Database Develop

Kaiser GPS Problem workaround

Some people might experience with certain GPS software.
If you look at the log of the NMEA log, you might realize that it burst out every 6-10 seconds. After that you might wait for another 6-10 sec, which is unusable for real-time navigation. If you happen to meet this trouble.
I have a way which could allow normal update intervals.
Install GPSGATE, it create virtual GPS COM PORT and re-route the NMEA data.
Install GPSGATE, just use the default settings, it create the virtual GPS port as COM 1.
Just use GPS software on COM 1 .
software url: http://franson.com/gpsgate/

Can anyone confirm this works? Ive noticed my GPS works the same way. Im using the Kaiser / TyTn II with Mapking and i notice that i also get my signbal ins bursts and NOT a smooth stream. Anyone know if this will resolve the problem?

What is the update intervals with GPSGATE ?
Do you mean GPSGATE must be run concurrently with the other software TomTom 6 for example ?
It would be a good workaround for people who encounter this GPS issue.

could this be some delicious spam?

How exactly does the OP propose that a user space application can make the hardware produce data in a smoother stream?
I call BS.

seems like BS to me too...Probably some spam Can anyone who has tried it out verify if it really works or not?..
THKS

You don't need to use other GPS software concurrently,
just use the GPSGATE and mapking will do.
Remember you have to modify the settings in mapking to use the virtual com port ( com1 default)
Not SPAM

I am not sure, this is BS.
If I am not mistaken the GPSGATE will act like a "router" (middle man) between the GPS hardware (Internal GPS of Kaiser) and the application (TomTom).
If the GPS hardware is faulty (having problem) with bursting data every 10 seconds, then the GPSGATE will also receive bursting data every 10 seconds.
So, that's useless as long as the problem is in the GPS hardware.

Gpsproxy should be able to do the same thing and its free.

GPSGate is a splitter, allowing using more than one application with the same NMEA stream. It creates another virtual GPS COM port, that's it.
GPS on the Kaiser works great and I'm on SatNav business. Aquisition time is fast, reception is great and update ratio is every 1 sec, just like any other civilian GPS receiver. GPS is NOT evaluated by the refresh rate you see on the screen, other software will give you other rate, try OZI Explorer for instance. I used Kaiser with TomTom, Destinator & Ozi, all works really great even comparing to Sirf III GPS chipset embedded devices such as Eten X500, HTC Artemis and Asus 535.
Last, Microsoft has included the same functionality of GPS Gate in WM5 and WM6 under settings. You do not need to install any additional SW, you can send "trueman 12345" (the guy who opened this thread with 2 posts history) your money directly.

Thanks RonenB for this very usefull precision !

Thanks as well RonenB, However, it does not solve the odd occasional pause in the data that we're seeing. Is this hardware or software that needs help in the Kaiser?

Actually I'm not so sure we have defined the problem accurately here.
Examining the signal from the GPS shows some interesting info.
1
A satellite is locked onto for perhaps only one or two seconds at a time.
2
Several satellites can achieve a lock but out of these a few will be lost every few seconds
3
New satellites are also acquired every few seconds.
The Result
If you are in the presence of many satellites then there is a constant dropping of some and locking onto others. This leads to no problems as there are always a few satellites locked on and data flow is smooth.
BUT
If you are in the presence of only say 2 or 3 satellites it is possible to drop these two or three (as indicated above), but no new ones are acquired. In this situation there will be a few seconds before the first 2 or 3 lock in again. Result a gap in data flow to your GPS software.
Meaning
The Internal GPS is not polling data in bursts. In other words you cannot turn up the frequency of data polling (possible baud rate adjustment maybe). The data is continuous but if there are too few satellites then there can be gaps where it drops some satellites and does not lock others.
There are various applications that can show this behaviour graphically but tomtom shows it well on the satellite view screen.
Compared to external GPS satellite locks this works in a strangely different way. You will see the bars jumping around from a lock on this one to that one continuously. Only a problem as I say when there are only a few satellites in sight.
Mike
PS - I cannot see the advantage of GPSGate in this particular situation as it is due to momentary periods when no satellite is detected.
Having said all of the above, I find the GPS perfectly adequate for general use. Perhaps if I need spot on plotting data then it might be weak. However if I need that unusual level of accuracy I would not use my phone to do it. I regularly use mine in place of my car's tomtom and the results are on a par with the full tomtom device.

