Related
I have been reading through alot of posts here over the last couple weeks.
There seems to be a lot of bickering, pointless debate, insults and flaming going on here. (I know am probably starting more with this post, but that is why I chose the off-topic forum) I know you get it on all internet forums, but this one seems to be worse than most.
I actually had someone pm me on something recently, I believe, because he was too afraid to make a post asking for help. I dont blame him. If someone here asks a question that may or may not have been asked months ago (therefore buried by 10 pages of more current posts) he gets flamed. I also notice he asks another newbie like me, instead of someone with a lot of posts, because they seem to be the most touchy.
And I know, that is why there is a search. But you know, search tools on forums like this are a joke. You are going to get a return of 1000's of posts, 99% of which have nothing to do with what you are looking for. And for me at least, half the time when I search, and I am rewarded with a blank page (in both mozilla and IE).
Just wanted report on what I see here. Maybe others see it differently.
Jimmy - not to validate your argument, but I disagree with you!
Seriously, I respond to so many posts, probably even unnecessarily so sometimes, just because I like the community. The vast majority of us are here because we enjoy the community and are like-minded gadget freaks.
You do get some flaming, some *****ing, some idiots, some spam, some divas. But the vast majority, in my experience, are very nice, helpful and supportive of newbies. We were all one once, and I hope that I'd rather say nothing then something unhelpful.
Anyone can PM or email me any time. I can't respond immediately, but I will try to respond.
The usual "use the search, Luke", response is normally only fired out when you've got a very new member blurting out things like "How do I switch the phone off?". My reasoning there is, teach a man to fish, he'll help himself a lot more then just filling his gullet with answers. But, for valid, non knee jerk questions, most people will try to help.
I think it's better no one answers if they don't know, and if they don't, feel free to bump. But don't bump twice in 5 mins - "COME ON, DOESN'T ANYBODY
KNOW HOW TO SORT MY CONTACTS BY FIRST NAME??!?!?!??!" is not a way to make friends with me.
Anyway, I could rant all day, but I think the board generally speaks for itself. Most are helpful, most are nice, most are here because we want to be here.
You get some bad posts, but seriously, in my year on the board, I've only had two encounters that caused me to contemplate leaving...
V
PS this was an interesting thread:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?p=329718#329718
I know it is not everyone, my subject should not have been why are people so temperamental, it should have been why are SOME people so temperamental.
I agree with you, if it is a repetive question, just dont answer. I just think it is bad when people are pm'ing rather than posting because they are afraid.
vijay555 said:
You get some bad posts, but seriously, in my year on the board, I've only had two encounters that caused me to contemplate leaving...
V
PS this was an interesting thread:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?p=329718#329718
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I gotta' agree with you on that thread, vijay. Those pics (the original ones) NEVER should have been posted. They provoked a LOT of ire from users and flaming, too. There's no room for politics on this forum. It's not here for that purpose and I felt like that was where that thread was heading. Even the world news networks don't show images THAT graphic!! Thanks for deleting them and putting that thread back "on course".
whos temperamental, you [email protected]@rd!
STFU! you think your so [email protected] smart, coming here and reading entries and you probably dont know your @ss froma hole in the ground when it comes to pdas....
whos says people here are temperamental?
dont know your @ss froma hole in the ground
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Gosh, in countries where you actually poo straight into a hole in the ground, this might cause some rather embarrassing situations!
V
maybe i hang out in the wrong forums or my level of what is hostile is wayy different from yours
but this is one of the most friendly forums i come in
or have ever come in (and thats a great deal)
i dont see telling people to use search and the likes to be hostile
personal attacks is hostile
Dont know what the problem is, sure once in a while people get pointed to search, wiki or spend some time reading. And yes once in awhile there are no flowers in that reply.
Sure even I have had the balls to move a post out of news and tell the guy to post in the correct, forum, read wiki and use search. It pisses of our other users who think news is news and not news being somebody asking how do I upgrade my device.
I have seen a lot of threads, a few things I did not like to see, a few I have killed. I have seen nice, not so nice and far form nice askers and also answerres.
In general you get a lot more help here than on other places (yes I have had to look other places).
But hell its a free word, if anybody thinks this site is not good to or for them, well its a click of the mouse to solve that problem.
Mean while will I point a user to the answer of his question which in fact is the same question in 4 different sections. Hum let me think about that one.
Personally I find most people on the forum very friendly. You always get a few who are a bit temperamental but that is life. But on the whole this would have to be the most helpful and friendly forum around.
I will have to agree and disagree with this.. i havent been a member that long and i did take the smart route, i actually read this board over and from top to bottom for months before making a single post, what stopped me from making a post right away was most senior people's complaints about newbs not searching, etc.. so i did just that searched and read... and here i am 3 months later of my first post and have made well over 500 now.. (i have point to all of this somewhere here ) This site can be a little confusing to newbs, but most of the confusion comes from other newbs making the same posts over and over again, you might search for one thing and come up with 50 posts of the same problem, however 49 of them are flames telling them to search to find the answer... and this is where it also gets frustrating for the senior people, people who have already answered this once before causing the temperamental flames.. Now i do try to answer what i can, we were all newbs once and i still consider myself one and i answer many pm's of people who are afraid to be flamed (which if they would have searched they would have found the answer) but im also not their personal wiki... ok, im done, oh yeah, vote for me for president
I agree with jimmy hauser
I came here from treocentral, which was much more supportive on average. Sure, there are some good-spirited and helpful people here, but it is overall much more antagonistic than treocentral.
As a practical matter, the search engine isn't very good and the recent upgrade of the forum didn't make it easier. It took me a few weeks to think of googling with the site:xda-developers.com, identifying the appropriate thread and then searching for that specific threads. Otherwise, one gets too much. Yes, we all find it annoying when someone starts a new thread that has already been answered fifty times, but on the other hand, there are pretty many 20+ page threads. It might be helpful to suggest to someone what they should have searched for, and try the search to see if it works. Just today I was trying to find the registry tweak that would eliminate the roaming indicator, but I couldn't remember what the thing did, so it took forever to find the registry tweak, and this for something I knew I had read on the board at some point in the past.
Here is what I think is actually better than most sites: the wiki. The wikis are uniformly high quality and some people have written fabulous how-tos.
My pet theory is that it is windows at fault. Things like activesync being so hilariously dysfunctional and the X meaning minimize on the PPC cause tempers to rise just a little too easily. Palm users are happier.
On the other hand, without XDA-developers, my MDA would have been approximately useless. The list of problems that were answered, either directly or indirectly, here is huge. Everything from ROM upgrades to TodayAgenda to 2.47 radio rom to wifi settings to wm5newmenu, I got them here. It is a wonderful resource.
