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I recently got a free year-long subscription of BusinessWeek and read the June 29th issue. I found this humorous, but pathetic article by a well-distinguished BusinessWeek journalist near the end of the issue:
http://www.businessweek.com/technology/content/jun2009/tc20090617_040512.htm
Did this guy ever laid eyes upon a Windows Mobile phone in the past 2 years? I doubt it. Every feature he mentioned is available on Windows Mobile but he dismisses it as looking "lame". It's almost like he's working for Apple the way he specifically outlines the features of the new iphone. I do see some mildly pro-mac, pro-apple articles in some publications, but this is just a joke, even for an opinion article. The least he could have done was mention the Touch Pro 2, or the new Omnia, with its large AMOLED screen and over double the resolution.
I might have the wrong reaction to this, but I think it's worth mentioning. What does the XDA community think of the article? Just another Apple fanboy, or an uninformed simpleton?
The biggest thing about the iPhone is it's interface/applications. Love it or hate it, the iPhone has a lot of great and useful applications, while Windows Mobile doesn't. Android (and WebOS soon) also have a lot of great and useful applications. Most, if not all, non HTC or Samsung or manufacturer applications look very old and perform slow. It's a sad, but true, fact.
And those who are like "why don't you just switch to the iPhone then, hater!", well, I like Windows Mobile for the customization. I like being able to change my interface every few weeks. With the upcoming HTC Hero, I might be switching to Android, though. It will be nice to have an OS that actually works right... Windows Mobile simply is slow, and it's RAM management is HELL.
derekwilkinson said:
The biggest thing about the iPhone is it's interface/applications. Love it or hate it, the iPhone has a lot of great and useful applications, while Windows Mobile doesn't. Android (and WebOS soon) also have a lot of great and useful applications. Most, if not all, non HTC or Samsung or manufacturer applications look very old and perform slow. It's a sad, but true, fact.
And those who are like "why don't you just switch to the iPhone then, hater!", well, I like Windows Mobile for the customization. I like being able to change my interface every few weeks. With the upcoming HTC Hero, I might be switching to Android, though. It will be nice to have an OS that actually works right... Windows Mobile simply is slow, and it's RAM management is HELL.
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All of that about the iphone is true, but not at all my point I was trying to make. The article mentioned features that were all available on Windows Mobile. It would have been OK with me if he said what you said, and that the interface, and certain applications (such as the large amount of simple, graphics-intensive games) are an advantage for the iphone. But he simply outlined features that an Apple spokesman would say at a newsconference promoting their product.
Also, I don't know what phone you are using, but my Fuze, which uses WM isn't slow at all in every basic use! The only thing I found slow was older applications that were made for xscale devices. Other than that I've ran over 9 applications at once, even music and youtube at once.
this article seems to be more biased than anything else. To me it simply sounds like another consumer who is very infatuated with the new phone. As the OP has said, nearly everything they offered was pretty much catching up to the other OS' and they did not "optimize" it as people claim it to be.
the thing that really caught my eye with the new iphone OS3 is the ability to edit on the fly, but then again, it is simply a cute toy for amateurs to post a huge range of amatuer videos to completely idiotic simpleminded videos of someone doing something stupid.
by the end of the article, it felt like a sales pitch.
I just read two similar postings to this, but I felt like I needed to give my opinions anyways. It's not exactly the same anyways.
Nexus One was Google's grand experiment. Some have considered it a failure due to sales numbers, some a success due to lack of marketing, some have lots to say about changing distribution channels, and the plusses and negatives.
But we are the test subjects here. And I'll tell you, coming from WinMo and a TP2, I was at first surprised and happy with my decision to impulse buy an experiment on a new OS. Speed, just-worksness, etc. My only negative was missing Sense. And then Modaco ported the Desire ROM, which I have to say isn't perfect but is 10x more stable than my old TP2 roms. I loved my phone.
However... being a test subject has worn on me. One: the first loved then panned screen, which I've heard everything from inferior coloring to last generation hardware on multitouch, none of which has bothered me, to the infuriating reception, which I have definitely been party to. Worst of all is the world class hardware HTC made to match the Iphone's style... matches it's weakness. I'm on my third N1. One broken digitizer, one broken LCD. Third one no problems so far. The LCD ridiculously while in my pocket.
And finally, the development community. One guy posted about the lack of comparitive stuff he could add from rooting. Any smartphone can add tethering. Porting Sense completed the phone for me, as I missed my smart dialing and weather clock. He got flamed for being demanding of devs, which I can understand on a dev community board... but I agree. The N1 was supposed to be the XDA's dream phone. Fastest updates, superior hardware... you could do anything with this phone. So we have a modified stock rom with additional features and RAM, Apps2SD, and ported Sense. Modaco is off for two weeks, and actually was hammering releases out daily for a while. But on my inferior TP2 they ported HD2 Roms, non HTC Roms, every new feature on any winmo phone... xda did that. They ported Android and convinced me to buy the n1! I am in no way complain about devs. Especially Cyanogen, Modaco, and that guy who has ported both Motoblur and Espresso and is now working on X10 Rom. I patiently await what they do. But all in all, developer response to N1 has been slow coming it would seem.
So to end my giant book post: how do you feel as an n1 user about your experience? The first legit google experience? I am not won over like an iphone fanboy. I am very dissappointed in customer service, and some hardware stuff. But overall I'm happy I made the Android jump. My only conclusion is that my next phone will not be from google dot come slash phone. It will be carrier branded. Rooting means I'll get updates fast anyways, and sales will be so much higher I expect that development will be more active. How do you all feel?
What exactly do you want to be developed? Do you want us Android users to port the lackluster Windows Mobile over to our devices? Is this what you expect?
MOTO Blur can't be correctly ported because of key mapping, and even so the resolution would be off without any current Android devices having MOTO Blur on a big screen, same goes for Espresso. X10 is in the making, as it also has button matching issues. Which are now being figured out.
You seem to be an intelligent person, someone who is smart enough to notice that this phone has been out for less that 4 months - which obviously means there is much to be left discovered. Your post, and this thread, are both pathetic. You act as if developing takes a small flick of the wrist, and as if the developers are not actually "trying" or pushing out more things that tickle your fancy fast enough - exactly what are you expecting? Also, please note that Windows has the ability to boot both Linux and itself, which im sure is a little relevant.