mikechannon said:
Actually I'm not so sure we have defined the problem accurately here.
Examining the signal from the GPS shows some interesting info.
1
A satellite is locked onto for perhaps only one or two seconds at a time.
2
Several satellites can achieve a lock but out of these a few will be lost every few seconds
3
New satellites are also acquired every few seconds.
The Result
If you are in the presence of many satellites then there is a constant dropping of some and locking onto others. This leads to no problems as there are always a few satellites locked on and data flow is smooth.
BUT
If you are in the presence of only say 2 or 3 satellites it is possible to drop these two or three (as indicated above), but no new ones are acquired. In this situation there will be a few seconds before the first 2 or 3 lock in again. Result a gap in data flow to your GPS software.
Meaning
The Internal GPS is not polling data in bursts. In other words you cannot turn up the frequency of data polling (possible baud rate adjustment maybe). The data is continuous but if there are too few satellites then there can be gaps where it drops some satellites and does not lock others.
There are various applications that can show this behaviour graphically but tomtom shows it well on the satellite view screen.
Compared to external GPS satellite locks this works in a strangely different way. You will see the bars jumping around from a lock on this one to that one continuously. Only a problem as I say when there are only a few satellites in sight.
Mike
PS - I cannot see the advantage of GPSGate in this particular situation as it is due to momentary periods when no satellite is detected.
Having said all of the above, I find the GPS perfectly adequate for general use. Perhaps if I need spot on plotting data then it might be weak. However if I need that unusual level of accuracy I would not use my phone to do it. I regularly use mine in place of my car's tomtom and the results are on a par with the full tomtom device.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ok, I believe that it is time to explain a little bit how GPS works.
The GPS satellites are transmitting their position rapidly. However, due to homeland security issues (US did not want to allow anyone to place a receiver in a jet fighter or a missile) civilian GPS receivers are limited to aquire position every 1 second only. This is not a problem for a normal user even for civilian aviation. Thus, when you look at the NMEA stream, you will see it coming in bursts and not as rapid as normal data. Since GPS strings are quite short, it is good enough for any navigation system.
Number of satellites aquired is not an indicator to anything. Like any RF system, the engineers can tweak the noise level so that it will look to you that you are receiving X amount of satellites, the signal is on the air anyway.
What is important though is the position of the satellites. the closer to the horizon, the less useable that satellite is to calulate the position. Therefore receivers are taking the best located satellites into account and ignoring others even of they are recieved. Valid fix (position) is aquired by at least 3 satellites for 2D (X,Y) and 4 or more for 3D (with elevation).
Result is that as a user, you should not bother too much looking into the stream or number of sattelite in use as long as you can get a valid fix. The important and effective elements are hidden from the user: number of transsistors in the GPS chipset, quality of antenna etc. User can just evaluate the overall preformance.
As I wrote above, the Kaiser integrated GPS surprised me for superb preformance. I just arrived this week from Israel to Germany and could get a fix as soon as I left the underground garage. I did not loose GPS signal even once since I started using the device. That includes forests and dence city centers. Real good job by HTC here.

This is the problem i am facing:
Im using MapKing with Hong Kong 2007 maps. Getting a fix is no problem. I can normally get a fix in about 10-15 secs. When i check the status page I will normally have a connection to 5-7 satelites.
The problem is that the icon does not move smoothly when i travel. In map king your position on the map is represented by a small car icon. It jumps from location to location every 3-5 secs but does not smoothly move along. Can someone please tell me if this is the case with tomtom as well? Maybe it a problem with mapking?

phame said:
This is the problem i am facing:
Im using MapKing with Hong Kong 2007 maps. Getting a fix is no problem. I can normally get a fix in about 10-15 secs. When i check the status page I will normally have a connection to 5-7 satelites.
The problem is that the icon does not move smoothly when i travel. In map king your position on the map is represented by a small car icon. It jumps from location to location every 3-5 secs but does not smoothly move along. Can someone please tell me if this is the case with tomtom as well? Maybe it a problem with mapking?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is a Mapking problem and you should contact their support. Does not happen to me with Destinator, TomTOm and Ozi.

