Database Develop

NO ICS For Us :(

Just checked the updated Motorola page... looks like this device is stuck at android 2.3 forever.
That really sucks, it's gotta be the 512mb memory that's in the device. I knew that would possibly be an issue when I first got the phone. Maybe we can put more pressure on moto to unlock our bootloader so we can get a fully functional ICS (even if it's hacked) on our devices.
Check the link:
http://forums.motorola.com/pages/00add97d6c

PFFFFFFFFFFFFF

I just saw this as well, very disappointing. I wish they would open up development to the community on devices they no longer plan on upgrading/supporting. I know it will never happen...but I can dream

Droid4 and Bionic get the ICS
maybe Hashcode or some one try to do what he can, and pull out from this phones something for us and for CM9 on D3

niko99 said:
Droid4 and Bionic get the ICS
maybe Hashcode or some one try to do what he can, and pull out from this phones something for us and for CM9 on D3
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just got a response back from hash regarding this on twitter:
" @danifunker @dhacker29 I have 1 more trick up my sleeve for the D3. And if that doesnt work, then ill drop back to cm7.2 or something. "
Let's hope the tweak works out... but either way I think I could live with CM 7.2, although I would REALLY love running ICS on this phone.

What ever happened to Kexec for the D3? I'll sacrifice a core for a new kernel that could even OC that one to 1.2.

I started to believe that motorola doesn't want anyone to buy motorola products.

calash said:
I just saw this as well, very disappointing. I wish they would open up development to the community on devices they no longer plan on upgrading/supporting. I know it will never happen...but I can dream
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Click to collapse
Sure would be nice if they would just open up phones when they started considering them legacy devices. Other than 4G which I don't particularly need anyway, the D3 is a great phone that could keep going for a long, long time just like my D1 did (I skipped the D2 and went directly from 1 to 3).
Part of the reason the D1 lasted me so long was that I could keep getting updates for it from Cyanogen. In fact I still have it. Though its no longer on the Vzw network I can test various things on it like security software, remote wipes etc over WiFi.
Verizon is probably against unlocking the D3 because they don't want to have the support issues and that's probably why we will never see it. How many people on these forums do you hear about that are constantly returning/exchanging phones that they have managed to kill through tweaking? Then its those same people who complain the loudest when the Motorola and the carriers won't unlock the phones. So, while I wish it was not so, we will probably never see them unlocked unless someone finds a way to hack them. Motorola isn't going to help and particularly VZW is not going to help.

danifunker said:
Just checked the updated Motorola page... looks like this device is stuck at android 2.3 forever.
That really sucks, it's gotta be the 512mb memory that's in the device. I knew that would possibly be an issue when I first got the phone. Maybe we can put more pressure on moto to unlock our bootloader so we can get a fully functional ICS (even if it's hacked) on our devices.
Check the link:
http://forums.motorola.com/pages/00add97d6c
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
HTC just released the HTC Desire C with a 600Mhz processor and 512MB ram. It runs Android 4.0
If they can do it with that, surely Motorola can too

ChristianPreachr said:
HTC just released the HTC Desire C with a 600Mhz processor and 512MB ram. It runs Android 4.0
If they can do it with that, surely Motorola can too
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Click to collapse
It's possible that the HVGA screen on that device needs far less memory - HVGA is 480x320 which is 70% less pixels to push than the qHD on the Droid 3. Also, Moto is pretty terrible at software, Blur runs a lot slower and chews up a lot more memory than a lot of its competitors.
What Moto should do is release a plain vanilla, non-blur ICS as an optional upgrade. I have to think that would take a minimal amount of time to port vanilla ICS to the Droid 3 if there is no need to get it working with Blur - just need the drivers which should be substantially similar to Droid 4.
---------- Post added at 05:22 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:18 PM ----------
ratman6161 said:
Sure would be nice if they would just open up phones when they started considering them legacy devices. Other than 4G which I don't particularly need anyway, the D3 is a great phone that could keep going for a long, long time just like my D1 did (I skipped the D2 and went directly from 1 to 3).
Part of the reason the D1 lasted me so long was that I could keep getting updates for it from Cyanogen. In fact I still have it. Though its no longer on the Vzw network I can test various things on it like security software, remote wipes etc over WiFi.
Verizon is probably against unlocking the D3 because they don't want to have the support issues and that's probably why we will never see it. How many people on these forums do you hear about that are constantly returning/exchanging phones that they have managed to kill through tweaking? Then its those same people who complain the loudest when the Motorola and the carriers won't unlock the phones. So, while I wish it was not so, we will probably never see them unlocked unless someone finds a way to hack them. Motorola isn't going to help and particularly VZW is not going to help.
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Click to collapse
Couldn't they just do what HTC did - online based bootloader unlock tool, which builds a list of unlocked IMEIs which are then voided of their warranty, and people calling for support will be checked against this list. Of course, the most enterprising guys with bricked phones will try to change their IMEI sticker, but that wouldn't match their Verizon account records.