I came here from esato, former sony ericsson user ditched it with the p990
if you really want to get flamed say I didn't like the p990 on esato or god forbid the tytn is better than it (I had both got rid of the p990) basically compare anything or say anything is better than a S.E. phone and you'll get your diehard fanboys by the dozens.
anyways some people get flamed here beacuse they are total noobs who don't bother to read anything, I agree they shouldn't get flamed that bad but they should do a little reading, there is a wealth of information in these forums,
as for asking I try to reply to anyone who asks something I know and if anybody needs anything please feel free to pm me I will answer when I can, although posting a forum gives more views as well as future reference for future noobs
I think this site provides so much useful information and it has kept many devices going when they would have gone in the bin. It has allowed a lot of older devices to still have the current operating system. I think half the time people have got home from work and are on a short fuse any way and any little thing pushes them over the edge and that is what causes the bickering. Just my thoughts on the matter.
darky said:
anyways some people get flamed here beacuse they are total noobs who don't bother to read anything, I agree they shouldn't get flamed that bad but they should do a little reading, there is a wealth of information in these forums,
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I'm not sure if I'm the "temperamental" one here, but yes, that is a very annoying thing. They act as if the members here are google, and they just type in a search sentence "Nood here, please give me a clear, step-by-step, easy to flash my ROM", click a button, and you get the answer. Not to mentioned the lack of information they provide, which can be potentially harmful to them consider they don't even know which ROM to get. And when things go wrong, they will post a new thread with the title "Pleeeeaazzz help".
The another annoying thing is the lack of information. Some members will post problems with so little information that they delay the solution to their very own questions, and annoying for the helpers. Eg. "I downloaded the flash software and ROM, but now the phone won't start, please help". Then, you try to be helpful and suggest "Why don't you try program X?". Later, you will get the answer "Oh, I've already tried that, won't work. Any other suggestion?" .. I will be like.. why don't you said so in your first post? ggrrrr..
Anyway, now I've developed an habbit of ignoring such posts. Those (a) Step by step guide for total nood (b) Thread with Pleeazzz help title (c) Post with lack of information. This will make me.. less "temperamental", I guess.
Anyway, as for the Wiki, I still thinks there are not enough information in the Wiki, such that it makes members difficult to point noobs to simple/common tasks. And, it also makes the non-noobs (the oldies ) going around the search function to answer something that they've forgot. So, for those who are happy to help others, please contribute yourself to the Wiki. Personally, I think it is much more influential to get one thing onto the Wiki than answering 10 PMs. And you get to point them to the Wiki if the same problem surfaced.
I'm temperamental beware
Well I remember when I got my MDAIII back over a year ago and came across this site thanks to google. So like a noob that I was and in many areas still our I posted one of those "how do I upgrade my german MDAIII to English.
Well I can tell you what has changed over the last year. Back then I got NO ANSWER, no falming, no use search, no use wiki.
So over time this site has changed and now at least you can get a reply even if this is thought by many as beeing flamed at.
Over time I learnt 2 things, one to read and one to use search. The reading I have kept the Search well that is a Pain in the ass. In the blue angel section (upgrade) do a search for "new rom" and you get Zero, its a bug we are working on it but it still sucks. Now in the same BA Upgrade section do a search for Threads by "MDAIIIUser". Here you get "New Rom" "new rom:" "New rom!" and the like.
Myself I have stoped the use search as I cant use it myself in the form that I want. Sad but true.
So what is the solutiom, for me it was then wiki, sure I had to post on how to edit it but with time I could even work it out. So from there I found out how to upgrade and posted it on wiki, found roms and posted them, found an unlocker, cabs and a bunch of stuff that I thought was cool of intrest and useful. So I posted it in wiki, edited it when new roms came out, ect bla bal.
Well Time moved on and I got bored after the 3 WM5 rom and well nothing else happens in the BA section the device is dead only sold by a few and thus.... I left it.
Now there is lots of grest info here, lots of great people that have found out lots of cool tricks. Its what makes this site, not the how do I upgrade or should I perform a restore after a rom upgrade. However noobs, newbies what ever we might like to discredit them as have a right to be here, I riight to the information and a right to some constructive help.
What we should all do is keep wiki upto date which is a lot easiser for a new member as he is driven by the quest of knowlege than an old member that does nto realy care in which direction his rom goes to as there is nothing new.
So I am not going to search the wiki pages for who finds this sites attitude bad but himslef has failed to update wiki, nor try to work out which users are helpful or flame.
All I am trying to say and now we get to the short version, is be nice, remember that you to were lost on this site and Please update wiki.
Oh yes, you will find a posts from me that just read "moved to XX (BA, Universal, hermes) but you will also see my signature which should point some people in the correct direction. Could I have answered all of there questions, yes sometims, sometimes not. So why don't I? well that due to the fact that some of us try to keep the site clean.
personally i feel the same way as the orginal poster...but i do see where some of yall are coming from with n00bs askin the same ? thats been answered before. i currently run a forum and have that problem sometimes. im no complete n00b just a novice with all this hackin/developin and i noticed i postd some ?s months ago with no responses at all and yes i searched for the answer and vj u had even posted in that thread but i never got a response. i didnt get mad....i pmd someone who helped me out the best he could since he was as new as me. i have found pm to be the best method of recieving help on this board....even tho at times "anal retentive" members dont even respond to say anything....no "f off" no "yea sure do this..." no "try looking here" just no response at all leaving n00bs to think i better not post if i dont know fully what im talking about.....i personally think the community would be better if everyone treated everyone as they would like to have been treated wheb they were n00bs. we all were at one point and time......shezzzzz......dont u guys remember? well all this is imho.
~mike
this does not apply to newbie's only.
i have asked about five times for help in here, responses 2
so i have been forced to read ,sometimes i find the answer some times
not.
pm several user for help. reply; 1
i receive several pms asking for help every week, i try to help ,but some people never give up. suddenly u become their personal google.
i got a guy now asking to write a a full tutorial in how to cook a rom. yea right!!
like an don’t have anything to do.
so I email him and said I was very busy at the moment, I would try to help when I had time.
following day got word from him. have you got time yet? !!!! now I get an email from him everyday. he says hi is in a hurry!!!!
faria
Love your newbie read this!
faria said:
I email him and said I was very busy at the moment, I would try to help when I had time.
following day got word from him. have you got time yet? !!!! now I get an email from him everyday. he says hi is in a hurry!!!!
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rofl
here is a good example of why people get temperamental
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=1038017&posted=1#post1038017
Okay, this post is really intended as a comment and I am not going to pretend I have THE answer but I do have some suggestions to spark discussion.
Based on a lot of the recent comments and back and forth about newbies/tech support I think that the forum is trending the same way I have seen MANY other forums go. What happens is simple; a group of first adopters, who are by default, technically capable, get together on a forum and start to fill in the gaps in tech support, especially when it comes to 'modded' soft or hardwre. They spend a while helping each other out and a comfort level develops. Members know where to go, and when to ask questions.
