For those of you who have used cooked WM6.1 ROM's, have you had to overclock your Wizards? If so, by how much?
i use battery status and use the CPUScaler option for minimum i use 121 and for origional 195 max 195 but for boost 260 this in my opinion gives me the best battery life to speed ratio
, Sorry, but I haven't understood a single thing you said there... So is overclocking necessary to have a useable phone? Or best to stick with WM5.0 if you don't want to overclock...
overclocking is not neccesary, but it does give a significant speed boost in most ROMS, regardless if they are 6.1 or not
How does this effect the temperature of the CPU? Does it get significantly hotter & thus likely to burn out quicker...
as far as i can tell ive been using my phone for over a year and have found absolutly no problem with over clocking besides the extra battery drain
And what i was explaining b4 was the options i used on the overclocking program batterystatus theres an option called CPUScaler that allows u to variate the cpu speed this gives u the best of both worlds ie when ur using it for something heavy it will increase the cpu speed to the level u specify but when its not under heavy usage it will underclock (ie go to a slower cpu speed thereby decreasing the drain on ur battery).
And yes overclocking does give a significant boost to performance on any of the roms even wm5. Theres no harm in trying it so give it a try and you would see for yourself, if u dont like the way it works just uninstall the program and your done no problems and no long term effects.
Hey everyone, there is an overclocking app in the market, anyone care to give it a try?
Edit: So I downloaded it lol. Here are some screenshots. BTW, is there anyway I can verify that the cpu freq is actually being adjusted?
*Just for fun I ran neocore to see if it would raise my FPS. lol.
just notice the difference in speed. If you notice please post. And its not overclocking its just clocking. Overclocking will be beyond 528 MHz
Gameloft said:
just notice the difference in speed. If you notice please post. And its not overclocking its just clocking. Overclocking will be beyond 528 MHz
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The app is called Overclock, you can argue with the developer about the name not me.
Anyways, I do notice a very nice speed increase.
For example, atrackdog would take me at least 20-30 seconds to load my full app list (184 apps)
After installing overclock, it loaded in under 5 seconds.
i'll run other programs, and post my results.
I ran droidgear (game gear emulator) before and after, and I can honestly say it was faster (not a placebo affect).
-Before: droidgear would take over 4 minutes just to get to the menu screen
-After: i was actually able to load a game in under 1 and a half minutes, I even let it sit to run the demo, and it is the fastest ive ever seen an emulator run on this device (compared to NesEmu, and GB emu)
It would probably actually be playable if tweaks were made to the application codebase, and android Open GL stack.
Also, the camera loads instantly after pressing the camera button and via the icon in the home screen.
well, i was too, and then i downloaded it and said "aahh, what the hell, if i break mine, ill just take my wifes haha..." probably not the best of plans but i installed it anyway
sooo i havnt burnt up my phone yet, but here is my issue with the app, does the app only work untill you reboot your phone?
because when i reboot my phone, it goes back to the default speed according to the app
also, my phone tends to hang up (stuck on the apps screen, no buttons work, screen wont rotate, power button wont shut screen off) when using the 528MHz
so far, i havnt found a reason to pay a dollar for it, but ill keep testing
[UPDATE]
resolution for all below tests is 320 x 480
i tried neocore like posted above, using the mid level setting, and i actually did raise my fps from
DEFAULT CPU (248 MHz): 20.5 (with sound off)
384 MHz: 25.0! (with sound off)
DEFAULT CPU (248 MHz): 14.5 (with sound on)
384 MHz: 20.8 (with sound on)
still havnt gotten the fast speed to work yet, but im still trying to figure that out, on another note, sweeter home does seem to load a little faster
[UPDATE]
Incase you didnt see my sig, im not running on a ADP1 phone, so that might by why the fastest setting doesnt work for me, but so far 384MHz is making a noticeable difference with NEOCORE and SWEETER HOME
andonnguyen said:
The app is called Overclock, you can argue with the developer about the name not me.
Anyways, I do notice a very nice speed increase.
Also, the camera loads instantly after pressing the camera button and via the icon in the home screen.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i use snap photo, which used to take FOREVER to load up on my g1 using the camera button, its significantly faster using the 384MHz setting, good observation
Ok, so so far here is a list of things ive noticed (using 384MHz vs 248MHz):
-FPS in NEOCORE increased on adverage 5 to 6 fps
-Sweeter Home doesnt lag NEARLY as much as it used to (ALOT less force closes)
-Snap Photo doesnt take a month to load using the camera button
-G1 Wakes up properly which was a issue my g1 (and others on this forum) had
-Even though the app says it will "kill" the battery, using 384MHz during normal use of the phone isnt "killing" my battery, however, doom (while runs better (even with sound on)) seems to be dropping my battery level faster, but the game is running faster, which is the trade off id expect when running these apps together
At this point is there really a need? My phone doesnt lag that much that I need to over clock not to mention my battery life sucks already.
speoples20 said:
At this point is there really a need? My phone doesnt lag that much that I need to over clock not to mention my battery life sucks already.