This is so sad... Cant believe that Dual Core Processor phone is not eligable to receive Ice Cream Sandwich... Media shall be contacted, so they could make fun from Motorola... I'm never going to buy Motorola products again.. Ever.

Rlin5741 said:
What Moto should do is release a plain vanilla, non-blur ICS as an optional upgrade. I have to think that would take a minimal amount of time to port vanilla ICS to the Droid 3 if there is no need to get it working with Blur - just need the drivers which should be substantially similar to Droid 4.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Im pretty sure all we need is a compatible kernel and hashcode will take care of the rest. If Motorola could do that, it can extend the life of our phones.
Sent from my XT860 running ICS

Time to do some more Facebook trolling, I may even make an account over on the Motorola forums and do some spamming/trolling.
In July 2011 when I bought my phone there were 2 new Motorola smartphones out there the Droid 3 and Droid X2. Both had dual core processors and felt mid-high end at the time. But somehow an Android OS upgrade that was released less than 6 months after the Droid 3 was released is skipped by Motorola.
This was my first Android phone and I bought it because I wanted a keyboard and really liked the feel of a friends OG Droid. The OG was probably built better but I have still been mostly satisfied with the Droid 3 hardware wise. But I just can't see myself buying another Motorola device. I will have to see what is out there in 2013 when I upgrade, hopefully some nice QWERTY non Motorola devices.

Damn it Verizon
This is the Fourth phone that I've had from Verizon that has been abandoned before the end of it's life cycle. Although I am sure this is Motorola's fault I will curse Verizon for all time and remember to get the latest and greatest for top dollar right off the bat to ensure that I will get updates when dealing with a cell phone company or maybe get a landline and tell jerks like Verizon to stick it where the sun don't shine. The real pisser is that I am finding this out the day after I spent the money that could have been used to buy out my contract. Color me angry and frustrated.
I'm going to start reading up about custom roms for this phone I might as well since support is all but gone from this model.

Return the phone and tell them you want out. Can be done.
Sent from my DROID3 using xda premium

spunker88 said:
Time to do some more Facebook trolling, I may even make an account over on the Motorola forums and do some spamming/trolling.
In July 2011 when I bought my phone there were 2 new Motorola smartphones out there the Droid 3 and Droid X2. Both had dual core processors and felt mid-high end at the time. But somehow an Android OS upgrade that was released less than 6 months after the Droid 3 was released is skipped by Motorola.
This was my first Android phone and I bought it because I wanted a keyboard and really liked the feel of a friends OG Droid. The OG was probably built better but I have still been mostly satisfied with the Droid 3 hardware wise. But I just can't see myself buying another Motorola device. I will have to see what is out there in 2013 when I upgrade, hopefully some nice QWERTY non Motorola devices.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Please don't troll that forum. The mods there aren't actualy affiliated with moto like you think.
I did some of this back in the day about the d2 and learned the hard way.
Sent from my DROID3 using xda premium

[Q] Now that we have leaked ICS, what does that mean for CM9/AOKP Roms?

I am not very phone savy, so please bear with me. I only ask to expand my knowledge, and I hope that my asking questions and learning doesnt offend the "Gurus". If it does, please feel free to flame.
I currently own a droid 3, running AOKP.
Now that the ICS leak has happened for the droid 4, I am considering upgrading to the Droid 4. I kicked myself when the D4 was announced, realizing I should not have bought my Droid 3, the 512 mb of ram and the lack of LTE.... >.< So, Grand ma offered me use of her upgrade for $100, plus $100 for the Droid 4 on Amazon, I could reasonably get the awesomeness that is the D4. I just want some info before I purchase it. (I welcome any input about this decision also)
Now that ya'll have a functional kernel with HW acceleration, video camera, and evil BLUR, how much work will it be to create custom roms based upon this? Is the Droid 4 likely to see AOKP/CM9 soon with fully functional video cameras?
My favorite things about AOKP on my D3 is that I have the "Octo" lock screen, which I love. I have spell check, (I believe this is built into ICS) which makes me look 1,000,000 times less stupid, and I have volume key music control. I realized that until a custom Rom for the D4 is released, one that has the custom lock-screens and the music controls, I wont be able to as efficiently control my phone. So, maybe the D4 isnt exactly what I need yet.
I also then wonder if 6 months after getting the D4 I will be trying to run Jelly Bean, and once again have no functional video camera, complaining I need the D5 or some nonsense. >.<

