Database Develop

Keypad Light tweak?

http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?t=43822&highlight=keyboard
Is there any current way to perform this kind of tweak for the Wizard? I've just spent 20 mins searching but couldn't find anything related
Cheers!

nope

I have to say, despite it's nice design I'm really starting to get irritated with my Vario now... The processor is uber-slow compared to all other HTC devices, it's not tweakable anywhere near the amount the others are, it has an OMAP processor and thus won't be possible to run Linux etc on it.
I think even after 2 months it's time to look at a new device

blackobsidian said:
it has an OMAP processor and thus won't be possible to run Linux etc on it.
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Click to collapse
That's bull**** - the first (?) Linux smartphone from imcosys runs the TI OMAP 730 with embedded Linux;
http://www.imcosys.com/html/technische_daten.html
It's just a matter of people actually doing the work to port the O/S. Personally I think people who want to run Linux on Device X should just get Device Y which runs it natively - less work, and you support a company that already readily supports Linux on Device X-alikes.
As far as CPU-speed goes, it appears to vary per-reviewer. Some say it's slower, others say it's faster. I guess it'll depend on what you're doing with it.
Not sure what you mean with regards to 'tweakable', though. The only 'tweak' I'm readily aware of that works on e.g. the HTC Universal but not on the HTC Wizard is the keyboard backlight. They both run WM5 and are tweakable to pretty much the same extent as far as the O/S and running software allows.
That said - I obviously rather like mine. -That- said, I can see myself moving to a different device 2-3 years down the road quite easily, especially with all the network upgrades -and- the speed at which new devices are coming out. Wouldn't be too surprised if they're all rather like smaller OQO's by that time.. handheld, good battery, running will Windows XP (probably not Vista yet - hardware specs for that thing are through the roof)

See my comments have all been based on various forums I've read, posted on and recieved replies from. Apparently the OMAP architecture is completely different from most other processors and so it's a niche market (meaning people won't bother with trying to do anything good such as Linux, major overhauls of software, overclocking software etc) - Even Anton Tomov's Hack Master software is having issues with the overclocking functionality and keeps getting pushed back and back and back some more.
I have to say I bought my Wizard (MDA Vario flavour) because the design is slick and it was pretty fast in the shop demonstration. I didn't realise that the second I put anything on it, it'd slow down so much.
I've reflashed it with the best and fastest current rom out there:-
VERSION
ROM Version 1.6.7.1
ROM Date 38624
Radio Version 01.13.10
Protocol Version 4.0.13.17
ExtROM Version 1.3.2.102
And although it's faster than the bloated T-Mobile crap that it comes with by default it's still slow (my today screen only has SPB Pocket Plus and Pocket Weather on it but it still chugs occasionally) and it's an absolute nightmare playing something as simple as Arkaball!
"tweakable" I class as something I can mess around with. With my Samsung T100 I completely replaced the casin with a clear casing, reconfigured everything including LED colour and created my own firmware for it etc. I basically like to try and be individual which is why I won't got for a device already running Linux etc.
Tech Knowledge + Gadgets + being a geek = wanting cool stuff
OQO looks nice but huge. I'm looking for a device I can use for business (running a QA department) and as a mobile. Shoulda got myself a P990i... lol

Here's a proposition for your thoughts... if everybody is customizing their device, then not customizing your device makes you more of an individual
That said - yes, if you want that manner of tweakability, you should've gone for a different device. I'm not sure why a Linux-preloaded one would be excluded from the get-go because you didn't put it on there yourself.. it certainly should open up tweaking possibilities.
Overclocking software for the OMAP does exist - and I'm sure AntonTomov will get one out eventually as the number of devices using the OMAP increases. I'm sure the XScale will still be #1 for some time to be with the recent pricedrops and announced speeds (1GHz - vroom).
However, just because it's a different architecture doesn't typically stop the person who go "But does it run Linux? it does now!" on e.g. Slashdot . Of course if Linux was on your mind from the get-go, a little googling around would've readily shown which devices run it natively and which have been successfully made to run it, to whatever extent, and should've based your purchasing decision on that
For what it's worth, the Treo 700w (650? - been a while) was on my list, but once in the shop with the device in my hand, I knew I would grow to hate the form factor within the first week.

