Related
Did you know you can enable the GPS functionality in the new-generation Pocket PC phone, the HTC Trinity (HTC P3600) with a simple, easy, free ROM upgrade? Did you know the latest ROM upgrade offers a significantly lowered boot-in time and slightly decreased (albeit still very bad) A2DP CPU usage, more wireless icons (E for Edge) and, last but not least, SDHC compatibility? If you didn’t but would certainly enjoy the advantages of the built-in GPS unit and the other goodies of the new ROM, make sure you do the following:
download the SSPL-TRIN.zip utility linked in from the first post of this thread (note that you’ll need to register yourself in the XDA-Dev forums to be able to access the file)
download the new ROM upgrade from here (Pacific users may also want to give a try to this Chinese source to see if it’s faster)
decompress both files. From the first, transfer SSPL-TRIN.exe to your PDA and execute it there, after disconnecting your Trinity from your desktop. You’ll see the standard rainbow-color bootup screen.
now, start the large RUU_Trinity_DOPODASIA_WWE_1.23.707.6_6275_1.35.00.11_108_Ship.exe file on the desktop, press the OK / Update / Yes buttons until it gets to flashing the new ROM.
It worked for everyone so far. Note that if there is “Serial” at the bottom third of the rainbow bootloader screen of the Trinity, the desktop PC won’t likely to recognize it. Then, just reset the PDA and, after booting in, just restart SSPL-TRIN.exe. You’ll need to see “USB” for the PDA to be recognized.
Warranty issues
Note that, by upgrading, you MAY lose your warranty, depending on where you've initially purchased your Trinity from. However, as you can flash back a ROM of your operator any time (assuming they DO come out with any publicly available ROM version), this isn’t really an issue most of the time.
Also note that, as SSPL-TRIN doesn’t remove the CID lock (unlike with the older and expensive IMEI-Check service), you won’t have problems with the service folks because of the lack of the CID lock. This is also a huge advantage over the IMEI-Check method.
Advantages
I’ve already listed the major advantages of the new version; most importantly, the enabled GPS functionality. Having GPS support in your phone is just unbeatable. Note that you must use the port COM9:. Also note that you may not want to run for example iGo to find the GPS port automatically because it’ll spend a LOT of time in doing so – just give it COM9: right at the beginning, and you’re all set.
As has already been pointed out, the boot-in time has been significantly reduced between the initial HTC ROM version (1.15.405.5 dated 10/23/2006) and the this one (1.23.707.6, 02/08/2007); according to my tests, it’s 39 seconds now, as opposed to the original 45 seconds. Getting better and better (albeit still can't beat the 36 seconds of the AKU3 HTC Wizard!)
I’ve also made some serious benchmarks with the new version to see whether the problematic areas (digitizer handling, A2DP CPU usage) have been fixed. Unfortunately, they aren’t – read on to see what the problem is!
Acute problems with the HTC Trinity
The excellent XDA-Developers community, lately, has been complaining about two special issues regarding the HTC Trinity, the, in my opinion, best HTC 2.8” Pocket PC right now. Having just received a Trinity myself, I’ve thoroughly scrutinized these problems.
Touchscreen CPU usage issues
(Also see this thread)
Unfortunately, it seems all 2.8” WM5 HTC QVGA Pocket PC phones are particularly sensitive to long-pressing the touchscreen. While none of the other Pocket PC models I’ve tested (HP iPAQ 2210, HP iPAQ hx4700 running WM5, Dell Axim x51v , Fujitsu-Siemens Pocket Loox 720 and the HTC Universal) exhibited any increased CPU usage while constantly keeping the stylus down on the touchscreen, both the 2.8” WM5 HTC Wizard and the HTC Trinity did. The, otherwise, almost-zero CPU usage of gwes.exe raised, on the (non-overclocked) former, to around 17% and about 36% on the latter. This is why, for example, action games like K-Rally or Skyforce (Unlimited) will become next to unplayable when, as is recommended, played with the stylus.
This issue is the same in even the latest (Dopod) Trinity ROM version and should be addressed by HTC as soon as possible. It’s hopefully a driver issue and, therefore, can be fixed in software.
(Note that, again, different HTC phone models exhibit different level of excess CPU usage because of the problem. The new, quick Trinity suffers a lot from the bug, the older, “slow” Wizard suffers a lot less, particularly when it’s overclocked (when overclocked to 240 MHz, games like K-Rally become really enjoyable with the stylus). This, however, doesn’t mean ALL “old” (TI CPU-based) HTC phones fare much better than ALL “new” (Samsung CPU-based) HTC phones – other new, Samsung-based models may behave fat better in this respect.
I really hope HTC really soon addresses this issue as it’s almost completely renders some? several? of their models almost useless for stylus-based action gaming and unnecessarily increases the power consumption.)
A2DP CPU usage issues
Unfortunately, there is another major Achilles’ heel with all Trinity ROM’s released so far: the A2DP CPU usage.
While the built-in A2DP doesn’t consume much CPU cycles in the other HTC phones I’ve tested (for example, on the HTC Wizard, even at the original 195 MHz, it hardly exceeds 30%), the Trinity is an exception. When playing music via A2DP, the CPU usage when used in the default (mono) mode is 52.5%, in stereo mode, 49.5%. (With the original ROM version, the figures were 54% and 51%, respectively – as can be seen, the new version has slightly improved upon the situation, but it’s still much worse than with most other devices.) This is another issue HTC should look into as soon as possible, because it makes the device almost useless as an A2DP player.
(A quick note: the A2DP defaults to mono in this device. If you’re familiar with the Registry and have already read my older A2DP-related articles, you will know HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\ SOFTWARE\ Microsoft\Bluetooth\ A2DP\Settings\ UseJointStereo also introduced in my article The A2DP support & sound quality & power consumption of the Microsoft and Widcomm BT stack compared; a lot of new A2DP info. With the Trinity, it’s set to 1 by default; you’ll want to change its value to 0.
