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Dear Microsoft,
I am writing this letter to ask permission for Xda-developers.com and it's users to officially use, develop, and share the new Wizard WM6 roms on this site. I know that you are currently not allowing us to do so. I believe it is in your best interest to let us. Here is why:
1) User Testing - allowing us to develop and share the WM6 rom for the wizard will open your product to a huge amount of testing. On this site, we don't just use our phones, we push them hard. We love to see the most we can get out of them. We get bored with what we have, so we load a new rom and see what it can do. 3 days later we load another. You will not find a better place on the Internet to test your roms.
Also, it will allow us to test compatibility with new and existing software. This site is already reference material for most software developers and even HTC. In our never-ending search for information about these devices we find things such as tricks to make them better, security holes, and all sorts of information that 3rd party companies can use.
All of this work is done by volunteers who, although they may gripe from time to time, feel a sense of satisfaction for doing this work. You can't buy their level of loyalty.
2) Goodwill - Allowing us to use, develop and share the WM6 rom will create a massive amount of goodwill on this site for your company. Since you are the biggest player in the game, you are currently subject to TONS of criticism everywhere you turn. People usually see you as this huge faceless corporation that wants to control people and take their money. I read the blogs of Microsoft employees and know this is really not the case. Allowing us to work on this rom openly will create goodwill that no ad campaign can buy.
3) Money - The bottom line is that you will save money. Money that might be spent on research will be saved by free research on this site. Money spent on ads to generate goodwill will be saved by the goodwill generated on this site.
I appreciate your consideration of this matter. Please let us know of your decision.
Sincerely,
texasaggie1
cool letter.. cant wait to see wat kind of responce you get.
Diddo.......Let's see if the big boss will let us play.
Great Letter Aggie. I would think the MS resposne would be pretty good about this. MS has been pretty good with other technologies lately in opening it up and taking feedbacks from users.
One thing is for sure. THERE IS NO OTHER PLACE BETTER THAN HERE TO TEST/TWEAK/BETTER WINDOWS MOBILE.
We do have a vast number of volunteers here that do a helluva job in making these roms faster and better.
What makes you think they aren't doing this already?
Where do you think this 'leaked' version originated from, anyway? And why is it literally painless to install?
MS has employees who actively troll this group (among others) to get feedback..good and bad...for their "pre-release" warez. They just lurk in the shadows (rightfully so, speaking up would make them the whipping boys of the forum...)
Since the hardware mfr and/or the service provider of the device is the one who decides whether or not to 'upgrade' your device with the latest and greatest OS (based heavily on whether or not they want to support multiple s/w versions) MS can't make any money off simply selling their product to the end user. Unlike the PC model of selling you a retail boxed version of a new operating system for your PC.
No money to be made = no money to be lost. Think about it.
All that being said, the most important thing to remember is that they will ACTIVELY shut down any site hosting their software without their permission. If they fail to enforce their copyrights by legal means, it further weakens any argument in future lawsuits regarding others who pirate their software. They will also quickly piss off the likes of t-mobile, cingular, and other service providers if they provide the end-user a means of bypassing their process of certifying the stability of their phones.
They will continue to operate in this way for a long time. They get free beta testing from 'hardcore users' while looking the other way. It's genius if you ask me!
!! Sweet !!
I would be very suprised if they gave this consideration, they will wait for the 'next gen' devices up to come to release it on in my opinion.
Besides we must face it, most people that are using these phones these days do not flash their device, nonetheless, know what it is.
We are the few flashing samurai that cannot live with a stock rom, and want to "juice" our hardware to get our money's worth. \m/
I will say If you live in the US now you will see that parents are buying their teenage kiddies smartphones/ppcs now for a couple reasons. 1) To ward off an appl music/video product, and of course. 2) To be able to reach them anywhere with the phone service.
It would have been funny to say that most people on this site are using/have used the wm6 leak already, so we might as well work together for free, for a learning purpose.
They need more of this for WM device settings...
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2362050448778905490&q=steve+ballmer+remix
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C5oGaZIKYvo
rizzo said:
What makes you think they aren't doing this already?
Where do you think this 'leaked' version originated from, anyway? And why is it literally painless to install?
MS has employees who actively troll this group (among others) to get feedback..good and bad...for their "pre-release" warez. They just lurk in the shadows (rightfully so, speaking up would make them the whipping boys of the forum...)
Since the hardware mfr and/or the service provider of the device is the one who decides whether or not to 'upgrade' your device with the latest and greatest OS (based heavily on whether or not they want to support multiple s/w versions) MS can't make any money off simply selling their product to the end user. Unlike the PC model of selling you a retail boxed version of a new operating system for your PC.
No money to be made = no money to be lost. Think about it.
All that being said, the most important thing to remember is that they will ACTIVELY shut down any site hosting their software without their permission. If they fail to enforce their copyrights by legal means, it further weakens any argument in future lawsuits regarding others who pirate their software. They will also quickly piss off the likes of t-mobile, cingular, and other service providers if they provide the end-user a means of bypassing their process of certifying the stability of their phones.
They will continue to operate in this way for a long time. They get free beta testing from 'hardcore users' while looking the other way. It's genius if you ask me!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, you might be right. But, aren't they allowing WM6 on the Universal? That may change the equation.
My gut feeling is that one or more of the ROM cookers in here works for M$. You don't know some of the things they do without having a lot more background knowledge than the average joe. There's nothing wrong with that, of course...that means better products for you and me.
