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Here are my computer's specs:
http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/...4322&cc=us&dlc=en&lc=en&jumpid=reg_R1002_USEN
Only difference is that it's been upgraded to 4Gb of RAM.
My issue is this: My cpu cooling fan recently died and my comp has been overheating and shutting down. Under load it's been as high as 97*C before shutdown. Obviously I need a new fan but getting THAT hot has to be bad for the CPU so I might as well upgrade while I'm in there. I was just told by HP support that my motherboard (Narra2-GL8E) will only handle CPUs from 45W to 65W. I was really hoping to upgrade to amd 64 x2 6400+ processor but according to them it would be wayyy too much for the motherboard. I'm operating under the assumption that the rep was full o' **** and feeding me some standardized response so as not to encourage me to do something that *could* possibly be damaging to my pc.
My question is what's the best processor can I realistically upgrade to with my current set-up??
I've got the Pavilion Elite m9402f, almost exact same specs, except it has 7GB of RAM, and runs at 2.3GHz. Watch that GPU, it sucks! Seems like the NVIDIA card isn't supplied with enough power. It prob isn't the reason for the overheating, but if you use any graphic-intensive apps/games, it may not help the issue.
Believe it or not, but the HP rep may have been correct. Your motherboard won't support CPU's with the designation AM2+. When AMD released the AM2+ CPU's, they intended them to be backwards compatible with existing AM2 motherboards. However, most manufacturers have refused to release the BIOS updates to allow this.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socket_AM2+
http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/document?docname=c01080282&lc=en&cc=ca&dlc=en&product=3445425
The 6400 is a special CPU that actually should have been released for the AM2+. But since the HT speed is the same as your stock processor, the wattage won't matter. I will warn you, the 6400 has been known to have severe overheating issues. You'll likely spend a good chunk in a high quality heatsink/fan for the processor.
The HP site doesn't list a PSU. What is the rating on yours? That may be what the rep was referring to... I couldn't imagine HP building a machine with more than enough wattage for the internal components. Usually PC Manufacturers cut those things pretty close to keep costs down.
I ended up deciding to err on the side of caution and bought an x2 5600+ processor to throw in there. My power supply is only 250W and that's definitely on the list of things to replace. Gonna need a better power supply to put a half decent GPU in there. Going to install the new CPU and heatsink/fan tomorrow and see if that doesn't help. I have a feeling there are other issues though...to be continued..?
**As a confusing little edit to the situation..upon closer inspection it turns out that the cpu fan IS actually working. So now I'm even more lost. It's understandable to run hot with no fan..but with a fully functional fan?!**
Hi all,
I wonder if there is any possibility to change the prosessor of the X2 for a faster one. If there is somewhere a processor that has the same pin-layout, same size than the one on the x2, then why wouldn't it be possible to unsolder it and swap to an faster one..?
Sorry if this question is stupid, but i have no idea about mobilephone processors... On computers you can swap processors if they fit in the socket, and consume the same amount of power etc..
I'm not so much more a mobilephone processor expert but I doubt it's that easy. In mobilephones those components have to work together I guess. That means some hardware probably needs that qualcomm to work.
Also, I could imagine theres a problem with the heat of faster processor - or is that nonsense?
hertell said:
Hi all,
I wonder if there is any possibility to change the prosessor of the X2 for a faster one. If there is somewhere a processor that has the same pin-layout, same size than the one on the x2, then why wouldn't it be possible to unsolder it and swap to an faster one..?
Sorry if this question is stupid, but i have no idea about mobilephone processors... On computers you can swap processors if they fit in the socket, and consume the same amount of power etc..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's a great question; I also wish it were possible. But mobile phone processors have various complexities such as a separate processor for various functions like phone or graphics. The only possibility would be to go from one Qualcomm to another, but even then, aren't mobile phone processors tiny? The soldering itself might be close to impossible.
ring-bearer said:
It's a great question; I also wish it were possible. But mobile phone processors have various complexities such as a separate processor for various functions like phone or graphics. The only possibility would be to go from one Qualcomm to another, but even then, aren't mobile phone processors tiny? The soldering itself might be close to impossible.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If it would just be the case of soldering, then i'll find someone who would do the job for me Afcourse the aspect of heat etc could be an issue..
Any other thoughts from anyone who knows about these kind of processors?
If the CPU itself is pin compatible, the issue is only the soldering. Mostly.
TAMHAN said:
If the CPU itself is pin compatible, the issue is only the soldering. Mostly.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sounds great! Now is there anyone who knows if there is a processor that would fit in the same pin-layout as the current x2-processor? For example the Qualcomms Snapdragon-processor?
unlikely that its even the same size let alone the same number of pins.. and even if it was of identical size and layout then theres the voltages to consider. i doubt the x2 was constructed by hand. quite often chips are placed and soldered by machine. would require an expert of considerable skill to remove and then solder in a new chip perfectly.
finally theres the problem of finding a processor to put in.... not like you can buy them in pcworld! if you wanted a snapdragon cpu you would have to buy a snapdragon phone to use as a donor. very expensive way to upgrade a phone.
Ur going to kill ur phone mate, u must be ridicusly precise if u decide to do that . .
Not possible! .. this is not a desktop! (or a laptop) with an changeble socket
apart from the soldering out a smd cpu with tons of legs then
if the new faster cpu didn't use 100% the same wm driver it would require a new rom and the the device would not work with any rom but the one custom made for the newer cpu
When the OMAP boots up it hashes a public key and compares it with a series of blown fuses. If they match then it uses the public key to verify the first stage bootloader. A novel idea idea is to swap out the OMAP 4430 from a development board with the chip inside the phone.