Why don't you wait a little while and see how things play out before making these little rant threads that are not needed..
What else do u want to do that hasn't been done or worked on?
Sent from my Nexus One using the XDA mobile application powered by Tapatalk
I love my Nexus one.
If you buy a phone for what MIGHT come, you've bought the wrong phone.
[QUOTE=trevorwhopkins;6187241 I am very dissappointed in customer service, and some hardware stuffl?[/QUOTE
You had to know you'd be flamed for your thoughts (although all valid opinions), but I can't see how you point out customer service as an issue when you're on your third (I assume free replacement) N1.
Regarding the community and development: I think this time around the community and devs knew what was needed based on prior android custom roms. Things like tethering, multitouch, rotating homescreen, launncher with an extra column, A2SD etc. were all released within a very reasonable timeframe. Then there were things like custom notification colors which didn't take much time to come out, either.
The phone is not perfect, and 99% of my frustrations seem to he simply a design flaw (aka hardware issue) where the normal/comfortable position to hold it creates a false/unintended pressz of the touchscreen resulting in random presses - which many blame software on while never realizing they simply need to adjust how they hold the phone. I learned to adjust, which I think everyone has to do for every phone (learn its quirks and adjust accordingly).
Disappointed? Not at all...overpriced? Maybe...glad I'm still the only one I know who has it? Hell yeah!
Fair post but good luck suggesting to many people at xda that their phone isn't the be-all end-all of mobile device development, its like telling a parent their kid is ugly, there's no reason or objectivity involved so youll be made to look soulless. : )
I personally couldn't care less about xda participation. However I am a little disappointed every time a new bug comes up and it turns out its regarding outdated hardware, in that department I did expect a little more. It's disappointing that we have an old screen and what not, surely Google didn't think users wouldn't discover and discuss the copious problems with the phone...
And I do feel like a beta tester. It does feel like the phone was rushed to the public. But this software is still awesome and ultimately we do have some solid hardware to work with and if Google wants to they can make this phone as stable and pleasurable as they advertised it to be. I am so incredibly curious to know what android has been doing lately, the folks there are historically bad at keeping secrets (thankfully) so they have either tightened security or they have been staring at the wall. I'm guessing the former and I can't wait. For a while after the bugs and shortcomings for this phone began to mount I turned my attention to the iPhone, lucky for android the iPhone OS 4.0 is not impressive. As long as the hardware isn't either, android can string me along for a good while.
I really don't know what to think. Google is making no effort to advertise the phone (for good reason at this point), and they are silent to all of the problems that have come up. I'm starting to think Google wishes the nexus would go away so they could try again...
about nexous one
Let me tell you after owning every phone out there the nexous one is the best and fastest phone i have ever owned period
8525
curve
tour
storm 1
storm 2 both on tmobile
g1
mytouch 3g
iphone 3g
iphone 3gs
HD2
after owning all of those phone i will never go back i love my n1
Look at the g1 its the first android phone and there is hella roms for it just wait and there will be more roms and google will give out more updated witch will make the phone better and better
If you like sinse just get the HD2
YAWN...
You didn't add anything new to what was posted before. It's just a bunch of empty thoughts.
What is it that you want????
As I said before, we have the most up-to-date version of Android already, we can't anything new if we don't fully understand the changes.
This is just about as open a platform as we will ever see, learn to fix/add what you want.
Here is what I ask? At the time the Nexus came out, what phone was better? Iphone... uhm no. Touchpro2... not a chance. Moto Droid? Inferior hardware. The bottom line is, even with a few problems the Nexus has, it is still a top 5 phone, if not the best phone there is. I can honestly say, for T-Mobile, there is not a single phone offered that I would rather have. I can think of ONE other phone I'd consider getting outside T-Mobile and thats a phone that isn't out yet (Evo 4g). Come on man, do you want the phone to mow your lawn for you? It's an incredible device.
Oh and judging the quality of a phone based on sales figures is retarded. I don't care if it only sold one phone, if its a great phone its a great phone.
evilkorn said:
What is it that you want????
As I said before, we have the most up-to-date version of Android already, we can't anything new if we don't fully understand the changes.
This is just about as open a platform as we will ever see, learn to fix/add what you want.
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I agree with you. Unlike the G1, we aren't trying to backport 2.1 features or build ROMs with as many things working in 2.1 as we can.
People like Sense, good for them. Personally, I don't care for it in the least. I like a few of the visuals of the status bar from it, which is why I kanged them, but I don't really care at all for the rest of it.
I'm running stock right know.. you know why? Because 2.1 is already the best Android experience! Like Eclair said, I don't get what you want right now.. Yes, the G1 and Magic have alot more ROMS out there but most of them are just 2.1 port attempts! They're trying to get what we already have on our phones. Just to further echo some common sentiments, the phone has only been out for a few months whereas the G1 has been out for a year and a half.. Don't worry, the development will come.. You should feel assured in the fact that many of the top G1/Magic devs switched over to the N1, it was one of the reasons I chose the Nexus over waiting for phones like the Desire.
All that said, I definitely am disappointed with a few things: The various hardware issues that have been popping up amongst different users (I personally have the purple tint issue), and the lagginess of the homescreen swiping. While the 2.1 is very fast in terms of app to app switching or web browsing, it lacks the polish that I hoped 2.1 would have (ie. like the iPhone). Yea, I know things like smooth scrolling on the iPhone are just eye candy, but it matters. It's what appeals to the masses.
An example, I have a non-techie friend who has played around with my Magic before (The Magic was running CursorSense). When he first played around with the N1 his first response was "How come this phone is slower than your Magic, I thought you payed $600 for it?".. He was referring to the scrolling. Of course after I showed him a few neat things (live walls, 3d launcher and gallery etc) he changed his mind but the point remains, the N1 doesn't leave the best first impression.
Overall I am happy with it although I feel it is definitely over priced. But the hardware is built for the future so I'm know that the software updates and future xda development will make it an investment that was worth taking!
