Related
ok, at 3.6" and 320x240, O2 Exec/JasJar is one of top contenders.
Nokia 9300 is about 4", 640x200 but non-square.
Any others? Budget is of no concern.
If 3-4" of screen is not big enough for you as a phone, you may be interested in FlyBook: 8.9" 16x9 screen (Tri-Band too)
http://www.flybook.biz/en/?section=generic&page=specs
mpman2k said:
If 3-4" of screen is not big enough for you as a phone, you may be interested in FlyBook: 8.9" 16x9 screen (Tri-Band too)
http://www.flybook.biz/en/?section=generic&page=specs
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
*Bwahahahahahaha ...*
Sorry ... just had this mental image of holding up a 1.2kg 'mini-laptop' to the side of my head in order to make a phone call. 8)
agree,... i have Dell Notebook LCD Size 15" and connected to GSM... i wont bring it to a public place just to make a phone call. is it same right? kidding, smile...
I love my PPC
Well I was in Paris having a beer when I saw this guy holding his 15" laptop to his ear and talking. He must have been on wifi and with sype.
So I would thing that a laptop with gsm and a 100" External display would be it.
http://www.engadget.com/2006/03/08/lg-philips-unveils-100-inch-lcd-display/
actually u guys have the right idea.
there are PC Card (PCMCIA) based GPRS/GSM modules.
Pop it into a mini tablet PC, and voila!
I'll see what Tablets are out there in 6-8" size...
My guess is that this is probably a leading candidate -- it's a 19-inch Zenith with Space Phone (a wired speakerphone built into the TV, activated via the remote).
3waygeek said:
My guess is that this is probably a leading candidate -- it's a 19-inch Zenith with Space Phone (a wired speakerphone built into the TV, activated via the remote).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
:!: *phwhooaaarrrrr!* :!:
I absolutely *NEED* one of those babies!
---
But seriously ... I'd strongly recommend a VGA size screen (if you're buying new), as I find that there is nothing better than having more pixels - physical size notwithstanding. Although, I've got very good eyesight, so fine detail and small display features is not an issue for me. Personally I need two monitors for my work / software development, and I use two 1600x1200 20" LCD monitors for this.
If a 3.x" screen isn't large enough, then whatever you purchase really can't be classed as a phone anymore. Holding anything larger up to your ear and/or trying to carry something heavy around is a real problem. I'd probably be quite happy with a 2.x" screen, but at some phenominal resolution. Portability in a phone is absolutely required, but it still needs to have enough information available to be useful.
Choose carefully, and choose wisely. It's more how you use it, and what you use it for which is important. The BA with it's keyboard, built-in WiFi, BT, WM5, etc., etc., etc., pretty much encompassses everything I need. What it's missing ... I'm adding. 8)
well, i'm looking to utilize "pocket pc" aspect more thoroughly
but, it's irritating to deal with content that's desktop oriented. For example, i cant see at once more than like 4 columns in spreadsheet. Same for some PDFs that are not reflow-able...endless scrolling back and forth
starik said:
well, i'm looking to utilize "pocket pc" aspect more thoroughly
but, it's irritating to deal with content that's desktop oriented. For example, i cant see at once more than like 4 columns in spreadsheet. Same for some PDFs that are not reflow-able...endless scrolling back and forth
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I can very much empathize with this problem. And I hate this as well. There are zoom functions, but those only 'mask' the pixel problem.
The only way I can think of solving it is to have some ridiculous resolution, in a very small area. A 3.x" screen running at 480x640 is a start ... but something running at 960x1200 would be ROCKIN'! Mind you - the pixels would be too tiny for most text or for real 'usability' for a lot of people. But ClearType would just look awesome. ;-)
Then again ... maybe something like this would be a good solution. I can see this becoming VERY useful ... especially if battery life can be 'good' from something like this ...
Iljin Display Develops Coin-Sized Laser Projector Module
http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/cellphon...s-coinsized-laser-projector-module-167323.php
The future is looking VERY cool ...
Bigger screen than the Exec:
http://www.windowsfordevices.com/news/NS3737841146.html
raymondu999 said:
Bigger screen than the Exec:
http://www.windowsfordevices.com/news/NS3737841146.html
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
looks very nice!
but, wtf they put WSIM in there
These are the first impressions of a power user after a week with the Diamond - I hope they might help others to decide whether to get one.
EDIT: Things have moved on since this post, you might want to look at post #39 too (page 4)
Background
I'm a power user but also a heavy day-to-day user as well. I use my phone for calling people, basic PDA functions, OTA google sync, web access, IMAP mail, GPS and also .NET software development. (I'm the author of 'Touch Settings') I used to have an HTC Touch. Before that, an HTC Prophet. Before that, an HTC MDA Compact.. ..you get the idea. I like HTC devices. I've stuck with them all, put up with their frustrations and watched them steadily improve. But this phone felt like the most exciting release yet. A massive leap forward in terms of specs. I was calling up Orange for about a month to find out the ETA. I actually RAN to the Orange Shop in Oxford Street and managed to get their last one in stock at the weekend!
So, one week in, here we go...
Great things
THE SCREEN
My favourite thing is the VGA screen. I cannot believe the difference it makes to the look of the phone, seriously. I could never go back to QVGA again now, this is a major improvement. Just reading the operator name in a slim, Arial-Narrow type font at the top of the screen and not being able to see the individual pixels, this is a true step forward. Everything, repeat, EVERYTHING looks better.
THE CAMERA
The auto-focus camera is nothing short of brilliant. Still rubbish in low-light levels, still no flash, but this is light-years ahead of the last one! I still get a little smirk of delight on my face when I hear it whirring as it focuses ahead of taking a picture!
A FASTER PROCESSOR
Hooray! FINALLY!... 528MHz ...4 times faster than my HTC Touch!...in theory. See below.
THE NEW ADD-ONS
Having GPS, FM radio, a tilt switch, a light sensor and more is fantastic. Teeter, the game, is awesome and will impress every person you know at a party.
