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Some people might experience with certain GPS software.
If you look at the log of the NMEA log, you might realize that it burst out every 6-10 seconds. After that you might wait for another 6-10 sec, which is unusable for real-time navigation. If you happen to meet this trouble.
I have a way which could allow normal update intervals.
Install GPSGATE, it create virtual GPS COM PORT and re-route the NMEA data.
Install GPSGATE, just use the default settings, it create the virtual GPS port as COM 1.
Just use GPS software on COM 1 .
software url: http://franson.com/gpsgate/
Can anyone confirm this works? Ive noticed my GPS works the same way. Im using the Kaiser / TyTn II with Mapking and i notice that i also get my signbal ins bursts and NOT a smooth stream. Anyone know if this will resolve the problem?
What is the update intervals with GPSGATE ?
Do you mean GPSGATE must be run concurrently with the other software TomTom 6 for example ?
It would be a good workaround for people who encounter this GPS issue.
could this be some delicious spam?
How exactly does the OP propose that a user space application can make the hardware produce data in a smoother stream?
I call BS.
seems like BS to me too...Probably some spam Can anyone who has tried it out verify if it really works or not?..
THKS
You don't need to use other GPS software concurrently,
just use the GPSGATE and mapking will do.
Remember you have to modify the settings in mapking to use the virtual com port ( com1 default)
Not SPAM
I am not sure, this is BS.
If I am not mistaken the GPSGATE will act like a "router" (middle man) between the GPS hardware (Internal GPS of Kaiser) and the application (TomTom).
If the GPS hardware is faulty (having problem) with bursting data every 10 seconds, then the GPSGATE will also receive bursting data every 10 seconds.
So, that's useless as long as the problem is in the GPS hardware.
Gpsproxy should be able to do the same thing and its free.
GPSGate is a splitter, allowing using more than one application with the same NMEA stream. It creates another virtual GPS COM port, that's it.
GPS on the Kaiser works great and I'm on SatNav business. Aquisition time is fast, reception is great and update ratio is every 1 sec, just like any other civilian GPS receiver. GPS is NOT evaluated by the refresh rate you see on the screen, other software will give you other rate, try OZI Explorer for instance. I used Kaiser with TomTom, Destinator & Ozi, all works really great even comparing to Sirf III GPS chipset embedded devices such as Eten X500, HTC Artemis and Asus 535.
Last, Microsoft has included the same functionality of GPS Gate in WM5 and WM6 under settings. You do not need to install any additional SW, you can send "trueman 12345" (the guy who opened this thread with 2 posts history) your money directly.
Thanks RonenB for this very usefull precision !
Thanks as well RonenB, However, it does not solve the odd occasional pause in the data that we're seeing. Is this hardware or software that needs help in the Kaiser?
Actually I'm not so sure we have defined the problem accurately here.
Examining the signal from the GPS shows some interesting info.
1
A satellite is locked onto for perhaps only one or two seconds at a time.
2
Several satellites can achieve a lock but out of these a few will be lost every few seconds
3
New satellites are also acquired every few seconds.
The Result
If you are in the presence of many satellites then there is a constant dropping of some and locking onto others. This leads to no problems as there are always a few satellites locked on and data flow is smooth.
BUT
If you are in the presence of only say 2 or 3 satellites it is possible to drop these two or three (as indicated above), but no new ones are acquired. In this situation there will be a few seconds before the first 2 or 3 lock in again. Result a gap in data flow to your GPS software.
Meaning
The Internal GPS is not polling data in bursts. In other words you cannot turn up the frequency of data polling (possible baud rate adjustment maybe). The data is continuous but if there are too few satellites then there can be gaps where it drops some satellites and does not lock others.
There are various applications that can show this behaviour graphically but tomtom shows it well on the satellite view screen.
Compared to external GPS satellite locks this works in a strangely different way. You will see the bars jumping around from a lock on this one to that one continuously. Only a problem as I say when there are only a few satellites in sight.
Mike
PS - I cannot see the advantage of GPSGate in this particular situation as it is due to momentary periods when no satellite is detected.
Having said all of the above, I find the GPS perfectly adequate for general use. Perhaps if I need spot on plotting data then it might be weak. However if I need that unusual level of accuracy I would not use my phone to do it. I regularly use mine in place of my car's tomtom and the results are on a par with the full tomtom device.
mikechannon said:
Actually I'm not so sure we have defined the problem accurately here.
Examining the signal from the GPS shows some interesting info.
1
A satellite is locked onto for perhaps only one or two seconds at a time.
2
Several satellites can achieve a lock but out of these a few will be lost every few seconds
3
New satellites are also acquired every few seconds.
The Result
If you are in the presence of many satellites then there is a constant dropping of some and locking onto others. This leads to no problems as there are always a few satellites locked on and data flow is smooth.
BUT
If you are in the presence of only say 2 or 3 satellites it is possible to drop these two or three (as indicated above), but no new ones are acquired. In this situation there will be a few seconds before the first 2 or 3 lock in again. Result a gap in data flow to your GPS software.
Meaning
The Internal GPS is not polling data in bursts. In other words you cannot turn up the frequency of data polling (possible baud rate adjustment maybe). The data is continuous but if there are too few satellites then there can be gaps where it drops some satellites and does not lock others.
There are various applications that can show this behaviour graphically but tomtom shows it well on the satellite view screen.
Compared to external GPS satellite locks this works in a strangely different way. You will see the bars jumping around from a lock on this one to that one continuously. Only a problem as I say when there are only a few satellites in sight.
Mike
PS - I cannot see the advantage of GPSGate in this particular situation as it is due to momentary periods when no satellite is detected.
Having said all of the above, I find the GPS perfectly adequate for general use. Perhaps if I need spot on plotting data then it might be weak. However if I need that unusual level of accuracy I would not use my phone to do it. I regularly use mine in place of my car's tomtom and the results are on a par with the full tomtom device.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ok, I believe that it is time to explain a little bit how GPS works.