Forget that handsoldering BGA is difficult because I have heard of it being done. What differences are there between the a development board chip and the processor in the Droid 4?
Bumped.
Does anyone know of any instances where someone was capable of hand soldering a BGA chip like an OMAP?
Master Melab said:
Bumped.
Does anyone know of any instances where someone was capable of hand soldering a BGA chip like an OMAP?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Really, hand solder something that small?
Sent from my HTC_Amaze_4G using xda premium
hot air rework would do it, wouldn't it?
i did something simpler to replace the nand chip on my ps3 bluray drive, cant imagine this chip being to much smaller.
It could be done; I've done quite a bit of soldering with ultra-tiny contact points such as those you'd find on SMD-components. You'd definitely want to use a loupe (one of those monocle-style magnifying lenses that you always see the bad guy in cheesy movies analyzing diamonds with... hehe).
I'd be really interested to see if anyone could pull this off.
Really kind of a novel plan of mine for bypassing signature checks. Only problem is getting my hands on a chip without being being an OEM.
You're looking for the Pandaboard, available for $174 here http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/UEVM4430G-01-00-00/UEVM4430F-01-00-00-ND/2349866?cur=USD and http://www.mouser.com/Search/ProductDetail.aspx?qs=ySz5i1dyTooQYPawsE8fWA==
Would be a very expensive mod, even without the difficulties of installation
Hi everyone!
After months and months, and countless hours spent (and a good deal of destroyed Nexus 5 motherboards...) ,I have succeeded in expanding both RAM and storage of a Nexus 5!
The RAM:
I have been thinking about it for quite some time, then I decided to go for it, so I bought a 24Gb LPDDR3 memory chip from Aliexpress and attempted a replacement to my spare Nexus 5. Well, believe it or not, it worked!!! My N5 has 3 GB of RAM, and the difference, with my 242 apps installed, is very evident! It has been hard work, not easy at all, but if there is anyone who has the necessary skill/equipment and is wondering if it can be done, well, the answer is YES!
The memory chip I purchased is the K3QF7F70DM-QGCF.
Replacement requires removing the ePOP memory from the top of the Snapdragon chip, then cleaning carefully the BGA land pads from any resin/glue residue, then re-soldering the new chip. I am not going into details (unless requested) because those who know about BGA reworking know what it is all about and those who don't... Well, don't try it! Anyway, I am available to provide any further explanation.
The Flash:
Then... I could not stop there. RAM is nice, but I was running out of storage space... Plus, it seems it had been done before, even if not many details had been provided... Well, there is all sort of documentation and software one can desire for the Nexus 5... So let's go for it! Let's buy a 64 GB eMMC chip from Aliexpress and let's try to transplant it!
The operation has proven more complex than I could have imagined: I collected 13 (!) dead Nexus 5s so that I could experiment with them, I fixed some of them and then I destroyed them again in the attempt to transplant the chip! The endline is: "Don't try this at home unless you are willing to end up with a broken phone"! And, believe me, it is VERY likely this is going to happen!
But the screenshots speak for themselves:
https://photos.google.com/album/AF1.../AF1QipPtZlfQ4vlWy5W94-_khYiE-WnZXHusHW18PsRu
https://photos.google.com/album/AF1.../AF1QipMCqe-Xn4x5l6PRykQDxyRnVhrbxZqTU0ZGumd4
If anyone is interested (be careful if you want to attempt the mod) I will provide all details of hardware equipment used, how to desolder chips, how to solder the new ones (but if you need to read my instructions then the operation is clearly out of your reach!) and how to flash the new chip with bootloader, recovery, ROM and everything. Just let me know!
Regards!
Hello, can you show in more detail and with screenshots where you soldered the memory. how long did it take you
Did you take any pictures through the process?
Hi guys,
unfortunately I have not taken any pictures, because I had not the slightest confidence in the outcome! However, I can summarize the process with pictures found online:
1- the memory chip (which is on top of the processor) is the one with the red dot on it; you must also remove the metal shield around it, which is fitted with just clips, so a small screwdriver and some care is enough to remove it;
2. you must heat up the chip with a hot air rework station; I also recommend to cover the rest of the board with kapton tape (or, at worst, with some aluminium foil);
3- use a thermocouple if possible; if you don't have it, monitor carefully the melting of the memory chip. Keep in mind you have to remove the memory only, not the entire chip (but the memory chip, being on top, is the first thing to come off);
4- using a needle or a thin razor blade, gently leverage one corner of the chip until you feel it softening and finally coming off;
5- after removing it, you must very carefully clean the pads from any glue left on them (yes, the memory is also glued!). The pads are not too delicate, however exert maximum care, you do not want to rip any of them off; I personally used the scalpel tip of my soldering iron to clean and level the pads;
6- use isopropyl alcohol, acetone and some sandpaper or a pencil rubber to clean the pads from any dirt and oxidation; you must end with some very clean pads, as in the picture (of course pads will not be gold but silver);
7- spread some gel flux on the pads and place the new chip on them, carefully aligning it with the processor underneath (careful about pin 1!);
8- heat up the chip again with the hot air gun; look at it from the side, until you see the balls melting and the whole chip settling down in the correct position;
9- remove hot air and let it cool nice and slow;
10- enjoy!
Please note that the process is extremely risky and complex; if you need to read the above steps, probably you should not attempt it; but if you succeed, results are worth the effort! The whole process took about 1-1.5 hours (I do not know exactly).
