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[Q] Does Google not continuing the Nexus One line threaten the future of Android?

So I have been giving a lot of thought to this subject ever since reading a few articles a couple of weeks back about the CEO of Google Eric Schmidt saying that they have no plans on making a "Nexus Two." Not only this, but Google stating that they will no longer sell the Nexus One direct and unlocked from the www.google.com/phone store. My question is, does this threaten the Android platform in the future. I personally think it won't because Android will continue to live on, but the open Android that we have come to know and love today will be jeopardized. This is why I decided to start this thread to see how others feel about this subject and ask some important questions about the fate of Android.
To start off we really have to see what Google's Nexus One brought to the world of Android to be able to see what we will be missing if there is no "Google phone" in the future. On January 5, 2010 Google threw a press conference where it called it's new baby the Nexus One a "superphone" and ever since then the i has been in the news having every flaw dissected and blown out of proportion by tech blogs all around the web. Yes, the Nexus One had some big flaws like the multitouch screen, early T-Mobile 3G problems, No multitouch pinch to zoom (now changed), and even the pentile arrangement of pixels on the AMOLED screen, but it also was the first in the smartphone world (unless you count the HD2, but we are talking about Android not WM in this discussion) to have a lot of huge features that now started this Android revolution. It had a powerful Snapdragon 1 Ghz processor (up to this point the biggest we had was the Droid with an Arm Cortex A8 550 mhz processor), 3.7 inch AMOLED screen (WVGA 800x480 pixels) , 512 mb of RAM (most had 256mb RAM), 5mp camera (with LED flash and 720x480 video capture), and one of the lightest (130 grams with battery), sleekest 119mm heidth by 59.8mm depth), and thinnest (11.5mm) phones on the market. The Droid paved the road and the Nexus One showed OEM's what the top of the line Android phone must have to compete in specs. The Nexus One launched with Eclair 2.1 and was the first to bring it to the world. A couple months after launch Google gave pinch to zoom multitouch to the Nexus One and this allowed other phones like the Droid and now most of the Android phones available to get this much desired feature. Perhaps one of the best features of the phone was that it launched with an unlocked bootloader and introduced the world to the adb command "fastboot oem unlock." I know that are beloved developers have been unlocking the full potential of phones since the Windows Mobile days, but Android has brought that even further. Since then the Nexus One has quickly become the dev phone of the Android world. If you don't like a feature simply change it or flash a different ROM. This wonderful world that the great developers in the Android community work so hard to bring to us is really the "killer feature" of the Android OS and this is being threatened by not having anymore "Google phones." Lately we are seeing companies like Motorola and Verizon using eFuse to lock down their phones and keeping people that spend their hard earned money from flashing ROM's. I am sure the whole eFuse thing has been blown out of proportion and I am sure the next Android superstar (or one of the many we already have here on XDA) will unlock the Droid X to it's full potential, but the mere fact that these companies are locking down phones using the FREE Android OS is very disheartening. We don't want the same cat and mouse game that Apple and their iPhone customers have to play to unlock and use their phones and this is one of the many reasons people flock to the open Android OS.
Not only do we risk "locking down" the platform, but by not having any further Nexus phones we will more than likely never see another Vanilla Android phone. Instead we are seeing what the OEMs and wireless providers want us to see and this is evident in the losing of WiFi tethering in the latest build of Android 2.2, or known as Froyo. If a wireless provider doesn't want a feature (like tethering) the OEM's are then pressured into leaving it out to make them happy. This is not a good thing in my opinion as it again puts the power and fate of Android in the wireless providers like Verizon and AT&T where we are quickly losing the openness of Android and the ability to even side load applications. This is exactly why we need a phone like the Nexus One. A phone that will push the boundaries of innovation and keep the wireless companies honest by simple competition. They won't leave an important feature out if the Google phone already has a version of it out and available unlocked. Without Google making a phone we are left with whatever skin the OEMs have minus the features the wireless companies don't want included. If the Nexus One would not of been released we would be stuck with minimal upgrades and even worse what would make the OEMs and providers hurry with the newest release (Froyo in this case and soon to be Gingerbread)? If Google wouldn't of pushed Android 2.2 to the Nexus One then would all the companies like HTC, Samsung, and Motorola even be racing to get Froyo out? In my opinion the Nexus One is the only reason that these companies are trying to get 2.2 out in a timely basis. I mean I may be wrong as I am not a developer, but what would really make the OEMs and providers want to hurry with their releases if they didn't have the competition? I think it would be the opposite and these companies would make us buy their newest and top of the line Android phone just to get the newest and best Android release. This has been proven in the past and if it wasn't for the iPhone and Google's Android the smartphone world would be a very different place filled with Bada OSs, Windows Mobile phones, no app stores, and worse of all mediocre upgrades. This is the real reason we need Google to release a phone so they can take the fate of Android (and the power, in my opinion) away from greedy wireless companies and OEM's that only look to sell us a phone multiple times a year.
I have really given a lot of thought to this because ever since I purchased my Nexus One back in March (without AT&Ts permission, I should add) I had planned on buying a "Google phone" every year. I was aware that Google would work closely with different OEMs and we would get a great dev phone every year with the latest and greatest Vanilla Android, free from the clutches of wireless contracts, and most of all "OPEN." This was a great idea and I can see why Google's idea of selling a phone didn't catch on here in the states, but they accomplished a lot more than selling millions of devices like Apple does. They accomplished (along with the Droid, which I might add Google had a big hand in creating and bringing to life, and also was free of a locked bootloader) bringing Android to the masses and making the statement to companies that a top of the line Android phone needs to have these specs to compete in the Android world.
I just went out and bought me a Samsung Captivate and to be honest the first thing I thought I would get rid of was TouchWiz, but it has kind of grown on me. I think HTC Sense is nice as well, but I will always be a Vanilla Android fan and there is something about the Nexus One that always brings me back. This will be a phone that I will not ever get rid of and is still the best phone I have ever owned. I am sure many others feel the same way and the Nexus One will continue to be a niche kind of product, but I think I have made the argument that Google needs a phone to further Android and keep the fate of it's Android in it's hands. This could get out of control quick and it could turn bad. We are just nearing the top and Android is here to stay and will be the OS that everyone else attempts to mimic. Come on Google I know I am not the only one that feels this way and this is why I started this thread to get the feel of others in the Android community as I am sure there are others that are worried as well. The open Android that we know and love today is in jeopardy if Google doesn't maintain a little control over their Android OS. The OEM's and wireless companies are going to ruin the openness of Android if they don't have a constant pressure keeping them honest. One of the main reasons that Android has grown so rapidly is that a company like Google has created it to be free, open, and common to many phones so we don't have to worry about dozens of companies with mediocre platforms. Weigh in and let me know how you feel and maybe just maybe we can get someones attention. Feel free to copy this on other forums as I feel we need to save the idea of an open Android. One without the boundaries of no side loading of apps, eFuses, locked bootloaders, and most of all innovation and the advancement of the Android platform.

Google's own line of phones phone has zero influence on the android os.

JCopernicus said:
Google's own line of phones phone has zero influence on the android os.
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Yes, you are right, but without a Google phone what will Android be like? We won't see another Vanilla Android phone that is for sure.