Hey, I'm in the same boat as you, but why don't you check out the buy and sell section of this website? I just picked up a droid 4 for around 300, no contract ;-)
Regarding your question about about the leaked roms, hashcode will need to build separate cm9/aokp builds that indicate ics-leaked in order for us to get full functionality on ICS. We also need safestrap2 in order to use custom roms on the leaked icss builds.
When upgrading your D4 to ICS, be sure to use the prescribed method on this forum in order to keep root. I don't think there is a way to get root back yet in the ics builds yet.
Hashcode recently got his d4 so we should be seeing some progress soon.
Sent from my A100 using Tapatalk 2

Question about Droid 4 development

This is a general question from me trying to understand things better. Before the D4 I had a samsung stratosphere. Completely unlocked bootloader with full capability to flash custom ROM/kernel images. Despite this no AOSP ROMs could be build due to lack of driver sources. It was the same situation with the Epic 4G. The Droid 4 on the other hand had the bootloader locked with the key thrown away. Despite this CM9 and other AOSP ROMs are up and nearly fully operational, even with ICS booting on GB kernels. What makes this possible on D4 but not the stratosphere?
My guess is that driver software is available for the D4. This is due to the fact that Motorola uses parts from other OEMs (TI CPU ect) with public drivers. Samsung on the other hand uses their own proprietary parts and keeps the drivers private. Is this an accurate assessment?
It would seem then that the most important thing to making development possible for a phone (apart from popularity) is driver availability, NOT whether or not the bootloader is unlocked. Is that true? Regardless, I will probably steer clear of samsung for future android purchases. HTC still seems best and motorola acceptable. If only HTC still made high end QWERTYs.

Usually devs just pull the proprietary files off the phone and use it in the compile/builds. This has been going on for Motorola phones since the original Droid.
Sounds like no one invested in seeing what proprietary files were needed from the Stratosphere or Epic 4G.
Public AOSP code mixed with copying in private/proprietary files is how most ROMs are made. The higher the user base of a device, the higher the development activity and the larger number of devs finding out what all is needed to be pulled from the stock device to compile a fully functional ROM.
Since some proprietary files are used....you need them for the same version OS you are building, ie...use stock phones ICS drivers for ICS builds or stock phones GB drivers for Gingerbread builds. You can sometimes hack drivers to work but with lots of limitations. Also drivers depend on the kernel so a matching kernel is needed......requiring the device to have the needed kernel level or an unlocked bootloader to be able to replace the stock kernel.

We wont be seeing an unlocked bootloader? Ever?
Sent from my DROID4 using xda premium

twizzles said:
We wont be seeing an unlocked bootloader? Ever?
Sent from my DROID4 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
All signs point to no...we will never see an unlocked bootloader on the current Motorola devices.
With Google owning Motorola Mobility and already replacing MM CEO with one of their own from Google........it's possible future devices may be unlock capable.
Current devices....no, not ever.
The first locked bootloader on a Motorola droid was the Droid 2. It still has not been unlocked, hacked, cracked, etc... How long has it been out?
Motorola released a special Razr Dev model with an unlockable bootloader...retail price, zero warranty, nothing you do on it would transfer over to the normal Razr or Razr Maxx.......so why would anyone buy it? Great PR for them to say "see..we released an unlockable device and no one bought it".

Well that just sucks. Thank you for the info
Sent from my DROID4 using xda premium

I have to say, I don't mind not having an unlocked bootloader. I had the Galaxy Nexus and ran multiple different setups on it. The radio still sucked though. With the Droid 4, I don't feel the need to do a lot of hacking. The phone is well built, radio is awesome, it just works.

GermanGuy said:
I have to say, I don't mind not having an unlocked bootloader. I had the Galaxy Nexus and ran multiple different setups on it. The radio still sucked though. With the Droid 4, I don't feel the need to do a lot of hacking. The phone is well built, radio is awesome, it just works.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I kind of agree with you for the most, but still I prefer the option and think we should have it as an option. It's one way to keep a device relevant throughout your 2 year contract. For example....the Droid 3. I have one, bought online day of release. In less than a years time it has become a non-supported, forgotten device from Motorola. The locked bootloader prevents devs from picking apart the Droid 4 leaked ICS kernel and compiling one with Droid 3 specs (less RAM, etc..) and bringing a fully functional ICS build to the Droid 3. Unlocked...that would be possible.