ZeBoxx said:
the first (?) Linux smartphone from imcosys runs the TI OMAP 730 with embedded Linux;
http://www.imcosys.com/html/technische_daten.html
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Click to collapse
There are many Linux phones already
http://openezx.org
but the ports to HTC Blueangel and HTC Universal
use more free software
You can also check Linux for OMAP page
http://focus.ti.com/docs/general/sp...mplatedata/cm/splashdsp/data/linux_com_portal

Correction... Everyone on this forum is customising their device... Most people in the real world buy a device and use it out of the box as they don't know or can't be bothered to upgrade it lol.
To be honest with you this is my first PPC device. Before this I was in a job where I didn't want or need the functions and features the PPC has and I had a K750i. Before that was a 7610 and before that a GX20.
I have to admit I was in the process of looking at PPC's when my K750i had an unfortunate incident where my fist went through the screen because it was crashing every 30 seconds... That's why I didn't research as much as I should have before getting my Wizard.
I've learned my lesson though and next time there'll be a LOT of research involved before I buy!
I'm assuming that individual hardware can't be replaced in the Wizard either? i.e. buying a faster processor/mobo etc? My mate's Universal had it's mobo replaced so maybe...
1Gb? Mmmm....
Treo 700w is nice but it was the 990i I meant to say (I updfated it when I realised what I posted lol)

ZeBoxx said:
I'm not sure why a Linux-preloaded one would be excluded from the get-go because you didn't put it on there yourself.. it certainly should open up tweaking possibilities.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
"running Linux" != running free software platform.
Compare Motorola A780 and HTC Blueangel/Universal.

well, I did say "should". I didn't say it would come with a CD with all the source code on it ready for compilation
We're getting way, way off-topic anyway. Keyboard/button backlights tweaks are as of yet non-existant. Chances are you can tweak it by modifying the driver - but nobody's confirmed or done so. Worst case scenario is that it's all in hardware. For the specific tweak mentioned - no, because the Wizard doesn't have a light sensor. Arguably you could start up the camera ever once in a while and check lighting that way, but it wouldn't be very accurate

Kaiser Video Drivers - Status of development effort

Can we make this a sticky post where the end status of the Kaiser Video driver development stands?
Where does it stand? Has anyone started work on it? How do we get ahold of the information required for developing the driver? Can we determine if the development for this driver is even possible? (Is the hardware completely set up to handle it? Maybe there are hardware design hurdles which makes it impossible to be done - that HTC knows about but cannot or will not currently tell us? Even if the chipset is up to it, maybe there is some other piece of hardware missing like an additional circuit left out? How can we determine this for sure and get the work on this started?
Let's make this a sticky post and only those with specific information should post here...
What pieces of hardware are required for a developer to work on this driver development issue? I am willing to part with my older units (for a price, I was going to sell them) if that would help the effort: (O2 XDA/O2 XDA II/Cingular 8525) - what specific models support this chipset so we know what hardware can be used for the development effort?

There are three sticky posts on the subject of video drivers already - are these needs not met by the Video driver project thread - http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=355345 ?

But not the current status
But not the current status in one place that is easy to find. Maybe there should be a sticky post with only one postingvand only updated - not added to - from time to time - only by the forum admin...

