The design of the Streak seems like it could fairly easily take a back with a solar charger built in. Has anyone seen something like that?
Sent from my Dell Streak using XDA App
I think you would have difficulty finding a solar panel small enough with enough power output to do any good, not to mention having to leave it out in the heat of the sun while it charged.
Good point.
Buts not about replacing the mains charger but adding a little charge while out and about. Prob get a few days extra with solar panel. Unless you forget to take it out of your pocket
I think its a great idea. Maybe a battery with built in cover/solar panel
Sent from my Dell Streak using Tapatalk
does sounds like a good idea you can already get solar phone chargers but one attached to the phone would be great!!
you'd probably be better off looking for one of those solar power batteries that could charge an internal battery, then use it to charge the streak once the charge is up
Solar chargers work under indoor lighting also. My watch never dies on me and I'm indoors all the time. As long as you left the unit face down, it would trickle charge and maybe get enough extra time to never worry about dying out before you get home to your charger.
mid_life_crisis said:
Solar chargers work under indoor lighting also. My watch never dies on me and I'm indoors all the time. As long as you left the unit face down, it would trickle charge and maybe get enough extra time to never worry about dying out before you get home to your charger.
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Problem is the Streak needs an awful lot more power than a watch. I see this panel on eBay http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/5V-150mA...895?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4aacb1b777 which they say is 5v 150ma and it's 110mm x 56mm. This is roughly the size of the battery cover on the Streak, but you would need 7 times as much current to successfully charge it.
Troute said:
Problem is the Streak needs an awful lot more power than a watch. I see this panel on eBay http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/5V-150mA...895?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4aacb1b777 which they say is 5v 150ma and it's 110mm x 56mm. This is roughly the size of the battery cover on the Streak, but you would need 7 times as much current to successfully charge it.
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What if you combined this with the battery idea? So it would charge a second smaller battery, and when your battery was running low you flipped a switch to charge the streak from that? It would start to get bulky but might work?
not a new idea or device... see:
http://www.powerbee.co.uk/Solar-Phone-Chargers/Powerpod-Solar-Phone-Charger/p-84-355/
http://www.amazon.com/Premium-Solar-Charger-Built-Windshield/dp/B00449U3K0/ref=pd_cp_e_0
http://www.ecoexpress.com/page-1440-ECO SHOPS-1101.htm
http://www.amazon.com/i-Sound-Portable-iPhone-Blackberry-Silver/dp/B00439G3WS/ref=pd_cp_e_2
etc...
I bought two extra charging cables. One for the car, one for work and the original stays at home by my computer. Charging problem solved with nothing to lug around. This thing is big enough without toting around accessories.
Troute said:
Problem is the Streak needs an awful lot more power than a watch. I see this panel on eBay http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/5V-150mA...895?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4aacb1b777 which they say is 5v 150ma and it's 110mm x 56mm. This is roughly the size of the battery cover on the Streak, but you would need 7 times as much current to successfully charge it.
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No you wouldn't, it would charge with only 150ma, it would just take about 10 hours for full charge, in reality, something like this would only slow battery drain on a "super"-phone like this.
That's my point - not to charge from dead, but to top up and maybe get an extra hour or more before searching for an outlet.
Sent from my Dell Streak using XDA App
Aren't there serious problems with trying to trickle charge Lithium ION cells? As in, it kills them pretty quickly?
Isn't that why loads of modern kit has normal and fast charge modes, depending on what the available amperage on the cable is, and why some things, e.g. iPad, cannot charge at all from some USB ports?
As far as I know the only thing you don't want to do to a lithium battery is let it discharge fully, that shortens the battery life considerably.
Troute said:
As far as I know the only thing you don't want to do to a lithium battery is let it discharge fully, that shortens the battery life considerably.
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This didn't make sense to me, so I Googled. It is correct. I found this quote on a battery research site.
"Similar to a mechanical device that wears out faster with heavy use, so also does the depth of discharge (DoD) determine the cycle count. The smaller the depth of discharge, the longer the battery will last. If at all possible, avoid frequent full discharges and charge more often between uses. If full discharges cannot be avoided, try utilizing a larger battery. Partial discharge on Li-ion is fine; there is no memory and the battery does not need periodic full discharge cycles other than to calibrate the fuel gauge on a smart battery."
There was a chart that indicated that discharging only to 50% as opposed to until it dies can triple the battery life.
The moral is to have it on a charger whenever possible.
Well, according to http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/charging_lithium_ion_batteries
A continuous trickle charge would cause plating of metallic lithium, and this could compromise safety.
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It is referring to when they are fully charged, but you would definitely have to cope with that situation, since that's a recipe for exploding batteries, otherwise
mid_life_crisis said:
The moral is to have it on a charger whenever possible.
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After reading that article, this statement I made previously is clearly wrong.
What I gathered from the article is that for max lifespan of the battery, a couple of things should be done:
1) Do not completely discharge.
2) Turn the phone off while charging.
Of course with the Streak it would be impractical to do both of these, as it would mean turning your phone off for an hour or so in the middle of the day.
Oh yeah, and hope like hell that Dell did a good job designing the charger circuitry.
p_razzi said:
The design of the Streak seems like it could fairly easily take a back with a solar charger built in. Has anyone seen something like that?
Sent from my Dell Streak using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/charging_with_solar_and_turbine
Its still a great idea, free energy, even if its only 10mins
Sent from my Dell Streak using Tapatalk
A seperate solar charger might be useful but there's another potential problem with a built in one, that is having to leave the phone lying in the sun for long periods of time, never a good idea.