I support Texasaggie1
Hi, i would like to support the request. It makes damn sense, I am an old-time Linux user and i think that Microsoft would show great marketing sense in allowing us to test it. I will not argue about the advantages and benefits,
and one simple question: Who would be negatively affected by it? HTC? Microsoft? other users? Network providers?
pzucchel said:
Hi, i would like to support the request. It makes damn sense, I am an old-time Linux user and i think that Microsoft would show great marketing sense in allowing us to test it. I will not argue about the advantages and benefits,
and one simple question: Who would be negatively affected by it? HTC? Microsoft? other users? Network providers?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My Thought is NO-ONE. As all we do is RUN these ROMS and Tweak them to perform in the best way that they can. All that everyone does here is readily available and can/could/HAS been adopted by Developers, Networks & Manufacturers alike.
jwzg said:
My gut feeling is that one or more of the ROM cookers in here works for M$. You don't know some of the things they do without having a lot more background knowledge than the average joe. There's nothing wrong with that, of course...that means better products for you and me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I doubt any of the 'cookers' work for Microsoft. Although difficult, it's fairly common to reverse-engineer someone elses code and mold it into something that you want. Once you get the hang of how things work and make the script kiddie tools to do it, it's fairly simple.
One thing that a cooker can't do is write an entire OS then 'leak' it onto the internet and call it WM6, this is done by someone entrusted with copies of it for legitimate purposes. Blame HTC or any of the ODM's if you want, but it my opinion, it would be a waste of your time.
If you want to infect the world, you must spread your disease. MS has come a long way in this regard with the likes of gaining on Palm, RIM, symbian, etc.
Microsoft has always leveraged piracy to work in their favor...those that can't get the disease (or otherwise can't afford it) will have access to it. If you can't make the sale, might as well get them hooked fo' free!
pzucchel said:
and one simple question: Who would be negatively affected by it? HTC? Microsoft? other users? Network providers?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry, but I had to chime in on this one, too. Maybe some people don't see it, but we ARE actively beta testing their software.
If you develop software, and want to have beta testing do any good, there needs to be some kind of order. Visiting forums to find information is chaotic at best. Sifting through page after page of hijacked threads and RTFM type questions isn't going to yield the feedback a company needs to squash the bugs out of code. If enough people complain about a particular 'feature' then it might get the company to try and replicate it in-house, but its very unlikely that you'd ever hear anything back from them.
End-users modifying their devices by flashing it with unreleased firmware it wasn't originally designed for is dangerous, and can cause a ripple effect if it's not managed. As long as the company stands by its "hey, we never said this code was finished - not to mention you're not supposed to have it" stance, it can shield them from almost ALL liability in you bricking your phone. In the mean time, hardcore folks like us will continue shoving the bleeding-edge not-ready-ware into our phones in order to tell the tales of our adventures to all that will listen - and MS will continue "leaking" their warez into the wild.
The minute Microsoft starts bending these rules for folks like us, then they are going to have to answer to THEIR customers (HTC, network providers, etc) when the nOObs start flooding their call centers for warranty-return requests.
texasaggie1 said:
Dear Microsoft,
I am writing this letter to ask permission for Xda-developers.com and it's users to officially use, develop, and share the new Wizard WM6 roms on this site. I know that you are currently not allowing us to do so. I believe it is in your best interest to let us. Here is why:
1) User Testing - allowing us to develop and share the WM6 rom for the wizard will open your product to a huge amount of testing. On this site, we don't just use our phones, we push them hard. We love to see the most we can get out of them. We get bored with what we have, so we load a new rom and see what it can do. 3 days later we load another. You will not find a better place on the Internet to test your roms.
Also, it will allow us to test compatibility with new and existing software. This site is already reference material for most software developers and even HTC. In our never-ending search for information about these devices we find things such as tricks to make them better, security holes, and all sorts of information that 3rd party companies can use.
All of this work is done by volunteers who, although they may gripe from time to time, feel a sense of satisfaction for doing this work. You can't buy their level of loyalty.
2) Goodwill - Allowing us to use, develop and share the WM6 rom will create a massive amount of goodwill on this site for your company. Since you are the biggest player in the game, you are currently subject to TONS of criticism everywhere you turn. People usually see you as this huge faceless corporation that wants to control people and take their money. I read the blogs of Microsoft employees and know this is really not the case. Allowing us to work on this rom openly will create goodwill that no ad campaign can buy.
3) Money - The bottom line is that you will save money. Money that might be spent on research will be saved by free research on this site. Money spent on ads to generate goodwill will be saved by the goodwill generated on this site.
I appreciate your consideration of this matter. Please let us know of your decision.
Sincerely,
texasaggie1
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Totally agreed texasaggie1 said but dont forget in all devices rom ,MS just part of 70% of rom others 30% belong to HTC,T-mobile...etc, the reason we need to cook rom in here not really problem belong to MS that belong to HTC,
MS understand HTC was first OEM used Mobile window,but MS can understand why we need to cook rom in here ? do you hear anyone cook Window XP ? MS must understand device rom is different with Window XP,MS just proved PB and AKU ,device also need driver and some of OEM program otherwide device(phone) will not working,you can see in rom kithen had OS/LOC/OEM , SO belong to MS,LOC/OEM belong to HTC,T-Mobile..etc. this is different with window XP,if today all rom made by MS than no one can said anything,but not in this case ,we in here not only help MS also help HTC,T-Mobile...etc. too, they got how many free employees to worked with them,now Apple will come out IPhone ,I dont think MS want to lose market to them,we in here 100% support to MS , I dont understand what piont they refuse us ?
