Database Develop

Buy yourself a cheaper battery: using lower amp batteries with the Nexus S

I have always thought that the amperage of a battery made no difference to the voltage due to the factory adjusting the internal resistance of the battery. Amperage I understood was measured in current, however, which does have an effect on overall voltage.
Recall:
V = I * R
With electronics, it is my understanding that the mAh battery doesn't matter as long as the voltage is the same, although you'd get less longevity out of a 1650 mAh vs a 1440 mAh.
Thus, I believe this battery would work. Thoughts? The part number matches exactly what was in my Nexus S and the batteries look identical. If this is the case, save yourself some money buy not searching Nexus S battery and instead searching ab653850ca in eBay instead of paying $30-$40 for a new/replacement Nexus S battery when they are the same thing.
http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-OEM-SAMSUNG...Accessories&hash=item3a5dd479e2#ht_1287wt_900
Thoughts? Both are 3.7 volts.

mAh is a unit of electric charge, not current (notice the 'h' making it milli-Ampere-hour). So, yes, a lower mAh battery will definitely work, but it will last less time.
Also (just trying to explain better) a battery is not a "powered resistor", so the relationship between its voltage and its current is not just ohm's law (the one you recall). More specifically, the 3.7 volts is due to the chemical reaction inside the battery and is more or less fixed (although it decreases as the battery discharges). The current flowing is basically a function of the load of the battery, so it changes according to what parts of the phone are working at that moment. The output resistance of the battery is a formal way of describing how close the battery is to an ideal voltage source and is not related to the amount of current it's actually providing.
Sorry if I was not clear enough, it's late here!

Missed the h. Not sure why, I see mA all the time and I just missed the h. Interesting and helpful. Thanks man. Clear to me.

That's strange, if it is the same model (AB653850CA), why is it only 1440mAh? But I'm sure it will work.

All I know is that this Samsung Moment battery I got off of Amazon for $6 is almost as good as my stock battery.
Sent from my Nexus S using XDA Premium App

The 1440mAh batteries work perfect, I have 2 of them. While you are at it, buy a wall charger to charge them in so they will charge to 100%. Having 2 spares means you will always have a FULLY charged battery to pop in and never have to tether the phone to a charger. Plus you get 2 to 4 extra hours of use.

Very informative!

turbodroid said:
Plus you get 2 to 4 extra hours of use.
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Click to collapse
What do you mean by that ? That the 1440 mAh battery only gives you 2-4 hours ? I doubt it lasts so little time. I hope it doesn't.

No he means charging the batteries in an external charger gives them a more complete charge as I find the same thing. I've got 2 genuine batteries and a third on the way and the external charger charges them to 100% whereas the phone only charges them to around 95%. The batteries charged in the external charger last longer than those charged in the phone.

Hard to know when you're legitimately getting a battery with "more capacity" though, so I just assume I'm always buying another stock battery anyways.

maltloaf said:
No he means charging the batteries in an external charger gives them a more complete charge as I find the same thing. I've got 2 genuine batteries and a third on the way and the external charger charges them to 100% whereas the phone only charges them to around 95%. The batteries charged in the external charger last longer than those charged in the phone.
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Click to collapse
Oh, I got it, thanks !
Anyway, for 6$, I think I'm going to buy one, too. Coupled with the 2nd battery dock, it should work flawlessly.

Hey guys,
I went ahead and ordered one of these too. I noticed that the Watts/hour is 5.55 on the Nexus S battery but on the battery I ordered (but have yet to get in) it says 5.3. Is this going to make a difference outside of how long the battery lasts?
If you guys buy one of these 1440s report back with what you've found out.
And if this is a success, then please urge XDA to sticky this thread or put this on the main page. Paying $50 for a second/replacement Nexus S battery is outrageous, and if this saves my fellow XDA members $45, more people should know about this. :]
UPDATE:
Looks like turbodroid already ordered these and said they work great! Thanks guys! Thank me if this was helpful.

Maximizing Nexus 4 battery charge cycles. Reducing battery capacity drop.

I've been following the great battery impression thread, which discusses ways to tweak the Nexus 4 settings, ROMs, and so forth for maximum run time between charging. This thread focuses on a different battery concern.
The Nexus 4 lithium polymer battery is sealed, and as far as I know, there are still several unknowns about replacing it. We've seen a tear-down showing how to remove the battery. However, as of now, few users have attempted it and there's not a consensus about how easy or difficult it is to do. Questions include:
Even with the correct tools, are the tabs that secure the Nexus 4's back prone to breakage, potentially leaving the case borked?
Is the battery difficult to extricate from its compartment?
Will it a high quality replacement battery become available inexpensively on eBay and elsewhere, or is it this battery, which was not designed to be user-replaceable, too much of an oddball for that to happen meaning that a replacement battery will be expensive and hard to find?
That said, the ease (or lack thereof) of replacing the Nexus 4's battery isn't what I've come here to discuss.
Given the unknowns about battery replacement, my concern is to how to maximize the Nexus 4 battery charge cycles and reduce the capacity drop of the battery over time. It could be bad if after just a year, the Nexus 4's capacity is already noticeably dropping. Not possible? I'm not so sure. Based on what I've read, it may depend upon how we handle charging.
This article at "Battery University" discusses the discharge characteristics of Lithium batteries, and it is my understanding that Lithium Polymer batteries, like the one in the Nexus 4 mirror these characteristics.
My takeaway from the article is:
Charging the Nexus 4 battery before it drops to less than 50% capacity will greatly increase the number of charge cycles before there's a noticeable capacity drop. Letting the battery nearly completely discharge will greatly reduce the number of charge cycles, and therefore greatly reduce the time before battery replacement will be necessary. (Table 2)
Inductive (wireless) charging, while convenient, generates extra heat that will over time reduce the recoverable capacity of the battery. (Table 3)
Having read this article, I am curious about the charging characteristics of the Nexus 4 and which, if any, charging variables we can control as users to maximize battery longevity.