Next step will be to upgrade storage space (someone has already done it, if I remember correctly)!
If only i had rework station. I have broken display connector. 8 or 9 pins came off. I need to solder them and i do not have equipment. What is the cheapest hot air rework station i can get?
make youtube video, you will be a legend, really, my phone was stolen while leaving work, xiaomi mi6 6gb ram (powerful) and unfortunately I had to buy a lg g2, do you think you can add more ram to g6 ?, I'm very used to the speed of my once loved mi6: /, do the process please, it would be great!
matusala said:
If only i had rework station. I have broken display connector. 8 or 9 pins came off. I need to solder them and i do not have equipment. What is the cheapest hot air rework station i can get?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I do not recommend hot air on that connector. It is very prone to desoldering, but your best bet would be a very thin soldering tip, like the Weller LT1S, for example.
As for a cheap hot air reworl station, this is a pretty standard one:
https://it.aliexpress.com/item/220V...a0-4569-8e61-9b85979280bd&transAbTest=ae803_5
or even cheaper:
https://it.aliexpress.com/item/High...a0-4569-8e61-9b85979280bd&transAbTest=ae803_5
you will have to build your own stand, because it is impractical to hold it in your hand (you will need both at a certain point!). I attached it to a desktop spring loaded lamp, "Pixar style" to be clear.
dgm_mixtoon said:
make youtube video, you will be a legend, really, my phone was stolen while leaving work, xiaomi mi6 6gb ram (powerful) and unfortunately I had to buy a lg g2, do you think you can add more ram to g6 ?, I'm very used to the speed of my once loved mi6: /, do the process please, it would be great!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have ordered a new 4 GB memory chip, this time I will make a video when I attempt the mod!
can you please clarify to which device you would like to add RAM?
how about geekbench result?
JackyGundam said:
how about geekbench result?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hope this works:
https://browser.geekbench.com/v4/cpu/12973897
https://browser.geekbench.com/v4/compute/3984170
ilciumbia said:
I have ordered a new 4 GB memory chip, this time I will make a video when I attempt the mod!
can you please clarify to which device you would like to add RAM?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Amazing! :fingers-crossed:Waiting for that!:good:
The new Snapdragon 801 has just arrived (yes, I am attempting to transplant that, too!), while the memory chip should come in any day now... Please stay tuned for some wild modifications! ?
ilciumbia said:
The new Snapdragon 801 has just arrived (yes, I am attempting to transplant that, too!), while the memory chip should come in any day now... Please stay tuned for some wild modifications! ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Pls, if that works, make a video
Of course! Memory chip coming in next Tuesday!
Inviato dal mio Nexus 5 utilizzando Tapatalk
ilciumbia said:
The new Snapdragon 801 has just arrived (yes, I am attempting to transplant that, too!), while the memory chip should come in any day now... Please stay tuned for some wild modifications!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It would be awesome if it worked, really awesome. But I don't think it will work right of the bat. A different processor will most probably need an update in the kernel code to accommodate for that hardware change. I think that this hardware change is significant enough to require an change in the kernel source. Same goes for upgrading the internal storage.
Actually, the Snapdragon 800 and 801 are pretty much the same processor with some very minor differences, so I would expect them to be swappable. The first attempt, however, has proven to be a real disaster due to the fact that all BGAs are glued to the PCB with some strong epoxy and removing them is really hard, because it is difficult to understand if the chip is holding on to the glue or if temperature is not high enough... So you raise it and raise it to the point the PCB gets delaminated... So I am waiting for a new PID and a new thermocouple so that I can monitor the temperature more accurately!
ilciumbia said:
Actually, the Snapdragon 800 and 801 are pretty much the same processor with some very minor differences, so I would expect them to be swappable. The first attempt, however, has proven to be a real disaster due to the fact that all BGAs are glued to the PCB with some strong epoxy and removing them is really hard, because it is difficult to understand if the chip is holding on to the glue or if temperature is not high enough... So you raise it and raise it to the point the PCB gets delaminated... So I am waiting for a new PID and a new thermocouple so that I can monitor the temperature more accurately!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Maybe you're true about the processors, I hope you are it will make it much more easier for you . But is the difference between them really worth the effort? As far as I remember, it's just a slight increase in clock speeds (for both CPU and GPU).
I remember I saw someone on Youtube who upgraded the internal storage of their iPhone to 512 GB, he had to create new partition tables for the new storage chip. If my brain doesn't fail me, there's someone here on XDA who also managed to do it for the Nexus 5, he also had to create new partition tables and done some flashing for some stuff that were required to get it to boot. I'll try and find the link maybe it would help you
I'm really interested to see how much further can you push a Nexus 5 before it reaches its limits
Edit: Found it! Check the thread here. It was also featured on XDA news
Ok.
ilciumbia said:
The new Snapdragon 801 has just arrived (yes, I am attempting to transplant that, too!), while the memory chip should come in any day now... Please stay tuned for some wild modifications!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Jeezus, maybe 805 and with and it is a mini Nexus 6? xD
Hi all,
here I am back after quite some time, to report results which are disastrous to say the least. In the past week I have collected some malfunctioning Nexus 5 (some with broken switches, other with broken screens, others with broken eMMC chips), fixed some of them and then attempted the mods I had dreamed of, unfortunately so far I have managed to destroy them all, and must conclude that my very first attempt when I successfully swapped the original RAM chip for a 3GB one has been nothing but a lucky event and that my ability to perform such mods has been overestimated.
