Related
I read on this other forum http://pdaphonehome.com/forums/htc-p4450-kaiser/89014-htc-p4450-release-rumor-thread-4.html in this thread they say that it will be released in like November. They say that the person mention this did not say who his source was it still worried me cuz that is the month the 8525 was released. Additionally they mention the 8925 will not have the front facing camera nor will it have built in GPS!!!
I personally will probably boycott AT&T if this is true or at least petition this BS. I mean seriously I love my 8525 but I am getting sick and tired of at&t stripping features out of the damn devices. I am wondering if any of these claims have any value or are they just more incoherent gibberish from the internet.
Any thoughts?
I would entirely believe they could strip out those features. The front facing camera is useless in the usa as we have no infrastructure to use it. The GPS now, that's the sticky subject. Yes, they could release it and have one of the first devices ever in the usa to support built in standalone gps... But they have a service they sell at $10 or $15 a month to do the same thing. Releasing this phone would take away "revenue" as far as their bean counters will be concerned. It doesn't matter how many of those people would or would not pay for it, it's just a matter of potential revenue to them.
What will happen? That's still up in the air, but rest easy knowing it's still easy enough to get a import if need be!
No GPS?
I don't care if they leave out the front camera. But if AT&T is dumb enough to disable the GPS, I'm buying an unlocked Kaiser, period. I hate it when companies cripple perfectly good technology. It's not even like they would be getting revenue from GPS if they crippled it - they'd just be preventing us from using free GPS.....
Shadowmite said:
I would entirely believe they could strip out those features. The front facing camera is useless in the usa as we have no infrastructure to use it. The GPS now, that's the sticky subject. Yes, they could release it and have one of the first devices ever in the usa to support built in standalone gps... But they have a service they sell at $10 or $15 a month to do the same thing. Releasing this phone would take away "revenue" as far as their bean counters will be concerned. It doesn't matter how many of those people would or would not pay for it, it's just a matter of potential revenue to them.
What will happen? That's still up in the air, but rest easy knowing it's still easy enough to get a import if need be!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In regard to the lack of support for the front facing camera I thought they were planning on do the whole video share thing? I even found the option for video share on the wm6 beta I put on my girlfriends blackjack. In regard to the bean counters and potential loss of revenue? As far as I know the gps module does not determine who one will use for navigation. I currently have a gps chip through at&t however the same one is available elsewhere. Furthermore, telenav is offered to other carriers as well. The only way I can see this taking money away from them is it came with not only the chip but the software (maps) as well. If it does not come with maps I will still most likely stay with telenav through at&t.
What will happen? That's still up in the air, but rest easy knowing it's still easy enough to get a import if need be![/QUOTE]
Yeah, heres the other thing. I am aware I can get the kaiser and use my at&t sim but I doubt I could find the kaiser for $100 or so. I have a contact I send almost 30 customers a year to so I get the supreme hook up. My beef is with AT&T, I think they need to quit being so f_cking retarded and give their loyal customers the device they demand. Unaltered!!!
I am actually surprised they didnt take away the touch screen LOL, bunch of frickin idiots, hey we should all chip in and buy them a new brain. According to my calculations it should take about a dollar to upgrade from their existing
Ill throw in the first .02
AT&T has in the works a video call service.
The iPAQ has offered GPS for a long time.
There is no reason to remove GPS from the 8925 and I seriously doubt this would happen. I COULD see them removing the front camera though.
I think Ive decided to just buy an unlocked HTC instead of getting the Cingular 8925 because this phone will more than likely be nerfed.
evolution_theory said:
AT&T has in the works a video call service.
The iPAQ has offered GPS for a long time.
There is no reason to remove GPS from the 8925 and I seriously doubt this would happen. I COULD see them removing the front camera though.
I think Ive decided to just buy an unlocked HTC instead of getting the Cingular 8925 because this phone will more than likely be nerfed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Note what AT&T is doing to the blackberrry 8800 series ... they have neutered the GPS so that it only works if you sign up for the $10/mo TeleNav services. I can confirm this is not a rumor, having seen some recent 8800 series 8800 series devices in the last week. There should be some way to hack around this if they do the same on the 8925, but I would predict a similar approach ... leave the radio in place, but disable without the consumer spending more $$.
ok.. let me throw in my 2 cents real quick.....
First off, GPS..
I have been told from a reliable source that it will be crippled through the ATT rom to be used with telenav only... like the 8800 crap.. but im sure that we here can figure something out on making it work otherwise, so im not worried about that...
Phone versions....
I have also heard from the same reliable source that there will be 3 different versions:
8900 - No camera's
8915 - Back 3MP no front camera
8925 - back 3MP camera, and front camera for VideoShare service...
Hope this clears the air for some people... my source is reliable, but things could change....
Hahahahaha
hahahaha...haha...ha....ahem.
Sorry, just looked at the Telenav site to understand what this service is. You get 'unlimited routes' for $10 a month or 10 routes for just $5.99 a month!
Charging per route for a GPS device. Amazing. Why don't they just charge us for each appointment we store in our Pocket PC calendar too?
"Hmmm, I really want to find my way to that new restaurant - but I wonder how many routes I've used this month?"
Ridiculous.
shogunmark said:
ok.. let me throw in my 2 cents real quick.....
First off, GPS..
I have been told from a reliable source that it will be crippled through the ATT rom to be used with telenav only... like the 8800 crap.. but im sure that we here can figure something out on making it work otherwise, so im not worried about that...
Phone versions....
I have also heard from the same reliable source that there will be 3 different versions:
8900 - No camera's
8915 - Back 3MP no front camera
8925 - back 3MP camera, and front camera for VideoShare service...
Hope this clears the air for some people... my source is reliable, but things could change....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the info ... you always seem spot on with your sources... and that configuration would make some marketing sense
Any chance your source has any greater clarity on release dates? I figure I might as well plan on November, since that would be par for the course, but if you have anything more solid, let us know.
shogunmark said:
ok.. let me throw in my 2 cents real quick.....
First off, GPS..
I have been told from a reliable source that it will be crippled through the ATT rom to be used with telenav only... like the 8800 crap.. but im sure that we here can figure something out on making it work otherwise, so im not worried about that...
Phone versions....
I have also heard from the same reliable source that there will be 3 different versions:
8900 - No camera's
8915 - Back 3MP no front camera
8925 - back 3MP camera, and front camera for VideoShare service...