When I first get a new smartphone I try to do a handful of full cycle charges before doing any partial charges. Your battery is still "new" and in the "break in" period. Many users that were the first to get theirs have reported their battery life as getting better. Of course a lot to do with battery are things like your data usage and what you have syncing.

RealiZms said:
When I first get a new smartphone I try to do a handful of full cycle charges before doing any partial charges. Your battery is still "new" and in the "break in" period. Many users that were the first to get theirs have reported their battery life as getting better. Of course a lot to do with battery are things like your data usage and what you have syncing.
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Click to collapse
Thanks, but I will again clarify that that I created this thread to discuss maximizing the Nexus 4 battery's long-term life and recoverable capacity, not maximizing run-down time in the short-term. That is already being discussed extensively in the great battery impression thread.

I have had a lot of experience with LiIon batteries over the years and I can tell you that the enemy of them is both inactivity and deep discharge use.
Use your phone as you normally would, but avoid frequent deep discharges. Don't be afraid about the number of charge cycles. Frequent charges are better than deep discharge cycles.
These pups have been designed to be used the way most folks use frequently used rechargeable devices. Pop it on the charger when you can, even if you know it won't be there long enough to be topped off. The more frequent and varied activity the better.

I'll add that I do not currently see an LG BL-T5 Nexus 4 replacement battery sold anywhere.

FYI - The Nexus 4 uses an 800 cycle battery as well so makes it even less of a thing to worry about. My SGS2 still gives me good battery life and it's more than 1yr old already, and i think that is a 300 cycle battery. Remember also that at that 800 cycle mark the battery should still have 80% of it's original capacity. 800 cycles is more than 2yrs of constant use/charge every night and for people that don't so much that could put you in the 3yr-4yr range. If you still have this phone 4yrs from now, i think you wont need to complain if it "only" has 80% of it's original charge.

Hi
borntochill said:
I've been following the great battery impression thread, which discusses ways to tweak the Nexus 4 settings, ROMs, and so forth for maximum run time between charging. This thread focuses on a different battery concern.
The Nexus 4 lithium polymer battery is sealed, and as far as I know, there are still several unknowns about replacing it. We've seen a tear-down showing how to remove the battery. However, as of now, few users have attempted it and there's not a consensus about how easy or difficult it is to do. Questions include:
Even with the correct tools, are the tabs that secure the Nexus 4's back prone to breakage, potentially leaving the case borked?
Is the battery difficult to extricate from its compartment?
Will it a high quality replacement battery become available inexpensively on eBay and elsewhere, or is it this battery, which was not designed to be user-replaceable, too much of an oddball for that to happen meaning that a replacement battery will be expensive and hard to find?
That said, the ease (or lack thereof) of replacing the Nexus 4's battery isn't what I've come here to discuss.
Given the unknowns about battery replacement, my concern is to how to maximize the Nexus 4 battery charge cycles and reduce the capacity drop of the battery over time. It could be bad if after just a year, the Nexus 4's capacity is already noticeably dropping. Not possible? I'm not so sure. Based on what I've read, it may depend upon how we handle charging.
This article at "Battery University" discusses the discharge characteristics of Lithium batteries, and it is my understanding that Lithium Polymer batteries, like the one in the Nexus 4 mirror these characteristics.
My takeaway from the article is:
Charging the Nexus 4 battery before it drops to less than 50% capacity will greatly increase the number of charge cycles before there's a noticeable capacity drop. Letting the battery nearly completely discharge will greatly reduce the number of charge cycles, and therefore greatly reduce the time before battery replacement will be necessary. (Table 2)
Inductive (wireless) charging, while convenient, generates extra heat that will over time reduce the recoverable capacity of the battery. (Table 3)
Having read this article, I am curious about the charging characteristics of the Nexus 4 and which, if any, charging variables we can control as users to maximize battery longevity.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There is little point in worrying about charging before it's discharged to 50% and/or not charging to maximum. Yes it increases the number of cycles, but is reducing runtime between those cycles, so you have to charge it twice as often using up the extra cycles gained, so overall it tends to even out.
The longevity argument for only partial discharges really only applies at the time of design and specification where the manufacturer can spec a larger battery and sacrifice some of the capacity (by only charging say from 30 to 70%) to get extra charge cycles. Clearly with a mobile phone this isn't desirable to do, as we crave all the the runtime we can get in the smallest form factor possible.
Regards
Phil

shotta35 said:
FYI - The Nexus 4 uses an 800 cycle battery as well so makes it even less of a thing to worry about. My SGS2 still gives me good battery life and it's more than 1yr old already, and i think that is a 300 cycle battery. Remember also that at that 800 cycle mark the battery should still have 80% of it's original capacity. 800 cycles is more than 2yrs of constant use/charge every night and for people that don't so much that could put you in the 3yr-4yr range. If you still have this phone 4yrs from now, i think you wont need to complain if it "only" has 80% of it's original charge.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Is the "800 cycle" rating is based on real world usage, or a set of idealized laboratory conditions that few users will actually meet? Many Nexus 4 forum users are reporting running down their batteries to a discharge depth exceeding 90% on a daily basis before recharging. This will dramatically reduce their battery's number of charge cycles. The "800 cycle" rating is only useful if we know the conditions upon which it was tested.

PhilipL said:
Hi
There is little point in worrying about charging before it's discharged to 50% and/or not charging to maximum. Yes it increases the number of cycles, but is reducing runtime between those cycles, so you have to charge it twice as often using up the extra cycles gained, so overall it tends to even out.
The longevity argument for only partial discharges really only applies at the time of design and specification where the manufacturer can spec a larger battery and sacrifice some of the capacity (by only charging say from 30 to 70%) to get extra charge cycles. Clearly with a mobile phone this isn't desirable to do, as we crave all the the runtime we can get in the smallest form factor possible.
Regards
Phil
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Point taken, although it looks to me like the relationship between discharge depth and maximum number of charge cycles is not linear. From the way I read it, frequent deep discharging can markedly impact battery longevity which is why I'm skeptical of the 800 cycle figure. Given that many Nexus 4 users are currently reporting an inability to make it through a full day without completely draining their battery, those particular users are bound to have shortened battery longevity unless they charge at least twice/day.