Obviously the marketing (lack of) cant have helped sales. Putting it out first on Tmo was a mistake because it severly limited its market even among those who knew about it due to the lack of coverage. I think a traditional carrier launch on either AT&T or Verizon would have moved a lot of handsets. I think Google isnt stupid and they knew these things going in so they had their reasons.
Im not getting the slow development complaints. Its been 4 months. None of the other devices I had saw development that was faster in their intial months of release. At least not as I could notice, I freely admit I wasnt counting roms/apps and logging them in a database.
Personally I dont feel qualified to comment in great detail on a phone I picked up yesterday but I can say I dont regret it at all now that I have hardware in hand. It pretty much rocks as is and I for one am confident that good things are coming and its going to get better.
I will be returning my Nexus One to HTC for repair/replacement due to a faulty power button.
My only real gripe with the phone itself is that the power button is used to sleep & wake the device by default. There is no single button more important than the power button, imho, and it was a poor choice for HTC to design it so.
I take that back, the other huge gripe I have about the phone is HTC's decision to embed the radio antenna at the base of the phone where it is covered by the meaty part of the hand while holding the phone to your ear. Maybe they just assumed everyone would use the headset or bluetooth, but I don't. It is annoying to see it drop a bar of signal because I'm holding the phone naturally in the palm of my hand.
Once I get my replacement phone, I will not be unlocking or rooting it. I will be keeping it intact (and possibly sealed) until this summer, when I can see the next gen iPhone in action, and possibly as late as November, as Windows Phone 7 is already shaping up to be pretty slick.
Here are the things I want in my phone:
1. Just works. Most important thing. Dialer, Contacts, Bluetooth, etc. These things should just be a flick of the finger away.
2. Feature-rich. Integrated search, multi-touch browsing and maps, GPS nav, Native Internet Tethering (bugs the **** out of me that Android doesn't offer this OOB still).
3. Business AND pleasure - don't make me choose between personal email and contacts and enterprise features. HTC has saved Google's ass on this one with their amazing Sense framework from the Desire ROM. Exchange with ActiveSync is a MUST. Also where's the love for Blackberry mail server?? I guess Android is not for law firms? /shrug
4. When something says "Full web browsing", if it doesn't include Flash, HTML5, or Silverlight support, that's false advertising.
Other stuff:
I'm starting to write my apps for Windows Phone 7 SDK, I have been writing apps for the iPhone OS (now looking at iPhone OS 4 beta SDK), and I have written a few for Android.
The Windows Phone 7 SDK using Visual Studio 2010 is bread and butter for me -- its perfect. Working with Xcode on the iPhone SDK always felt clunky, and inefficient. Working with Eclipse on the Android SDK has come a *long* way since I started two years ago, and is much easier now than then.
But VS 2010 makes writing apps for WinPhone7 dead simple. I've already ported across my apps from the iPhone and Android platforms without any 3rd party cross-compilers, and it took a very short period of time.
These days it is the ecosystem that drives the market for handheld devices. iTunes made iPod what it is. The iPhone App store with 180,000+ apps made the iPhone platform what it is (we all know it certainly was nice hardware when it was released, but is definitely dated now). The Android Market has been a blessing and a curse for Android. Many solid apps, but no unified Android platform to develop for (to be addressed in Froyo -- or so they say). No single set of hardware to develop for. It's literally like shooting at a moving target. And developing with open source tools is fun for a while, but gets tiresome when there is so much more effort involved in some of the simplest things.
So that's basically where I am personally at. I love my N1. I will be getting it replaced due to hardware failure. I may not use the replacement, and may sell it instead to finance a Windows Phone 7, or possibly (but not likely) an iPhone over the course of the summer.
And before anyone calls me a hater on any grounds: I have used WinMo in the past, I am using Android now, I have good friends who use iPhones and I hold nothing against them for that. I develop my code on a Windows 7 machine, and I am typing this message on my Mac, which boots Win7, OSX, and Ubuntu.
Lastly, I will say this. There is a sad saying in business that "good enough beats best." This means that despite the technology or ability out there to produce unquestionably excellent goods and services, those which are "good enough" and produce a higher profit margin will win. We will likely always feel like we are being forced to accept mediocrity, but fortunately, the devices we have today will still be outshined, outclassed, and outdone by nearly everything to come in the future.
I would say the negative responses I got here are unappreciated and pointless, but then again they were expected and matter as much as my opinion does.
As for customer service... no. I didn't get anything free. My first n1's lcd broke inside my pocket in a restauraunt. The glass and case was perfect. There were tiny cracks in the lcd. I didn't drop it or anything. I really liked the phone, so I bought another. Google and HTC both gave me a runaround about covering it. Twenty minutes into a conversation, 3 steps up the corporate ladder, and and they finally said send it in, charge 500 dollars, and if your lucky we will give it back. The second time, my wife dropped it, which was her fault. As opposed to my TP2, Palm Pre, my sister's G1, which carriers were glad to replace free immediately if they even looked funny.
My point wasnt to repeat the other guys, only to explain my point about us being beta testers and ask how others felt. I expected some of you to defend it all, and some to complain. I was only explaining the things that made me think about it. And I feel that it is pointless for people to jump all over any person that posts a opinionated comment. If your not trolling or begging or complaining to devs, there's nothing wrong with having an opinion.
I didn't want to end up defending WM at all, only pointing out that their community is insanely creative. I have plenty of respect for how hard devs work. It's not the devs work I questioned, but the amount and interest of the dev community in this phone. If I wanted a WM phone I'ld have gotten the HD2. I like Android just fine, although I'ld be happy to jump on a GSM Droid with 1ghz, as I like my keyboards and hate the glare under the sun of OLED.
Also, all I meant to say about the sales numbers was that is just statistics. Chances are the phone with the most users has the most development, as theaudience is the biggest.
I see all of your points, and didnt mean to complain. The point of my post was this:
How do YOU ALL feel about your experience so far?
Thats why I explained overall how I felt with all the stuff we all have seen positive and negative.
love the phone.. but the touchscreen issues are really pissing me off. and the power button is starting to ***** out on me.