Ok, there is no point to argue, if you really find yourself having problem with GPS update lag, then give it a try. No harm indeed...
In HK, there are people the validity of the work around. GPS proxy might also work as well( i think it is the same principal) just i wasn't aware of this good free software before hand..
http://www11.discuss.com.hk/viewthread.php?tid=5329804&extra=page=2
(u need an account and some chinese word knowledge)

trueman12345 said:
Ok, there is no point to argue, if you really find yourself having problem with GPS update lag, then give it a try. No harm indeed...
In HK, there are people the validity of the work around. GPS proxy might also work as well( i think it is the same principal) just i wasn't aware of this good free software before hand..
http://www11.discuss.com.hk/viewthread.php?tid=5329804&extra=page=2
(u need an account and some chinese word knowledge)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Quite agree it's worth trying, and the application has other uses too.
Mike

FYI: I got GPS to work easily by installing GPSViewer, opening COM4/4800baud and getting located. After that, using Google Maps was a breeze; total "trick" took me about 1 minute to figure out which is way quicker than some other workarounds on the internet.

I was driving with iGuidance for about 1 hour this morning and I'm seeing different behavoir for this bug. iGuidance also has an excellent GPS signal viewer, mine was showing 8 out of 8 sattellites, all green, all the time (they turn red when not receiving signal from a sat). My map was moving about once per second or slightly faster. The program only paused once after about 30 minutes into the trip, for about 20-30 seconds. The iGuidance program's moving arrow's color also changes color based on signal quality of the combined sattelite lock, Green for good 3D mapping, Yellow for 2D when there are minimal sats for navigating, and Red for no signal data. During this pause the arrow went Red to indicate no data.
This seems like a bug to me.

GPS - turn off static navigation

Is it possible turn off static navigation in GPS in Kaiser?
It is important for walk navigation and necessary for geocaching.

Hello,
I suppose that you can do it with this
http://w5.nuinternet.com/s660100031/SirfTech.htm
pt_t830

no, you cant.. this works with sirf chip only
in this time, you can't turn it off...

Is there really no way to turn off static nav on the Kaiser? I've upgraded from a Mio a701 which was great for geocaching, but this is just no good unless I can disable static nav.
What chipset is the GPS? I assume it's not Sirf III then?

I see it's a Qualcomm chipset and it doesn't look like it can be turned off. How stupid, makes the GPS useless for geocaching.

I'm really disappointed by the chipset in the Kaiser too, from what I've heard. I don't have mine in hand yet, but I've been doing lots of reading on it the last week while I build a list of Palm->WM programs for migration from my long time platform. At least until Palm gets off their ass.
I already have a Holux 236, I suspect what I'll do is use the Kaiser GPS for navigation and the Holux for geocaching. I'll see how that works out.

Little surprise that you jump the ship, khaytsus.
Not only poorer performance Qualcomm GPS chipset vs. SIRF III chipset, but also you will miss some of great palm applications e.g takephone, callrec, and ptunes.

I'm not too bothered about the 3d performance a lot of other people complain about, but being able to disable static nav is something that should not have been overlooked. It would have swayed me from buying a Kaiser in the first place, even though it's pretty much perfect for what I want apart from this issue.

(This message has been translated as Google Translate)
I had the TyTN II (Kaiser) in the main purchased for geocaching. I am very disappointed now appears that static navigation can not be disabled.
I hope that HTC soon gives a solution.

I have to ask what does this Static Navigation do? and what benifit would you have from turning it off?

When you are not moving (or moving slowly) it stops updating your GPS position. This stops apps like tomtom spinning the map round when youre at traffic lights, but if you need to find a precise point on foot as in Geocaching, it makes it very difficult becuse you have to keep walking fairly quickly for the direction arrow to show.