If you feel unsafe about editing the Registry, you can also use the excellent, free HTweakC tool. I highly recommend it for all Trinity, Wizard and TyTN users.)
Widcomm BT stack compliance?
Unfortunately, as was the case with the original HTC Trinity ROM, neither the Dell Axim WM5 x50/x51 / HTC Wizard nor the HTC Universal Widcomm Bluetooth stacks work with the new ROM. This is very bad news: first, the Microsoft Bluetooth stack as of AKU3 has still bad sound quality with a lot of Bluetooth stereo headphones; second, the Widcomm BT stack would consume considerably less power on the Trinity (I’d say the third of that of the current MS BT stack.)
Verdict
I’m really sorry about HTC’s leaving so bad bugs in the firm- and/or software of this model – the Pocket PC I, otherwise, recommend the most of today’s Pocket PC’s. While upgrading to the new ROM version is HIGHLY recommended for most people, you still won’t be able to play fast-paced action games and should think twice before using the built-in A2DP sound transfer.
Recommended links
My older A2DP-related articles. I also recommend the two reports I’ve posted today about the news: here and here.
Thanks for your excellent work here!
I really appreciate what you do for the Trinity communitiy!
Thanks for a great summary.... nice to have it all in one post, one of my disadvantages with the Trinity is the bad performance with xvid in coreplayer, due to the ATI graphic chip...
MP3/Audio quality
I've read that some users have experienced highly degraded audio quality after upgrading to the latest test Dopod ROM. Has this final ROM corrected this issue?
psargent said:
...MP3 quality is GREATLY degraded after upgrading to the test rom. Used to be rich with plenty of bass when plugged into my car aux input when I was using HTC rom, now it sounds like I am listening through a tin can!!! Sounds like most of the lower frequencies are not being sent out of the audio output...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
prsnow said:
I've read that some users have experienced highly degraded audio quality after upgrading to the latest test Dopod ROM. Has this final ROM corrected this issue?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've only checked it through (the crappy) A2DP, not via a wired headset - I couldn't notice any sound degradaton, iot sounded equally bad than with other MS BT stack A2DP implemenations.
Are you sure about SDHC being now supported? From other reports it seems that the problem with disappearing files and folders on 4GB SDHC cards is still there.
Menneisyys said:
Did you know you can enable the GPS functionality in the new-generation Pocket PC phone, the HTC Trinity (HTC P3600) with a simple, easy, free ROM upgrade? Did you know the latest ROM upgrade offers a significantly lowered boot-in time and slightly decreased (albeit still very bad) A2DP CPU usage, more wireless icons (E for Edge) and, last but not least, SDHC compatibility? If you didn’t but would certainly enjoy the advantages of the built-in GPS unit and the other goodies of the new ROM, make sure you do the following:
download the SSPL-TRIN.zip utility linked in from the first post of this thread (note that you’ll need to register yourself in the XDA-Dev forums to be able to access the file)
download the new ROM upgrade from here (Pacific users may also want to give a try to this Chinese source to see if it’s faster)
decompress both files. From the first, transfer SSPL-TRIN.exe to your PDA and execute it there, after disconnecting your Trinity from your desktop. You’ll see the standard rainbow-color bootup screen.
now, start the large RUU_Trinity_DOPODASIA_WWE_1.23.707.6_6275_1.35.00.11_108_Ship.exe file on the desktop, press the OK / Update / Yes buttons until it gets to flashing the new ROM.
It worked for everyone so far. Note that if there is “Serial” at the bottom third of the rainbow bootloader screen of the Trinity, the desktop PC won’t likely to recognize it. Then, just reset the PDA and, after booting in, just restart SSPL-TRIN.exe. You’ll need to see “USB” for the PDA to be recognized.
Warranty issues
Note that, by upgrading, you MAY lose your warranty, depending on where you've initially purchased your Trinity from. However, as you can flash back a ROM of your operator any time (assuming they DO come out with any publicly available ROM version), this isn’t really an issue most of the time.
Also note that, as SSPL-TRIN doesn’t remove the CID lock (unlike with the older and expensive IMEI-Check service), you won’t have problems with the service folks because of the lack of the CID lock. This is also a huge advantage over the IMEI-Check method.
Advantages
I’ve already listed the major advantages of the new version; most importantly, the enabled GPS functionality. Having GPS support in your phone is just unbeatable. Note that you must use the port COM9:. Also note that you may not want to run for example iGo to find the GPS port automatically because it’ll spend a LOT of time in doing so – just give it COM9: right at the beginning, and you’re all set.
As has already been pointed out, the boot-in time has been significantly reduced between the initial HTC ROM version (1.15.405.5 dated 10/23/2006) and the this one (1.23.707.6, 02/08/2007); according to my tests, it’s 39 seconds now, as opposed to the original 45 seconds. Getting better and better (albeit still can't beat the 36 seconds of the AKU3 HTC Wizard!)
I’ve also made some serious benchmarks with the new version to see whether the problematic areas (digitizer handling, A2DP CPU usage) have been fixed. Unfortunately, they aren’t – read on to see what the problem is!
Acute problems with the HTC Trinity
The excellent XDA-Developers community, lately, has been complaining about two special issues regarding the HTC Trinity, the, in my opinion, best HTC 2.8” Pocket PC right now. Having just received a Trinity myself, I’ve thoroughly scrutinized these problems.