I don't regret at all the $$ I paid for Nexus One. It's an amazing phone with a great OS, it has some negatives like any other phone in the universe (battery,ringtones volume and sunlight visibility) but it has so many positives
My ex-SE phones (that I totally loved) look like an old nintendo NES compared to an XboX360
Other than the **** battery, I'm perfectly happy with my N1.
plain and simple... give me a multi-touch screen that actually works the way it should and I would be 100% satisfied with my phone...
I was hoping that the gaming experience on the phone would be much more pleasurable but with how quirky the touch screen is its nearly impossible to have a great experience...
I would say I am about 80% pleased with the experience so far and I came from a t-mobile dash so the tech on the N1 was leaps and bounds ahead of my old phone but given that I had to shell out all that money for the phone means I should have a 100% sexy piece of hardware instead of 80% of one... with a phone that has no physical keyboard, the touch screen should be much higher quality than it is....
my 2 cents...
Trevor, I agree with you.
Face it people, the phone is a disappointment.
Battery= sucks
touchscreen= sucks
can't save apps to sd= sucks
sloppy slow interface = sucks
3g = sucks
2g = sucks
trackball = sucks
hotmail = sucks
still no flash/html5 = sucks
pink blob im my photos = sucks
no gdocs app = sucks
force closing = sucks
no native profile choice = sucks
silent mode still allows sounds = sucks
slow googles response to the above issues = sucks
bunch of N1 fanboys who can't admit that thier N1 sucks = sucks
be happy you have wp7..
go to:
wpcentral.com/rumor-january-windows-phone-7-update-be-massive-catches-iphone
copy paste that on your browser and read it
Excellent news! This is exactly what the market needs to hear. People who are upset by the initial release and believe it is all WP7 would ever be will be able to ease up a bit on the nay-saying.
The forces opposed to WP7 will be active all the way to the release of the update. They will actually be even more pronounced because of this information. So I hope MS does impress. Because if they don't, the system will suffer massively because of the heightened opposition.
Great news indeed
Hope to see this for real in January.
no one can exactly says that wp7 is selling poorly in the market,, i read an article that android is outselling wp7 by ratio of 15:1, and by symbian at 3:1.. but this is only on their stores or he maybe a android fanboy!
i am monitoring a facebook page of windows phone 7, the first day i monitored it there where 250,000 plus people who like it that was 3 weeks ago and now it grows to 500,000 plus likes, from this we can see that windows phone 7 is getting lots of user or maybe people are liking it and waiting to get their own in the future.
MartyLK said:
. . . .
The forces opposed to WP7 will be active all the way to the release of the update. They will actually be even more pronounced because of this information. So I hope MS does impress. Because if they don't, the system will suffer massively because of the heightened opposition.
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I don't think your comment is fair. I've been using MS products since MS DOS 2.0 right up till Windows 7. Never missed a release. Likewise the same with Windows Mobile or Pocket PC 2000 as it may be and as you can see from my sig.
All that being said WP7 was abysmal for a 1.0 release. It's nothing to do with nay-sayers. They released a great OS with too missing out of the box. This update if it comes to fruition would prove those 'nay sayers' as you called them right. In fact we may need to thank them because if MS went with people like you (no offense intended) who thought it was a great 1.0 release we may never get that update.
What exactly makes WP7 in its current state "abysmal"? And MartyLK's statement is spot on, WP7's detractors focused solely on the missing features and completely ignored the things WP7 does well OOB compared to other OS's, like multimedia playback, Office, gaming, new UI that doesnt clone the alternatives and dont forget making phone calls (which some high profile phones struggled to do when they were released). So where exactly is the "abysmal" part of WP7?
efjay said:
What exactly makes WP7 in its current state "abysmal"? . . . . . missing features and completely ignored the things WP7 does well OOB compared . . . . .?
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LOL! You seem to have answered your own question buddy. You've got to understand that no one is calling WM crap; nor am I comparing it to other OS's. I'm actually comparing it to PPCPE; the first generation.
If you feel WP7 is better compared to other OS's then you are probably right. My 2nd cellphone that I owned in 2001 was the Pocket PC phone Edition. Even that iteration had more functionality and features than WP7.
What people are upset about is not the promising factor of WP7; its going to be a great OS no doubt about it but that doesn't elude the fact that significant features were held back till an 'update'.
alabij said:
LOL! You seem to have answered your own question buddy. You've got to understand that no one is calling WM crap; nor am I comparing it to other OS's. I'm actually comparing it to PPCPE; the first generation.
If you feel WP7 is better compared to other OS's then you are probably right. My 2nd cellphone that I owned in 2001 was the Pocket PC phone Edition. Even that iteration had more functionality and features than WP7.
What people are upset about is not the promising factor of WP7; its going to be a great OS no doubt about it but that doesn't elude the fact that significant features were held back till an 'update'.
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Whatever its compared to, PPCPE, android or ios I dont see how adding features later in its life cycle makes it so abhorrent. Doesnt account for your statement that its "abysmal". Lets not forget, previous versions of WM were feature packed but for various reasons performed poorly so they are hardly a model to compare to WP7 which seeks to put performance first.
alabij said:
LOL! You seem to have answered your own question buddy. You've got to understand that no one is calling WM crap; nor am I comparing it to other OS's. I'm actually comparing it to PPCPE; the first generation.
If you feel WP7 is better compared to other OS's then you are probably right. My 2nd cellphone that I owned in 2001 was the Pocket PC phone Edition. Even that iteration had more functionality and features than WP7.
What people are upset about is not the promising factor of WP7; its going to be a great OS no doubt about it but that doesn't elude the fact that significant features were held back till an 'update'.
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You must be one of the few who never kept up with the news about WP7 from before it was released. It was widely known that the features absent currently would not be in the release version. I knew that and a great many knew that. I also know that what WP7 is currently is pure quality. I also expect future features for it, as well.
The ppl who are crying and moaning that WP7 is short-lived and bad because of the lack of these features are the ones that are referenced. They have zero excuse for saying what they say, if they are in-the-know. They are vocal and heard. How is it possible when someone like myself, who is nothing in the industry knows more than the ones who are centered in the industry? How is it possible that I and the multitude of XDA'ers know these features would be missing in the release version and they do not know that?
efjay said:
What exactly makes WP7 in its current state "abysmal"? And MartyLK's statement is spot on, WP7's detractors focused solely on the missing features and completely ignored the things WP7 does well OOB compared to other OS's, like multimedia playback, Office, gaming, new UI that doesnt clone the alternatives and dont forget making phone calls (which some high profile phones struggled to do when they were released). So where exactly is the "abysmal" part of WP7?