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Click to collapse
all of our battery life sucks unless you have the extended battery, im not getting THAT big of a battery drain according to the system monitor app, and it DOES make a difference on g1's that have lag issues (running tons of apps like i do)
in other threads, people have complained about the g1 not waking up quickly sometimes, ive yet to have that issue since ive clocked mine up to the 384MHz setting
@woot, you do know that the default cpu freq on the G1 is ~384mHz. So you might want to change in your sig that you're overclocked to 384mHz lol.
The program installs a script on your sd card called ocx_tmp.sh and adjusts it that way, it'll write to /system as -rw (from what I've discussed with someone) would probably cause instability.
The program will reset the cpu freq back down to 384mHz after the phone sleeps. You can verify this in terminal emulator by typing:
$su
#cat /proc/cpuinfo
Try it before and after setting the cpu freq in overclock and you'll see what I mean =)
I thought the the CPU ran at 528 MHz by default? Or is it clocked dynamically and this forces it?
Gameloft said:
just notice the difference in speed. If you notice please post. And its not overclocking its just clocking. Overclocking will be beyond 528 MHz
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
andonnguyen said:
@woot, you do know that the default cpu freq on the G1 is ~384mHz. So you might want to change in your sig that you're overclocked to 384mHz lol.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
im not as familiar with clocking/overclocking so i wasnt sure if i was clocking it to 384, overclocking it to 384, or what, so what would be the proper thing to put in my sig? lol because according to my first quote, true overclocking wouldnt be untill i went beyond 528, so from the view of my first quote, im not OVERclocking, im clocking, wheras your saying im overclocked
andonnguyen said:
The program will reset the cpu freq back down to 384mHz after the phone sleeps. You can verify this in terminal emulator by typing:
$su
#cat /proc/cpuinfo
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
so is it infact the program thats changing the cpu freq or is it the phone? if its the program, is this to avoid overworking the cpu without the demand?
andonnguyen said:
.
The program will reset the cpu freq back down to 384mHz after the phone sleeps.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
by sleep do you mean turning the screen off using the power button? because i saw no change in my cpu freq when doing so using your commands
ivanmmj said:
I thought the the CPU ran at 528 MHz by default? Or is it clocked dynamically and this forces it?
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dont know, but i found this over at the android community:
Technical Features
Supports WCDMA/HSUPA and EGPRS networks
Multimedia Broadcasting Multicast Service (MBMS)
Integrated ARM11™ applications processor and ARM9™ modem
QDSP4000™ and QDSP5000™ high-performance digital signal processors (DSP)
528 MHz ARM11 Jazelle™ Java® hardware acceleration
Support for BREW® and Java applications
Qcamera™: Up to 6.0 megapixel digital images
Qtv™: Playback up to 30 fps VGA
Qcamcorder™: Record up to 24 fps QVGA
Up to 4 million triangles per second, and 133 million depth-tested, textured 3D pixels per second fill rate
gpsOne® position-location assisted-GPS (A-GPS) solution
Support for third-party operating systems
Digital audio support for MP3, aacPlus™ and Enhanced aacPlus
Integrated Mobile Digital Display Interface (MDDI), Bluetooth® 1.2 baseband processor and Wi-Fi® support
maybe that info will help? if not sorry
I remember reading somewhere by someone that it runs at 384 by default, and I think the post above confirms that...
ivanmmj said:
I thought the the CPU ran at 528 MHz by default? Or is it clocked dynamically and this forces it?
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Click to collapse
no, it runs at 384 by default, and clocks down even lower in the idle loop.
i am curious how this program works, as the normal cpufreq interfaces are not compiled in the kernel.
i've been running my phone for several months now at 528mhz, at a fairly minimal detriment to battery life.
i did however notice that without modifying the idle loop, the amount of cpu frequency switches even while the phone is not sleeping drops your average clock within a 10 second period to somewhere closer to 400mhz.
after modifying the idle loop to not switch frequency so often, i was able to get 27.4fps out of neocore w/o sound, and 22.7fps w/ sound.
my overall caffeine benchmark score was 582.
battery life impact is there, but fairly small. phone lasts for about a day and a half now where it used to last for sometimes 2. under heavy use, this is of course dramatically reduced.
gui fluidity is definitely increased, and sluggishness between app switches and when the translucent app drawer opens up is gone. i like it, but to the average person there probably is no need to do it.