JKingDev said:
This is a general question from me trying to understand things better. Before the D4 I had a samsung stratosphere. Completely unlocked bootloader with full capability to flash custom ROM/kernel images. Despite this no AOSP ROMs could be build due to lack of driver sources. It was the same situation with the Epic 4G. The Droid 4 on the other hand had the bootloader locked with the key thrown away. Despite this CM9 and other AOSP ROMs are up and nearly fully operational, even with ICS booting on GB kernels. What makes this possible on D4 but not the stratosphere?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I, as well, went from the Stratosphere to the Droid 4. I love my Stratosphere and still have it, but the lack of development on it is just down right aggravating. That is why I took it upon myself to learn how to compile a kernel to provide everyone with root and recovery for it. Otherwise we wouldn't have the ROMs we have for it now. If it wasn't for the Droid Charge using the exact same dev board as the Strat, I doubt we'd even have that much. I had to take the Charge build of CWM and packed it in a Strat kernel and tweaked the scripts, thank god at least that worked.
JKingDev said:
My guess is that driver software is available for the D4. This is due to the fact that Motorola uses parts from other OEMs (TI CPU ect) with public drivers. Samsung on the other hand uses their own proprietary parts and keeps the drivers private. Is this an accurate assessment?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am not sure about the Motorola drivers, but you are right about Samsung. The first time I compiled the kernel, I was missing 11 modules. I couldn't figure out what I did to keep them from being compiled... and then I learned the sneakiness Samsung uses to get around releasing the source, they compile the kernels for the file system and radios and dynamically link them in the init.rc script. Apparently a lot of them do this, actually.
JKingDev said:
It would seem then that the most important thing to making development possible for a phone (apart from popularity) is driver availability, NOT whether or not the bootloader is unlocked. Is that true?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually both are true to some extent, with a locked bootloader you are stuck with OEM signed boot images and can't recompile the kernel to your own needs, or compiling one with ro.secure = 0 so you get root access in adb (which is how I rooted the Stratosphere). Then you need the drivers to talk to the hardware too. Without them, you'd need to reverse engineer them or use the currently complied ones (also, like we did with the Strat). Finally, you have to have the source for the RIL (Radio Interface Layer) in Android so Android as an OS knows how to talk to the drivers to make calls, send messages, use data, etc. THIS is where we are currently hung up from using AOSP on the Stratosphere. I know work is being done on the RIL for the Charge and since its the same board, we might get lucky and be able to reuse most (if not all) of the same code and bring new life to it. But, I wasn't getting my hopes up and decided to get a D4 anyway.
JKingDev said:
Regardless, I will probably steer clear of samsung for future android purchases. HTC still seems best and motorola acceptable. If only HTC still made high end QWERTYs.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You and me both. I was in love with the keyboard on my HTC Touch Pro 2 and wish they'd release something like that running Android on Verizon with newer hardware. Closest they had to a QWERTY on VZ was the Merge, and they botched that up from the gate. I also have the Rezound and am trying to design a way to attach a sliding keyboard to the back battery cover to give me something closer to what i have been wanting in a phone.
I think us QWERTY loves on VZ are at the mercy of Motorola and Motorola alone with the original Droid line of sliders.

KnightCrusader said:
I, as well, went from the Stratosphere to the Droid 4. I love my Stratosphere and still have it, but the lack of development on it is just down right aggravating. That is why I took it upon myself to learn how to compile a kernel to provide everyone with root and recovery for it. Otherwise we wouldn't have the ROMs we have for it now. If it wasn't for the Droid Charge using the exact same dev board as the Strat, I doubt we'd even have that much. I had to take the Charge build of CWM and packed it in a Strat kernel and tweaked the scripts, thank god at least that worked.
I am not sure about the Motorola drivers, but you are right about Samsung. The first time I compiled the kernel, I was missing 11 modules. I couldn't figure out what I did to keep them from being compiled... and then I learned the sneakiness Samsung uses to get around releasing the source, they compile the kernels for the file system and radios and dynamically link them in the init.rc script. Apparently a lot of them do this, actually.
Actually both are true to some extent, with a locked bootloader you are stuck with OEM signed boot images and can't recompile the kernel to your own needs, or compiling one with ro.secure = 0 so you get root access in adb (which is how I rooted the Stratosphere). Then you need the drivers to talk to the hardware too. Without them, you'd need to reverse engineer them or use the currently complied ones (also, like we did with the Strat). Finally, you have to have the source for the RIL (Radio Interface Layer) in Android so Android as an OS knows how to talk to the drivers to make calls, send messages, use data, etc. THIS is where we are currently hung up from using AOSP on the Stratosphere. I know work is being done on the RIL for the Charge and since its the same board, we might get lucky and be able to reuse most (if not all) of the same code and bring new life to it. But, I wasn't getting my hopes up and decided to get a D4 anyway.
You and me both. I was in love with the keyboard on my HTC Touch Pro 2 and wish they'd release something like that running Android on Verizon with newer hardware. Closest they had to a QWERTY on VZ was the Merge, and they botched that up from the gate. I also have the Rezound and am trying to design a way to attach a sliding keyboard to the back battery cover to give me something closer to what i have been wanting in a phone.
I think us QWERTY loves on VZ are at the mercy of Motorola and Motorola alone with the original Droid line of sliders.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the replies. It is interesting stuff. And KC I definitely appreciated your work on the Strat. So I guess it really was a question of popularity being the problem for stratosphere. I definitely know it wasnt the most popular device but it also seemed like reverse engineering drivers for the Samsung devices was so much harder. The charge was relatively popular and years later the RIL has still not been successfully reverse engineered. All the moto devices get cracked so quickly. Is it only because they are more popular, or are there other reasons that make them easier to hack? Thats what leads me to think maybe it's samsung's use of proprietary hardware that makes things more difficult. Does that have something to do with it?