Related
Hey all,
I've been experimenting with the rear 4-pin connector on the back of the droid 4 (pogo-pins for the inductive charging rear door)
Connected a current limited power supply to Gnd and Vin on the back of my Droid 4 (pin lower right = gnd, pin lower left = Vin) at 5.0V and I had charging occurring at a nice speedy rate. Screen showed charging, amperage was around 1500mA to start scaling down to 1300mA-1100mA as it reached full charge. It seems to pass through the Lithium Ion battery management circuity so appears to be a safe way to dump in lots of power. Obviously these pins are designed to pick up power from the rear inductive charging cover that Motorola produced, but I wanted to try just pure 5.0V power. It appears that it is not bypassing or defeating the battery temp/overcharging safety circuit but of course test at your own will in a safe environment. I personally noted that if the battery was 'warm' the charge rate was reduced to avoid overtemp. Also it would scale down as the on-screen-indicator showed it was reaching full charge.
I’m thinking of grabbing some extra rear covers and making up some drop-in charging stations or alternative inputs (like solar/etc.)
Nice to get away from having to charge on the USB Micro connector which appears to limit charging current and cause wear-and-tear.
This seems like a VERY good thing if someone was building an external battery pack that fit onto the phone (like the one for the iPhone)…you could power it on, charge via this connector, and shut it down whenever you liked. The power draw on the phone drops off massively once it is charged so if you started with a full charge, it could float the battery all the way to empty.
Time to experiment! My first build will likely be a drop-in docking station.
Again, for reference:
Bottom right (when viewing back, camera at the top):
Gnd is Lower Right – Nearest the microUSB connector
Vin is Lower Left – Opposite side from Gnd on the bottom row
Don’t hit it with too much voltage! I limited myself to about 4.8V and 1700mA max. I'd expect over-voltage on these pins could damage the battery management circuity and fry the phone. I was using a good regulated supply with meters.
Cheers,
This is awesome, thanks for this! Might have to play with a cover and done batteries at some point... Please let us all know how your experiments go!
Sent from my DROID BIONIC using xda app-developers app
I like the idea of an expanded battery very useful.
I have a small solar cell + battery to charge my phone by USB already.
That is bad ass. Post some pics of your first prototype
Sent from my DROID4 using xda premium
Great news, thanks for your time, man.
Just wondering but do you know what the other 2 pins are for?
I got one with a broken usb port for parts and am now wondering if I could use this to build a fix.
Most any (not all) Li-ion battery is rated for at least a 1C charge rate. So with a 1785 mAh Li-ion battery you should be able to safely charge at 1785 mA. The trade off is the faster you charge it the more you reduce overall battery life. For example (not real numbers) if the expected life of the battery is 500 charges (a charge is the amount of current to charge the battery from it's nominal voltage to fully charged and has no correlation to how many times you plug it into a charger) then charging it at 0.75C might increase it's life significantly to 750 to 1000 charges.
Note: the stock wall wart is speced at 850 mA at 5.1 V output (very odd that voltage...).
Brandon314159 said:
Nice to get away from having to charge on the USB Micro connector which appears to limit charging current and cause wear-and-tear.
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More likely it's the power supply. Most all PC usb ports put out 500 mA at 5.0 V. Most (USB) wall warts are rated at 1000 mA at 5.0 V.
What has me worried is that the phone appears to overcharge the battery to something like 4.317 V or even 4.351 V... I'm hoping this is just an error in the phone/app voltage reporting, but then again it could just be the way they get that 1785 mAh capacity from the battery. Overcharging the battery in this way could well be safe and would have the effect of increasing it's capacity, but it will significantly reduce it's life as well. You would not expect a Li-ion battery to be charged over 4.2 V and preferably something like 4.17 V
Can you use those pins to directly measure the battery voltage? I was going to measure mine directly to compare with Battery Monitor Widget reporting but decided I didn't want to remove the sticker from the back of the battery and I couldn't get a reading from the push pin contacts.
Quick7135 said:
What has me worried is that the phone appears to overcharge the battery to something like 4.317 V or even 4.351 V... I'm hoping this is just an error in the phone/app voltage reporting, but then again it could just be the way they get that 1785 mAh capacity from the battery. Overcharging the battery in this way could well be safe and would have the effect of increasing it's capacity, but it will significantly reduce it's life as well. You would not expect a Li-ion battery to be charged over 4.2 V and preferably something like 4.17 V
Can you use those pins to directly measure the battery voltage? I was going to measure mine directly to compare with Battery Monitor Widget reporting but decided I didn't want to remove the sticker from the back of the battery and I couldn't get a reading from the push pin contacts.
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Click to collapse
- You cannot use those pins to measure battery voltage as they are an input to the charger... IE they do not tie directly to the battery. You would have to watch the battery voltage at the screws for the battery flex-cable mount.
- There are lots of notes about the battery voltage being 'high' by peoples viewpoints. If you search around, someone explains the difference in chemistry that the Droid 4 is using and that it does have a higher Vmax during bulk/absorption charge levels. I believe the summary was that it is a non-issue. They aren't trying to 'cheat' the battery into higher voltage for more cap...it's just simply how that chemistry wants to be charged. You'll have to google around to find it.
I am curious to see what sort of 'external' packs I can come up with and likely would limit my charging rate to 1200mA or so just to keep things 'happy'. I got slapped pretty hard over at droidforums by an admin and my post removed for this same info...glad to see the community here is more accepting of my discoveries. :cyclops:
-Also, the other two pins are data lines...not sure if In/out compatible but one is Batt Temp and the other is Communication (for determining battery type). The phone doesn't like having these pins futzed with (can cause reboots/lockups) so there is clearly something on the other end...but sounds like the protection is weak regarding input into the processor/etc.