Then what happens is that the hardware becomes much more popular. All of a sudden your average Joe can walk out a Cingular store with a 8125 for a couple hundred bucks. These folks are NOT early adopters. They are not necessarily tech savvy. They are the people that are most prone to 'keyboard to chair interface errors'. Since the early members did such a good job raising the profile of the forum it starts to come up every time someone does a Google search. and they all end up over their heads.
So then the folks that have been around for a while start to get frustrated. Why should they provide tech support? Why can't these newbies read? Why should they even try to help if they get barraged by stupid questions?
Well I think that takes us to where we are now, so the question is what do we do now? In my experience the only solution that I have seen is to have people equally dedicated to wiki and sticky writing as they are to writing ROMs and programs. The truth is that if you release something you WILL become tech support and a large part of tech support is writing documentation and then explaining it to others.
I have intended this post as something helpful and to spark discussion, not as a criticism of anyone in particular or any particular group. Hopefully it will be taken as such
I agree. I get the feeling that since the relaunch, for one reason or another, there appears to be a lot more"Why don't my apps close when I press X?" and "How dat I swtich this thing 0ff!!!!!!!" type posts.
I think that it's beholden on more experienced users to try to share their experience as they see fit, but it's absolutely essential that newbs and less experienced users use the search button and wiki.
I've been sponsoring a post in the moderators' forum regarding having a specific section for Tutorials etc, eg for the excellent posts that Menneisyys puts together. The wiki may not be the best place for them (due to the risk of negative edits), although it's certainly better then people never looking at them at all...
But as you say, it's pretty much predicted by psychohistory that all fora of dedicated people will eventually turn into a tech support. I don't mind, but less experienced must use the resources already online - quid pro quo.
V
As a new user on this forum i have noticed inconsitant information about G3 vs G4 devices and ROM upgrading. I've seen questions asked by people about G4 devices that go unanswered.
I think the problem with searching on this forum and many others. They do not allow you to search for 3 or fewer letter acronyms such as IPL, SPL, CID. There is no way to search for answers about these things. If there is a setting on the forum that can be changed to allow searching for these terms, then please fix it.
I think when people start posting info about how they did something they need to specify what hardware they are using G3/G4. Thankfully i havent done anything as far as modding my device, but i had seen posts where someone most likely with a G3 device says they figured out how to do this or that, Then someone with a G4 comes along and tried it, not knowing it was done on a G3 and ended up screwing up their device. We need to clearly specify what hardware we are doing mods on.
I still have no clear answer about CID unlocking a G4. I know there is no free utility to do it. Ive seen posts that say the imei-check site can CID unlock. Then i saw a post this morning that imei-check is only a SIM unlock. Can people please provide clear info?
d0ug said:
As a new user on this forum i have noticed inconsitant information about G3 vs G4 devices and ROM upgrading. I've seen questions asked by people about G4 devices that go unanswered.
I think the problem with searching on this forum and many others. They do not allow you to search for 3 or fewer letter acronyms such as IPL, SPL, CID. There is no way to search for answers about these things. If there is a setting on the forum that can be changed to allow searching for these terms, then please fix it.
I think when people start posting info about how they did something they need to specify what hardware they are using G3/G4. Thankfully i havent done anything as far as modding my device, but i had seen posts where someone most likely with a G3 device says they figured out how to do this or that, Then someone with a G4 comes along and tried it, not knowing it was done on a G3 and ended up screwing up their device. We need to clearly specify what hardware we are doing mods on.
I still have no clear answer about CID unlocking a G4. I know there is no free utility to do it. Ive seen posts that say the imei-check site can CID unlock. Then i saw a post this morning that imei-check is only a SIM unlock. Can people please provide clear info?
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I agree with you d0ug! It is rather confusing to navigate and find your way. Especially when you are a n00b, such as myself. I have been trying to mod my phone for 3 days now. I have tried many ways of unlocking my G3, but none of them have worked. I have listened to 3 different people tell me their "way" of unlocking the phone, and all 3 attempts failed in the end. I get flamed for not reading posts or searching, when i did, just nothing relevant popped up! This is not a whine fest, just saying that some people dont have phones that were built on a Wednesday, like mine that was probably built on a Monday and has issues!
Either way, i called Cingular and they are shipping me a brand new 8125 to test things out on!
Canon
Haven't been a wizard user that long although I've been in the ppc scene in about 5 years and quite active in several forums. The most successful solution that I've seen to this problem (witch enevitably always comes up) is to not let new users post for at least 7 days and/or forcing them to read various informational topics before getting access to the actual forum.
This will of course not get everyone but has in my experience improved the situation considerably.
Ah well, that's just my two cents
vijay555 said:
I agree. I get the feeling that since the relaunch, for one reason or another, there appears to be a lot more"Why don't my apps close when I press X?" and "How dat I swtich this thing 0ff!!!!!!!" type posts.
I think that it's beholden on more experienced users to try to share their experience as they see fit, but it's absolutely essential that newbs and less experienced users use the search button and wiki.
I've been sponsoring a post in the moderators' forum regarding having a specific section for Tutorials etc, eg for the excellent posts that Menneisyys puts together. The wiki may not be the best place for them (due to the risk of negative edits), although it's certainly better then people never looking at them at all...
But as you say, it's pretty much predicted by psychohistory that all fora of dedicated people will eventually turn into a tech support. I don't mind, but less experienced must use the resources already online - quid pro quo.
V
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Vijay, very happy to see that the mods are looking at this. I agree that Wiki's have their limitations especially given the validity of some of the comments about conflicting advice.
The search function definitely does have its limits as well, and people are less likely to go through searches that produce a 100 threads with 5 pages each.
I for one would feel a lot better about telling someone harshly to stop answering questions if I knew that I could also direct them to a single place for answers.
I really love this forum and it has helped me so much. I don't post much except to say "thank you" from time to time to the people who have made some program that has been helpful to me. And although I have been coming to this board every day for over a year I still don't know half as much as the majority of people here.
Some solutions to this problem are:
1) get frustrated and write a mean message to the noob
2) take a minute and just give the link to the page where the answer is
3) make it easier on this forum to find things
_Nomad_ said:
Haven't been a wizard user that long although I've been in the ppc scene in about 5 years and quite active in several forums. The most successful solution that I've seen to this problem (witch enevitably always comes up) is to not let new users post for at least 7 days and/or forcing them to read various informational topics before getting access to the actual forum.
This will of course not get everyone but has in my experience improved the situation considerably.
Ah well, that's just my two cents
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That could be nice... part of the things that had contributed to the bad search results are the tons of new threads asking the very same questions over and over and over again... is there anyway to disable these threads from showing up in the search results? Maybe it's time for us to out up another sticky thread specifically talking abóut G4 devices =)
vseehua said:
That could be nice... part of the things that had contributed to the bad search results are the tons of new threads asking the very same questions over and over and over again... is there anyway to disable these threads from showing up in the search results? Maybe it's time for us to out up another sticky thread specifically talking abóut G4 devices =)
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I would like to see a thread dedicated to G4 devices, with verified correct information in it.