Hope this clears the air for some people... my source is reliable, but things could change....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I can definately deal with this as I use telenav already and have found it to be reliable enough. I am wondering if your "reliable source has an idea on release date? Just curious. Thanks for your input.
weinson said:
Thanks for the info ... you always seem spot on with your sources... and that configuration would make some marketing sense
Any chance your source has any greater clarity on release dates? I figure I might as well plan on November, since that would be par for the course, but if you have anything more solid, let us know.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
release date is one thing i cant get my hands on... it seems that they always like to change their minds... look at what happened with the 8525... i myself am planning on november, i will probably crack and buy a real kaiser before then..
swtaltima said:
I read on this other forum http://pdaphonehome.com/forums/htc-p4450-kaiser/89014-htc-p4450-release-rumor-thread-4.html in this thread they say that it will be released in like November. They say that the person mention this did not say who his source was it still worried me cuz that is the month the 8525 was released. Additionally they mention the 8925 will not have the front facing camera nor will it have built in GPS!!!
I personally will probably boycott AT&T if this is true or at least petition this BS. I mean seriously I love my 8525 but I am getting sick and tired of at&t stripping features out of the damn devices. I am wondering if any of these claims have any value or are they just more incoherent gibberish from the internet.
Any thoughts?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This all sounds like pure speculation.
swtaltima said:
What will happen? That's still up in the air, but rest easy knowing it's still easy enough to get a import if need be!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, heres the other thing. I am aware I can get the kaiser and use my at&t sim but I doubt I could find the kaiser for $100 or so. I have a contact I send almost 30 customers a year to so I get the supreme hook up. My beef is with AT&T, I think they need to quit being so f_cking retarded and give their loyal customers the device they demand. Unaltered!!!
I am actually surprised they didnt take away the touch screen LOL, bunch of frickin idiots, hey we should all chip in and buy them a new brain. According to my calculations it should take about a dollar to upgrade from their existing
Ill throw in the first .02[/QUOTE]
It could be worse - you could be a Verizon customer like I used to be.
AT&T has NOTHING on Verizon when it comes to phone crippling.
Disabling GPS would suck, it makes no sense other than greed.
Removing front camera may be a different story, as I recall hearing that the non-front-camera variant may have a slightly thinner form factor. Given that the phone is going to be targeted towards the business market where any camera can often be problematic, I can easily see AT&T choosing form factor over function in the case of a front-camera-or-not tradeoff if such a tradeoff situation exists.
OK,
Just trying to start a discussion here about the thought process I'm going through, wanted to see if anyone else was having the same dilemma.
Do I buy an unlocked Kaiser or wait for the Cingular 8925?
1) My wallet tells me to wait for the Cingular device - I'm due for an upgrade, I get a hardware discount through my company, and it is guaranteed to be cheaper.
but.....
2) I watched the unboxing video of the Tytn II retail unit, and it just looks like they threw in lots of goodies, nice case, TomTom software, etc. I doubt AT&T will throw in anything but the phone and a stylus.
and.....
3) we know that the unlocked version is fully featured and won't be crippled at all, whereas the AT&T version may disable GPS (except w/ their service) and/or the ROM may suck compared to the full HTC rom.
and finally.....
4) I can get an unlocked version NOW, versus waiting until god-knows-when (Oct/Nov?) to get an 8925.
The one other thing stopping me from going w/ an unlocked version is it seems to be mainly UK retailers (or US retailer selling a UK version). I want to wait until I can buy one in the U.S., with a U.S. power adapter. Has anyone seen this yet?
Thoughts?
its a tough call for myself im thinking just going HTC unlocked one and then when the 8925 comes out trying to add some of there rom stuff like cingular video app ect as its free with my data plan.
Another reason for the HTC one vrs the ATT one is ATT app locks them so you will have to wait a bit for someone to get a unlocking system working for it. With the 8525 it took 2-4 months if i remember correctly before there was a unlock avil for it.
Pricewise shrug if you can afford the htc one over waiting I would not even consider it then.
Well I CAN afford the HTC unit, doesn't mean I should waste money on it though
Realistically: AT&T unit is the best choice for price.
Preferably: Users on this forum would choose the htc if they can afford/justify it because it wont have nerfed hardware or software which the ATT version is likely to have.
Hoenstly, I would go with the HTC branded version before the AT&T. First, the HTC for sure will have GPS, the front facing camera, HSUPA, the case, and it's alrady unlocked. Worst case scenario, you have to buy a generic charger, or use your old one because it comes with the UK charger which we can't use. There is a lot more that your getting with the phone for the extra money. Especially if you have it to spend. AT&T always finds a way to spoil a situation becuause of their future plans an ideas. If you get the HTC branded Kaiser, at least there are no curve balls and you know that you're getting everything that the phone is capable of.
Triune said:
First, the HTC for sure will have GPS, the front facing camera
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why is that? Is it possible that the AT&T model doesn't come with those features???
its more then likely ATT will not have the front camera as they do not support 2way video calling. also if the BB 8800 is any sign they will cripple the internal GPS if not take it out compleatly and force you to use there tower based telanav service.
Man, if I could afford, I would not even be asking this question. I would have a TyTN II on my hand right now.
Good points.
On the charger issue - won't HTC soon release a U.S. retail version of the Kaiser? Or are they prevented from doing so because of their relationship w/ AT&T?
there sales dep they use told me on the phone yesturday they will be selling them. she said they get them in on the 14th and there orders sould start going out on the 18th. Not sure if that ment u can order on the 14th or have to wait till the 18th tho.
Also note there sales dep does do contracts for ATT and all there americas carriers so they may or may not offier the unlocked one.
you can check there sales page from the HTC america site it send you to there sales front of letstalk.com
There has been people on here and other blogs claiming that AT&T may not offer some of these things. For instance, the 8525 didn't have the front camera, the case, and a few other things. AT&T is known for stripping down phones. Plus, even if AT&T doesn't offer the video conferencing now, when they do. you'll already have the capabilities to do it.
I expect the only crippling of GPS will be the lack of free Tom-Tom software. Of course telnav will be on there for them to make money but ATT would not disable GPS as other than that why buy a 8925 if you have a 8525. You can add your own GPS software, however the cost with that may bring you near just buying an unbranded Kaiser in the first place. I am waiting for the flame as to all the other great enhancements by upgrading, but I am talking about real useful stuff...when consumers spend $400 to change PDA it better be for something more than a little more RAM that they probably never maxed out the RAM on the 8525.
Isn't an HTC unlocked phone $800 or so ?
I don't see any point in going that route.
For $350 (probably) with 2 year contract, you'll get the same thing less :
1) front camera. i couldn't care less about that.
2) they MIGHT remove GPS. i have BT gps receiver already, so no issue there. even if you don't already have one, they are 80 bucks and don't suck up your PDA battery life.
3) i have ZERO doubt somebody will unlock this thing in short order. no value there either.
is it really worth $450 bucks to pick up 3 items that aren't of much use ?
just my 2c
DLD
RacerX10 said:
Isn't an HTC unlocked phone $800 or so ?
I don't see any pointing that route.
For $350 (probably) with 2 year contract, you'll get the same thing less :
1) front camera. i couldn't care less about that.