Hi
borntochill said:
Point taken, although it looks to me like the relationship between discharge depth and maximum number of charge cycles is not linear. From the way I read it, frequent deep discharging can markedly impact battery longevity which is why I'm skeptical of the 800 cycle figure. Given that many Nexus 4 users are currently reporting an inability to make it through a full day without completely draining their battery, those particular users are bound to have shortened battery longevity unless they charge at least twice/day.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes it isn't linear, but the advantages are also outweighed by the negatives, such as having to plug it in more often to charge, and if people are struggling to get through the day now on a full charge/discharge cycle.....
The 800 cycle figure is probably about right for chemistry used in the LG Nexus, and most of us will have replaced our phone in a couple of years anyway long before we start to notice the lowered battery life.
The other thing with a lithium batteries is they are like perishable foods, even if we don't use them much, after a few years the capacity has diminished anyway. So even if we only charged the phone twice in two years, the third charge capacity would probably not be that much different to having charged it every day for two years.
So we shouldn't worry about the battery, the best thing we can do is use it as much as possible as it is going to degrade anyway, and we will see little benefit from treating it with kit gloves.
The above also assumes the battery can never be replaced. It certainly is replaceable by the manufacturer or a repair centre, and more than likely most of us could manage a replacement ourselves.
Regards
Phil

One very important thing to realize is that these 500/800 or whatever hundred cycles it's talking about is not how many times it can be charged, period.
It's not like after the 500th or 800th charge, this battery can never be powered on again.
Read the article closely:
" the number of discharge/charge cycles Li-ion can deliver at various DoD levels before the battery capacity drops to 70 percent."
Also, if you lower the voltage of the charge, it seems battery long term life greatly increases:
"Most Li-ions are charged to 4.20V/cell and every reduction of 0.10V/cell is said to double cycle life. For example, a lithium-ion cell charged to 4.20V/cell typically delivers 300–500 cycles. If charged to only 4.10V/cell, the life can be prolonged to 600–1,000 cycles; 4.00V/cell should deliver 1,200–2,000 and 3.90V/cell 2,400–4,000 cycles. Table 4 summarizes these results. The values are estimate and depend on the type of li-ion-ion battery."

Hi
borntochill said:
Is the "800 cycle" rating is based on real world usage, or a set of idealized laboratory conditions that few users will actually meet? Many Nexus 4 forum users are reporting running down their batteries to a discharge depth exceeding 90% on a daily basis before recharging. This will dramatically reduce their battery's number of charge cycles. The "800 cycle" rating is only useful if we know the conditions upon which it was tested.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
When a lithium battery is fully discharged, it isn't actually completely discharged. LG like other manufacturers will have programmed a level that shows 0% on the phone before it shuts down, but in reality this might still leave 10% or 20% or 2% capacity in reserve, we don't know the figure, but presumably LG have set both full and empty charge points to ensure we see around 800 cycles.
Regards
Phil
---------- Post added at 09:19 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:10 PM ----------
Hi
ksc6000 said:
Also, if you lower the voltage of the charge, it seems battery long term life greatly increases:
"Most Li-ions are charged to 4.20V/cell and every reduction of 0.10V/cell is said to double cycle life. For example, a lithium-ion cell charged to 4.20V/cell typically delivers 300–500 cycles. If charged to only 4.10V/cell, the life can be prolonged to 600–1,000 cycles; 4.00V/cell should deliver 1,200–2,000 and 3.90V/cell 2,400–4,000 cycles. Table 4 summarizes these results. The values are estimate and depend on the type of li-ion-ion battery."
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes you get more cycles, but because you have a battery with reduced capacity, you are having to charge it more. Overall the benefit isn't as great as the numbers make it. If LG wanted to give us 1600 cycles they could lower the charge voltages, but then the battery capacity would have to be advertised at around 1050mAh, meaning it lasts half the time it does now, and will need charging around twice as often.
For a mobile phone with a typical 2 year life span, the priority is to maximum the time between charges while ensuring the battery lasts the typical 2 years of most peoples phone contracts. It isn't a co-incidence that 800 charges works out as a bit over 2 years if you charge every day.
We don't need to worry about the battery, just enjoy using the phone. Also the battery doesn't just stop working at 800 cycles either, it just doesn't hold as much charge, but capacity is lost anyway over time regardless if you use it or not as lithium batteries start to age the moment they are made.
Regards
Phil

PhilipL said:
For a mobile phone with a typical 2 year life span, the priority is to maximum the time between charges while ensuring the battery lasts the typical 2 years of most peoples phone contracts. It isn't a co-incidence that 800 charges works out as a bit over 2 years if you charge every day.
We don't need to worry about the battery, just enjoy using the phone.
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Click to collapse
A lot of assumptions there, Phil.
My "priorities" and LG's differ. 2 years from now, some will replace their Nexus 4 with whatever shiny new phone comes along that offers holographic video projection chat and does double duty as a sex robot. However, I will happily trudge on with my Nexus 4 for between 3 to 5 years which is how long I typically own a phone before replacement. I don't need bleeding edge, especially if the bleeding edge is a menstruating sex robot phone. Just sayin'.
We don't know if the Nexus 4 battery replacement will turn out to be either very costly and/or difficult. For those of us who don't plan to toss our Nexus 4 into a landfill two years from now, it pays to know what measures we can take to prolong battery longevity.

'Maximizing Nexus 4 battery'
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'Menstruating sex robot'
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Hmmmm....how did that happen...

I don't know if we will really know how good the battery longevity is in this thing until the device is a year old or more. Lithium polymer technology varies a lot. There have been a lot of advances with this tech in the last few years and some companies claim to have developed manufacturing techniques that allow THOUSANDS of charge before noticeable drops in batty capacity. Other technologies developed include the tech Apple uses and advertised in its MacBook line a few years ago that claimed longer battery life and very fast charging compared to Lithium Ion batteries. It all varies. LG claims to have some special tech baked into this battery that allows it to charge to a higher voltage compared to batteries of similar size, but I don't know how long its life is rated at.