It isnt just people asking the same questions over and over making the search junk. Its the inability to even search for simple short 3 letter acronyms like CID, IPL, SPL, AKU. These are all things I have tried to search for and get 0 results. If I were able to search for these terms I could probably turn up a wealth of information on my own.
_Nomad_ said:
Haven't been a wizard user that long although I've been in the ppc scene in about 5 years and quite active in several forums. The most successful solution that I've seen to this problem (witch enevitably always comes up) is to not let new users post for at least 7 days and/or forcing them to read various informational topics before getting access to the actual forum.
This will of course not get everyone but has in my experience improved the situation considerably.
Ah well, that's just my two cents
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That would work me thinks!!!!!
Hi all,
I've been reading this forum for weeks now and still have not found enough answers to be secure enough and cid-unlock my G3 2.21 vario.
I HAVE indeed read most relevant threads, although navigating them can be somewhat confusing. However When I posted some -in my n00b opinion - valid questions I either got 1) no reply whatsoever 2) replies to read "the" threads....which wasn't really helpfull or I wouldn't have asked 3) contradicting advice .... like a 2.21 G3 Can be unlocked, or it Cannot be unlocked, you have to downgrade twice, you have to upgrade twice, you Can or Cannot flash a G4 rom to a G3 device so you won't have to downgrade and CID unlock your phone first, etc.
I believe that I am somewhat beyond the real n00b level right now but still I'd like information to be more consistent and easier to find, I've already tried to suggest making a stickied n00b FAQ or wiki for us where to find the basic answers in a easy and consistent manner so the sdame questions aren't asked over and over and ROM threads hijacked for support questions.
but that is just my cup of tea.
thanks for a good forum with vlauable info.
stefan.
Regular search
Personally, I find using google or yahoo, with site:xda-developers.com, works much better than the forum search. My personal pet peeve is the inability to use quotes to search for phrases. Quotes don't work.
A major problem with "read the threads" is the 800+ entry length of some of them. It would be nice to try to harness the power of those of us newly figuring things out and ask them to submit a wiki for something they just learned. If we had a submission point for the wiki, perhaps those of us who recently learned new things would do a how-to write-up and submit it to the wiki.
Finally, there are a lot of repeat threads, many with false or useless information. These threads stand in the way of a searcher. I would be happier if the moderators deleted more bad threads. Alternatively, we could use democracy -- add a "vote to delete" button to every thread not posted by a moderator and if a high enough percentage vote to delete, the thread is gone. I'd suggest 20% as a threshold -- more than that and the thread goes away.
Have been reading all your comments and completely agree with you guys... I see you have specific problems on G3/G4 on Wizards, as someone suggested a separate subforum for G4 devices would be ideal for you, and also for Prophet I guess.
About the search functions I'm also using google to search as a fallback when I can't find specific things using vBulletin's integrated search function, there's a thread on the mod forum where we discussed how to improve it, but seems is not very active now... will try to push Flar to do something about that.
Regarding the wiki, I think everyone should be less afraid to edit, if you look at the "recent changes" you see always the same people is editing. Have a look at the Hermes or BlueAngel wiki pages, these are good examples on how info has to be organized on the wiki, it's easy to find everything on the front page and information is well divided. Formating may seem a bit complicated at the beginning, but you don't have to care too much if you just want to add content, sure someone more experienced with wiki syntax will edit and correct any bad formating mistakes.
I do 100% agree with you that the wiki itself doesn't cover half of what it should. Yet if you take the time to read through it, and the links, you should be quite familiar with your device...
And oh yeah, sure, you can't search for keywords less than four characters, but that's not really an excuse... look at the thread containing the latest Faria ROM. Half... Half of what the thread contains is the same question over and over again... those ppl didn't even read the initial post of the thread... they found the download link, tried to install the ROM, got problem and went right to work, posting their (stupid) question all over again and again... The problem was never the limited search capabilities... It's always the ppl...
A board without limitations always get bloated with crap, whether it's unwanted commercial och just plain stupid posts...
So, unfortunatly this is going to continue unless you put constraints on the board... I'm sorry, but that's what's gonna happen.
Seems to me that since this was posted the situation has sorta escalated... Faria, Molski, risidoro and just now Dr P has announced their leave.
In this rate all that'll be left will be the newbies soon. Sad to witness
_Nomad_ said:
And oh yeah, sure, you can't search for keywords less than four characters, but that's not really an excuse... look at the thread containing the latest Faria ROM. Half... Half of what the thread contains is the same question over and over again... those ppl didn't even read the initial post of the thread... they found the download link, tried to install the ROM, got problem and went right to work, posting their (stupid) question all over again and again... The problem was never the limited search capabilities... It's always the ppl...
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It's also very human.
_Nomad_ said:
A board without limitations always get bloated with crap, whether it's unwanted commercial och just plain stupid posts...
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There just should be enough moderators. Now what happens when you write something stupid is you also get useless answers like "don't do that" which just makes everything even worse. There should be a "FAQ"-section, there should be a "how-to"-section etc...but there isn't. The forum structure is FAR TOO SIMPLE to handle the amount of messages.
Two main things to handle this (just my opinion):
Re-designed forum structure
Moderators
(well, the structure should be designed in the first place so that it would be easy to extend it later...not an easy job)
prestonmcafee said:
...A major problem with "read the threads" is the 800+ entry length of some of them. It would be nice to try to harness the power of those of us newly figuring things out...
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I usually suggest to those asking questions to post the solution to their question in the first post. But I'm over at the Mio forums, and since we only have 4500 peps, the mods aren't overwhelmed. I can lock a thread, post the correct thread to post in, and a few days later, delete the thread. I spend 1/2 my time using the search function to consolidate questions into single threads. But like I said, that's not feasible here. I suggest a PM sent to everyone the registers, that is kind of a quick start guide. I understand why the 3 letter limit, because people type words like "the" and "and". I'm not sure how powerful the forum software is, but it would be nice to remove the size limit, and omit such words as mentioned above, from the search.
Regards,
Jason
mlehtola said:
There should be a "FAQ"-section, there should be a "how-to"-section etc...but there isn't. The forum structure is FAR TOO SIMPLE to handle the amount of messages.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ummm, have you ever taken the time to look at the Wiki?
This forum is being provided to us basically for free. (Except for voluntary donations.) I personally can't afford to donate $$$ to the community, or for that matter to individual developers, so I dedicate some time to post in the forums to share what I've learned. I have also donated time to updating the Wiki.
If the Wiki doesn't contain all you would like it to, just add it yourself! One brief tutorial could make a world of difference to a newbie, or even a more experienced user. It also helps to point out gaps in the general knowledge we have here in these forums.