keep in mind this is also not overclocking the cpu, it's clocking it to its default spec. as it is an embedded arm, it is designed to run hot, so i guarantee you are in no danger of hurting your phone.
also, do not listen to people that claim there could be no gain from overclocking, just because the bus speed is slower than the cpu speed does NOT mean there will be no improvement in system performance. if that were the case, there'd be no use for 4ghz desktop processors.
cache still runs full speed, and common execution paths stay in cache meaning no prefetch from system memory, meaning BIG improvement in many cases. (that's why cache exists.)
damnoregonian said:
no, it runs at 384 by default, and clocks down even lower in the idle loop.
i am curious how this program works, as the normal cpufreq interfaces are not compiled in the kernel.
i've been running my phone for several months now at 528mhz, at a fairly minimal detriment to battery life.
i did however notice that without modifying the idle loop, the amount of cpu frequency switches even while the phone is not sleeping drops your average clock within a 10 second period to somewhere closer to 400mhz.
after modifying the idle loop to not switch frequency so often, i was able to get 27.4fps out of neocore w/o sound, and 22.7fps w/ sound.
gui fluidity and responsiveness is greatly improved. sluggishness if app switching and the translucent app drawer are completely gone.
for many i imagine this means there isn't really any reason to clock the cpu up to its stock speed, but to each their own.
my overall caffeine benchmark score was 582.
battery life impact is there, but fairly small. phone lasts for about a day and a half now where it used to last for sometimes 2. under heavy use, this is of course dramatically reduced.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
care to write up a how-to for getting the 582 consistantly and changing the idle loop?
Holy crap. Used this @528MHz with Haykuro's version 4.5 apps to sd ROM and the osk works SO MUCH BETTER!!!! Also I got 25.6 fps on neocore... very smooth
wootroot said:
care to write up a how-to for getting the 582 consistantly and changing the idle loop?
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Click to collapse
writeup? no. it's a big process involving the android dev environment, a modified version of mkbootimg and unyaffs.
i will gladly post the kernel modifications for those who want to recompile the kernel to do so.
the bootloader sets the clock speed, and the idle loop simply clocks down to a preset and back up to whatever it was previously after x milliseconds of inactivity (not to be confused with sleep) it's kind of a poor man's cpufreq arbitrator.
so on top of tweaking the idle loop to not drop down as often, you also have to explicitly set the frequency in the kernel upon bootup, or it will bet set at what it thinks is full speed, which is 384.
A modded version of JF's ROM would ROM.
I DO notice the sluggishness and it bugs the heck out of me. (I switched from a WING with a 200MHz CPU, and although it IS faster than the wing, it doesn't seem significantly faster and seems to much slower when I open up the camera...
damnoregonian said:
writeup? no. it's a big process involving the android dev environment, a modified version of mkbootimg and unyaffs.
i will gladly post the kernel modifications for those who want to recompile the kernel to do so.
the bootloader sets the clock speed, and the idle loop simply clocks down to a preset and back up to whatever it was previously after x milliseconds of inactivity (not to be confused with sleep) it's kind of a poor man's cpufreq arbitrator.
so on top of tweaking the idle loop to not drop down as often, you also have to explicitly set the frequency in the kernel upon bootup, or it will bet set at what it thinks is full speed, which is 384.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
that involved eh?
thanks for this post though, now i understand more about the idle loop and why the cpu freq resets with each reboot
maybe someone can take this stuff further like he said, that kind of stuff would be worth the dollar, imo more than a dollar
well... i don't mind providing basic procedure and source, i just don't want to get dragged into level 1 support of the procedure.
i'll go ahead and package up some source, prebuilt boot images based on JF's RC33 (which is what i run) and a basic procedure.
Most people here probably knows that the higher the CPU clock speed is, the higher voltage the phone needs. Which means higher clock speed results to more battery consumption. This is very simple logic, and sure, in real life practice this theory is proven to be true.
One method that is usually used to gain better performance while not necessarily waste more battery is by overclocking and in the same time undervolting. Because there obviously is a certain level of voltage needed to run a certain clock speed, the normal practice is reducing the voltage level to a bare minimum level where the CPU can still run alright while raising the highest clock speed possible. Reducing the voltage too low usually leads the phone to shut off because there isn't enough voltage for the phone to run.
By following the theories above, we can conclude that to achieve the best performance while still considering battery life, adjusting the proper OC and UV level is needed. This is obviously only talking about hardware affecting tweaks.
We now know that the main factor affecting the overall performance vs battery life turns to be the clock speed itself. Now here comes the ultimate questions.
1) How does the phone handle its clockspeed?