Developing new drivers from the ground up won't happen anytime soon. It's a massive undertaking and I bet much too much even for the fine people here.
Even "stealing" drivers from similair hardware has proven very difficult, though it's most probably possible.
I think our best chance would be if HTC releases a device with MSM 7200/7500 and they deliver it with drivers, then it would probably be a fairly easy task.
As for the hardware the only two things that come to mind would be if HTC bought cost reduced chipsets with non-functional Imageon hardware (if for an example there's a problem with yields and Qualcomm has a stock of partially broken chipsets) or if Qualcomm has different SKUs of the same chipset which they artificially handicap by disbling certain hardware (and thus ell them cheaper).
None of the two theories above are that far fetched actually.
Hardware manufacturers often artificially create multiple SKUs by disabling features in a high end product. (Perfect sample would be CD/DVD burners that are firmware capped to a lower speed that the hardware can actually manage.)
Sma ething happens with videocards. When Radeon 9500 was launched the chip on those boards were actually 9700 chips but with non-functional hardware units (and when ATi were out of those they actually started capping 9700 chips that were 100 % operational).
As for the exact current status I believe the only person who really gave this a try was Chainfire who tried to make the LG KS20 drivers work on a Kaiser without any luck. SO I guess the status is still att 0 % so to speak.

KruseLudsMobile said:
But not the current status in one place that is easy to find. Maybe there should be a sticky post with only one postingvand only updated - not added to - from time to time - only by the forum admin...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yes, thats a good idea.

Really there are way too many threads dealing with these issues. Two or three new ones at least pop up every day. As far as I know, there is currently nobody actually working on the drivers. I was, but after putting about a 100 hours in porting the LG KS20 drivers, ultimately without success, I focussed my efforts towards the website. Porting these drivers is most likely not impossible, but it's not an easy task and I personally only know of one person here on XDA who may possibly pull it off and this person does not have one of the affected devices, and even if she did, it might still take a long time to do.
In the meantime, progress is being made with the website, news coverage everywhere, and a lot going on behind the scenes that we honestly cannot say 'out loud'.
Let's first see what the update HTC keeps telling us about brings. And if you need to get rid of bounty money, I would say giving a fair part of it to those of us who have put all this effort and time into making it happen would not be unfair

Chainfire said:
Really there are way too many threads dealing with these issues. Two or three new ones at least pop up every day. As far as I know, there is currently nobody actually working on the drivers. I was, but after putting about a 100 hours in porting the LG KS20 drivers, ultimately without success, I focussed my efforts towards the website. Porting these drivers is most likely not impossible, but it's not an easy task and I personally only know of one person here on XDA who may possibly pull it off and this person does not have one of the affected devices, and even if she did, it might still take a long time to do.
In the meantime, progress is being made with the website, news coverage everywhere, and a lot going on behind the scenes that we honestly cannot say 'out loud'.
Let's first see what the update HTC keeps telling us about brings. And if you need to get rid of bounty money, I would say giving a fair part of it to those of us who have put all this effort and time into making it happen would not be unfair
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
not enough threads IMO

Guys, I can make this thread sticky too if you promise it'll be a catch-all thread, eferring to all the other, referred threads.

[Dev Poll]

Without an unlocked boot loader, which would allow for a custom kernel, we will never see substantial development on the Atrix.
Lack of (the ability to run) custom kernels prevents many of the modifications that have made Cyanogenmod and other popular ROMs appealing. (including overclocking, enhanced power management and screen color adjustments just to name a few)
The best we could hope for (without an unlocked bootloader) would be a stock version of android, devoid of all things Blur.
Luckily the latter will happen sooner rather than later, imo.
Like some other posters said, we still have hope. There are three main sources of unlocking the bootloader, I will list them here in the order I feel they are likely to actually happen chronologically:
1. Information gleaned from the LG Optimus 2X will directly translate into an unlocked bootloader on the Atrix:
If unconfirmed rumors are to be believed, the LG Optimus 2X, which runs the same Tegra 2 SOC (system on chip) as the Atrix, has already had its bootloader unlocked. With a European March release eminent (its only available in South Korea currently) it could only be a small matter of time before the same methods used to unlock the 2X fall into our hands.
2. Out of the box thinking by Developers leads to exploiting the bootloader:
Inquisitive and risky developers here at XDA have been laying waste to bootloaders and the like for years now. The Tegra 2 System On a Chip Platform is still very much in its infancy, it stands to reason that there are quite a few vulnerabilities hiding just under the surface awaiting the prodding minds of credit hungry devs.
3. Motorola makes good on their "promise" and gives us the keys to the castle:
Motorola has alluded to the possibility of releasing their secure grasp on our most prised dual core phone. Rest assured it won't literally be "keys" they give us, and more likely they will provide a flashable development bootloader accessible as a download to registered developers.
What method do you think will happen, first?