If, for example, there isn't a sub-forum for the device you use, you don't have to wait for the moderators, etc. to create it. Just create a Wiki page, and get the ball rolling on your own!
Take the initiative! That's what these forums were founded on!
Just my opinion.
Now go have fun!
JKR said:
I suggest a PM sent to everyone the registers, that is kind of a quick start guide. I understand why the 3 letter limit, because people type words like "the" and "and". I'm not sure how powerful the forum software is, but it would be nice to remove the size limit, and omit such words as mentioned above, from the search.
Regards,
Jason
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
First of all, you get much better, and more detailed search results by using a search-engine like Google. Their advanced search features do a fantastic job, and can be fine tuned to search only through a specific site. (i.e. http://forum.xdadevelopers.com )
Secondly, as opposed to a PM, possibly an email with a confirmation link after the introductory information.
Hope this helps....
Now go have fun!
I think it is more synonymous of the world today, do you read the manual when you buy a new stereo or mobile phone, or do you dig in saying 'nah i know how it works it'll be ok'. People just dont take the time to understand first, they think they know it all and then the proverbial hits the fan! As an experienced R&D firmware developer it doesn't matter how easy I make the interface you will always get those that stuff it up!
So not such an easy one to fix, you have given the masses a place to ask the ridiculous and the tools to stuff up easily, How do you fix that?
Riptos
This is a request to all uses and moderators.
I would like to see three things.
1) Sticky's/Announcements in Kaiser General to the FAQ/GWENI/ETC. Currently these are listed in ROM development and not intuitive for a new user to find.
2) A guide for NOOBZ - while the above are invaluable resources, they don't address very basic issues. Things like:
How do I use activesync to install a CAB?
How do I do a basic registry edit
Where can I look for good software for x, y, and z
What does ROM, CID, SIM, XML mean...in general a Glossary
other basic tasks/information
I don't have the bandwidth to create such a guide right now, but if someone would like to volunteer, particularly a user who has gone through a noob to more experienced level using this site and is aware of the issues and pitfalls. It would be much appreciated...
3) A forum section for Noobz... As we have seen many posts as of late with titles like "I am a noob" , "Help me...","What software is good?",etc.
I think having this forum there would attract these posts better while appease the larger community from having to entertain these even in the general forum. Which, as some have stated should be a forum for questions not releated to the other 3, and not as a place for spoonfeeding.
If you think any of these 3 suggestions is a good idea, please post your support and or ideas.
thanks
Agree, sounds like a good idea.
My other suggestion would be to migrate to mediawiki as it just works nicer and the wiki may be developed more and be easier for noobies to get through!
good idea .. but i bet there will still be stupid posts by users who just wana be spoon fed.
thesire said:
good idea .. but i bet there will still be stupid posts by users who just wana be spoon fed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
TITLE
Im a noob and need help
MESSAGE
You mentioned "spoon fed" how do you do this? can you show me. Is it a .cab and if so how do i install.
Thank you and please don't flame me
thesire said:
good idea .. but i bet there will still be stupid posts by users who just wana be spoon fed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree.
However many of the "senior" or more educated members of the forum seem to get quite upset at these "noob" and/or redundant posts.
There are three ways to handle a post like this:
1) Ignore it
2) Flame it
3) Respond in a helpful manner
Ignoring it works, and it is something ALL OF US NEED TO DO MORE. Remember, if you don't have anything nice to say, don't say it at all. (The Internet is encroaching more and more into the realm of real life...it has been shown more than once that bullying someone on line can have legal consequences in real life.). However, ignoring posts won't make them go away either, as there will be more since nothing is being done to educate the user or point future users in the right direction.
Flaming it serves no one any good. Stupid users won't learn, and if flaming makes you feel better, just remember you are taking up just as much (or more) of the forum resources and wasting just as much time flaming a worthless or uneducated post. Remember, fighting on the Internet is like competing in the special olympics. Even if you win, you are still retarded (no offense meant to the special olympics, or mentally challenged individuals...I have just always found this statement funny...and true).
Responding in a helpful manner should be the way to go if you choose not to ignore it. But, a helpful manner does not mean spoon feeding. Remember, "Give a man a fish; you have fed him for today. Teach a man to fish; and you have fed him for a lifetime." Proactive responses such as sticky's and announcments do the most to this effect.
As a "forum" in the classical sense, this should be a place for thought and discussion. However, it is also a gathering place for the masses. The leaders of the society should strive to educate and elucidate. However this can't be done on an individual level for every single post.
No man is an island either and to be part of the greater continent that is XDA-DEVELOPERS they need to have a modicum of intellect insofar that they know how to navigate an internet site.
I would feel better knowing that we have made ALL the resources available to the masses. This way we don't need to feel bad about ignoring any posts that we deem are ignorant.
I'm sure you have all heard the old saying about the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results....
Rather than attempt to dispel "NOOB" queries by means such as WIKIs,FAQs and the like which clearly have proven futile, it would make more sense to come up with a method of allowing such queries in a manner that doesn't encroach on the sense of ownership of the forum that seems to prevail amongst the senior members.
bengalih said:
This is a request to all uses and moderators.
I would like to see three things.
1) Sticky's/Announcements in Kaiser General to the FAQ/GWENI/ETC. Currently these are listed in ROM development and not intuitive for a new user to find.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As stated to you before but I'm stating so that more people can see it, I completely agree with this.
2) A guide for NOOBZ - while the above are invaluable resources, they don't address very basic issues. Things like:
How do I use activesync to install a CAB?
How do I do a basic registry edit
Where can I look for good software for x, y, and z
What does ROM, CID, SIM, XML mean...in general a Glossary
other basic tasks/information
I don't have the bandwidth to create such a guide right now, but if someone would like to volunteer, particularly a user who has gone through a noob to more experienced level using this site and is aware of the issues and pitfalls. It would be much appreciated...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Also as you know, I have gone from newb to somewhat experienced almost solely through this site and I'll work on the bold part above this week and weekend. Here is my 1st attempt at it though.
boomermax said:
I'm sure you have all heard the old saying about the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results....
Rather than attempt to dispel "NOOB" queries by means such as WIKIs,FAQs and the like which clearly have proven futile, it would make more sense to come up with a method of allowing such queries in a manner that doesn't encroach on the sense of ownership of the forum that seems to prevail amongst the senior members.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not sure what the point of stating this is?
We have a new idea...the noob forum. This is in addition to refining the current methods to possibly make them more effective.
What would your method be?
I also don't feel that the senior's assume a sense of ownership. Except to the effect that without them there would be no resources and thus this site wouldn't exist and thus be visited by noobz. I think the sense is more of outrage or incredulity the same as any member of a community would have when it accumulates members who have no concept of how to function in that society.
Don't you think that some people in your community might get a little offput if they had some native tribe move in and walk around naked? Performed drum circles at 2am every night? Dump on the lawns?