2) they MIGHT remove GPS. i have BT gps receiver already, so no issue there. even if you don't already have one, they are 80 bucks and don't suck up your PDA battery life.
3) i have ZERO doubt somebody will unlock this thing in short order. no value there either.
is it really worth $450 bucks to pick up 3 items that aren't of much use ?
just my 2c
DLD
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree except I think GPS will be fully functional minus approx $100 TomTom software, so it still savings to wait for ATT version.
RacerX10 said:
Isn't an HTC unlocked phone $800 or so ?
I don't see any pointing that route.
For $350 (probably) with 2 year contract, you'll get the same thing less :
1) front camera. i couldn't care less about that.
2) they MIGHT remove GPS. i have BT gps receiver already, so no issue there. even if you don't already have one, they are 80 bucks and don't suck up your PDA battery life.
3) i have ZERO doubt somebody will unlock this thing in short order. no value there either.
is it really worth $450 bucks to pick up 3 items that aren't of much use ?
just my 2c
DLD
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And you'll pay at least $20 per month more for the PDA data plan
magnamar said:
Another reason for the HTC one vrs the ATT one is ATT app locks them so you will have to wait a bit for someone to get a unlocking system working for it. With the 8525 it took 2-4 months if i remember correctly before there was a unlock avil for it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not exactly - the Cingular 8525 released November '06 and the pof free unlocker was out before release day. But recall that the TyTN had been out for almost a year by the time 8525 released - so free unlocker predated 8525 but not TyTN. imei-check had unlockers even earlier.
Richard
wpbear said:
when consumers spend $400 to change PDA it better be for something more than a little more RAM that they probably never maxed out the RAM on the 8525.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually I'm *hoping* the 128MB RAM brings performance of the Kaiser back up to the level of my iPAQ5555 on Mapopolis. Moving from a "400MHz 128MB" iPAQ to a "400MHz 64MB" 8525/TyTN made Mapopolis MUCH less useful - loading Los Angeles alone kills the 8525, and is quick as a bunny on the iPAQ
I'd pay the upgrade in a heartbeat if I were sure I'd get Mapopolis back up to iPAQ performance! My struggle is $800 to *maybe* get back my performance vs wait and pay $450 to *maybe* get back my performance.
FWIW, I switched from a CF GPS on the iPAQ to a BT GPS because I found reception to be MUCH better having the GPS on the dash of the car vs attached to the iPAQ in my hand. So I like the integrated GPS option, but I don't know that it'll really save me from using my existing BT GPS. GPS has improved a fair bit since my Holux CF days, but I don't know if that'll be enough to overcome the antenna positioning issues.
Just my $0.02,
Richard
kept it simple..
my rationalization: post my thoughts in the forum and hope that someone tells me i made the right decision. (just kidding!)
for me the purchase amounts to a redistribution of discretionary spending. i lowered discretionary spending for a few weeks to finance the (irrational) "early adopter" cost of a hot new toy. at the first opportunity i purchased the toy without hesitation. i'll deal with buyer's remorse for 24hrs or until the new toy gets here. once i have the new toy in my hands, the need to rationalize will inexplicably disappear...
in other words, i was willing to pay the premium cost of getting what i wanted when i wanted it. i know i'll enjoy the new toy...lol
just my $0.02 (that i have left after buying the new toy )
rsolomon said:
Actually I'm *hoping* the 128MB RAM brings performance of the Kaiser back up to the level of my iPAQ5555 on Mapopolis. Moving from a "400MHz 128MB" iPAQ to a "400MHz 64MB" 8525/TyTN made Mapopolis MUCH less useful - loading Los Angeles alone kills the 8525, and is quick as a bunny on the iPAQ
I'd pay the upgrade in a heartbeat if I were sure I'd get Mapopolis back up to iPAQ performance! My struggle is $800 to *maybe* get back my performance vs wait and pay $450 to *maybe* get back my performance.
FWIW, I switched from a CF GPS on the iPAQ to a BT GPS because I found reception to be MUCH better having the GPS on the dash of the car vs attached to the iPAQ in my hand. So I like the integrated GPS option, but I don't know that it'll really save me from using my existing BT GPS. GPS has improved a fair bit since my Holux CF days, but I don't know if that'll be enough to overcome the antenna positioning issues.
Just my $0.02,
Richard
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
mapoplis should be replaced by tomtom anyway but thats my opinion.
as far as gps reception in the car...there is a cheap wired ext antenna already for the device
wpbear said:
mapoplis should be replaced by tomtom anyway but thats my opinion.
as far as gps reception in the car...there is a cheap wired ext antenna already for the device
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
TomTom performance on the 8525 certainly beats Mapopolis on that machine, but the UI is years behind: No text-to-speech???? In the 21st century??? WTF! TomTom POI management is a joke compared to Mapopolis, try to add your own Restaurant in TomTom - it's gotta be in a custom category and thus won't show up in all the Restaurant searches.
Yes, I did the wired antenna thing for my CF GPS and it helps, but it's yet one more wire. The BT is wonderful, no wires, better signal.... Don't get me wrong, I'll be tickled if Kaiser GPS is usable!
Richard
What do people think about integrated antennas like these:
http://store.mp3car.com/Roof_top_GPS_Cellular_PCS_WiFi_antenna_p/com-008.htm
I am thinking about getting one like this for my car obviously to up the gps and cellular signal strength.
A question I have for any TyTn II experts, Which antenna does the WiFi use, is it integrated into the cellular antenna or gps or neither?
Neither, I believe all three have their own internal antennas. I say this because I have seen the internal photos of the Hermes and Trinity (which has GPS) and they had seperate small antennas. The Kaiser has two external antenna ports but after bricking my 1st Hermes by plugging an external antenna in and having it kill my radio, I'll never play the external game again. Besides it seems to work very well on all radios, even simultaneously, without externals.
I Would Have To Go With All In A 3 In One (technicaly)
FROM MY EXPERIENCE I WOULD SAY THAT THEY ALL WORK WITH THE RIGHT DRIVERS.
hOW EVER BEING ABSTRACT I WOULD SAY SINCE I BELIEVE MOST OF ALL THE PHONES HAVE GPS BUILT IN and THAT THE WRITE DRIVER SHOULD GIVE YOU THE ABILITY TO UTILIZE THE antenna FROM THE PHONE WHICH HAS MORE THAN ONE WIRE IN IT.
external NOW YOUR TALKING SOME EXTRA BOOST JUST FOR YOUR CONNECTION TO IT.
YOU CANT GO WRONG, TRICK IS ALL ABOUT TIME AND EFFICIENCY COST IS PERSONAL OPINION[
good luck
The first photo is with the rubber grommet off and you can see the hole that goes through to the documented external GPS antenna. In the red circle is a piece of plastic that is blocking another external antenna port.