The GPS satellites are transmitting their position rapidly. However, due to homeland security issues (US did not want to allow anyone to place a receiver in a jet fighter or a missile) civilian GPS receivers are limited to aquire position every 1 second only. This is not a problem for a normal user even for civilian aviation. Thus, when you look at the NMEA stream, you will see it coming in bursts and not as rapid as normal data. Since GPS strings are quite short, it is good enough for any navigation system.
Number of satellites aquired is not an indicator to anything. Like any RF system, the engineers can tweak the noise level so that it will look to you that you are receiving X amount of satellites, the signal is on the air anyway.
What is important though is the position of the satellites. the closer to the horizon, the less useable that satellite is to calulate the position. Therefore receivers are taking the best located satellites into account and ignoring others even of they are recieved. Valid fix (position) is aquired by at least 3 satellites for 2D (X,Y) and 4 or more for 3D (with elevation).
Result is that as a user, you should not bother too much looking into the stream or number of sattelite in use as long as you can get a valid fix. The important and effective elements are hidden from the user: number of transsistors in the GPS chipset, quality of antenna etc. User can just evaluate the overall preformance.
As I wrote above, the Kaiser integrated GPS surprised me for superb preformance. I just arrived this week from Israel to Germany and could get a fix as soon as I left the underground garage. I did not loose GPS signal even once since I started using the device. That includes forests and dence city centers. Real good job by HTC here.
This is the problem i am facing:
Im using MapKing with Hong Kong 2007 maps. Getting a fix is no problem. I can normally get a fix in about 10-15 secs. When i check the status page I will normally have a connection to 5-7 satelites.
The problem is that the icon does not move smoothly when i travel. In map king your position on the map is represented by a small car icon. It jumps from location to location every 3-5 secs but does not smoothly move along. Can someone please tell me if this is the case with tomtom as well? Maybe it a problem with mapking?
phame said:
This is the problem i am facing:
Im using MapKing with Hong Kong 2007 maps. Getting a fix is no problem. I can normally get a fix in about 10-15 secs. When i check the status page I will normally have a connection to 5-7 satelites.
The problem is that the icon does not move smoothly when i travel. In map king your position on the map is represented by a small car icon. It jumps from location to location every 3-5 secs but does not smoothly move along. Can someone please tell me if this is the case with tomtom as well? Maybe it a problem with mapking?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is a Mapking problem and you should contact their support. Does not happen to me with Destinator, TomTOm and Ozi.
Ok, there is no point to argue, if you really find yourself having problem with GPS update lag, then give it a try. No harm indeed...
In HK, there are people the validity of the work around. GPS proxy might also work as well( i think it is the same principal) just i wasn't aware of this good free software before hand..
http://www11.discuss.com.hk/viewthread.php?tid=5329804&extra=page=2
(u need an account and some chinese word knowledge)
trueman12345 said:
Ok, there is no point to argue, if you really find yourself having problem with GPS update lag, then give it a try. No harm indeed...
In HK, there are people the validity of the work around. GPS proxy might also work as well( i think it is the same principal) just i wasn't aware of this good free software before hand..
http://www11.discuss.com.hk/viewthread.php?tid=5329804&extra=page=2
(u need an account and some chinese word knowledge)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Quite agree it's worth trying, and the application has other uses too.
Mike
FYI: I got GPS to work easily by installing GPSViewer, opening COM4/4800baud and getting located. After that, using Google Maps was a breeze; total "trick" took me about 1 minute to figure out which is way quicker than some other workarounds on the internet.
I was driving with iGuidance for about 1 hour this morning and I'm seeing different behavoir for this bug. iGuidance also has an excellent GPS signal viewer, mine was showing 8 out of 8 sattellites, all green, all the time (they turn red when not receiving signal from a sat). My map was moving about once per second or slightly faster. The program only paused once after about 30 minutes into the trip, for about 20-30 seconds. The iGuidance program's moving arrow's color also changes color based on signal quality of the combined sattelite lock, Green for good 3D mapping, Yellow for 2D when there are minimal sats for navigating, and Red for no signal data. During this pause the arrow went Red to indicate no data.
This seems like a bug to me.
I see a lot of people with GPS problems these days & most of them have to do with not getting a fast enough satelite fix. There are several things you can & should do to enhance you Kaiser & it's GPS capabilities.
Firstly, use HTC's QuickGPS. Your device has to locate, communicate with & track numerous navigation satelites to get a fix that can be used by your navigation software of choice. Typically your device will need this information from 3 - 5 satelites, however there can be as many as 14. Each Satelite has Almanac information, this information contains suck as the current location, speed & Orbitital Patterns. This is where QuickGPS comes in. QuickGPS downloads this almanc information from servers & helps to guide your device the most appropriate satelites in your area. downloading the QuickGPS data at least once a week is key to maintaining quick satelite locks with your device.
Second, I see a lot of people using the HCT GPS Tool from the Polaris. WHY? Sure it can help to jump start your GPS, but there are other more functional programs out there that accomplish the same thing & much more.
Enter GPSGate! GPSGate is a light weight GPS utility that can be installed on a storage card & I could not live without. It is easy to use, it configures itself, it WILL jumpstart your GPS & allows you to do some amazing things otherwise impossible. GPSGate is a semi-commercial software developed by Franson. A trial version is free to download & the only difference between the free & the pay version is that the pay version allows you to Connect to GpsGate Server or GpsGate.com for sharing or logging over the Internet. GPSGate will help speed things up for you & also do many other things. Whenever you launch GPSGate, you GPS chip is immediately initialized & goes to work. Starting GPSGate before your navigation software or selecting the auto-start function gets your device working on connecting to the satelites NOW!
Ever tried running TomTom & Live Search at the same time? Usually it won't work & sometimes will freeze your device. Not when you use GPSGate. GPSGate will not only start your GPS faster, but it will also let you share the Kaiser GPS among several applications all at once.
GPSGate will let you use external GPS devices with your Kaiser & it will also allow you to use your Kaiser as a GPS receiver for other devices such as laptops, over A/S or Bluetooth connections. In fact, you can share the Kaiser's GPS over a network, ActiveSync, Bluetooth or HTTP. It will also allow you to Multiplex and split NMEA streams. GPSGate will communicate fast & flawlessly with a simultaneous multitude of programs. It will also allow you to start & stop your GPS Session on the fly.