I think we may learn something from the Optimus 2X.

im feeling pessimistic about this. im not thinking its going to get cracked. hope im wrong though

The Devs always win, why would Moto release the software? Because they feel like it? Sorry they are worried about one thing and that is the bottom line, they wont do anything to help a small portion of their customer base.

You need to have an option for "DG will figure it out"

if anything we'd learn we should learn that from the XOOM, no ?
LG use the tegra 2 and all, but different company do ( lock ) things differently

oFUNGUSo said:
im feeling pessimistic about this. im not thinking its going to get cracked. hope im wrong though
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Click to collapse
Unfortunately I'm in line with you. It doesn't seem like there's any motivation for Motorola to release the keys, and from past history with their devices cracking the bootloader does not look promising.
It's a shame because this is a very good phone that just needs a little tweaking (removing Blur).

There has to be some way without the keys.. I don't know what, but it can't require just those. We need to get other developers to look at the Atrix. Like I said in the other thread, jimmydafish and maybe even koush could help DG try to find some way to bring ROMs. Even if they don't fully unlock it, just do it similar to the droid x.
Atrix4G Rooted!

the poll results speak truth.
*sad face*
its dumb too because i returned my craptivate to get this phone, and now i wont be able to do all the same cool stuff to it.
i guess i have 20 more days where i could return this and either go to the crappy again, or inspire. im juggling the idea, but the dual core, large ram and good battery life are making me lean towards just keeping this phone.....oh and the fact taht the GPS works when the crappy didnt

oFUNGUSo said:
the poll results speak truth.
*sad face*
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You sir are no economist!
But seriously... if you look at the results, an overwhelming majority believe that we will in one way or another obtain an unlocked bootloader:
66.18% of all voters think it will happen, while only 33.82 think it never will.

Have faith in the DEVs, I'm voting on option 2!

it won't be cracked, it's almost impossible, but the droid x wasn't doomed because it still has greats rom. No unlocked bootloader only means no custom kernels, not roms.
i would like those 100+ people that signed the petition about at&t's block of hsupa instead post on motorola's twitter accounts all day. the only way we MAY get an unlocked bootloader would be for moto to do it.

jruweaver said:
Have faith in the DEVs, I'm voting on option 2!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
what if one of those DEVs is the ony who actually told me, and i quote:
"it wont get cracked"

oFUNGUSo said:
what if one of those DEVs is the ony who actually told me, and i quote:
"it wont get cracked"
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I guess it depends on which dev said it.

Designgears told me more than once, and everyone else in the IRC channel that we more than likely will not be able to unlock it. Never said it was impossible, but the thing that checks the kernel and recovery, whatever it is, is lower than the bootloader, that is why the bootloader is only signed.

Out of curiosity is it possible at all to OC without cracking the boot loader and loading a new kernel? I'm pretty sure it's not but just double checking.
Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk

DemonWav said:
Designgears told me more than once, and everyone else in the IRC channel that we more than likely will not be able to unlock it. Never said it was impossible, but the thing that checks the kernel and recovery, whatever it is, is lower than the bootloader, that is why the bootloader is only signed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ohhh boy.. That does not sound good at all What to do, what to do?

Give up. It's tilting windmills without a leak from within moto.

I think you mean tilting at windmills, in reference to Don Quixote tilting his lance at a windmill thinking it was an enemy.

All literary references aside, even with a "leak from within moto" the chances of unlocking the bootloader are negligible.
We had all of the documentation and files from Motorola for the Droid devices including efuse implementation and emulation on unsecured hardware, all of component files themselves for both secured and unsecured hardware and all of the firmware builds.
None of it helped unlock the bootloader. We even have the methods and tools for setting and blowing the fuses with RadioComm.
It is irrevocable once set and we have been told that Motorola themselves cannot "unlock" them. All they can do is replace the chip with an unsecured one.

