Related
Guidelines for prolonging Li-ion battery life
* Like many rechargeable batteries, lithium-ion batteries should be charged early and often. However, if they are not used for a long time, they should be brought to a charge level of around 40%–60%
* Lithium-ion batteries should not be frequently fully discharged and recharged ("deep-cycled"), but this may be necessary after about every 30th recharge to recalibrate any electronic charge monitor (e.g. a battery meter). This allows the monitoring electronics to more accurately estimate battery charge.[28]
* Li-ion batteries should never be depleted to below their minimum voltage, 2.4 V to 3.0 V per cell.
* Li-ion batteries should be kept cool. Ideally they are stored in a refrigerator. Aging will take its toll much faster at high temperatures. The high temperatures found in cars cause lithium-ion batteries to degrade rapidly.
* Li-ion batteries should not be frozen [49] (most lithium-ion battery electrolytes freeze at approximately −40 °C; however, this is much colder than the lowest temperature reached by household freezers).
* Li-ion batteries should be bought only when needed, because the aging process begins as soon as the battery is manufactured.[28]
* When using a notebook computer running from fixed line power over extended periods, consider removing the battery[50] and storing it in a cool place so that it is not affected by the heat produced by the computer.
Taken from Wikipedia!
so don't flatten the battery before each charge!
I guess this might be an eye-opener for some people. Thanks for this contribution.
My Droid 4 appears to charge to over 4.3V. Yikes!
Reported by Battery Monitor Widget Pro: 4.317V (pretty sure I saw 4.351V one time but I don't know how BMW calculates/reports voltage)
Measured with Fluke 88V across battery terminals: (drat...are there convenient probe contacts? didn't find anything obvious without deconstructing it)
Found this for the Nexus Galaxy
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1507528
Anything like this for the Droid 4? an app (root)?
It appears some sort of battery management boots when the phone is plugged in while turned off? Just curious since I always leave my phone on.
My past 3 smart phones I've kept for 3 to 6 years each. With the non-removable battery in the Droid 4 I'd like to find something to extend it's life.
I figure Motorola went with the lightest smallest battery that would power the thing for the better part of a work day and last for the average user's retention time for a phone (1 year? maybe 2?). It appears they are overcharging the battery to squeeze some extra capacity out of it. Greatly reduces the usable battery life but still meets the design criteria. I'd rather go with something like 10% - 90% charge cycles and double or (more likely) triple the life of the battery.
Right now I'm using Battery Monitor with the max voltage alarm but that means you have to be there to hear the alarm and unplug from the charger. Not really practical.
Since I mostly charge at home I'm considering wiring up a usb cable for my ElectriFly RC charger but that's not as convenient or flexible.
For reference, the following are excerpts from Battery University:
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/charging_lithium_ion_batteries
"Most cells charge to 4.20V/cell with a tolerance of +/–50mV/cell. Higher voltages could increase the capacity, but the resulting cell oxidation would reduce service life"
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/the_li_polymer_battery_substance_or_hype
"Charge and discharge characteristics of Li-polymer are identical to other Li-ion systems "
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries
"Most Li-ions are charged to 4.20V/cell and every reduction of 0.10V/cell is said to double cycle life. For example, a lithium-ion cell charged to 4.20V/cell typically delivers 300–500 cycles. If charged to only 4.10V/cell, the life can be prolonged to 600–1,000 cycles; 4.00V/cell should deliver 1,200–2,000 and 3.90V/cell 2,400–4,000 cycles. Table 4 summarizes these results. The values are estimate and depend on the type of li-ion-ion battery."
Charge Level (v) -- Discharge Cycles -- Capacity at Full Charge
---- [4.30] --------------- [150 - 250] -------------- [110%]
----- 4.20 ----------------- 300 - 500 ---------------- 100%
----- 4.10 ----------------- 500 - 1000 --------------- 90%
----- 4.00 --------------- 1200 - 2000 --------------- 70%
----- 3.92 --------------- 2400 - 4000 --------------- 50%
The Droid 4 uses a different kind of battery chemistry than most other li-ion batteries. You can read about it here on this Anandtech article on the RAZR (which uses the same chemistry, they didn't bother writing an article on the D4).
The interesting bit:
When I reviewed the Bionic, I made note of the device’s higher than normal Li-Ion voltage battery (3.8 V nominal) and later received word that this is actually a new Li-Ion battery chemistry that Motorola is adopting across its device line. We’ve now seen it in the Bionic, the Atrix 2, and thanks to some teardowns know that it’s inside the RAZR as well.