THE SIZE
The Diamond is slightly smaller than the HTC Touch as well - easier to fit in a pocket. And it really does look gorgeous. Well done HTC.
Enough praise. Because then there's all this:
The Not-so-great things:
THE SPEED
Pop Quiz. Take your Windows Mobile phone. Tap the start button. Then tap 'Programs'. Does the window flash onto your screen immediately? No. There's a delay, isn't there? And sometimes you can even see it drawing every individual icon, top-to-bottom. On my HTC Touch, after a day of use, this took about 2 seconds.
On the Diamond, with TouchFlo 3D running, it's worse.
Skip this paragraph if you don't want a rant. Seriously, when are Windows Mobile phones actually going to get responsive enough to be useable? Delays when you press buttons, delays when you bring up menus, switch applications, etc, etc. What the hell is this operating system DOING with those 537 mega cycles per second??? Having patiently waited through my last THREE sloooow devices, I was thrilled at the thought of a phone that actually whizzed along... ...but it's a bit like going from XP on a slow computer to Vista on a fast computer - no noticable increase in speed at all. Such a crushing disappointment. My old Nokia could re-draw a screen faster 3 years ago. In this day and age, and with a processor doing a belting 500+ MHz, this should NOT be happening. Things should appear INSTANTLY and react the VERY MOMENT you touch them. I am running out of patience. The iPhone is looking more attactive every day.
TFL3D - INTERFACE
Fantastic to look at, but surprisngly sluggish to use. The more days that pass, the more it's becoming apparent that this interface is more about form and less about function. It's also often lacking in visual feedback; sometimes a button will move when you drag it (main nav bar at the bottom), sometimes not! You just have to swipe and see! Visual feedback is a very important part of user interface design.
COMMON ACTIONS, E.G. CALLING PEOPLE
I feel that, action-wise, some things have (incredibly) got HARDER since my HTC Touch. For example, I used to be able to call my favourite contacts with a swipe and a tap.. ..now it's a swipe, a complicated side-swipey thing, a painstaking wait for the piccies to flip around, and finally a tap. Er, hello? This is the MAIN THING I USE THE PHONE FOR - CALLING PEOPLE! I can't even position my favourite contacts in memorable places; again, a big factor in user interface design, hence why you remember where your icons are on your PC's desktop.
HOME SCREEN (TFL3D again really)
I can't add any custom home screen items! What the hell happened to being able to view my list of things to do? (tasks) Seriously, this is a shockingly bad step back. I know there are some apps to work around this, but I'm doing a review of the stock phone and software here.
THE JOYPAD
This should be renamed the joy-less pad. It's virtually impossible to click the Left and Right buttons without frequently mis-tapping and hitting the 'Back' or 'Hang Up' keys instead. There are no markings, you just sort of have to 'guess' where abouts on the flat screen to tap. The actual target area isn't big enough and I'm getting sick of quitting out of screens when I just want to move right or left. I've got fairly big hands but I'm no elephant.
The ipod-style 'whiz-around' wheel seems promising but when you try it, it's under-responsive and jerky in its movements. I would suggest that's why they've limited the applications that support it by default.
NO MINI SD CARD SLOT
Another step back - from 8Gb storage on my HTC Touch (with a mini SD card) to a paltry 4Gb now. Not enough to put all my music on the phone plus nav software, and no slot for more storage.
GROSS GREASINESS
As other forum users have pointed out, all that swiping on this shiny black device - it looks like the back of a transit van after a minute or so of use.
CONCLUSION
Owning an HTC Diamond is without doubt a step forward from an HTC Touch, but it's a smaller step than you might think. Be prepared for a mixed bag of emotions. Joy at the look of the thing, disappointment when you realise it's slower than you hoped, shouts of happiness when you first play 'Teeter', cries of frustration when the screen turns off randomly during calls or you miss-hit the joypad button or you can't swipe the tiny bit of the screen you're meant to.
After all that, I might surprise you by saying this. I would still say this phone is the best option on the market for the day-to-day user who wants an ultra-portable device that packs enough power to do that bit more than just making calls.
Just 24 hours into owning the phone I did my first ROM flash, from 1.37...1 to 1.37...3 - and this helped the speed somewhat and fixed a memory leak. I also tweaked the registry as much as I could. This has helped too, but the above problems are all still too evident, nothing has really improved enough to make me retract any of them. Keep watching these forums, though, because future ROM updates have the power to make this device much, much better.
That's about it, I hope these comments have helped, or given you something to debate in the space below. I'm going to stick with the Diamond for now. But I wouldn't mind betting I'll have completely disabled TouchFlo 3D before the week is out...
Carlos
I too wonder how long I will last with TF3D. However, the joypad is no problem. Simply use the centre button as a reference point. If you rest part of your thumb in there and press any side of it, then it is easy to navigate. At least I find it easy anyway. Hope that might help you.
carlosp_uk said:
I was calling up Orange for about a month to find out the ETA. I actually RAN to the Orange Shop in Oxford Street and managed to get their last one in stock at the weekend!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you were really a fan you would have made sure you were the first, and didn't have to run
mcwtrekkie said:
If you were really a fan you would have made sure you were the first, and didn't have to run
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think I may well have been Orange's first online order! Could not wait.
evilskanker said:
I think I may well have been Orange's first online order! Could not wait.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's the spirit!
Has anyone managed to add a UK city to the weather forecast page ? I found it almost impossible to scroll down to the last page, it keeps selecting wrong countries, the only way I see - scroll one-by-one using hardware buttons ....