Touchscreen CPU usage issues
(Also see this thread)
Unfortunately, it seems all 2.8” WM5 HTC QVGA Pocket PC phones are particularly sensitive to long-pressing the touchscreen. While none of the other Pocket PC models I’ve tested (HP iPAQ 2210, HP iPAQ hx4700 running WM5, Dell Axim x51v , Fujitsu-Siemens Pocket Loox 720 and the HTC Universal) exhibited any increased CPU usage while constantly keeping the stylus down on the touchscreen, both the 2.8” WM5 HTC Wizard and the HTC Trinity did. The, otherwise, almost-zero CPU usage of gwes.exe raised, on the (non-overclocked) former, to around 17% and about 36% on the latter. This is why, for example, action games like K-Rally or Skyforce (Unlimited) will become next to unplayable when, as is recommended, played with the stylus.
This issue is the same in even the latest (Dopod) Trinity ROM version and should be addressed by HTC as soon as possible. It’s hopefully a driver issue and, therefore, can be fixed in software.
(Note that, again, different HTC phone models exhibit different level of excess CPU usage because of the problem. The new, quick Trinity suffers a lot from the bug, the older, “slow” Wizard suffers a lot less, particularly when it’s overclocked (when overclocked to 240 MHz, games like K-Rally become really enjoyable with the stylus). This, however, doesn’t mean ALL “old” (TI CPU-based) HTC phones fare much better than ALL “new” (Samsung CPU-based) HTC phones – other new, Samsung-based models may behave fat better in this respect.
I really hope HTC really soon addresses this issue as it’s almost completely renders some? several? of their models almost useless for stylus-based action gaming and unnecessarily increases the power consumption.)
A2DP CPU usage issues
Unfortunately, there is another major Achilles’ heel with all Trinity ROM’s released so far: the A2DP CPU usage.
While the built-in A2DP doesn’t consume much CPU cycles in the other HTC phones I’ve tested (for example, on the HTC Wizard, even at the original 195 MHz, it hardly exceeds 30%), the Trinity is an exception. When playing music via A2DP, the CPU usage when used in the default (mono) mode is 52.5%, in stereo mode, 49.5%. (With the original ROM version, the figures were 54% and 51%, respectively – as can be seen, the new version has slightly improved upon the situation, but it’s still much worse than with most other devices.) This is another issue HTC should look into as soon as possible, because it makes the device almost useless as an A2DP player.
(A quick note: the A2DP defaults to mono in this device. If you’re familiar with the Registry and have already read my older A2DP-related articles, you will know HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\ SOFTWARE\ Microsoft\Bluetooth\ A2DP\Settings\ UseJointStereo also introduced in my article The A2DP support & sound quality & power consumption of the Microsoft and Widcomm BT stack compared; a lot of new A2DP info. With the Trinity, it’s set to 1 by default; you’ll want to change its value to 0.
If you feel unsafe about editing the Registry, you can also use the excellent, free HTweakC tool. I highly recommend it for all Trinity, Wizard and TyTN users.)
Widcomm BT stack compliance?
Unfortunately, as was the case with the original HTC Trinity ROM, neither the Dell Axim WM5 x50/x51 / HTC Wizard nor the HTC Universal Widcomm Bluetooth stacks work with the new ROM. This is very bad news: first, the Microsoft Bluetooth stack as of AKU3 has still bad sound quality with a lot of Bluetooth stereo headphones; second, the Widcomm BT stack would consume considerably less power on the Trinity (I’d say the third of that of the current MS BT stack.)
Verdict
I’m really sorry about HTC’s leaving so bad bugs in the firm- and/or software of this model – the Pocket PC I, otherwise, recommend the most of today’s Pocket PC’s. While upgrading to the new ROM version is HIGHLY recommended for most people, you still won’t be able to play fast-paced action games and should think twice before using the built-in A2DP sound transfer.
Recommended links
My older A2DP-related articles. I also recommend the two reports I’ve posted today about the news: here and here.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I upgreaded as instructed and put the new rom. My problem is I see no GPS icon in the Systems folder or anywhere for that matter to set it to Com 9. Furthermore, when I installed Tomtom it said i have no gps on my Trinity Can you help advise where my GPS icon is
Another thing that is bugging the hell out of me is the network configuration. how can I get it rid of it completely so that everytime i soft reset, i don't get that annoying message?
Second, please advise, if I remove My Connect, does it make a difference to the device? I live in Canada and do not own a dopod but a HTC unbranded Trinity instead.
Third, What is the CAM program. What does it do?
Many thanks for any help you can offer and best regards,
Gilbert
Gilbert said:
I upgreaded as instructed and put the new rom. My problem is I see no GPS icon in the Systems folder or anywhere for that matter to set it to Com 9. Furthermore, when I installed Tomtom it said i have no gps on my Trinity Can you help advise where my GPS icon is
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hold - one thing at a time
1) Once you have upgraded the ROM you have to configure TomTom to use the internal GPS, so start TomTom, go to "Change Preferences", go to "Show GPS Status" , then "Configure" to choose your new GPS. Select "Other NMEA GPS Receiver", baud rate = 115200, "GPS on COM9".
2) You will not see any "GPS setting" anywhere unless you hack the Windows Registry. You need a registry editor to do that. Go in HKLM->ControlPanel->GPS Settings: get rid of any DWORD there and make sure to add a new DWORD with the following values: "Group"/0x02. Once done SoftReset and you will have your GPS icon into Settings->Connections.
3) BTW, if you do that registry hack you will be able to map the GPS to other COM ports as well.
Hope this will help!
Anubis
anonimo said:
Are you sure about SDHC being now supported? From other reports it seems that the problem with disappearing files and folders on 4GB SDHC cards is still there.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes; unfortunately my 4GB Transcend SDHC card still behaves in this way with the new rom.
