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I must say after months of flashing and upgrading to a zillion new WM 2005 romz, I'm so happy i went back to 2003 SE. (no disrespect to the fine work of all developers here)
I almost forgot how fast my device could be. And do we really need all the extra applications wm 2005 has to offer? Seems most people just want a fast device that lasts 2 days on battery.
The single problem 2003 has is the bluetooth issue, which still exists in some way in all WM 2005 versions. Isn't there a way to just fix the BT issue in 2003?
grtz
let just say ppl have different preference.
do u have the latest BT stack from widcomm ie ver 3900. It works OK for me(running WM2003SE)
actually no, i don't. I just have the standard rom. (140.556 i believe) Were can i get that? and can i install it separately?
nijhof said:
I must say after months of flashing and upgrading to a zillion new WM 2005 romz, I'm so happy i went back to 2003 SE. (no disrespect to the fine work of all developers here)
I almost forgot how fast my device could be. And do we really need all the extra applications wm 2005 has to offer? Seems most people just want a fast device that lasts 2 days on battery.
The single problem 2003 has is the bluetooth issue, which still exists in some way in all WM 2005 versions. Isn't there a way to just fix the BT issue in 2003?
grtz
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would agree, I have a BA with 2003 SE, a Wizard WM5 and a Prophet WM5. The BA certainly seems to run much faster.
nijhof said:
actually no, i don't. I just have the standard rom. (140.556 i believe) Were can i get that? and can i install it separately?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am talking about BT stack(and not ROM version)
You may check the FTP site for it
sorry i'm kind of a newbie, but I have bluetooth version BT-PPCE/PE 1.0.0 (www.broadcom.com) Build 3900 with ROM 140.00WWE and radio 1.1300 (1.15 did not work also)
is this the widcomm you mean?
if not, i could not locate it on the ftp site.
help is much appreciated.
for me, the most important beside having this BA as a phone is handling emails (in Vietnamese, a typical non english character set). 2K3 sucks a lot in handling this, and I still don't find any application which can substitute this UTF-8 in 2K3 outlook. With 2k5, life is much easier, but sucks in another aspect: cannot handle many emails (say - I am synchronyzing at only 1 week latest emails, while with my previous 2K3, it was 1 month without any problem).
Any suggestion to handle UTF-8 in outlook under 2k3 environment will make me coming back to 2k3 IMMEDIATELY!
Thanks for reading
I would like to see this thread filled with more info and turned into a wiki page comparing BA+2003SE vs BA+WM5...
Some things I would like to have better explained:
STORAGE - I have read that 2003SE divides its ram to be used as, well, ram, and the other part to be used as storage (like a ramdisk). So the is a backup battery to keep this ram alive if the main battery gets exhausted, but if you don't recharge for an extended time this battery could die too and lead to data loss and a hard reset.
In contrast, there would be no mode 'ramdisk' in WM5. This would solve the data loss issue, and have an impact on filesystem performance which is understandable. Well, BA+2003SE has 128MB of ram dived 50-50 by default between actual ram and storage and 96 mb of persistent storage, 40something available to the user. How does it change while using BA+WM5?
BATTERY LIFE - does it improve? if we have no more ramdisk, and thus no risk of data loss, do we have backup battery + main battery juice to chug along happily with our BAs?
PERFORMANCE - Do WM5 apps perform better than 2003/SE? Do they use more or less memory? the filesystem performance drop should affect apps differently...
STABILITY - How often do we need to soft reset with WM5? On my BA+2003SE, for example, I have to soft reset before using my GPRS. it connects once, and keeps happy until I stop using the connection for some time. After that it gets lost and I have to soft reset the machine to conect to GPRS again...
Persistent Storage
The reason I use the WM5 rom is the persistent storage.
I realize that not everyone runs their phone battery down or changes the battery (and I don't do it that often) but it's a nice not to have to do a backup everyday (ok I should but why) just because my battery might run down.
Also my BA battery would come loose at times and the phone would reset. With WM5 I only have to reset the date.
That's my major reason. Persistent storage. Otherwise WM5 brings no benefits as far as I can see.
I've been trying a week of wm2003 after using ivan and tuma (1.3, 1.4) for a month or 2.
All WM5 builds gave me these problems on-and-off in everyday use :-
Slow phone app response (answering on wakeup and dialing particularly)
Laggy UI response normally, sometimes crawls along for 30-40 seconds.
WM2003 gives me these :-
Tap-screen goes dead on wake up. Powering off then on fixes this.
