Database Develop

Direct Push issues

Hi everyone
Have been using the Diamond for a few days now and have noticed a few quirks here and there. Mostly are software issues that I think will be ironed out in later releases of the ROM but for now there are a few issues that I was wondering if anyone else was having.
I have my own Exchange server running and have Direct Push/3G on constantly. The only issue is that sometimes i get the mail come through via Direct Push while sometimes it doesnt. In those situations I have to push "sync" in active sync for it to grab the new mails.
My settings are on "as item arrives" for both peak and offpeak and the status in active sync is shown as connected. This worked perfectly on my Trinity and Direct Push has never missed a beat once.
Anyone else experiencing similar issues?

The only time I ever experienced this is when O2 had a data outage in the UK yesterday. Other than that it has worked flawlessly.

Have my own exchange aswell, and haven't any problems so far !

Have you tried checking the peak times in the options for activesync?

not Diamond-related at all (since I don't have one yet) - but are you perhaps roaming networks sometimes?
had a customer with this issue and there is an extra option 'sync when roaming' (at least in WM5) - syncing manually worked in other networks without option enabled

HKC\Software\HTC\Manila:
PushMailOn : default value is "0" ( OFF)
PLease chech this value in your registry. I wonder if this settings might affect push mail avaiability for you.
I would set to "1" and soft reset to confirm.

I have the problem also! I had no problems with a TyTN II being used on the same Exchange server, but the diamond has a mind of it's own.

The peak time is on the default 8am to 8pm and reverse for off peak. But I dont think this affects it since I have it on "as item arrives" for both.
I dont have "use above settings when roaming" ticked since I'm in a very well covered 3G zone. The "H" icon is constantly on where I am.
I havent tried the reg edit yet SecureGSM, thanx for the tip. I will try to isolate the problem and do that for a last resort.
Is your problem consistent or inconsistent vas79?
I have noticed something but not sure if my paranoia or what but I have a feeling the time size affects it. If you have it large at the default size the mail comes in fine. But when you minimise the time to see more calendar items, the mail does not direct push. I'm still testing this so i'll post result after a few days of use in both.

Well it consistently doesn't work!
I very rarely hear the email alert when the phone is in standby. When I turn the phone on a unlock no email then within 10 seconds email will come in and get the little icon by the Mail saying how many new emails.
Alternatively I'd go to Activesync and it would say last sync'd at XXX rather than connected. I then select Sync which it does then it stays connected until next time.
If I go to the comm manger it says Direct Push is on and Data Connection on.
I can live with it, because i assume it's a bug and it will get fixed!..
My major gripe is it doesn't ring straight away, takes 3/4 rings to get going and ring. I have missed so many calls because of this!

i have been using Diamond with Exchange Server 2007 pushmail via GPRS since 1st June. There is no problem so far.
I am using BlackBerry at the same time. Basically pushmail arrives later than blackberry for 1.5 secs, I am sure all mails can be arrived to my Diamond in these 2 weeks.

vas79 said:
Well it consistently doesn't work!
I very rarely hear the email alert when the phone is in standby. When I turn the phone on a unlock no email then within 10 seconds email will come in and get the little icon by the Mail saying how many new emails.
Alternatively I'd go to Activesync and it would say last sync'd at XXX rather than connected. I then select Sync which it does then it stays connected until next time.
If I go to the comm manger it says Direct Push is on and Data Connection on.
I can live with it, because i assume it's a bug and it will get fixed!..
My major gripe is it doesn't ring straight away, takes 3/4 rings to get going and ring. I have missed so many calls because of this!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hmmm ok, seems like you have a different problem to me. Mine actually says "connected" but mail just doesnt get pushed out or rather Diamond doesnt get the message. Have you made sure that you have "as item arrives" in the schedule (in activesync) for both peak and off peak?

yuhaohuang said:
hmmm ok, seems like you have a different problem to me. Mine actually says "connected" but mail just doesnt get pushed out or rather Diamond doesnt get the message. Have you made sure that you have "as item arrives" in the schedule (in activesync) for both peak and off peak?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yep, everything says "as item arrives" also tried ticking even when roaming, when i'm not!!
Actually today it has said connected everytime I've checked!
Only thing I changed yesterday was one of the registry tweaks to improve touchflo 3d performance.
When the UK rom drops and we can load it I will see then!