Once I have my phone near a camera, I will photo my connection method/mods (no direct soldering in-case I have to warranty the phone for other issues). That gave me 6" pigtails of wire that I have hiding behind my cheap-o case right now waiting for proper connections (I exited through the speaker hole on the stock back cover).
Brandon314159 said:
I am curious to see what sort of 'external' packs I can come up with and likely would limit my charging rate to 1200mA or so just to keep things 'happy'. I got slapped pretty hard over at droidforums by an admin and my post removed for this same info...glad to see the community here is more accepting of my discoveries. :cyclops:
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which mod did this to u? what reason did he give to do that to u? just want to know... cuz that sounds really uncool
myfishbear said:
which mod did this to u? what reason did he give to do that to u? just want to know... cuz that sounds really uncool
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I don't wanna get anyone in trouble or piss peeps off. PM me if ya want more details.
It was pretty uncool, all things considered.
Oh well, happier here already!
you know what u should add is a resistor and a on/off toggle for safety
Brandon314159 said:
- You cannot use those pins to measure battery voltage as they are an input to the charger... IE they do not tie directly to the battery. You would have to watch the battery voltage at the screws for the battery flex-cable mount.
- There are lots of notes about the battery voltage being 'high' by peoples viewpoints. If you search around, someone explains the difference in chemistry that the Droid 4 is using and that it does have a higher Vmax during bulk/absorption charge levels. I believe the summary was that it is a non-issue. They aren't trying to 'cheat' the battery into higher voltage for more cap...it's just simply how that chemistry wants to be charged. You'll have to google around to find it.
I am curious to see what sort of 'external' packs I can come up with and likely would limit my charging rate to 1200mA or so just to keep things 'happy'. I got slapped pretty hard over at droidforums by an admin and my post removed for this same info...glad to see the community here is more accepting of my discoveries. :cyclops:
-Also, the other two pins are data lines...not sure if In/out compatible but one is Batt Temp and the other is Communication (for determining battery type). The phone doesn't like having these pins futzed with (can cause reboots/lockups) so there is clearly something on the other end...but sounds like the protection is weak regarding input into the processor/etc.
Once I have my phone near a camera, I will photo my connection method/mods (no direct soldering in-case I have to warranty the phone for other issues). That gave me 6" pigtails of wire that I have hiding behind my cheap-o case right now waiting for proper connections (I exited through the speaker hole on the stock back cover).
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Click to collapse
Very excited to see those photos. I can't imagine your post getting removed for that sort of information, that is a shame... Hardware mods are just as much fun as software mods, imho! Plus, they have the added bonus that there is a slight risk of explosion, something I err, enjoy
Brandon314159 said:
- You would have to watch the battery voltage at the screws for the battery flex-cable mount.
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Click to collapse
Drat. I really didn't want to peal off the sticker... heh, maybe I could just punch through it with the needle probes and only leave 2 tiny holes .
There are lots of notes about the battery voltage being 'high' by peoples viewpoints. If you search around, someone explains the difference in chemistry that the Droid 4 is using and that it does have a higher Vmax during bulk/absorption charge levels. I believe the summary was that it is a non-issue. They aren't trying to 'cheat' the battery into higher voltage for more cap...it's just simply how that chemistry wants to be charged. You'll have to google around to find it.
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Click to collapse
I have done a lot of googling and failed. I'm skeptical that I can't find any "new Li-ion chemistry". The only thing I did find was a pointer to an Anandtech article where the writer said he "heard" they were using a "new Li-ion chemistry" ... with no references or cites. In any event I agree it is mostly a non-issue for most everyone else. I figure they have it all designed for some target duty cycle -- probably about 1 year? maybe 2? Thing is, I plan to keep my phone for 4 or more years like all my past smart phones. The difference this time is that the battery is non-removeable (yes, I know it can be done with tools and some risk). I was hoping to find an app that would interface with the battery management and allow a configurable threshold for the "fully charged" cutoff. With a charging cutoff at about 90% I should be able to triple the life of my battery.
sigh... sorry for the hijack (but there isn't much on the actually battery operation, even around here).
Quick7135 said:
I was hoping to find an app that would interface with the battery management and allow a configurable threshold for the "fully charged" cutoff. With a charging cutoff at about 90% I should be able to triple the life of my battery.
sigh... sorry for the hijack (but there isn't much on the actually battery operation, even around here).
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drain the phone and charge it up in charging mode with the stock charger. this will calibrate your battery so it will charge to 100%
myfishbear said:
drain the phone and charge it up in charging mode with the stock charger. this will calibrate your battery so it will charge to 100%
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He wants to make it so it ONLY takes charges to 90%, to extend the duty cycle of the battery. Honestly, I would just not worry about it, and replace the battery as necessary.
Sent from my Amazon Kindle Fire using xda app-developers app
I put my reply over on this thread that you created, which seems to be more on-topic:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1856514
Cheers!
podspi said:
He wants to make it so it ONLY takes charges to 90%, to extend the duty cycle of the battery. Honestly, I would just not worry about it, and replace the battery as necessary.
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You're probably right but I'm not clear on the risks of damage to the hardware when prying out the non-replaceable battery.
Brandon314159 said:
I put my reply over on this thread that you created, which seems to be more on-topic:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1856514
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Thanks. and I do apologize (again) for the interruption here. It won't happen again.