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Nicely said...
will updates be done how HD2 was? have to reset to factory on install? or will it be more like Droid, u just get notice it installs and runs without a hard boot?
any one know?
rysky007 said:
will updates be done how HD2 was? have to reset to factory on install? or will it be more like Droid, u just get notice it installs and runs without a hard boot?
any one know?
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Update with no reset, most likely just a re-boot 100%.
Paul Nur said:
Update with no reset, most likely just a re-boot 100%.
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good news, cant wait to see
MartyLK said:
You must be one of the few who never kept up with the news about WP7 from before it was released. It was widely known that the features absent currently would not be in the release version. I knew that and a great many knew that. I also know that what WP7 is currently is pure quality. I also expect future features for it, as well.
The ppl who are crying and moaning that WP7 is short-lived and bad because of the lack of these features are the ones that are referenced. They have zero excuse for saying what they say, if they are in-the-know. They are vocal and heard. How is it possible when someone like myself, who is nothing in the industry knows more than the ones who are centered in the industry? How is it possible that I and the multitude of XDA'ers know these features would be missing in the release version and they do not know that?
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I have a feeling that no matter how I repeat myself my words will still get twisted. I don't recall ever stating that I wasn't aware that numerous features would be missing from WP7 on release. Nor do I recall dismissing them. I am simply stating a criticism of the current OS from an urban masses perspective.
You are looking at WP7 from your perspective of understanding. Remember your view make sense to you and me and probably every other geek or tech inclined person out there. However MS is in the business of making money not satisfying the tech fetishes of geeks.
Let me simplify my point. if you took your grandma to an ATT store. What phone do you think the store rep would sell her and why if she had an option between a WP7 and an iPhone. Take a moment before you reply and note I said "store rep"?
alabij said:
I don't think your comment is fair. I've been using MS products since MS DOS 2.0 right up till Windows 7. Never missed a release. Likewise the same with Windows Mobile or Pocket PC 2000 as it may be and as you can see from my sig.
All that being said WP7 was abysmal for a 1.0 release. It's nothing to do with nay-sayers. They released a great OS with too missing out of the box. This update if it comes to fruition would prove those 'nay sayers' as you called them right. In fact we may need to thank them because if MS went with people like you (no offense intended) who thought it was a great 1.0 release we may never get that update.
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Click to collapse
Here is what I responded to. You say (the red words). I say it has everything to do with these "nay-sayers". They are in-the-know and are complaining that WP7 is crap because of it's lack of features. If they are in-the-know, they knew it would lack these features. They are in fact treating WP7 as if it is all it will ever be. The fact that they are in-the-know and no doubt knew about its lack of features at launch means they are opposed to WP7 no matter what. They are the ones who will be even more vocal in opposition to WP7 now that the public knows there is a huge update planned.
The nay-sayers aren't fair-minded common users. They are the opposition to WP7.
MartyLK said:
Here is what I responded to. You say (the red words). I say it has everything to do with these "nay-sayers". They are in-the-know and are complaining that WP7 is crap because of it's lack of features. If they are in-the-know, they knew it would lack these features. They are in fact treating WP7 as if it is all it will ever be. The fact that they are in-the-know and no doubt knew about its lack of features at launch means they are opposed to WP7 no matter what. They are the ones who will be even more vocal in opposition to WP7 now that the public knows there is a huge update planned.
The nay-sayers aren't fair-minded common users. They are the opposition to WP7.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Dont you feel (if not agree); that it's these flood of people that are forcing MS to release this update of missing features in early 2011. Meaning that if you keep saying something is perfect then how will the manufacturer know. Why do you think every store, website, business aske for surveys.
Without the so called Apple "nay sayers" complaining about copy/paste it would have never happened. Now ask yourself. How many people do you know who use an iPhone use copy/paste?
alabij said:
Dont you feel (if not agree); that it's these flood of people that are forcing MS to release this update of missing features in early 2011. Meaning that if you keep saying something is perfect then how will the manufacturer know. Why do you think every store, website, business aske for surveys.
Without the so called Apple "nay sayers" complaining about copy/paste it would have never happened. Now ask yourself. How many people do you know who use an iPhone use copy/paste?
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Click to collapse
I understand what you are saying but I disagree with you in intent of purpose. Nay-saying from general, user, public is what will drive the OS to loftier heights, if MS does in fact listen to them. I'm not fully certain of that. I think of MS as doing their own thing, to their own drumbeat rather than catering to the public. The nay-sayers you are referring to are an obstacle to survival because they are -in-the-know and the general public listens to them. They will not ever like WP7 because they oppose it, no matter what. They will twist everything they can to destroy it before it's up and running.
People... people... people... Microsoft rushed this phone to market. They new exactly what they were doing. They wanted to capture a piece of the Christmas shopping pie. And we jumped in because we are sick of Apple and their iPhone. I mean really a battery that you can't replace???? Get with it Apple !!!! I digress... As I stated in a previous thread Microsoft will do what Apple did and in half the time. In fact it wouldn't surprise me at all if it surpasses iPhone in less than a year. I mean why oh why did Microsoft come out with a totally new Phone OS ? Because they know the current platforms will not support future funtionality and cloud services. They sank millions into this and they are not going to play second fiddle to Apple or Google in this space. So did we buy our WP7 phones for what it can do? No.... we bought it because of what it will be able to do. Yes it is lacking some defacto funtionality (copy/paste) but would you have rather spent your money and upgraded to iPhone4 and have a nice paper weight in 6 months? Yes there will be nay sayers. Heck I even say iPhone still sucks despite their advances. And if you think iPhone is so great, talk to me when you can swap the battery in 20 seconds or less. So bring on the the releases Microsoft and make us smile ! We know you have done the market research and we know you are going to bring great things to this platform.