BA_Flash_GOD said:
I would be very suprised if they gave this consideration, they will wait for the 'next gen' devices up to come to release it on in my opinion.
Besides we must face it, most people that are using these phones these days do not flash their device, nonetheless, know what it is.
We are the few flashing samurai that cannot live with a stock rom, and want to "juice" our hardware to get our money's worth. \m/
I will say If you live in the US now you will see that parents are buying their teenage kiddies smartphones/ppcs now for a couple reasons. 1) To ward off an appl music/video product, and of course. 2) To be able to reach them anywhere with the phone service.
It would have been funny to say that most people on this site are using/have used the wm6 leak already, so we might as well work together for free, for a learning purpose.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree. Good reply.
I know all of this is a long shot. But it's been bugging me lately. I had to post this letter.
Flashing/Testing New OS = Good Experience
I think M$ should show more of the average users that yes, you can upgrade/downgrade your current rom very easily. This would let all users have the option to use any individual one to meet their needs. I'm guessing another big issue would be CID locking though, wouldn't that be another breech of contract for M$ to the original phone service providers? What you guys think
BA_Flash_GOD said:
I think M$ should show more of the average users that yes, you can upgrade/downgrade your current rom very easily. This would let all users have the option to use any individual one to meet their needs. I'm guessing another big issue would be CID locking though, wouldn't that be another breech of contract for M$ to the original phone service providers? What you guys think
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am sorry, please don't take this the wrong way. But this is one of the silliest ideas I have seen in a long time. Think for a moment about the support headaches from even 20% of their users playing with ROMS versus the 2-3% that do it now. And you think some of the NOOBS on here get annoying forget about regular users!!!
I think things are about perfect the way they are. A little "unofficial" help lets us hardcore users reap the benefits of upgrading with out the hassles. Trust me if ROM upgrades became more official they would kill groups like this. They would charge for the upgrades and they would want to control them like they do desktop OS upgrades. I say no thanks to that. It's like the early days of Napster, or more recently You Tube taking down tons of videos, those things were much better before they became mainstream and then they had to change.
I will say this. MS should figure out how to make the CID & SIM Lock a separate part of the rom like the radio and bootloader, make it totally separate from the Rom & Extended Rom itself. That would allow tweakers to change roms with out worrying about Locks and would make the phone companies happy too. And I am sure users that need unlocking would figure that out too
BA_Flash_GOD said:
I think M$ should show more of the average users that yes, you can upgrade/downgrade your current rom very easily. This would let all users have the option to use any individual one to meet their needs. I'm guessing another big issue would be CID locking though, wouldn't that be another breech of contract for M$ to the original phone service providers? What you guys think
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
anyone who wants to can use google. I seriously do not think that its neccesary to let the world know. they could know... if they wanted to. Bad idea imho.
rizzo said:
Sorry, but I had to chime in on this one, too. Maybe some people don't see it, but we ARE actively beta testing their software.
If you develop software, and want to have beta testing do any good, there needs to be some kind of order. Visiting forums to find information is chaotic at best. Sifting through page after page of hijacked threads and RTFM type questions isn't going to yield the feedback a company needs to squash the bugs out of code. If enough people complain about a particular 'feature' then it might get the company to try and replicate it in-house, but its very unlikely that you'd ever hear anything back from them.
End-users modifying their devices by flashing it with unreleased firmware it wasn't originally designed for is dangerous, and can cause a ripple effect if it's not managed. As long as the company stands by its "hey, we never said this code was finished - not to mention you're not supposed to have it" stance, it can shield them from almost ALL liability in you bricking your phone. In the mean time, hardcore folks like us will continue shoving the bleeding-edge not-ready-ware into our phones in order to tell the tales of our adventures to all that will listen - and MS will continue "leaking" their warez into the wild.
The minute Microsoft starts bending these rules for folks like us, then they are going to have to answer to THEIR customers (HTC, network providers, etc) when the nOObs start flooding their call centers for warranty-return requests.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm sorry but I have to side with rizzo on this one. They will never officially come out and allow this because they can't. You are asking them to agree to a. Code leaking, b. Code theft, c. Software Piracy in a sense (since you have to not acquired a legal copy and have not paid licenses for it), d. Copyright infringement. What company in their right mind say yes to this and open up the flood gates? And like rizzo said allow them to be liable for consumer or partner lawsuits as well?
As much as I agree with the original heartfelt post, we say what we say for argument's sake. They have already responded numerous times by allowing this and turning a blind eye. Every now and then they complain, either because we did step on some toes or because they officially have to say this is not allowed. If they really tried, they could cause some serious legal trouble. They choose not to, for a all the reasons mentioned in the original post.
So don't ask the impossible. Don't expect windows to become an open source application or windows mobile to release official betas to the public (not for sometime anyway). Pigs just don't fly sorry.
I have to agree with Rizzo. Besides, Microsoft won't spend resources on releasing ROMs for old devices, giving them for free to users and then having no way to recover some of the investment, because the Wizard is being phased out. It doesn't make sense.
However Microsoft can open a program for betatesting their ROMs, that is completely possible. A program that involves registering every user that gets the ROM, once we agree not to ask for support and all the legal stuff. And provide the means to keep track of bug reporst, etc. But still if you want to beta test something, you want to do it on the device where it's intended to be used the final release, and I don't think our Wizards are going to get an official WM 6 upgrade.