I use TomTom, but I frequently use Live Search at the same time because POI's are always changing & new ones are added. Live Search is much better @ finding New things like restraunts & allows me to add them into my contacts & then select them thru TomTom all without having to start & stop each program allowing me to keep my focus on the road where it belongs.
Just download & install the cab, launch the program, follow the 2-steps on the screen & you're done.
Most of the important functionality is intact without licensing, (I think everything except the server based tracking & logging)
Overview:
Share your position online using GpsGate.com
Track your friends on a map, see a remote person in Google Earth and more...
Connecting Google Earth to GpsGate!
Display your GPS position in Google Earth.
Connecting Google Maps to GpsGate!
Display your GPS position in Google Maps.
Sharing GPS data over a network and between computers
How to share GPS data using TCP/IP, UDP, Bluetooth or COM ports.
NMEA Multiplexer - combine multiple inputs
How to merge and split several NMEA channels.
Run GpsGate as a Service
How to set up GpsGate to run as a NT service.
How to run multiple instances of GpsGate, close input when no output is used, block writing and reading, and more...
NO, I do NOT work for or endorse Franson! I just really find this program helpful & very useful.
GPSGate: http://rapidshare.com/files/95732296/GPSGate.rar
QuickGPS: http://rapidshare.com/files/69959229/HTC_QuickGPS.CAB
spent this whole time talking about GPSGATE but dont even post a way to find more info or even get it......
ChInEsE ChIcKeN said:
spent this whole time talking about GPSGATE but dont even post a way to find more info or even get it......
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
LOL are you serious....thanks I needed this
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=GPSgate&btnG=Google+Search
Not that hard to find.
Google is your friend
I don't understand why this is useful. The GPS is already sharable in the Kaiser. I've run multiple GPS apps at the same time with no problems. The only use for GPS gate that I can see is uploading your position to their server.
tdusen said:
I don't understand why this is useful. The GPS is already sharable in the Kaiser. I've run multiple GPS apps at the same time with no problems. The only use for GPS gate that I can see is uploading your position to their server.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you use iGuidance 4 and are using a 6.1 rom, GPSGate is not only useful, it is required in order for your map to update. Others have reported that GPSPROXY will also work, and it is free.
Thank you, thank you, thank you!
I have been playing with 6.1 ROMS for two weeks and was about to give up because I could not get GPS to work properly (yes I tried everything that was recommended!) I was about to give up and revert back to a 6 ROM... and like a pheonix from the ashes I saw your post. Franson GpsGate did the trick. My GPS is working better than ever, heck my phone is working better than ever, many thanks to Sleuth and to you for fixing that last very frustrating and important glitch.
crispyj said:
If you use iGuidance 4 and are using a 6.1 rom, GPSGate is not only useful, it is required in order for your map to update. Others have reported that GPSPROXY will also work, and it is free.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Then I'm just lucky I guess. I'm running 6.1 and I have Beeline GPS, TomTom and Live Search all running just fine. No GPS Gate or GPSProxy loaded.
tdusen said:
Then I'm just lucky I guess. I'm running 6.1 and I have Beeline GPS, TomTom and Live Search all running just fine. No GPS Gate or GPSProxy loaded.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes you are lucky. Many Tilt users are, but for the unfortunate, for what ever reason, we have GPS issues and this solved it at least for me. But I am curious... if you GPS is operating so wonderfully... why are you in this thread?
the same reason I am in here probably, to see what everyone is talking about and to see what kinds of GPS issues are out there that people are having. I know mine is working just fine but still checking out what is going on in case I run in to issues or see someone with issues that I might be able to help out or point them to this thread.
I read every GPS thread. I'm always on the look out for some way to disable Static Navigation. So far, no luck.
My original post in this thread was to ask what does this software give me that I don't already have. The stock GPS is intended to be sharable. If it does work like it's supposed then no proxy software should be necessary.
GPS quality varies widely from one Tilt to the next...
I have 2 Tilts and I can tell you one of them gets almost instant GPS lock while the other one struggles to ever get a lock.
I'm awaiting a second warranty replacement from at&t as the first one they sent has crappy GPS also. I've already warned them that they will continue shipping me Tilts under warranty until I get a replacement that works as well as my 2nd Tilt does.
One thing I like about GPS Gate is the Tray Icon. It would be better if the tap & hold menu had an option to toggle the GPS on/off.
It is nice that you can also use it to provide GPS feed to your laptop if you have such a need.
tdusen said:
I read every GPS thread. I'm always on the look out for some way to disable Static Navigation. So far, no luck.
My original post in this thread was to ask what does this software give me that I don't already have. The stock GPS is intended to be sharable. If it does work like it's supposed then no proxy software should be necessary.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
More than anything I was bored & wanted to write (Got my replacement & had time to kill while Sec. Unlocking, Flashing, etc.), lol.
Really I'd see a lot of Noobies complaining about not being able to use multiple proggies & having issues giving gps a quick jump. This post was really just kinda intended for the noobie that doesn't have the skill or patience to set up multiple port connections for the GPS. With GPSGate they don't have to. It all wil run thru the same V-port without them having to do any changes manually. I find that using GPSGate there is NO DELAY in the new application receiving the GPS data. Before GPSGate, every time I switched programs my device would hang for a bit. I also noticed a lot of people using or including HTC GPS Tools in roms for a jump start of the GPS device, & I figured why not something more useful.
+ I know that while a lot of us know about these programs, not many new guys do & when I'm out & about, occasionally I like to use my laptop W/ Streets & trips because all my customer routes are in there. This way I can use it for navigation & construction updates on long drive days. Of course I know not everyone has a nerd mobile like my truck with a PPC & Laptop Mount cradle, lol...but you never know.
Do these proxies keep the GPS receiver running all the time? what does that do to battery life?
It does what you TELL IT to do. You can start or stop the GPS on the fly. OF COURSE if you leave the GPS running it will drain the battery faster. But it only keeps it on for as long as you keep it active. Using the proxy itself will not change the discharge rate of your battery to any noticable degree.