Termiter said:
Is it possible turn off static navigation in GPS in Kaiser?
It is important for walk navigation and necessary for geocaching.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It seems fine to me, Kaiser can detect slow walking speed quite accurately such as 1 or 2 mph. If you walk slower than 1mph, it can't tell.
For the SirfIII chip device with SN on (my ETEN M700), it ignores any speed under 3mph and keep you at the same position. With SN off then you are looking at another problem, your position jumps around even when you stand still.

I assume you have never tried geocaching, otherwise you would see the problem. You often need to stand still and let the gps average your position to determine exactly how far away you are. Before anyone chimes in saying it is only accurate to ~10m anyway, my Mio a701 would get me to within 2-3m every time.
When you place a geocache, you need to have your coords spot on. The only way to do this is to leave the gps averaging for a while. I use GPS Tuner for this, but it is useless on the Kaiser.
"Position jumping around" is what you need for on foot accurate GPS nav, but not good for tomtom etc. All I want is the option to choose for myself, which unlike Sirf III, is currently not available for this crappy Qualcomm GPS.

What is static navigation: click here
What I tried to turn static navigation of without any result (but it works on other divices with the same gps-chipset: SiRFstar III):
SiRFTech
SiRFDemo
MMSirf setup (direct download)
So I hope there follows also a solution for the Kaiser!

There is one solution...get a bluetooth GPS receiver with a SIRFIII chip. Not ideal, I agree, but for the most part I use the bluetooth GPS for geocaching and hiking both because it can turn off SN and because it's just a much more accurate chip in general. The internal works ok for hiking, but is more ideally suited for driving applications.
@Geinponem: it doesn't have a SirfStar III gps chipset. That is part of the problem.

@Geinponem: it doesn't have a SirfStar III gps chipset. That is part of the problem.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
See here the specifications of MY TyTN II (this is the site where I bought the divice). Sorry its a Dutch site.
Here and here another Dutch sites.
Is the information wrong on this sites? Or is the build-in chipset not in every country the same?
BTW: where do you hold your BT-GPSr by geocaching. Can you put it in your pocket?

I don't get it, on my Kaiser the GPS continues updating normally even when static, as if I leave the phone on a table the position will always change a little at each reading.

Updating of the current position is great!
The problem is that the direction of the destination by low speed is not updated. In programs like GPSTuner the destination arrow is 'frozen' then.

That's totally normal. A GPS can't give you a direction (heading) when it doesn't move. If it gives you one it's just derived from the position error (even if the GPS is stationary, there will be a little position error between consecutive readings, and the direction the GPS gives will be the one between those points) so it means nothing at all.
By the way, in GPS Tuner by default there's a filter that ignores new GPS data if speed is under something like 2km/h. So even if the GPS does give info, the program discards it. You need to turn that off in the GPS options.

Nghiem said:
Little surprise that you jump the ship, khaytsus.
Not only poorer performance Qualcomm GPS chipset vs. SIRF III chipset, but also you will miss some of great palm applications e.g takephone, callrec, and ptunes.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've found the Tilt's GPS to be VERY accurate, in fact, it beats some of the stand-alone GPS units out there. I live in a very rural area, and it finds my house EXACTLY on the money, I am very impressed!
Edit-I see a lot in this thread who don't have their location or carrier in their posting info, it would help a lot if we knew that

GPS Issue: Loss of satellites -> Softreset necessary?

Hi!
I encountered a strange GPS behaviour and wanted to share this with you / maybe someone has an idea bout this one:
On a businessjourney i wanted to log my way with my kaiser, and everything went fine so far. But after several hunderts of kilometres, kaiser lost more and more satellites till only 1 was left and the values were unuseable (phantasy-koordinates, speed and altitude too).
I am 100% sure that it was not a problem with our jet or any kind of shielding in it - because after a softreset it could lock again on 8 to 12 satellites. I could approve this strange loss of statellites on longer flights and car etappes (lets say 500km+) now several times.
Any idea what could be the reason?

Did the airline crew know you were using a gps device?

unwired4 said:
Did the airline crew know you were using a gps device?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Who cares, GPS device is just a receiver, they use several of them in cockpit. Even GSM mobile phone intereference is exaggerated...