Development shouldn't factor in smartphone decision making, should it?

So trying to choose between the Moto X and the Nexus 5, I came across the biggest difference between these phones, their development. Moto X has little to none and Nexus 5 has more than any phone out there. This was an easy win for Nexus 5 I thought. Until I read Moto X users saying that flashing ROMs and kernels are normally to fix issues that the stock versions have and that they don't need Custom ROMs and kernels because what they get is stable, smooth, and lasts long enough (battery wise).
I thought back to why I flash ROMs on Note II and my previous phone SII, and fair enough, I used to do it because I wanted to fix issues that came with stock versions. Now, I hate flashing ROMs, I just want to use my phone. Anyways, looking at the development on the Nexus 5, it seems much of it is to fix the speakers, camera, battery life, etc.
Then I thought that Custom ROMs are important to stay up to date with Google's updates but then Motorola released their update faster than Google did with their Nexus 4. They are also updating their 1.5 year old phones (Not the Razr HD or the Razr HD Maxx probably because of their TI chipset). So it looks like Moto X users are in good hands as far as updates are concerned.
What do you guys think? Would you rather have a fully functional stable stock ROM on a phone that has no development otherwise or would you rather get a phone with tons of development to fix issues that the stock ROM has?
I am asking because there may be an angle to development that I haven't considered. Many customizable things included in ROMs on Nexus 5 are available via Xposed on Moto X.

Until I read Moto X users saying that flashing ROMs and kernels are normally to fix issues that the stock versions have and that they don't need Custom ROMs and kernels because what they get is stable, smooth, and lasts long enough (battery wise).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's a very narrow perspective. There are lots of reasons one might want to flash a ROM or kernel; the "one size fits all" mentality of other vendors such as Apple and Microsoft need not apply here. Custom ROMs open the door to different features that the OEM might not have considered or wanted to spend time on, and allow the creativity of the general public to enhance the phone in ways that are unique to them or only fits a certain niche that wouldn't be profitable for a big company to try and cater to. It certainly isn't just about "fixing issues".
Though custom ROMs certainly aren't the only feature I would look for in a phone, I might hesitate before buying a phone that little support or, even worse, a locked bootloader with no current workaround or hack for the simple reason that even if there's nothing I'm interested in today, there might be something cool that I want to try out tomorrow.

MaxCarnage said:
there might be something cool that I want to try out tomorrow.
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Click to collapse
If you had bought something like the Moto X one year ago, what feature made by the ROM developers on the Nexus 4 would you really want to try out?