Search for Franson GPSGate. You can read your heart out about it.
What should you put the baud rate to?
I mean I would assume higher means better but since my kaiser takes 10 minutes to get a lock I haven't really bothered doing any proper comparisons.
In any case all I get for the ten-fifteen minutes I've had this running is "GPS data but no position, running ok"
(Pretty much like GPS Tool, it runs and shows a lot of sattelites but never gets a lock. It does once in a while but it seldom and it'll always take ~10 minutes)
I have run quick gps.
This is with a cooked rom and a new radio though.
With my stock rom/radio I got a lock within 2-3 minutes after starting tomtom.
GSLEON3 said:
Really I'd see a lot of Noobies complaining about not being able to use multiple proggies & having issues giving gps a quick jump. This post was really just kinda intended for the noobie that doesn't have the skill or patience to set up multiple port connections for the GPS. With GPSGate they don't have to. It all wil run thru the same V-port without them having to do any changes manually. I find that using GPSGate there is NO DELAY in the new application receiving the GPS data. Before GPSGate, every time I switched programs my device would hang for a bit. I also noticed a lot of people using or including HTC GPS Tools in roms for a jump start of the GPS device, & I figured why not something more useful.
.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
GSLEON3,
Although my GPS works within much problems or 3rd party software so far, I do appreciate your post on this as it clearly is helpful at his point of the ROM development.
I too am having troubles with my GPS. I have only had my tilt for a week or so but I can't seem to get the GPS to work well enough to be truly useful.
I have GPS Gate installed and it sometimes gets a lock and sometimes it doesn't. I have tried both TomTom 6 and iNav v3 and v4 with and without GPS Gate. I can generally get a lock sitting still and sometimes I can get a lock moving but anytime I try to use the navigation to go anywhere it either looses its lock within 10 minutes OR it only is able to track 1-3 satellites and thus HORRIBLY inaccurate showing me tracking between 50 and 500 yards from my actual location (if there are side roads or streets it almost never has me on the correct road). I have tried changing the position of the device to get better reception with no change.
I have also tried several different ROMS with different radios with no change. Are there some settings in GPS gate that I need to change to get better performance or do I have a defective unit? Any help would be appreciated.
GSLEON3 said:
More than anything I was bored & wanted to write (Got my replacement & had time to kill while Sec. Unlocking, Flashing, etc.), lol.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm glad you were bored to write this. I, for one, thinks its a good source of info and a possible set of solutions for GPS issues. I dont think you can have too much possible solutions, so thanks for posting this up!
thanks much for taking time to post valuable information. i for one am no noob to windows mobile, but am too GPS. so, i definitely am willing to check into anything that could possibly boost performance of any component. thanks again and it does help alot with the new tool. one question i have is about the virtual port driver. the message comes up and ask me to soft reset for the virtual port driver to be installed, so i do. when i run the tool again it does the same thing, to me, indicating the driver didnt install. i go into advanced options and check the status and it says my driver memory is low, please soft reset. any ideas and thanks again.
GPS working Better at higher baud
I have been experimenting with changing the settings for my GPS in GPSGate. I posted earlier that I was having trouble getting it to work reliably and that I would frequently loose lock and not be able to get it back.
Here is what I have found works best so far:
Radio: 1.64.08.21
COM: 4
BAUD: 57600
Emulating: COM 1
TomTom: COM 1 at 57600
I really don't know why this works better but I have been able to consistently HOLD a lock once I get one. I still have trouble with it sometimes taking a VERY long time acquire a lock but once I have one it is working well. I will post if I find anything that works better.
If anyone has insight on this or finds any better settings please post.
I have just updated my ROM to "Dutty's WM6.1 Hybrid v2 5.2.19716/5.2.19700" and at the same time installed TomTom.
It can take quite a while to pick up a lock the first time the software is booted but if I close and open TomTom without rebooting the phone the second time is much quicker (almost instant). I have just tried rebooting the phone and it goes through the same slow process the first time tomtom is booted and then quick following that. Is this normal behaviour for GPS on the device (not holding GPS info when the phone is rebooted) or is it an issue with the ROM or Radio. If its the radio is their anyone in the UK who can recommend the best radio for battery life and GPS.
Cheers,
Michael
cyberkid2002 said:
I have just updated my ROM to "Dutty's WM6.1 Hybrid v2 5.2.19716/5.2.19700" and at the same time installed TomTom.
It can take quite a while to pick up a lock the first time the software is booted but if I close and open TomTom without rebooting the phone the second time is much quicker (almost instant). I have just tried rebooting the phone and it goes through the same slow process the first time tomtom is booted and then quick following that. Is this normal behaviour for GPS on the device (not holding GPS info when the phone is rebooted) or is it an issue with the ROM or Radio. If its the radio is their anyone in the UK who can recommend the best radio for battery life and GPS.
Cheers,
Michael
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is pretty normal for GPS especially on these devices. It takes a while to get the first fix after a reset, but subsequent ones are quicker.
You may be able to speed up this process by using the QuickGPS tool to download cache data of satellite locations.
Also, try and use GPSTest to get the lock first. Many people use the GPSTest application and keep it running in the background as it tends to keep a good lock on things.
Adjust the baud rate with GPStest.
cheers for the responses... i will try the GPSTest thing...
KDKobes: what change does adjusting the baud rate make? quicker to lock?
I'm running the new, stock 6.1 Rom, and the only criticisim I have of it is the really slow initial GPS lock. The first time I use it after a soft reset or reboot, it can take anything in the region of 10-15 minutes, which I really don't think is right - I'm positive the original Rom was better at this. Subsequent fixes are much quicker, but if you find yourself needing the GPS and you happen to have recently rebooted, chance are you'll be well past your destination by the time it picks up, which is not good.
Quick GPS appears to be behaving as it always has - whenever I check it has recent data showing, downloaded through Activesync as normal - but it's almost as if that data's not being used in this Rom.
I should mention I'm seeing this behaviour in both Tom Tom and Live Search... it always does get a lock eventually, so there doesn't appear to be a problem with the GPS itself. Has anyone got any insight into this?
cyberkid2002 said:
cheers for the responses... i will try the GPSTest thing...