To summarize what happened so far:
1- attempt to replace the SD800 wirh a SD801 and concurrently mount a 4 GB RAM chip has ended up with a destroyed SD801 and a destroyed RAM chip;
2- 2 attempts to replace a defective eMMC chip on a working SD800 ended up with a non functioning phone;
3- replacement of a defective WiFi/BT chip succeeded, but the subsequent attempt to replace the eMMC chip ended up with a non functioning phone;
4- replacement of RAM chip with a 4 GB one ended up with a fried SD800; unsure about the RAM chip.
I am not giving up though; I am still convinced that it can be done, and that it is only a matter of finding the right way to desolder and then resolder memory chips... I am continuing experiments and collecting cheap damaged Nexus 5 phones. If you have one you can spare...
Here I am, and this time with great news! Finally, after 13 motherboards sacrificed in the name of knowledge, I have succeeded in expanding both RAM and storage of my Nexus 5! See OP and, if interested, I am willing to provide any detail you require!
Regards!
I have a Samsung Galaxy S7 (SM-G930F) that appears to be dead. I found the service manual online and I'm now trying to follow the troubleshooting flowchart for power issues. I am stuck at the third step (already), where it tells me to check the voltage level at a resistor.
"Check the voltage level at R7027 while pressing power key. Is the voltage high?"
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So my first question is, how do you check voltage at a resistor in circuit without shortening something out? Ground to either side of the resistor? Multimeter in voltage metering mode?
Second question, what is a "high" voltage? How high is high? High as in digital circuit, like one (high) vs. zero (low)?
Two possible answers are given for this question in the flowchart. One is "No" and the other is "Abnormal". So my third question is, what does "abnormal" voltage look like?
Use a good set of probes and don't shake
Clip one to the ground plane so you only need to hold one probe instead of two.
Abnormal is under 2 VDC... I think.
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No worries, it all went well. Thanks for the tip about ground plane! I didn't find a plane, but I did manage to land on the ground. (I think got that in-joke right.)
I actually tried using both test leads directly on the resistor and while it did give me a reading, it also started to smell funny after a while. It also read something like 0.44 V. But after putting the negative lead on the metal shield, and positive on either side of the resistor, I got a very different reading. I got something like 3.7 V. Now that I understand the expectation, I know this is normal value. Because it's just the voltage from the battery which is rated 3.85 V nominal voltage. It's a bit discharged but it's OK (Samsung original replacement battery).
I do wish they had put more effort into writing these "service manual" things that they keep so secretive. They got me wondering what they mean by "abnormal" voltage. I admit do being a complete noob when it comes to repairing phones and electronics in general, but they could have used proper English and I would have understood (even though it's not my first language either). Now I understand this "abnormal" to mean "way above 3.8 V or way below 3.8 V". I get the impression they just slapped together some images and text, and they could not even spell things right or draw the little boxes in the flowchart with pixel perfect attention to detail. I do get it though. Why bother when no one else is supposed to even look at this except Samsung authorized service technicians?
Why below 2 V? How do you figure it's TTL and not RTL or DTL? Full disclosure: I have no understanding of what either of these things mean. I just looked it up on Wikipedia. I do know it has to do with the way electronic circuits are designed, it's engineering jargon. TTL stands for Transistor-Transistor Logic.
Pretty sure it's TTL protocol.
You really don't want to muck with most of everything on the mobo. Keep the phone in a good case at all times and keep it away from water. 99% of the time it's easier to replace a defective assembly rather than try to fix it.
Protocol? As in data transmission protocol, like USB? Can you elaborate please? I am only familiar with the term "TTL" in the context of UART interfaces, where you use some kind of USB or RS232 to TTL adapter in order to communicate with defective devices and things of that nature. I have used an adapter like that many years ago to clear a firmware error in a Seagate disk for example so I could recover the data.
I am in a similar situation this time. This phone is not powering on and I need to recover my data. It died suddenly while it was charging. What do you suggest I do to extract the data? I don't care about MOBO or assembly, I just want my data back. But I have no experience with phone repairs, and I have learned that the UFS storage chip is encrypted too. So I can't just pull of the storage chip and put it in a chip reader, do a data dump and then take it from there. I need to repair this board to get to my data. Or is there an alternative?
Protocol; voltage specs for different states.
A data recovery specialist may be able to retrieve the data. For you as it it is now, no boot, no data.
Not backing the data up redundantly was a big no-no.
As Dirty Harry said: "A lot of things can happen to an Android...".
I may not get it to boot in the end and recover the data, but neither will IBAS Ontrack. I doubt they even know what's involved in recovering data from such devices. They are probably still doing HDD data recoveries. Those guys don't even know how to answer the phone properly when a customer calls in. I called in three times and spoke to some weirdo at a switchboard, telling me that the people I need to talk to are busy. But they are always busy! And each time they give you this switchboard operator. They also don't call you back either when they promise to get back to you and you leave your phone number. I haven't called Drive Savers yet. I may try that some day, just to compare how they treat incoming calls for help. That's my experience with these data recovery specialists thus far (they don't exist!).
I agree, I should have had a fresh backup of the phone or at least a backup of the most important files. Should have, could have. That's not going to help me with what happened in the past. I made a mistake, and I didn't think my smartest phone of all smartphones would die so soon. Expiration date on these things seems to be one to two years, which is insane! So we keep buying and trashing them and creating e-waste. No one knows how to make make things or fix things, they only know how to buy and consume. We only have our theories and we know how to sell fog (ideas). All manufacturing is still done in China (they are the ones with the tools and the brains). I don't think it's right on any level. But here we are. A simple thing like changing the battery on these devices is intentionally made impossible.