Quick7135 said:
You're probably right but I'm not clear on the risks of damage to the hardware when prying out the non-replaceable battery.
Thanks. and I do apologize (again) for the interruption here. It won't happen again.
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I'd think you'd be at higher risk of damage playing with the software/firmware interface that controls battery charging than doing an actual battery swap.
It appears to be pretty easy: http://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/Motorola-Droid-4-Teardown/7759/1
No worries on cross posting...just figured better to keep it all over there where there is already a few replies on-topic.
Cheers,
BTW noticed today that the phone says "Charging - Connected to an inductive charging mat" when you connect up power to the back.
I will try to get a shot of the connection when I get home.
My USB port broke... would you think this would charge a completely dead battery.. thank you kindly for your time...
update this will charge a completely dead battery... took an OEM charger cut it open used the red and black... worked perfectly...
why do they call it common sense when only a few people have it...
Got it from eBay.
Charges faster in phone...while using!
If battery is around 40% it being be charged overnight.
Anyone else experience this?
could be the amp? maybe below 1 amp? Samsung charger has 2amps om it. check your charger and look for the amp. btw. the lower the amp the better for your battery..
Buy an OEM charger. The Samsung one is $50 from Samsung website but you can get the Asus charger from Google play store for $25. Both are two ampbi believe. Or you can get the 1a for $25 from samsung. Getting OEM directly from an OEM or authorized reseller or a storefront lime Google is key. Getting cheap chargers is gonna bite you in the ass one day or think about it like this. Why keep wasting time buying cheap chargers again and again when you can put up proper money and get quality in one go and have peace of mind for a few years. I even stopped buying chargers from amazon because they're just cheap knockoffs too. Phi hong makes good chargers and power supplies but they are harder to source. Phi hong came with my nexus one andy galaxy nexus OEM Home dock.
Anyways, aside from that part of the reason for slow charging is you probably have an unsafe charger that is not rated what it really is and is made of poor materials. Getting a quality 1a or higher, preferably 2a in this case and your gnote2 should charge @ 1.8a. In other words, you can charge from zero to full in ~2-2.5 hours. Or from partially full to 100% in less than 2 easily.
Sent from my GT-N7100
Unless I am mistaken, OP is referring to battery chargers, not usb chargers. That's how I charge mine, too. I have spare batteries, and they all get charged directly. When my battery is low, I just swap. I hate having my phone attached to a cord, even at night.
Yes, all the battery chargers I've had for every device (including this one) have been lower amp than the usb chargers supplied with the phone. It is especially slow for this huge battery for the Note 2. While it bothers me in concept, it's never actually been an issue for me, so I haven't done anything about it. I don't know if higher amp battery chargers are available, but I don't feel like spending extra money on one.
As far as battery health goes, charging at a lower amperage certainly isn't hurting the battery. If anything, it's actually better for it.
Yes...charging just the battery with wall charger.
@ 40% it will not be charged at 6am when I wake!!!
Are there better wall chargers?
Why do you hate having your phone attached to a Cord overnight. I heard that's fine and do it every night.!
dan_tm said:
Unless I am mistaken, OP is referring to battery chargers, not usb chargers. That's how I charge mine, too. I have spare batteries, and they all get charged directly. When my battery is low, I just swap. I hate having my phone attached to a cord, even at night.
Yes, all the battery chargers I've had for every device (including this one) have been lower amp than the usb chargers supplied with the phone. It is especially slow for this huge battery for the Note 2. While it bothers me in concept, it's never actually been an issue for me, so I haven't done anything about it. I don't know if higher amp battery chargers are available, but I don't feel like spending extra money on one.
As far as battery health goes, charging at a lower amperage certainly isn't hurting the battery. If anything, it's actually better for it.
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rockky said:
Why do you hate having your phone attached to a Cord overnight. I heard that's fine and do it every night.!
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Not for the phone, for me. It just bothers me having a wireless device locked to a wall. There's no reason for it. And I frequently get up in the night for various reasons (kids, work, insomnia, etc), and it bugs me unplugging in the middle of a charge cycle.
Incidentally, a non-removable battery was a deal breaker, and one of the reasons I didn't get a Nexus 4. I got used to never plugging in my last phone, and I don't want to go back. It was torture the first week or two with the N2 before my spare batteries arrived.
The charger should have its output printed on it, I've had a look at the pics on ebay and the first two I found that I could read were 500mA and 350mA, the original charger is 2A or 2000mA. Samsung make there own battery charger http://www.samsung.com/au/consumer/...es/EB-H1J9VNEGSTD?subsubtype=other-multimedia the output is 1.7A so much closer to the original usb charger.
I'd be worried about my back cover getting loose doing what you do. I had three batteries for my old phone, but I did not swap them on a daily basis, just when travelling or away from power for an extended time. I've ordered some wireless chargers so I can have one by my bed and another downstairs. I know they only output 500mA too, but for an overnight charge thats fine for me. I dont think there is any issue with interrupting the charge cycle, the two main enemies of lithium batteries are heat and being totally/almost discharged on a regular basis. Its best to keep them topped up.
scote said:
The charger should have its output printed on it, I've had a look at the pics on ebay and the first two I found that I could read were 500mA and 350mA, the original charger is 2A or 2000mA. Samsung make there own battery charger http://www.samsung.com/au/consumer/...es/EB-H1J9VNEGSTD?subsubtype=other-multimedia the output is 1.7A so much closer to the original usb charger.