It's a long shot
igalan said:
I have to agree with Rizzo. Besides, Microsoft won't spend resources on releasing ROMs for old devices, giving them for free to users and then having no way to recover some of the investment, because the Wizard is being phased out. It doesn't make sense.
However Microsoft can open a program for betatesting their ROMs, that is completely possible. A program that involves registering every user that gets the ROM, once we agree not to ask for support and all the legal stuff. And provide the means to keep track of bug reporst, etc. But still if you want to beta test something, you want to do it on the device where it's intended to be used the final release, and I don't think our Wizards are going to get an official WM 6 upgrade.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's a long shot, but they do allow WM6 in the Universal thread. Maybe they will for us. Maybe we try again to post WM6 roms in a few weeks and see what happens??
Today, when I went to Sakajati's website to check the release of his new WM6.5 ROM, I was totally depressed and completely lost the mood to flash this brand new ROM, after I read this brief intro:
sakajati
May 4th, 2009 at 5:59 am
Sorry guys for being away, I’ve been under stress due to financial problem. The business is getting worse and worse, I’m afraid I won’t be able to support this website anymore and may also have to sell my device (God I hope this won’t happend). To all hyperdragon users, please consider to support/donate, it may help me so I don’t have to sell this crapy device. Thanks in advance! Enjoy this new rom and let me know for any bugs you found!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It was exactly the same feeling when yesterday I passed by Mirko Schenk's website and read this:
I aten't ded (12/05/2008, 10:00 PM)
Yeah, I know, I'm a bit slow with updates recently. Somehow, when I wasn't missing free time, all too often I was missing motivation (no, that's not begging for donations) to struggly with the pitfalls of programming after I struggled with them in my job before. And this even though there's currently no girl friend that threadens me when I'd spend more time on my PC than with her. (But admitted, she'd probably wouldn't need to threaden me... )
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sakajati, a famouse ROM cooker for Kaiser, his Hyperdragon ROM thread in this forum has received 11,178 repplies and 1,574,596 views up to now. Yes, not mistaken, it's more than 1.5 milllion views. Is he brilliant? The numbers speak for themselves.
Mirko Schenk, the name may not much known to public. But if I talk about Mort, every chefs here knows who he is. One of his small programs named 'Mortscript' is now cooked in many of the custom ROMs on this site. Is he brilliant? You can ask every chef here, I guess you'll get the same answer:'Yes, he is VERY brillant.'
These two guys are only examples of many of the brilliant stars here. They all have these two same characters as I know: First, their softwares are all FREE. I.e, they supply free service to pubic without asking any material support from users. Second, I am regret to say, they are all VERY POOR now.
Well, I believe, that the initial puppose of their developing these wares are not for money. I also believe that they would like to continue this cause even if they can not receive one single coin from it, even if they maintain a poor living condition for his own life, they just enjoy it.
On the other hand, have to say this: It is ULTIMATE FORTUNE for a man, that in his life he can find something he likes, he is good at, he did it, and finally he fighted to clime to top of the line. BUT, it is an ULTIMATE UNFORTUNE for him that after he did this, he only found his life is 'worsen and worsen'.
Yes a man's value is not only reallize his own joy, he also has to be responsible for his beloves, his family, his girlfiend, or even his pet. This is the reason they may decide to drop this loved cause and find something else to do. And finally they may be driven out from this society.
Now the question comes: Can we do something to rescue them out of this situation?
Yes, we can donate to their PayPal account.
BUT, to donate to a paypal account is not always convienient for everybody that want to help them.
Actually, there are other much better ways, but the forum rules here does not support it. Like this: Why not allow them to put a simple advertisement on their signature?
Like this one (I found in this thread):
iPhone ... its a maxipad without wings!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So that viewers can support them by a simple click of their mouse, which will bring a small money for them? Say in Sakajati's case, he has 1.5 million viewers, onlyif 10% of viewers would make a click on the ad, and only if each click can just bring $0.1 for them. That will collect to an amount of $15,000. Which will greatly enhance their life, at lest let them keep the 'crapy device'.
Don't tell me this is impossible for this forum. We have so many super-smart brains here. Actually can set some rules or systems to avoid any 'side effects' of it, like rules on the size, layout, postion, etc of the ad. Who can use it, who can not etc.
Yes, this great forum place should become a worm home for all telents in this line.
MODs: Can you discuss on this issue?
First let me say this is all very sad. Though I never use MortScript, I do sometimes run Sakajati's ROM.
There are unfortunately some issues with what you propose.
While I love XDA-Developers.com (primarily for its people and community), the board owners are not exactly known for 'making things happen'.
Second, clicking ads to "support someone" is a surefire way to get booted from the ad network. This is a definite no in the ad-world and against all regulations. Besides, all this does is move money from businesses who pay for those advertisements to freeware developers, while the users skimp on the cash again, and those who pay for advert gain nothing - you just click to support, not because you are interested in the ad product. So you rise prices for businesses trying to sell something. In turn this will make their products more expensive, you hurt the business and their consumers, and you have gained nothing. Its frowned upon for good reason.
Right now the best and quickest solution is probably still a PayPal rally. Frequent users should simply just donate a few bucks (remember when PayPal'ing, donate at least $2.50 or so or so much will be lost by the money they take, it's hardly worth donating at all). I have been thinking of a solution for this for years, even before I joined the WM community. I may have thought of something but unfortunately right now do not have the time to set up - however it will remain on my to-do list.