It's not that I don't want a specialist to have a look at this and have my money. It's that there are none around, and those that are and do this type of job, they don't want it. They only want easy and quick jobs for big bucks. I had two of these phones sent to two different microelectronics repair shops, they both sent them back, on both occasions, saying it's a dead ROM chip. I don't believe them. How could I? The last guy didn't even send me back the 12 screws that I sent to him in a zip back along with the phone. Only because I told him to send it back disassembled, after he asked me. He asked if I wanted disassembled or assembled. Where assembled is twice the price. Why would I want it assembled? I already had disassembled it myself. Not fully, I just took the back cover off and tried putting in a brand new battery. I know how to assemble and glue it back together myself. He didn't tell me he would omit the screws if I opted to have it send back disassembled. It's a complete bull**** of repair shop, and he has like 40 thousands subscribers on YouTube. None of these guys will show you their failures. They only show their success to promote themselves. In my opinion, failure is where true learning takes place.
Anyway. I will take my chances and try to repair it myself. It's a costly experiment, and it's going to take time, but I am learning a lot in the process, and little by little I am actually putting together my own little microelectronics repair lab at home. I even got myself a thermal camera so I can inspect and locate overheating components. Hot air station and microscope is next. After that I may even start my own business and do phone repairs at a level that's simply not offered where I live.
There are recovery specialists that go as far as pulling the SOC to attempt to recover data. No small or easy task.
Otherwise if you can't get that mobo to run I would write the data off... and save myself a lot of time and trouble for nothing.
I'm stuck in a similar situation with my GT-i9060 (Galaxy Grand Neo) where I could care less about the board or phone and just want my data recovered.
This would be my last-resort attempt to repair but you could try it out maybe. I am attempting to figure out what's wrong with the mobo first and try to get that thing started.
Here's my post. Any inputs would be helpful.
Rizzi87 said:
I'm stuck in a similar situation with my GT-i9060 (Galaxy Grand Neo) where I could care less about the board or phone and just want my data recovered.
This would be my last-resort attempt to repair but you could try it out maybe. I am attempting to figure out what's wrong with the mobo first and try to get that thing started.
Here's my post. Any inputs would be helpful.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nice find. Last resort time... you see what a pain it is. Very involved and no guarantees.
Is the sim card still intact; are your contacts stored on it?
blackhawk said:
Nice find. Last resort time... you see what a pain it is. Very involved and no guarantees.
Is the sim card still intact; are your contacts stored on it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the reply.
The SIM is still intact but no, my contacts aren't saved on it. My Whatsapp backup is on there too and yes, I was ignorant enough to not have backed it up
As I mentioned, if I try to switch it on using the battery or even plug the charger, certain areas of the mobo get hot which points out to some component being shorted (according to my limited knowledge)
I'm trying to test each component using the schematic diagrams because the repair flowchart mentions some equipment that I don't have access to. Gonna pop open the emi shields today so I can test those components too.
I also have a G930F with a bad display (I think) but that will have to wait
You can't repair a mobile with just a flow chart. You need to be proffessional and also need some basic tools like dc power supply. Mobile pcb's most DC bus lines will normally shows below 30ohms resistance.
Connect phone to pc with charged battery and check phone's SOC detects or not, if detects probably emmc/bootloader failure.
Rizzi87 said:
Thanks for the reply.
The SIM is still intact but no, my contacts aren't saved on it. My Whatsapp backup is on there too and yes, I was ignorant enough to not have backed it up
As I mentioned, if I try to switch it on using the battery or even plug the charger, certain areas of the mobo get hot which points out to some component being shorted (according to my limited knowledge)
I'm trying to test each component using the schematic diagrams because the repair flowchart mentions some equipment that I don't have access to. Gonna pop open the emi shields today so I can test those components too.
I also have a G930F with a bad display (I think) but that will have to wait
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're welcome and welcome to XDA
That link was an interesting read.
If you really need the data just stop now and send it in. If you have already or do damage the memory chipset it will be game over. One price quote I heard was $800 from another member here. Can't recall if they had to hot air the memory chip off or not.
Many people have no idea the trouble not backing up critical data causes or how fragile digital data can be. I have at least a dozen backup drives, many are redundant copies. No such thing as too much.
@blackhawk Yeah, I will probably head over to some recovery specialists and then experiment with getting the board to work again.
@R7027 - If you have the service manual for the G930F, can you check if it lists the main parts and exploded view for the phone?
blackhawk said:
There are recovery specialists that go as far as pulling the SOC to attempt to recover data.
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Click to collapse
I know. That's a chip-off procedure. But that doesn't work on devices running Android 6 and above because of hardware based encryption of storage chips. This is enforced by Google. Manufacturers must comply with Google's demands if they want to receive Android certification.
Rizzi87 said:
I'm stuck in a similar situation with my GT-i9060 (Galaxy Grand Neo) where I could care less about the board or phone and just want my data recovered.
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I'm sorry to hear. I know the feeling.
Rizzi87 said:
This would be my last-resort attempt to repair but you could try it out maybe. I am attempting to figure out what's wrong with the mobo first and try to get that thing started.
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Click to collapse
I'm familiar with FlashFixers. I have seen the video version of the article you linked to, seen their website and read most of the information there.
For example, this information:
"Chip-off data recovery is only an option for Android OS 2.3-5.1."