Yes, I added 3. Scroll with finger, well, more of a flick.
evilskanker said:
Yes, I added 3. Scroll with finger, well, more of a flick.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think I've tried about 20 different ways of scrolling with a finger, always end up with a list of south american cities ... (
Comparing to my old Orbit, I would say I have to press harder for screen to react ..
hertc said:
I think I've tried about 20 different ways of scrolling with a finger, always end up with a list of south american cities ... (
Comparing to my old Orbit, I would say I have to press harder for screen to react ..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's at times like these that it would be good to be able to use the wheel for scrolling down.
evilskanker said:
It's at times like these that it would be good to be able to use the wheel for scrolling down.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agree, still remember Sony J7 I had long time ago, all these things were so easy with a wheel ..
hertc said:
Comparing to my old Orbit, I would say I have to press harder for screen to react ..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Apparently the Diamond is the first PocketPC device to have a tempered glass screen to make it extra tough. This makes it require a little more pressure than other devices.
But much more resilient to damage, and also nicer on the eye.
wasn't to amazed with the stock rom,
but after some days of usage and flashing the first cooked rom,
i am getting more and more into my new mobile..
Totally agree, using my Diamond for a week after three years on I-mate's.
carlosp_uk said:
CALLING PEOPLE
I feel that, action-wise, some things have (incredibly) got HARDER since my HTC Touch. For example, I used to be able to call my favourite contacts with a swipe and a tap.. ..now it's a swipe, a complicated side-swipey thing, a painstaking wait for the piccies to flip around, and finally a tap. Er, hello? This is the MAIN THING I USE THE PHONE FOR - CALLING PEOPLE! I can't even position my favourite contacts in memorable places;
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just a suggestion -
Speed Dialing.
you can place at least SOME off your favorites in the positions you want.. and then it will just be one long press.. and it will dial.
Phone - menu - Speed Dial.
and of course.. there is always voice dialing.
Turn off TF3D. Ive heard is does HUGE things for the interface speed, and you'll get your tasks back (first thing Im going to do when I get a sprint diamond on this side of the pond)
I agree on almost every point
Not having used touch before, I really can't say anything bad about the navigation. To me it's a revolution, but it's not quite there yet.
The biggest flaw is the biggest asset. Let me explain.
The biggest asset to this device is the screen. I have never liked the screen on any of the QVGA devices I have used (Wizard and Hermes). The VGA screen on the Diamond is fantastic! Crisp and easy to read, even in direct sunlight. The words by HTC "Not too big, not too small" really sums up my feelings about it. However. Screen size is relative to what you display on it. I'm sure a lot of research, testing and effort went in to decide the size of the elements on the TF3D interface. Personally I would have designed it differently.
The main professional reason I choose to use a WiMo is Active Sync OTA (Over-The-Air). Having direct push of Mail, Calendar and Contacts to my device is critical in my profession. This HAS to work, it has to be easy to use, and easy to read. On the Diamond it works fantastically. Lots better than on the Hermes. It takes some getting used to, when you have never used touchflo before.
The touch interface has to be finger friendly, demanding finger sized icons and buttons. Having a small screen required HTC to use the entire screen. That makes you wish for a larger screen, yet a larger screen would require a larger device and I dont want that. Dilemma.
Like you said, the TF3D interface lacks in visual feedback. This could be replaced by tactile feedback. The same technology used in the game TEETER could be used to give me feedback on my actions.
Being a WiMo certified pro I know that the main obstacle for HTC is WiMo itself, or rather the Windows CE it is built upon. Win CE 5 is nowhere near a realtime OS and the switch to Win CE 6 (afaik it will be the foundation for WiMo 7) will be a major leap. CE6 is not a RTOS either, but it has the means to enable truly great applications. I look forward to what Developers will create for WiMo7.
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_Embedded_CE_6.0)
The only thing I really dislike on my Diamond is the scrollwheel. I clearly does not work like you would expect it to. Unintuitive. And the Up/Down/Left/Right navigation around it is near unusable. Using the touch screen works though so it is not a showstopper for me.
Speed of the interface is good once you have used the cache size tweaks. Not great but good.
I fully agree on the speed comment, 527mhz... but it seems it's different mhz compared to my HTC Herald (P4350).
On my Herald I also have WM6.1, a 200mhz cpu (o'ced to 240 mhz) and everything starts faster!
I've got the 1.37.xxx.3 rom on my Diamond, TF3D disabled and still it's slower.
Very strange indeed.
guys i suggest you all to flash duttythroy's diamond project v2 rom. it increased the usability amazingly.
guys i suggest you all to flash duttythroy's diamond project v2 rom. it increased the usability amazingly. and c'mon guys, our shiny precioussssssss is out some weeks. look what they've done with the kaiser within one year... stay patient and keep being excited for that genius piece of hardware.
carlosp_uk said:
These are the first impressions of a power user after a week with the Diamond - I hope they might help others to decide whether to get one.
Background
I'm a power user but also a heavy day-to-day user as well. I use my phone for calling people, basic PDA functions, OTA google sync, web access, IMAP mail, GPS and also .NET software development. (I'm the author of 'Touch Settings') I used to have an HTC Touch. Before that, an HTC Prophet. Before that, an HTC MDA Compact.. ..you get the idea. I like HTC devices. I've stuck with them all, put up with their frustrations and watched them steadily improve. But this phone felt like the most exciting release yet. A massive leap forward in terms of specs. I was calling up Orange for about a month to find out the ETA. I actually RAN to the Orange Shop in Oxford Street and managed to get their last one in stock at the weekend!
So, one week in, here we go...
Great things
THE SCREEN
My favourite thing is the VGA screen. I cannot believe the difference it makes to the look of the phone, seriously. I could never go back to QVGA again now, this is a major improvement. Just reading the operator name in a slim, Arial-Narrow type font at the top of the screen and not being able to see the individual pixels, this is a true step forward. Everything, repeat, EVERYTHING looks better.
THE CAMERA
The auto-focus camera is nothing short of brilliant. Still rubbish in low-light levels, still no flash, but this is light-years ahead of the last one! I still get a little smirk of delight on my face when I hear it whirring as it focuses ahead of taking a picture!
A FASTER PROCESSOR
Hooray! FINALLY!... 528MHz ...4 times faster than my HTC Touch!...in theory. See below.