Not being able to see into the future makes this a hard statement to take as fact.

There were vanilla phones before nexus one and there will continue to be more
Sent from my Nexus One using XDA App

If you want a true vanilla android phone grabe one of HTC's china phones, not even google apps are on it. =D

I agree with the basic premise that the Nexus One did provide leverage to potentially (and I think that is a key qualifier) keep the competition honest, but it isn't clear that it would do so without significantly more marketing. And, to market the Nexus One more could have annoyed some of the vendors that Google wants to keep happy - lots of happy vendors means lots of seats for Android means lots of seats off of which Google makes a lot of money. In particular, if every Android phone is locked, then Google still makes a mint, though they stand to make more of a mint if the platform is more widely adopted. And, an open phone does have an impact on platform adoption, but I don't think it is that critical since the public is used to buying fixed feature-set phones and upgrading for new features so this isn't an issue of taking away something that they demand as it is failing to give them something that they would come to know and love (as we already do).
But, I also want to counter some of the supporting arguments you present.
First, the current wave of smartphones was headed here one way or another. Google didn't create the wave, they simply reacted and targeted Android at the capabilities that were coming down the pike. To do that most effectively they needed a new developer phone and the Nexus One was going to be released in January one way or another as the ADP3 until they had this idea to sell direct. It was simply them needing to get out a testbed for the new Android capabilities that were targeted at the new baseline smartphone hardware and they chose to do it in an experimental new way this time. If they hadn't released the Nexus One direct to consumers then you would have seen the same phones come out and you would have seen the same OS releases, you just wouldn't have had a large installed base of end users previewing it on a non-developer handset.
Second, I think the main factor spurring the vendors to get 2.2 out quickly is that it offers so much, not that they have to keep up with the Nexus One. It is, in my opinion, the biggest release so far (and I've been with Android since 1.0) primarily because of the JIT. Also, all the manufacturers came out with what would become the new standard amount of RAM (512MB) and the existing release available for them to ship on did not support it, so they need to get on 2.2 in order to simply unlock the hardware they originally designed. In some sense, these phones were really designed for 2.2 - 2.1 was simply a stepping stone to get them shipped on their hardware schedule until 2.2 was ready on its software schedule. So, there are really 2 factors that would encourage them to get 2.2 out on their 2010-class phones that have nothing to do with the Nexus One being here.
As far as vanilla phones... The G1 was vanilla. The original Droid was vanilla (is it still vanilla with the latest releases?). The Nexus One was vanilla. But, where there any others? I love my vanilla phones (first G1 then N1), but I don't mind value added by the vendors, I just wish they would make it easier to customize things away and that they would learn to design their add-ons so that they can be easily dropped on to a new Android release with little fuss...

Short answer: No. It does not.
Simply put, there will always be a phone that will have Vanilla Android. If for nothing more than using that as a sale point. Especially with Andy 3.0 in the horizon which focus is on the UI. No worries.

Of course it doesn't.

Simple answer, no. There have always been vanilla Android phones, the developer phones at least, and there will always be developer phones. In fact, the Nexus is still for sale now as the latest developer phone.

Eventually there will be another vanilla Android phone that Google is behind, unless they get their own hardware built by someone and don't sell it publicly... but that wouldn't make much sense, just like it wouldn't make any sense for them to not ever have another phone.
Soon enough, the 2ghz and dual-core phones will be out, and eventually mobile devices will catch up to computers in terms of power. They're gonna have to.

I'm sure they will come out with a different dev phone in the future.

I agree with the op, up to a point. While it may be true that there'll always be a phone Google gets behind -a 'dev' phone, if you will- I think it still limits choice for people who want the vanilla experience. Is it really ok to just have one phone that's vanilla?
To the op: "If the Nexus One would not of been released...."
I think you mean "had not been released..."
and: "If Google wouldn't of pushed Android 2.2 to the Nexus One then...."
It's "If Google hadn't pushed Android..."
Sorry for the pedantry. Bad grammar just spoilt a good, well-thought out post.

Consumer are what they are a android is one of the greatest os I have experience.all those problems was soft ware issue and minor only something a child would complain about.i have a nexus almost went with a nokia n900 glad I didn't .proud of google.
Sent from my Nexus One using XDA App

Returned mine today.

Well after having my HD7 since launch I returned it today and went back to my HD2 running Android.
The last straw for me was using Youtube and seeing the lousy video playback..in a centered screen. WTF is that? Totally unacceptable in my book.
While I like the look of the UI, theres just something about it that got tiresome.
Real Cons for me were.
I really dislike IE.
Youtube.
Battery life.
No LED notifications.
Amount of animations to get something done.
No Google Maps.
Homescreen tiles. While pretty, because most tiles are the same color I found it confusing to quickly choose what I wanted.
Camera was a toss up. Some photos were great, some not.
I never got around to playing games on it because battery life was so bad.
Anyway you get the idea. I gave it a shot and I will be keeping an eye on it.
I hope it works out for all you others.

Good for you. I don't think you are set to be an early adopter anyway.
This OS is still in its infancy. So, I would say you guys should hold off on getting the WP7 until the next version.
I, for one LOVE this OS and I do not have any issues for the functions that I use this phone on a daily basis... Phone Call, Internet, Mails, Movies and Music. No issues what so every. I also use the camera, and if at all, thats the only only issue I have compared to the HD2. I think the camera should be improved a bit more.

Agreed
I do have to agree that the OS is still new and has some bugs to be worked out, but over all I really enjoy the HD7 and WP7. The OS is simple and for myself was ready for something a little simpler them the current OS systems out there. I have found it in some ways to be a blending of the Android and IPhone, but still remaining Windows. The camera is a little difficult and touchy to get good pics, but hey it's a phone.
I think in the months to come we will see updates from MS and they will adress some of the small issues. MS has invested alot money into the development of WP7, and feel and hope that MS will really put the resources needed to futher develope the firmware/software.

Sorry to hear that but hey it wasn't meant to be a fully loved OS by everybody.
Btw what are you going back to ? (or forward)
Personally, I am very satisfied with the OS so far and I am in a long run with Microsoft on this one. If other OSs aren't catching up in terms of speed (besides functionality) I doubt I will break away from WP7 any time soon. Me being more the music/browsing/e-mail type of guy it does perfectly what others haven't been able to reach yet.

i have to agree on some points. I do like the fact it's "speedy" but really dislike about camera (but that is not a OS issues but HTC's, i believe). considering the platform being only a few weeks (almost a month) old, it's got good start. Just as Nokia N900 when it first came out, there were issues. they will be address as time pass by. Microsoft just need a bit of support from all of us to really expand their market.
I think having Apple, Google and Microsoft in the mix will keep different inovation to come into the market.
i'm sorry for your experience but i guess no single solution will make everyone happy.

yly3 said:
Sorry to hear that but hey it wasn't meant to be a fully loved OS by everybody.
Btw what are you going back to ? (or forward)
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Going back to HD2 running Android.

harsaphes said:
Going back to HD2 running Android.
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would be interested to know what Android web browser has that WP7 IE does not?
speed is the same, rendering is the same, Android has a tendency to "block render" a bit more than IE on slow sites, overall same experience between the two.
Also, Youtube is an application for WP7, it is not part of WP7 so judging the OS based on a crappy app is not a fair evaluation of its capabilities.
I am usually streaming youtube vids from home while connected to my WIFI and quality is pretty decent, got a bit worse over slow 3G but don't see how it could better with Android.

guys its personal preference and if some one likes to RUN android on a machine which is not made for it.. i will rest my case....
why do u want to run android on a WM device when there are so many android device in the market...
all the best to u my friend.... and the only valid reason u had was the youtube app... which ic not even WP7 app... any way all the best..