Can I Install WP8 on a WP7 Phone?

is there any way to install wp8 on a wp7 phone?

Really ? Did you do any homework or read any of the blogs about Windows Phone 8 ? I guess not. A key word that you should know is "search" as you would of found your answer.
To answer your question, NO. Window Phone 7 users will get a upgrade to Windows Phone 7.8 and it will give you the new start menu of Windows Phone 8 but, nothing else.

Windows phone 7.8
There will be update to wp7/wp7.5 called wp7.8 and you have same interface than Windows phone 8

kilus said:
is there any way to install wp8 on a wp7 phone?
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Click to collapse
I'm pretty sure we'll be able to put some sort of custom ROM WP8 on a WP7 device.
Other than the secure boot, which should hopefully be easily turned off, I haven't seen anything which would prevent the OS from running on a WP7 device.

DavidinCT said:
Really ? Did you do any homework or read any of the blogs about Windows Phone 8 ? I guess not. A key word that you should know is "search" as you would of found your answer.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
really? did you do any homework or read any blogs about how to get laid as a nerd? i guess not. a key word you should know is "balls," as you'd require a pair as a real man and help you stop masterbating at online porn, move out your mom's house, and finally get laid at 43 years of age.
hetwo said:
There will be update to wp7/wp7.5 called wp7.8 and you have same interface than Windows phone 8
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Click to collapse
thanks hetwo.
gedmurphy said:
I'm pretty sure we'll be able to put some sort of custom ROM WP8 on a WP7 device.
Other than the secure boot, which should hopefully be easily turned off, I haven't seen anything which would prevent the OS from running on a WP7 device.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
thank you too.. its good knowing there are some decent intelligent people out there willing to answer questions without having to be a disrespectful troll.

Hey guys,
Firstly please don't get this wp8 forum off to a bad start and keep flaming each other? Respect each other and the rules please :cyclops:
Secondly, from my understanding current hardware specs of wp7 phones are not high enough, do not meet, wp8 requirements so the answer is probably no. The official line is a definate no, wp7 devices, even new ones like lumia 900 will not get wp8 update

Hopefully soon wp8 on WP7 by Custom Rom

timmymarsh said:
Secondly, from my understanding current hardware specs of wp7 phones are not high enough, do not meet, wp8 requirements so the answer is probably no. The official line is a definate no, wp7 devices, even new ones like lumia 900 will not get wp8 update
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Click to collapse
Definitely not via an update, that's clearly been addressed by Microsoft. However existing WP7 hardware is surely powerful enough to run WP8. The single core processor is definitely not a problem, and low end WP8 devices are looking to be lower in specs than current WP7 devices.
I'm no expert in usermode on WP, but I know the NT kernel extremely well, and it's more than capable of running on our hardware.

Some body will hack it
Sent from my Lumia 900 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App

Only problem maybe drivers. It is Microsoft way to release oem from out of warranty obligation to keep an outdated product updated.
Who wants to sell one shirt and that person never buys another because it last too long. I understand wanted to save money. But how can they keep making money if the people that work for them is trying to make something2 years old work off of the mere 500$ the phone is worth. Hey has to make money or they will disappear like farmer jack and circuit city
Sent from my HD7 T9292 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App

kilus said:
really? did you do any homework or read any blogs about how to get laid as a nerd? i guess not. a key word you should know is "balls," as you'd require a pair as a real man and help you stop masterbating at online porn, move out your mom's house, and finally get laid at 43 years of age.
.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hahaha. If you read ANY PLACE on this site, it says to SEARCH before posting.
You must not know how to read. This has been a major topic of discussion over every Windows Phone 7 related site.
It does not take a geek or loser like yourself just to spend 2 min reading before posting a subject that has been posted everywhere.
The new upgrade goes to the NT kernal over the WinCE one. That does take more horsepower than current devices can do. It will have native support for C++ and a lot of other modern tech (NFC and others). The current chipset in current devices will not be able to handle it with reasonable performance. As I understand it.
IF some hacker was to create a rom for a current device, it would not support more than 1/2 of the OS and the performace would not be anything worth using unless they stripped everything out.
It's really questionable if a hacker will be able to get it working on current devices and what type of performance. If you really want to know the changes, it's a little long but, it really shows what it can and will do...
http://channel9.msdn.com/Events/Windows-Phone/Summit
It's the full streaming event, and it's almost 2 hours but, it's impressive and I can see why they went this route.