THE NEW ADD-ONS
Having GPS, FM radio, a tilt switch, a light sensor and more is fantastic. Teeter, the game, is awesome and will impress every person you know at a party.
THE SIZE
The Diamond is slightly smaller than the HTC Touch as well - easier to fit in a pocket. And it really does look gorgeous. Well done HTC.
Enough praise. Because then there's all this:
The Not-so-great things:
THE SPEED
Pop Quiz. Take your Windows Mobile phone. Tap the start button. Then tap 'Programs'. Does the window flash onto your screen immediately? No. There's a delay, isn't there? And sometimes you can even see it drawing every individual icon, top-to-bottom. On my HTC Touch, after a day of use, this took about 2 seconds.
On the Diamond, with TouchFlo 3D running, it's worse.
Skip this paragraph if you don't want a rant. Seriously, when are Windows Mobile phones actually going to get responsive enough to be useable? Delays when you press buttons, delays when you bring up menus, switch applications, etc, etc. What the hell is this operating system DOING with those 537 mega cycles per second??? Having patiently waited through my last THREE sloooow devices, I was thrilled at the thought of a phone that actually whizzed along... ...but it's a bit like going from XP on a slow computer to Vista on a fast computer - no noticable increase in speed at all. Such a crushing disappointment. My old Nokia could re-draw a screen faster 3 years ago. In this day and age, and with a processor doing a belting 500+ MHz, this should NOT be happening. Things should appear INSTANTLY and react the VERY MOMENT you touch them. I am running out of patience. The iPhone is looking more attactive every day.
TFL3D - INTERFACE
Fantastic to look at, but surprisngly sluggish to use. The more days that pass, the more it's becoming apparent that this interface is more about form and less about function. It's also often lacking in visual feedback; sometimes a button will move when you drag it (main nav bar at the bottom), sometimes not! You just have to swipe and see! Visual feedback is a very important part of user interface design.
COMMON ACTIONS, E.G. CALLING PEOPLE
I feel that, action-wise, some things have (incredibly) got HARDER since my HTC Touch. For example, I used to be able to call my favourite contacts with a swipe and a tap.. ..now it's a swipe, a complicated side-swipey thing, a painstaking wait for the piccies to flip around, and finally a tap. Er, hello? This is the MAIN THING I USE THE PHONE FOR - CALLING PEOPLE! I can't even position my favourite contacts in memorable places; again, a big factor in user interface design, hence why you remember where your icons are on your PC's desktop.
HOME SCREEN (TFL3D again really)
I can't add any custom home screen items! What the hell happened to being able to view my list of things to do? (tasks) Seriously, this is a shockingly bad step back. I know there are some apps to work around this, but I'm doing a review of the stock phone and software here.
THE JOYPAD
This should be renamed the joy-less pad. It's virtually impossible to click the Left and Right buttons without frequently mis-tapping and hitting the 'Back' or 'Hang Up' keys instead. There are no markings, you just sort of have to 'guess' where abouts on the flat screen to tap. The actual target area isn't big enough and I'm getting sick of quitting out of screens when I just want to move right or left. I've got fairly big hands but I'm no elephant.
The ipod-style 'whiz-around' wheel seems promising but when you try it, it's under-responsive and jerky in its movements. I would suggest that's why they've limited the applications that support it by default.
NO MINI SD CARD SLOT
Another step back - from 8Gb storage on my HTC Touch (with a mini SD card) to a paltry 4Gb now. Not enough to put all my music on the phone plus nav software, and no slot for more storage.
GROSS GREASINESS
As other forum users have pointed out, all that swiping on this shiny black device - it looks like the back of a transit van after a minute or so of use.
CONCLUSION
Owning an HTC Diamond is without doubt a step forward from an HTC Touch, but it's a smaller step than you might think. Be prepared for a mixed bag of emotions. Joy at the look of the thing, disappointment when you realise it's slower than you hoped, shouts of happiness when you first play 'Teeter', cries of frustration when the screen turns off randomly during calls or you miss-hit the joypad button or you can't swipe the tiny bit of the screen you're meant to.
After all that, I might surprise you by saying this. I would still say this phone is the best option on the market for the day-to-day user who wants an ultra-portable device that packs enough power to do that bit more than just making calls.
Just 24 hours into owning the phone I did my first ROM flash, from 1.37...1 to 1.37...3 - and this helped the speed somewhat and fixed a memory leak. I also tweaked the registry as much as I could. This has helped too, but the above problems are all still too evident, nothing has really improved enough to make me retract any of them. Keep watching these forums, though, because future ROM updates have the power to make this device much, much better.
That's about it, I hope these comments have helped, or given you something to debate in the space below. I'm going to stick with the Diamond for now. But I wouldn't mind betting I'll have completely disabled TouchFlo 3D before the week is out...
Carlos
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
what a crap...
THE SPEED
Put one of the new ROMs on it (Dutty, Walshieau), runs like hell. No delay here!
TFL3D - INTERFACE
Simply switch TF3D off if you don't like it.
And use an existing tool for your today (SPB Mobile Shell ect.).
COMMON ACTIONS, E.G. CALLING PEOPLE
Disable the Diamond dialer, you get your traditional dialer back.
HOME SCREEN (TFL3D again really)
Simply switch TF3D off.
Use an existing tool for today (SPB Mobile Shell ect.).
THE JOYPAD
Get used to it, it works perfect after a few weeks.
NO MINI SD CARD SLOT
Ok, maybe you got a point...
On the other hand: do you really need ALL your music all the time. A sync now and then for other music isn't that hard.
GROSS GREASINESS
Ok, the shiny cover gets greasy. But is't so beautiful,,,
Been trying to google this for a while, but is the Diamond multitouch capable?
Been playing the Maggot Pinball and seems like you can touch both flippers at the same time. Or hold down one flipper and use the other. If so, can't someone write a decent drum kit app for the Diamond? Iphone's killing us in this area.