I've considered returning my HD7 many times. What's really keeping me from returning my phone is the potential. The UI on WP7 is beautiful. If you guys try the Flux and the IMdB apps, you'll know what I mean.

I'm keeping mine. I actually love it. I had a first gen iPhone and loved it. This HD7 and WP7 is every bit as good as that iPhone and is better in numerous ways. To me, it feels like a luxurious high-end Lexus or Infiniti. I find it to be the absolute best phone ever created. Just purely gorgeous from every aspect, externally and internally. WP7 is a sweet piece of kit.
Too bad you are giving up on it. The next update will likely solve your concerns. I knew what would be *initially* lacking in WP7 and still find it pure bliss.

MartyLK said:
I'm keeping mine. I actually love it. I had a first gen iPhone and loved it. This HD7 and WP7 is every bit as good as that iPhone and is better in numerous ways. To me, it feels like a luxurious high-end Lexus or Infiniti. I find it to be the absolute best phone ever created. Just purely gorgeous from every aspect, externally and internally. WP7 is a sweet piece of kit.
Too bad you are giving up on it. The next update will likely solve your concerns. I knew what would be *initially* lacking in WP7 and still find it pure bliss.
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Click to collapse
+1. I'm willing to do without a few features for another month or so till the update, because this phone is fantastic. Once the updates starts taking care of more and more issues being one of the first WP7 (specifically HD7) owners will be so worth it.

I been from Nokia apple android and now the Hd7
So yeah I have had all of them Each has the goodies and the baddies
although I am more inclined towards android.. ( hope nokia ditches symbian and goes with their meego which is also linux based like android.. or just go with android )
WM7 and HD 7 is the lovable although i do agree they they to update the OS which I am hoping will be next year
Must admit thought that Microsoft has taken the best of both android and apple with WM7 so fingers crossed that the updates will sort us out

unlockMe said:
Also, Youtube is an application for WP7, it is not part of WP7 so judging the OS based on a crappy app is not a fair evaluation of its capabilities.
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I have never owned a recent phone that Youtube video doesnt play full screen.

truffle1234 said:
why do u want to run android on a WM device when there are so many android device in the market...
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Its just to hold me over till the Nexus S comes out. I have no problem with the HD2 running Android. The size is great. I also have the N1, but prefer this form factor. And it wasnt "just" youtube. It was many things.

harsaphes said:
Well after having my HD7 since launch I returned it today and went back to my HD2 running Android.
The last straw for me was using Youtube and seeing the lousy video playback..in a centered screen. WTF is that? Totally unacceptable in my book.
While I like the look of the UI, theres just something about it that got tiresome.
Real Cons for me were.
I really dislike IE.
Youtube.
Batter life.
No LED notifications.
Amount of animations to get something done.
No Google Maps.
Homescreen tiles. While pretty, because most tiles are the same color I found it confusing to quickly choose what I wanted.
Camera was a toss up. Some photos were great, some not.
I never got around to playing games on it because battery life was so bad.
Anyway you get the idea. I gave it a shot and I will be keeping an eye on it.
I hope it works out for all you others.
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Click to collapse
I agree with you on many, but not all.
I took some pictures last night, and I have to say the button to use ( like a camera ) is the most annoying thing ever, the HD2 / I phone and I think many phone on screen touch button was the best, you tap it, it auto focuses and walla good pics, I took 15 pictures last night in a low light condition with flash, not one is clear, every pic came out blurry, then I realized its because i move the phone a tiny bit when attempting to press the worst button created for taking pictures.
I still have 10 days left before I can return mine, going to contemplate.

MartyLK said:
I'm keeping mine. I actually love it. I had a first gen iPhone and loved it. This HD7 and WP7 is every bit as good as that iPhone and is better in numerous ways. To me, it feels like a luxurious high-end Lexus or Infiniti. I find it to be the absolute best phone ever created. Just purely gorgeous from every aspect, externally and internally. WP7 is a sweet piece of kit.
Too bad you are giving up on it. The next update will likely solve your concerns. I knew what would be *initially* lacking in WP7 and still find it pure bliss.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My thoughts exactly. I knew what I was getting, and what I wasn't, and I love it!
I find it a bit strange as well to go back to Android on the HDS - why not the Desire HD - same phone but actually made for Android?!

I love the new Windows Phone 7 OS, but the HTC HD7 really is a piece of s**t. Ive got to send mine away for repair already due to the power button getting stuck in, not exactly what you'd call a high end quality product. Ive had plenty of HTC phones, since the days of the XDA 1, and to be honest they have all been utter s***e. Im definately never going to buy another HTC product, I suppose thats what you get for buyin stuff that comes from China.

rob_p said:
I find it a bit strange as well to go back to Android on the HDS - why not the Desire HD - same phone but actually made for Android?!
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Because I own the HD2 and the Nexus 1...so Im using the ones I have until the Nexus S comes out, hopefully in december.

s1nn0n said:
I love the new Windows Phone 7 OS, but the HTC HD7 really is a piece of s**t. Ive got to send mine away for repair already due to the power button getting stuck in, not exactly what you'd call a high end quality product. Ive had plenty of HTC phones, since the days of the XDA 1, and to be honest they have all been utter s***e. Im definately never going to buy another HTC product, I suppose thats what you get for buyin stuff that comes from China.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Most phones and most electronics come from China. The iPhone, designed and developed in the USA, is made in China. Most Sony phones...Japanese phones...are made in China. Pretty much any electronic equipment you own is likely made in China. HTC is a Taiwan company and is the major producer of nearly all the major phones from most companies. They made all the Palm devices prior to the Pre and Pixi...not sure who makes the Pre and Pixi now. Apple has always used Foxconn ...a Chinese company... for production of the iPhone and most, if not all, of their other products. MS used a Chinese producer for the Zunes. HTC is a similar producer. They are contracted by a number of electronics makers to produce their products. The HTC quality has always been quite good. But, until recently, that quality has nose dived a bit...for whatever reason.
My HTC HD7 is an outstanding phone. The quality is exemplary. But it took 3 other, defective, HD7s to get the good one. I feel my HD7 is like a high-class, high-end automobile in look, feel and construction.

Hi guys,
Using my HD7 for the last 5 days and until now everything runs fine
In my opinion this is an outstanding phone. Excellent quality and the new SO is very good for my use (professional and personal)
Of course some things must be corrected by MS, let's wait for the updates that all people are waiting

Nokia to beat Android?