Chainfire said:
First let me say this is all very sad. Though I never use MortScript, I do sometimes run Sakajati's ROM.
There are unfortunately some issues with what you propose.
While I love XDA-Developers.com (primarily for its people and community), the board owners are not exactly known for 'making things happen'.
Second, clicking ads to "support someone" is a surefire way to get booted from the ad network. This is a definite no in the ad-world and against all regulations. Besides, all this does is move money from businesses who pay for those advertisements to freeware developers, while the users skimp on the cash again, and those who pay for advert gain nothing - you just click to support, not because you are interested in the ad product. So you rise prices for businesses trying to sell something. In turn this will make their products more expensive, you hurt the business and their consumers, and you have gained nothing. Its frowned upon for good reason.
Right now the best and quickest solution is probably still a PayPal rally. Frequent users should simply just donate a few bucks (remember when PayPal'ing, donate at least $2.50 or so or so much will be lost by the money they take, it's hardly worth donating at all). I have been thinking of a solution for this for years, even before I joined the WM community. I may have thought of something but unfortunately right now do not have the time to set up - however it will remain on my to-do list.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank for your attention on tjis issue. There must be a solution for that, at least not 'completely impossible.
But the circut of money in 'ads' industry. Is just like 'everybody follow the rules here'.
Since the activities concerning 'advertising' may become a key factor in judgement of this issue. Here I add some more info. There are books about 'advertisement', or lots of internet materials available, but probably not everyone has time to read it. Let me just tell what is advertisement in this simple way:
The major target of ads is not to reach people who want the product, because people wants it already knows it. It is targeted to those people who doesn't want it, or even doesn't know it. Advertisement will let them know the product, and MAKE (sorry I use this word) them reallize that they want it.
This is why ads sponsors would be glad to pay even for a mouse click and a slight glance at what they are advertising. At least this make the clicker have a short memery about their brand name, or their product idea.
After read this, you may feel somehow uncomfortble about 'ads'. But sorry, this is just the prevailing commercial activity.
Please Post Your Comments on This Issue!
Anybody pass by here and reading this, if you have some opinion, comments, or different idea about this issue, please post here.
Maybe you are freeware developer, or commercial software developer, or common user, or moderator, it doesn't matter. What I'm thinking about is not trying to persuade the forum board to issue a new advertising policy, really need to be concerned is how to help those GREAT freeware developers OUT. Avertisement is just the best way that I can figure out by myself. But maybe you guys have better idea about this issue.
Here appeal to everybody:
If you are using a freeware, and find it's really helpful, or may bring additional conveineince and joy to your life. Please think about the life of the developer of the freeware. And first please consider a DONATION to them, if you can not, please think about what else you can do.
Everybody please leave your voice here, maybe we can work out a way together!
Also put a post about up on myblog (spam, not finished yet). Who knows maybe it will even help.
I'll be making a serious donation myself. I hope others will do the same.
Chainfire said:
Also put a post about up on myblog (spam, not finished yet). Who knows maybe it will even help.
I'll be making a serious donation myself. I hope others will do the same.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Certainly yours will be a nice place with lots of chef want to take a look. I went there and found some projects not known to me in the past. Before I only know WMWifiRouter's from you, later WMLongLife, but that's already enough to call you a Master. Now you're master++.
Also noted that you already sent donation confirmation code on Sakajati's site.
You built a nice blog.
I would like to kick this project back off following the withdrawal of tuxhero.
After putting the feelers out and speaking with the developer responsible for the vogue android Kernel build & port I would like to Try and bring those guys onboard and am looking at a way to source them with a device. Further conversations need to take place and definitive project scope and tasks defined with much more transparent approach to the code development.
I have registered androidkernel.com and am asking for feedback from you all on how you think you would like things to pan out. My role is with Project Management and have a wealth of experience in that area, so I would be looking to appoint a team of people to work on the project and either set bounties for milestones or listen to other options and feedback on reaching our project goals.
Hopefully something of value can be achieved and I would be grateful to hear from the previous developers for any assistance available. We can create a website or use github or google code, opinions wanted and lets not rule anything out.
Sangreal
I would be glad to help out with this project. But since I dont have much time (I work 8-10hours/day as a developer) I would be glad if this would be an open development for all to contribute to.
Also it would be nice if the technical documents that Tuxhero has was posted to the developers so that they could be able to make progress faster.
Lets hope we can get android for our device.
I'm in agreement totally - open source, more transparency would be the aim.
very nice ...
but we should ask tuxhero, to share his researched information and diffs.
tuxhero actually didn't get anything done at all. He was making fake posts but in reality he wasn't doing anything.
Lets try not to get into any of that, but I agree there was very little transparency or visibility of code development.
I have asked Tuxhero if he could handover documentation and anything else to kickstart things so whether that is provided we shall see.
Sangreal
sangreal said:
I would like to kick this project back off following the withdrawal of tuxhero.
After putting the feelers out and speaking with the developer responsible for the vogue android Kernel build & port I would like to Try and bring those guys onboard and am looking at a way to source them with a device. Further conversations need to take place and definitive project scope and tasks defined with much more transparent approach to the code development.
I have registered androidkernel.com and am asking for feedback from you all on how you think you would like things to pan out. My role is with Project Management and have a wealth of experience in that area, so I would be looking to appoint a team of people to work on the project and either set bounties for milestones or listen to other options and feedback on reaching our project goals.