Well, even if the diamond is screen itself multitouch (which I doubt), could WM6.1 handle it ? I thought it was for WM7
Don't know if it's related, but I just discovered that trying to slide with the stylus is impossible for me, I can do it with the finger only, no matter how strong I press...
hard for me too, but not impossible
my opinion is that multi touch sucks ass, 99% of the time you hold your phone in one hand, with only your thumb available for touch.
Its useless for normal use, and its battery draining since the screen must handle more parameters at once.
so i think iphone lacks something to wm.
grr
multi-touch may be good for some things but bad for others, it depends really on the application at hand (or game).
i'm not sure if this is correct, but i had read somewhere that multi-touch is purely driver and software related, and not related to the hardware itself. i remember the old macbook pros were originally single-touch until they were given a driver/software update which enabled multi-touch functionality. please correct me if i'm wrong as i don't read up too much on macs.
It's not purely software, the hardware has to support it. I dont know much on the topic but i do know there are only a few types of touch screen and only a certain type supports it. I think they normally use an X Y grid and send pulses down the x and the Y and see where they meet, and then thats where your finger is. However if you have 2 fingers then it doesnt know what to do. Multitouch requires a different kind of hardware.
surface_rom, i think you're being a bit harsh on multi-touc, it's most deffinitely not battery draining.
ljames28 said:
It's not purely software, the hardware has to support it. I dont know much on the topic but i do know there are only a few types of touch screen and only a certain type supports it. I think they normally use an X Y grid and send pulses down the x and the Y and see where they meet, and then thats where your finger is. However if you have 2 fingers then it doesnt know what to do. Multitouch requires a different kind of hardware.
surface_rom, i think you're being a bit harsh on multi-touc, it's most deffinitely not battery draining.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for clearing that up for me. I do find that multi-touch on the diamond wouldn't be that beneficial, considering the screen size and device size (in comparison to that of the iPhone, which has a larger screen and overall size) and the fact that you would use the phone 1-handed majority of the time (I do, unless I am typing where I would hold the phone with 2 hands to type with 2 thumbs).
Huey85 said:
Thanks for clearing that up for me. I do find that multi-touch on the diamond wouldn't be that beneficial, considering the screen size and device size (in comparison to that of the iPhone, which has a larger screen and overall size) and the fact that you would use the phone 1-handed majority of the time (I do, unless I am typing where I would hold the phone with 2 hands to type with 2 thumbs).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, bit too small for multi-touch. You could only do that zooming in thing diagonally, theres not enough room sideways.
Btw the fact you can actually use the Diamond one handed is quite a good thing that people may take for granted, how many other non-smartphone WM phones can you type one handed, or even use one handed for that matter? Normally you need the stylus or you need the other hand to steady the phone while you use your nail to move around the phone.
Yes, quite true. I absolutely love the Diamond's size and being able to use it 1-handedly for majority of the tasks which I use it for.
surface_rom said:
my opinion is that multi touch sucks ass, 99% of the time you hold your phone in one hand, with only your thumb available for touch.
Its useless for normal use, and its battery draining since the screen must handle more parameters at once.
so i think iphone lacks something to wm.
grr
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agree! 100%
Just found this on some other site:
HTC Diamond's Hidden Multitouch Revealed
If you're reading the back of the HTC Diamond's box, it doesn't show some little child laughing with glee as he pinches in and out of webpages or draws with two fingers at once, in fact, it doesn't even list multitouch as a feature at all. But just because you can't see something doesn't mean it isn't there. When using the program NavDbgTool, HTC's secret weapon is uncovered—the entire front case supports tandem touching.
I've been obsessing over the N1 since launch. Android is super neat, and unlocked phones rock. The only thing that really held me back from the purchase was the multitouch issue. I could easily see having to reset my screen with a lock cycle would drive me crazy. That said, I love the idea of the N1, and wish to escape my iPhone prison.
I recently purchased a Galaxy S phone, but am annoyed by the lack of support (saw this coming) and non-functioning locational services. The GPS and Compass are totally and utterly busted. Sadly, Google stopped selling the N1 on the day I decided to order one. However, I have been given a second chance, by purchasing the dev phone (which I am now considering).
So, let's make this like ripping off a bandage. Have mercy, internet. I have questions that require honest answers. I'm sorry if you've heard it all before, but this kind of information is annoyingly hard to dig up. Lightning Round, Go!:
Is the multitouch problem with the N1 (inverse axis swapping when two points cross) still present with 2.2?
Do any custom ROMs, apps or tweaks solve this issue? I read that the Moto Droid had a software setting ticked that allows proper multitouch (a sort of software hack), that google had not opted to enable by default? Sounds a bit silly to me, but what's the deal?
Does your screen still lose track of your fingers (inputing the wrong characters on the keyboard), causing you to lock cycle your screen to reset the digitizer?
Are the touch-buttons difficult to use?
A fellow N1 owner I met told me that his phone showed no signs of the multitouch 'bug', when using 'Multitouch Vis Test'. He said he was running the Modaco ROM. Is it true that something in this ROM fixes the multitouch problem?
Thank you, Princes of Internet.
Personally i dont experience any multitouch issues on my n1. Im running stock froyo 2.2. I have only had to re-lock my screen once and it never happened again. The capicative buttons below the screen take a bit of time to get used to at first it might take you a couple of tries to register a click but a few hours of use you get the hang of it.
Sent from my Nexus One using XDA App
Thanks for the reply.
Would you mind taking the 'Multitouch Vis Test' app for a spin, to see if the problem is gone, or if you just don't notice it?
If the issue is gone, would you mind making a youtube vid of it?
The multitouch on the n1 will not be "fixed" unless google/htc decided to use different hardware. If you can live with a device that can only do pinch to zoom, but not true multitouch, then the n1 is fine.
Honestly at this point, I'd hold off until you see the rest of HTC's lineup that's coming up before december.
Jon C said:
Is the multitouch problem with the N1 (inverse axis swapping when two points cross) still present with 2.2?
Do any custom ROMs, apps or tweaks solve this issue? I read that the Moto Droid had a software setting ticked that allows proper multitouch (a sort of software hack), that google had not opted to enable by default? Sounds a bit silly to me, but what's the deal?