Here's the article: http://www.engadget.com/2011/02/13/nokia-our-first-priority-is-beating-android/
My first thoughts were....hahahaha! In their dreams.
Open source can't be beat, simple as that. But Google do need to come up with a better strategy for implementing their OS on the devices otherwise fragmentation will drive potential customers away.
In my view WP7 is a step backwards, the UI is horrible with home being filed with tons of tiles that you have to scroll through, no real multitasking, locked down like iOS etc, and now Nokia thinks that this move will beat Android. Are they that arrogant?
I did a speed test comparison between DHD and HD7 and WP7 got its ass smacked, it loaded apps/games much slower.
They should of made a better version of N900, that was not a bad phone but could of been a monster.
Your thoughts?

The day that Nokia has dominance over Android, I will get an iphone. I currently own the 1 and only Evo 4g, rooted, stock. (wireless tether of course).

yeah i think nokia is making a bad move

lol good old nokia trying to make a comeback...

I honestly don't know who even carries Nokia phones anymore They once made really nice phones. Windows mobile or phone 7 or what ever they are calling it this year is in the same boat imo. I carried wm since the HTC 8125. And year after year I pationatly waited for ms to get it right, and they never did. It did get better in terms of reliability but I still had to reset my tilt 2 a few times a week.
I think the team up could be good for them but I could care less.
To me, It's like 2 old men in your neighborhood teaming up and thinking they are gonna take back that snow shoveling biz that they had when they were kids all the while everyone already has the youngsters down the street with their self propelled snow blowers that knock out the jobs in no time.
They pissed off most of us loyal wm folks along time ago and you know how that saying about screw me once, screw me twice goes....not gonna happen to me.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App

Hmmnn, noki is not going anywhere except in your dreams

Speaking of steps backwards hows the whole no GPU accelerated UI treating you guys? I'm loving having a homescreen that doesnt look like an iphone ripoff. Nokia has an astounding market share in the European market, they have the power to help drive WP7 much higher. Call it a step backwards if you'd like. It's nice to not have to flash a new rom at least once a week to have a functional phone.

I like Nokias phones. My brother has the n8 and the camera is amazing! hopefully this works out and I'll get a nokia with a xenon flash

z33dev33l said:
Speaking of steps backwards hows the whole no GPU accelerated UI treating you guys? I'm loving having a homescreen that doesnt look like an iphone ripoff. Nokia has an astounding market share in the European market, they have the power to help drive WP7 much higher. Call it a step backwards if you'd like. It's nice to not have to flash a new rom at least once a week to have a functional phone.
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There it is, that's what I was waiting for.
UI is hardware accelerated on 2.3 and up, even 2.2 can have it with a minor file modification. How the no copy/paste going? Or hows the whole can't edit a email when forwarding going? When M$ bring out an update will you jump around like a little schoolgirl and call it innovation? C'mon man, the OS is seriously lacking the most important features, it's shameful.
Sure stock UIs layout is slightly like iPhones but looks nothing like it though. You see, I can make the UI looks how I want which fits my needs, not what a few guys think it should be.
Flashing ROMs has nothing to do with having a functional phone, it's only to improve it further and bring out the potential.
Nokia may help with a few sales but many longtime fans will turn around and look elsewhere for a phone to fulfill their needs.

Nokia wont ever beat android
Sent from my ADR6300 using XDA App

Why not??? Nokia will beat Android... Didnt u read the article?

ErOR22 said:
There it is, that's what I was waiting for.
UI is hardware accelerated on 2.3 and up, even 2.2 can have it with a minor file modification. How the no copy/paste going? Or hows the whole can't edit a email when forwarding going? When M$ bring out an update will you jump around like a little schoolgirl and call it innovation? C'mon man, the OS is seriously lacking the most important features, it's shameful.
Sure stock UIs layout is slightly like iPhones but looks nothing like it though. You see, I can make the UI looks how I want which fits my needs, not what a few guys think it should be.
Flashing ROMs has nothing to do with having a functional phone, it's only to improve it further and bring out the potential.
Nokia may help with a few sales but many longtime fans will turn around and look elsewhere for a phone to fulfill their needs.
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Important features? in the 2 years I had android I can not remember a single occurrence in which I used C&P or needed to edit a forwarded email. Would it be nice? Sure. Is it necessary? Not at all. The point is while android has these features most of them are haphazardly thrown together and hardly functional where what WP7 has (even though it is lacking some features) truly works without having to jump through hoops. GPU acceleration is possible apparently on 2.3 plus but due to fragmentation and other issues it isn't implemented. If you can truly say the vibrant with its impossible lag or the dodgy touchscreen on the cliq or any of the other ill built phones were functional before custom roms your much more prone to fanboyism than I. It's nice to have a phone that really works, android was a low-end alternative to the iphone, putting it on high end devices is like throwing a Chevy cavalier engine in a lambo, it just makes them look bad except to the community thats always flashing roms which frankl, I dont have the time for any more.

I think Nokia partnering with Microsoft to make WP7 phones is a dumb move. Elop was quoted as saying Nokia is like being on a burning oil platform in the North Sea. So what he wants to do, is to jump onto another burning oil platform called WP7? I think it's entirely due to the fact that Elop is a former Microsoft exec!
I wasn't at all surprised, when I read an article yesterday that said investors were so upset with the news that Nokia stock price fell 14% and many Nokia employees were so upset, they used flex time and left work early.
What I think Nokia should have done, is partnered with Google and used Android. These new phones should be supplied with some kind of proprietary libraries or emulation that only works in Nokia phones to allow existing Symbian apps to run seamlessly. That way, it would provide a practical upgrade path for existing Nokia phone owners. This worked great for Apple when they went to OS X which was a completely different UNIX-based architecture, but used Rosetta to allow old PPC Mac OS apps to run. They could even market a play on words with Symbian related to symbiosis.
I just don't see how going to the smartphone platform with the least market share will help matters. WP7 has less market share than even old WinMo 6.x according to current stats.

GnatGoSplat said:
I think Nokia partnering with Microsoft to make WP7 phones is a dumb move. Elop was quoted as saying Nokia is like being on a burning oil platform in the North Sea. So what he wants to do, is to jump onto another burning oil platform called WP7? I think it's entirely due to the fact that Elop is a former Microsoft exec!
I wasn't at all surprised, when I read an article yesterday that said investors were so upset with the news that Nokia stock price fell 14% and many Nokia employees were so upset, they used flex time and left work early.
What I think Nokia should have done, is partnered with Google and used Android. These new phones should be supplied with some kind of proprietary libraries or emulation that only works in Nokia phones to allow existing Symbian apps to run seamlessly. That way, it would provide a practical upgrade path for existing Nokia phone owners. This worked great for Apple when they went to OS X which was a completely different UNIX-based architecture, but used Rosetta to allow old PPC Mac OS apps to run. They could even market a play on words with Symbian related to symbiosis.
I just don't see how going to the smartphone platform with the least market share will help matters. WP7 has less market share than even old WinMo 6.x according to current stats.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Your whole argument is based on the foundation that WP7 in 4 months didn't sell as much as WM did since 03? Really? Ya don't say? Their choices were either be just another fish in the android OEM pool that would have received no more attention and no more rights than any other or be THE manufacturer of WP7. Really though, why would you jump from marketing symbian to marketing some re-skinned version of android... that's like jumping from Windows ME to windows Vista. They're both buggy and both require tons of modification before they're usable. Android only sold because it was marketed by google and essentially looked like a low-end iphone for every carrier. WP7 is innovation, it currently lacks a few basic features but what it does have works and thats more than any other OS except iOS can say and honestly, who wants those hardware limitations and ugly UI?