666fff said:
'Maximizing Nexus 4 battery'
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'Menstruating sex robot'
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.
.
Hmmmm....how did that happen...
Click to expand...
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You apparently haven't seen the leaked mock-up of the Nexus 6.

borntochill said:
You apparently haven't seen the leaked mock-up of the Nexus 6.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would consider an early upgrade for a menstruating Daryl Hannah any day

HTC Rapid Charger 2.0

Just found out HTC is going to release a charger that will charge any snapdragon 800 and above HTC device; 60% in 30 mins. I may actually get that depending on the price BUT then again I hardly ever need to charge my device more than once a day unless I didn't charge it overnight.
Also Motorola has a quick charger too. Not sure if its faster than the HTC one BUT it is compatible with HTC devices.

I wonder how much faster does it charge than the note 3 charger?
Sent from my HTC One_M8 using XDA Free mobile app

One thing to keep in mind though, charging the battery that fast can actually decrease the battery's life span. a healthy recharge would be a slow one. Yet i can see why some people would need a rapid charger.
This topic should probably go under the accessories.

Shu. said:
One thing to keep in mind though, charging the battery that fast can actually decrease the battery's life span. a healthy recharge would be a slow one. Yet i can see why some people would need a rapid charger.
This topic should probably go under the accessories.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree 100%, its a simple fact in all battery's, faster charging means also less capacity from each charge and faster draining of battery and also shorter battery life in general..

From what I understand, this is not just a case of throwing more voltage and current up it.
The QC2.0 chargers are different. They utilise technology within the charger and the phone, I'm assuming to distribute the voltage and current in a stabilised battery friendly way. You can use a 2a charger on any device and it'll charge a battery quicker but risk reducing battery life. These QC2.0 chargers only charge Qualcomm devices rapidly. So they have to be different to regular chargers.
I'm lead to believe they kick out 9-12v at 2.1a.
Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk

I'd assume HTC would work on trying to not weaken battery life span while charging at quick speeds.
Sent from my HTC6525LVW using XDA Free mobile app

Ndaoud360 said:
I'd assume HTC would work on trying to not weaken battery life span while charging at quick speeds.
Sent from my HTC6525LVW using XDA Free mobile app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It doesn't matter what software/hardware configuration is in it, as long as it's the same lithium polymer being used it will still be susceptible to stresses like deep discharges, charge voltage, temperature and load currents.
Also, the 60% in 30 min refers to Qualcomm's benchmark tests with a 3300 mAh battery. The M8 has a 2600 mAh batt.

100% in 30 minutes.... I'm drooling. For those long double days.

PcFish said:
It doesn't matter what software/hardware configuration is in it, as long as it's the same lithium polymer being used it will still be susceptible to stresses like deep discharges, charge voltage, temperature and load currents.
Also, the 60% in 30 min refers to Qualcomm's benchmark tests with a 3300 mAh battery. The M8 has a 2600 mAh batt.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yea your right. HTC said 40% faster charging.

It's quite a nice idea for people who travel a lot and always be on the way. I feel satisfied with my OEM though, charges a full cycle in 2.5-3 hours and I usually charge it at night so it's not a hassle

Does anyone know if there is any substantive data on whether chargers utilizing quickcharge 2.0 do, in fact, reduce overall battery life? I could see this being useful in some scenarios, but I like the battery life on my M8 and do not want to do anything to jeopardize it.

daboscovellen said:
Does anyone know if there is any substantive data on whether chargers utilizing quickcharge 2.0 do, in fact, reduce overall battery life? I could see this being useful in some scenarios, but I like the battery life on my M8 and do not want to do anything to jeopardize it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not until end users have done extensive testing. Qualcomm and handset manufacturers and accessory manufacturers are hardly going to advertise this information.
I personally do not believe it will affect battery life drastically. As I said before, it's a technology utilising chips and software within the charger and handset. It's not like shoving a 2a or greater bog standard charger up it.
Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk

Chris_c81 said:
Not until end users have done extensive testing. Qualcomm and handset manufacturers and accessory manufacturers are hardly going to advertise this information.
I personally do not believe it will affect battery life drastically. As I said before, it's a technology utilising chips and software within the charger and handset. It's not like shoving a 2a or greater bog standard charger up it.
Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
BUT then again phone companies like to make your phone die quicker so you can buy their latest device. I don't HTC would do that so I believe they would try to make the battery stay the same length of time.

Ndaoud360 said:
BUT then again phone companies like to make your phone die quicker so you can buy their latest device.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Of course, I'm assuming you have evidence of that statement!?
Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk

Chris_c81 said:
Of course, I'm assuming you have evidence of that statement!?
Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's just been rumored throughout the years. It's like how some companies like Version (rumored again that most people believe) force some manufactures to not have an sd card slot or something like that so people can use cloud storage which means using more data and possibly going over your monthly limit and paying extra per month for overages. Don't know how true it is but all this rumored.

Wife just got a Droid Turbo...I'll try to remember to do a test in the morning and report back...

I use my Samsung 5.3v 2a charger...I go from 0 to 100% in 2 hours that saved me over 30 min charge. Time...
Sent from my SM-P600 using XDA Premium HD app

Can you get this Rapid 2.0 charger by HTC is it out yet? HTC site says out of stock but I didn't know if it was even available yet or if anyone else had it. I tried to google it and couldn't find it anywhere. Someone at work stole my original HTC charger that came with my M8. I know HTC does there 50% off deals too alot on Tuesdays.

Rose4uKY said:
Can you get this Rapid 2.0 charger by HTC is it out yet? HTC site says out of stock but I didn't know if it was even available yet or if anyone else had it. I tried to google it and couldn't find it anywhere. Someone at work stole my original HTC charger that came with my M8. I know HTC does there 50% off deals too alot on Tuesdays.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yeah they are out already. i bought two earlier this week. I just got them yesterday. haven't had alot of time to test them out. I believe the rapid chargers dont last long on their website. i been trying to buy one for weeks and it wasnt until last monday that i was able to purchase them

Any body know a quality cable to use with it?? My original broke and every syncing cable has been snotty at best

Battery mods have terrible battery life?