Anubis1965 said:
Hold - one thing at a time
1) Once you have upgraded the ROM you have to configure TomTom to use the internal GPS, so start TomTom, go to "Change Preferences", go to "Show GPS Status" , then "Configure" to choose your new GPS. Select "Other NMEA GPS Receiver", baud rate = 115200, "GPS on COM9".
2) You will not see any "GPS setting" anywhere unless you hack the Windows Registry. You need a registry editor to do that. Go in HKLM->ControlPanel->GPS Settings: get rid of any DWORD there and make sure to add a new DWORD with the following values: "Group"/0x02. Once done SoftReset and you will have your GPS icon into Settings->Connections.
3) BTW, if you do that registry hack you will be able to map the GPS to other COM ports as well.
Hope this will help!
Anubis
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I got:
GPS program port: COM9
GPS hardware port: COM6 (randomly chosen) with Baud rate 115200 (what does Baud rate mean?)
Access: automatically
In TomTom I use COM9, but when I switch the program with the hardware port, TomTom tells me that the GPS still has port COM9.. weird.
Anyways, is this correct? Thanks in advance!
BTW: this goes a looot quicker if you choose the other NMEA GPS Receiver than if you use "other external bluetooth" thanks!
BTW2: you can use "http://www2r.biglobe.ne.jp/~tascal/download/pocketpc/tre_e.htm to edit the register.
Thanks Menneisyys for the summary.
Regarding the cpu consumption I am not so sure everything is HTC related.
can you give me a device which is performing very well with this samsung cpu?
it is fast: 400 Mhz. ok, on paper. but in real life it needs a lot of cycles to do things...
40% if you press the screen.
85% for 320*240 simple divX with tcpmp (more than the OMAP 200 from Wizard)
55% to encode A2DP stream.
and it gets on and on, and does not improve with new ROMs.
I start to wonder why nobody is blaming samsung there. Is there proof somewhere of its effectiveness?
I have HTC-P3600 purchased in US. So far I have no problem using Cingular service and I like the phone.
But why I am posting. I want to update to the latest ROM with the GPS activated.
When I run SSPL-TRIN I get only "SERIAL" in third line.
I have tried three times and same result. I there a something else I need to change to get "USB" activated.
Thanks in advance Peter Simek
psimek said:
I have HTC-P3600 purchased in US. So far I have no problem using Cingular service and I like the phone.
But why I am posting. I want to update to the latest ROM with the GPS activated.
When I run SSPL-TRIN I get only "SERIAL" in third line.
I have tried three times and same result. I there a something else I need to change to get "USB" activated.
Thanks in advance Peter Simek
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You have to have it connected to USB when you run SSPL-TRIN.exe.
mdacfan said:
@chenchon
my way:
1. extract RUU_Trinity_DOPODASIA_WWE_1.23.707.6_6275_1.35.00. 11_108_Ship.exe with WinRAR to XP PC (NewFolder)
2. connect phone to windows XP PC (activesync status green)
3. copy the SSPL-trin to the device ie. \temp (memory) - not storage card
4. run the SSPL-trin (Trinity Display must then show "USB" at the bottom) - wait until XP detects a new USB device
5. run from the extracted file on XP PC (NewFolder) the file "ROMUpdateUtility.exe"
6. Pass all Upgrade questions and wait about 10 Minutes to finish the upgrade from 0% to 100%
7. Softreset Trinity after the successfull upgrade
No SuperCID required if you use SSPL !!
good luck,
Gerhard
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Worked well for me.
Tomtom 6.03 freeze
hi,
does anyone with tomtom 6.03 as any problem of freezing while u r navigating?
i think the problem was when i selected the gps in tomtom config... i selected "use own gps" (the built in gps) but now i choosed another cable gps nmea on com9 and with 115200. Tomorrow i'll feedback
another experiences with tomtom 6.03 are welcome.
best regards,
aprt
Lost Voice Dialing
Hi All,
I have done the ROM upgrade, but seem to have lost voice dialing. Is this something available only on the original HTC ROM? Can I download this seperately?
Thanks
Small Problem
I have updated both the test and final rom,I have noticed a strange problem. As I am using a third party keyboard because of the arabic language i can not switch the keyboard to any installed one rather than the preinstalled SIPs.
I tried two different arabic software plus Resco keyboard all the same. som times it works and many other times it does not.
Any Idea?
I started noticing problems too.
When I soft reset, Pocket Informant always start automatically and hangs the phone.
Before that, the Network guide started and hung, every reboot, so that I had to hard reset.
It works for about one hour, regardless of which programs I install.
GPS works though..
NOT Blaming Samsung
meroupow said:
Thanks Menneisyys for the summary.
Regarding the cpu consumption I am not so sure everything is HTC related.
can you give me a device which is performing very well with this samsung cpu?
it is fast: 400 Mhz. ok, on paper. but in real life it needs a lot of cycles to do things...
40% if you press the screen.
85% for 320*240 simple divX with tcpmp (more than the OMAP 200 from Wizard)
55% to encode A2DP stream.
and it gets on and on, and does not improve with new ROMs.
I start to wonder why nobody is blaming samsung there. Is there proof somewhere of its effectiveness?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In the case of TCPMP it is not anything todo with solely the Samsung chip itself but more todo with the Imageon Chip being not properly utilised in the ROMS and also TCPMP not being able to make use of the Imageon with the Samsung/ATI combo.
I did a small test once where I had one video that didn't cause screen flicker with the Imageon being used in TCPMP and I got a MASSIVE improvement - posted the benchmark results in another post I will look for them.
The A2DP Stream in my opinion is more todo with the Bluetooth Stack i.e if it were WIDCOMM then we woudn't have these problems.
As for the screen press I am hoping it is down to the Samsung Chip and ROM combination as a pose to just the chip being flawed.
And yes they should put more effort in tweaking these flaws and provide fixes for software and ROMS faster - but these are money making corporations that like to take shortcuts.