I'd be worried about my back cover getting loose doing what you do. I had three batteries for my old phone, but I did not swap them on a daily basis, just when travelling or away from power for an extended time. I've ordered some wireless chargers so I can have one by my bed and another downstairs. I know they only output 500mA too, but for an overnight charge thats fine for me. I dont think there is any issue with interrupting the charge cycle, the two main enemies of lithium batteries are heat and being totally/almost discharged on a regular basis. Its best to keep them topped up.
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It looks like the OEM battery charger is available on ebay for around $15. That's good to know in case mine ever crap out on me. These cheapies that I get tend to.
As far as the back cover getting loose, after 3 months, it is a little bit looser than when it was new. 1.5 years with my G2x didn't loosen it at all, but the build quality on that thing was fantastic. I keep this in a case anyway, so it being a little looser goes unnoticed. If it gets bad, back cover replacements are cheap.
If one of the devs can make the kernel capable of fastcharge, it would not take but half the time to charge. Yank who is working with Faux on his kernel, helped make the kernel fast charge capable.
Sent from my SGH-T889 using xda app-developers app
UnixSlayer said:
If one of the devs can make the kernel capable of fastcharge, it would not take but half the time to charge. Yank who is working with Faux on his kernel, helped make the kernel fast charge capable.
Sent from my SGH-T889 using xda app-developers app
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But what is the point of having it charge fast, when all it is is going to drain faster?
I charge mine overnight with a charger rated at 750mah I believe and it last me a whole day. As oppose to using a 2.1 am charger I have, where the battery percentage would start dropping by the first hour.
Correct me if I am wrong here, but this is what I've notice with my last few phones.
The Perseus kernel with stweaks has the ability to change the charging parameters.
With it overclocked/undervolted I am getting better life than I did on stock.
Not for sure what you mean as it depleting the charge faster on a higher amperage charger. Kind of sounds like you may have had failing batteries, etc.
There seem to be a few misunderstandings here regarding batteries and chargers.
1) The charge rate, when the battery is in the phone, is controlled BY the phone. The charger itself just supplies regulated power to the phone. How much current is put into the battery at any given time is up to the phone, which is why kernels can do things like fast charge, it's controlled by the kernel. Now, the reason the battery charges faster when using the stock charger vs. something lower current or a computer is simple. The phone can detect what it's connected to within some limitations. It sounds like our phone can also sense the incoming voltage levels and back off if the supply becomes unstable.
2) Using the stock 2A charger is "harder" on the battery than a lower current charger. Not true, at least not within any margin of error you will be able to detect without specialized equipment. Lipo batteries are generally built to charge/discharge at 1C. C in this case stands for capacity. So our 3100mah batteries can charge at 3.1Amp and be within safety margin. So the 2Amp charger the phone comes with is perfectly fine for the battery. Without seeing a datasheet for the battery from Samsung, that's a good guess. And again, the phone controls the charge current based on a number of parameters. You could connect the phone to a 5V supply capable of 100Amp and it will still only use what it needs.
3) The percentage readout on the phone screen is a GUESS. Don't pay it too much attention. For this same reason, evaluating 3rd party batteries based on phone runtime etc is not useful. To validate the battery capacity with any accuracy requires a test setup discharging the battery through a known load and measuring how long it takes to get to a cutoff voltage. I've done some of these tests myself on stock and 3rd party batteries. In general, the OEM batteries are always at or above spec, the 3rd party battery manufacturers lie. Often by upward of 20%. Even the high $ batteries. Keep that in mind when shopping if you want extras or extended batteries.
4) Interrupting the charge cycle is bad. Nope. It's fine. On this same line of thought, full cycles ARE bad. Don't do it. Don't think too much about it either though. Just plug it in when convenient. Or set it on the wireless charger if you've installed one. Generally speaking, they actually don't like to be charged to 100% either. Keeping it at 20%-80% is actually best for the longevity of the battery cell itself. In practice, you will probably have a new phone before any of this is actually noticeable.
The OP sounds like they are talking about a stand-alone charger, where the battery is not in the phone. Those will vary wildly in quality and capability, particularly from ebay. They are probably cheap POS devices. Not that that's really a bad thing, just know about it. It's probably a very low charge rate device, perhaps even down to 100ma or so. That would take forever to charge our larger batteries. As for if there is a better one, probably. If Samsung makes one, it will probably charge faster than the phone with the provided charger plug as there would be no load from the phone using power. Of course, it will cost a lot more as well. Look for devices that at least claim they will charge at 2Amp or so. In practice, they will probably be a lot lower, but your chances are improved. Not many people will break out an ammeter and check, after all.
UnixSlayer said:
If one of the devs can make the kernel capable of fastcharge, it would not take but half the time to charge. Yank who is working with Faux on his kernel, helped make the kernel fast charge capable.
Sent from my SGH-T889 using xda app-developers app
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Click to collapse
Perseus kernal has fast charging settings.
What ttabbal wrote is mostly correct. But the problem lies within some input voltage protection logic tied to the charger chip of the phone which is extremely (and too much so) sensitive.
rsalan said:
Perseus kernal has fast charging settings.
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Can people stop calling it fast-charge, it's an idiotic term which technically means nothing. While most kernels have some sort of charging speed configuration options, they're all useless in regard to this problem as the current in the end is decided by a different logic. You'll have to disable unstable power detection and that's the only way to make it work and fix the problem, unless you go hunting down high quality cables and chargers.
Personally I also encountered the problem as my stock S3 charger, as many others here have reported, has deteriorated and it would only charge at an effective 300mA. I disabled unstable power detection and now it charges at the full given current limits, without any issues.
rockky said:
Got it from eBay.
Charges faster in phone...while using!
If battery is around 40% it being be charged overnight.