I've been using both the incipio offgrid, and tumi powerpack battery mods (both are wireless charging variants) and have noticed just awful battery life. from 100% it charges my phone up maybe 15-20 percent, and thats with the screen off, just streaming music. If I'm using the phone (just surfing the web or instagram) the battery dies in around 30-45 minutes, is this normal? I expected alot more out of these. I can just stare at the notification bar and watch as the battery drops, my software is up to date, and I was just wondering if this is normal? Is everyone else getting this awful performance? I expected way more for like 70-80 bucks each...

Sky's Divide said:
I've been using both the incipio offgrid, and tumi powerpack battery mods (both are wireless charging variants) and have noticed just awful battery life. from 100% it charges my phone up maybe 15-20 percent, and thats with the screen off, just streaming music. If I'm using the phone (just surfing the web or instagram) the battery dies in around 30-45 minutes, is this normal? I expected alot more out of these. I can just stare at the notification bar and watch as the battery drops, my software is up to date, and I was just wondering if this is normal? Is everyone else getting this awful performance? I expected way more for like 70-80 bucks each...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is not normal. While I don't have either of these, based on the reading I've done and reports I've seen from people who do, the Incipio off grid should be able to charge your phone up 50-75% when attached. Not sure if you have some crazy wakelock that's keeping your CPU maxed out all the time or what, but dying in 30-40 minutes makes no sense.

xxBrun0xx said:
This is not normal. While I don't have either of these, based on the reading I've done and reports I've seen from people who do, the Incipio off grid should be able to charge your phone up 50-75% when attached. Not sure if you have some crazy wakelock that's keeping your CPU maxed out all the time or what, but dying in 30-40 minutes makes no sense.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
When I got it to die In 30-40 min I was on a phone call and surfing instagram. Took the tumi out yesterday with 80% battery in it and had my phones screen off streaming music over Bluetooth. The phone charged up about 25% before the battery pack died. Any ideas on how I could improve the battery life? My moto mods manager is up to date and I don't get any prompts to update anything whenever I snap on the mods

I was surprised when I found this post, so I checked how many percent of battery do I get with a my incipio battery mod. I plugged the mod, my phone's battery was at 15% and the battery mod was at 100%.
Now the Incipio battery mod is empty and my phone's battery is at 50%. So it charged my phone by 35%.
Pretty disappointing for a 2220 mAh battery that costs almost 100€ ...

To me the best use of the mod is to snap it on when the Moto Z Play is fully charged and to chose the option to keep the phone battery at 80%. With normal use, i've seen the mod keep the phone at 80% for up to a day. To me the mod is not meant to charge the phone but more to keep it from discharging.

To me the idea of the battery mod makes no sense.
There is an Aukey 16000 mAh power pack with QuickCharge 3.0 available which boosts the battery in nearly no time. I paid less than 20 Euro.
Who needs such a battery mod with a Moto Z Play which lasts all day under heavy usage?
Who needs such a battery mod when power packs are big, cheap and fast?
Who even needs the power pack if you have a wall outlet with a QuickCharge 3.0 charger boosting the battery percentage in no time? I needed that power pack when the previous phone (Moto X Play) had some hardware defect making it lose power.
Edit: These questions are meant honestly. Are you living in the desert for several days and can't afford to carry a bag?

tag68 said:
To me the idea of the battery mod makes no sense.
There is an Aukey 16000 mAh power pack with QuickCharge 3.0 available which boosts the battery in nearly no time. I paid less than 20 Euro.
Who needs such a battery mod with a Moto Z Play which lasts all day under heavy usage?
Who needs such a battery mod when power packs are big, cheap and fast?
Who even needs the power pack if you have a wall outlet with a QuickCharge 3.0 charger boosting the battery percentage in no time? I needed that power pack when the previous phone (Moto X Play) had some hardware defect making it lose power.
Edit: These questions are meant honestly. Are you living in the desert for several days and can't afford to carry a bag?
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The battery mods are not particularly useful for the Z Play because if you charge every night, you have basically unlimited battery life. Battery packs are extremely useful for the regular Z, though, which has extremely poor battery life on its own. They're basically mandatory for the Z.

I'm shocked that battery mods can only charge your internal battery and can't be used directly (discharging the mod battery instead of the internal battery), the same way Thinkpads that have more than one battery can do. That makes the $80 (vs maybe $10 for a 2000 mah ravpower) cost all the more eyebrow-raising.
I'd love to use them as a way of preserving the sealed in internal battery's longevity, making the internal battery the backup battery and wearing out the easily replaceable, easily swappable mods instead.

fortunz said:
I'd love to use them as a way of preserving the sealed in internal battery's longevity,
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What do you think how a battery should be treated to prolong its lifetime?
This is a serious question. I'm not sure if charging cycles do matter these days. The point which makes batteries getting weak is the age. An additional battery will not help reduce the age.
Of course you should be careful not to be in extreme cold or heat. If the battery is below 30 percent, you should consider to charge it. You should not charge it again if it's over 80 percent. But trying not to use it seems not to really be helpful for the battery to have a longer life, although battery lifetime usually is given in battery cycles. At least this is my experience. If it does not get hot when used or charged, all batteries nowadays start getting weaker a bit after about 2 years, it gets really recognizable after 4 years, and when they are 6-8 years old, they get so low that they may not fulfill there purpose anymore. Cycles? Never recognized any influence for the lifetime. But one hot day with a usage above average where the battery gets hot may really cause a recognizable decrease in capacity.
If you have some source comparing battery lifetime for different use cases (storage, low usage, middle usage, frequent usage, under different conditions of temperature, fast charge and slow charge) I'd be really interested.