It is about community upkeep, and you don't have to be a senior to do it. In fact, some seniors may be counter productive. It is about being knowledgeable of your surroundings and willing to learn the rules to properly assimilate.
i love ur writing style bengalih ur posts are always so perfectly composed
I agree as well
I am not new to the forum because I have been lurking in the shadows for a while and have not posted anything as of yet but I have to totally agree with this request as I think that it is a great idea.I know that it would help me out a lot and feel that it would help others out as well.
I also just wanted to post this private message I got from a user:
(empahsis added by me)
Hello I'm [name removed] and I will be the first to say that I am new to all of this but I was reading a post and u had suggested that a "noobie Forum" might be a good idea and I would have to agree.
I have just gotten an AT&T Tilt and I have spent hours on top of hours reading in the forums here and I have to say that a lot of it is very complicated for someone like me who doesn't understand ROMs and Flashing and things like that.
I have read a lot of the post and to be honest I have had several questions that I could not find anwsers too after searching and have been terrified to post my question because of the negitivity and hostility that I have read.
The problem that I am having is that I am not understanding a lot of what is being written and am not sure what I should put on my phone or how to do it correctly.I am not stupid,ignorant,nor have I not taken the time to read and search things on this forum.
I am college educated and fairly intelligent but I am not tech savy or computer savy for that matter and I don't understand a lot of what is being said.I will admit that my phone is smarter than I am but I would like to learn how to use it more effecentally and get the most out of my phone and what it can do for me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I hope you senior/educated members take to heart comments like this and realize that although this isn't rocket science there are still many educated individuals that don't know where to start. Even after a user RTFM (which this user apparently did some), there is obviously a gap to get them to the next level.
We have to accept that this has become a place for the PPC masses and we can either ignore the pleas for help or do something to assist in the long term.
On the flip-side to you noobs... don't get over your head. You don't buy a junker or a tuner if you're not a mechanic, and you don't try to paint the Mona Lisa if you're just a dilletante. If you are in a position where you can't understand things even after hours of research you may want to get your feet wet in something else (like a basic computer class), or you can always buy from Apple . This stuff isn't for everyone, and unfortunately nothing we do will make it so.
bengalih said:
I'm not sure what the point of stating this is?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
First off I began writing the previously posted comment prior to your well spoken post above.
The ownership I spoke of was reference to the few senior members that feel a need to reply to every single post by redundantly pointing out the redundancy of others.
My suggestion was to avoid the attempt of "pre-answering" all possible questions. It can't be done.
Nor is it reasonable to expect all knowledge to exist on the same level. Take the analogy of communities that you spoke of (which I agreed with up until you equated elemental levels of knowledge with pooping on one's lawn).
Within all successful communities you have an acknowledged and agreed upon division of areas of education.
In other words 1st graders don't sit in the same classroom as upperclassmates...
...nor do upperclassmates refuse to graduate.
I think the idea of a noob forum sounds good, and I believe it would help separate many of the redundant posts in the general forum.......but at the same time, if those posts are separated so as not to bother the more experienced people from having to sort through them, then who is going to help them? Would we have noobs answering other noobs? I'm afraid we would end up with the blind leading the blind.
By that same token, if the experienced users decided to venture into the noob forum to help them....then separating the posts for the sake of not having to wade through them seems somewhat counter-productive.
Don't take any of this as a negative. I think putting together a collection of noob resources is a good idea, and creating a noob forum may be as well......I'm just trying to weigh the benefits with the potential problems it could cause.
I am probley the top flamer (IMO) and sometimes I flame and sometimes not. Mostly I flame people who you can honestly see from the question that they didn't look for anything. If I can find the answer in 5 minutes and you claim to have spent days, then I know you didn't search. As to the person that has read and still doesn't understand, please post. Most of the time those people come out and explain things in their question so that you can tell they actually have an understanding.
Asking a specific question about a step or a method in an educated manor is far better then say, I Are noob, what software should I install, oh and can someone literally hold my hand while I flash this rom on my phone.
If you're willing to educate yourself then it shows.
I know that I was nervous and a little scared before I flashed for the first time. I was on edge the whole time, but I knew I read over the instructions over and over.. I have read them again and again and I just don't see where the mistakes happen.
I will provide support if you need it, but you don't need it if the answer is right there, 3 posts down or if it's a well known thing.
Oh I wonder if you could keep that forum from registering in the search function.
boomermax said:
First off I began writing the previously posted comment prior to your well spoken post above.
The ownership I spoke of was reference to the few senior members that feel a need to reply to every single post by redundantly pointing out the redundancy of others.
My suggestion was to avoid the attempt of "pre-answering" all possible questions. It can't be done.
Nor is it reasonable to expect all knowledge to exist on the same level. Take the analogy of communities that you spoke of (which I agreed with up until you equated elemental levels of knowledge with pooping on one's lawn).
Within all successful communities you have an acknowledged and agreed upon division of areas of education.
In other words 1st graders don't sit in the same classroom as upperclassmates...
...nor do upperclassmates refuse to graduate.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agreed. Although I stand by my "pooping" comment . The fact is that all of those levels of knowledge may be perfectly acceptable in some communities, but totally unacceptable in others (ok ok, granted not too many poop on their lawns...but not that far off.).
I think you are right that we can't answer all questions, but we can try. I think if we can teach the fundamentals, and then a lower classman learns those he should be able to synthesize most of the remaining elements.
For what they can't extract from their learnings, they can ask a question on. After all, most of the info passed around here isn't new, it is synthesized and rehashed in different forms applicable to a particular issue.
I don't think we can get rid of the basic posts, the "I am a noob posts", the didn't search for this first post. But I do think putting them in another question would help.
I know it has been suggested before, and I don't know if it is possible (I have been on other forums that can do this....) But it would be great if we could limit posting to the noob forum for the first 2 weeks of someone's membership.
Valtamr said:
I think the idea of a noob forum sounds good, and I believe it would help separate many of the redundant posts in the general forum.......but at the same time, if those posts are separated so as not to bother the more experienced people from having to sort through them, then who is going to help them? ....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I address this here
ChumleyEX said:
I am probley the top flamer (IMO) and sometimes I flame and sometimes not. Mostly I flame people who you can honestly see from the question that they didn't look for anything. ....
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Click to collapse
I think you are far from the worst Chumley...but as a genuine question:
Why do you feel the need to flame? Why not just ignore the post?
I am not stating this rhetorically to be preachy. I am asking to figure out how we can eliminate it.
Personally I sometimes want to flame back a flamer just for contributing something just as worthless as the original post, but I refrain.
I mean, if someone came into the ROM Development forum and posted "I am a NOOB, how can I please to update my phone!!!" I would expect and even welcome the flames there. If we have to terrify the users to know their place then that's ok...the second part of that though is we NEED TO GIVE THEM A PLACE TO PUT THEM IN! That's why I think a noob forum might help.
bengalih said:
But it would be great if we could limit posting to the noob forum for the first 2 weeks of someone's membership.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But isn't that really the point that's being refused to be acknowledged?