Anyone else experience this?
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You have to make sure it's "2a" charger capacity. It happened to me once. Go to monoprice.com and search for a universal 2a charger... pretty cheap
So, I'm nervous about the fact that I can't replace the battery on my ONE. So far every night I've been staying up late until the phone dies, then plugging it in, waiting til the light stops flashing, then powering it up to charge while on overnight.
Problem is, this phone has awesome battery life. Right now at 10.30pm, I'm sitting at 41%, and debating just leaving it unplugged all night.
So what's the deal with memory on these batteries? How much, say over a 2 yr span, will charging a non-drained battery shorten its lifespan or lessen its capacity?
Sent from my HTCONE using xda app-developers app
MadDogMaddux said:
So what's the deal with memory on these batteries? How much, say over a 2 yr span, will charging a non-drained battery shorten its lifespan or lessen its capacity?
Sent from my HTCONE using xda app-developers app
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Click to collapse
Lithium ion batteries are awesome. They are lighter, smaller and do not suffer from "memory effect."
Do not drain then fully recharge this phone on a regular basis. That will accelerate capacitance loss. Keep it charged as much as possible, avoid fast charging, try to use your PC to charge it overnight. Do not leave it charging for too long (i.e. days on end). Though on board computers can refuse charging, it is best to stay on the safe side.
2 years, you will definitely notice a decrease in battery life, but by the time it becomes intolerable, you will have upgraded. I can almost guarantee that.
EDIT: Please add to/refute any statements I made if you have greater knowledge on this subject, people.
Thanks! Can you explain why using mr PC to charge is better?
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MadDogMaddux said:
Thanks! Can you explain why using mr PC to charge is better?
Sent from my HTCONE using xda app-developers app
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Because it's a slower charge at a lower amp rating prolongs battery life by not boiling the cells
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customhdrider said:
Because it's a slower charge at a lower amp rating prolongs battery life by not boiling the cells
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Click to collapse
Gottit. Thanks!
No problem,glad I could shed some light on the subject
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MadDogMaddux said:
So, I'm nervous about the fact that I can't replace the battery on my ONE. So far every night I've been staying up late until the phone dies, then plugging it in, waiting til the light stops flashing, then powering it up to charge while on overnight.
Problem is, this phone has awesome battery life. Right now at 10.30pm, I'm sitting at 41%, and debating just leaving it unplugged all night.
So what's the deal with memory on these batteries? How much, say over a 2 yr span, will charging a non-drained battery shorten its lifespan or lessen its capacity?
Sent from my HTCONE using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As was previously noted, what you're doing is actually the worst possible thing you can do to a lithium ion battery. In general, best practice is to keep your battery somewhere between 10%-95% charge whenever possible. Once a month, you should "cycle" your battery under 10% (but not fully drained) to keep everything in peak condition. If you're ever not going to use the phone for any length of time, best practice is to drain to 40% and store in a cool, dark area.
When you first get a new device, you do want to condition it by doing three to five (varies on the device) full charge/discharge cycles, but after that, once a month with a conditioning cycle will take care of things for you. And again, as was previously noted, it's not a great idea to leave your phone charging overnight because you can't always depend on the battery controller chip.
These newer cells are all rated to relatively high cycle lifetimes, so I wouldn't worry overmuch. At that point, capacity is supposed to start degrading, although naturally it's going to happen a bit earlier for any number of reasons. I'd be much more worried about avoiding heat though than overcharge.
I'm assuming charging it slowly would keep it slightly cooler than a wall socket and closer to room temp, the better.
There is probably some other reason, but I'm not the person to ask. you can do some independent research. :good:
Just charge your phone when it needs it and don't when it doesn't. Do that and you'll be good until you upgrade no problem.
EDIT: Oh, beat me to it... haha
EDIT: Also, does the 40% apply to phones? Mobile devices never really turn off, they just go into deep sleep, I'm told. I was going to say that too, but then I remembered this. Does the 40% rule apply to non-removable batteries?
sauprankul said:
I'm assuming charging it slowly would keep it slightly cooler than a wall socket and closer to room temp, the better.
There is probably some other reason, but I'm not the person to ask. you can do some independent research. :good:
Just charge your phone when it needs it and don't when it doesn't. Do that and you'll be good until you upgrade no problem.
EDIT: Oh, beat me to it... haha
EDIT: Also, does the 40% apply to phones? Mobile devices never really turn off, they just go into deep sleep, I'm told. I was going to say that too, but then I remembered this. Does the 40% rule apply to non-removable batteries?
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It's a question of how much voltage you're chucking into the battery. If you use a low-voltage wall adapter it'll be the same as if you were charging from your PC.
The 40% rule applies to any battery, and they'll all discharge over time anyway (connected or no). If you shut your phone off, everything powers down except (if memory serves) what's necessary to run the internal clock. The impact that has should be pretty minimal (unless you're trying to bury your One for a thousand years, in which case...can't help you there).
Rirere said:
It's a question of how much voltage you're chucking into the battery. If you use a low-voltage wall adapter it'll be the same as if you were charging from your PC.
(unless you're trying to bury your One for a thousand years, in which case...can't help you there).
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Who would buy a low voltage wall adapter?
And yes, I would like to bury my One safely for a thousand years, so when it is found by the generation of humadroids, they will see it and be amazed that a civilization so primitive could achieve such technological mastery.
sauprankul said:
Who would buy a low voltage wall adapter?
And yes, I would like to bury my One safely for a thousand years, so when it is found by the generation of humadroids, they will see it and be amazed that a civilization so primitive could achieve such technological mastery.