The joys of early adoption!
Hello,
Everyone seems to talk about 115200 baud but in Tomtom the highest you get is 57k+ for baud speed. I read once that it should remain on 9600 baud to work well. Where do you all see the 115200 baud? is it through the hack of the registry to enable the GPS icon? Hope someone can help me here.
Best regards,
Gilbert
I have flashed my unlocked Vodafone 750v used on AT&T in US several times to
1.15-VFE
firmware 1.52.3.00
How do I flash to a more stable radio ROM?
I have such bad reception after about 3 months of an otherwise initially very stable ROM, that the phone part is barely usable now. My present ROM otherwise stable with no need for resets, but I have noticed the phoen reception gets worse with time, has anyone else noticed?
I am almost ready to give up on the Treo 750 if I can find a comparable device with threaded SMS & HSDPA
Read post 3 of http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=368131
and http://wiki.xda-developers.com/index.php?pagename=Hermes_ExtractedRadioRoms
Changing your radio will NOT fix broken SIM cards, WiFi problems, Bluetooth issues or external GPS problems, Nor will it magic up a signal from nowhere if you live in a poor coverage area It may however resolve some network connectivity issues or help improve data speeds.
Having the latest release does NOT necessarily mean it is the best ROM for your network or country. In extreme cases a later radio may introduce more issues than it fixes so treat all upgrades with caution.
It is (in extreme cases) possible for the radio firmware to kill actual radio hardware if something is badly wrong or a radio firmware is buggy. This is rarely seen but is potentially a real risk.
Any update that drives the hardware "harder" in order to increase the gain of both the transmit element and recieve pre-amp element in any radio module is usually at the expense of the lifespan of the radio device. To put it simply, high output devices tend to have shorter lives than low output devices.
Problems with the device emitting more heat than usual, shorter battery life, long drop out periods where the device looks for a network or other "odd" intermittent radio issues can be a warning that something may not be right.
Recently the battery consumption of popular radio stack versions have been tested and compared. See this thread for more details.
Finally - always experiment cautiously, be aware of the risks and minimise them and read other peoples experiences on the forums before just taking the latest image and flashing it (i.e cross reference posts, see where posters are reporting from and take some proper time to do some research BEFORE considering flashing a new image - this way you are less likely to encounter problems and should have a good idea of how an upgrade will perform before exposing your device to any risk).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
fatality88 said:
Read post 3 of http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=368131
and http://wiki.xda-developers.com/index.php?pagename=Hermes_ExtractedRadioRoms
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks fatality, that looks like a Hermes radio ROM, does it work on the Treo 750?
10 charcaters
Yeah, Use the KaiserCustomRUU utility - http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=334890
Place one of the Hermes roms (.nbh) files in the same folder and execute and follow instructions
Hermes and Treo use the same chipset and the Hermes ones I have tried (3 or 4 of the latest) have worked fine
You will need to hardSPL your device though - http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=334100
Some roms will work differently and you should be able to find one suitable for your carrier/data/battery needs...
ps. i of course hold nothing resonsible but i have got into no trouble myself...
I had bought a stock ATT tilt, and had since followed the well written directions and have successfully flashed a different rom onto it using the
"Ruu_Signed_Duttys_WM6.1_5.2.19700_Hybrid V2_1_65.14.06[CubeV2]"
Problem being, after installing it, I cannot get the video recorder out of the camera to successfully encode .mp4, or .3gp. It encodes the audio fine though, so the audio stream isn't broken, but somewhere along the way the video stream is corrupted.
I've done the best I can with my computer background, but I think this boils down to some easy simple solution, that I just can't fathom without the prior expertise.
Long story short, How do I trouble shoot this? Is there a registry location that I can assign a different mp4 & 3gp encoder, or did I corrupt the install, and have to nuke, and try again?
no expert in the field either, but maybe try a different radio version
The radio just covers the broadcast from the phone to the cell tower.
This is an encoding problem from the camera to the file. Somehow the driver/codec/whatever that is encased in the camera executable is improperly encoding the video stream.
Kaze0110 said:
The radio just covers the broadcast from the phone to the cell tower.
This is an encoding problem from the camera to the file. Somehow the driver/codec/whatever that is encased in the camera executable is improperly encoding the video stream.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The radio does not only cover the phone transmission. The Camera, GPS, and several aspects of the phone are controlled by the radio ROM.
That being said, how long ago did you purchase your Tilt? There is another thread on here that discusses certain newer ROMs and their incompatibility with the camera on newer "7201" Tilts.
Go to Start -> Settings -> Device Information -> Hardware and see if you CPU is listed as Qualcomm 7200 or 7201.
I had purchased this tilt approximately 1 month ago, and the processor lists it as a "qualcomm 7200".
Could you possibly recommend me to a rom which I should flash into it?
Well I just upgraded the radio rom to the one listed in your sig I believe it was called "neon".
So my Radio version just went from 1.65.14.06 --> 1.58.25.17.
No change. So I suppose I'll upgrade the complete rom to the one specified in your signature, and we'll see how this goes.
Here is the thread about the camera issues. I would check this out for any possible solutions.
I am running Dutty's newest Diamond build, and was just recently running on shogunmark's Death v3.5 ROM. Both of these work without any camera issues.
On second thought, I seem to remember one of the newer cooked ROMs actually causing the CPU to show as a 7500 (which is the model with 3D acceleration), even though we know for a fact that the phone actually has a 7200 CPU.
If you continue to have issues after checking out the above thread, I would flash back to your ship ROM and see if the CPU still shows as a 7200.
Well I'd already swapped over to [June 02] L26_Kaiser_Diamond_V5 (Hybrid 3.29.707) (http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=396882)
And now the processor indicates it as a 7201, and the camera works fine.