Well, since it was our own jet and pilot i guess that its ok
But back to the issue: A friend of mine could acknowledge that he has the same problem when traveling over a certain distance by car.
Is it possible, that this has something to do with QuickGPS where the receiver calculates extimated postitions of the satellites (and those triangulations will be false when moving too far)? Is QuickGPS postition-dependend?
Any ideas highly appreciated...

licht77 said:
Well, since it was our own jet and pilot i guess that its ok
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good answer
It could be, but quickgps only provides a pre-download of the ephemeris data so that the GPS unit does not have to download it from the satellites. If it does not have the quickgps data, it could download it from the sats (thats why a normal lock takes so long), so I would guess not, unless maybe download of new data from sats is turned off if quickgps is turned on.
I see no option to specify location in quickgps but then again it could look at the handset's country code or something. Surely though it is kilobytes in size at max so downloading the whole world's data via GSM/3G would be no biggie.
On a side note, I get the same issue on my Kaiser even if I stay local sometimes. I *think* it may be getting stuck on A-GPS (Using cell phone masts to get a rough fix) - maybe try and disable A-GPS as it would be no use in a jet?

I have experienced the same thing once - and that was after using the Kaiser in a jet for only a few minutes. Once I landed, I started TomTom and was placed over 700 miles from my actual position. A soft rest cured it; I was a bit worried that the high speeds of a jet might have confused/fried my GPS, but all was fine after a soft reset.

You may see what I mean here: xxx (username and password: test): Right above Toledo / Madrid the GPS readings go crazy... :-(

Could this be the mythical 'Barcelona Triangle' ?

Interesting, you might try posting this at GPSpassion.com forum. They are the experts in GPS. It's odd that it would loose sats as the view of the sky couldn't be much better and you'd think that it would be able to keep up things, even at jet speeds the number of visible satellites wouldn't change. I would try it with GPS ON and Phone radio OFF as this might rule out any cell tower issues.

RemE said:
Interesting, you might try posting this at GPSpassion.com forum. They are the experts in GPS. It's odd that it would loose sats as the view of the sky couldn't be much better and you'd think that it would be able to keep up things, even at jet speeds the number of visible satellites wouldn't change. I would try it with GPS ON and Phone radio OFF as this might rule out any cell tower issues.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi! I tried it with GSM off - with no improvement. It seems that this is some kind of bug in the GPS-receiver?
If you have an user in that forum - feel free to post this issue!
Thx, Licht

I do experience this problem too. I was thinking it is the problem of the chip, has anyone tried the external antenna and does the problem still persist?

ZorMi said:
Who cares, GPS device is just a receiver, they use several of them in cockpit. Even GSM mobile phone intereference is exaggerated...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Might be exaggerated... but considering how much interference a normal GSM signal has with household electronics (and yes, commercial jetliners are heavily shielded)... it's still kind of scary.
I actually discovered I left my phone on in my bag on a Frontier Airlines flight when the GSM modem started up at around 15,000 feet and the in-seat screen in front of me started flickering and I got that cool 'ch-ch-ch-ch' noise in my headphones.
Whoops.
It's probably safe to have the GPS on, but you really should turn off the radio.. there's no telling what wiring is running next to/under your seat, and there might just be an antenna above your head that you don't know about. It's just not worth the risk (plus, if you get caught.. well.. it's a federal offense).
If you just ask, some pilots will let you turn your GPS unit on in the plane (the flight attendants will ask him/her)... Delta Airlines doesn't seem to have any problem with this, while United and American do.

I think you'll find the answer to this thread is to do with the travelling speed and height.
Dedicated flight GPS units have a much faster baud rate for data transfer and the unit itself has virtually no other background tasks to take care of.
The 'Kaiser' GPS is primarily designed as a 'walkabout' unit and can just cope with vehicle speeds. If the data shows a marked change in position (due to say travelling at a few hundred kph) then the GPS firmware believes it has an erroneous sat lock and tries to re-aquire causing the confused output.
Also, Ephemeris data is incorrect for ionospheric distortion when you are at above 25,000 thousand feet so if it tries to use QuickGPS it will actually lengthen the acquisition time.
Try it next time with both A-GPS and QuickGPS off (QuickGPS auto disables if data is out of date so just disable downloads) and note what speed/height you are when is goes crazy.