KDKobes: what change does adjusting the baud rate make? quicker to lock?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The baud rate is used by the internal COM port to interface with the GPS controller. It is the same deal like the speed of a modem...2400....4800...9600, etc.
Honestly with the amount of data that a GPS passes (which is not that much) I don't know if it makes a difference if it is set low. However, I always set mine high because faster is better, right so, might as well.
bengalih said:
The baud rate is used by the internal COM port to interface with the GPS controller. It is the same deal like the speed of a modem...2400....4800...9600, etc.
Honestly with the amount of data that a GPS passes (which is not that much) I don't know if it makes a difference if it is set low. However, I always set mine high because faster is better, right so, might as well.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Where would you even set that though? I played with GPS Tool for a while, but it appeared to forget whatever port setting I used next time it ran anyway, so presumably it only affects that session of GPS Tool, not the system as a whole. In TomTom there's no speed setting for the internal GPS either; it should all be handled by WM itself.
Boinng said:
Where would you even set that though? I played with GPS Tool for a while, but it appeared to forget whatever port setting I used next time it ran anyway, so presumably it only affects that session of GPS Tool, not the system as a whole. In TomTom there's no speed setting for the internal GPS either; it should all be handled by WM itself.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, I think that's right... you can set it inside GPSTest.
However, like I stated many people find that GPSTest gets the quickest lock and prefer to either open it first and/or leave it running in the background. I haven't used my GPS that much, but I do find that this works.
It at least allows me to see what is going on with the lock. If I start Google Maps it will either work or not with GPS, but not really show me what's going on. GPSTest will allow me to see if I have a lock or not and then open up my other apps for use.
I just realised, I'm talking about the HTC GPS Tool, while you're talking about GPS Test - which is that, the Chartcross one?
You should try IGO8
cyberkid2002 said:
I have just updated my ROM to "Dutty's WM6.1 Hybrid v2 5.2.19716/5.2.19700" and at the same time installed TomTom.
It can take quite a while to pick up a lock the first time the software is booted but if I close and open TomTom without rebooting the phone the second time is much quicker (almost instant). I have just tried rebooting the phone and it goes through the same slow process the first time tomtom is booted and then quick following that. Is this normal behaviour for GPS on the device (not holding GPS info when the phone is rebooted) or is it an issue with the ROM or Radio. If its the radio is their anyone in the UK who can recommend the best radio for battery life and GPS.
Cheers,
Michael
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hello!
I have experienced exactly the same problem as you have with TomTom.
I have both a "Tytn II" and a HTC Advantage (X7500).
When using TomTom on the X7500 the GPS takes time to fix a position, 15-20 min or more is not unusual after a soft reset.
Then when it has fixed the position it is EXTREMLY slow when it comes to calculating the route!
I live in Sweden and I often drive to Germany, and when calculating the route from Sweden to Germany it takes over 3 min to finish!
Then we have the issue with the struggling graphics, (Of course I have been told that TomTom has trouble with VGA displays, and I find that to be very true.) the map is very slow and sometimes it stops completly for a few secounds!
On my Tytn II however the map is not struggling the same way, and it calculates much faster then on the X7500, Why? I dont know!
X7500 is a much faster device so it beats me!
The GPS lock is however almost as slow on the Tytn II as it is on the X7500, no matter if I have used quick GPS to download data or not!
A few weeks ago I stumbled upon a navigation program called IGO8, I decided to try it, and believe me when I say that I will never go back to TomTom again!
First of all the GPS lock is almost instant with IGO8, from a soft reset it finds a lock within maybe 2 min at most! And then it seems that it somehow remembers the position and the next time you start the program it will have a fix in secounds!
Then it calculates much faster, I tryed to calculate the route from Sweden to Germany on my X7500 and it was finishes under 20 secounds! (Compare that to over 3 minutes with TomTom on the same device!)
It supports VGA screens, so the map floats much better on my X7500.
Next thing is that there is more maps for IGO 8 so it covers much more of "mother earth" if you want to navigate in a foreign country!
It also has 3D terrain, and can even show buildings in 3D! (Only works in some places!)
It has a very simple and logical interface that is much easyer to understand then TomTom, and it is skinnable and very customizable!
So if you are serious about having a great navi I would strongly recommend you to try IGO 8! I can promise you will not be dissapointed!
Oh and buy the way, I dont work for IGO either!
More GPS Woes
KDKobes said:
Adjust the baud rate with GPStest.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have problems getting software on my O2 Stellar to recognise the internal gps. I've tried a couple of different programs (TomTom & GPSTuner) and also fiddled around with the com ports in both the software and on the Stellar (using the External gps app in settings) but still no recognition of the internal gps.
I caleed O2 and no one could help, in fact they didn't even know it had internal gps!
I've seen GPSTest mentioned a few times. It's not on my Stellar - where can I get it?
Am I missing something?
Help please!
Thanks
Dave
davespearce said:
I have problems getting software on my O2 Stellar to recognise the internal gps. I've tried a couple of different programs (TomTom & GPSTuner) and also fiddled around with the com ports in both the software and on the Stellar (using the External gps app in settings) but still no recognition of the internal gps.
I caleed O2 and no one could help, in fact they didn't even know it had internal gps!
I've seen GPSTest mentioned a few times. It's not on my Stellar - where can I get it?
Am I missing something?
Help please!
Thanks
Dave
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Get GPSTest here
You can either manually set it to a COM port or have it autoscan. I believe some ROMs identify it as COM3 and others COM4, so probably best to do an autoscan. It might take a few minutes to find it, and then another few to get a lock. But after that it generally starts up and locks within a minute or two (in my experience).
Now please no groaning when you see this topic. I know the GPS has been hammered to death on these forums; this post is my vein attempt to see if one particular area of interest of mine has at all moved forward.
(let's also side-step the whole "does your GPS lag?" issue here too!)