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Click to collapse
I don't know that I bought any, but I have a few lying around from yesteryear's gadgetry.
And at that point, why not launch it into space instead, a la HTC Nexus One?
So I use my phone as my alarm clock and also run the Relax and Sleep app all night. Otherwise I'd just plug it into my lappy throughout the day and not worry about it.
But that raises another question: running the phone overnight while charging it at the same time. Bad juju?
I plugged into my lappy last night around midnight, woke up this morning and had about 95% charge, rather than the usual 100%. I'm assuming this is the result of power output for Relax and Sleep cutting int power input from charging.
I've also been in the habit of leaving my EVO 4G plugged in while tethering. I assume this is also a bad plan?
Sent from my HTCONE using xda app-developers app
sauprankul said:
Lithium ion batteries are awesome. They are lighter, smaller and do not suffer from "memory effect."
Do not drain then fully recharge this phone on a regular basis. That will accelerate capacitance loss. Keep it charged as much as possible, avoid fast charging, try to use your PC to charge it overnight. Do not leave it charging for too long (i.e. days on end). Though on board computers can refuse charging, it is best to stay on the safe side.
2 years, you will definitely notice a decrease in battery life, but by the time it becomes intolerable, you will have upgraded. I can almost guarantee that.
EDIT: Please add to/refute any statements I made if you have greater knowledge on this subject, people.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
MOST of this advice is 100% true.
The only part that is not correct information is the advice to not let it die. It is perfectly OK to do this as long as you don't deep discharge the battery... Example like let it die then not charge it for like a week or something.
The science behind this is the fact that lithium ion batteries actually have a nominal voltage operating range which is like 3.2 - 4.3 volts or something like that. Your device is designed to shut itself down when it gets to about 3.5... This is done to protect the battery from deep discharge cycles.
Letting it die is perfectly alright. Just make sure you charge it soon after.
Also, you don't need to use your PC to charge it. That is in no way necessary. Your device came with a wall charger for a reason...
There are safety features built into the kernel and cable to keep you from damaging the device during charge. Use the wall.. It is perfectly safe and faster / more practical.
MadDogMaddux said:
So I use my phone as my alarm clock and also run the Relax and Sleep app all night. Otherwise I'd just plug it into my lappy throughout the day and not worry about it.
But that raises another question: running the phone overnight while charging it at the same time. Bad juju?
I plugged into my lappy last night around midnight, woke up this morning and had about 95% charge, rather than the usual 100%. I'm assuming this is the result of power output for Relax and Sleep cutting int power input from charging.
I've also been in the habit of leaving my EVO 4G plugged in while tethering. I assume this is also a bad plan?
Sent from my HTCONE using xda app-developers app
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Click to collapse
Your battery will automatically cycle between 95%-99.9999% to prevent overcharge, so you're fine on this front. You probably just caught it on the low end of the cycle.
The issue with charging + tethering is that a phone draws more power when plugged in (ramping up processor, etc.), and tethering eats a lot of power. More importantly, both charging the battery and running the antennas for tethering generate a lot of heat. So long as you watch your battery temp (most good tethering apps will toss in a temperature gauge, although if you're using stock you'll need another solution), you should be fine, but heat is one of the fastest ways to kill a Li-ion battery.
Admiral Sir Manley Power said:
MOST of this advice is 100% true.
The only part that is not correct information is the advice to not let it die. It is perfectly OK to do this as long as you don't deep discharge the battery... Example like let it die then not charge it for like a week or something.
The science behind this is the fact that lithium ion batteries actually have a nominal voltage operating range which is like 3.2 - 4.3 volts or something like that. Your device is designed to shut itself down when it gets to about 3.5... This is done to protect the battery from deep discharge cycles.
Letting it die is perfectly alright. Just make sure you charge it soon after.
Also, you don't need to use your PC to charge it. That is in no way necessary. Your device came with a wall charger for a reason...
There are safety features built into the kernel and cable to keep you from damaging the device during charge. Use the wall.. It is perfectly safe and faster / more practical.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Although a full normal discharge (phone powering off) won't kill your battery in one go, it's a deeper discharge than I would recommend on a regular basis. Things are built with margins of safety, but I don't like playing on the edge when I can avoid it. The difference between 10%-15% isn't too much either when it comes to my use-case either, so I'm content to bounce between 20/30-95 most of the time.
Rirere said:
Your battery will automatically cycle between 95%-99.9999% to prevent overcharge, so you're fine on this front. You probably just caught it on the low end of the cycle.
The issue with charging + tethering is that a phone draws more power when plugged in (ramping up processor, etc.), and tethering eats a lot of power. More importantly, both charging the battery and running the antennas for tethering generate a lot of heat. So long as you watch your battery temp (most good tethering apps will toss in a temperature gauge, although if you're using stock you'll need another solution), you should be fine, but heat is one of the fastest ways to kill a Li-ion battery.
Although a full normal discharge (phone powering off) won't kill your battery in one go, it's a deeper discharge than I would recommend on a regular basis. Things are built with margins of safety, but I don't like playing on the edge when I can avoid it. The difference between 10%-15% isn't too much either when it comes to my use-case either, so I'm content to bounce between 20/30-95 most of the time.
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Click to collapse
That is certainly a good point as well. No need to play on the edge of the cliffs. lol
You see my point tho
About safety margins
I always charge my phones overnight when I go to bed. Not that it takes that long for a battery to charge, it's just when it's convenient. And I'm sure I'm not the only one who does this.