I am a big MS fan and waited very patiently for WP7. I must say I was rather underwhelmed with the initial release and cannot wait for numerous updates that will bring it atleast on par with the functionality in W6.5
Exchange-
No settings to decide how you want the phone to behave after a delete
No hierachial folder list
NO ability to search your mailbox.
Cannot select all to mass act on criteria
No ability to custmize font, color in emails. most new androids do this
People Search
Cannot search people by file as field or company.
Other issues
Wifi Mac address hidden
No Flash. Atleast recognize a you tube URL and send us to m.youtube.com
No Bluetooth settings (cannot change behavior of phone when paired) ie voice commands dont work.
Phone menu doesnt separate missed, incoming and outgoing calls.
Cannot forward a txt message
No Wifi router
No Remote desktop
No Swype keyboard
All of the above are painful ommisions for me. if the hardware on my Imagio wasnt so damn slow I would be back using it.
for search .... in the program you are in, mail, music, phone, click on the bottom right hand search symbol (last one on right). Type what you are searching. If there is a match it will find it quickly... yes some of the other features are not there yet (release coming soon). Not sure by the last one? No Swype ?
Hey all,
Past couple of days been doing some research. Thoroughly confused TBH. Can't decide which is better...
Now, I'm on Android and not dying to get rid of it or something. But just keeping an eye open for better alternatives.
My sole concern is price. I believe WP8 is a fantastic product. But has got a ridiculous price tag. The kind of money MS is asking for is just bizarre. Nonetheless, I currently can't decide what to pick, LUMIA 920 or the HTC 8X.
Also, a question to everyone who has a WP8, are you truly satisfied in your experience with it or do you think Android is a better bet?
Sent from my RaZr on MIUI.
I'm in the same boat really, I have always used Android but starting to get a little bored with it so looking to try something else. iOS is okay but not for me, so am really looking into WP. The app store worries me, although most of what I use there is already an equivalent app, but it's nice to have more choice.
Have been looking at the 8X but the price is a little high, especially compared to the new Nexus 4. I don't know. Not sure if I would get bored with a Windows Phone, maybe a little more digging into it is needed.
If you keep the Nexus 4 out of the picture then the WP8 phones are priced pretty similar to what new Android phones are priced at, so actually I don't see why you think those would be problematic. Given that the Nexus 4 is also priced in that price range if provided by LG instead of Google (which it is in many countries as there is no Google Play Store there).
Aside from that WP8 vs. Android for most people will simply come down to preference. For some it will depend on certain Apps they rely on and have no equivalent. I personally currently have a HTC Titan with WP7.5 and will get my Lumia next week. For work I have an SGS2 (currently running CM9.1) and I actually prefer WP.
In the end I can only encourage you to really dig into the threads people opened on what they miss in WP. Sometimes they get told how it works in WP, sometimes it simply can't be done but it will give you a better picture than asking us WP users what we think because pretty obviously there are only 2 types:
1.) People who tried WP and don't like it (who will do anything to push you away from the OS)
2.) People who tried WP and like it (and will tell you that you won't need anything else)
In the end no two people are really alike in what they need so the only way to go is to really do some research. WP7 has been my daily driver for 2 years now and a lot of the stuff I was actually missing in the beginning is there in WP8 now (last thing I was missing was backgrounding of Skype). But there obviously are still functionalities someone might need that are not (one example is PPTP VPN - I don't need it, most don't need it but if you do it might be a dealbreaker).
As for the decission Lumia 920 vs HTX 8X. For me the great low light performance of the Lumia and the better App support made me go the Nokia-route. Also I simply wanted 32 GB of storage. My biggest problem with the 8X is that I simply detest the look of the colored speaker grill on the front (otherwise the design is really nice). Weight might be another thing that makes you want to go with the 8X.
R3ACTOR4 said:
Hey all,
Past couple of days been doing some research. Thoroughly confused TBH. Can't decide which is better...
Now, I'm on Android and not dying to get rid of it or something. But just keeping an eye open for better alternatives.
My sole concern is price. I believe WP8 is a fantastic product. But has got a ridiculous price tag. The kind of money MS is asking for is just bizarre. Nonetheless, I currently can't decide what to pick, LUMIA 920 or the HTC 8X.
Also, a question to everyone who has a WP8, are you truly satisfied in your experience with it or do you think Android is a better bet?
Sent from my RaZr on MIUI.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ive had Windows Phone for a couple years now. First one was the Trophy. Before that I had an Android Incredible and I now have a Nokia Lumia 920. I just switched from Verizon to ATT, and must admit, primarily so I could have the flagship WP8 phone.
I have to be honest. While I do love the phone (though it really is a bit big. Im selling my Trophy/Incredible and picking them up for the first time in a long time after having the 920 for a few weeks is strange. They seem so small, but in a good way as I can hold them in one hand and easily do tasks on them. But thats another story)
I do like the WP OS. I enjoy the look of it, and have always been partial to Windows/MS stuff. But I have to admit that there are indeed somethings that I really miss from Android. Specifically, I do miss choice. What I mean by that is with things like Email clients, messaging clients, true 3rd party browsers, customization. You will be limited to what MS has as base apps for these things. MS has the OS locked down to prevent Devs from giving us anything different when it comes to these things. Now while I do like how the Email works, and now real complaints about the messaging, itd be nice to have choice.
Here is just a small list of some things that are different that youll have to accept if you come from Android. Its up to you how important these things are, and if you want to make the switch.
1. Live Tiles. I actually love the tiles. Great visual aspect of the OS that sets it apart from others. I do find it annoying that even with WP8, there is a very limited choice of color. They give you a few more than WP7, but rather than let us make any color, we are still limited to a handful of choices. It wouldve been very easy for them to do this, I dont know why they didnt.
2. No real notification center. Most are aware of this by now, but I expect that MS is actually working on a notification center as we speak. So I wouldnt be too concerned with it at the moment, as I believe they will get an update out to give us this feature in the not too distant future.
3. Mail, messaging, browser clients. What you see is what you get. I always hoped theyd loosen up a little on this and let Devs provide different options but I dont think that will ever happen. Mail actually works well but its still limited. For example, you cant specifically download any attachment file to a folder. You can only open a pdf/pic/music file. On Android, I could open and save any file I received to a folder and access it later. Same goes with the browser. You cant save any file. IE is quick, but there is no dedicated back button. Very few options. On Android, Dolphin HD Browser was the best mobile browser ive ever used. You will never see a browser like that on WP's.