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Click to collapse
This is why they stopped doing that after Galaxy S6, because Galaxy S7 came with Android 6.
I also know what software they're using, what adapters, what readers, etc. So I can tell you what's possible and what's not. Your phone shipped with Android 4.2 and was upgradeable to 4.4.4. Therefore, your phone can undergo a chip-off procedure. GSM Arena is source number one for mobile phone specs. Head over there and check it out. Since this is an older phone model and spec data submitters (users) at GSM Arnea didn't pay much attention to type of internal storage, there is no info on the type of internal memory. But I believe it's eMMC. I know for a fact that Samsung switched from eMMC to eUFS when they released Galaxy S6. The relevance here is that the chip reader you use needs to support eMMC, and virtually every one of them supports eMMC. Only a few readers support eUFS, the new standard that no one in phone repair community cares much for when they can't do chip-off procedures on anything running Android 6 or above, due to Google's enforcement of hardware based encryption.
So if you turn your phone in to FlashFixers, or anyone else with the same equipment, skill and know-how, they should be able to dump, read and recover all your data from the chip. They can even write the whole lot back to a new chip and put it back on a donor board and install it into the phone frame, and deliver a working phone with all the data on it.
But as for me, I'm not so lucky. It doesn't work on Galaxy S7 because of Android 6. Mine was running Android 8 when it died, but it shipped with Android 6 and that's reason enough not to try it, as it is encrypted, for sure. They need to either repair the original board, or transplant the CPU/SOC and ROM/UFS to a donor board. This is true for all the newer phones. It's a new era.
Rizzi87 said:
The SIM is still intact but no, my contacts aren't saved on it.
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Are they stored on the internal memory of the phone? Thankfully I have the master copy of all my contacts, some 250 of them, all well documented and manually edited. I decided to switch to Google for storing all my contacts about 10 years ago, and I have not looked back since.
Rizzi87 said:
As I mentioned, if I try to switch it on using the battery or even plug the charger, certain areas of the mobo get hot which points out to some component being shorted (according to my limited knowledge)
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That's a good indication of a short. Problem is in knowing your reference points. How much is too much? Similar to voltage, how high temperature is too high? How low temperature is too low? If you don't have a reference, it doesn't tell you much. Unless it's in the extreme. Extremely low, or extremely high. Reference point for that might be if you get a burn mark if you touch it or a frost bite. But in general, abnormal temperature is a good indication of a short circuit. If you can rule out overheating.
Rizzi87 said:
I'm trying to test each component using the schematic diagrams because the repair flowchart mentions some equipment that I don't have access to. Gonna pop open the emi shields today so I can test those components too.
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Click to collapse
What equipment is that? What components have you tested if you have not removed the shields yet?
EMI shields? Is that what those things are called? I hate those. They are troublesome to remove. Some of them have a top cover that can be lifted and put back on, others don't. I knocked off a tiny capacitor on one of my test boards while removing the shield with pliers (expensive precision pliers for electronics by Knipex, "Made in Germany"). That board took a turn for the worse because of it. But I have saved the tiny capacitor. Good thing is I saw it and didn't digest it or something, it's almost invisible, it's like 1 mm x 0.5 mm.
Rizzi87 said:
I also have a G930F with a bad display (I think) but that will have to wait
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Does it have power? The first thing you should get in terms of equipment is a USB power meter.
engage4 said:
Mobile pcb's most DC bus lines will normally shows below 30ohms resistance.
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What does that mean? Can you re-phrase that please?
engage4 said:
Connect phone to pc with charged battery and check phone's SOC detects or not, if detects probably emmc/bootloader failure.
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Click to collapse
Check if phone detects PC? Not if PC detects phone? I don't understand this. Assuming PC is working and phone is not working, then how could phone detect the PC? Where do you even begin to look if you don't have anything on display (of the phone)?
blackhawk said:
One price quote I heard was $800 from another member here. Can't recall if they had to hot air the memory chip off or not.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think iPad Rehab takes like $999. You can also check the FlashFixers website. They have published their prices on there.
"Data recovery service of photos and videos from Android phones starts at $399 for Android OS 2.3-5.1, and $499 for Android OS 6-10, and $599 for Android OS 11 and newer."
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Click to collapse
For Android 4, they take $499 and for Android 6 or newer, they take $599. They have more on their Android Phone Data Recovery Service page.
Rizzi87 said:
Yeah, I will probably head over to some recovery specialists and then experiment with getting the board to work again.
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Click to collapse
Don't rush to send it in to a "specialist". I guess it doesn't matter much in your case, since your phone runs on Android 4 and any data recovery/microelectronics "specialist" should be able to do the job. But in general, and especially in case of Android 6 and above, I suggest you try to find someone who knows how to do repairs, first and foremost. Not data recovery.
In the past, anyone with the right equipment, steady hands, and good mental or cognitive functions used to be able to do data recoveries in a chip-off procedure. That's until Android 6 happened. After that, they were all faced with a decision: go out of business or learn how to do actual repairs. I have no insider information on this, but I can read between the lines and I can think. I suspect that Android 6 was a big blow to this type of businesses. Some of the old timers went on to do board swaps instead. That's the new default procedure for anything newer than Android 6 where data recovery is the priority. Board swaps essentially replaced chip-off procedures, starting from Android 6.
There is another guy on YouTube that used to do data recovery on Android devices. He no longer does that, not if your device runs on Android 6 or newer. He specifically states that on his website. He's from Canada if I recall correctly. I think he mostly does data recovery on USB flash drives and HDDs.