As an aside, people love to talk about how battery tech is going nowhere, but here we have a clear example of a few mass-market devices actually shipping with higher voltage batteries. Now that I know it exists, I want this in everything.
Interestingly enough, the sealed internal battery on the RAZR is 1750 mAh at 3.8 V (6.7 Whr) which is ever so slightly larger than the Bionic’s stock 1735 mAh at 3.8 V (6.6 Whr) battery. Like the Bionic, the battery has a thin profile and extends across almost the entire area of the device. We’ve now seen two different approaches to getting devices ultra thin: dual-sided PCBs that take up about a third of the areal profile (which is what Samsung and Apple do), saving the rest for a thick battery, and the Motorola approach with a single-sided PCB and a thin battery that extends over the entire area.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Anyway, the point is that that what you're seeing is normal. If your D4 isn't charging to that voltage (which can happen if your battery stats gets screwed up), battery life can be ... disappointing.
Hope this helps!
podspi said:
Anyway, the point is that that what you're seeing is normal. If your D4 isn't charging to that voltage (which can happen if your battery stats gets screwed up), battery life can be ... disappointing.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree that "normal" is "by design" but that's not what I want. I expect the designed duty cycle for the battery is less than 2 years.
I understand that charging to 90% will shorten time between getting on a charger but I can't go a whole day now anyway.
I plan to keep the phone for another 3, 4 or more years.
The battery or failure (worn out) is not covered under any of the warranty plans.
The battery is not removable and getting it replaced is probably not inexpensive (along with some probability of damaging the phone during replacement and probability of issues after).
My understanding is that (at least for now) upgrading or activating promotional equipment will cause me to lose my grandfathered $30 unlimited data.
Right now I usually charge in the morning, afternoon and late at night (phone stays on 24x7).
If I had something to limit charging to 90% unattended I would be leaving it on the charger over night and probably a couple of times during the day.
I am rarely away from a power source for very long. Charger at home, charger in the car, charger at work. Plugging in is not all that inconvenient.
If that triples the life of my battery that's HUGE.
The issue is leaving it on a charger unattended and having it stop charging at 90%.
[-deleted-]
Some more data:
http://forums.macrumors.com/archive/index.php/t-1429825.html
Another note:
These are 3.8V not 3.7V cells (100mV higher listed)
So, if you take your above chart and bump everything up by 100mV, 100% depth of charge is achieved at/around 4.3V (instead of 4.2V). I can believe a phone manufacturer would want to hit 100% charge if the cycles available are 300-500 (that's 1-2 years for 'average' users).
The info on that mac forum seems to indicate something about the 3.8V cells also having more available cycles, but that may be related to when they are used in stock configurations for the 3.7V cell (100mV less, double or better the usable cycle count).
Motorola is pretty good about covering their tracks and keeping things quiet (I worked on the communications equipment side of the pond for awhile) so finding spec's/data/charge curves for custom built batteries is going to be tricky. Easiest would be finding where they're getting them/re-branding and finding out exactly what they are.
Hope you can read Chinese
Brandon314159 said:
Some more data:
http://forums.macrumors.com/archive/index.php/t-1429825.html
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is the problem... (unless I missed it following all those links in that post) I didn't see any real data other than a battery labeled "3.8V". That post kind of sums it up in closing with:
Given the evidence, I think we'll likely see a new battery chemistry in the next iPhone. However, this needs to be taken with a grain of salt, since we don't know if the 3.8V chemistry is what LG is using. Even if we find out that the new LG battery is 3.8V, that doesn't mean it's the same 3.8V technology we're seeing in the new iPhone. Since Apple loves to talk about their batteries, if it is featured, I think there's a good possibility they may talk about it. If they do, that could confirm they're using LG's tech. Still, if they're using a 3.8V battery, one must ask why Apple made the change if it didn't have some benefits in store for the new iPhone ultimately. It does, without question, at least confirm a new battery chemistry. The nominal voltages of batteries are directly related to the chemistry utilized within, so you wouldn't get 3.7V and 3.8V both using the exact same chemistry.