So all seems well I suppose, just an incompatibility issue that was never addressed.
Ahh well, all seems fine enough for now at least.
Good to see you got it solved.
Yes I have searched before you ask.....
I have installed the stock official Radio ROM (1.65.16.25) as well as the later1.65.24.36 version and now the 1.71.09.01 version that has recently been posted, all of which seem to be very similar for GSM performance.
Now I am not convinced any of them actually do anything to the GPS receiver. I have had really quick GPS fixes with all of the Radios installed and I have also had really slow fixes. There doesn't seem to be any real consistency so I am not convinced upgrading the Radio ROM does anything with the GPS, I am sure it does with GSM, GPRS, 3G & HSDPA.
Does anyone have any technical knowledge as to what actually gets upgraded with the Radio ROM and which systems does it affect (i.e. Bluetooth, GPS etc)? Not just observations and perception?
Andy
I can't guarantee whether viper is right or not, but I've read all 10 of his posts and he seems to know his stuff.
Here is his take on this: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=2412197&postcount=39
However,
I have seem many people claim great GPS performance with new radios, especially the NIKI ones.
I don't use GPS that often to make my own guess.
Thanks
Dave
DaveShaw said:
I can't guarantee whether viper is right or not, but I've read all 10 of his posts and he seems to know his stuff.
Here is his take on this: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=2412197&postcount=39
However,
I have seem many people claim great GPS performance with new radios, especially the NIKI ones.
I don't use GPS that often to make my own guess.
Thanks
Dave
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its funny but... I can say the same thing:
For me - technicaly radio shouldn't affect camera but it does thats the trick.
DaveShaw said:
I can't guarantee whether viper is right or not, but I've read all 10 of his posts and he seems to know his stuff.
Here is his take on this: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=2412197&postcount=39
However,
I have seem many people claim great GPS performance with new radios, especially the NIKI ones.
I don't use GPS that often to make my own guess.
Thanks
Dave
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Cheers Dave I hadn't seen that post by viper. To be honest that was the conclusion I was coming to. I am pretty sure the differences in GPS fix times is just peoples perception and atmospheric conditions at the time.
Andy
DaveShaw said:
I can't guarantee whether viper is right or not, but I've read all 10 of his posts and he seems to know his stuff.
Here is his take on this: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=2412197&postcount=39
However,
I have seem many people claim great GPS performance with new radios, especially the NIKI ones.
I don't use GPS that often to make my own guess.
Thanks
Dave
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
After trying multiple radios I can say that radio definitely DOES somehow affect the GPS. How can be the different results from different radios explained then? How can I get the GPS fix with one radio in ~5 minutes and with another in ~15 seconds?
Strangely I have two Kaisers, at the moment both have identical everything and side by side the GPS fixes can vary greatly and it's not like one is always quicker than the other.
With regards to the camera being affected by the GPS? Again I think this is down to peoples warped perception.....
Andy
ADB100 said:
Strangely I have two Kaisers, at the moment both have identical everything and side by side the GPS fixes can vary greatly and it's not like one is always quicker than the other.
With regards to the camera being affected by the GPS? Again I think this is down to peoples warped perception.....
Andy
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Back in the early kaiser days, if you had the wrong radio you had no sound and camera problems. (See the title of this thread: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=349375)
Thanks
Dave
DaveShaw said:
Back in the early kaiser days, if you had the wrong radio you had no sound and camera problems. (See the title of this thread: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=349375)
Thanks
Dave
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes Dave, I have previously read that thread, however I think the move from WM6 to WM6.1 required more fundamental changes - maybe memory locations affecting why the Radio ROM had to be a certain revision or later.
What got me onto this was all the replies about GPS (& camera) performance increases due to a new Radio ROM. With my experience I have simply not seen the monumental (as reported by some people) performance improvements (fix times) when I upgraded the Radio ROM
As I said I have two Kaisers side by side here, both with identical everything and the GPS fix times varies considerably between the two.
Andy
Interesting question - I was one of those who noticed real problems with my GPS after the original HTC update to 6.1, and had really poor performance for weeks. I then upgraded my radio to the new version HTC released as part of a revised version of the same ROM update (going from 1.65.16.25 to 1.65.17.56) and immediately noticed a definite improvement.
My GPS still isn't perfect, sometimes it takes a minute or so longer than I'd like to get a fix, but I can say that in the exact same situations, and over a few weeks testing with both versions, installing the newer radio definitely improved matters for me and achieved consistently better results. Of course there could be various other explanations, like the actual process of flashing a new radio somehow resetting/improving some unknown factor, but either way there's no doubt in my mind that the GPS is now more robust and reliable than it was previously, and the radio update really is the only variable in my case.
I know many may suspect some placebo effect, but for the record I did try a whole range of other supposed "cures" like running GPS Test, changing TomTom settings, hard resetting, flashing a different SPL etc etc, without imagining any improvement afterwards.
Sadly True
I have been flashing daily for 3 weeks now, sometimes multiple times daily, while on vacation to get the most reliable GPS signal for driving and I cannot upgrade to 6.1 roms because of the greatly slower fix times. I have tried ALL the newer radios, SPL's, fixes and tweaks, and the 1.27.XX radios still get the quickest fix and have the strongest reception. I have tried daily resets and gps cold fixes quite often to get an average time and heres my results. Newer 6.1 radios cold fix (first fix after hard-reset) around 3-5 minutes and older 6.0 radios cold fix around 2-3 minutes. Yes there were some short times and some longer times but that is the average of testing daily after flashing repeatedly. The difference is most noticeable when I use GPS Tool because it shows more details on the strength of the signal. The older 1.27.XX radio just seem to see more satellites right off the bat and the newer radios take 60-90 seconds before even seeing a single satellite. I am glad people are finally recognizing this as an important issue because I upgraded to this phone primarily for the internal GPS. Now that the kaiser driver problem is winding down maybe some great minds can work on this problem also.