As far as i know, there is no profen evidence that one single plane was downed by a gsm signal. Additionally, i have seen Boeings where all TFT Flatscreens started heavy flickering when the intercom was running - so dont mix up important avionic board systems with unimportant, unshielded secondary systems Here in europe all commercial planes have excellent shielding standards - and there are several commerical and private planetypes around which already come up with internal gsm-repeaters and satellite connections to the gsm-groundstations (the reasons for low usage are missing business models and - i guess annoyance). And - as i said - it was our own jet and pilot, and so its me who makes the rules in there :-D
So much for offtopic.
But I really would like to know what causes this "satellite loss" and "mis-positioning" problems... - this probably makes some killerapplications impossible
Does anybody know if a-gps is geographically influenced? Anybody has further informations about how our Kaisers keep the fix on the satellites?

Farsquidge said:
I think you'll find the answer to this thread is to do with the travelling speed and height.
Dedicated flight GPS units have a much faster baud rate for data transfer and the unit itself has virtually no other background tasks to take care of.
The 'Kaiser' GPS is primarily designed as a 'walkabout' unit and can just cope with vehicle speeds. If the data shows a marked change in position (due to say travelling at a few hundred kph) then the GPS firmware believes it has an erroneous sat lock and tries to re-aquire causing the confused output.
Also, Ephemeris data is incorrect for ionospheric distortion when you are at above 25,000 thousand feet so if it tries to use QuickGPS it will actually lengthen the acquisition time.
Try it next time with both A-GPS and QuickGPS off (QuickGPS auto disables if data is out of date so just disable downloads) and note what speed/height you are when is goes crazy.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thx for your informations - your ideas sound plausible! But on the flight i posted before, u can see that we were travelling about 2.5 hours at 10.000 metres and 800 km/h before everything went crazy within 60 seconds (Placemark 273 is plausible, 275 insane)... but i turned GSM off to save battery... so a-gps and quick-gps should have been off too (correct me if i am wrong)...?

licht77 said:
Thx for your informations - your ideas sound plausible! But on the flight i posted before, u can see that we were travelling about 2.5 hours at 10.000 metres and 800 km/h before everything went crazy within 60 seconds (Placemark 273 is plausible, 275 insane)... but i turned GSM off to save battery... so a-gps and quick-gps should have been off too (correct me if i am wrong)...?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
A-GPS would be disabled but QuickGPS would still be active as it is just a downloaded info table.
It would only need loss of signal for a few seconds, say your reception was detuned by a flight manouver or you moved the location of the unit within the plane (signal strength is poor within an aircraft body without external antenna) to cause it to get confused and at speed it takes ages for a lock. You can see a big difference just starting the GPS standing still against starting it in a moving car.

Consumer GPS devices misread at high speeds and altitudes. Government regulations keep them from functioning to prohibit their use in the construction of ICBM's since most devices use a version of a generic GPS chip. Think I'm nuts? Google it.

xconradx said:
Consumer GPS devices misread at high speeds and altitudes. Government regulations keep them from functioning to prohibit their use in the construction of ICBM's since most devices use a version of a generic GPS chip. Think I'm nuts? Google it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nope, I don't think you are nuts! You are perfectly correct!
There are 3 types, consumer, commercial and military. (four if you count the US who contol the network and have the best).

Farsquidge said:
A-GPS would be disabled but QuickGPS would still be active as it is just a downloaded info table.
It would only need loss of signal for a few seconds, say your reception was detuned by a flight manouver or you moved the location of the unit within the plane (signal strength is poor within an aircraft body without external antenna) to cause it to get confused and at speed it takes ages for a lock. You can see a big difference just starting the GPS standing still against starting it in a moving car.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
OK I guess i will give this a try as i found out how to deactivate QuickGPS
@xconradx: No youre not nuts - i can confirm that there are regulations (thats why we are gonna send up Gallileo *g*) - but i can hardly believe that this was the bugger: The readings were accurate (too accurate to prevent abuse) for 2:45min - and then the readings were just insane.
I hope we can find a workaround...