DavidinCT said:
The new upgrade goes to the NT kernal over the WinCE one. That does take more horsepower than current devices can do.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Absolutely not true. The NT kernel will run on seriously low specs without any issues. It'll happily run on an old pentium 233 and 32MB RAM without any notable issues in performance. In fact,WP7 hardware is sufficient to run full blown Windows 7, not just the NT6 kernel (assuming the processor was x86 and not ARMv7)
I don't se drivers being a huge blocker as the number of drivers for NT6 is huge, and even in the worst case scenario any drivers we may be missing can be written.
It'll be interesting to see how quickly someone gets WP8 running on a WP7 device.

gedmurphy said:
Absolutely not true. The NT kernel will run on seriously low specs without any issues. It'll happily run on an old pentium 233 and 32MB RAM without any notable issues in performance. In fact,WP7 hardware is sufficient to run full blown Windows 7, not just the NT6 kernel (assuming the processor was x86 and not ARMv7)
I don't se drivers being a huge blocker as the number of drivers for NT6 is huge, and even in the worst case scenario any drivers we may be missing can be written.
It'll be interesting to see how quickly someone gets WP8 running on a WP7 device.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's a good question. As I got that from a Tweet by someone at MS. As I understand Windows 8 has a updated kernel that they are using on WP8. Not sure on it, as I thought it was the same as you (I'm a 20 year Windows Systems admin, I know the NT kernel COULD run on 286 machines if needed, not sure on the updated one, just going on what I heard).
It might of been the option of forcing users to have not hard reset their phones (like going from 32bit to 64-bit, no upgrade path) and that would cause a big impact on customer reports. As I have understood from watching the whole MS thing on it, it came down to performance problems that ended it before it started. Some chipsets to support the new OS are not on WP7 devices, so it limits the options current users can take advantage of.
It's not just about the devices and the end users , its' about the PR nightmare. Any press is good but, bad press is a whole different story. In a year or 2 no one will even talk about this. Android does this all the time and even Apple did it to their first gen device.
Who knows. Maybe one of the great hackers here or DFT will make it run on a current device. It makes me question it though.
As long as WP7 devices have been out, Not one WM 6.5 devices (not incuding the HD2 as it was used as a test device for MS on WP7 and drivers were leaked) got a WP7 upgrade OR No Android device got WP7 or the other way around. There are plenty of Android devices or even a handful of 6.5 devices that could of run WP7 fine.
The hackers can do only so much but, time will tell, I just wonder IF POSSABLE (with out MS), just how long it would take.
It will be interesting to see tho...
I do know I am about 95% sure I will be buying one on release, just depending on the models on release.

The reason for almost none of the 6.5 devices running WP7 could be that most of the old devices running 6.5 didn´t have the needed display (capacitive and the WP7 resolution) or processor. Take the Toshiba TG01: resistive display and higher resolution.

btw....moved to Q&A:good:

this will be possible atleast for hd7 and focus 1st gen:good:

hackarchive said:
this will be possible atleast for hd7 and focus 1st gen:good:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
for hd7? i see...

hackarchive said:
this will be possible atleast for hd7 and focus 1st gen:good:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just wondering... Where did you get your info on that ? Your HD7 and focus besides the display and case is almost like every other Windows Phone 7 device (standard hardware across all models).
Even though it has been clearly said by Microsoft that NO 1st or 2nd gen devices will get the update you seem to think the HD7 will.
Maybe it's me but, I'm smelling a little BS here....
Unless Microsoft says that they will be updating or DFT decides to dig in, your not getting a upgrade on any first or 2nd gen device and that includes the HD7 and Focus.