To right radios affect GPS performance
myteematt said:
I cannot upgrade to 6.1 roms because of the greatly slower fix times. I have tried ALL the newer radios, SPL's, fixes and tweaks, and the 1.27.XX radios still get the quickest fix and have the strongest reception.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's true in this case about the oldies being goodies - I agree the GPS with WM 6.0 and those 1.27 series radios was ahem... miles better.
Why do I suspect that the 1.27 series Radios for WM 6.0 were provided to HTC by Qualcomm but they had to actually come up with their own for WM 6.1 - I may be wrong, it's just a hunch.
Now that the kaiser driver problem is winding down maybe some great minds can work on this problem also.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The interesting thing is that (I remember reading somewhere) aspects of GFX Acceleration can/could be coded into these MSM 7200 Radios so with both that and a once and for all GPS cure, the opportunities are immense for someone who knows what they're doing with Radio programming and development. Thats one reason why I was glad to see viperbjk has appeared here. There's no doubt about it as far as I can tell that Radios affect GPS performance and the proof of the pudding is in the eating.
This is guess work, without that much understanding as to the way the device performs GPS operations (or any other low level machine operations), so feel free to shoot me down...
Could the Radio "operate" at different speeds, i.e. the 1.27 radios process instructions/operations much faster than the latest 6.1 ones?
Could parts of the radio be indirectly used when performing a GPS fix?
If so this would mean operations performed during GPS by the radio, slow down actual GPS operations?
Just an idea
Dave
We might be veering slightly out of focus here - because of course, if you compare 6.0 ROMs (and radios) with 6.1 ROMs (and radios) then there's a huge number of not necessarily radio-related factors that come into the mix, not least 6.1 itself, and HTC's implementation of it.
Notwithstanding the fact that it's impossible to use 1.27 radios with 6.1 and vice versa, it could easily be argued that a 1.27 radio would not improve GPS performance on a 6.1 ROM, and that a 1.65 radio would provide excellent GPS on a 6.0 ROM - it simply can't be proved either way.
What can be said, is that when I changed the radio - and only the radio - on the same 6.1 ROM, I found the GPS performance had improved. Not so much that it equalled 6.0 performance, but a significant improvement in any case, and enough to prove to me that (in answer to the topic) the radio ROM definitely does affect the GPS.
GPS Speed
Not sure if radio effect gps but I loaded the D3D driver and these did slow gps lock down by a lot, removed driver and gps lock went back to being instant.
Hope this help.
A no other variable example
Boinng said:
We might be veering slightly out of focus here - because of course, if you compare 6.0 ROMs (and radios) with 6.1 ROMs (and radios) then there's a huge number of not necessarily radio-related factors that come into the mix, not least 6.1 itself, and HTC's implementation of it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes you are right that this example isn't a very strong case because there are lots of other variables. Just like you though I made that Radio only upgrade from HTCs initial WM 6.1 release to their latest one with only a different radio and noticed the difference straight away. For those who doubt the effect of the Radio on GPS performance, If everything else is the same (and the ROM itself is the same) what else could explain the difference in performance under the same sorts of daily use in similar weather and locations? It's crystal clear to me.
Well, for me, it isn't crystal clear
First of all, I do not know much about HTC so far, I just learned to understand what's going on. But regarding the radio, there is no difference in what I've seen so far.
Ok .... some technical explanations :
1. Radio CAN affect GPS reception as far as AGPS is involved.
2. Radio does NOT affect the way GPS is recieved.
Why ?
AGPS (MSM Chipset) can be used for getting
a) position fixes via mobile towers
b) recieve GPS fixation database via GPRS/EDGE etc.
This can speed up first GPS reception lock a lot.
But the radio does not affect the reception of the GPS reciever (chipset by infineon or surf I suppose).
GPS is normally controlled by WM driver. It could be controlled by AMSS (radio) but that is VERY unlikely because changes always have to be resigned (takes a lot of time) and gps-drivers would have to be reprogrammed for MSM chipset (very unlikely).
It will take a deeper research to be sure.
Comparing the same condition parameters isn't precise enough.
To be sure that radio driver affects GPS reception, you would have to disable radio by itself, especially AGPS.
Conclusion :
Radio can speed up updating fixation database using AGPS.
Radio can also offer faster positioning than GPS using AGPS, although not as accurate.
But as long as a surf/infineon gps chipset is used, there is no way radio speeds up or influences GPS reception in any way
Hope this answers some questions.
Cya,
Viper BJK
It's a Qualcomm chip that drives the GPS. And who knows what a Radio does, what underlying functionality it facilitates. At this piont, I take it you were just guessing, viper?
Good guesses as anyone I guess, just wanted to correct you on the GPS. I wish it were a SirfStar III chip.
viperbjk said:
But as long as a surf/infineon gps chipset is used, there is no way radio speeds up or influences GPS reception in any way
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It isn't. The GPS baseband processing takes place in the main Qualcomm chip as shown by their product sheet. So to me it seems logical that the low level GPS processing code would be part of the radio firmware, therefore explaining the performance changes as they mess up with the code and possibly change their algorithms or simply the priority of the tasks the radio chip has to execute. Might be a power consumption issue too, as at least under the WM6 radios the current draw from the GPS is really significant, much higher than a usual dedicated (SiRF, MTK,...) chipset. Maybe they changed the SW under 6.1 to draw less power, leading to lower performance...
Also, as AGPS often messes up things (many people not being able to use the GPS anymore with it on), I'm pretty sure that all the users who reported different performance had it off anyway.