Hopefully something of value can be achieved and I would be grateful to hear from the previous developers for any assistance available. We can create a website or use github or google code, opinions wanted and lets not rule anything out.
Sangreal
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You should get in contact with TuxHero at least to ask about his technical documentation on the Blackstone and also if he is able to share any code. There is no harm in two teams working on this brilliant project!
So are the Vogue team really willing to try and crack the Blackstone? Do they need an actual handset?
Edit: If you actually managed to WORK WITH Tux that would be awesome
Transparacy is the clue.. there are a lot of smart heads here that may decide to contribute if the project is open for all..
good luck guys..
Good luck with the management Sangreal, its looking good!
Hope you can gather a good team.
nizzon said:
Good luck with the management Sangreal, its looking good!
Hope you can gather a good team.
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Allthough I do not use the Touch HD for the moment, I wish You all the best. I'm sure You will make it!
If TuxHero does not provide You with the documents he got, I say his intension was only to get 5 minutes of fame.
im happy this project has started, but what plan do you have in mind to get the vogue developers a blackstone? What i mean to say is that even though the blackstone is starting to get a tad dated, its still a very expensive device.
maybe you could get the donation pot from the other thread. that just about added up to the cost of a blackst... oh.
This sounds great.
let us keep this thread clean of the thing other people have done in the past.
and support the topic starter with every bit of information we could give.
i hope he could build a android kernel for the blackstone.
Just a suggestion..
Perhaps the following thing to do would be to list things what needs to be done, what is high priority and is related to what. Also if the task/s could be categorized by difficulty (read: time expected to complete).
Then after we have a list, we can start addressing task/s to people or smaller teams.
I also suggest that there would be some kind of progress bar per task (how much is completed of the task and what is the estimated time for the task to be 100% complete, what is working and what is not). Then there would be no need for people to ask questions like "when is this ready?".
The last thing I would suggest is that we make a list of people that are willing to contribute and with what (read: I would like to contribute and I have skills in ______________)
I would like to contribute with code but I have no experience of hardware coding so I guess it is better I stand aside. However, if You need a forum setup (live chat etc etc), just let me know. I do not want to step on any toes but if you need someone to help with trying to manage the project, I'm absolutely willing to give a hand.
My developing skills are close to none existent,
however any designs (web design, graphic designs and stuff like that) i can do well (or atleast other people think so)
I can also do any testing, if any of this may be useful, let me know.
- Dan
Thanks for all the suggestions so far and I will get in touch with those who have offered skills in other areas to assist where possible, I appreciate a lot of people are waiting for some value in this port and at least a fully implemented kernel.
It will take a couple of days for me to touch base with some of the developers on here and I will need to discuss things in more detail with them whilst at the same time getting the base requirements fulfilled on which to start the project off properly, after which there will be a kick off in some form.
My intention regarding getting a device for them if needed was to contribute myself as well as set up donations however bearing in mind the debacle of people donating before and nothing really progressing I am somewhat conscious of doing this properly and not in the business of obtaining something for nothing so definitely need some good suggestions on that aspect.
make a bounty
no donation, get that f**king thing out of your mind... as soon as the project is done, then open it. Not that I don't value WIP, but otherwise it will only lead to the same disasters we had in the last two attempts... (and I'm not talking about the other devices or other development attempts)
"oh yeah, why is the thing not out yet"
or
"we gave you money, where's the progress"
will be questions we always will see, even if that person didn't donate.
Let money out of the game, it spoils everything.
I personally would still love to wait for tuxhero. Not because I have donated, but simiply believe that good people is all around. BTW, it is always good to have more and more developer to join. Thanks everyone.
Apparently cash is going to be the pilot light and life cycle motivator of such a massive project. Qualified developers a project manager and loads of volunteers. The consensus is $50 (US) per person. That seems far too inexpensive if such a project is to reach a satisfactory conclusion. I agree, giving up our hard earned cash to persons unknown, for unknown effort is not a productive way to go.
What is needed is an escrow: Donations held until specific milestones area reach, as predetermined. Personally, I don't want to give, for example, $250 and some one else $50, with the expectation we each receive the same result. Then again, if specific donations are mandated then this becomes a private project. Oh boy! Back to square one.
No, here's the deal: Each person donate what they want with the donation kept secrete. Either a service or a reputable member hold the donations, perhaps in a paypal account until a bounty release is authorized.
I'm a little less than optimistic, but I am quite agreeable (and already have) to donating to this worthy effort.
What is the best free web hosting out there?
I have tried Sixserve, megabyet, and other smalltime ones who didn't send me a confirmation mail. Sixserve has a lot of ads that skew the formatting of the site, and megabyet has flood control, and my site takes forever to load on most occasions. I can't use a credit card as I'm too young, and my parents are overly paranoid to use their credit card online. I want to use the site as a repo for my upcoming project to cook roms in a package, and also to be my portfolio (I'm also a photographer, and a smalltime video editor) . I want to use Joomla!, or wordpress for my site. Can anyone please guide me on which free web host is the best, or, even better, donate to me a web host. I will do something great in return . You decide.
Why not just use the wordpress hosting? I'm not sure on what sort of restrictions there are on the sites though re content etc.
captainstu72 said:
Why not just use the wordpress hosting? I'm not sure on what sort of restrictions there are on the sites though re content etc.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wordpress hosting does not support 3rd party themes, and I have to pay for CSS editing. Also, no space for my repo. Anyway, thanks.