From the anandtech article: Most of the time, users quote battery capacity in just mAh because you can be assured that the nominal per-cell voltage of consumer grade lithium-ion batteries is going to remain the same, at 3.7 V nominal, and 4.2 V fully charged for a Lithium-manganese oxide (LiMn2O4) battery. That isn’t something that was just decided on; the voltage falls literally out of the electrochemistry of the reaction. Lithium is the ideal anode for an electrochemical cell because it has the lowest redox potential, at –3.05 V, and it’s very light, at 6.94 g/mol. Combine that with a cathode of your choice, and you get a battery. Relatively standard cathode choices are things like Mn2O4 or CoO2 or NiO2, with the first and second being popular choices. In reality, a graphite anode is used alongside a LiMn2O4 cathode to make things safer, and ions migrate between the cathode and anode during charge and discharge. I’ll spare you the hand waving, but the anode reaction gives you –3.0 V, the cathode reaction 1.15 V, combine them, and you get a ΔE of 4.15 V. You can see where the 4.2 V comes from purely from this, with a little bit of fudge factor. Each battery is different, but it’s again just a material choice.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Still can't find any pointer to any "new chemistry" other than allusions to it... There hasn't been any new battery "chemistry" in years and I think that would be a really big deal. I'm sticking with the info in my first post for the time being. Especially the table at the bottom.
Lets look at it this way:
* charging to 4.3 V *
Right now, starting with a charged battery in the morning I have to put it on the charger about once during the day and it's pretty much done again at the end of the day. That's just sort of my average usage.
* charging to 4.1 V *
If I were to only charge it to 90% I would probably have to put it on the charger about twice during the day (and again at the end of the day) and I would approximately quadruple the usable number of charge cycles.
[i'm really bad at math...]
So I would be putting it on the charger 1.5 number of times to get a ~4x increase in the number of usable cycles?
I can deal with the inconvenience of an extra charge during the day for the added battery life before replacement is required.
I cannot deal with the inconvenience if each charge has to be attended (to unplug it when it reaches 4.1V)
Can someone do an app to cut off my charge at a configurable voltage?
You might have a look at this (not for the faint of heart):
http://www.researchgate.net/publica...e_Material_for_Lithium_Rechargeable_Batteries
Click "view" on the right when that page comes up.
It has more to do with chemistry than much else, but the basic premise is that by using certain cathode materials, stretching available capacity out of a Lithium Cobalt Oxide battery can warrant the higher voltage with less of an available cycle charges hit than you might think. They're talking about up to 4.5V in this article although they're admitting losses of available cycles at high voltages.
I just skimmed through it so if you're really curious, dig deep (I'm at work so limited).
I'm a chemistry major so take it with a grain of salt
Ok... that made my eyes bleed.
something about blah, blah ... increased stability up to 4.5v ... blah, blah, ...dual doping ... blah, blah, ...microwave heating for 25 minutes...
No idea if manufacturing it might cost more than the phone or if that is what might have gone into my Droid 4, or how quantify increased stability up to 4.5v in terms of increased cycles.
but yes, from what I can tell, it does look like someone made some sort of advancement in battery tech
Did anybody find an app to do this?
I've been following the great battery impression thread, which discusses ways to tweak the Nexus 4 settings, ROMs, and so forth for maximum run time between charging. This thread focuses on a different battery concern.
The Nexus 4 lithium polymer battery is sealed, and as far as I know, there are still several unknowns about replacing it. We've seen a tear-down showing how to remove the battery. However, as of now, few users have attempted it and there's not a consensus about how easy or difficult it is to do. Questions include:
Even with the correct tools, are the tabs that secure the Nexus 4's back prone to breakage, potentially leaving the case borked?
Is the battery difficult to extricate from its compartment?
Will it a high quality replacement battery become available inexpensively on eBay and elsewhere, or is it this battery, which was not designed to be user-replaceable, too much of an oddball for that to happen meaning that a replacement battery will be expensive and hard to find?
That said, the ease (or lack thereof) of replacing the Nexus 4's battery isn't what I've come here to discuss.
Given the unknowns about battery replacement, my concern is to how to maximize the Nexus 4 battery charge cycles and reduce the capacity drop of the battery over time. It could be bad if after just a year, the Nexus 4's capacity is already noticeably dropping. Not possible? I'm not so sure. Based on what I've read, it may depend upon how we handle charging.
This article at "Battery University" discusses the discharge characteristics of Lithium batteries, and it is my understanding that Lithium Polymer batteries, like the one in the Nexus 4 mirror these characteristics.
My takeaway from the article is:
Charging the Nexus 4 battery before it drops to less than 50% capacity will greatly increase the number of charge cycles before there's a noticeable capacity drop. Letting the battery nearly completely discharge will greatly reduce the number of charge cycles, and therefore greatly reduce the time before battery replacement will be necessary. (Table 2)
Inductive (wireless) charging, while convenient, generates extra heat that will over time reduce the recoverable capacity of the battery. (Table 3)
Having read this article, I am curious about the charging characteristics of the Nexus 4 and which, if any, charging variables we can control as users to maximize battery longevity.