Quick UI response normally, sometimes crawls along for 30-40 seconds.
Audio fails totally on the phone sometimes, reboot fixes this.
Crazy battery use compared to WM5.
(I don't have a BT headset, so I'm immune to the famous problems that brings)
To be honest I find as many, if not more problems with 2003 as with the recent WM5 releases. It's a huge credit to those brave guys hacking the rom in their spare time that their ROMs are more or less as robust as the official builds.
On balance I'd have to go for WM5 for its tight Messenger/hotmail integration, more efficient battery use and the more intuitive UI, even if it does respond slower.
Right now I'm checking regularly for the release of TuMa 1.5, at that point I'll be compelled to re-upgrade to WM5.
half your problems can be silved by using radio 1.12 or 1.13, 1.15 has a never ending list of problems with WM5. Downgrade and you will be fine
I'll copy your approach and go for 1.13 then, thanks for the help.
I am the not so proud owner of a Wizard but have the opportunity of moving to a Wing. I love my wizard with the exception of the radio performance, poor reception, missed calls and vanishing text messages which are all part of the deal. So those of you who have a Wing, is the radio any good?
Radio is slightly better than the MDA, IMO. BT radio is definitely better. WM6 is sweet, and stable.... speed and battery are fine overclocked at 247. The BT stack is waaaay better for A2DP.
The big problem is program memory... something around 15MB before plug-ins, and with a medium-bad leak. No one has real good answers yet, and we are all DESPARATELY waiting for custom ROMS! In the meantime, I've recommended using Oxios to clear memory as often as possible, and soft resets at least once a day.
It's really a great device, except for the memory problem. If you do get one, make sure to check at HoFo as to the best purchase deal.
-Richard
Well, the reason why you're missing so many calls is because your Radio is 2.61. That for whatever reason, that "improved" radio sucks in Southern California. If I remember correctly, that was a German radio. The Wing has an upgraded radio, but I haven't tried it in areas I know are sketchy. But all in all, except for the huge loss of RAM due to God only knows (I don't run My Favs) it seems to be a pretty stable phone, but I've only had it for less than a week.
Thanks falconeyez, I have actually been running 2.69 for the past few days but it is as bad or worse than 2.61. I have jsut downloaded 2.40 from the FTP to try that but I have just about given up hope of any radio rom working in the Wizard. If the Wing has a suitable replacement then I will make the change as the rest of the phone appears to be the same as a Wizard
jt_armstrong said:
Thanks falconeyez, I have actually been running 2.69 for the past few days but it is as bad or worse than 2.61. I have jsut downloaded 2.40 from the FTP to try that but I have just about given up hope of any radio rom working in the Wizard. If the Wing has a suitable replacement then I will make the change as the rest of the phone appears to be the same as a Wizard
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No problem, that's what the boards are for. When I was using the wizard I kept my radio at 2.25 (2.26?) and that consistently gave me the best results.
rpodos said:
Radio is slightly better than the MDA, IMO. BT radio is definitely better. WM6 is sweet, and stable.... speed and battery are fine overclocked at 247. The BT stack is waaaay better for A2DP.
The big problem is program memory... something around 15MB before plug-ins, and with a medium-bad leak. No one has real good answers yet, and we are all DESPARATELY waiting for custom ROMS! In the meantime, I've recommended using Oxios to clear memory as often as possible, and soft resets at least once a day.
It's really a great device, except for the memory problem. If you do get one, make sure to check at HoFo as to the best purchase deal.
-Richard
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
/agree 100% with everything said here.
As a result I've been playing with customizing my own rom (removing programs adding in - etc) and what I've come up with is a cross between the Touch and the Iphone - I use the iLock and the iContacts, and all of the other themes and apps from the Touch as posted in the Touch for Wizard thread (http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=311225)
Now my problem is: I want to remove the annoying taskbar that holds the battery status (OEM) and etc on the bottom because I do not need it anymore. Anyone have any ideas on how to do this?
Just wondering if anyone's TomTom 6 or 7 is as slow as the one as this video I made or is yours running smoothly. Would have though TomTom would have ran much better than this due the the GPU acceleration
Even though it's a VGA screen my Tytn 2 was running this much, much faster, not far off silky smooth . The TomTom in the video is v7 VGA running the latest v7.20 maps (tested also with TomTom 6 QVGA running v6 maps and was just as slow).
Am posting this as reading some posts here and people are saying my TomTom is running smoothly, mines running perfectly, no lag etc.