The problem with the kernel is not that it by itself would need that much power to run but rather that they would have to develop loads of drivers for it to work, as they would not be able to use those that already exist for Windows CE.
A bigger problem might be the Bootloader process. The NT Kernel at least on ARM requires an UEFI firmware which is likely to be pretty different from the bootloaders we currently have on our phones.
So the steps would be:
- Develop an UEFI firmware for current WP7 hardware (HSPL needed because it would replace the old bootloader) - including UEFI hardware drivers
- Develop drivers for the chipsets from scratch
- Find out on how many hardware characteristics Microsoft chose to rely that are simply not there on old devices
I'm not saying that it is impossible to do or that it won't ever be done but I guess until it's done almost no one will still be using such an old phone.

RE:
DavidinCT said:
Hahaha. If you read ANY PLACE on this site, it says to SEARCH before posting.
You must not know how to read. This has been a major topic of discussion over every Windows Phone 7 related site.
It does not take a geek or loser like yourself just to spend 2 min reading before posting a subject that has been posted everywhere.
The new upgrade goes to the NT kernal over the WinCE one. That does take more horsepower than current devices can do. It will have native support for C++ and a lot of other modern tech (NFC and others). The current chipset in current devices will not be able to handle it with reasonable performance. As I understand it.
IF some hacker was to create a rom for a current device, it would not support more than 1/2 of the OS and the performace would not be anything worth using unless they stripped everything out.
It's really questionable if a hacker will be able to get it working on current devices and what type of performance. If you really want to know the changes, it's a little long but, it really shows what it can and will do...
http://channel9.msdn.com/Events/Windows-Phone/Summit
It's the full streaming event, and it's almost 2 hours but, it's impressive and I can see why they went this route.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Helooo???
Low end WP8 devices will have lower HW specs than some current WP7 devices.
WP8 could run very well on a focus s or HD7 or any other.
There will be custom roms for many current devices, there are many smart guys here that I'm sure will try to do this. Let's hope they will manage to do it.

Will there be any development for this phone?

I remember there was some rom development for the moto z play when I had it. There seems to be no interest for this 3rd generation model. Is there something like an uncrackable, locked bootloader that's stopping developers in their tracks or just no interest in kernels and tweaked roms?

Perhaps some, but from what I've seen, (and I've owned Moto X, Z, Z2play and now this one) there's not a whole lot of development. Some, but not much. Probably because the OS is very vanilla and smooth, for one. And two, unfortunately, they are just not very popular devices.
On the Moto X, most seemed to want to just root and use xposed, and stay stock. Otherwise cool proprietary Moto apps and functions were lost. Not available on custom roms.
The fact that downgrading is near impossible without bricking doesn't help either.
Warranty is void when you unlock bootloader on Moto's site and that probably deters many from messing with the device too.
But this phone is very new still, hopefully some development starts up. Just may take more time, cause it's not that popular and not as many own it. Developers may not be buying it cause it's the 3rd generation now and they've seen that it's not that popular in the past. Time will tell.
Oh, and if mod use is affected by custom roms, that would be a huge roadblock too. For many folks anyways.

When do you think root will be available for this phone? That is what I am waiting for before I buy it.

G.I. Jew said:
When do you think root will be available for this phone? That is what I am waiting for before I buy it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Probably not until a developer or two get this device and work on it.
Problem is, it's 3rd generation, and developers know that development is quiet on the Z's. Many Moto's really. So they choose a more popular device in many cases.
Hopefully we see some action soon though! Or learn to do for ourselves.

...delete me

Just bought this phone and will see about development, I want to get back into it, the only thing I built before was a kernel for Surnia , development is very different nowadays so if it's not to hard count me in.