Well, we all know what Vic Gundotra thinks about this...

z33dev33l said:
Your whole argument is based on the foundation that WP7 in 4 months didn't sell as much as WM did since 03? Really? Ya don't say? Their choices were either be just another fish in the android OEM pool that would have received no more attention and no more rights than any other or be THE manufacturer of WP7. Really though, why would you jump from marketing symbian to marketing some re-skinned version of android... that's like jumping from Windows ME to windows Vista. They're both buggy and both require tons of modification before they're usable. Android only sold because it was marketed by google and essentially looked like a low-end iphone for every carrier. WP7 is innovation, it currently lacks a few basic features but what it does have works and thats more than any other OS except iOS can say and honestly, who wants those hardware limitations and ugly UI?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, my whole argument is based on WP7 being a sales FAIL. The comparison to WM is only a point of reference, because it's generally well accepted that except for a few fanboys, nobody likes WM.
No, their choices were to use Android, a product that people actually WANT, vs WP7, a product that nobody wants. It doesn't matter how awesome or innovative you may think WP7 is, if nobody wants it, nobody's going to buy it. So if Nokia wants to make money, and unless I'm mistaken, but all companies exist to do one thing and that is make money, they should choose the platform that makes money rather than one nobody wants.
You're saying iOS has an ugly UI? Compared to WP7? Seriously? For most people I know (and according to sales figures, most people worldwide), the UI is what turned them off to WP7 and drove them to Android or iOS.

z33dev33l said:
Important features? in the 2 years I had android I can not remember a single occurrence in which I used C&P or needed to edit a forwarded email. Would it be nice? Sure. Is it necessary? Not at all. The point is while android has these features most of them are haphazardly thrown together and hardly functional where what WP7 has (even though it is lacking some features) truly works without having to jump through hoops. GPU acceleration is possible apparently on 2.3 plus but due to fragmentation and other issues it isn't implemented. If you can truly say the vibrant with its impossible lag or the dodgy touchscreen on the cliq or any of the other ill built phones were functional before custom roms your much more prone to fanboyism than I. It's nice to have a phone that really works, android was a low-end alternative to the iphone, putting it on high end devices is like throwing a Chevy cavalier engine in a lambo, it just makes them look bad except to the community thats always flashing roms which frankl, I dont have the time for any more.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
lol wut?
This is basic functionality I use most days. Even if I used it monthly the whole point is that when I need it it's there, thats the power of android. You don't need all the features every day, but when you do need it its all there ready.

I will take a speedy UI and no c&p over the opposite any day. No one dropped wp7 and turned to Android or IOS because of the UI. No one has used wp7 because they're a fanboy of either of the other oses and think anything else is wrong. Wp7 in its first poor iteration has a more complete feeling than any of the 30ish Android devices I've owned and that's just sad. Wp7 is small now because people fear change regardless of how much smoother the user experience is.

z33dev33l said:
I will take a speedy UI and no c&p over the opposite any day. No one dropped wp7 and turned to Android or IOS because of the UI. No one has used wp7 because they're a fanboy of either of the other oses and think anything else is wrong. Wp7 in its first poor iteration has a more complete feeling than any of the 30ish Android devices I've owned and that's just sad. Wp7 is small now because people fear change regardless of how much smoother the user experience is.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not true. The only fanboys I know are on this site. I've recently talked to many smartphone n00bs who are getting a smartphone for the first time. Just from playing with the phone in the showroom, they narrow it down to Android or iPhone. WP7 is never even considered. Some people will switch from Android to iPhone and vice versa. People on this forum excluded, I don't know anyone who has even considered going from iPhone to WP7 or Android to WP7. Even my wife, who isn't even remotely a fanboy, has no interest in WP7 simply because she doesn't like how, "it looks so plain and boring". Maybe people would love WP7 if they actually used it for awhile, but Microsoft can't even get them through the door, much less reel them in.

Wp7 needs a mascot like a bald guy in a turtleneck or a little green robot. Then it would be srsbiz.

Who cares about iPhone5 ? It's outdated already

I don't get the crazy foaming at the mouth hype for the upcoming iPhone5 Unless I am missing something, it still is still very much going to be like the iPhone4, which was like the iPhone3, rinse and repeat...The iPhone1 was way cool and bad ass, but Apple seemed to stop innovation after that.
I am a very happy Nexus-S owner, but there are some really cool phones due out this Fall to be excited about. Windows Mango running on a Samsung Galaxy S II hardware device will be uber cool And the Nexus-Three with the all new next gen Android OS "Ice Cream" will also be awesome.
To me the iPhone needs major changes to get back into the game. Still just a screen full of app icons Ok they finally added a notification bar, about time. What about widgets ? Or total customization out of the box, without a jailbreak ? How about a 4.3" AMOLED screen ? I don't know, but to me the last few iPhone releases don't look radically different, just more of the same, with a few old tweaks added.
end of rant/

Zorachus said:
I don't get the crazy foaming at the mouth hype for the upcoming iPhone5 Unless I am missing something, it still is still very much going to be like the iPhone4, which was like the iPhone3, rinse and repeat...The iPhone1 was way cool and bad ass, but Apple seemed to stop innovation after that.
I am a very happy Nexus-S owner, but there are some really cool phones due out this Fall to be excited about. Windows Mango running on a Samsung Galaxy S II hardware device will be uber cool And the Nexus-Three with the all new next gen Android OS "Ice Cream" will also be awesome.
To me the iPhone needs major changes to get back into the game. Still just a screen full of app icons Ok they finally added a notification bar, about time. What about widgets ? Or total customization out of the box, without a jailbreak ? How about a 4.3" AMOLED screen ? I don't know, but to me the last few iPhone releases don't look radically different, just more of the same, with a few old tweaks added.
end of rant/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Apple is never going to take those requests and put them into a phone.
Let me explain how apple works.
1. Buy parts from other manufacturers
2. Built electronics using cheaply bought parts (not knocking build quality)
3. Sell updated electronic from first ever design at an extremely high price
4. Profit from all the fanboys raving over the same device only with minor changes
LET THE TROLLING BEGIN! ;D

Zorachus said:
I don't get the crazy foaming at the mouth hype for the upcoming iPhone5 Unless I am missing something, it still is still very much going to be like the iPhone4, which was like the iPhone3, rinse and repeat...The iPhone1 was way cool and bad ass, but Apple seemed to stop innovation after that.
I am a very happy Nexus-S owner, but there are some really cool phones due out this Fall to be excited about. Windows Mango running on a Samsung Galaxy S II hardware device will be uber cool And the Nexus-Three with the all new next gen Android OS "Ice Cream" will also be awesome.
To me the iPhone needs major changes to get back into the game. Still just a screen full of app icons Ok they finally added a notification bar, about time. What about widgets ? Or total customization out of the box, without a jailbreak ? How about a 4.3" AMOLED screen ? I don't know, but to me the last few iPhone releases don't look radically different, just more of the same, with a few old tweaks added.
end of rant/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I watched an Apple keynote about the iPhone 5 and showing the improvements and all. Before I saw the demonstration I thought the iPhone 5 would be like a whole new OS. After the demonstration it was the same tired old thing. I have an iPhone 4 and appreciate it for its simplicity and reliability and quality. But it is a tired system. Apple truly needs to move on to something new and fresh.
By the way, I love my Nexus S also. Just an excellent phone.