UK Rom here and seeing exactly the same issues!

Mine has been working fine too...

EDGE

All,
Generic question about Edge really..
I have setup my diamond for direct push from my works exchange server..
when it does this it opens the data connection and logs onto the edge network and recieves any new emals (headers only). Now, the signal indicator stays on the E rather than the normal mobile mast icon. Does this mean it stays logged into the edge network? I pay per kb but I'm guessing if its just logged into the edge network then its not actually downloading anything, only when the scheduled time to check the exchange server? is that correct?
Regards,
Me.

Depending on the Settings the EDGE Connection keeps established because the ActiveSync is sending a Keepalive (Heartbeat) to the Exchange Server.
This "Ping" is not very Traffic Consuming.
Looks that you have configured the "Always on / On new Objects" rather than a scheduled ordinary Download.
So if you want your emails to be "pushed" to your Diamond immediately the connection is kept alive and the "E" will be displayed instead of the "Antenna".

Hmm.. must be that heartbeat.. I have it configured to only download manually..
Any way to change the heartbeat? how often is it sent?
Regards,
Me.

Hmm dunno excatly.... on MFe on Symbian Devices is was set to 10 Seconds.
But the strange thing is that I also configured a scheduled 15Min Download (both Peak and Offpeak Time set to manually) and the connection will be torn down shortly after the Download.

hm.. its definately not taking down the edge connection.. I'll have a search around the forums to see if there is a setting somewhere! thanks for the pointers though.

What does the Active Sync Screen say after the download?
Connected?
Or is it showing the last Sync Time?

pballs said:
Hmm.. must be that heartbeat.. I have it configured to only download manually..
Any way to change the heartbeat? how often is it sent?
Regards,
Me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I do it manually and its no big deal. It takes 5 seconds tops. Or you can set the phone to chek every 30 minutes or something like that (weekdays) and chek every 2 hours (weekends) I also pay for KB.
Hope it helps.
cheers boys.

jkb770 said:
What does the Active Sync Screen say after the download?
Connected?
Or is it showing the last Sync Time?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ActiveSync says last Sync Time, not connected.. hmm..
Ta,
Me.

How does push mail really work?

Hi!
I have tried to wrap my head around this but have not succeded yet. I think I have the system actually set up and working. I have push mail on in the comm manager and I have set up our exchange server in activesync. Mail seems to arrive in the phone from time to time so I guess it works. My question is more about how it works.
I am using the spb GPRS monitor so I see there is traffic beeing logged. In the sync settings it is set to "when items arrive" (I have swedish language but I think the english says something similar). Does the phone go out and log into the mailserver and checks for mail? This hardly seems like "push" email.
If thats not how it works, how does the mailserver send the email to my phone - more true to the meaning of "push".
If someone savvy in the subject took some time to explain I would be very happy

essentially you keep a connection open constantly to your email server and as soon as the server gets new messages the client (your mobile phone in this case) is notified and downloads the email. its quite battery intensive since the phone has to keep a data connection with the server at all times.
for a complete explanation read http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Push_email

Ok I see, I am like a normal Outlook client logged in at all times. Its clearer now.
In regards to the battery drain, what does drain more, 3G or Edge connection?

Great tip thanks

Another quick question - since it uses EDGE when getting email, what happens when I enter and log into a WiFi network. Does it abandon EDGE in favour for the, mostly, free WiFi internet thus saving me money?

Push technology?