Apparently, FlashFixers offer data recovery on Android 6 and above. That's a good indication actually of a good service. They charge more for it, of course, but rightfully so. Because the name of the game is no longer "take the chip off, dump the data, mount it, read it, copy or upload and ask for payment". Now they have to do proper diagnostics and troubleshooting, repair the original board, or do a board swap and risk damaging the chips.
Board repair is really the territory of guys like Louis Rossmann. Most of the other guys will just do a board swap and hope for the best. But even that is a tall order. You can easily damage a chip in the process. I looked at my Samsung Exynos chip and it's like 1 mm thin, and it sits on top of a 1 mm thin RAM chip. I don't really want to mess with that if I want to preserve the data. So to increase my chances of recovering data I would leave it to someone else. Or! Skill up! I would need to practice on less important phones first.
To tell you the truth I have already ruined two SM-G930F boards. Not beyond repair, but I made them worse. I knocking off a tiny capacitor on one of them, and I ruined the connectors on the other one with what turned out to be fake Kapton tape that didn't stand the heat (I didn't know people made fake Kapton tapes and I didn't test my tape first). Both boards were already having the same issue as my main SM-G930F board. I now have 4 boards, 3 of which are not working. I purchased a fully functional SM-G930F that I plan on taking apart just to learn more about how it works when it's normal. In medicine, you study anatomy first, then physiology, and then pathology. It's same thing here.
All of this is very involved, I'm aware of it. It's not for the faint of heart or for people without stamina to continue when it gets difficult. I have the curiosity, drive and energy to pursue this. Little by little, I'm improving every day. I'm actually thinking about going for an electronics engineering degree. I have always been interested in electronics. I ended up working as an electrician instead, and then IT technician. I don't need to tell you my life's story, I'm just saying that there is more than one reason why I am pursuing this path.
Rizzi87 said:
If you have the service manual for the G930F, can you check if it lists the main parts and exploded view for the phone?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There is one or two pages dedicated to listing only the components. Not sure if that's what you mean. A parts list? There is no exploded view, but there is a picture of the phone on one or two of the pages, with everything marked up for overview (anatomy). Then there is also board views, front and back, and also each side of the the sub-board (I think it's called). I don't know if I'm allowed to post it here? But you can find it online. What would you like to know from it? I can check it and get back to you.
Forget "TTL" and 5V. There is nothing on your board that is at that level.
Sometimes signals that are designed for external things run at 3.3V, but they usually use a converter.
An actual SD card (if it's from the stone age) uses 3.3V levels.
Normally the system will just say, "Can we just talk at 1.8V levels?" And they do.
Most processors of the last decade work at 1.8V or less.
If a signal comes right out of the processor it will be at that level.
For instance, my Onyx Poke3 has UART running on 1.8V levels.
So, back to your power button. That's internal. It connect directly to a GPIO on the SOC.
That means the voltage levels are probably 0V to 1.8V.
I'd guess that "R7027" is a pull-down resistor to ground.
That means the power switch is connected to 1.8V and it pulls the input on the SoC up.
(Many other things tend to have a switch ground things and they use a pull-up resistor to 1.8V)
Did you find the test point for the power switch? Did you see what happens when you push it?
It should go to 1.8V (obviously).
Renate said:
Forget "TTL" and 5V. There is nothing on your board that is at that level.
Sometimes signals that are designed for external things run at 3.3V, but they usually use a converter.
An actual SD card (if it's from the stone age) uses 3.3V levels.
Normally the system will just say, "Can we just talk at 1.8V levels?" And they do.
Most processors of the last decade work at 1.8V or less.
If a signal comes right out of the processor it will be at that level.
For instance, my Onyx Poke3 has UART running on 1.8V levels.
So, back to your power button. That's internal. It connect directly to a GPIO on the SOC.
That means the voltage levels are probably 0V to 1.8V.
I'd guess that "R7027" is a pull-down resistor to ground.
That means the power switch is connected to 1.8V and it pulls the input on the SoC up.
(Many other things tend to have a switch ground things and they use a pull-up resistor to 1.8V)
Did you find the test point for the power switch? Did you see what happens when you push it?
It should go to 1.8V (obviously).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What's the name of that protocol? The low/high threshold ranges for 1.8VDC?
CMOS or LVCMOS
Earlier logic families didn't generally go rail-to-rail, i.e. the full range of the power supply.
Since CMOS (complementary metal oxide semiconductors) the logic swings from the negative power supply (usually zero) to the positive power supply.
Over the years the voltage has gotten lower to reduce the power needed to swing the parasitic capacitances.
Your desktop probably runs at less than 1V
There is 5V on your cell phone motherboard, for the USB power in and the USB power out when powering peripherals.
Even then the actual logic on the data lines only swings from 0 to 3.3V (in USB2 low and full speed).
In USB2 high speed, it's 0.4V
Renate said:
Sometimes signals that are designed for external things run at 3.3V, but they usually use a converter.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What do you mean by external?
Renate said:
Normally the system will just say, "Can we just talk at 1.8V levels?" And they do.
Most processors of the last decade work at 1.8V or less.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
By system you mean the processor? That's assuming the signal is coming out of the processor and not going into the processor?
Renate said:
Normally the system will just say, "Can we just talk at 1.8V levels?" And they do.
Most processors of the last decade work at 1.8V or less.
If a signal comes right out of the processor it will be at that level.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So by "system" you mean the processor? That's assuming the signal is coming out of the processor and not going into the processor?