My question is if the Turbo Charger that comes with the phone will hurt the battery long term if I keep it plugged in all night. Or is is smart enough to shut off and/or lower it's power draw from the wall. I know a lot of people have hypothesized that the battery will have a shorter life cycle with the abuse the Turbo Charger will deliver time and time again.
Can't answer your question specifically, but read where the phone fast charges up until a certain percentage is left. I'm thinking that it fast charges up to 75 or 80%, then reverts to the regular slow charge.
Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk
Kayak83 said:
I always charge my phones overnight when I go to bed. Not that it takes that long for a battery to charge, it's just when it's convenient. And I'm sure I'm not the only one who does this.
My question is if the Turbo Charger that comes with the phone will hurt the battery long term if I keep it plugged in all night. Or is is smart enough to shut off and/or lower it's power draw from the wall. I know a lot of people have hypothesized that the battery will have a shorter life cycle with the abuse the Turbo Charger will deliver time and time again.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Going forward, a huge number of phones are going to support Snapdragons Quick charge technology, the turbo is not the first nor will it be the last that will have this feature. I am no expert on this, but I HIGHLY doubt that Moto (and all of the other companies that will be supporting this technology) would package a charger with a phone and advertise this feature if it has the possibility of damaging the battery.
I plug my phone in every night like you, personally I am not going to worry about it. I think a lot of people charge their phones when they go to bed as well, I have to imagine the engineers thought this one through.
Manjews said:
Going forward, a huge number of phones are going to support Snapdragons Quick charge technology, the turbo is not the first nor will it be the last that will have this feature. I am no expert on this, but I HIGHLY doubt that Moto (and all of the other companies that will be supporting this technology) would package a charger with a phone and advertise this feature if it has the possibility of damaging the battery.
I plug my phone in every night like you, personally I am not going to worry about it. I think a lot of people charge their phones when they go to bed as well, I have to imagine the engineers thought this one through.
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Click to collapse
Kayak83 said:
I always charge my phones overnight when I go to bed. Not that it takes that long for a battery to charge, it's just when it's convenient. And I'm sure I'm not the only one who does this.
My question is if the Turbo Charger that comes with the phone will hurt the battery long term if I keep it plugged in all night. Or is is smart enough to shut off and/or lower it's power draw from the wall. I know a lot of people have hypothesized that the battery will have a shorter life cycle with the abuse the Turbo Charger will deliver time and time again.
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Click to collapse
I'm agree in the part that I highly doubt that companies put harmful accessories with their products, it won't make any sense.
frankeegee said:
Can't answer your question specifically, but read where the phone fast charges up until a certain percentage is left. I'm thinking that it fast charges up to 75 or 80%, then reverts to the regular slow charge.
Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk
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I noted that the phone gets real hot when charging until 80%, and then it starts to cool down, maybe is because of what you said.
I plan on using a regular charger for overnight, and keep my turbo charger at work for my long shifts. Just in case.
Sent from my SCH-I535 using XDA Free mobile app
I have been using the turbo charger daily since the release. I too have my phone charge overnight with it and haven't encountered any negative effects or problems at all. The phone cools down for me after 60%. This cpu and charger are intelligent in handling the voltage and what not to not harm battery. If it was harmful then qualcomm wouldn't be inputing so much research and tests to have a stable version of quick charge. Keep that in mind too
Been using quick charging for 6 months including plugging in overnight while breaking every rule about charging batteries with no noticeable losses. As stated quick charging only goes at full speed during the first part of the charge, 70 percent is often mentioned. In practice the full charge phase is dependent on battery temp which is monitored per cell and other factors. I recall reading that such charging has a theoretical perfect world capability of charging 1amp in 6 minutes and we are nowhere near that. There is a lot of research and testing in quicker charging methodology and it has been in use in other areas for several years, I'm thinking there isn't much to be concerned over in any aspect of it.
Edit, just an FYI... My Oppo charger works on the Maxx and the Maxx charger works on the Find 7, I get full speed with either charger on either device. I have one of the Verizon car quick chargers and I can confirm it also works on both devices and charges full speed. Nice to know we can do some mix and match on these.
Hello
Bit of random one but can I charge my nexus 6 with a normal charger say my old Samsung s4 charger?
Don't want to damage my battery or phone but can't see why it would but would rather check.
I'm guessing it will just take longer to charge?
Cheers lee
leekeene said:
Hello
Bit of random one but can I charge my nexus 6 with a normal charger say my old Samsung s4 charger?
Don't want to damage my battery or phone but can't see why it would but would rather check.
I'm guessing it will just take longer to charge?
Cheers lee
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
sure, you can use any compatible charger. but to warn you, most normal phone chargers will just take MUCH longer to charge the n6.
Yea no worries on the time. Thinking slower charge over night might be better than leaving it plugged in fully charged for longer. Plus I'm a believer about running battery flat for the first few charges and only have a normal charger at work which is when it will run out next lol
leekeene said:
Yea no worries on the time. Thinking slower charge over night might be better than leaving it plugged in fully charged for longer. Plus I'm a believer about running battery flat for the first few charges and only have a normal charger at work which is when it will run out next lol
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Click to collapse
1) You *cannot* run the battery flat. The battery chip WILL shut you down when the voltage drops below a certain threshold.
2) Li-ion batteries DO NOT do well with being deep cycled. The lower you let it drop, the shorter the battery life. This is one of the reasons why they shut you down before it goes flat.
3) The battery has to have a minimum voltage in order to power the circuit that controls charging. Yes, if the battery level drops too low, YOU CAN'T EVEN RECHARGE IT.
It is better for the battery to charge slowly, and to top up frequently.