I've been debating this myself. I have a Nexus 5 now that I'm testing with TMO prepaid for a month. So far, the phone is really nice and as you said, the level of development is astounding. BUT, I have to leave VZW in order to keep the phone. That's very hard to do when I get a hefty discount on the service and still have unlimited data. I can get LTE pretty much everywhere I go. With TMO, I'm lucky to get Edge data in some places or even a signal at all inside buildings.
I love the look and feel of the X. It's is a great piece of hardware and with the Dev edition, I could stay on VZW. I also like the fact that it runs basically stock Android along with additions that are actually useful and well done. The dev community is very limited though and will most likely stay that way. Moto was quick to get the 4.4 update out but it remains to be seen if that pace will continue. You would hope so but nothing is guaranteed. The X2 may be out next year putting the update schedule for the current model on the back burner.
I had the original Nexus One and the Galaxy Nexus. I've always been a diehard AOSP guy. Every phone I've owned in between has always been on a custom AOSP based ROM in order to get close to that Nexus experience. I'm attracted to custom ROMs not because they fix bugs, but because they allow me to always stay on a current version of Android (no waiting for carrier updates) and add some nice features to the basic AOSP design. Custom kernels can also improve overall performance and battery life even if you decide to stay stock otherwise. The Nexus line will always have the edge in this regard.
I wanted to be blown away with the N5 and content with TMO but I'm second guessing my decision each day.....
darkgoon3r96 said:
So trying to choose between the Moto X and the Nexus 5, I came across the biggest difference between these phones, their development. Moto X has little to none and Nexus 5 has more than any phone out there. This was an easy win for Nexus 5 I thought. Until I read Moto X users saying that flashing ROMs and kernels are normally to fix issues that the stock versions have and that they don't need Custom ROMs and kernels because what they get is stable, smooth, and lasts long enough (battery wise).
I thought back to why I flash ROMs on Note II and my previous phone SII, and fair enough, I used to do it because I wanted to fix issues that came with stock versions. Now, I hate flashing ROMs, I just want to use my phone. Anyways, looking at the development on the Nexus 5, it seems much of it is to fix the speakers, camera, battery life, etc.
Then I thought that Custom ROMs are important to stay up to date with Google's updates but then Motorola released their update faster than Google did with their Nexus 4. They are also updating their 1.5 year old phones (Not the Razr HD or the Razr HD Maxx probably because of their TI chipset). So it looks like Moto X users are in good hands as far as updates are concerned.
What do you guys think? Would you rather have a fully functional stable stock ROM on a phone that has no development otherwise or would you rather get a phone with tons of development to fix issues that the stock ROM has?
I am asking because there may be an angle to development that I haven't considered. Many customizable things included in ROMs on Nexus 5 are available via Xposed on Moto X.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

I am running the N5 stock and have no reason to root or flash a custom Rom. Never thought I would say that about my phone but I am actually content with the N5 the way it is. There are some cool features that devs add in but then you get sucked into this never ending flashing frenzy which I have been in for years.
It is good to actually enjoy the phone now and keep the software on it for more then a few days. lol
Anyway, the screen alone on the N5 is enough for what I consider a big step up from the Moto X. I have friends with Moto X's which I actually recommended to them since they are on Verizon and it was being offered for free on contract. I do think it is a great phone with some great features. Not enough there to sway my decision to get one over a N5 though.
I do applaud Motorola for their unbelievable quick update and I bet we start to see some other maunfacturers start stepping up their game as well. We have seen this recently with HTC also.
The question to ask yourself is what is important to you. Another good thing with the Moto X is it generally stocks with the stock Android feel so it almost resembles Nexus software.
Bottom line, when I turn on my N5 after playing with the Moto X, the Moto X does not in any way make me want to buy one for myself.
---------- Post added at 11:34 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:32 AM ----------
fallingd0wn said:
I've been debating this myself. I have a Nexus 5 now that I'm testing with TMO prepaid for a month. So far, the phone is really nice and as you said, the level of development is astounding. BUT, I have to leave VZW in order to keep the phone. That's very hard to do when I get a hefty discount on the service and still have unlimited data. I can get LTE pretty much everywhere I go. With TMO, I'm lucky to get Edge data in some places or even a signal at all inside buildings.
I love the look and feel of the X. It's is a great piece of hardware and with the Dev edition, I could stay on VZW. I also like the fact that it runs basically stock Android along with additions that are actually useful and well done. The dev community is very limited though and will most likely stay that way. Moto was quick to get the 4.4 update out but it remains to be seen if that pace will continue. You would hope so but nothing is guaranteed. The X2 may be out next year putting the update schedule for the current model on the back burner.
I had the original Nexus One and the Galaxy Nexus. I've always been a diehard AOSP guy. Every phone I've owned in between has always been on a custom AOSP based ROM in order to get close to that Nexus experience. I'm attracted to custom ROMs not because they fix bugs, but because they allow me to always stay on a current version of Android (no waiting for carrier updates) and add some nice features to the basic AOSP design. Custom kernels can also improve overall performance and battery life even if you decide to stay stock otherwise. The Nexus line will always have the edge in this regard.
I wanted to be blown away with the N5 and content with TMO but I'm second guessing my decision each day.....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why not go to a MVNO that uses AT&T towers? Would still be much chepaer then Verizon and they offer much better coverage then T-Mo.