Look forward to your feedback
Excuse the background noise, forgot to remove it
http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v604/Radeon/?action=view¤t=MOV04324.flv
im using tomtom7 that came with some of the original diamond roms and the free map that you get for one city from tomtom's site and it runs flawlessly.
Smartstradamus said:
im using tomtom7 that came with some of the original diamond roms and the free map that you get for one city from tomtom's site and it runs flawlessly.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What rom version are you running?
Wouldn't mind trying it.
i've run tomtom (both 6 and 7 with your same map) on ALL the ROM that we have at this moment for ours diamond , always smoothly.
neither my polaris have problem like that in your video , my be you have too many POI activated.
Radeon123 said:
Just wondering if anyone's TomTom 6 or 7 is as slow as the one as this video
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yep, mine is as ****ty as yours. That is the reason I liked Tomtom is it's smooth movement..... not on the Diamond though, might as well run a slideshow, could possibly be faster.
hi radeon, it seems that i have the same problem as you.
till now i'm thinking it's because of the gps refresh rate, but i'm not really sure
because this should offend all diamond users...
but for me the major problem of using any gps software at the moment is the
enormous lag at low speeds. when i'm in a traffic jam the position updates approx.
only every 100m, and the actual speed is also very slow in changing it's values (i'm
standing still and the tachymetre shows still ~10km/h for a few seconds...
i guess this is because the static navigation of the chipset.
regards,
markus
Hi
I had the same problem on my first tomtom, you display too much POIs, try to disable a lot of POI and retest.
POI's Rubbish
It has nothing to do with the number of POI's. I have run the exact same version of TTN and the exact same map on a Treo 750 with ALL POI's activated and it was as smooth as my Tomtom GO720.
I just find it hard to beleive that my old Palm ran faster??????
Dont know why but it isnt POI's.
thorin31 said:
Hi
I had the same problem on my first tomtom, you display too much POIs, try to disable a lot of POI and retest.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I always make sure my POI's are disabled otherwise TomTom would run a lot slower than that video .
Smartstradamus said:
im using tomtom7 that came with some of the original diamond roms and the free map that you get for one city from tomtom's site and it runs flawlessly.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well I would like to see that "flawlessly" on a video!
I just can't believe the current TomToms run flawlessly on the current Diamond ROMs. Till I see it myself.
pietrucci said:
Well I would like to see that "flawlessly" on a video!
I just can't believe the current TomToms run flawlessly on the current Diamond ROMs. Till I see it myself.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Would love to see this to
Just as a test, I removed all my POI's and voices from the map folder and ran TomTom with as little on screen as possible, also disabled all street names etc, did a demo run and it ran at exactly the same speed as that video.
I'm running the TLR 1.37.405.1 rom at the moment, so hopefully this maybe a rom issue because the GPU is doing bugger all to help run TomTom, seems the CPU is doing everything, and being a VGA screen that's why it's a lot slower than my old Tytn 2 which the CPU did everything there to.
This is the only issue I have with the Diamond and it's an annoying one
pietrucci said:
Well I would like to see that "flawlessly" on a video!
I just can't believe the current TomToms run flawlessly on the current Diamond ROMs. Till I see it myself.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Trust me when i say that you need the tomtom version that was shipped on certain roms.
I would give you a link but im sure the xda guys would class it as warez!
I have a uk diamond that didnt come with tomtom7 but i have a license for tomtom so i found the optimized version for the diamond.
My friend and I both have Tilts running the following:
HardSPL 3.56
Death V4.1
Radio 1.58.16.24
The only difference between the two phones, is that I used the cab widely available here for TomTom and he bought a full fledged copy on DVD.
When I go to use my phone for navigation everything is choppy like so many others, but he showed me a route demo and it's smooth as the Magician in the htcclassaction.org demonstration video. I can't figure out how it's so smooth though. He's not using the "D3D drivers", either, so I'm at a loss.
His TomTom is 6.01 with 6.01 USA and Canada
Any ideas as to why / how TomTom got around the choppyness of DirectDraw?
Nothing at all?
I think this could be very important for DirectDraw and 2D acceleration if someone could figure this out
What I found when running TomTom on my Tytn II is that if you disable all the POIs from showing on the map while you are navigating then the software runs very smoothly.
If you use any speed cam warnings etc these still show up on the map as you navigate but it has no impact on the speed etc.
Let me know how that works.
Paul.