Does your screen still lose track of your fingers (inputing the wrong characters on the keyboard), causing you to lock cycle your screen to reset the digitizer?
Are the touch-buttons difficult to use?
A fellow N1 owner I met told me that his phone showed no signs of the multitouch 'bug', when using 'Multitouch Vis Test'. He said he was running the Modaco ROM. Is it true that something in this ROM fixes the multitouch problem?
Thank you, Princes of Internet.
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1) It was possibly noticable in 2.1, in 2.2 in months now I havn't see it once. You can see with the visualiser you really have to know how to force it to get it to go, its just not something which will occur with correct commands you'll be doing.
2) Its down to the hardware, I'm not aware of any custom ROMs which have anything/anything significant.
3) The only time I EVER get this is with beta super bundles of ROMs, which is either the fault of the ROM, something going skitz in dalvic, how I installed it, or just a self generating bug. All of which are easily fixable. However if you were to stay with stock or more tested ROMs, you'd literally never see this.
4) For me they just work, at the start yes they wouldnt act the same a touch screen, but now they'll act like I want maybe 99% of the time. Sure friends using it to start with have to get used to it, but its not 'broken' if you will. The only thing I will mention is if your using it in weird orientations, there is a chance of hitting the buttons [mainly search] without meaning to with parts of your hand.
5) Again, this problem ONLY shows up if you know how to 'break' it. With 2.2+ its really hard to do it if you handed the phone to someone who's never used it before, because also again you wont be doing any commands which would conflict with the limitations, so you have to be misusing it in the first place to get the bug.
JCopernicus said:
Honestly at this point, I'd hold off until you see the rest of HTC's lineup that's coming up before december.
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Agree with this.
Multitouch is completely crap on the n1. I loved it otherwise, yes every now and again it goes wack and registers the wrong thing... the capacitive buttons also suck and are hard to get used to... on Multitouch test its wacky and registers the wrong finger and won't register more than 2...
Great device, but galaxy is better.. I don't have any gps issues so can't complain about that.
No. No roms will fix the Multitouch issue. Nor make it any better.. if your into gaming with controls on the same axis forget about it, if ya want Multitouch keyboard forget about it...
I still have yet to ever experience the actual axis switch issue using this phone in real world. Sure the issue exists, but it just doesn't effect a single thing unless you use a certain game. But even that works fine, watch YouTube videos showing emulators on the nexus.
The point is, if you're looking for a reason to not get the nexus, The axis switch issue is not the reason that should sway your decision.
I recently came from an iPhone and I haven't noticed any difference in the multi-touch screen (except maybe in the typing on occasion, which I just attributed to my big fingers). I'd say for a good 95%+ of what you would do on the phone you can't tell any difference between the iPhone or N1 multitouch.
With the touch buttons on the bottom of the screen... Sometimes I hit one while typing, which takes me back to the home screen, but since the N1 has true multitasking all I have to do is reopen the app. A minor inconvenience. Or I could just type in landscape mode and not have any trouble at all.
RogerPodacter said:
I still have yet to ever experience the actual axis switch issue using this phone in real world. Sure the issue exists, but it just doesn't effect a single thing unless you use a certain game. But even that works fine, watch YouTube videos showing emulators on the nexus.
The point is, if you're looking for a reason to not get the nexus, The axis switch issue is not the reason that should sway your decision.
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Games like toonWarz or nova will mess up. Has the controls on bottom right and shooting on bottom right. So when your running using the left controls and shoot real quick with the right, it'll now wig out and keep shooting even when you let go and the dude will walk a different way be cause now the sensor thinks your touching in a different spot..
Now you can let go of the left finger then shoot but when ya need precision in some shooting games you will be dead if you do that....
Pinch to zoom is fine and emulators with controls on the top and bottom vs just the bottom ( same axis), but for games like nova, heavy gunner, modern combat, ps1 emulator (unless it has opposite axis controls) which mine don't, took Warz, etc. It will not work properly ....
smashpunks said:
Games like toonWarz or nova will mess up. Has the controls on bottom right and shooting on bottom right. So when your running using the left controls and shoot real quick with the right, it'll now wig out and keep shooting even when you let go and the dude will walk a different way be cause now the sensor thinks your touching in a different spot..
Now you can let go of the left finger then shoot but when ya need precision in some shooting games you will be dead if you do that....
Pinch to zoom is fine and emulators with controls on the top and bottom vs just the bottom ( same axis), but for games like nova, heavy gunner, modern combat, ps1 emulator (unless it has opposite axis controls) which mine don't, took Warz, etc. It will not work properly ....
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this is a good explanation of what is effected. if you're a big gamer then consider it, but things like pinch to zoom in the browser, maps, pics, works just as great as ever.
Thanks for the feedback, guys.
Coming from the Galaxy S, I imagine I will miss a few things. One of them being: media playback and overall storage.
I guess with the N1, I'd need to find a non-bootlegged 32GB microSD card. But my other question would be: is there an easy way to play all of the content that the Galaxy S can handle, or is the GPU in the Samsung phone so much better that the N1 can't keep up?
I really like that about the SGS: I just drop movies (mp4, xvid, divx and so forth) onto the internal ROM and they play without issue. Media capabilities are very nice.
Does the N1 play lots of videos like this out of the box? If not, is there a decent media application?
Also, about HTC's other devices: I'd love to wait, but I'm worried that the newer phones won't have nice accessories. The N1 has that awesome car dock, that I would use all of the time. The SGS doesn't have any accessories like that, and it makes me sad. Most of HTC's N1 follow-up lacked similar docks and cradles.
If I return this SGS (likely), I will probably be jumping to the N1, just for that 'official' feel of it (very sturdy, solid first-party accessories).
You have no idea how sad I was, when Google announced they were giving up on creating their own phones. Hate them all you want: but Apple really has that system (solid build, quality integration / lack of fragmentation) nailed. I was really hoping that Google could bring that unification to Android with their own branded devices.