This is the noob forum. Senior members who have already acquired the "upper" levels of knowledge are begrudgingly noticing that not every day is a day of discovery like before and are being faced with the choice of becoming teachers or finding other sources of higher knowledge.
boomermax said:
But isn't that really the point that's being refused to be acknowledged?
This is the noob forum. Senior members who have already acquired the "upper" levels of knowledge are begrudgingly noticing that not every day is a day of discovery like before and are being faced with the choice of becoming teachers or finding other sources of higher knowledge.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not sure of your statement of "This is the noob forum"
Are you suggesting that either the "General" forum or XDA-developers in general is now for noobz?
I would whole-heartedly disagree with the latter. As for the former, General is not meant for noobz, it is meant for anything that doesn't fit in the other 3 forums (e.g, not about ROM development, not about an accessory, not about a specific piece of software).
I don't want to keep stressing the name of the site is "XDA-Developers." Just because it may be bombarded by power users or noobz, shouldn't diminish the function of the site. If the attitude starts to become "This is where noobz should be" then I think you are going to see some real problems. The least of which is that if you piss off the seniors, they WILL go somewhere else and this site will become meaningless.
well I suppose it comes from many things. As a child I was bullied and now I find myself in a situation of assumed power. Or, I feel that because spent the time to educate myself, through all the grulling threads, I have the right to do it. And like a drill Sergent , I will not be nice about teaching you to fish.
Man I gotta work on my rep.
Alright, so I have heard something over at the vineyard... and them little birds chirped way too loudly...
I know that OT is in a decline, and many of us are to blame, so here I am, taking partial responsibility for what happened.
But, I would also like to point out that some of the new members aren't helping either. Case in point:
gwrace said:
test post test post
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So, how would the mods like us to proceed? An immediate PM for deletion?
While I do try my best to remain civil and funny (it is kinda hard to do both at times), these posts do get on my nerves. Are we proposing double standards where new members are allowed a modicum of spamming while some of the more seasoned members in OT continue to be judged a little too harshly (in my opinion)?
While some of us might be a little radical in our approach, we really do have an issue with these kind of posts. How do you expect us to be funny and intelligent when everywhere we turn, we see new members posting stuff like the above?
Report any posts like that using the Report Post button located in the top right corner of each post.
These days though it seems that nearly all posts in OT are one post little blurbs like people saying "lol (10char)" which really just takes up space. Plus people creating threads with that as the OP and then a ton of people posting links to images and memes in the following posts.
^Just my 2 cents
Captainkrtek said:
Report any posts like that using the Report Post button located in the top right corner of each post.
These days though it seems that nearly all posts in OT are one post little blurbs like people saying "lol (10char)" which really just takes up space. Plus people creating threads with that as the OP and then a ton of people posting links to images and memes in the following posts.
^Just my 2 cents
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Alright, fair enough... although I can count the number of times I used 10char with a (probably mutated) hand.
I can't say for the rest, but I will try to help keep the place civil.
sakai4eva said:
Alright, fair enough... although I can count the number of times I used 10char with a (probably mutated) hand.
I can't say for the rest, but I will try to help keep the place civil.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks. As you know this place is also for us to have a relaxing time (it's not that we are against it) but a few months ago as you also noticed, this forum has been loosing it's purpose and going down the hill because members (not only new ones, also seniors) over abuse in making OT threads and boosting their post account.
Up until recently, using the Report Post button was the way to deal with these if you find them, but as per the new guidelines on the Report Post page, if you come across any posts like this, send a PM to the forum mod. Report Posts is only to be used for more serious issues
the_scotsman said:
using the Report Post button was the way to deal with these if you find them, but as per the new guidelines on the Report Post page, if you come across any posts like this, send a PM to the forum mod. Report Posts is only to be used for more serious issues
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Click to collapse
ive noticed this recently , im sure there were problems with it (eg i dont think it was fixed cuz it wasnt broken) thats why this new scheme is in place ,
but ...
shouldnt it be the other way around ? i mean the little things in the report and the bigger problems in pm ? because for the users
1, they just fill out the little report form and its off
2, they find the mod in the doc , go to their profile , after another 3 clicks , write the pm , add hyperlink , fill in the subject and then send ..
im just not sure peeps will go this far if its only a little matter like some noob spamming or being rude , theyll just say , its not worth my time ... i know i did(3 times as of yet)
souljaboy said:
ive noticed this recently , im sure there were problems with it (eg i dont think it was fixed cuz it wasnt broken) thats why this new scheme is in place ,
but ...
shouldnt it be the other way around ? i mean the little things in the report and the bigger problems in pm ? because for the users
1, they just fill out the little report form and its off
2, they find the mod in the doc , go to their profile , after another 3 clicks , write the pm , add hyperlink , fill in the subject and then send ..
im just not sure peeps will go this far if its only a little matter like some noob spamming or being rude , theyll just say , its not worth my time ... i know i did(3 times as of yet)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yea, I understand what you're saying, and somewhat agree. But the Report Post form will soon be modified again to include more options and be somewhat more interactive.
The reason we want minor issues to be sent by PM to forum mods is because of the way our moderator system works behind the scenes...I can't go into any details, but the forum mods are there for that very reason, to be able to handle all the small problems by themselves.
the_scotsman said:
Yea, I understand what you're saying, and somewhat agree. But the Report Post form will soon be modified again to include more options and be somewhat more interactive.
The reason we want minor issues to be sent by PM to forum mods is because of the way our moderator system works behind the scenes...I can't go into any details, but the forum mods are there for that very reason, to be able to handle all the small problems by themselves.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Alright, we'll do your way.
Thanks to the mods for listening.
Rule 1 clearly states, that you shall read the thread first and then ask questions. So, most questions are answered in the first post. In my case people are asking again and again "is the rom quitable for model XY" and similar things. This is obviously a violation of rule 1. I wouldn't mind, but the threads are growing rapidly. 50% is just asking this question, 20% is "can confirm that bug xy is present" or "installation not working", while not following the instructions, which is also useless. 10% is asking for feature xy, usually for an unfinished rom, which is not working 100%. So only 20% is really information. As the threads grow and grow you are literally unable to find the information you are looking for and people don't look too, they even don't read the first post; they just ask. And the thread grows with this spam.
I hinted someone to read the first post. The answer was right there. My post was deleted with the hint "If you don't help then shut up". But really, is this necessary? I don't know if I'm the only one, but posts like these should be deleted with a hint, that the poster should read the first post. This would make the threads clearer, cleaner and shorter.
Any ideas on that?
I completely agree with you. People should definitely read more and ask less.
Great post, hope people READ it.
Sent from my SM-N910C using Tapatalk
massehullah said:
I completely agree with you. People should definitely read more and ask less.
Great post, hope people READ it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks.