Haha, I'm glad people dont think I'm a nutjob... I've tried to explain the regulated GPS to people before and was called "paranoid, crazy", whatever....
Thats weird that it read so well for a period. I just know that basics!

GPS questions

GPS Questions that I haven’t seen in other threads.
Along with many of you I'm trying to get my GPS to obtain a fix faster.
I have a Tilt (8925 / TYTNII) / WM6.1 with Garmin Mobile XT (no data plan just wifi). I’ve had an issue for the past year with the GPS not locking on for up to fifteen minutes even though it appears to see up to nine good satellites. HTC replaced the mother board which includes the Qualcomm GPSone chip. This corrected most of the problems but at times it still takes a long time to lock on even though it shows satellites with good signal strength. QuickGPS comes loaded on the phone yet has no effect on how long it takes to lock on. It’s my understanding that the satellite locations are loaded in an almanac on the phone. Since this data changes it must be refreshed on a regular basis for the chip to lock on quickly. I have several questions.
1) Is the almanac / ephemeris data stored on the GPSone chip’s memory (if it has any) or does it reside in the phones memory? If it’s on the phone can it be read?
2) Does each satellite transmit at a different frequency and does the GPSone chip scan these frequencies looking for a satellite that can download the latest almanac and ephemeris data?
3) QuickGPS doesn’t seem to make any difference on my phone. Is this program what’s called “assisted GPS”? If so does QuickGPS update the GPSone’s ship data or the GPS software’s data you are using such as Google maps or Garmin? I assume it’s the GPSone’s data because the chip must send a “sentence” to your GPS software telling it that the chip has locked on to enough satellites to provide navigation. Until this happens the GPS software just waits or times out. When I look in the registry I see that enableAGPS dword is set to 00000000. Wouldn’t this have to be a one for assisted GPS to work? I tried setting it to a 1 but it didn’t make any difference.
4) I download data using QuickGPS (via wifi). How can I tell that the data is for my area or if it is being used by the GPSone chip? It’s using 193.253.42.109 which is a site in California called Geo Information. Is the almanac information global? In other words does QuickGPS provide information on all GPS satellites in every download? If I do a soft reset and then run QuickGPS and then start Garmin I don’t see any satellites for about two minutes. It then appears to load almanac data from the first satellite it sees and then a bunch of satellites pop up all at once. That’s why I don’t think QuickGPS is helping.
5) This seems to be a huge problem with our phones. Could someone write a script to poll the GPSone chip say every two hours which would in turn refresh the GPS data so that whenever we need to use the GPS it would be doing a warm start rather than a cold?
Thanks for any insight. I’m lost in more ways than one.
Frank

Im not sure whats causing ur issue! but i never thought quickgps helps. its always the usual slow gps connectivity in my phone. just thought i will add my 2 cents...

Get this http://www.visualgps.net/VisualGPSce/default.htm program. Go outdoors (not between tall building) in an open area. Run VisualGPSce, see if it locks within 2-3 minutes. Once it locks, you can try other programs.
Make sure you GPS is set to com4 and preferably 38400 bps.
GPS coverage is not so good inside the buldings. Wood buildings are fine. Buildings and cars with UV protection and tinted glass are trouble. Also concrete walls/roof are another trouble.
Also to add, QuickGPS never helped me.