Loving Android, though. Never going back to iOS.
Anyone saying the n1 doesn't suffer from multitouch issues is sadly mistaken. The one thing that bugs me about the n1 is the touch screen issue. You won't be able to play games like nova, or certain games on emulators (when using dpad plus buttons that are at the same level it has issues) and it does have issues when crossing the axises.
mjm128 said:
Anyone saying the n1 doesn't suffer from multitouch issues is sadly mistaken. The one thing that bugs me about the n1 is the touch screen issue. You won't be able to play games like nova, or certain games on emulators (when using dpad plus buttons that are at the same level it has issues) and it does have issues when crossing the axises.
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everyone said the issue exists it just doesnt show up unless you...play....games. otherwise its a non issue.
The N1's touchscreen is totaly crap. There is a thread about touchscreen issues at oficial forum. It has more than 2000 posts explaning all problems of nexus one touchscreen. Check it out.
Sent from my Nexus One using XDA App
Jon C said:
Thanks for the feedback, guys.
Coming from the Galaxy S, I imagine I will miss a few things. One of them being: media playback and overall storage.
I guess with the N1, I'd need to find a non-bootlegged 32GB microSD card. But my other question would be: is there an easy way to play all of the content that the Galaxy S can handle, or is the GPU in the Samsung phone so much better that the N1 can't keep up?
I really like that about the SGS: I just drop movies (mp4, xvid, divx and so forth) onto the internal ROM and they play without issue. Media capabilities are very nice.
Does the N1 play lots of videos like this out of the box? If not, is there a decent media application?
Also, about HTC's other devices: I'd love to wait, but I'm worried that the newer phones won't have nice accessories. The N1 has that awesome car dock, that I would use all of the time. The SGS doesn't have any accessories like that, and it makes me sad. Most of HTC's N1 follow-up lacked similar docks and cradles.
If I return this SGS (likely), I will probably be jumping to the N1, just for that 'official' feel of it (very sturdy, solid first-party accessories).
You have no idea how sad I was, when Google announced they were giving up on creating their own phones. Hate them all you want: but Apple really has that system (solid build, quality integration / lack of fragmentation) nailed. I was really hoping that Google could bring that unification to Android with their own branded devices.
Loving Android, though. Never going back to iOS.
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The gpu is OK. But definitely a lot less powerful than the sgs, you will notice in movies, live wallpapers and especially games... there's a decent video player called rockplayer that plays a lot of stuff like avi and xvid , but its not ad good as the sgs player ...
Put it this way, either stay sgs and have a not so well navigation but awesome everything elsex or go nexus with good GPS but a old touch sensor that will hardly recognize both fingers on anything other than pinch to zoom.....
The only real world scenario i have encountered the axis switch is when you do a pinch on an album in the gallery to have it flick through them, it switches often when doing that.
Nexus One multi-touch sucks for games. I've tried some fancy gameloft games that req two fingers on screen, or PS & gameboy emulators that req this and it drives me insane. Can be so frustrating for gaming and is the only thing that I find a let down for this device. I wish I knew before I purchased it because the gaming although not the only thing I brought it for is something that I thought would be cool on my phone.
Simply put, don't get the N1 if mobile gaming is important to you. I'm not talking about simple single tap games, but the intricate ones (PSX Emu, EA Sports, Gamesloft, etc). If you could live without it, the touchscreen is fine for regular day to day use.
Or just root and carry your favorite bluetooth game controller. I have a mini bt keyboard that works great for emulators
So iam now 3 days in with the S10 plus and i have to say that while theres lots i love about it , iam also disappointed. Here are my complaints thus far..... I pray some of these can and will be fixed with a software update.
1 - Camera, Yes its pretty good but i expected more. No better then the S9 imo. Expected a little more from Samsung with regards the camera this year.
2 - Kepad touch issues..... I virtually cannot type on this phone without constantly and accidentally hitting the 'p' key. I do not have chubby hands or anything but whenever i need to reach across to the left side of the keypad , iam forever hitting that 'p' key and it drives me crazy to the point where i may return the phone.
3 - No notification LED - This wouldnt be a deal breaker if Edge lighting worked properly but Edge lighting is pretty damn poor lets be honest. Works fine for default messaging app but thats about it.
4 - Fingerprint scanner - Was awful initially but improved massively once i removed the pre-installed screen protector and added a second fingerprint using the same finger. However, I still find that it occasionally fails to read my fingerprint. I feel like iam placing my thumb in the right area given that the icon lights up to help me but somehow it still sometimes fails. I would say it works around 80% of the time
5 - Fast Charging - Again i expected more. Its not slow but its not fast either. It takes around 1hr 45 mins to get from 15% - 100%
For me personally i would be happy if they could improve the keypad and fingerprint issue but theres already been updates and not much has changed.
You mention keypad, are you talking about the keyboard? If so just use another keyboard.
Tel864 said:
You mention keypad, are you talking about the keyboard? If so just use another keyboard.
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Tried another keyboard but same issue! Its the curved display ultimately thats the issue i guess not the keyboard. Although i also owned an S8 and S9 Plus and neither of them had this issue!
Blaalad12 said:
Tried another keyboard but same issue! Its the curved display ultimately thats the issue i guess not the keyboard. Although i also owned an S8 and S9 Plus and neither of them had this issue!
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Yea, that is odd. I sometimes fat finger but never that way, mine seems to be i and 8.
Tel864 said:
Yea, that is odd. I sometimes fat finger but never that way, mine seems to be i and 8.
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Ha When i reach over to the left edge of the display to type, my skin hits the 'p' key. Its absolutely driving me insane ha
Blaalad12 said:
Tried another keyboard but same issue! Its the curved display ultimately thats the issue i guess not the keyboard. Although i also owned an S8 and S9 Plus and neither of them had this issue!
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You can modify the size of the keyboard for this very reason, move it up or down until you can use it comfortably.