Oh right, thats pretty lame then!
What kind of space do you think you'd need? Just so someone who possibly has some spare space on there host can give you?
I would help - but do not have any subdomains, nor any space/spare DB's.
captainstu72 said:
Oh right, thats pretty lame then!
What kind of space do you think you'd need? Just so someone who possibly has some spare space on there host can give you?
I would help - but do not have any subdomains, nor any space/spare DB's.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't need much space for the front-end (the web site), based on my experiences in jumping around free web hosts, I only need 1 MYSQL database, about 100mb is more than enough for the site. However, for the repo, i would need (maybe) a LOT! of space, so that the end-user does not need to download >1gb? of data just to cook a ROM of < 50mb. Oh, the area for the repo should not have flood control enabled, please. TYVM
I guess you gave up on hosting it yourself?
captainstu72 said:
I guess you gave up on hosting it yourself?
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Yup, becos' the electricity costs involved were humongous, so did the bill (I don't know about your country, but electricity in S'pore is charged at 20-40 Singapore cents per kilowatt, depending on the type of housing; that's equal to about 13-30 US cents!)
You get the idea.
I wouldn't touch free hosting with the proverbial barge-pole, but apparently byethost is alright.
I can't vouch for them, or otherwise, and I would always recommend people use their own dedicated server they have root on (provided they know how to manage a server), or that of someone they trust to run the server for them.
I am not a fan of shared hosting services, but they're obviously very convenient for a lot of people who aren't interested in servers etc. I just think you're better to learn to work on a server, for the day something it goes wrong and you need to use ssh to fix something.
But this doesn't help the OP, who can't pay for hosting, so if you want to try a free host, byethost might be worth a look. No personal recommendation from me btw, just what I've heard from others.
pulser_g2 said:
I wouldn't touch free hosting with the proverbial barge-pole, but apparently byethost is alright.
I can't vouch for them, or otherwise, and I would always recommend people use their own dedicated server they have root on (provided they know how to manage a server), or that of someone they trust to run the server for them.
I am not a fan of shared hosting services, but they're obviously very convenient for a lot of people who aren't interested in servers etc. I just think you're better to learn to work on a server, for the day something it goes wrong and you need to use ssh to fix something.
But this doesn't help the OP, who can't pay for hosting, so if you want to try a free host, byethost might be worth a look. No personal recommendation from me btw, just what I've heard from others.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I tried the following free web hosts:
Byet
Sixserve
Megabyet
Byet's resellers(e.g: noadsfree, 000a.biz, etc...)
000webhost
Awardspace
Dreamhost
And more
But all... s*ck. All have flood control, which isn't beneficial for WordPress as it will query the MySQL DB 30+ times every time a user loads a web page, hence it will take forever to load the page(Flood control blocks out multiple connections to save bandwidth). Wp-cache did not help either. I am at my wits end now. I would definitely appreciate if someone who has $$$ to spare treat me with a hosting account. AdSense will pay you back when I start up the site. Please..............?
Sent from my GT-I5700 using Tapatalk
@arikyeo: Wow you already tested many different web hosts.
I am actually very satisfied with my own web host and until now I had no problems. I can recommend this webhost. Maybe you want to test this one too.
cashu30 said:
@arikyeo: Wow you already tested many different web hosts.
I am actually very satisfied with my own web host and until now I had no problems. I can recommend this webhost. Maybe you want to test this one too.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
LOL... This thread was abandoned a long time ago...
Anyway, I'm happy with Heliohost now. Great service, great uptime.
I think the best choice for you is WordPress hosting , specially if your CMS is WordPress .
If you want to use a free web host for WP I recommend Wordpress.com. My recommended web host for Joomla is Freehostia. Just refer to: http://www.freehostia.com/free-joomla-hosting.html. I can understand why someone would choose WP for a small site and it's probably a little easier to administrate than Joomla. But I've always preferred Joomla to WP or other CMS, mostly because I've used it more. Joomla is very good, there's a lot of great free and commercial extensions available, pretty steap learning curve for an administrator though. Drupal is also a great platform to create complex sites, but I'm not a fan of it just because I don't wanna learn another system. Joomla meets all my current requirements. I don't think there's a "best one" of them.... it depends on your goal and technical expertise. There are some useful resources which can help you have a right choice when choosing your needed CMS. I recommend two pages providing a comparison chart of WordPress, Joomla and Drupal: http://www.threehosts.com/ratings/wordpress-vs-joomla-vs-drupal.html and http://www.rackspace.com/knowledge_center/article/cms-comparison-drupal-joomla-and-wordpress. Both present the information in an easy-to-understand format. The best recommendation I can give you is to do some good research on other available products so that when you made your final decision you can stick to it and don't have to change the whole system after some time because this then can get time consuming and causes additional costs. A full list of these programs is available at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_content_management_systems. But the most popular ones are presented on http://www.simplescripts.com/script_list. Platforms on SimpleScripts are categorized and this helps you make your decision more easily.
Hostinger is the best ever!
Many good subdomains!
Try it
Sent from my GT-I9100 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app
Best free web hosting for WordPress/ Joomla?
Joomla is a portal- or community type site while WordPress is a blog.
Joomla gives you a lot of power in your hands and that is noticeable in the admin section where there are so many options that you get dizzy the first time you go in. it's having less plugins.