Hopefully we can get twrp/root. Viper would be awesome on this phone! Thinking about this phone but I AM NOT GOING TO THROW AWAY HARDWARE WARRENTY TO UNLOCK BOOTLOADER. Oneplus 6 looks better but sucks with no fm radio/duel stereo speakers/sd card.
input?? opionion??

vq8acsxht said:
Hopefully we can get twrp/root. Viper would be awesome on this phone! Thinking about this phone but I AM NOT GOING TO THROW AWAY HARDWARE WARRENTY TO UNLOCK BOOTLOADER. Oneplus 6 looks better but sucks with no fm radio/duel stereo speakers/sd card.
input?? opionion??
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Click to collapse
You won't have root then on this device, if it becomes an option. Have to unlock bootloader, which kills your warranty.

Darth said:
You won't have root then on this device, if it becomes an option. Have to unlock bootloader, which kills your warranty.
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Click to collapse
I wonder about this, has there been a case where a manufacturer refused to repair a phone because of warranty root wise?

That is what I am wondering, also. I do not mind them killing the software support. Besides, sounds fony bolony that a person rooting can mess up software that factory reset can't fix. On the other hand, TWRP can brick a phone by flashing things. But if GPS/screen dies, that is not because of TWRP/flashing things, that is because chips have failed aka. hardware failure. What can cause hardware/cpu's failure is bring cpu's up to 100% and leaving there or overclocking them but who would do that? I think a custom ROM is easier on the processors because of all the stock crapware that continues digging for hours on hours for private information making the phone hot. The facebook app is the one that made my phone warm and when I killed it with a root uninstaller, the phone cooled back down.

vq8acsxht said:
That is what I am wondering, also. I do not mind them killing the software support. Besides, sounds fony bolony that a person rooting can mess up software that factory reset can't fix. On the other hand, TWRP can brick a phone by flashing things. But if GPS/screen dies, that is not because of TWRP/flashing things, that is because chips have failed aka. hardware failure. What can cause hardware/cpu's failure is bring cpu's up to 100% and leaving there or overclocking them but who would do that? I think a custom ROM is easier on the processors because of all the stock crapware that continues digging for hours on hours for private information making the phone hot. The facebook app is the one that made my phone warm and when I killed it with a root uninstaller, the phone cooled back down.
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Click to collapse
Actually recent Motos are easy to brick if you do things wrong. Particularly trying to downgrade firmware. Check Out other moto sections, lots of "help I bricked my phone" threads. Many can be fixed by us, but how many don't even try and send it in under warranty?
So that's one definite reason to deny warranty. Though its not directly related to rooting.

I agree. I think they panic and need the phone to work. I like Samsung or Alcatel way of restore the phone to stock. Samsung especially. Turn phone off and plug it into the computer and send firmware to phone. I just wonder why newbies do not read and understand how to restore phone to stock BEFORE touching the phone. They do not ask themselves, "Do I have ALL OF THE TOOLS" to restore phone to factory settings/firmware and "Do I have the firmware". They just want to know how to do mods to phone to see what other tricks the phone can do. Roll over, but DO NOT PLAY DEAD! Crap, "My phone just died". Warranty, where's the warranty card and phone number, now?

vq8acsxht said:
Hopefully we can get twrp/root. Viper would be awesome on this phone! Thinking about this phone but I AM NOT GOING TO THROW AWAY HARDWARE WARRENTY TO UNLOCK BOOTLOADER. Oneplus 6 looks better but sucks with no fm radio/duel stereo speakers/sd card.
input?? opionion??
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Are you a time-traveler who just appeared here naked in the streets, behind a dumpster, with only memories of 2010 in your head?
(Just checking...)
"Viper would be AWESOME on this phone!"
Lolololol-plop.
+ And "TWRP"??
What year *did* the EVO 3D come out anyway?

yourbrotherrex said:
Are you a time-traveler who just appeared here naked in the streets, behind a dumpster, with only memories of 2010 in your head?
(Just checking...)
"Viper would be AWESOME on this phone!"
Lolololol-plop.
+ And "TWRP"??
What year *did* the EVO 3D come out anyway?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
@Darth. If you can translate what the crack pot is saying, thank you. I do not speak pot head, sorry. Not unless he/she/it is infering that he/she/it has just rooted/twrp with viperfx installed?