The 2nd photo is with the whole back off and inside the circle again you can see the extra antenna port.
aboutthemind said:
FROM MY EXPERIENCE I WOULD SAY THAT THEY ALL WORK WITH THE RIGHT DRIVERS.
hOW EVER BEING ABSTRACT I WOULD SAY SINCE I BELIEVE MOST OF ALL THE PHONES HAVE GPS BUILT IN and THAT THE WRITE DRIVER SHOULD GIVE YOU THE ABILITY TO UTILIZE THE antenna FROM THE PHONE WHICH HAS MORE THAN ONE WIRE IN IT.
external NOW YOUR TALKING SOME EXTRA BOOST JUST FOR YOUR CONNECTION TO IT.
YOU CANT GO WRONG, TRICK IS ALL ABOUT TIME AND EFFICIENCY COST IS PERSONAL OPINION
good luck
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
1. Stop yelling!
2. Most phones do NOT have GPS built-in.
3. You don't need drivers to use an external antenna. It's a physical connection.
4. Get your facts straight.
5. I like the antenna. Now if it had an XM antenna in it, I would buy it in a heartbeat. It would also work great for wardriving (not with my Tilt, but with my laptop)
Another Fan i apologize for not being clear
Lidberg said:
1. Stop yelling!
Please refrain from giving me orders!
2. Most phones do NOT have GPS built-in.
Actually they do to eliminate have to change a board already n production. besides the kaiser is older like 5 years then an mda.
3. You don't need drivers to use an external antenna. It's a physical connection.
Who said anything about drivers for the XM Radio antenna. I said Driversfor the internal gps antena. Read the kaiser wiki... the wiki for the pre-installed gps module.
4. Get your facts straight.
Well this is the part where tell you my way of thinking. I dont read so bare with me considering i am self taught and taking over a hundred different phones apart i can even say with out knowing that they stopped the technology cause 1000 features that are to advanced become a forum!!!!
Again if you are a HTC technician or a hardware engineer for any of the pocket pc device i will with draw any of my comments.
How ever of your here for fun and to learn do a litle bit of home work before you accidentally insult some one willing to read your opinion.
Hope i was a little bit better in explaining what i meant
ciao
5. I like the antenna. Now if it had an XM antenna in it, I would buy it in a heartbeat. It would also work great for wardriving (not with my Tilt, but with my laptop)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This can be done
People don't like when you use ALL CAPS. It looks like you're yelling at them.
The way you made your statement, it sounded like you needed drivers for the GPS antenna, which is not true. You need drivers to utilize the GPS radio. Two different things. You even got the two mixed up in the same post.
I seriously doubt the Kaiser is 5 years old. Where are you getting this information??
Personally I think your statements tend to ramble and be incoherent, but I digress. The Kaiser is an excellent phone. I love having built-in GPS. I am probably going to buy an external GPS antenna for it, although it really doesn't need it. I can even get 2-3 birds inside my house.
aboutthemind said:
Actually they do to eliminate have to change a board already n production. besides the kaiser is older like 5 years then an mda.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What does this mean? That HTC or other cell phone manufacturer are removing components on a board they've already produced before they release a new phone? Why on earth would they do that when they could save the cost of buying the additional circuitry in the first place and just order a run of what they want?
I said Driversfor the internal gps antena.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Antennae don't require drivers. Circuits do. What you're saying doesn't make any sense.
...they stopped the technology cause 1000 features that are to advanced become a forum!!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This doesn't make any sense.
Again if you are a HTC technician or a hardware engineer for any of the pocket pc device i will with draw any of my comments.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm neither, but I believe you need to withdraw your comments.
Hope i was a little bit better in explaining what i meant
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not really, no. It sounds like you're saying the Kaiser is using a board that's five years old and has physically had circuits removed from it because HTC didn't want to provide all of the features/functions that they could. I sincerely doubt that this is the case, since they'll produce a couple million of these things and paying even $1 extra for circuits they'll remove and labor to remove them makes no sense when they can order up a board that they want and get it for cheaper.
Throw in that you posted in all caps (considered rude by just about everyone) and then provided information that just doesn't add up, I'm not surprised you got push back.
Again i apologize for beining insulted and for any misrepresentation
I really don't feel like explaining my self, so if you feel that i am attacking you i apologize.
considering that i have simply stated a an opinion and you have managed to exert the fact that you do not respect others. i will respond.
and seriously just take what you like in theory and leave the stuff that you dont like.
I am not going to explain that typing is not the easiest thing for me. please don't mistake that for a representation of how i deal with people.
PerfAlbion said:
What does this mean? That HTC or other cell phone manufacturer are removing components on a board they've already produced before they release a new phone? Why on earth would they do that when they could save the cost of buying the additional circuitry in the first place and just order a run of what they want?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
PerfAlbion said:
Wow now were ar talking so a little lesson in busines 101 agan i can only base this on doing business in the us for over ten years this is not to have you answer me back
cost of labor for most manufacture is far greater than the price of parts in bulk.
out of respect for the people reading this ill stop thier.
Antennae don't require drivers. Circuits do. What you're saying doesn't make any sense.sorry for confusing the the exact words i was trying to offend everyone are you kidding me
1000 features that no one needs
This doesn't make any sense.
ok so since your opinion is not completely biast this again alies the theaory of an article in a vry small country called he us have youu heard of it?
Seriuosley i am in no mood to go over every line to some one that is biast to my comment that all of a sudden became an issue.
Listen genious and i do say geneous with respect the fact is and this goes for all. technology has far supercede the cash cow(people who buy, consumers, money, what makes the world go round)
i noticed after getting into the bigger phones like the 1700 and the BA and the hermes that they all look the same or have very similar compositions.
I came to the conclusion that they all had gps in them from a market professional stand pioint. So really just appriciate some input.
You want the facts well yeh its but so what i was trying to give some input before you reminded me that i wll end up having to type for an hour cause a genious felt it necessary to chalenge me.
I'm neither, but I believe you need to withdraw your comments.
Ok no problem please understand i was giving input and you decided to insult me.
I openly withdraw any comment i have ever made that you feel is not worthy as another member put it and if you would like me to say that i am sorry posting i do.
Not really, no. It sounds like you're saying
the Kaiser is using a board that's five years old and has physically had circuits removed from it because HTC didn't want to provide all of the features/functions that they could.
no one said anything about removal, baords for the most part have alot of he circuits on them it makes it vary easy to acomplish global standards and upgrades and maximizing profit by making upgrades look tangible.
I sincerely doubt that this is the case, since they'll produce a couple million of these things and paying even $1 extra for circuits they'll remove and labor to remove them makes no sense when they can order up a board that they want and get it for cheaper.
I agree that would make no sense thats why i would nt say it i see where your coming from.