It could be controlled by AMSS (radio) but that is VERY unlikely because changes always have to be resigned (takes a lot of time) and gps-drivers would have to be reprogrammed for MSM chipset (very unlikely).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
To me the GPS code is as said in the radio firmware, and the actual HW drivers (given by Qualcomm) are compiled in it as well. Then, the GPS is presented to WM as a simple COM port i.e transparently so no particular driver is needed for WM itself. So the only part that would change when a change of behavior is required would be.. the radio firmware, confirming users' experiences.
Personally I still run WM6, and always get between 15 and 30sec fix times.
Small update :
For best evaluation of Sirf chipsets, I recommend
http://w5.nuinternet.com/s660100031/SirfTech.htm
I'll see if I can find anything similiar for Infineon chipsets.
Learning curve
viperbjk said:
Well, for me, it isn't crystal clear
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Don't get me wrong, other programming aspects about this aren't clear to me, just the fact that the Radio includes driver code for the GPS and has a direct effect on GPS performance. As already mentioned by others the GPS hardware is within the Qualcomm chipset and is not provided by separate hardware.
First of all, I do not know much about HTC so far, I just learned to understand what's going on. But regarding the radio, there is no difference in what I've seen so far.
Ok .... some technical explanations :
1. Radio CAN affect GPS reception as far as AGPS is involved.
2. Radio does NOT affect the way GPS is recieved.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As I've never used AGPS (the native HTC ROMS without additional tweaking software have this turned off by default), I have no experience to report in this regard. I'm unsure what 2. actually means. I'm sure the statement "Radio does NOT affect GPS reception" would be incorrect though as in my experience radio changes alone can make big differences to how Tomtom and Google Maps behave. If the radio has different priorities or reduces the current/power available for GPS reception then it seems clear to me that this will alter the strength of GPS reception although maybe not the 'way it's received'. I see reducing the current available for the GPS hardware as a bit like reducing the diameter of a cars fuel line - it may end up being counterproductive. As long as the programming code results in efficient execution of GPS functioning, I'm happy for it to get all the power it needs. It's only if power is used to compensate for inefficient execution of GPS functioning that I'd have reservations about power consumption.
Why ?
AGPS (MSM Chipset) can be used for getting
a) position fixes via mobile towers
b) recieve GPS fixation database via GPRS/EDGE etc.
This can speed up first GPS reception lock a lot.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
First GPS lock times were fine with my TyTN II in its original form and that didn't use AGPS. I'd be quite happy just to restore that level of performance again without relying on AGPS at all. I have started my TyTN IIs GPS up in some far flung locations where there was no phone reception at all and under WM 6.0, even then I had cold lock times of about 25 seconds as long as there was a clear view of the sky.
But the radio does not affect the reception of the GPS reciever (chipset by infineon or surf I suppose).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Maybe not when the GPS reception is dealt with by separate hardware but the TyTN IIs GPS is integrated into its MSM 720x chipset. Regarding your latest post, I doubt GPS functionality is part of the ATI Imageon type functionality in the MSM720x chipset, it'll be separate areas of the silicon that handle this (I presume thats what you're referring to with reference to infineon).
I look forward to what you may accomplish viperbjk when you become familiar with this hardware. The opportunities for someone who understands these chipsets and associated radio programming inside and out are huge.
I have an x1i running windows mobile 6.5 Energy rom (build 2308.1.5.30)
and it contains radio 1.14.25.55.
I bought it this way, but the problem is that the GPS sensor does not work. I have tried the usual programs to activate it, but no signal whatsoever in any of the programs (Chart CrossGPS test, GPS scanner, GPS reset, HTC GPSTool). Is the ROM or radio incompatible with the GPS hardware? Or is there a way to test if the hardware itself is not working.
I like the phone a lot (now), even though I am a Mac person. Flashing a new ROM would be a big deal with a Mac. Plus I have set up the phone very nicely now. Hoping for an easy way out. GPS is not a huge deal for me but it keeps nagging.
check control panel setting: let windows managed automatically enable
check registry: \HKLM\System\CurrentControlSet\GPS Intermediate Driver\
isenable : 1.
check if using gpsmod driver : com4 enable.
hope thats help.
In the external GPS control panel, I enable the Manage GPS automatically
Also the settings on the registry is as you recommended
I do not have gpsmod.
so far no luck
You can flash a new radio and will be able to keep your settings, contacts, messages, etc. If you have trouble flashing with a Mac, you can easily flash via SD.
Try out the different radios available here in XDA. I went from 1.14 to 1.16 a year ago, got a HUGE boost in reception and battery life, but had to flash to the unofficial 1.17 since GPS did not work in 1.16 for me.
Thanks, I will try this.
Tried the radio 1.17. Flashing is indeed straightforward via SD card. Unfortunately the GPS did not work. I then changed the whole system by flashing the 826x series rom, as recommended here recently in the Q and A section. Great ROM, even better than the one I used. Still no GPS, so I concluded that it is a hardware issue. Then used an external GPS and finally got it to work after changing some registry data, because the 'external gps' settings on the phone would not save a com port for the external device, as others had also experienced. Used the two links below and finally deduced a solution from that as written below the links. (I could not use the exact solution from the link, since the registry item referring to the external device was named differently) Freedom Keychain GPS 2000 is the external device I use, really cheap (19 euro) and lasts up to 10 hours and is really small (considering the battery use of X1 not a bad solution).
the links:
sorry as new user I am not allowed to post the links
the changes in the registry:
1. [HKLM\System\CurrentControlSet\GPS Intermediate Driver\Drivers]
"CurrentDriver"=" GPSOnePort
2. [HKLM\System\CurrentControlSet\GPS Intermediate Driver\Drivers\GPSOnePort]
"CommPort"="COMX:" where X = the hardware COM port (for me COM0)
"InterfaceType"="COMM"