tag68 said:
What do you think how a battery should be treated to prolong its lifetime?
This is a serious question. I'm not sure if charging cycles do matter these days. The point which makes batteries getting weak is the age. An additional battery will not help reduce the age.
Of course you should be careful not to be in extreme cold or heat. If the battery is below 30 percent, you should consider to charge it. You should not charge it again if it's over 80 percent. But trying not to use it seems not to really be helpful for the battery to have a longer life, although battery lifetime usually is given in battery cycles. At least this is my experience. If it does not get hot when used or charged, all batteries nowadays start getting weaker a bit after about 2 years, it gets really recognizable after 4 years, and when they are 6-8 years old, they get so low that they may not fulfill there purpose anymore. Cycles? Never recognized any influence for the lifetime. But one hot day with a usage above average where the battery gets hot may really cause a recognizable decrease in capacity.
If you have some source comparing battery lifetime for different use cases (storage, low usage, middle usage, frequent usage, under different conditions of temperature, fast charge and slow charge) I'd be really interested.
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Same sources as you, personal experience and basic knowledge (battery life being measured in cycles). I'm not even completely worried about average aging, but out of a batch of millions of batteries, plenty will start to experience rapid discharge early, even without abnormal heat, not to the point of being completely dead, but certainly no longer tolerable. Today's phone batteries might actually tolerate heat better than in the past, having been built for quick charging, which is the hottest a sd625 seems to get.
I've read manuals and battery university and a few tech blog articles all of which have differing advice, just like you and me, but I have yet to find a source I find credible (based on diverse large scale testing not limited anecdotal evidence or in the case of manuals, insanely outdated nicad-era stuff). And, sincerely no offense intended, I'm unlikely to decide cycles don't matter and weight your anecdotal evidence over mine anymore than you'd weight mine over yours. But if you ever find a good source with those comparisons, I'd be pleased to check it out too.

tag68 said:
Who needs such a battery mod with a Moto Z Play which lasts all day under heavy usage?
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Because I'm a very heavy user of my phone and don't want to worry about power even if I can't get to a outlet during the day.
Who needs such a battery mod when power packs are big, cheap and fast?
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Because the bat mod is easy to slap on and keep on all the time (when I'm not using a different mod). Then I never have to worry about taking the pack with me or not or carrying the extra cable with me or not.
Who even needs the power pack if you have a wall outlet with a QuickCharge 3.0 charger boosting the battery percentage in no time?
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Because I don't want to have to worry about having the charger with me or finding a spot to charge.
I fully admit that I tend to be more paranoid about running out of power than I need to be, but I like to be secure knowing that I should have more than enough battery life, even if I can't charge overnight. I like to know that I can grab my phone at any point of the day and walk out the door with it without having to worry about taking a charger with me.

RedRamage said:
I fully admit that I tend to be more paranoid about running out of power than I need to be, but I like to be secure knowing that I should have more than enough battery life, even if I can't charge overnight. I like to know that I can grab my phone at any point of the day and walk out the door with it without having to worry about taking a charger with me.
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I quite like just not having to charge for three days. I have the battery mod which I use on the efficiency mode, and I got over a full day out of it. At the end of day three I had nearly 30% battery left. Probably enough for most of one more day.
The other thing for me is using wireless charging. I like just slapping my phone on a stand overnight when I do charge it. It charges slowly, yes, but it doesn't matter if I am charging overnight. I still have access to the quick charger if I need to get a full battery quick!

I use mine on my motorcycle where I'm riding for 10 hours a day. I'm at about 50% in 4 hours and dead by 7 or 8, so I'm hoping with the additional battery MOD that I can get at least 12 hours charge. I'm really bad about remembering to plug my phone in when I stop for a break!

@tag68 : dude I think you totally missed to read what @fortunz was saying, he was only pointing that he would like the Mods to be used as a primary source battery instead of being a "ultra-portable power bank".
Given that there is also a fraction of the power being lost in the form of heat, during charge/transfer, it is even more silly from Motorola not to have the battery used directly. I can say by the 25-35% charge from the Mods estimated from other users, that the efficiency is somewhere around 50%, HORRIBLE to say the least.
And yeah I was reading through both of your posts and good information was provided, although unnecessary friction used (not naming anyone).
I actually have kind of the same idea from @fortunz to prolong the battery life of my Z-play even with the mod just being a power bank.
Saying that the mods (~2220mah) charge your phone anywhere between 25-35%, I can actually take the top 25-35% out of my internal battery use and move it to the Mod.
So I can charge my phone up to 70% before going to bed, and then when my phone reaches 30% during the use next day, I'll just slap the mod.
I can allow myself a lot of variation to this, I will not be religious about it, the topic is to avoid hitting 100% charge, and instead, moving the wear of that 30% usage to the Mod.
According, to many articles, citing just one below, considering the depth of discharges and voltage levels, you guys might do the equation if you like, but according to the charts and theory:
charging my phone twice a day trying not to exceed 70%, will give me WAY more longevity run than charging up to 100% every day.
First charge will be from around 15% which is my normal deadline to around 70% with a wall charger, before going to bed.
Second charge will be from the mod from around 30% to around 60% (hopefully), which will give me portability while charging.
Total screen on time during the day, should be around 10% less, but well worth and I can definitely take the hit if getting more battery longevity as a trade.
Source:
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries
Huh, it even makes sense when explaining to other people...

In re: friction, I took no offense from the exchange. Hopefully I didn't cause any either.
Good luck with your efforts. I have considered using this app to to stop charging early: https://forum.xda-developers.com/android/apps-games/root-battery-charge-limit-t3557002 Haven't started using it yet.

fortunz said:
In re: friction, I took no offense from the exchange. Hopefully I didn't cause any either.
Good luck with your efforts. I have considered using this app to to stop charging early: https://forum.xda-developers.com/android/apps-games/root-battery-charge-limit-t3557002 Haven't started using it yet.
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Sadly that application requires root... and I don't want to unlock the bootloader and then having to worry about SafetyNet...