I hope mods read it and maybe agree too.
jacdelad said:
Rule 1 clearly states, that you shall read the thread first and then ask questions. So, most questions are answered in the first post. In my case people are asking again and again "is the rom quitable for model XY" and similar things. This is obviously a violation of rule 1. I wouldn't mind, but the threads are growing rapidly. 50% is just asking this question, 20% is "can confirm that bug xy is present" or "installation not working", while not following the instructions, which is also useless. 10% is asking for feature xy, usually for an unfinished rom, which is not working 100%. So only 20% is really information. As the threads grow and grow you are literally unable to find the information you are looking for and people don't look too, they even don't read the first post; they just ask. And the thread grows with this spam.
I hinted someone to read the first post. The answer was right there. My post was deleted with the hint "If you don't help then shut up". But really, is this necessary? I don't know if I'm the only one, but posts like these should be deleted with a hint, that the poster should read the first post. This would make the threads clearer, cleaner and shorter.
Any ideas on that?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're not wrong about people not searching or reading OPs. I always call Rule #1 the number one rule we don't enforce. Maybe we should somehow, but it's not really enforceable as someone could search and just miss it.
I looked through the thread and saw you answered the same question for somebody else previously so a simple search would have revealed that. When you said your post was deleted with "If you don't help then shut up", that piqued my interest so I looked into it. The issue wasn't that you hinted he search, but in the way you said it. You called the guy a spammer which started an argument so to the moderator, it looked like you were blasting someone for not searching. Had you said something like, "I answered this last week; search through the thread and you'll find it." then you most likely would have been fine. Most (all?) of us moderators don't like to spoon-feed members so we understand if you nicely tell someone to search instead of giving them the answer directly.
I get the frustration with people asking if ROM X supports Device Y, but I blame that on the manufacturers and carriers for not making things uniform, not on members. I have a Sprint HTC One m7 and so have to be very careful about flashing international variant ROMs. If the OP isn't clear if there is Sprint support, then I could brick my device. Vice versa, we have a lot of people in the Sprint fora for the device who are trying to use it on international CDMA carriers and are constantly asking about that compatibility. It can be annoying, but I see both sides.
By the way, my (PM) door's always open if you need help or just need to vent on something. I'd rather you do that then say something in thread that could get you in trouble.
coal686 said:
You're not wrong about people not searching or reading OPs. I always call Rule #1 the number one rule we don't enforce. Maybe we should somehow, but it's not really enforceable as someone could search and just miss it.
I looked through the thread and saw you answered the same question for somebody else previously so a simple search would have revealed that. When you said your post was deleted with "If you don't help then shut up", that piqued my interest so I looked into it. The issue wasn't that you hinted he search, but in the way you said it. You called the guy a spammer which started an argument so to the moderator, it looked like you were blasting someone for not searching. Had you said something like, "I answered this last week; search through the thread and you'll find it." then you most likely would have been fine. Most (all?) of us moderators don't like to spoon-feed members so we understand if you nicely tell someone to search instead of giving them the answer directly.
I get the frustration with people asking if ROM X supports Device Y, but I blame that on the manufacturers and carriers for not making things uniform, not on members. I have a Sprint HTC One m7 and so have to be very careful about flashing international variant ROMs. If the OP isn't clear if there is Sprint support, then I could brick my device. Vice versa, we have a lot of people in the Sprint fora for the device who are trying to use it on international CDMA carriers and are constantly asking about that compatibility. It can be annoying, but I see both sides.
By the way, my (PM) door's always open if you need help or just need to vent on something. I'd rather you do that then say something in thread that could get you in trouble.
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You're right, my tone wasn't the nicest. It's the frustration speaking through said post. The same posts over and over again...you also surely read the answer on m post, something like "deleting post of someone saying you should use the search function".
But I can't agree with the variant problem. Nearly all ROMs clear that up in the first post, most of them already in the title. If you want to flash, you need dome knowledge. You have to read before, maybe watch a YouTube video. This clears most questions.
Take a look at the carhd rom-thread from carotix. It has 1545 pages now, carotix is very active and makes frequently updates. The people are begging, some demanding, certain features which were available with mm, but not on n yet. I cannot understand how he stays so calm.
Look at the N0G33K kernel thread for the Galaxy S6. Count how often it's asked if this kernel is for n. This information is cleared up in the first post...and this is nothing else than spamming and laziness.
Maybe it would be useful to have a more concrete forced design for the op. Something unified, maybe a template which would have the information always on the same place (version, model etc.). But I guess this wouldn't stop the unnecessary questions.
Maybe a "unnecessary"-button for this kind of spam would help. A moderator could delete post and hint the poster to read the rules/op.
In a forum this big, things get lost very easily and forum searches aren't great.
One of my topics has had no responses, despite being a somewhat valid question (what phone protection do you have - case, film screen, glass)
Yet, if there were yearly versions, stickied, then simple questions would get answered in the one thread.
jacdelad said:
But I can't agree with the variant problem. Nearly all ROMs clear that up in the first post, most of them already in the title. If you want to flash, you need dome knowledge. You have to read before, maybe watch a YouTube video. This clears most questions.
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The OP of that thread you mentioned didn't say though, or if it did, I couldn't find it. Nearly everything was hidden under hide tags, but I went through them all. Now, I will admit that I'm an HTC guy and so it might have been there in secret Samsung code and I just missed it.
jacdelad said:
Take a look at the carhd rom-thread from carotix. It has 1545 pages now, carotix is very active and makes frequently updates. The people are begging, some demanding, certain features which were available with mm, but not on n yet. I cannot understand how he stays so calm.
Look at the N0G33K kernel thread for the Galaxy S6. Count how often it's asked if this kernel is for n. This information is cleared up in the first post...and this is nothing else than spamming and laziness.
Maybe it would be useful to have a more concrete forced design for the op. Something unified, maybe a template which would have the information always on the same place (version, model etc.). But I guess this wouldn't stop the unnecessary questions.
Maybe a "unnecessary"-button for this kind of spam would help. A moderator could delete post and hint the poster to read the rules/op.
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Yes, that is an unfortunate problem. I don't know if you saw the thread where we discussed "sharing changes", but some ideas to deal with this exact complaint came up and are being considered. If you have any feedback you'd like to add, feel free.
anotherxdauser said:
In a forum this big, things get lost very easily and forum searches aren't great.
One of my topics has had no responses, despite being a somewhat valid question (what phone protection do you have - case, film screen, glass)
Yet, if there were yearly versions, stickied, then simple questions would get answered in the one thread.
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That unfortunately happens sometimes and to me, it's a shame.
Look at this thread:
https://forum.xda-developers.com/galaxy-s6/orig-development/beta-stable-lineageos-14-1-t3583456
First post after the ones from the devs is "does not work on edge". Op clearly states that is only for flat by now.
Really, I'm about to become a Nazi by reading this...