Renate said:
An actual SD card (if it's from the stone age) uses 3.3V levels.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So this would be pulled down to 1.8 V if it's going into the processor? And if it's below 1.8 V it may need to be pulled up if it's going into the processor? In other words, a processor simply talks at 1.8 V? Unless it's overvoltaged to 2.0 V or even up to 2.2 V for added headroom for overclocking (and shorter life span). I'm referring to PC processors (x86).
Renate said:
So, back to your power button. That's internal. It connect directly to a GPIO on the SOC.
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Click to collapse
What does internal mean here? I recognize the acronym GPIO from my Arduino experiments. That's General Purpose Input and Output. I didn't know ARM SOCs have that too. I thought they had purpose built ins and outs, not generalized/universal varieties. You can tell how little I know, right?!
Renate said:
That means the voltage levels are probably 0V to 1.8V.
I'd guess that "R7027" is a pull-down resistor to ground.
That means the power switch is connected to 1.8V and it pulls the input on the SoC up.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not sure we're on the same page here.
The chipset is Exynos 8890 Octa (14 nm). The CPU of which is an 8 core (4x2.3 GHz Mongoose & 4x1.6 GHz Cortex-A53) and the GPU is Mali-T880 MP12.
Mongoose 1 or M1 for short is an ARM microarchitecture designed by Samsung and their first in-house design according to WikiChip. Exynox 8890 features one "big" core cluster of 4 of these and an additional "littl" core cluster of Cortex-A53. Interestingly, "big" and "little" qualify as technical terms. Very technical! LOL. For someone who can't tell size. Anyway! I could not find any specifics on M1, but if the "Juno ARM Development Platform SoC Technical Overview r2p0" document is anything to go by, the "core supply to the quad core Cortex-A53 cluster" is "0.8-1.0V". I believe the "Juno" is a device people in the know (and in need) use to develop their own electronic products based on ARM processors.
I will not pretend like I know all of this. I am just a good researcher and a decent google-fu practitioner. On the grand scheme of things, I still fail to see the relevance of this to my question of what the voltage should be level should be at that resistor.
Renate said:
Did you find the test point for the power switch? Did you see what happens when you push it?
It should go to 1.8V (obviously).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What do you mean by test point? If you mean what end of the resistor I put the positive lead on, then no. Such information is not given in the service manual and I don't have the board view software needed to go in depth on that. But either side will give a similar reading of around 3.7 V.
I quote myself:
"I actually tried using both test leads directly on the resistor and while it did give me a reading, it also started to smell funny after a while. It also read something like 0.44 V. But after putting the negative lead on the metal shield, and positive on either side of the resistor, I got a very different reading. I got something like 3.7 V."
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Click to collapse
So negative lead on one end of the resistor and positive lead on the other end is the wrong idea.
The correct way to measure is to have the negative lead touch some point that connects to ground, like the metal around a screw hole or these metal shields, and then the positive lead on either side of the resistor. The difference between them is very small. It measures maybe 3.65 V if you put the red probe (positive) on the left end of resistor and it measures 3.70 V if you put the probe on the other side of the resistor. Can you maybe answer which value to note down? I keep running into this issue, and I keep notes of my findings (like a proper professional will do), so I keep writing down both. This I think is something I will learn with time, and once I get proper schematics of the things I measure.
I also wonder why some people will write down voltage as "5V" while others will write "5 V"? Is there no standard to this? Do you travel at 60mph or at 60 mph? I don't travel at either, because I use Km/h and there is always a space between measurement value and the measurement unit. But we have "Km/h" wrong too, because "kilo" is the only SI prefix that uses a lower case "k", so it should be "km/h". But Microsoft has it wrong too, because they write "KB" for kilobyte, instead of "kB". This depends on what version of Windows OS it is I think, or if it's MS-DOS. Anyway. I got carried away here. But please do tell me if there is a right and wrong way to write out 5 volts with unit symbols, I'm curious.
Renate said:
There is 5V on your cell phone motherboard, for the USB power in and the USB power out when powering peripherals.
Even then the actual logic on the data lines only swings from 0 to 3.3V (in USB2 low and full speed).
In USB2 high speed, it's 0.4V
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Swinging logic sounds like fun.
Speaking of powering peripherals, maybe you can help me understand why my brand new Seek Thermal Comapct thermal camera doesn't work with my brand new Galaxy S22 phone? They both use USB-C connectors. But the Seek Thermal app doesn't see my camera when I plug it in. It sees is sometimes. It saw it the first time and Android prompted me to decide if I wanted Seek Thermal to auto start each time I plug the device in. I said yes. So now the phone does see something being plugged in, because it auto starts Seek Thermal, but the app complains that camera is not plugged in. If I leave it plugged in, reboot, and then it auto starts again and sees it. If I unplug, plug back in, sometimes it sees it again but most often not. So I have to reboot each time I want to be sure I will be able to use it.
It's something odd going on and I'm not the only one affected by this. Customers of FLIR ONE PRO (not caps scream, it's actually name of the product) have made similar complaints. One FLIR ONE PRO user said that this is due to lack of support for USB OTG on "modern" Android devices. Do you think it's related to OTG? What's the the current status of OTG? Is it deprecated? He suggested using a OTG adapter. Except there are none for USB-C to USB-C. They only exist for connections between USB-A to USB-C or micro-USB (B?) and vice verse. Not between USB-C and USB-C. Because USB-C devices don't need training wheels to enable compatibility, right?