For me SafetyNet is green using Magisk 12.0 as root solution, but that may change of course. But it would help for the battery.
Short rant about this topic: It is strange that the owner of a device can be forbidden to restrict the charging. You bought it, you should be able to do these things with it. Introducing SafetyNet is a bad idea by Google. Security should be made by algorithms, not by hardware. Using public key anyone may modify anything, and you can still assure the content to be trustworthy. There no need to prove the Android not to be modified, it is just a bad idea, unnecessary restricting the user. Owner.

tag68 said:
For me SafetyNet is green using Magisk 12.0 as root solution, but that may change of course. But it would help for the battery.
Short rant about this topic: It is strange that the owner of a device can be forbidden to restrict the charging. You bought it, you should be able to do these things with it. Introducing SafetyNet is a bad idea by Google. Security should be made by algorithms, not by hardware. Using public key anyone may modify anything, and you can still assure the content to be trustworthy. There no need to prove the Android not to be modified, it is just a bad idea, unnecessary restricting the user. Owner.
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Well said
Thanks for the tip! I'll have it mind!
At the moment I don't feel like unlocking the bootloader because I'm planning to use the moto Mods and these can't be used with custom ROMs yet, and I have no use for root other than changing the work mode on Greenify but it already works well enough in No-Root mode, so for me there is no true benefit.

A good resource for lithium batteries are rc helicopter forums. Helis use speed controllers of many tens of amps, drain the batteries in minutes versus days to low levels and charge them at high speed. What reduces their life is heat, overcharging the voltage or over discharging the voltage. They do not age if left in a partial charge. You can let them sit for years unused and they will lose very little capacity. If you only run them at 70%cycle, they last about 3000 cycles.

Well, that was weird.
Phone at 9%, mophie mod at 100%. Put it on, barely used the phone (even took a nap). About an hour later, the mophie mod is at 50%, but the phone actually went down to 8%. Took off the mod and the phone went immediately to 4%. Ouch.
Mod normally works fine. It'll keep the phone at 80% for most of the day just fine. Not sure what was going on.

Realme X2 Pro Battery Health - AccuBattery App

For you who use AccuBattery app to monitor your battery usage, can you share yours?
Because mine is showing my battery health is only 47%. I think it's maybe, just maybe, the app only read half of the battery capacity. Since this phone is actually have two batteries installed in a single pack of battery.
With this phone I got around 6 hours of screen on time with 70% battery usage (from 90 - 20%).
It's normal SOT for this phone right?
I attached my SS from the app. I use version 1.2.7-2 build 45.

Yeah yours are pretty normal. I have a similar results.

Maybe the 50 watt charging is degrading the battery at a rapid pace,
Maybe this app is not very accurate.
I've seen others complaining about this app with other phones but hopefully here it's just estimating one of the two batteries

andrejd1 said:
Yeah yours are pretty normal. I have a similar results.
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Thanks for sharing. We have the same battery performance.
manus31 said:
Maybe the 50 watt charging is degrading the battery at a rapid pace,
Maybe this app is not very accurate.
I've seen others complaining about this app with other phones but hopefully here it's just estimating one of the two batteries
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Pretty sure it's not because the rapid charging, if so the phone is a disaster.
The app is most possible reason.

smart_thingup said:
Thanks for sharing. We have the same battery performance.
Pretty sure it's not because the rapid charging, if so the phone is a disaster.
The app is most possible reason.
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Here's hoping,I'm getting mine next week and I'm already very skeptical of the vooc charging,I've seen nothing from Realme or Oppo in regards to it's testing or how it affects the degradation of battery.Because of this and I want the battery to last a few years I will be charging with a 18w charger,using the vooc charger occasionally

manus31 said:
Here's hoping,I'm getting mine next week and I'm already very skeptical of the vooc charging,I've seen nothing from Realme or Oppo in regards to it's testing or how it affects the degradation of battery.Because of this and I want the battery to last a few years I will be charging with a 18w charger,using the vooc charger occasionally
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At first I also skeptical about the Super VOOC charging, I think it will damage battery faster, especially because of heat while charging.
And then, turns out to be more make sense because it use dual battery. And with my experience using this phone, there's no heat problem while charging. Not from the hand feel and not from the system temparature reading.
Since the charging is super fast, I usually put the phone at idle for about 5 minutes to cool down the phone before charging and put on airplane mode while charging to prevent over hear and keep the battery as cool as possible. After several try different circumstances of charging condition, I think Super VOOC is doing just fine.

smart_thingup said:
At first I also skeptical about the Super VOOC charging, I think it will damage battery faster, especially because of heat while charging.
And then, turns out to be more make sense because it use dual battery. And with my experience using this phone, there's no heat problem while charging. Not from the hand feel and not from the system temparature reading.
Since the charging is super fast, I usually put the phone at idle for about 5 minutes to cool down the phone before charging and put on airplane mode while charging to prevent over hear and keep the battery as cool as possible. After several try different circumstances of charging condition, I think Super VOOC is doing just fine.
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I'm sure it's safe and all very good but I still think it will be too difficult to maintain the battery and make it last a few years. I like to keep the battery between around 40 to 85 and it's not recommend to fully charge modern phone batteries aswell as not fully draining them,there is only so many cycles for the batteries lifetime,around 500 or so,
here we have two batteries but still that does not matter,
I will be using in and around 18w charger but might try my OnePlus charger to see if that is any quicker to find a happy medium

manus31 said:
I'm sure it's safe and all very good but I still think it will be too difficult to maintain the battery and make it last a few years. I like to keep the battery between around 40 to 85 and it's not recommend to fully charge modern phone batteries aswell as not fully draining them,there is only so many cycles for the batteries lifetime,around 500 or so,
here we have two batteries but still that does not matter,
I will be using in and around 18w charger but might try my OnePlus charger to see if that is any quicker to find a happy medium
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OnePlus charger will give you VOOC charging. I think that will suit you.

smart_thingup said:
OnePlus charger will give you VOOC charging. I think that will suit you.
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Yes should give around 27 to 30 watt charge,that would be perfect.Wil test it and see,getting phone tomorrow according to my national post

manus31 said:
Yes should give around 27 to 30 watt charge,that would be perfect.Wil test it and see,getting phone tomorrow according to my national post
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Got phone today,the 50 watt charge is lightning fast,
My OnePlus 6T charger is also lightning,think it's about 27w charger. My 6T battery must have a problem as the charging has slowed over time on that. I'm only noticing again how fast the dash charger is on the X2 pro

Have been using Accubattery for few days now and have similar stats to you guys,48% battery health and estimated capacity of 1913mAh,
Maybe Accubattery can improve the software for these type of phones which have two separate batteries

have the same result. maybe an update with the app can result in a more accurate reading.