(..and, for clarify, I'm referring to AGPS as in the use of the mobile phone network to 'assist' positioning by use of triangulation in areas of poor/no GPS reception, and NOT the use of QuickGPS to download current sat. info in an attempt to get a quicker initial fix)
I used to use TomTom Navigator v7.450; it worked (of a fashion! ) although one specific thing that never worked was that whenever AGPS was enabled (using AdvancedConfig or similar) TomTom would get a signal and then immediately drop it again.. on/off on/off etc.. the fix being to disable AGPS.
I must admit I'm suspicious about HTC having their stock ROMs with AGPS disabled by default - especially as this was initially a 'selling point' of the device and part of the sales blurb ("not only does it have GPS but really good GPS using AGPS".. oh the irony!) - have they themselves ever got it to work?!?!
Now TomTom Navigator v7.910 is out (have just installed it myself, currently waiting for an updated map to download). I have seen it muted that this now works with AGPS on the Diamond or maybe the Pro (ie. someone reports the above bug, yet claims it now works having moved to v7.910). Can anyone else confirm this? More importantly, can anyone confirm AGPS has given the Diamond any GPS-related benefit what-so-ever?? (ie. great if it doesn't stop TomTom working anymore, but does it actually improve it like it should?).
I'll of course try it out myself later today or over the weekend and report back.
Hope this makes sense.. cheers.
just tried TomTom 7.910 (9185) with AGPS enabled, and cant say i noticed much difference.
seems the same now with it enable or dissabled. Cant be sure tho, havent done a long journey yet.
Will update later/tomorrow.
mugglesquop said:
just tried TomTom 7.910 (9185) with AGPS enabled, and cant say i noticed much difference.
seems the same now with it enable or disabled. Cant be sure tho, haven't done a long journey yet.
Will update later/tomorrow.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for taking the time etc.
Interesting, because..
I've just taken a wonder outside and found I'm still getting the signal constantly being lost bug (looking at the screen that shows the sat. bars I have a good signal for a few seconds, then this goes and 'No GPS device' is displayed, then good signal back again and so on).
On this Diamond I'm using ROM 1.93.401.2 the the supplied radio (1.0.25.05), as I suspected this 'improvement' (potentially) noticed by you/others is more likely a result of a ROM/radio update and not a TomTom software update (guessing this AGPS bug isn't the first thing you try after flashing is it?).
Hmm..
nb. I'm using the exact same version/build of TomTom as you
hmmm... yeh, i'm going on a 60+ mile journey later, so will have a play.
Using Dutty's 3.4 ROM and Radio is BS14...
I thought that the whole point of AGPS is so you could help you get a GPS fix when indoors. Which I always thought was an unusual selling point when the entire purpose of GPS software is to help you find your way in the outdoors. Perhaps it could be more useful for those new tagging services that are popping up.
Anyhow I've been running a fairly recent version of iGo8 using Dutty's Rom 3.3 and 3.4 (both with that new radio).
With AGPS turned off, GPS signal is quickly attained and holds strong outdoors. Nothing indoors, naturally.
With AGPS turned on (via Duttys "AGPS Settings" utility), GPS signal is as quickly attained and flickers fully on then fully off, repeating constantly. When indoors, nothing at all.
So, with iGo8, AGPS seems to be a non-runner.
By the way, I once read that AGPS has to be configured to your particular mobile provider. Perhaps that's the issue?
Same here, with a-gps enabled signal drops constantly
after my journey yesterday, had the same problems as above.
tried with TomTom 7 and iGo8
I've never had any problems with GPS apart from slow getting a moving fix when the unit is physically very hot.
The main benefit of AGPS for me is that you can get your location on Google Maps within 1500m or so without enabling GPS.
It also proves A-GPS works.
ben cole said:
I've never had any problems with GPS apart from slow getting a moving fix when the unit is physically very hot.
The main benefit of AGPS for me is that you can get your location on Google Maps within 1500m or so without enabling GPS.
It also proves A-GPS works.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hmm, I think this is thanks to googles effort, not AGPS... Google uses Google Gears API which can position you by using basestations and SSIDs.
AGPS is correcting/updating the GPS data with actual almanac data sent from you mobile provider...
Pitchb3nd said:
Same here, with a-gps enabled signal drops constantly
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Same for me, anyone being able to use TomTom and AGPS without losing signal periodically?
ben cole said:
I've never had any problems with GPS apart from slow getting a moving fix when the unit is physically very hot.
The main benefit of AGPS for me is that you can get your location on Google Maps within 1500m or so without enabling GPS.
It also proves A-GPS works.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah Google Maps does this on its own without having AGPS enabled on the Diamond. I believe AGPS is supposed to be more accurate than 1000m - 1500m though.
Oh and I believe the way that Google Maps gets its position depends on your mobile provider. I used to get the message "your location is not available" constantly on my network but one day (simultaneously as the iPhone was released in my country), the location was available. So I believe that the network flicked a switch for this technology to work.
AGps and TomTom
Hi,
agps have need to run to:
1) Carrier to inform MobilePhone here is (Is a Base Station Issue)
2) Public information about position
On mobilephone if is enable i think is need to have different information, and tomtom have old pattern to process agps information.
With googlemaps have new process and can use.
With my diamond agps run (googlemaps)
Cityhunter71
Please, don't mix the Google technology and A-GPS. They have nothing in common.
Google maintains their own privately held database of GSM-cellids which GMM can query to determine your position based on the current cellid.
A-GPS is a technology where the GSM-basestation itself receives GPS-satellitedata and relays it to the device. With this additional data, the GPS-receiver in the device is supposed to achieve a faster fix.
Have fun!
a-gps works with 7.450
i remember once that it was taking forever for the satelites to be found yet is was updating my postion on the map constantly via a-gps (which im sure was enabled by default in stock rom as ive never changed it)
a-gps is useful inside because you usually have your phone with you and to find a route, you need gps
Apologies for my erroneous post.
I realised my error today when I installed Google Maps on an ageing Blackberry I had unlocked to play with.
Started it up and lo and behold there was my location....thought I'd better head back here to suffer my shame ...LOL
Thanks for the input guys.
So - in summary:
Even with later ROMS / radios / software applications, there is still yet to be seen any benefit from the Diamond (theoretically) having an A-GPS capability.