Your logic is sound more or less. But I could gurantee if apple released the iphone 5 that was exactly like the iphone 4 with only a cornea display as improvement, they would have the same if not more people buying the phone. When it comes to marketing, apple knows what they are doing.
They could sell someone a spoon for $10.
It would be nice to see something revolutionary spec wise like sgs2 from apple, it would warrent the pricing.

Of course the iPhone5 will have upgraded hardware, but based on the past four iPhone releases, the iPhone1 and iPhone4 are NOT radically different to the average joe blow, minor updates to the same tired OS. My sister-in-law, a huge tech geek, still uses her iPhone1 she bought in 2007, she sees no reason to upgrade to a new iPhone4, which doesn't look that much different to her. And she uses Mac Book Air's, and a MAC computer, etc...
I myself have owned the iPhone1 and iPhone3G, they were the greatest things ever back then, then a year after the 3G was getting stale and old to me, I saw the Nexus-One and never looked back, loving my rooted and custom ROM'd Nexus-S now, and looking forward to a Samsung WinMo 7 Mango phone on a Galaxy S II device or the Nexus-Three this Fall.

MIUI is proof positive that Android is superior

Loved the sex appeal of both phones I have owned but..... I got an ATRIX... will never return to iOS
Sent from my MB860 using XDA App

MartyLK said:
. I have an iPhone 4 and appreciate it for its simplicity and reliability and quality.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
after the constant irritation of having my leo for over a year, and reading the complaints of so many newer phones, I am considering an iphone.
I've flashed, hacked, ruined, and revived my hd2 numerous times, now I am burned out with playing around...i want honest reliability and a phone that simply WORKS dangit.
Not to mention the abuse for asking noob questions of hotheaded smart mouth xda members with "experience from the gods" who post everywhere with the same insulting "you're an idiot noob" type responses.
Look, I'm 38, married' business owner with 5 terrific kids...gimme a break already I'm not young with endless time and a bottomless wallet...just help out that's all.
Thank goodness for operation iron fist eh?
so, to answer the op, i might be.
neener neener.
p.s. i do not like the religious nature of apple fanboys however i am not gonna need to ask noob questions with an iphone, so they won't be a problem...

kidrythm said:
after the constant irritation of having my leo for over a year, and reading the complaints of so many newer phones, I am considering an iphone.
I've flashed, hacked, ruined, and revived my hd2 numerous times, now I am burned out with playing around...i want honest reliability and a phone that simply WORKS dangit.
Not to mention the abuse for asking noob questions of hotheaded smart mouth xda members with "experience from the gods" who post everywhere with the same insulting "you're an idiot noob" type responses.
Look, I'm 38, married' business owner with 5 terrific kids...gimme a break already I'm not young with endless time and a bottomless wallet...just help out that's all.
Thank goodness for operation iron fist eh?
so, to answer the op, i might be.
neener neener.
p.s. i do not like the religious nature of apple fanboys however i am not gonna need to ask noob questions with an iphone, so they won't be a problem...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Certainly sorry to hear android users give u such a hard time. Not that im taking up for them but over at the x10 forums I can see the same question asked on the same page 3 times with the answer in a post above, lmao. They are just frustrated that and ur chosen name prolly didnt help LOL
But by all means try an iphone and tell us about the experience or maybe even take a look at some reviews or read the forums of some android devices before going for the buy.

kidrythm said:
after the constant irritation of having my leo for over a year, and reading the complaints of so many newer phones, I am considering an iphone.
I've flashed, hacked, ruined, and revived my hd2 numerous times, now I am burned out with playing around...i want honest reliability and a phone that simply WORKS dangit.
Not to mention the abuse for asking noob questions of hotheaded smart mouth xda members with "experience from the gods" who post everywhere with the same insulting "you're an idiot noob" type responses.
Look, I'm 38, married' business owner with 5 terrific kids...gimme a break already I'm not young with endless time and a bottomless wallet...just help out that's all.
Thank goodness for operation iron fist eh?
so, to answer the op, i might be.
neener neener.
p.s. i do not like the religious nature of apple fanboys however i am not gonna need to ask noob questions with an iphone, so they won't be a problem...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I understand you very well about the responses people get here in XDA. Mainly it comes from young people who don't really have much life experience. But I've learned to let it roll off my shoulder.
The iPhone does indeed just work. It's super reliable as long as you don't jailbreak it. But the Nexus S is Google's iPhone and is better, in my opinion, that than the iPhone for all-around usability. Just don't customize with different ROMs. You can root for the sole purpose of using certain apps that require root, and I did that to mine. But I didn't allow the process to retain the custom recovery image and I let it return to the OEM recovery image then relocked it. I have a Nexus S that is completely stock in every way but is rooted to let me use root apps, which is all I care about in rooting.
The iPhone has a simpler video calling interface than the Nexus S. But once you get the right app set up on the Nexus, it is pretty much super simple. Oh...and the iPhone can't be beat for battery life. It's purely amazing how long the battery lasts on my iPhone 4. That is something Android can't compete with. The BL of Android is just generally horrendous. The NS isn't too bad, though, once you run through a few charge/discharge cycles.

kidrythm said:
after the constant irritation of having my leo for over a year, and reading the complaints of so many newer phones, I am considering an iphone.
I've flashed, hacked, ruined, and revived my hd2 numerous times, now I am burned out with playing around...i want honest reliability and a phone that simply WORKS dangit.
Not to mention the abuse for asking noob questions of hotheaded smart mouth xda members with "experience from the gods" who post everywhere with the same insulting "you're an idiot noob" type responses.
Look, I'm 38, married' business owner with 5 terrific kids...gimme a break already I'm not young with endless time and a bottomless wallet...just help out that's all.
Thank goodness for operation iron fist eh?
so, to answer the op, i might be.
neener neener.
p.s. i do not like the religious nature of apple fanboys however i am not gonna need to ask noob questions with an iphone, so they won't be a problem...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Flash to stock for stability and wait for updates? :shrugs:
Sent from my Motorola StarTac using XDA App.

kidrythm said:
after the constant irritation of having my leo for over a year, and reading the complaints of so many newer phones, I am considering an iphone.
I've flashed, hacked, ruined, and revived my hd2 numerous times, now I am burned out with playing around...i want honest reliability and a phone that simply WORKS dangit.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've gone from iphone 2g to my first android SGS2..
The iphone has their fair share of issues with firmware and updates. Once you start to mod and flash that thing, you're going to encounter the same issues you encountered with the Android.
If you want something that works out of the box, you have to just resist modding it..