Guys it's normal, this phone has a battery made of 2 1950mAh cells that charge in parallel. This means that Accubattery (which reads the stats based on voltage and current) can only read a single cell charge.
I also read some strange comments here, so let's dismantle a myth: SuperVOOC WON'T damage your battery much more than normal fast charging. Having 50W on a single battery would be absurd, instead this power is distributed between the two cells, resulting in a charge of 5V and 5A per cell (pretty standard, 5V is super safe because it's the same as the cell voltage, and current is similar to other manufacturer quick charge currents). Having 5V input is also better for heat, because it doesn't need conversion (see Qualcomm Quickcharge which can input 5/9/12/15V).
Of course heat is the worst enemy of a battery life, but try not to use it while charging for those 25/30mins needed for a full charge and you'll be good to go.
I hope this clarifies things for people scared of using the boxed charger.

danypava said:
Guys it's normal, this phone has a battery made of 2 1950mAh cells that charge in parallel. This means that Accubattery (which reads the stats based on voltage and current) can only read a single cell charge.
I also read some strange comments here, so let's dismantle a myth: SuperVOOC WON'T damage your battery much more than normal fast charging. Having 50W on a single battery would be absurd, instead this power is distributed between the two cells, resulting in a charge of 5V and 5A per cell (pretty standard, 5V is super safe because it's the same as the cell voltage, and current is similar to other manufacturer quick charge currents). Having 5V input is also better for heat, because it doesn't need conversion (see Qualcomm Quickcharge which can input 5/9/12/15V).
Of course heat is the worst enemy of a battery life, but try not to use it while charging for those 25/30mins needed for a full charge and you'll be good to go.
I hope this clarifies things for people scared of using the boxed charger.
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I was a bit apprehensive about the super vooc at the start but I've only ever used it since I got the phone. I will say it's so much more useful for my use a d I can literally charge it twice a day for 10 to 15 minutes each time.Phone does heat up quite a bit though,like it's warm every time I take it off the charge.
I'm just hoping it will be as quick this time next year and the battery holds out

danypava said:
Guys it's normal, this phone has a battery made of 2 1950mAh cells that charge in parallel. This means that Accubattery (which reads the stats based on voltage and current) can only read a single cell charge.
I also read some strange comments here, so let's dismantle a myth: SuperVOOC WON'T damage your battery much more than normal fast charging. *1 Having 50W on a single battery would be absurd, instead this power is distributed between the two cells, resulting in a charge of 5V and 5A per cell (pretty standard,*2 5V is super safe because it's the same as the cell voltage, and current is similar to other manufacturer quick charge currents). Having 5V input is also better for heat, because it doesn't need conversion (see Qualcomm Quickcharge which can input 5/9/12/15V).
Of course *3 heat is the worst enemy of a battery life, but try not to use it while charging for those 25/30mins needed for a full charge and you'll be good to go.
I hope this clarifies things for people scared of using the boxed charger.
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*1 - could you elaborate on this here a tad bit more? What is the advantage of pumping power into two cells with total capacity of 4A/h put next to running a single cell with the same amount of power, with the cell being 4A/h too?
*2
This is simply not true. Mass production liPo cells are manufactured with 3.7V nominal voltage, 3V min. voltage and 4.2V max. voltage. When discharging a li-po cell your under-load voltage wouldn't zap anywhere outside the range of 3 - 4.2 volts at any point. If it did you would be saying ciao to that cell in the upcoming month.
According to what Ive learned past the last 12years of dealing with LiPos in my radio controlled aircrafts and, cell phones, smartphones, battery banks and so on and so on.. I am yet to see a mass production lithium cell whose "cell voltage" is 5 volts..? Sooo.. where do you get that from?
Do you have the kind of information that I am struggling to find on the inet right now? Such as who is the outsourced manufacturer of cells for realme? What is the grouping method of the two cells in our x2pro when charging - parallel or series?
The answer on the later two questions will paint it all as to what can we expect from the battery in our phones for the forseeable future.
*3
Heat is the result of charging and discharging the cell at higher than usually considered healthy charging and discharging rates. As far as Im concerned I don't think that realme are in possession of any advanced battery tech, and would be much more oriented towards trustworthy tested day in-day out type of chemistry in their batteries. Specially at the price point of my x2pro.
Taking into consideration that I can only conclude that realme are driving these cells at their maximum tolerance of charging current. I would be pretty entertained if the juice in this device is satisfactory past the 2 year mark. And shocked at the same time.

This has been spoke about before by oppo themselves and is available on the internet, it's 2x batteries at 2000mah each... The batteries are charged at the same time but independently and each battery is monitored at all times for heat etc... Total voltage is split between both to not apply to much pressure and as the batteries are 2000mah each it's obviously Parallel as you get total 4000mah.

Realme x2 pro has two batteries
Hey guys hope you are aware that realme x2 pro has 2 batteries of approximately 2000mah each and not one single 4000mah battery. That is what gives it the charging speed and the battery health is not affected because of the ingenious way VOOC works. You can watch the video on youtube. AccuBattery is not designed for phones with two batteries. Maybe we can expect compatibility for realme x2 pro in a future update.

Ab97 said:
Hey guys hope you are aware that realme x2 pro has 2 batteries of approximately 2000mah each and not one single 4000mah battery. That is what gives it the charging speed and the battery health is not affected because of the ingenious way VOOC works. You can watch the video on youtube. AccuBattery is not designed for phones with two batteries. Maybe we can expect compatibility for realme x2 pro in a future update.
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Just declare it as 2000 mAh and you're good.