally speaking, I feel that when you read a rom description from the author, it is addressed to technical people. I think a centralized JIRA (each rom = one project) idea would be very helpful to compare but I don't know if it is easy to implement.
What do you think?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually always or it is baseed on stock or aosp or cyanogenmod it's pretty much in every thread i see. it's always described in the information they write.
and a centralized topic where is everything written well. it's for everybody else some like Lg stock ui and some like more clean android
Issue tracking jira i dont really understand i only know that developers are just wanting a catlog if there is a problem so they can see from what the problem is coming from or what it is related.
and that from a short sentence well. every rom misses something it's for everybody different and in almost all roms they are describing where it is based on and they have permission to use other work (the base) but some people are not asking it like the miui team who just took kowalski kernel without permission and they don't even give credit or something like that.
this post is just my opinion how i think it is
ergosum said:
...
Generally speaking, I feel that when you read a rom description from the author, it is addressed to technical people.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I do support the idea of asking the developers for more detailed info of their ROM / kernel features, however keep in mind that this is an Android development site - members are expected to have some level of knowledge and / or the will to learn stuff by themselves.
On the other hand, I've seen developers who care enough to spend time writing detailed documentation about their work and yet you'll find people asking questions or posting stuff without even reading the OP or using the search function. This obviously discourages the developer. Who will want to spend hours or even days writing how their stuff works or what are its main features if people won't take the time to read it?
DrummerMuppet said:
I do support the idea of asking the developers for more detailed info of their ROM / kernel features, however keep in mind that this is an Android development site - members are expected to have some level of knowledge and / or the will to learn stuff by themselves.
On the other hand, I've seen developers who care enough to spend time writing detailed documentation about their work and yet you'll find people asking questions or posting stuff without even reading the OP or using the search function. This obviously discourages the developer. Who will want to spend hours or even days writing how their stuff works or what are its main features if people won't take the time to read it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I understand, but I don't ask for hours of well descriptions. One sum-up sentence and one link to a topic where other people has already spent the time should be enough. Example: an developer says "here are the 3 kernels [links]" and the only difference you can tell when looking at the links was "32rh", "16rh", "0rh". I had to guess that "rh" is ram hack and search for what it is. While with just "the ram hack is taking memory from GPU for the CPU", it's a clean and quick explanation. Otherwise people are bound to ask questions when they see this.
As for the JIRA system, it's just more obvious to see, for a newcomer:
how much issue a rom has at the moment
if a troubling issue important for you is described and prevent you from using the rom (so you don't waste time)
help the developer to see easyly what is wrong (instead of navigating through all the post)
help the developer by centralizing all the relevant information for one issue in one page, instead of having these spread everywhere