You can also modify the curve display deadzone with goodlock.
I'm also surprised that AOD doesn't fill the void of a notification led.. it certainly does for me.. In saying that I would like to see a notification ring around the camera cutout, I think that would of been a nice touch.
I agree with you on everything you mentioned.
I would add one more thing regarding accidental touches, I am a skinny guy, and so are my hands, but whenever I am reaching to other side of the screen, I find the screen either not responding to my touches or causing accidental touches, what drives me crazy is that I check the palm of my hand and almost always it's not even touching the edge of the screen, it's as if even when your skin is hovering few mm above the edge if the screen the phone will take it as if your actually touching it, if that makes sense.
As for the camera, coming from the Note 9, I am so disappointed with the low light capabilities of this phone, even indoors it's not up to par with other flagships, I even get worse shots than my previous Note 9 and S9. To make matters worse, Samsung didn't include a propper night mode that can compete with Huawei's night mode or the Pixel's night sight.
Sorry for my bad English, I hope I was clear enough in delivering my point. Cheers.
Blaalad12 said:
So iam now 3 days in with the S10 plus and i have to say that while theres lots i love about it , iam also disappointed. Here are my complaints thus far..... I pray some of these can and will be fixed with a software update.
1 - Camera, Yes its pretty good but i expected more. No better then the S9 imo. Expected a little more from Samsung with regards the camera this year.
2 - Kepad touch issues..... I virtually cannot type on this phone without constantly and accidentally hitting the 'p' key. I do not have chubby hands or anything but whenever i need to reach across to the left side of the keypad , iam forever hitting that 'p' key and it drives me crazy to the point where i may return the phone.
3 - No notification LED - This wouldnt be a deal breaker if Edge lighting worked properly but Edge lighting is pretty damn poor lets be honest. Works fine for default messaging app but thats about it.
4 - Fingerprint scanner - Was awful initially but improved massively once i removed the pre-installed screen protector and added a second fingerprint using the same finger. However, I still find that it occasionally fails to read my fingerprint. I feel like iam placing my thumb in the right area given that the icon lights up to help me but somehow it still sometimes fails. I would say it works around 80% of the time
5 - Fast Charging - Again i expected more. Its not slow but its not fast either. It takes around 1hr 45 mins to get from 15% - 100%
For me personally i would be happy if they could improve the keypad and fingerprint issue but theres already been updates and not much has changed.
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Have you tried disabling Touch Sensitivity? I had some issues at first, but after disabling touch sensitivity, it improved a bit.
Blaalad12 said:
So iam now 3 days in with the S10 plus and i have to say that while theres lots i love about it , iam also disappointed. Here are my complaints thus far..... I pray some of these can and will be fixed with a software update.
1 - Camera, Yes its pretty good but i expected more. No better then the S9 imo. Expected a little more from Samsung with regards the camera this year.
2 - Kepad touch issues..... I virtually cannot type on this phone without constantly and accidentally hitting the 'p' key. I do not have chubby hands or anything but whenever i need to reach across to the left side of the keypad , iam forever hitting that 'p' key and it drives me crazy to the point where i may return the phone.
3 - No notification LED - This wouldnt be a deal breaker if Edge lighting worked properly but Edge lighting is pretty damn poor lets be honest. Works fine for default messaging app but thats about it.
4 - Fingerprint scanner - Was awful initially but improved massively once i removed the pre-installed screen protector and added a second fingerprint using the same finger. However, I still find that it occasionally fails to read my fingerprint. I feel like iam placing my thumb in the right area given that the icon lights up to help me but somehow it still sometimes fails. I would say it works around 80% of the time
5 - Fast Charging - Again i expected more. Its not slow but its not fast either. It takes around 1hr 45 mins to get from 15% - 100%
For me personally i would be happy if they could improve the keypad and fingerprint issue but theres already been updates and not much has changed.
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Click to collapse
The S10 does have a Multi Colored Notification LED around it's camera cutout. This YouTube video explains how to activate and manage it.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Android/comments/b0p0o6/s10_s10_how_to_enable_led_notification_light/
Try using a light touch on the fingerprint display reader as opposed to a hard press, this is how it's designed to function.
The S10 Camera has a Pro Mode, you can adjust virtual any aspect of photos to your preference.
varcor said:
The S10 does have a Multi Colored Notification LED around it's camera cutout. This YouTube video explains how to activate and manage it.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Android/comments/b0p0o6/s10_s10_how_to_enable_led_notification_light/
Try using a light touch on the fingerprint display reader as opposed to a hard press, this is how it's designed to function.
The S10 Camera has a Pro Mode, you can adjust virtual any aspect of photos to your preference.
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That notification is from using a 3rd party app and a light touch with the screen protector hasn't worked too well.
I am the same my main issue is the led notification for WhatsApp
Already thinking of going back to my old s8
Keyboard I am also having issues with clicking on the wrong keys
Lenney said:
I am the same my main issue is the led notification for WhatsApp
Already thinking of going back to my old s8
Keyboard I am also having issues with clicking on the wrong keys
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I contacted Samsung about the keyboard issue! All they suggest is to leave feedback. If your using the stock keyboard then it can be resized which i guess kinda is a solution but you have to bring it in from both sides to keep it centered and the keyboard then winds up been a tad too small so its not ideal! Its weird because my s9 plus was almost identical in terms of its dimensions yet it did not have this issue.
fingerprint scanner has also been a nightmare today! I could swear iam not doing anything different yet it works sometimes and rejects me other times. Its makin me miss the finger print scanner on the s9. It was so much better. Another small annoyance is how fast my battery goes from 100% to 99% lol
Battery in general is great but i charge it to 100%, Unplug it and seconds later iam at 99% .......... what the fudge ha
I used an iphone xs temporarily recently and i have to say that while it is over priced and in general Samsung is much better and cheaper too. However, Apple does things properly. It worked flawlessly and never gave issue. The Samsung is far better on paper and ticks all the boxes but in day to day use its just not as 'perfect'