Throw in that you posted in all caps (considered rude by just about everyone) and then provided information that just doesn't add up,
I'm not surprised you got push back.
i wouldnt know but i apriciate yur interest in my curent position and standings may be you could show me how i can get pms cause its very hard for me to read i have add and typing is the worst,
What a waste of time and energy i apologize to anyone having to read this
you see chief i didn't ven relize that that the caps lock was on but since you decide to think now i will tell you the system i use wich is also a system i created because of you thinking for me requires caps lock to be own as well as the state of ca on documents.
so again i apologize
record time MIKE 1:15 mins
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
bazzatron said:
The first photo is with the rubber grommet off and you can see the hole that goes through to the documented external GPS antenna. In the red circle is a piece of plastic that is blocking another external antenna port.
The 2nd photo is with the whole back off and inside the circle again you can see the extra antenna port.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the visual thats what i am talking about
back to the real question
i would look for any type of after market booster car kit easiest way is google the word china after it and you would be shocked what youll find they can pretty much customize anything the word to use for phones in china is not cellular or htc.. pocket pc
"mobile phone"
is the key word attached to gps car kit or what ever
always request a sample good luck only sugestion i am not an expert
sorry about the caps didnt see it
Lidberg said:
People don't like when you use ALL CAPS. It looks like you're yelling at them.
The way you made your statement, it sounded like you needed drivers for the GPS antenna, which is not true. You need drivers to utilize the GPS radio. Two different things. You even got the two mixed up in the same post.
again tabgled up up a bit my bad
I seriously doubt the Kaiser is 5 years old. Where are you getting this information??
well not to be a drag but the hermes is been around for ages and again not to be rude but the kaiser is not the first phone to have a total new build. just some awsome exploited adjustments.
Personally I think your statements tend to ramble and be incoherent, but I digress.
well i guess everyone has an opinion but no need to insult me
The Kaiser is an excellent phone. I love having built-in GPS. I am probably going to buy an external GPS antenna for it, although it really doesn't need it. I can even get 2-3 birds inside my house.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Kool let me know how it goes
if i get around to it
i am assuming it can hook into a car via blue toothe???????
aboutthemind said:
sue.
Listen genious and i do say geneous with respect the fact is and this goes for all. technology has far supercede the cash cow(people who buy, consumers, money, what makes the world go round)
i noticed after getting into the bigger phones like the 1700 and the BA and the hermes that they all look the same or have very similar compositions.
I came to the conclusion that they all had gps in them from a market professional stand pioint.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Don't insult us by calling us "genius". There are a lot of very smart people on this board. Without their help, my phone wouldn't be nearly as fun to play with.
You made a pretty broad assumption that if one or two phones have GPS built-in, then all of them do. The fact is, very few phones have GPS built-in. My last phone, the 8525, was a very good phone with lots of features. It's less than a year old and it doesn't have GPS. Go ahead and keep making those assumptions and you'll stand out as someone who doesn't know how to do any kind of research. You will make yourself look like a fool.
P.S. Spell check is your friend. Use it.
Actually the 8525 does have GPS! However, after in-depth investigation these XDA folks identified that while the IC Chipset did have GPS as part of it's standard fratures, HTC shorted those particular pins to ground on the circuit board and did not include the internal amp and antenna assembly as well so it was impossible to make it work on them without major micro surgery. The Trinity, however, had the components and thru software was able to have it's GPS come to life. But certainly all phones don't have Chipsets with integrated GPS.
I would agree that many companies will use a particular chip and elect NOT to provide all of the features at first release or for specific models, that is normal marketing driven buisness and gives us reasons to buy the next model.
XDA certainly has made it possible for us all to reap the collective tinkering experience and get more from the phones we have and sometimes get these hidden features with a little work.
No disrespect "aboutthemind", but I must agree that your text is a challenge to understand, but I'm always amazed at the worldwide, round-the-clock, activity on this forum. I've learned so much here.
RemE said:
Actually the 8525 does have GPS! However, after in-depth investigation these XDA folks identified that while the IC Chipset did have GPS as part of it's standard fratures, HTC shorted those particular pins to ground on the circuit board and did not include the internal amp and antenna assembly as well so it was impossible to make it work on them without major micro surgery. The Trinity, however, had the components and thru software was able to have it's GPS come to life. But certainly all phones don't have Chipsets with integrated GPS.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I remember that discussion well about the 8525 GPS. I think one guy even had the GPS working, but only by disassembling the phone and having wires running everywhere. Not exactly portable...
Lidberg said:
I remember that discussion well about the 8525 GPS. I think one guy even had the GPS working, but only by disassembling the phone and having wires running everywhere. Not exactly portable...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually they got the GPS chip activated but could receive no valid data since the antenna bits were not present, they investigated the internal components and determined that it was basically not worth the effort to attempt to unsoldier all of the grounded pins on the chip and then get an amp/bandpass filter and antenna installed. No one ever got a 8525 to work and the project halted, but along came Kaiser!
Here's another one: http://www.mobileplanet.com/p.aspx?i=151025 much cheaper too, but only to be placed on the dash. Probably work just as good though.
My Wing has only one external connection. I bought a 3 watt Wilson booster which then goes to a Yagi (one directional antenna). Its awesome the reception I get. Costs about $300.00 to do all this.
ok no gps in 8525 and aboutthemind is a fool Y N
Lidberg said:
Don't insult us by calling us "genius". There are a lot of very smart people on this board. Without their help, my phone wouldn't be nearly as fun to play with.
You made a pretty broad assumption that if one or two phones have GPS built-in, then all of them do. The fact is, very few phones have GPS built-in. My last phone, the 8525, was a very good phone with lots of features. It's less than a year old and it doesn't have GPS. Go ahead and keep making those assumptions and you'll stand out as someone who doesn't know how to do any kind of research. You will make yourself look like a fool.
P.S. Spell check is your friend. Use it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
let me ask you a question, what gives you the right to speak for another person, I would you like to help the gentle man that was here for help cause i am confused as to why you want me to engage in this. i will if we can all end up with a gps that also gives you real-time police positions. Linberg i strongly sugest you bring a positive opinion to this one cause so far your not really contributing to a solution.
With all due respect sir, please refrain from putting words in my mouth. I have addressed the typing and by the looks of it i don't think u get that you my friend are assuming that i am just swing info from my hip.
your right but it from my eyes and hands threw my head to a yellow box so you can see.
now the comment you made finished this so at least we know that your old phone has a gps in it what else can we add to the gentle mans question..
yes i am a fool for answering you but i'll just pass cause i have no interest in your theory due to the nature of your comments.
gps is in the 8525 and yes you can take apart a phone. and im gane i got one in pieces so no is the time but the kaisers 8525 so the fun is one and that is poff's world i would start by maybe doing some reading on his work mans a guru
Mike I'm trying my best but out of respect for the genius members all of them including this guy . i can't take another comment with out losing character.