2) Does the voltage level change according to; a) the current clock speed the phone is running at, or b) the highest clock speed set/allowed the CPU to go?
3) Does the highest clock speed set (OC) leads to necessary higher voltage, or does the voltage accostumize itself to the running CPU level?
The most logical answer to number 1 would be that the CPU changes its clock speed according to whatever is happening and needs to be done to achieve the best performance. So the clock speed will go up when there's lots of tasks, and go down again when there's little or nothing to do.
Number 2 and 3 I can't explain, but I hope after someone with enough knowledge explains how voltage level works, we can have an answer to the following case;
IF two same phones clocked differently, one at 1ghz and the other at 1.5ghz run the the same relatively simple task for a long time, will the lower clocked one noticeably save/waste more battery than the other one? Or will they consume the same amount of battery because they would most likely be running at the same clock speed (say, at 200 ~ 600)?
Hopefully we'll have a better insight about overclocking vs undervolting
silentmelodies said:
Now here comes the ultimate questions.
1) How does the phone handle its clockspeed?
2) Does the voltage level change according to; a) the current clock speed the phone is running at, or b) the highest clock speed set/allowed the CPU to go?
3) Does the highest clock speed set (OC) leads to necessary higher voltage, or does the voltage accostumize itself to the running CPU level?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I believe one would have to set each speed & undervolt up together if one scales the speed. I just run mine straight up at 1300MHz/1325mV all the time & set up profiles for screen off, charging, etc. I get wonderful speed & battery life.
Example:
1300MHz/1325mV
1200MHz/1275mV
1000MHz/1175mV
/800/MHz/1125mV
etc.
Each phone is different due to the variations in manufacturing.
The only way to really optimise your phone is to try all of the various settings and combinations of voltage/speed.
Set the phone to a given speed, stress test and try decreasing the voltage until you get crashes / errors. Then raise the voltage one level (or 2 if you are a bit paranoid) and that is the stable voltage for that speed.
Rinse and repeat for all other speeds...
Then set profiles in setcpu / pimpmycpu accordingly.
Job done.
---------- Post added at 06:09 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:08 PM ----------
countrycoyote said:
I believe one would have to set each speed & undervolt up together if one scales the speed. I just run mine straight up at 1300MHz/1325mV all the time & set up profiles for screen off, charging, etc. I get wonderful speed & battery life.
Example:
1300MHz/1325mV
1200MHz/1275mV
1000MHz/1175mV
/800/MHz/1125mV
etc.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think you could lower your voltages quite a bit - eg Mine runs at 1.4GHz at 1.2V
Ok my friend... so... having designed a circuit for a mobile phone myself, I'll try to explain quickly what's the deal (tradeoff) between frequency and voltage.
A CPU/GPU basically is made out of MOSFET's (transistors). Lots of them! They act like capacitors. They have to be turned on and off. At a certain frequency. So, basically they are capacitors being filled and emptied at a certain frequency.
In practice, a capacitor being filled and emptied at a high enough frequency can be seen as a resistor. A variable resistor in fact, as you can see (more or less) here:
http://www.electronics-tutorials.ws/filter/filter_1.html
The thing is, the higher the frequency, the lower the equivalent resistance, because the amount of current keeps getting higher and higher. If the current value gets high enough the very tracks (you can think of them as wires) from the battery to the transistors start having a considerable drop in voltage (the resistance in these wires is supposed to be very low but it's not zero!). And if you have to much voltage drop on the wires the transistors don't get enough voltage to turn on/off.
So there you have it! That's the problem with overclocking. Voltage drop at the tracks (wires) because of increased current. You may also run into heat issues
Now, trying to answer your question, even at the same clock frequency a CPU that is processing stuff will use more energy than one that isn't "doing anything", because transistors aren't really changing state. But a CPU not doing anything at a lower clock frequency will waste less energy than another one not doing anything at a higher clock frequency, because energy is required to drive the clocking circuit itself. So it's very non-linear, you get the picture I hope
LarsPT said:
Now, trying to answer your question, even at the same clock frequency a CPU that is processing stuff will use more energy than one that isn't "doing anything", because transistors aren't really changing state. But a CPU not doing anything at a lower clock frequency will waste less energy than another one not doing anything at a higher clock frequency, because energy is required to drive the clocking circuit itself. So it's very non-linear, you get the picture I hope
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Click to collapse
This. This is the answer I was looking for. Thank you for the detailed explanation!
silentmelodies said:
This. This is the answer I was looking for. Thank you for the detailed explanation!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're welcome!
Also, to complete the answer a bit more, lower voltage also helps with getting less energy consumption, because it takes more charge to "fill" a capacitor to, let's say, 1.3 V than to 1.1 V.