Hey guys, I've been lurking around the forums for a while, (rooted my G1 the day I got it, thanks guys!)
Before my G1, I had a blackberry, with "push email". It seemed cool, I could send an email to my blackberry address, and get it in seconds. It might have taken longer, I just didn't realize it because I had no web-access to my blackberry address.
Now, with the G1, I get that you have control over whether or not your gmail syncs (seems to be every 5 minutes), but I keep hearing about "push gmail", suggesting that gmail sends a token to your phone telling it you have new gmail.
This doesn't seem to be the case, because my phone doesn't tell me I have new gmail until it "syncs" again.
Do I just have an idiotic fantasy-land idea about "push technology"? Is the ability to have your cell phone's gmail app check for new mail every 5 minutes what they mean when they say "push"?
Because if my mail client still has to check every 5 minutes, that still sounds like "pull".
Not trying to start any arguments, android is awesome!

umaro said:
Hey guys, I've been lurking around the forums for a while, (rooted my G1 the day I got it, thanks guys!)
Before my G1, I had a blackberry, with "push email". It seemed cool, I could send an email to my blackberry address, and get it in seconds. It might have taken longer, I just didn't realize it because I had no web-access to my blackberry address.
Now, with the G1, I get that you have control over whether or not your gmail syncs (seems to be every 5 minutes), but I keep hearing about "push gmail", suggesting that gmail sends a token to your phone telling it you have new gmail.
This doesn't seem to be the case, because my phone doesn't tell me I have new gmail until it "syncs" again.
Do I just have an idiotic fantasy-land idea about "push technology"? Is the ability to have your cell phone's gmail app check for new mail every 5 minutes what they mean when they say "push"?
Because if my mail client still has to check every 5 minutes, that still sounds like "pull".
Not trying to start any arguments, android is awesome!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Try Seven. It's the best that I can think of at the moment.
http://community.seven.com/main.php

Gmail is push. Check Settings --> Data Synchronization. Note that there is NO time setting. Check Gmail --> Settings --> Labels. Note that the ONLY time setting is in DAYS, which indicates the time period over which you should have sync, i.e., things older than X days won't sync (though they WILL download.
Also note: If your network connection drops, then the connection with the gmail server is broken and push email will be broken until the connection can be re-established. Naturally, you don't want the thing to keep on trying over and over again (draining your battery) to make a connection when it isn't available, so it just tries every once in a while. Once the connection with the gmail server is back, THEN push comes back.
For example, I have no data plan since in canada it just costs so much that it simply isn't worth it -- which means that all my data goes over wifi. In order to conserve battery, I have it set to turn wifi OFF when it is both unplugged AND screen off. During this time, it obviously doesn't get push email. When the connection comes back, it may take a little while before it logs back in to gmail and restarts synchronization. If it is already signed in, then email delivery is literally within a couple of seconds.
Note: it signs in upon forced synchronization (manual or periodic), which is why you observe that email is delivered only after a synchronization. It doesn't synchronize unless it is either disconnected, or you initiate a manual forced synchronization.
Email is pull. This is a separate app from gmail and should not be confused. This would have the option under Account Settings --> Email check frequency.
If you want non-GMAIL push email, I suggest k9mail BETA. It does, of course, have the same limitations as the gmail app in that it can't synchronize unless there is a network connection present.
umaro said:
Hey guys, I've been lurking around the forums for a while, (rooted my G1 the day I got it, thanks guys!)
Before my G1, I had a blackberry, with "push email". It seemed cool, I could send an email to my blackberry address, and get it in seconds. It might have taken longer, I just didn't realize it because I had no web-access to my blackberry address.
Now, with the G1, I get that you have control over whether or not your gmail syncs (seems to be every 5 minutes), but I keep hearing about "push gmail", suggesting that gmail sends a token to your phone telling it you have new gmail.
This doesn't seem to be the case, because my phone doesn't tell me I have new gmail until it "syncs" again.
Do I just have an idiotic fantasy-land idea about "push technology"? Is the ability to have your cell phone's gmail app check for new mail every 5 minutes what they mean when they say "push"?
Because if my mail client still has to check every 5 minutes, that still sounds like "pull".
Not trying to start any arguments, android is awesome!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

[Q] Why Gmail its not full push email?

i love gmail but im wondering why its not full push e-mail?
all will say yes its push mail but you need leave all day "sync" on to get notifications if you turn off the sync you will not have instant e mail.
leaving all day "sync" will drain a little more the battery, so if you get a mail when you have "sync" off you will nit have any notification UNTIL you turn on, there is program like shutupbattery that will sync every X time but whats the point of push mail?
get instant right? i guess using k9 will work better (not sure) but why not in stock gmail app?