Since WordPress has a logical structure, it is easy for a developer to change things around, place ad banners etc…Again, give preference to a specialized developer used to work with WordPress. its having good and lot more plugin's then Joomla
Joomla’s strength is in complexity which is not useful to beginners
WordPress is simple, you can see it as a blog or as a regular website so, it is very useful to beginners.
From free hosting you can not get all basic services which are required for a beginner. You have to pay a minimum amount for basic things which can you do by best hosting service providers. if you need to suggest some hosting services means go with web host, ubiqhost, hostingshout. you can expect good services from these hosting providers as per my experiences.
Best free web hosting for WordPress/ Joomla?
its been good thing to have such forums, its good news of free hosting over wordpress....i was searching alot for such hosting provider i too went with different hosting providers......but its all conditional.......can you give some more details over these free hosting provision.
The Best Free Web Hosting Services
arikyeo said:
What is the best free web hosting out there?
I have tried Sixserve, megabyet, and other smalltime ones who didn't send me a confirmation mail. Sixserve has a lot of ads that skew the formatting of the site, and megabyet has flood control, and my site takes forever to load on most occasions. I can't use a credit card as I'm too young, and my parents are overly paranoid to use their credit card online. I want to use the site as a repo for my upcoming project to cook roms in a package, and also to be my portfolio (I'm also a photographer, and a smalltime video editor) . I want to use Joomla!, or wordpress for my site. Can anyone please guide me on which free web host is the best, or, even better, donate to me a web host. I will do something great in return . You decide.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Honestly, there are tons of ways you can host a website free. From the top cloud giants (Google, Amazon, Microsoft) to local hosting start-ups that are looking for ways to scale up their customer base.
Google cloud hosting has an offer of $300 free credit that lets you deploy live websites/application on their cloud platform. Amazon and most cloud giants has similar offers ranging from a month credit to a full year free hosting plan.
While these are solid options, they seem too technical for most persons that are just on the lookout for a test environment to deploy their demo websites.
Assuming your purpose for this search is to get a basic shared hosting with an easy to use control panel, then here are the best options for you.
x10hosting: x10hosting is one of my preferred option for deploying demo web apps in the past. I recommended their services to lots of students who are learning to code and so far, none of them have a single complaint against them. Needless to say; they’re one of your best guys whenever free hosting is the topic of discussion.
FreeHostia: FreeHostia lets you host up to 5 different domain names on their free plan. There’s also 3 free custom domain email accounts and up to 6GB monthly bandwidth on FreeHostia free hosting offer. Even though I do normally prefer Zoho and yandex.connect for free email hosting, the email hosting services from FreeHostia really rocks. There’s certainly no risk in giving them a trial.
AtSpace: AtSpace is another free hosting services offering company with support for webmail, php, mysql database and 1-click WordPress installation tool. Even though I do not strongly recommend their premium plans for best CMS hosting experience, I’d like to say that they are very honest and straight-forward with their platform and pricing scheme.
The ability to upgrade your free web hosting plan from free to premium for a small amount once it starts getting a good traffic is an added advantage that distinguishes them from similar hosting providers.
AtSpace hosting offers 30 days money back guarantee for new clients to let them test their premium servers before deciding to stay or opt-out.
With AtSpace free hosting, there’s zero ads, unmetered bandwidth, custom domain email account and PHP/MySql database access.
4. 000webhost: 000webhost is very popular among student developers as it comes in handy for testing demo websites/apps.
With a free hosting account at 000webhost, you’d get access to the following features:
10 GB of monthly bandwidth limit
1 GB disk space
Free domain name
Free auto installer for WordPress, Drupal, Forums, Joomla and many other scripts
A vibrant website builder
Free Cpanel control
Instant account verification without any charges
5. $1 USD hosting options: Most shared and VPS hosting companies lets you try their hosting packages for only a dollar per month. If your reasons for wanting a free host is to test your local host contents, temporarily deploy a test site for a client or work on short term code testing: Then this option would come in handy. All you’d need do is → Search Google with the $1 hosting keyword to pick any company of your choice from the list.
Note: Most free hosting companies would force you to upgrade as soon as you start getting good traffic. It is better to have a backup plan as soon as your website start getting a good number of daily visits.
PS: Once you’ve outgrown the free hosting offers, look towards any of these reliable shared hosting options or pick from these cheap VPS SSD hosting plans.
PPS: Upgrading to a premium hosting plan offered by the free hosting provider is never a good option. This is because they are mostly over-sold and would affect your website performance in the long run.
Hi guys,
I'm one of the admins of the travel social network tripcolony.com and I would be glad to receive your tips and suggestions regarding the website, along with some volunteers for spare-time and quick betatesting while using the platform. Our priority right now is to improve it (it's still in beta version!) and make it a comfortable and useful service for many travelers and socially open people in general. That's why your feedbacks are important.
A quick explanation about what it really is first, so you get the gist of it.
TripColony aims to be an easy-to-use social network built by travelers for travelers. It wants to offer the chance for those who love to explore the world to get to know more of their future destinations through friendships with people living on the spot. You create your public profile, your private one for your friends, you set your style, you share the knowledge you have of the places and you just help and get helped. And why not, you might grow friends all around the world and meet them eventually.
We look forward to grow a consistent user-base but what matters most is caring about people's needs.
Soon we will start a "bring a friend, get rewarded" campaign (and of course betatesters get rewarded as well).
I'd really appreciate if any of you checked it out and gave their opinions.