bdpyo said:
Flash to stock for stability and wait for updates? :shrugs:
Sent from my Motorola StarTac using XDA App.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1
I was pretty close to shipping the thing to mskip with funding to execute his protocol for nandroid...lol.
thinking over it, i despise apple, have since the eighties and with the new crowd of hipster d00ds ugh (i skipped sxsw).
no iphone for me...

just my 2 cents going out there...
I do love my android, it amazes me with what it can do and I learn to do new things all the time. it really grows on you. I love android, but iOS stole my soul haha. I think its the fact of having an iPhone, the "bandwagon" everyone is on, the "revolutionary" aspect, isn't very revolutionary. I'd say close to 50%? of us have 8 MP cameras, but if the iPhone 5 or 4G has one, everyone will think its the most amazing thing ever.
I have this discussion a lot with my friend, we both came from iOS, hundreds of jailbreaks, bricked devices, DFU mode nightmares, the whole nine yards. he went to windows, I'm on android. the latest we've done is build custom hackintoshes, so we dual boot OS X and win7, and I always find myself using apple... I supose its the simplicity of it and the fact that its so well known, the fact that there isn't 200 different devices. an iPhone is an iPhone, in a way it is revolutionary no matter what they seem to do, and I admit eventually I will go back to it for college, buy a Mac book air. they speak for themselves, and IMHO, I don't think apple will ever be less than number 1...
Sent from my Incredible 2 using XDA App

Let me start by saying i am not a fanboy or a hater or anythign of those sorts. I respect what each os brings to the table. I use android and that is all i will use for the fact of customization and that i can do wateva the f*** i want to it. I have never been a fan of crapple products but i absolutely love the release of a new iPhone for 2 main reasons. The first is that, everytime apple releases a product, google releases their newest state-of-the-art product. Secondly, it gives me another chance to show my friends that my phone is still better than theirs.

rizdog23 said:
Let me start by saying i am not a fanboy or a hater or anythign of those sorts. I respect what each os brings to the table. I use android and that is all i will use for the fact of customization and that i can do wateva the f*** i want to it. I have never been a fan of crapple products but i absolutely love the release of a new iPhone for 2 main reasons. The first is that, everytime apple releases a product, google releases their newest state-of-the-art product. Secondly, it gives me another chance to show my friends that my phone is still better than theirs.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
LOL yeah. Wait till your friend brags and shows off his new iPhone5 like its the second coming and then you pull out the new Nexus-Prime and he just cries in shame.
Sent from my Nexus S 4G using XDA Premium App

Zorachus said:
I don't get the crazy foaming at the mouth hype for the upcoming iPhone5 Unless I am missing something, it still is still very much going to be like the iPhone4, which was like the iPhone3, rinse and repeat...The iPhone1 was way cool and bad ass, but Apple seemed to stop innovation after that.
I am a very happy Nexus-S owner, but there are some really cool phones due out this Fall to be excited about. Windows Mango running on a Samsung Galaxy S II hardware device will be uber cool And the Nexus-Three with the all new next gen Android OS "Ice Cream" will also be awesome.
To me the iPhone needs major changes to get back into the game. Still just a screen full of app icons Ok they finally added a notification bar, about time. What about widgets ? Or total customization out of the box, without a jailbreak ? How about a 4.3" AMOLED screen ? I don't know, but to me the last few iPhone releases don't look radically different, just more of the same, with a few old tweaks added.
end of rant/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Text in mty sig sez it all

I was a happy iPhone owner of the first two generations, I have just moved on, found it getting stale with hardly any changes, besides the obvious hardware upgrades yearly, it is the app drawer always open look I can't stand, plus the "toy" Fischer Price look and feel of the settings and icons, feels more like a chick phone or non techie phone, more for the average Joe blow.

I think both platforms are great.
I had an iPhone all the way up to 3g. It was an awesome device for it's time. It worked right out of the box with little to no setup. iTunes had a ton of apps to choose from and once jailbroken you could change the theme and do a few other nifty things.
BUT... it was god awful slow - I never had 3g speeds in my area, and even back to stock was a pain to have to wait... and wait... and wait for it to do ANYTHING.
My buddy got an iPhone 4 and although it is sleek and it runs great - I wasn't super impressed - it was the same ol phone but now had a front facing camera.
You were still stuck with the limitations of what Apple allowed you to have - no expansion, no switching out the battery, and no control over on how your phone looks/feels/tweaks etc...
I received a Samsung Captivate for my birthday. The screen is gorgeous, I had access to the battery and could even add memory! I didn't miss the front facing camera.. and the back camera is decent.
But right out of the box I had to come here and flash a custom ROM. This is a blessing and a curse. I had to spend a lot of time (ok hours) to ensure I didn't brick my brand new device.
Skip to today and I still have the same phone for over a year. Still snappy, the screen is still gorgeous. And now I have my choice of ROMs that I can easily and quickly flash to my device. Currently I run MIUI - which to me is a blend of awesomeness... of both IOS and Android
Either way... Apple designs a great device which is designed to be "thrown away" for the next model (which has been their business model for years now.) Its a great business plan.
That and since they (Apple) spend so much time with marketing and design of a "great" smartphone - the sheeple eat it up. I'm not knocking folks who get the device. It will work out of the box and you don't have to **** around with it for hours.
I personally prefer Android devices - I get to do what I want with them and I live with the bugs. As long as it's stable enough to make phone calls, send/rcv txts, and I can check my email - I'm good.

looking for the best online deal for a cellphone.

Okay, so im looking for the best deal online for a cellphone preferably through t-mobile and it'd need to be windows phone 7. I am willing to sign a new contract, at&Ts network is just too overloaded in my area and t-mobile is just a bit more friendly. I dont care if it's the venue pro or the hd7 and I've checked wirefly and lets talk. I just want to find the best deal for my money.

Or you could go android....
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using XDA App

Amazon? xD

Nerz said:
Or you could go android....
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not desperate enough to downgrade like that.

try amazon!

Thanks for the Amazon suggestions. I'd never actually used Amazon before but it's 50 dollars less. If I can't find anything better by tomorrow I'm switching over.

If you cannot handle Android's Suzuki Hayabusa, it's a good idea to stick with WP7's pink Huffy with training wheels. Amazon is great either way.
Sent from my LG G2x

TJBunch1228 said:
If you cannot handle Android's Suzuki Hayabusa, it's a good idea to stick with WP7's pink Huffy with training wheels. Amazon is great either way.
Sent from my LG G2x
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
nice, compare the OS who's main complaints are lag and fragmentation to the fast bike, outstanding. This thread was not intended to turn into a **** measuring contest between OSes, I've reduced enough fandroids to petty 2nd grade insults in every other one of those I've entered. This thread was simply to get some advice, stop trying to compensate for your perpetually dated OS.

Remove panties, untwist, reapply.
If you are happy using a child-friendly phone, surely you can take a joke.
Sent from my LG G2x

Thank you for proving my point, if child friendly means Im not forced to spend hours modifying it before it can pass as functional then I'm more than happy. Look mommy, no lag.