Mr Lindberg i regret to inform you that calling people fool and names and insulting my dyslexias probably cost you. I like the name very historical but again i will only ask you one more time do not insult me and do not speak for the team
yes we have lift off
zcink said:
My Wing has only one external connection. I bought a 3 watt Wilson booster which then goes to a Yagi (one directional antenna). Its awesome the reception I get. Costs about $300.00 to do all this.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yeah thats what I'm talking about i like it. can yu post a link
aboutthemind said:
let me ask you a question, what gives you the right to speak for another person, I would you like to help the gentle man that was here for help cause i am confused as to why you want me to engage in this. i will if we can all end up with a gps that also gives you real-time police positions. Linberg i strongly sugest you bring a positive opinion to this one cause so far your not really contributing to a solution.
With all due respect sir, please refrain from putting words in my mouth. I have addressed the typing and by the looks of it i don't think u get that you my friend are assuming that i am just swing info from my hip.
your right but it from my eyes and hands threw my head to a yellow box so you can see.
now the comment you made finished this so at least we know that your old phone has a gps in it what else can we add to the gentle mans question..
yes i am a fool for answering you but i'll just pass cause i have no interest in your theory due to the nature of your comments.
gps is in the 8525 and yes you can take apart a phone. and im gane i got one in pieces so no is the time but the kaisers 8525 so the fun is one and that is poff's world i would start by maybe doing some reading on his work mans a guru
Mike I'm trying my best but out of respect for the genius members all of them including this guy . i can't take another comment with out losing character.
Mr Lindberg i regret to inform you that calling people fool and names and insulting my dyslexias probably cost you. I like the name very historical but again i will only ask you one more time do not insult me and do not speak for the team
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry man, but I can't make any sense out of what you're trying to say. I didn't put any words into your mouth. I don't know where you got that idea.
You made some pretty broad statements about GPS in phones and I told you that that is not true - most phones do not have GPS built-in. The 8525 has some of the hardware, but it is not a complete, workable solution.
Also, I did not call you a fool. I said you would look like a fool if you made broad statements about phones in general that are not true.
'nuff said.
Okay I did search and I have seen it posted BOTH ways I am not a big fan of hacked cracked or Warez apps right now I am running a rom that come bundled with tomtom6 I then installed tomtom7 from the post here but when I went to download the freeby map and voices I got a weird error so I popped over to tomtom.com and my version doesn't seem to be legal before I yank it out can someone tell me once and for all if I am legal ?
I suppose the blunt answer is that if a) you haven't paid TomTom money for the software, or b) the software wasn't included in an official ROM on your device for 'trial' purposes; then you are outside terms of the licence - in simple terms, not legal.
There is however reasonable grounds for debate given that TomTom seem to be forgetting the PDA community to ever more significant levels. That's particularly out of order when you consider that it was really PDA users that put TomTom on the map (no pun intended) and really helped the consumer satellite navigation system market flourish into the extremely lucrative enterprise it now is.
The situation we're in now is that we've bank-rolled a good portion of TomTom's discreet product development, and indeed commercial success; and it seems our party-invites are being forgotten...
At the end of the day the product development and channel support for PDA users is shrinking more and more. The only real way to have a chance (and it's not guaranteed) of owning up-to-date (and therefore really useful) TomTom sat nav for your PDA is if you happen to buy one of only a handful of devices which fall inside the remit of the deal TomTom did with HTC. The next kick in the nuts is when you find out that even though you own a perfectly capable device, manufactured by the company who are in bed with TomTom, you still don't automatically join the party because the chances are you got your Diamond/Kaiser/Whatever from your Telco; and re-brands of device and software don't fall inside the same deal.
So, Mr A with his ageing but still capable iPaq can't buy a recent version of Navigator and a map for it because PDA software isn't out in the channel. And also Mr B, who owns a shiny-new Kaiser, but may have got it in the form of a Vaio III from T-Mobile, or a Tilt from those lovely folks over the pond, also can't get the software; again even though it is in existence, simply because they got their HTC manufactured (and the key point here is that HTC still made their £££, it was just T-Mobile/AT&T/Orange/whoever signing the cheque rather than Mr B himself) from a Telco because it worked out to be £0-£100 for the device rather than £300-500 to buy it 'SIM free'. The fact that TomTom are slowly and quietly dropping their PDA customers winds me up enough, but the fact a good number of HTC customers are excluded from the ever-shrinking party simply because their Telco subsidised part of the purchase price of the device makes it even worse.
So, relatively up-to-date versions of TomTom navigator for PDAs do exist, as do relatively up-to-date maps and extras (traffic/safety camera subscriptions). The only problem is that even if you want to, it's near impossible to spend your money on them.
Does this make TomTom a bunch of clowns for still putting some resource into development but at the same time slamming the door on a large number of loyal users who would still quite happily help them recoup or even profit on those costs, absolutely. Should they be surprised if some people find other ways around those obstacles when pound-notes fail, probably not. Does that make it ethical - it's debatable (but for the sake of this great site's legal-footing, that debate can't really take place here. ...Does it make it legal, alas no.
So, for the black-and-white legal position on the matter, read the first paragraph again. Anything beyond that I think is up to the individual, who has to decide whether they'll risk/be prepared for/accept any potential consequences of other actions which fall outside of TomTom's frankly ridiculous position.
I can't help wondering what the blinkered-idiots at TomTom are thinking on this issue. As far as I can see they currently have product available, and there's no real reason why that can't continue for the forseeable future given that most of the development cost will still be incurred if they only shipped discreet devices (ie, it can't cost that much extra to make sure there's a pretty recent PDA version living alongside their discreet products); BUT, they've more or less completely closed every route to market. Which Mickey Mouse school of business did these chumps go to? Yes, I see the point that they stand to make more money by selling you a Go! 940 Live than a software-only product for your PDA; but I for one certainly won't go running out to buy a 940 (or its descendant) if all possibility of my running an up-to-date version on my PDA ceases. I think I'll be feeling alienated enough to give my money to Navman, Garmin or any of the others first. Likewise they could, and should have enough confidence in their own discreet products to see that there are USPs differentiating both markets - some folks just one a gadget to do sat nav, and nothing else, they want it to be integrated and simple, with more focus on certain aspects of specification. On the other hand some folks will always have the need for a PDA, and would prefer not to have a rucksack full of electronics to carry with us - OK, we might not get all the benefits of a discreet sat nav unit; but if it's that way or the highway (again, no pun intended, I'm just one damn funny guy ), why exclude our money from your coffers.
Anyway, in short; you're probably a little outside of licensing and copyright law; but at the moment it's probably fair to say that TomTom have left us out in the cold to some degree, so you should just feel the force/go with your heart/<insert other suitable cliché here>...