[email protected] said:
I am running the N5 stock and have no reason to root or flash a custom Rom. Never thought I would say that about my phone but I am actually content with the N5 the way it is. There are some cool features that devs add in but then you get sucked into this never ending flashing frenzy which I have been in for years.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Don't you want to improve the Audio and the battery life by trying out the kernels and the mods made here?
Anyway, the screen alone on the N5 is enough for what I consider a big step up from the Moto X.
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I assume you mean resolution? I was under the impression that 1080p and 720p are not that different under daily usage?

It all comes down to your habits. I love flashing new ROM's, I sometimes try multiple ROM's per week. So for me, development means a lot. It's why I switched from the S4 to the N5. The S4 just received 4.3 and was locked down by Knox. Plus, with the N5 being an unlocked phone, you can flash any ROM on any carrier, so you won't ever have to drool over another carrier's ROM.

mjs2011 said:
It all comes down to your habits. I love flashing new ROM's, I sometimes try multiple ROM's per week. So for me, development means a lot. It's why I switched from the S4 to the N5. The S4 just received 4.3 and was locked down by Knox. Plus, with the N5 being an unlocked phone, you can flash any ROM on any carrier, so you won't ever have to drool over another carrier's ROM.
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Click to collapse
I also flash a ton of ROMs every week and also used to enjoy it, but I am getting tired of it now... I want to live life more than flash ROMs (if that makes sense)

darkgoon3r96 said:
If you had bought something like the Moto X one year ago, what feature made by the ROM developers on the Nexus 4 would you really want to try out?
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Anything and everything. The top reason I don't even consider not getting a Nexus device anymore is the development scene. Look, you're viewing the huge development community on the Nexus line as people who are "fixing" a "broken" stock image. That's not really true. The stock image is perfectly fine. The developers are merely making things that they deem better than how stock handled it. For instance, a developer might think that the on-screen buttons are too large on stock, taking up way too much screen real-estate. They would then develop a way to remove it, but still be able to navigate. They might make something like PIE controls. Now, I may agree that the buttons really are too large, but I like the nav bar. So I might just resize it, instead of working around it.
I guess the point I'm making is, all of those modifications you see to "improve" the stock image are there to "improve" it, but what counts as an "improvement" is completely subjective. There are different people in the world with vastly differentiating opinions about things, so they will make something to improve something else as they see fit. The development sections here on XDA are merely huge repositories of any modification that anyone who was willing to make, made. Looking at them all as collectively-required flashable improvements isn't how it should be viewed. That's the beauty of having a large development community. You can pick and choose, depending on your personal opinions, which modifications are improvements and flash them. Another way to think of it is cookie-cutter vs modular. Do you want a phone that appeals the masses,;a one-size fits all, or a phone that is completely customizable?

darkgoon3r96 said:
Don't you want to improve the Audio and the battery life by trying out the kernels and the mods made here?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Battery life has been great on stock for me. Absolutley no complaints here. I have ran so many custom kernels on prior phones and never saw a large boost in battery from them. Lots of times it would actually be worse.
The speaker volume can definitley use a boost and the camera needs some fixing. I know there is some dev work for both of these issues but I am going to hang a little and see if Google fixes it. If not, I might think about rooting solely for those 2 things. If Google fixes it, absolutley no reason for me to root this time around.
Anyway, as a prior flashoholic there is no better phone then a Nexus for people who like to flash Roms and like every feature on the sun. No other phones custom Roms work as good as they do on a Nexus.

Development is like the first determining factor for me when buying phones.

darkgoon3r96 said:
I assume you mean resolution? I was under the impression that 1080p and 720p are not that different under daily usage?
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Screen size. A 5" screen starts the sweet spot for a device that uses on-screen buttons. I always felt shorted on prior 4.7" screens with on screen buttons. Like there wasn't enough viewing real estate. Sure you can remove the on-screen buttons but then you would need something that always to longer to activate then the actual buttons being present.
I also think the quality and colors of the N5 screen are just gorgous.