No other messaging clients either.
4. Back up of apps/data to SD Card. You dont have that on WP8. They have improved the back up utility, but it is still nothing like Titanium Backup. That app was awesome on Android. You could back up App data as you saw fit to your SD card and it was easy to re-install. Again, you will never see an app like Titanium backup on WP. MS lock downs have prevented that.
5. Tethering. It was rather easy to tether without having to pay some extra fee for it on Android. Not so much with WPs. Not sure if its the same on Android as it use to be, but if you enjoyed free tethering, it probably wont happen with WP.
Im sure there are more, cant think of any at the moment as Im a little tired. Its been a while since I had Android. I do miss it but I remember flashing ROMs alot. I dont remember if I did it more to improve my experience or just for phone. Probably a little of both but it did get old updating a ROM every week or so. But I will say this. There was next to nothing my Android phone couldnt do. That is what I really miss about it. Completely customizable, devs could do next to anything as they werent locked out of certain aspects of the phone.
Sometimes I ask myself why I switched to WP. Im a bit torn as of now and not sure where I am going next. I wish I knew what MS's agenda was for the future. What are they working on to improve upon, and what new features. At this point in time, Im going to give them another year, see what they come up with. But part of me is ready to go back to Android.
Sorry for the long winded post. Honestly, think about what you love most about Android. And no matter how silly, ask of those specific things are possible or featured on WP. Something you take for granted my not be here. So ask. Check out WPCentral too and ask questions there too.
Hello. I have a few questions for JB. I was expecting most of these to be gone, but still haven't found a solution so I thought I'd ask.
So, is there a way to save contacts to google contacts BY DEFAULT?
scooterlord said:
Hello. I have a few questions for JB. I was expecting most of these to be gone, but still haven't found a solution so I thought I'd ask.
So, is there a way to save contacts to google contacts BY DEFAULT?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They do, don't they? I don't think anyone's gonna give you a mod just so you don't have to tap one window before you add a contact
Sent from my rooted P880
I wasn't expecting a mod, maybe something I missed out. That's why I hate my switch from iOS to android. In iOS you have every feature you could have thought to need, just waiting for you to use it.
I'm sorry, but I can't help from laughing at that comment!!
Tcm9669 said:
I'm sorry, but I can't help from laughing at that comment!!
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Click to collapse
:/ laugh all you want. Facts are facts.
scooterlord said:
I wasn't expecting a mod, maybe something I missed out. That's why I hate my switch from iOS to android. In iOS you have every feature you could have thought to need, just waiting for you to use it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're actually kidding right? IOS is the most bland closed featureless system there is. Lets see what android can do that IOS can't
1. Insert SDcard
2. No limits on how big apps are when downloading with 3G
3. Live wallpaper
4. Install stuff from anywhere you want, no jailbreak (root to us) required
5. Better specs, cheaper price
6. Root, roms etc
7. Don't need itunes to move files around
8. Themes
9. £30 to repair in a shop instead of over £100
10. You're in the wrong place to insult android, go away
Sent from my rooted P880
@non4 said:
You're actually kidding right? IOS is the most bland closed featureless system there is. Lets see what android can do that IOS can't
1. Insert SDcard
2. No limits on how big apps are when downloading with 3G
3. Live wallpaper
4. Install stuff from anywhere you want, no jailbreak (root to us) required
5. Better specs, cheaper price
6. Root, roms etc
7. Don't need itunes to move files around
8. Themes
9. £30 to repair in a shop instead of over £100
10. You're in the wrong place to insult android, go away
Sent from my rooted P880
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Although I wasn't expecting this kind of answer, I will still reply. I am not a fanboy, both oses have their pros and cons. Hardware-wise, android might be one generation ahead (check your list above), but software-wise it has a long way to mature until it reaches iOS standards.
You might feel like you have freedom, but probably have been visiting this forum waiting for the unlocked bootloader - so, the need to jailbreak is the same as this one. Once jailbroken on the iphone, you have no need of itunes, no need of anything. As for sds, batteris etc, personally I never ran out of data space on my 16gb device.
What android users don't see (or can't accept) for the apple devices are three things.
a) Accessories - tell me if you have found a decent case/car mount/pod base/WHATEVER for your android device.
b) the iOS experience is the same EVERY SINGLE TIME. No lags, no hangups. Once speedy-ALWAYS speedy. Just try one and see. I don't know why android keeps re-optimizing my email, I don't know why sometimes a 4-core cellphone lags to enter the call list, sometimes lags even on the home screen - never happened on my..(wait for it) 3GS!
c) Apple Store is AGES ahead play store - quality stuff ONLY. Keep in mind that devs use iOS to develop and PORT to android later.
As I said.. facts are facts.
Want a closed up featureless OS that is a compleate waste for more powerfull phones?
Check out Windows Phone.
---------- Post added at 01:34 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:29 PM ----------
scooterlord said:
a) Accessories - tell me if you have found a decent case/car mount/pod base/WHATEVER for your android device.
b) the iOS experience is the same EVERY SINGLE TIME. No lags, no hangups. Once speedy-ALWAYS speedy. Just try one and see. I don't know why android keeps re-optimizing my email, I don't know why sometimes a 4-core cellphone lags to enter the call list, sometimes lags even on the home screen - never happened on my..(wait for it) 3GS!
c) Apple Store is AGES ahead play store - quality stuff ONLY. Keep in mind that devs use iOS to develop and PORT to android later.
As I said.. facts are facts.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have to say he is right on this one... I have an iPod Touch 4 and it hardly lags with anything.
As for the Store, they have only quality stuff because App Store carefully checks every submission to see if it's worthy to end up there.
Developers pay 100$ to submit an app, so you can bet yourself they will work hard on it.
Android takes 30$ for submission, you can submit an app that only had a big red button to open google and it'll still end up in Play Store.