Rant over.
Love and hugs (to everyone apart from TomTom's marketeers),
Rob.
Write to TomTom and let the boss know what you think
FactionOne said:
TomTom seem to be forgetting the PDA community to ever more significant levels.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I know what you mean and (after several unsatifying phonecalls to the company) I recently sent their big cheese (at HQ in the Netherlands) a letter about it. Sometimes buying a dedicated TomTom device just isn't an answer - for example I use my TyTN II for navigation on my bicycle (using a TyTN II handlebar mount) and on foot alot of the time so there's no way I'm going to carry around a 12 volt battery just to power a dedicated, comparitively bulky, TomTom device.
I suggest you write to them as well, The addresses and manager/supervisor names and positions are all on their website. I'd be happy with TomTom Navigator 6 if it weren't for the fact the map I have (which is the latest available) is very outdated and it doesn't support map share or any other similar way of getting any sort of update. I refuse to pay for a product thats not officially supported (eg buying a map for an illegal version of TTN7 on a Kaiser) so I'm just making do with TTN 6 and my purchased compatible map, the rest of my money is staying in my wallet.
You are correct in that it is a glaring example of missed marketing opportunities. Perhaps given their tremendous growth in recent times, they are getting to big for their boots and think they can shape the market to suit their ideal, to a greater extent than they really can? They need to watch out or people will go with the competition.
I beleive their reasoning is that they're fed up of piracy. A bit silly really considering they're making piracy the only option.
Absolutely agree with everything posted here.
I have paid for TomTom Nav 6, the most up-to-date maps (early 2007), extra voices, Speed Camera & Traffic subscriptions - and have now been told it's no longer supported (they will not be issuing new maps).
I have raised support calls & spoken to them on the phone - they agree this is now obsolete and they have no plans to release TomTom 7 in this country (UK). They even said if you have TomTom 7 in the UK it's an illegal copy!
I want my money back. I was told there would be 4 map updates every year - there was only 1 update after I bought the software.
Having said all that, I am struggling to find a viable alternative. I need to traffic to make it worthwhile (as I do the same trips most days, but need traffic warnings due to motorway snarl-ups).
I'm v.impressed with the trial of Navigon MN7 - but there seems to be no way of getting TMC traffic on the Kaiser in the UK (outstanding support call with Navigon as well now...).
If anyone finds an alternative, please let me know.
I really don't understand TomTom's position on this. They have a market leading product and now choose to pull out of the market - at exactly the point you would expect the PDA solution to supercede the traditional separate unit. In my company we looking to stop using 250 TomTom units and repace them with an integrated PDA solution - so TomTom will (eventually) lose out big-style. They seem to be shooting themselves in the foot.
CoPilot Live 7 is one alternative that was bundled with some Kaisers
Ramsfan_Jim said:
If anyone finds an alternative, please let me know.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
CoPilot Live 7 works on the Kaiser, indeed some UK providers bundled the two together. I have no personal experience of the product so I don't know how up to date their maps are but CoPilot maps are provided by a different company to TomToms maps (Navteq vs TeleAtlas respectively) and fewer countries/regions are covered at the moment compared to TomTom, I'm sure a search here and on google will yield lots of results.
As for getting your money back, see if you can find some documentation showing they said there'd be 4 maps a year, then talk to the C.A.B. or your Trading Standards Office - good luck with that
I think you also have lots of good points that'd be best dealt with via a letter or Fax to the company boss. If they REALLY want to get out of that section of the market due to piracy issues, it's throwing out the baby with the bath water. Instead they should be looking at improving security and making the product less easy to steal - perhaps by using activation for BOTH the software AND maps.
FactionOne said:
Anyway, in short; you're probably a little outside of licensing and copyright law; but at the moment it's probably fair to say that TomTom have left us out in the cold to some degree, so you should just feel the force/go with your heart/<insert other suitable cliché here>...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the clarification and for soothing my conscience...
Flying Kiwi said:
CoPilot Live 7 works on the Kaiser, indeed some UK providers bundled the two together. I have no personal experience of the product so I don't know how up to date their maps are but CoPilot maps are provided by a different company to TomToms maps (Navteq vs TeleAtlas respectively) and fewer countries/regions are covered at the moment compared to TomTom, I'm sure a search here and on google will yield lots of results.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have spoken to ALK regarding switching to CoPilot, but was told their maps are also over 18 months old, and they will not be releasing updates for CoPilot 7. They could not give me a date for CoPilot 8, but if they do not issue map updates, then it will be exactly the same problem as TomTom i.e. It will become obsolete.
Ramsfan_Jim said:
I have spoken to ALK regarding switching to CoPilot, but was told their maps are also over 18 months old,
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I could only dream of having a TomTom map thats age is in months rather than years!
they will not be releasing updates for CoPilot 7.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Maybe not program updates but the map would still be newer to start with (although in fairness I've not compared the two in the areas where TomToms maps have things wrong).
They could not give me a date for CoPilot 8, but if they do not issue map updates, then it will be exactly the same problem as TomTom i.e. It will become obsolete.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Most importantly, they've also not said they'll be releasing future versions only bundled with devices. This means if you're keen for the absolute latest and greatest maps and you're willing to pay, they'll still be providing suitable products - not something that can be said of TomTom.
Hi,
I decided to make my 1st post. I've been visiting XDA for some time and flashed several ROM's. I want to say thank you for everyone responsible for making XDA what it is today.
My question is regarding AT&T & Custom ROM. I currently work for AT&T and use a captivate provided by the company. I have flashed several i9000 ROM's and they're absolutely great. My concern is that AT&T can tell that I have a custom ROM/Modem on the network. I understand that they can tell on the device itself but how about the network. I'm guessing if I'm using the i9000 ROM it would be visible to the engineers.
Thank you in advance for your reply
I also work for AT&T. Without physically looking at the phone, I believe the only way they could tell would be if the software imei (*#06#) does not match the phone's imei (under battery) - since the software imei is transmitted to the network. This is why if you change sims, the network still knows what phone you are using.
Pardon me for asking the obvious, but if both of you work for AT$T, can't you get us some info on the 2.2 update? Had to ask.
LOL.. depends on where they work.
If they both work at a Retail outlet selling phones? Then uh no.
Miami_Son said:
Pardon me for asking the obvious, but if both of you work for AT$T, can't you get us some info on the 2.2 update? Had to ask.[/QUOTE
As of 2 weeks ago AT&T did not have the software ready for testing. Nothing can happen until Samsung completes it and send it to at&t's lab for testing. I can assure you at&t wants it out as much as you do to be competitive in the android market. Besides who cares about the official version with all the awesome ROM's on XDA.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
avgjoegeek said:
LOL.. depends on where they work.