FrankCB said:
GPS Questions that I haven’t seen in other threads.
Along with many of you I'm trying to get my GPS to obtain a fix faster.
I have a Tilt (8925 / TYTNII) / WM6.1 with Garmin Mobile XT (no data plan just wifi). I’ve had an issue for the past year with the GPS not locking on for up to fifteen minutes even though it appears to see up to nine good satellites. HTC replaced the mother board which includes the Qualcomm GPSone chip. This corrected most of the problems but at times it still takes a long time to lock on even though it shows satellites with good signal strength. QuickGPS comes loaded on the phone yet has no effect on how long it takes to lock on. It’s my understanding that the satellite locations are loaded in an almanac on the phone. Since this data changes it must be refreshed on a regular basis for the chip to lock on quickly. I have several questions.
1) Is the almanac / ephemeris data stored on the GPSone chip’s memory (if it has any) or does it reside in the phones memory? If it’s on the phone can it be read?
2) Does each satellite transmit at a different frequency and does the GPSone chip scan these frequencies looking for a satellite that can download the latest almanac and ephemeris data?
3) QuickGPS doesn’t seem to make any difference on my phone. Is this program what’s called “assisted GPS”? If so does QuickGPS update the GPSone’s ship data or the GPS software’s data you are using such as Google maps or Garmin? I assume it’s the GPSone’s data because the chip must send a “sentence” to your GPS software telling it that the chip has locked on to enough satellites to provide navigation. Until this happens the GPS software just waits or times out. When I look in the registry I see that enableAGPS dword is set to 00000000. Wouldn’t this have to be a one for assisted GPS to work? I tried setting it to a 1 but it didn’t make any difference.
4) I download data using QuickGPS (via wifi). How can I tell that the data is for my area or if it is being used by the GPSone chip? It’s using 193.253.42.109 which is a site in California called Geo Information. Is the almanac information global? In other words does QuickGPS provide information on all GPS satellites in every download? If I do a soft reset and then run QuickGPS and then start Garmin I don’t see any satellites for about two minutes. It then appears to load almanac data from the first satellite it sees and then a bunch of satellites pop up all at once. That’s why I don’t think QuickGPS is helping.
5) This seems to be a huge problem with our phones. Could someone write a script to poll the GPSone chip say every two hours which would in turn refresh the GPS data so that whenever we need to use the GPS it would be doing a warm start rather than a cold?
Thanks for any insight. I’m lost in more ways than one.
Frank
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
1. Stored in phone memory, and yes it can be read.
2. A GPS receiver calculates its position by precisely timing the signals sent by the GPS satellites high above the Earth. Each satellite continually transmits messages containing the time the message was sent, precise orbital information (the ephemeris), and the general system health and rough orbits of all GPS satellites (the almanac). The receiver measures the transit time of each message and computes the distance to each satellite. Geometric trilateration is used to combine these distances with the location of the satellites to determine the receiver's location. The position is displayed, perhaps with a moving map display or latitude and longitude; elevation information may be included.
3. QuickGPS is not Assisted GPS. QuickGPS downloads the latest satellite positions to help with a faster initial GPS fix. Assisted GPS uses your cell-phone location through cell-tower triangulation to provide a location just like a GPS receiver would. Usually not as accurate.
4. QuickGPS downloads a global catelog. The amount of satellites used for GPS aren't so numerous that it needs to download just the ones in your area. It basically downloads a text listing of all the available GPS satellites.
5. Have you tried flashing a new radio to your device? This can make a world of difference in GPS fix acquisition, especially in different areas.

Also, have you read this?

Thank you for all the info. I just found this article
I'm still not sure why QuickGPS isn't helping. While on my quest for GPS information I found this article. It answers a lot of questions. Thanks also for the link to the GPS thread. I had read it before but it didn't answer the questions I posted.
http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/news/2009/01/assisted-gps.ars

my Tilt locks onto 4 or 5 satellites within 10-20 seconds, usually faster. I've never had a problem. It even locks onto 2 satellites when I'm in my apartment. I use quick GPS, updated via WiFi, but I haven't updated it for a couple weeks.
I'm running wm6.5, 1.7x radio.

WAAS For GPS navigation?

I would like to use my Fuze for more precise GPS coordinates while Fishing.
Many GPS units on the market receive the WAAS signal for more accuracy in coordinates. Is it possible for someone to create software for our phones to receive this signal? Anything available? Ideas?
I sometimes pay to go with a pro while fishing and once used a large handheld GPS with WAAS enabled. I was able to go back to very specific spots and found my boat was longer than the error of the WAAS coordinates. If I could have this on my phone...lets just say it would be more beneficial.