RUBBISH!!
I personally subscribe to the theory that there is a missing link between the A-GPS driver type software and an info feed from the likes of the network operator, ie. it's all very well it picking up info on the network but without a back-end database to translate this it's useless.
As far as purpose goes.. I personally think A-GPS sounds on paper to be a great idea. Not a replacement for GPS, nor to be used exclusively indoors, but a good aid/starting point. For example, if I'm sitting in an unfamiliar office in London and wanted to use TomTom to navigate me a route to where I want to get to, A-GPS could provide TomTom with a rough starting point. Similarly, I often find myself launch a nav program (when I'm lost!) and standing there for up to 5 mins waiting for a fix.. at least this would give me an approximation from which I could probably work out myself where I was from looking around me. In my mind when you first fire up TomTom on the Diamond A-GPS should simply put you in the right postcode and start doing its stuff while the GPS seeks out its signal, and not still show me as being either at Home or its last known destination. But in any event - it seems not to work!! Bugger!!
I thought that aGPS was also to help hold a GPS signal when in tunnels, canyons, heavy forest cover (ie.Redwoods in this area, many tower to well over 300 feet!) or any situation where the signal from the satellites may be impaired, or even blocked completely.
Im running Duttys 3.5 and with AGPS on I will get a signal for 10 seconds, then it goes for a second, then back for 10. then gone. Turned AGPS off and all is well.
I can confirm that AGPS does work, some parts here in Finland it works and someplaces it does that on off thingy. once when I was just playing with my tomtom it got signal where it would never get it without it. but mostly here it doesnt work properly so i disable it.
But in Helsinki (larger city) it works properly and helps getting signal fast beneath tall buildings.
But yeah it doesnt work in my hometown so its kinda rubbish here.
Maybe it has something to do with how new are nearby cell towers or something. dunno
In Trondheim, Norway it worked with Telenor and gave me a signal indoors, but when I use it together with TomTom the signal gets lost periodicly, really really annoying since "everything" is already there. Probably just something with the co-operation with the regular GPS or something?
I think i got it to run.
I use tt7.910 on diamond with htc 1.93 dutch rom
My mobile provider is mobistar.
I can get a lock inside, tough it's slow(ie not as fast as outside).
When I fire up tt7 the almanac data is showing in the satelite screen.
reg settings are:
Code:
GPRSConnection: Orange World
GpsMode: 4
Network: Orange World
ServerIP: 194.51.71.138
ServerPort: 7275
ServerUrl: agps.orange.fr
I'm a .NET developer and I had a Tilt (Kaiser) before getting a Fuze (Raphael). GPS issues were always ridiculous. Sometimes I'd get it quickly, sometimes it would take 20 minutes. (Very annoying when you need to drive somewhere fast and the GPS doesn't want to work right.)
GPS ID stands for GPS Intermediate Driver
What this is (added in Windows Mobile 5.0) is to use Windows to ask information about the GPS device, not accessing the GPS device itself. Utilizing the COMM port will lock the COMM port for access. This was a problem so Microsoft made the driver for developers to use. Google Maps uses this driver while in TomTom you have to manually select the COMM port.
Having Windows to read the COMM port keeps it open for other applications to use. It's also faster since it's working as a device driver to the GPS hardware. I'm not sure if HTC updates the driver but the driver takes care of calculating speed, altitude, latitude, longitude, etc as well as parsing the NMEA information.
I've seen a lot of different tools all opening the COMM port directly and as a developer, you shouldn't be doing this, not unless you're using PPC2003. I believe (and this could be just wishful thinking) that GPSID is faster at getting a fix than COMM based. I could be wrong, but that's where you guys can help.
So here's a simple GPSID based GPS Tool. Include the Microsoft written DLL (Microsoft.WindowsMobile.Samples.Location.dll) with the executable.
Maybe I can make a simple application to stay keep the GPS open in the background and if you run it again, a message box appears saying "GPS is closed" or something (like S2U2) does.
Suggestions welcome.
(Link soon---bug testing)
Downloads
GPSTool v0.01
--------------
First release
GPSToolPro v.0.02
-----------------
Changed name
Added Satellite info
GPSToolPro v.0.03
-----------------
Changed from VB.NET to C#
Added code to obtain cell tower information from RIL (Radio Information Layer)
Query Google for GPS position of cell tower and report to user
It does run and report correctly. Not sure if it helped with the quick fix though.
It really needs signal strength bars. The direction I'm facing and angle I hold my phone makes a difference, without bars I don't know if I'll be standing there forever or if I just need to wait a bit longer...
I will try this, currently i use GPS Tool. But yes i do need the bars as those are vital informations.
But what are bars?
Bars are simply graphical representation of %.
If you want the percentage, you take the SatelliteCount and divide that by SatellitesInViewCount * 100
SatelliteCount is the number of satellites locked on to.
SatellitesInViewCount is the number of the satellites that the device is seeing.
I'll make it prettier. Hopefully I can find something that can get a power usage rating and see how much mW are being sucked up by GPS
Edit: Oh wait, I see what you mean. You mean signal strength per satellite. There's something in the API about that. I'll work on that.
Edit2: Okay, got it. Per satellite I have Azimuth, Elevation and Signal Strength
Glad you understand about bars & signal strength. This does launch faster than GPSTest and VisualGPSce, so that's nice.
Okay, i put v0.02
I also renamed the application to GPSToolPro.
The satellite info is Azimuth, Elevation, Signal %
I also added Heading and cleaned up the format slightly. Remember, this is really beta. After we get it working decently I'll pretty it up.
I think it's broken, i'm fixing that.
Edit: It's working now.
What's interesting is that i have A-GPS off and I'm getting 3 satellites in view from sitting in my kitchen and there are no windows nearby.
I'm guessing that means AGPS isn't off as we thought it was.
Edit2: I'm getting a GPS lock from inside my kitchen. I'm looking at the elevation values. I'm not sure what measurement it is but I have 46 and 11
Edit3: Okay, I understand Azimuth and Elevation now. It's strange but why am I getting signal inside if I have AGPS off. I'm turning it on and registry and trying it out.