When I first get a new smartphone I try to do a handful of full cycle charges before doing any partial charges. Your battery is still "new" and in the "break in" period. Many users that were the first to get theirs have reported their battery life as getting better. Of course a lot to do with battery are things like your data usage and what you have syncing.
RealiZms said:
When I first get a new smartphone I try to do a handful of full cycle charges before doing any partial charges. Your battery is still "new" and in the "break in" period. Many users that were the first to get theirs have reported their battery life as getting better. Of course a lot to do with battery are things like your data usage and what you have syncing.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks, but I will again clarify that that I created this thread to discuss maximizing the Nexus 4 battery's long-term life and recoverable capacity, not maximizing run-down time in the short-term. That is already being discussed extensively in the great battery impression thread.
I have had a lot of experience with LiIon batteries over the years and I can tell you that the enemy of them is both inactivity and deep discharge use.
Use your phone as you normally would, but avoid frequent deep discharges. Don't be afraid about the number of charge cycles. Frequent charges are better than deep discharge cycles.
These pups have been designed to be used the way most folks use frequently used rechargeable devices. Pop it on the charger when you can, even if you know it won't be there long enough to be topped off. The more frequent and varied activity the better.
I'll add that I do not currently see an LG BL-T5 Nexus 4 replacement battery sold anywhere.
FYI - The Nexus 4 uses an 800 cycle battery as well so makes it even less of a thing to worry about. My SGS2 still gives me good battery life and it's more than 1yr old already, and i think that is a 300 cycle battery. Remember also that at that 800 cycle mark the battery should still have 80% of it's original capacity. 800 cycles is more than 2yrs of constant use/charge every night and for people that don't so much that could put you in the 3yr-4yr range. If you still have this phone 4yrs from now, i think you wont need to complain if it "only" has 80% of it's original charge.
Hi
borntochill said:
I've been following the great battery impression thread, which discusses ways to tweak the Nexus 4 settings, ROMs, and so forth for maximum run time between charging. This thread focuses on a different battery concern.
The Nexus 4 lithium polymer battery is sealed, and as far as I know, there are still several unknowns about replacing it. We've seen a tear-down showing how to remove the battery. However, as of now, few users have attempted it and there's not a consensus about how easy or difficult it is to do. Questions include:
Even with the correct tools, are the tabs that secure the Nexus 4's back prone to breakage, potentially leaving the case borked?
Is the battery difficult to extricate from its compartment?
Will it a high quality replacement battery become available inexpensively on eBay and elsewhere, or is it this battery, which was not designed to be user-replaceable, too much of an oddball for that to happen meaning that a replacement battery will be expensive and hard to find?
That said, the ease (or lack thereof) of replacing the Nexus 4's battery isn't what I've come here to discuss.
Given the unknowns about battery replacement, my concern is to how to maximize the Nexus 4 battery charge cycles and reduce the capacity drop of the battery over time. It could be bad if after just a year, the Nexus 4's capacity is already noticeably dropping. Not possible? I'm not so sure. Based on what I've read, it may depend upon how we handle charging.
This article at "Battery University" discusses the discharge characteristics of Lithium batteries, and it is my understanding that Lithium Polymer batteries, like the one in the Nexus 4 mirror these characteristics.
My takeaway from the article is:
Charging the Nexus 4 battery before it drops to less than 50% capacity will greatly increase the number of charge cycles before there's a noticeable capacity drop. Letting the battery nearly completely discharge will greatly reduce the number of charge cycles, and therefore greatly reduce the time before battery replacement will be necessary. (Table 2)
Inductive (wireless) charging, while convenient, generates extra heat that will over time reduce the recoverable capacity of the battery. (Table 3)
Having read this article, I am curious about the charging characteristics of the Nexus 4 and which, if any, charging variables we can control as users to maximize battery longevity.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There is little point in worrying about charging before it's discharged to 50% and/or not charging to maximum. Yes it increases the number of cycles, but is reducing runtime between those cycles, so you have to charge it twice as often using up the extra cycles gained, so overall it tends to even out.
The longevity argument for only partial discharges really only applies at the time of design and specification where the manufacturer can spec a larger battery and sacrifice some of the capacity (by only charging say from 30 to 70%) to get extra charge cycles. Clearly with a mobile phone this isn't desirable to do, as we crave all the the runtime we can get in the smallest form factor possible.