Yep, Android is the most successful mobile OS, with the largest marketshare and the fastest growth in the history of cellular technology precisely because it requires hours of technical modification before it even becomes usable...
WP7 is barely a blip on the mobile OS radar because the only thing it offers is a smooth UI. It accomplishes this by having no customization. You can play with the phone for a day and have done everything the phone is capable of. This appeals to (a tiny minority) of people who want something to hold their hands while they go about their facebooking and emailing. There is nothing that WP7 offers that Android is incapable of doing, but the list of things WP7 is incapable of would turn any forum post into a Novella.
You like the simplicity of WP7, cool. Those pretty colors on the blocks that tell you if you have an email or text message are rad. I can run a fully functional WP7 launcher on my phone and stare at that before I go into a boredom coma. How many Android launchers with widgets, live wallpapers and customizable icons can you run on your super sweet OS?
Sent from my LG G2x

I believe the term here, and I apologize for my butchering of the English language, is, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." Yes, android is the largest and fastest growing mobile OS, lets go to t-mobile's website, oh, 2 free android phones and some free flip phones, wonder which I'm going to pick. Hmm, let's try ATT, wow, same thing. Android can be used by anybody, any oem, and because of that it's optimized for nobody. This is why it will always feel like going back to windows 95 to me.
As far as your other statement goes, the UI is a massive selling point, absolutely lag free. However, it does have other points. The social networking integration can not come close with any number of apps on android, Zune pass annihilates any service on android, wp7 makes gaming on android look like a joke for the most part and has full Xbox live integration, the most amusing game I've found thus far on either OS came out near each of their releases. For windows phone 7 its the beautifully crafted IloMilo and for android it's a basic tower defense game, robo-defense. Still robo-defense doesn't work on a number of devices because of *gasp* fragmentation. With the release of your new android device the sword of Damocles is hanging over your head, fat chance that it's ever going to see an update. I own an S2 as well and that things been in my kitchen drawer since 2 days after I got it because it has no wow factor at all. Sure opposed to most android phones the lag is greatly reduced but that's about as relevant as coming in first in the special olympics.
For us devs, the dev environment of wp7 is 1000 times easier than androids and much more user friendly, last I heard androids dev support doesn't even offer anything more than a dead email address anymore. Most importantly, wp7 is people-centric as they like to call it. The main point of a phone is to keep up with people and for that it's perfect. I can pull up a contact, read up on what's going on, message them on Facebook or via SMS, hell I could shoot em an email if I wanted to I suppose. I can do all of this with the full facebook/twitter/live integration out of the box (and yes, my most recent hd7 shipped with mango so I guess they are shipping them out that way now)
Finally, sure, you could launch a piss poor emulation of wp7 on your device, you could even get a cheap rip-off of our keyboard and while imitation is the most sincere form of flattery, regardless of how poorly done, windows doesn't need to do that because hey look, our OS actually works. If it ran on every piece of hardware, if OEMs didn't have to pay for it, and if we'd let Chinese companies that make tablets and sell em for 80 dollars use our OS then we'd have all that hype too. Of course then we'd likely be laggy, fragmented, and always feel like windows 95.

Well it wasn't my intention to derail the thread from it's original topic, I was just being a smart ass.
That being said, I am honestly glad Microsoft is doing atleast a decent enough job to pull a couple users away from Android. WP7 is useless to me as well as the majority of other heavy users, but competition breeds innovation. The better WP7 gets, the better the competition gets in response. Win-win.
I'll consider going back to WP7 when it offers the ability to modify and update the OS and UI independent of Microsoft and the carriers whim. They have free wifi tether yet, either?
Sent from my LG G2x

z33dev33l said:
I believe the term here, and I apologize for my butchering of the English language, is, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." Yes, android is the largest and fastest growing mobile OS, lets go to t-mobile's website, oh, 2 free android phones and some free flip phones, wonder which I'm going to pick. Hmm, let's try ATT, wow, same thing. Android can be used by anybody, any oem, and because of that it's optimized for nobody. This is why it will always feel like going back to windows 95 to me.
As far as your other statement goes, the UI is a massive selling point, absolutely lag free. However, it does have other points. The social networking integration can not come close with any number of apps on android, Zune pass annihilates any service on android, wp7 makes gaming on android look like a joke for the most part and has full Xbox live integration, the most amusing game I've found thus far on either OS came out near each of their releases. For windows phone 7 its the beautifully crafted IloMilo and for android it's a basic tower defense game, robo-defense. Still robo-defense doesn't work on a number of devices because of *gasp* fragmentation. With the release of your new android device the sword of Damocles is hanging over your head, fat chance that it's ever going to see an update. I own an S2 as well and that things been in my kitchen drawer since 2 days after I got it because it has no wow factor at all. Sure opposed to most android phones the lag is greatly reduced but that's about as relevant as coming in first in the special olympics.
For us devs, the dev environment of wp7 is 1000 times easier than androids and much more user friendly, last I heard androids dev support doesn't even offer anything more than a dead email address anymore. Most importantly, wp7 is people-centric as they like to call it. The main point of a phone is to keep up with people and for that it's perfect. I can pull up a contact, read up on what's going on, message them on Facebook or via SMS, hell I could shoot em an email if I wanted to I suppose. I can do all of this with the full facebook/twitter/live integration out of the box (and yes, my most recent hd7 shipped with mango so I guess they are shipping them out that way now)
Finally, sure, you could launch a piss poor emulation of wp7 on your device, you could even get a cheap rip-off of our keyboard and while imitation is the most sincere form of flattery, regardless of how poorly done, windows doesn't need to do that because hey look, our OS actually works. If it ran on every piece of hardware, if OEMs didn't have to pay for it, and if we'd let Chinese companies that make tablets and sell em for 80 dollars use our OS then we'd have all that hype too. Of course then we'd likely be laggy, fragmented, and always feel like windows 95.
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can't go wrong with tmobile lowest mainstream contract to offer its unlimited web plan. with being that said wp7 is a real battery hogger as i've heard i think that's what makes up for it's high end graphic UI's pushing it.

Mcds said:
can't go wrong with tmobile lowest mainstream contract to offer its unlimited web plan. with being that said wp7 is a real battery hogger as i've heard i think that's what makes up for it's high end graphic UI's pushing it.
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Yeah my pre-Mango HD7 got 4-6 hours of moderate to heavy use. But my OC'd and heavily animated G2x only gets a few more hours than that of the same use, so you pick your poison.
Sent from my LG G2x

Pre-mango I'll admit, my battery life on all four of my wp7 devices was a joke, my dvp is literally twice as strong battery-wise, my hd7 gets around 13 hours moderate-heavy usage, and my focus can go two days. That part blew me away. As for what you want from windows phone, the ability to update outside of Microsoft is there for htc's devices though I personally dont see the point in intentionally introducing fragmentation to an OS that is free of it. I doubt there will ever be much more customization than what's intact for the UI, honestly I love not having to move stuff around frequently always looking for that clean but efficient look but that was always just my personal aesthetic preference.