I don't think it's AGPS, I think you're getting GPS signal. I'm pretty sure AGPS is completely disabled in NATF 4.1, requiring a CAB to re-enable it, and I get signal inside buildings... Signal strength GREATLY varies depending on which radio I'm using though.
RE .02 - it doesn't work on my device. Extracted on the PC, copied over via Mobile Device Center, it launches & runs for a couple seconds, then errors out. NullReferenceException
Hmm, I changed the refresh to 3 seconds and it hasn't quit yet. Maybe it doesn't like 1 second? - Update, I did a SR to see how quick it would lock, 1 second did not error, but the data values flicked on/off so fast I couldn't see them until they populated the upper right. Oh and the lock was pretty quick >30 seconds.
What do the three boxes represent? Is Left the current refresh, Upper Right the locked satellites?
On v.01 the elevation was not accurate, reporting 130' but really where I'm at is closer to 500'.
This seems pretty good so far.
I got a fix within seconds inside my living room on 5 sats. I also loaded VisualGPSCe to verify and it showed the same thing. I loaded up iGo and it showed a strong GPS signal and an accurate position.
Of course I also use GPS about 4 hours ago, so I'm not sure if that helped it any or not.
The real test is when you're nowhere near you were on the last lock. Otherwise (from what a senior member wrote), if it sees all the same satellites from the previous time it was on, the lock is pretty quick.
I think this leads to some people reporting constant 20 second locks vs several minute locks. If you never wander more than 20 miles, I'm guessing it still has the proper data stored.
pkley said:
The real test is when you're nowhere near you were on the last lock. Otherwise (from what a senior member wrote), if it sees all the same satellites from the previous time it was on, the lock is pretty quick.
I think this leads to some people reporting constant 20 second locks vs several minute locks. If you never wander more than 20 miles, I'm guessing it still has the proper data stored.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is called the GPS Almanac. The GPS information is stored in the "GPS Almanac" so when you start up the GPS again, it reads what's on the GPS Almanac and gets a fix faster. This is called a hot fix. When the GPS Almanac is out of date or the location is moved then it takes longer to get a fix. This is called a cold fix.
I've managed to use Google's servers as well as the cell phone's towerID to find the approximate longitude and latitude. I'm working on putting this information into the GPS Almanac and then turning on the GPS device. It might avoid ever having to do a cold fix.
It's not a cab, it's a zip. how do I install this, please?
paulyluca said:
It's not a cab, it's a zip. how do I install this, please?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just copy both files somewhere and run the exe.
I just stuck them in the same folder on my SD card and ran it from there.
Great work CLShortFuse,
So I tested it out outside on my deck (30 degrees out, so it warmed up!) and this is the info i got...
Running JUST google maps after a soft reset:
1 minute 22 secs and 9 satellite lock
GPSTest after a soft reset
29sec, 1.2HDOP, 3D, 8 Sat
GPSTool after a soft reset
31 sec, 10 sat and a lot of info that is beyond me
Looks like a good tool and i'm positive with time and work it'll be great!
-SCDavis
CLShortFuse said:
This is called the GPS Almanac. The GPS information is stored in the "GPS Almanac" so when you start up the GPS again, it reads what's on the GPS Almanac and gets a fix faster. This is called a hot fix. When the GPS Almanac is out of date or the location is moved then it takes longer to get a fix. This is called a cold fix.
I've managed to use Google's servers as well as the cell phone's towerID to find the approximate longitude and latitude. I'm working on putting this information into the GPS Almanac and then turning on the GPS device. It might avoid ever having to do a cold fix.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Now that would be the bomb!
Your software did not seem to get a lock quicker once I drove 30 miles away. Course neither did GPSTest...
So I installed GPSToolPro. It seems to be working.
A few questions.
1. How is this app different than GPSTest?
2. How do the two columns differ in the information they offer?
3. What is the practical value of the data for each satellite?
4. What is a reasonable Update interval?
5. When should this app be used?
Thanks.
It's still a work in progress. As of right now, no benefit. I've already managed to get an AGPS signal (something HTC didn't do for the device) but I'm still trying to send those coordinates to the GPS device. If I can do that, the GPS device won't have to cold fix anymore. Basically, if you have an internet connection you'll never have to cold fix anymore. Hot fixes in 30seconds or less. I have an idea of how to do it, but I haven't got around to playing with that.
I'll also try to add as many advanced functions as I can with the device including to completely power off the GPS device and not keep it on standby (shutting off GPS to any other applications in the background).
It's to be a truly complete diagnostic tool.
I know it's ugly right now I can work on the UI after I get the technical stuff working.
drjim said:
1. How is this app different than GPSTest?
2. How do the two columns differ in the information they offer?
3. What is the practical value of the data for each satellite?
4. What is a reasonable Update interval?
5. When should this app be used?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
1) I haven't looked into GPSTest, so I don't know.
2) The top right is satellites in view and the bottom right is satellites locked onto.
3) The values are Azimuth, Elevation, Signal Strength
4) I keep it at 1 second but how often you want to refresh the GPSID information. Any value lower than the GPSID Poll frequency in the registry is pointless
5) Right now, just for seeing what's going on with the GPS. Hopefully in the future it'll have a more practical use (faster GPS fixes)
Thanks, CLSF. It sounds like it will develop into a useful tool.
While I have you, does the FUZE GPS use data from a data plan, i.e., does it get its info through the mobile provider's cellular system?
ps-uninstall
If I wanted to uninstall and wait for final product, how would I do that? I don't see it in my Programs or Remove Programs lists?
Thanks.
drjim said:
Thanks, CLSF. It sounds like it will develop into a useful tool.
While I have you, does the FUZE GPS use data from a data plan, i.e., does it get its info through the mobile provider's cellular system?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you disable AGPS from Start -> Settings -> System -> AGPS Settings, then the Fuze will not start a data connection to assist with navigating.
drjim said:
If I wanted to uninstall and wait for final product, how would I do that? I don't see it in my Programs or Remove Programs lists?
Thanks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It did not install. Just delete the files.