darkgoon3r96 said:
So trying to choose between the Moto X and the Nexus 5, I came across the biggest difference between these phones, their development. Moto X has little to none and Nexus 5 has more than any phone out there. This was an easy win for Nexus 5 I thought. Until I read Moto X users saying that flashing ROMs and kernels are normally to fix issues that the stock versions have and that they don't need Custom ROMs and kernels because what they get is stable, smooth, and lasts long enough (battery wise).
I thought back to why I flash ROMs on Note II and my previous phone SII, and fair enough, I used to do it because I wanted to fix issues that came with stock versions. Now, I hate flashing ROMs, I just want to use my phone. Anyways, looking at the development on the Nexus 5, it seems much of it is to fix the speakers, camera, battery life, etc.
Then I thought that Custom ROMs are important to stay up to date with Google's updates but then Motorola released their update faster than Google did with their Nexus 4. They are also updating their 1.5 year old phones (Not the Razr HD or the Razr HD Maxx probably because of their TI chipset). So it looks like Moto X users are in good hands as far as updates are concerned.
What do you guys think? Would you rather have a fully functional stable stock ROM on a phone that has no development otherwise or would you rather get a phone with tons of development to fix issues that the stock ROM has?
I am asking because there may be an angle to development that I haven't considered. Many customizable things included in ROMs on Nexus 5 are available via Xposed on Moto X.
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I just got rid of my moto x for the N5 for this very reason. The moto x is a great device and probably the best carrier controlled device to date.
That being said, it drove me nuts to be locked down with a locked bootloader and no development. Knowing the n5 is open and has all the Dev support means I have control over MY phone, not AT&T and not Motorola.
After dealing with the locked down s4, I promised myself I would never get another device without an unlockable bootloader. I caved when the moto x came out and as I said it's one amazing device but at the end of the day, I'll be sticking with nexus devices from here on out.
To me it's not worth giving up that freedom but for you it may not matter.
Sent from my Nexus 5

Development totally cones into it for me. One of the biggest considerations.
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brooksyx said:
Development is like the first determining factor for me when buying phones.
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rootSU said:
Development totally cones into it for me. One of the biggest considerations.
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Please elaborate. I want to know which features exactly do Custom ROMs provide that you won't be able to get from the xposed mod that you would want that much.
capathy21 said:
That being said, it drove me nuts to be locked down with a locked bootloader and no development. Knowing the n5 is open and has all the Dev support means I have control over MY phone, not AT&T and not Motorola.
Sent from my Nexus 5
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If I do get the Moto X, then I will get the Developer Unlocked model.

brooksyx said:
Development is like the first determining factor for me when buying phones.
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Click to collapse
Same here, after my first Nexus phone, I could never go back to a phone that didn't have a strong dev. community behind it. For me; tablets and phones are as much about the journey of playing with ROM/kernel/mods as they are a communication device.

darkgoon3r96 said:
Please elaborate. I want to know which features exactly do Custom ROMs provide that you won't be able to get from the xposed mod that you would want that much.
If I do get the Moto X, then I will get the Developer Unlocked model.
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Click to collapse
No stock rom mod can touch the stability and features of cyanogenmod. It is the only way to do anroid. In fact I prefer iOS over stock android. But CM is awesome.

brooksyx said:
No stock rom mod can touch the stability and features of cyanogenmod. It is the only way to do anroid. In fact I prefer iOS over stock android. But CM is awesome.
Click to expand...
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To be honest, CM's future plans SERIOUSLY excite me.. Like that recent conversation feature

CyanogenMod, AOKP, AOSPA support, along with great kernel devs. The Nexus 5 is essentially guaranteed support for these things, and these are things I like.

darkgoon3r96 said:
Please elaborate. I want to know which features exactly do Custom ROMs provide that you won't be able to get from the xposed mod that you would want that much.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Who said anything about roms or features? Its all about kernels.
But if you look at ROMS like PAC, you'll see what features true roms can offer over xposed
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[Q] Motorola A855 viable?

Hello all, Quick question about the Motorola Droid. I have heard that this is/was a popular phone for custom ROMs. I found a new one locally for $40 and am thinking about purchasing it. I have am currently using a Galaxy S3 which has limited possibilities due to the know that came with 4.3 OTA. I also have been playing with a Samsung Charge but that never really had a lot of ROMs developed and traffic on that forum has come to a standstill.
So my questions, Does the the Motorola Droid forum still happening and functioning? Are there many custom ROMs to play with? A quick glance at post dates lead to mixed data.
Second, the phone I found was a A855 with slide out keyboard. When I see a reference to the 'Motorola Droid' or even the Motorola Droid 1' as in this post http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1098483 are they referring to the A855 or the A853 for even some other phone? Seems confusing.
Thanks for any help!

You know it was a great phone and still is (build quality, screen, qwerty, etc) but it is really outdated.
I mean RAM is the bottleneck of Android and this phone has only 256MB.
If you want a phone to mess around with it, then go ahead, if you need a qwerty Android phone, buy a Moto Photon Q.
Afaik, there are no active developer on the Droid (the development on the Milestone halted a year ago).
Btw, A855 is the NA edition but you can look it up on wikipedia.

It was a great phone while it lasted, and there are a ton of roms out there, but as far as I know there aren't any with active development. I still get mine out every once in a while to mess with, but it isn't really good for anything except a toy at this point.