I had an iphone and I hated it, got straight back to android as soon as I could. What apple really does is block good devs from getting their apps in, look at kaalus having issues with survivalcraft, and they do let junk on there too. Its smooth, but thats it, my o4x is smooth too. I don't give a damn about cases, and as for the bootloader thats unfortunate but I still choose android. Android is open source and its functionality can be expanded a lot more than iphone without even rooting it. Its a closed system designed to filter all your money to apple. And not to mention they break so damn easy!
Sent from my rooted P880
and do you know why devs start dev'ing on iOS phones? cause they're all the same... same size, HW and so on. it is way harder to develop an android app, cause you need to support (LDPI), MDPI, HDPI, XHDPI, completely different chipsets/hardware in general. and another question? do you know why it is "smooth"? because you need to optimize the rom only one time and it fits to all devices. BTW, have you ever seen a real custom rom or even a recovery on an apple device? i haven't.
if you know what you're doing, android is way better than iOS. it can be way smoother and faster. and the most important thing about android: it is OPEN SOURCE.
if you hate android that much, why did you even buy it? you're of course free to leave.
So let's keep it with that and back to topic.
laufersteppenwolf said:
and do you know why devs start dev'ing on iOS phones? cause they're all the same... same size, HW and so on. it is way harder to develop an android app, cause you need to support (LDPI), MDPI, HDPI, XHDPI, completely different chipsets/hardware in general. and another question? do you know why it is "smooth"? because you need to optimize the rom only one time and it fits to all devices. BTW, have you ever seen a real custom rom or even a recovery on an apple device? i haven't.
if you know what you're doing, android is way better than iOS. it can be way smoother and faster. and the most important thing about android: it is OPEN SOURCE.
if you hate android that much, why did you even buy it? you're of course free to leave.
So let's keep it with that and back to topic.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's not that I hate Android, it's just that I find iOS better in some cases. And that's about it. The phone I got as a gift, and previously being an owner of an android tablet I thought I'd adjust and see great improvements - which unfortunately I didn't. It's just a matter of preference though and it stems from the individual's needs.
As you said, back to topic, is there a solution to what I am asking? I saw my friends Galaxy S3 last night and he selects it only ONCE and it's autoselected after that. So, any ideas?
scooterlord said:
It's not that I hate Android, it's just that I find iOS better in some cases. And that's about it. The phone I got as a gift, and previously being an owner of an android tablet I thought I'd adjust and see great improvements - which unfortunately I didn't. It's just a matter of preference though and it stems from the individual's needs.
As you said, back to topic, is there a solution to what I am asking? I saw my friends Galaxy S3 last night and he selects it only ONCE and it's autoselected after that. So, any ideas?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Maybe there is on s3, but not ours as far as I know. I don't see the big deal at all, you got arthritis in your thumb? No but seriously I don't know just tap the option and live with it if someone knows they will surely tell you
Sent from my rooted P880
scooterlord said:
I wasn't expecting a mod, maybe something I missed out. That's why I hate my switch from iOS to android. In iOS you have every feature you could have thought to need, just waiting for you to use it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I just wanted to fix this for you, since this is the basis of this argument:
In iOS you have every feature you're used to just the way you like it*.
* - or the way you're used to - sometimes it's hard to tell the difference, since "the way you like it" is usually as good as the best way you found of doing something.. if something better comes along, it becomes "the way you like it".
IMO, the great thing about Android is that you can adapt the features to the way you want it. Same thing goes for LG's UI and Sammy's TouchWiz - if you don't like the things they added to the stock Android, you can install a launcher more suited to your needs (and more flexible too). Same goes for the basic apps for SMS, Email, etc. And you might think the iOS does it right on the first try (as do some Nexus users), but the fact you have alternatives is a plus for me.
And the reason it's not completely Off-Topic is this: the same applies to your question. The S3 might have something done differently than the LG, because they made different design choices. Some people might not liking to have every contact of theirs in their Google account (as many are still distrustful of Google's privacy rules), so LG preferred to have people choose everytime. S3 chose a set-it-and-forget-it POV, which some people might prefer, while others might not. And if you don't like the way it is in the phone you got, just get an app that does it the way you want it.
Or develop it (another HUGE plus for Android, IMO).
skryptus said:
I just wanted to fix this for you, since this is the basis of this argument:
In iOS you have every feature you're used to just the way you like it*.
* - or the way you're used to - sometimes it's hard to tell the difference, since "the way you like it" is usually as good as the best way you found of doing something.. if something better comes along, it becomes "the way you like it".
IMO, the great thing about Android is that you can adapt the features to the way you want it. Same thing goes for LG's UI and Sammy's TouchWiz - if you don't like the things they added to the stock Android, you can install a launcher more suited to your needs (and more flexible too). Same goes for the basic apps for SMS, Email, etc. And you might think the iOS does it right on the first try (as do some Nexus users), but the fact you have alternatives is a plus for me.
And the reason it's not completely Off-Topic is this: the same applies to your question. The S3 might have something done differently than the LG, because they made different design choices. Some people might not liking to have every contact of theirs in their Google account (as many are still distrustful of Google's privacy rules), so LG preferred to have people choose everytime. S3 chose a set-it-and-forget-it POV, which some people might prefer, while others might not. And if you don't like the way it is in the phone you got, just get an app that does it the way you want it.
Or develop it (another HUGE plus for Android, IMO).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Very well said. Trouble with apple is it does it one way, and only one way. With android theres several ways to do one thing. The longer you use android the more shortcuts you can learn and it really starts to flow, android grows on you, apple is more noob friendly
Sent from my rooted P880
It's not a big deal but I'd like to automatic save my contacts on google acount or smartphone memory, cause I use to forget to tick the option and my contacts keep beeing saved on the SIM card.
back on topic, default save location
So... I used search and found this iphone rant, instead of trying to post something in a new topic, lets do something insane and try to get an XDA topic back ON topic
Previous phones supported default save locations so I thought i missed something, here are tutorials for other roms:
http://www.tech-recipes.com/rx/20432/android-auto-save-contacts-to-phone-or-sim-card-by-default/
http://genius-tips.com/change-default-save-location-for-contacts-in-android/
Why it matters, I quickly save contacts without looking at the location and later discover they are gone, this is because I only show google contacts.