Regards
Phil
shotta35 said:
FYI - The Nexus 4 uses an 800 cycle battery as well so makes it even less of a thing to worry about. My SGS2 still gives me good battery life and it's more than 1yr old already, and i think that is a 300 cycle battery. Remember also that at that 800 cycle mark the battery should still have 80% of it's original capacity. 800 cycles is more than 2yrs of constant use/charge every night and for people that don't so much that could put you in the 3yr-4yr range. If you still have this phone 4yrs from now, i think you wont need to complain if it "only" has 80% of it's original charge.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Is the "800 cycle" rating is based on real world usage, or a set of idealized laboratory conditions that few users will actually meet? Many Nexus 4 forum users are reporting running down their batteries to a discharge depth exceeding 90% on a daily basis before recharging. This will dramatically reduce their battery's number of charge cycles. The "800 cycle" rating is only useful if we know the conditions upon which it was tested.
PhilipL said:
Hi
There is little point in worrying about charging before it's discharged to 50% and/or not charging to maximum. Yes it increases the number of cycles, but is reducing runtime between those cycles, so you have to charge it twice as often using up the extra cycles gained, so overall it tends to even out.
The longevity argument for only partial discharges really only applies at the time of design and specification where the manufacturer can spec a larger battery and sacrifice some of the capacity (by only charging say from 30 to 70%) to get extra charge cycles. Clearly with a mobile phone this isn't desirable to do, as we crave all the the runtime we can get in the smallest form factor possible.
Regards
Phil
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Point taken, although it looks to me like the relationship between discharge depth and maximum number of charge cycles is not linear. From the way I read it, frequent deep discharging can markedly impact battery longevity which is why I'm skeptical of the 800 cycle figure. Given that many Nexus 4 users are currently reporting an inability to make it through a full day without completely draining their battery, those particular users are bound to have shortened battery longevity unless they charge at least twice/day.
Hi
borntochill said:
Point taken, although it looks to me like the relationship between discharge depth and maximum number of charge cycles is not linear. From the way I read it, frequent deep discharging can markedly impact battery longevity which is why I'm skeptical of the 800 cycle figure. Given that many Nexus 4 users are currently reporting an inability to make it through a full day without completely draining their battery, those particular users are bound to have shortened battery longevity unless they charge at least twice/day.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes it isn't linear, but the advantages are also outweighed by the negatives, such as having to plug it in more often to charge, and if people are struggling to get through the day now on a full charge/discharge cycle.....
The 800 cycle figure is probably about right for chemistry used in the LG Nexus, and most of us will have replaced our phone in a couple of years anyway long before we start to notice the lowered battery life.
The other thing with a lithium batteries is they are like perishable foods, even if we don't use them much, after a few years the capacity has diminished anyway. So even if we only charged the phone twice in two years, the third charge capacity would probably not be that much different to having charged it every day for two years.
So we shouldn't worry about the battery, the best thing we can do is use it as much as possible as it is going to degrade anyway, and we will see little benefit from treating it with kit gloves.
The above also assumes the battery can never be replaced. It certainly is replaceable by the manufacturer or a repair centre, and more than likely most of us could manage a replacement ourselves.
Regards
Phil
One very important thing to realize is that these 500/800 or whatever hundred cycles it's talking about is not how many times it can be charged, period.
It's not like after the 500th or 800th charge, this battery can never be powered on again.
Read the article closely:
" the number of discharge/charge cycles Li-ion can deliver at various DoD levels before the battery capacity drops to 70 percent."
Also, if you lower the voltage of the charge, it seems battery long term life greatly increases:
"Most Li-ions are charged to 4.20V/cell and every reduction of 0.10V/cell is said to double cycle life. For example, a lithium-ion cell charged to 4.20V/cell typically delivers 300–500 cycles. If charged to only 4.10V/cell, the life can be prolonged to 600–1,000 cycles; 4.00V/cell should deliver 1,200–2,000 and 3.90V/cell 2,400–4,000 cycles. Table 4 summarizes these results. The values are estimate and depend on the type of li-ion-ion battery."