That's what push is. It is a constant low bandwidth connection kept open waiting for Google to send notifications.
The gmail servers cannot just send a message to your phones IP or anything like that, because trying to get that to work with all the various operators and different networking setups in the world would be impossible.
That's how push works on a windows mobile phone, and maybe even a blackberry (but I cannot be sure of that since they run special software on the telco's side)

Clarkster said:
That's what push is. It is a constant low bandwidth connection kept open waiting for Google to send notifications.
The gmail servers cannot just send a message to your phones IP or anything like that, because trying to get that to work with all the various operators and different networking setups in the world would be impossible.
That's how push works on a windows mobile phone, and maybe even a blackberry (but I cannot be sure of that since they run special software on the telco's side)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i didint test it or dont remember if chrome to phone works without sync but if all works in that way why google bother to toggle "sync" yea i know its a low bandwith connection instead always check as poll but you need leave all day sync on to all work well and that will drain a little battery too

Well, you should test, that IS how Chrome to Phone works. It uses the push notification system Google developed. Which uses the push data connection.
The point is, apps written for 2.2 and up should use this system when possible. Instead of having your widgets, twitter apps, chat apps, mail apps all doing their own push or periodic checking, they can all use the one Google connection. Saving battery over 4 apps doing their own checking.
And of course it uses the battery. If you want push on ANY device it will use the battery a lot more. If you want your battery to last longer, don't use any push features.

zen kun said:
i didint test it or dont remember if chrome to phone works without sync but if all works in that way why google bother to toggle "sync" yea i know its a low bandwith connection instead always check as poll but you need leave all day sync on to all work well and that will drain a little battery too
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Dude, you ever tried to get your ISP to turn on your internet connection on your home laptop when you get a mail?
Well, since you (hopefully) understood what kind of gibberish it is, maybe you'll understand why the data connection is always on in the phone? Because it's your internet, and without it you WON'T HAVE ANY DATA AT ALL.
If you choose to disable this connection for battery savings - it's your personal problem that you won't get any service that comes from the internet, including mails. That's how it works, and Google has nothing to do with it.

Jack_R1 said:
Dude, you ever tried to get your ISP to turn on your internet connection on your home laptop when you get a mail?
Well, since you (hopefully) understood what kind of gibberish it is, maybe you'll understand why the data connection is always on in the phone? Because it's your internet, and without it you WON'T HAVE ANY DATA AT ALL.
If you choose to disable this connection for battery savings - it's your personal problem that you won't get any service that comes from the internet, including mails. That's how it works, and Google has nothing to do with it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
FYI, they aren't talking about turning off data, rather have gmail push without having to keep sync on. With sync on, the apps regularly poke at the servers to get info about new emails, etc. In contrast, Blackberry push email works is a different way... the server pushes notifications to the app. Chrome to Phone works in this way and I guess it would be quite viable to have other Google apps do the same...

That is[/is] how Google apps do it. My phone tends to notify me of email before Thunderbird picks it up, and they're both push.

craigacgomez said:
FYI, they aren't talking about turning off data, rather have gmail push without having to keep sync on. With sync on, the apps regularly poke at the servers to get info about new emails, etc. In contrast, Blackberry push email works is a different way... the server pushes notifications to the app. Chrome to Phone works in this way and I guess it would be quite viable to have other Google apps do the same...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Spoken by someone who never tried to confirm what he writes, and the same goes for the OP. The easiest way to understand that you're wrong is - position your phone in place with 3G / WiFi reception, and send yourself a mail on the PC. How much time it takes until you receive it on the phone? My measurements were from 5 sec to 1.5 min, and mostly stayed within half a minute from sending time. So, if your theory was correct, it would mean that the Gmail "pokes at the servers" more than once a minute.. Which is obviously wrong, and if you monitor traffic (in the easiest way possible - just look at your "H" symbol, if you have a custom ROM), you'll see that it doesn't happen.
"Sync" is a general term. Sync can be done in multiple ways. One of them is push sync. It just so happens that Gmail is push sync. And the "Sync" switch is just to enable/disable the sync for Google apps, it doesn't say anything about it being push/pull/whatever.