If they both work at a Retail outlet selling phones? Then uh no.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I do not sell the phones and do not work at a retail location. I do however support the stores in making sure all the reps know the products.
[/QUOTE
As of 2 weeks ago AT&T did not have the software ready for testing. Nothing can happen until Samsung completes it and send it to at&t's lab for testing. I can assure you at&t wants it out as much as you do to be competitive in the android market. Besides who cares about the official version with all the awesome ROM's on XDA.[/QUOTE]
Seems a bit off that the US market is so far behind plus I highly doubt ATT wants to be competitive since they are just sucking on that Apple core. Not all users want to flash or even know how to. Personally I believe the phone should have launched with Froyo but at least we aren't waiting for Eclair like the x10
alaimar said:
I do not sell the phones and do not work at a retail location. I do however support the stores in making sure all the reps know the products.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Then you would know - Thanks for the update. If AT&T would put out little updates like this one - many a user would be happy.
Go figure with twitter, facebook, myspace, email, txting, telephone, and hell even pen and paper - we still fail at one basic thing COMMUNICATION.
c0ldburn3r said:
[/QUOTE
As of 2 weeks ago AT&T did not have the software ready for testing. Nothing can happen until Samsung completes it and send it to at&t's lab for testing. I can assure you at&t wants it out as much as you do to be competitive in the android market. Besides who cares about the official version with all the awesome ROM's on XDA.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Seems a bit off that the US market is so far behind plus I highly doubt ATT wants to be competitive since they are just sucking on that Apple core. Not all users want to flash or even know how to. Personally I believe the phone should have launched with Froyo but at least we aren't waiting for Eclair like the x10[/QUOTE]
I agree with the flashing; however in regards to Apple core AT&T is looking at every possible way to stop sucking on it. As you know the exclusivity is expiring and they're doing everything possible to adjust. BB Torch and WP7 is a perfect example of that. US market is behind simply due to all the limitations every carrier wants to implement on every device and make sure that it's loaded with bloatware.
alaimar said:
Seems a bit off that the US market is so far behind plus I highly doubt ATT wants to be competitive since they are just sucking on that Apple core. Not all users want to flash or even know how to. Personally I believe the phone should have launched with Froyo but at least we aren't waiting for Eclair like the x10
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree with the flashing; however in regards to Apple core AT&T is looking at every possible way to stop sucking on it. As you know the exclusivity is expiring and they're doing everything possible to adjust. BB Torch and WP7 is a perfect example of that. US market is behind simply due to all the limitations every carrier wants to implement on every device and make sure that it's loaded with bloatware.[/QUOTE]
Off topic but only slightly: why exactly does ram flashing void hardware warranties? I wouldn't void my video card's hardware warranty for using Ubuntu instead of Windows. I understand they can't support problems arrising from using the software the hardware wasn't designed for, but you'd think flashing back to stock would put you back into warranty coverage. I don't understand why custom software is so vilified.
Jofaba said:
Off topic but only slightly: why exactly does ram flashing void hardware warranties? I wouldn't void my video card's hardware warranty for using Ubuntu instead of Windows. I understand they can't support problems arrising from using the software the hardware wasn't designed for, but you'd think flashing back to stock would put you back into warranty coverage. I don't understand why custom software is so vilified.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wireless carriers are not fans of customization as it usaualy removes their bloatware and enables features that they like to charge for ( wireless AP). From the manufacturers perspective using custom rom's can result in hardware damage. Imagine if it didn't how many bricked phones would be going back. Manufacturer always sets the warranty policy carrier's just enforce it.
I think att will ditch the captivate all together. I kinda dont even think we will see an official froyo.
what could be holding it back?
this is just my opinion
Krooked22 said:
I think att will ditch the captivate all together. I kinda dont even think we will see an official froyo.
what could be holding it back?
this is just my opinion
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
AT&T has no choice when it comes to Android. Ralph's made it publicly known that he doesn't like Android at all. With market share growing fast they are definitely working on beefing up their Android lineup ASAP
alaimar said:
Wireless carriers are not fans of customization as it usaualy removes their bloatware and enables features that they like to charge for ( wireless AP). From the manufacturers perspective using custom rom's can result in hardware damage. Imagine if it didn't how many bricked phones would be going back. Manufacturer always sets the warranty policy carrier's just enforce it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not trying to be rude but I asked about the manufacturer not the carrier. I fully understand the carrier's stance. That'd be like if I called Time Warner and *****ed to them about having problems getting online and was using Ubuntu, which they didn't support or even understand.
I'm saying Samsung. Why would they care? Unless they could prove that your customization caused the problem, how can they instantly void your warranty simply by using different software?
i would guess that overclocking might be a reason. aslo, even though bricking your phone is something that they can (most likely)reflash-stock and resell refurb, because retail reps will warratny your phone not knowing what the cause was ( you know that no one walks into store admitting they are to blame for phone issue so they assume it's faulty and process warranty to keep you happy
Jofaba said:
I'm not trying to be rude but I asked about the manufacturer not the carrier. I fully understand the carrier's stance. That'd be like if I called Time Warner and *****ed to them about having problems getting online and was using Ubuntu, which they didn't support or even understand.
I'm saying Samsung. Why would they care? Unless they could prove that your customization caused the problem, how can they instantly void your warranty simply by using different software?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well for one you didn't specify that you are referring to the manufacturer. You're comparing apple to oranges. At&t handles manufacturers warranty themselves and time Warner has nothing to do with your hardware ; -) You also answered your own question, they really have no way of proving it, therefore they created a legal document that gives them the right to screw you : -)
Sent from my GT-I9000 using Tapatalk
Jofaba said:
Off topic but only slightly: why exactly does ram flashing void hardware warranties? I wouldn't void my video card's hardware warranty for using Ubuntu instead of Windows. I understand they can't support problems arrising from using the software the hardware wasn't designed for, but you'd think flashing back to stock would put you back into warranty coverage. I don't understand why custom software is so vilified.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This isn't only software in a sense, you are flashing a chip...that's why they call it ROM flashing. Now if you were to flash your BIOS chip, I'm sure your motherboard manufacturer wouldn't hand out a refund either.
Another point to tackle, custom software is not frowned upon by Google(GPL), but when a bunch of kids come in complaining why their AT&T phones won't turn on because they don't know what flashing, ROMs and how video cards INTERFACE with operating systems the carrier may have issues.
They instantly void your warranty because they are trained to troubleshoot their hardware with approved software, not with your software which can trickle down and affect everything about the phone leading to a myriad of issues.
It's not what you know, it's what you can prove and even then that's a two sided coin and left up to the manufacturer to say you aren't covered under the warranty. But if you're slick and can seep through the cracks make a backup of your "default" OS... ROM whatever and save it for that very rainy day when you need it.