What about differences in the speeds of the SD cards? What do you have and what does he have? There have been reports that the 4GB and higher capacity cards cause Tom Tom to run slow.
how is it laggy?
Err...could this be the old Windoze analogy???
Increase of version = extra stuff to do???
Like early version just drew maps,,,new version waits for you to talk to it, checks traffic draws more items and still wants to work on same memory and processor???
you disable all the POIs from showing on the map while you are navigating then the software runs very smoothly.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm sure glad to have seen this post. I've posted on 2-3 different forums, including teh TomTom support forum here; I've Called TomTom support...all to no avail.
This fixed my problem.
how is it laggy?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Go in and check a dozen or so POIs to display while driving, and I suspect you'll find out. Map was jerky; I could make a turn, and be a half block down the road before it know I had turned.
I have an 8GB Sandisk MicroSDHC card and he has a 4GB Sandisk MicroSD card. I'm going to try disabling POIs, but I don't think that's it.
NerdsMcGee said:
I have an 8GB Sandisk MicroSDHC card and he has a 4GB Sandisk MicroSD card. I'm going to try disabling POIs, but I don't think that's it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Disabling POIs sped up TomTom IMMENSELY. Thanks for the info.
NerdsMcGee said:
Disabling POIs sped up TomTom IMMENSELY. Thanks for the info.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're welcome.
I have a 4gb micro sd card and the speed has nothing to do with the size or speed of the card.
I wonder if the video of the 2 machines on the class action lawsuit website had the Tytn II displaying all the POIs.
I think they would be a bit embarrassed if that turns out to be the case
I think the problem is just TomToms laggy software rather than the PDA
Paul.
firstandlast said:
You're welcome.
I have a 4gb micro sd card and the speed has nothing to do with the size or speed of the card.
I wonder if the video of the 2 machines on the class action lawsuit website had the Tytn II displaying all the POIs.
I think they would be a bit embarrassed if that turns out to be the case
I think the problem is just TomToms laggy software rather than the PDA
Paul.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I wouldn't be surprised. TomTom has always been smooth and lag-free for me, even with the stock HTC shipped ROM.
I forget which versions I've used, but I think it was:
6.02?
6.030 (or 6.032? I can't remember)
7.450 (the latest TTN7)
Well, at least video is smooth. I had sound issues with 6.030/32 and TTN7 that did not occur with the first version I used.
As you can see by my current sig (although soon to change) I'm using the latest HTC WM 6.1 ROM and 1.65.17.56 Radio with the correct 3.28.0000 SPL and I get very laggy GPS performance full-stop. It's not necessarily jerky (although on occasion where lots of movement such as going around a roundabout occurs, it can be) but it is very laggy. By this I mean I can be sitting in the train stationary and from the train starting to move and Tomtom Navigator actually registering movement/speed, it can take up to 25 seconds - and this is with a reasonable signal reception averaging 3 or more bars the whole time. I put this down to the actual GPS perfomance of the Radio module driver. Tomtoms call centre in the UK advised me that TTN Version 6.032 (the HTC official version) isn't actually supported under WM 6.1, only the original WM 6.0 O/S so guess what's happening to my TyTN II later this week at the HTC repair centre.... I'll be so pleased not to have to put up with rubbish GPS performance anymore. Next time I'll only upgrade to WM 6.1 once I get the all clear that they've fixed their WM 6.1 ROM/Radio combination.
Oh and I have tried TT 6.10 when Tomtom were first attempting to work out why their software was playing up after the WM 6.1 upgrade (they provided me with a free 'crossgrade' for faultfinding purposes) and I fould in terms of smoothness, it was identical to 6.032. I went back to 6.032 because 6.10 didn't have fully working customised things like jog button volume control, volume change screen indication and native inbuilt 'internal' GPS setting. The start menu also misbehaved or the physical Windows button on the phone wouldn't work properly when TTN was running, something like that - altogether not as 'Kaiser friendly'.
NerdsMcGee said:
Disabling POIs sped up TomTom IMMENSELY. Thanks for the info.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Perhaps this works with Navigon, too. Gonna try that later
I am using TTN 6.032 on the latest WM 6.1 with a maximum of POIs enabled and it runs smoothly.
I've tried a version lower than 6.032, and based on my personal experience it didn't really make a difference. As long as you turn off the POI the TT will run like crazy, and plus the lower version is not as user friendly as the 6.032, or even better V.7, that's if V.7 will accept the maps from V.6, just my 2 cents.
Flying Kiwi said:
As you can see by my current sig (although soon to change) I'm using the latest HTC WM 6.1 ROM and 1.65.17.56 Radio with the correct 3.28.0000 SPL and I get very laggy GPS performance full-stop. It's not necessarily jerky (although on occasion where lots of movement such as going around a roundabout occurs, it can be) but it is very laggy. By this I mean I can be sitting in the train stationary and from the train starting to move and Tomtom Navigator actually registering movement/speed, it can take up to 25 seconds - and this is with a reasonable signal reception averaging 3 or more bars the whole time. I put this down to the actual GPS perfomance of the Radio module driver. Tomtoms call centre in the UK advised me that TTN Version 6.032 (the HTC official version) isn't actually supported under WM 6.1, only the original WM 6.0 O/S so guess what's happening to my TyTN II later this week at the HTC repair centre.... I'll be so pleased not to have to put up with rubbish GPS performance anymore. Next time I'll only upgrade to WM 6.1 once I get the all clear that they've fixed their WM 6.1 ROM/Radio combination.
Oh and I have tried TT 6.10 when Tomtom were first attempting to work out why their software was playing up after the WM 6.1 upgrade (they provided me with a free 'crossgrade' for faultfinding purposes) and I fould in terms of smoothness, it was identical to 6.032. I went back to 6.032 because 6.10 didn't have fully working customised things like jog button volume control, volume change screen indication and native inbuilt 'internal' GPS setting. The start menu also misbehaved or the physical Windows button on the phone wouldn't work properly when TTN was running, something like that - altogether not as 'Kaiser friendly'.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Google "static navigation". The oddball performance at low speeds (such as lag from a stop) is not TomTom's fault. It's a setting in the GPS receiver that (unfortunately) can't be disabled on the Kaiser.
Hi,
I updated my Kaiser using the official T-Mobile upgrade (German) to WM 6.1. Since then, my GPS is very slow to aquire a first fix. When it's up and running, performance is fine, but time-to-first-fix is three to five minutes, sometimes longer.
This even happens when I exit the GPS program, wait a while, then start it again - TTFF will again be more than three minutes.
QuickGPS is running and reporting its data as current. However, the GPS still appears to "cold start" every time, not even remembering its own previous data. With the previous WM 6.0 startup times were fine while clearly dependand on the actuality of QuickGPS data.
Has anybody else observed this behaviour, and is there a tweak to cure it?
Regs,
150d
Just have a quick search for WM6.1 and GPS. Early 6.1 ROMs had very poor GPS performance, there's a huge thread about it. Maybe your T-Mob ROM is one of them. The ultimate solution is switching to a ROM based on a newer build, custom ROMs are all fine by now.
kilrah said:
Just have a quick search for WM6.1 and GPS.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Did you try that? Just enter anything plus "6.1" and there will be zero results. On the other hand, enter "T-Mobile upgrade GPS" and there will be about 300 pages of results, few of which will even contain the word "T-Mobile".
Either the search function doesn't work or it just doesn't like me.
Early 6.1 ROMs had very poor GPS performance, there's a huge thread about it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Could you give me a pointer, please?
The ultimate solution is switching to a ROM based on a newer build, custom ROMs are all fine by now.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Problem is that I don't want to use a non-official ROM just yet. Additionally, I'm not that keen on doing the installing bit all over again just yet, so I was hoping there was a simpler solution. ;-)
Regs,
150d
150d said:
Did you try that? Just enter anything plus "6.1" and there will be zero results. On the other hand, enter "T-Mobile upgrade GPS" and there will be about 300 pages of results, few of which will even contain the word "T-Mobile".
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
OK then, open wide for the train going into the tunnel: [Spoon Feeding Mode]*Hopeless* GPS after 6.1 Update?[/Spoon Feeding Mode]
Problem is that I don't want to use a non-official ROM just yet. Additionally, I'm not that keen on doing the installing bit all over again just yet, so I was hoping there was a simpler solution. ;-)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There is.... leave it on Windows Mobile 6.0 Even the very latest HTC Official TyTN II ROMs for the European and Asian markets have hopeless GPS here in the UK when compared to the one in my sig. I've not tried any custom or operator provided ROMs so cant comment there. I think the first step should be complaining to T-Mobile that their their latest and greatest ROM upgrade actually broke your GPS and asking them for a solution (if you don't have the original ROM/ability to revert it yourself). If they claim to not know anything about this issue, you can tell them how you found out that it's a common problem.