Hi
borntochill said:
Is the "800 cycle" rating is based on real world usage, or a set of idealized laboratory conditions that few users will actually meet? Many Nexus 4 forum users are reporting running down their batteries to a discharge depth exceeding 90% on a daily basis before recharging. This will dramatically reduce their battery's number of charge cycles. The "800 cycle" rating is only useful if we know the conditions upon which it was tested.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
When a lithium battery is fully discharged, it isn't actually completely discharged. LG like other manufacturers will have programmed a level that shows 0% on the phone before it shuts down, but in reality this might still leave 10% or 20% or 2% capacity in reserve, we don't know the figure, but presumably LG have set both full and empty charge points to ensure we see around 800 cycles.
Regards
Phil
---------- Post added at 09:19 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:10 PM ----------
Hi
ksc6000 said:
Also, if you lower the voltage of the charge, it seems battery long term life greatly increases:
"Most Li-ions are charged to 4.20V/cell and every reduction of 0.10V/cell is said to double cycle life. For example, a lithium-ion cell charged to 4.20V/cell typically delivers 300–500 cycles. If charged to only 4.10V/cell, the life can be prolonged to 600–1,000 cycles; 4.00V/cell should deliver 1,200–2,000 and 3.90V/cell 2,400–4,000 cycles. Table 4 summarizes these results. The values are estimate and depend on the type of li-ion-ion battery."
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes you get more cycles, but because you have a battery with reduced capacity, you are having to charge it more. Overall the benefit isn't as great as the numbers make it. If LG wanted to give us 1600 cycles they could lower the charge voltages, but then the battery capacity would have to be advertised at around 1050mAh, meaning it lasts half the time it does now, and will need charging around twice as often.
For a mobile phone with a typical 2 year life span, the priority is to maximum the time between charges while ensuring the battery lasts the typical 2 years of most peoples phone contracts. It isn't a co-incidence that 800 charges works out as a bit over 2 years if you charge every day.
We don't need to worry about the battery, just enjoy using the phone. Also the battery doesn't just stop working at 800 cycles either, it just doesn't hold as much charge, but capacity is lost anyway over time regardless if you use it or not as lithium batteries start to age the moment they are made.
Regards
Phil
PhilipL said:
For a mobile phone with a typical 2 year life span, the priority is to maximum the time between charges while ensuring the battery lasts the typical 2 years of most peoples phone contracts. It isn't a co-incidence that 800 charges works out as a bit over 2 years if you charge every day.
We don't need to worry about the battery, just enjoy using the phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
A lot of assumptions there, Phil.
My "priorities" and LG's differ. 2 years from now, some will replace their Nexus 4 with whatever shiny new phone comes along that offers holographic video projection chat and does double duty as a sex robot. However, I will happily trudge on with my Nexus 4 for between 3 to 5 years which is how long I typically own a phone before replacement. I don't need bleeding edge, especially if the bleeding edge is a menstruating sex robot phone. Just sayin'.
We don't know if the Nexus 4 battery replacement will turn out to be either very costly and/or difficult. For those of us who don't plan to toss our Nexus 4 into a landfill two years from now, it pays to know what measures we can take to prolong battery longevity.
'Maximizing Nexus 4 battery'
.
.
.
'Menstruating sex robot'
.
.
.
Hmmmm....how did that happen...
I don't know if we will really know how good the battery longevity is in this thing until the device is a year old or more. Lithium polymer technology varies a lot. There have been a lot of advances with this tech in the last few years and some companies claim to have developed manufacturing techniques that allow THOUSANDS of charge before noticeable drops in batty capacity. Other technologies developed include the tech Apple uses and advertised in its MacBook line a few years ago that claimed longer battery life and very fast charging compared to Lithium Ion batteries. It all varies. LG claims to have some special tech baked into this battery that allows it to charge to a higher voltage compared to batteries of similar size, but I don't know how long its life is rated at.
666fff said:
'Maximizing Nexus 4 battery'
.
.
.
'Menstruating sex robot'
.
.
.
Hmmmm....how did that happen...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You apparently haven't seen the leaked mock-up of the Nexus 6.
borntochill said:
You apparently haven't seen the leaked mock-up of the Nexus 6.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would consider an early upgrade for a menstruating Daryl Hannah any day
Hi guys, good afternoon, how are you?
As I was looking after the Nexus 5 and the battery life of the device began to get discussed, I was unaware of the fact that nowadays we can just charge the device however we like, using Lithium-ion polymer batteries, different from the past, when a full recharge was recommended for the battery performance not get affected.
Considering that, for some users the battery life shouldn't be a concern, mainly for those who have a power outlet nearby, making an option to recharge it at any % level before getting it to fully recharge during the night.
I'd like to know from you guys: how do you recharge your devices? Do you wait for it to drain every % of the battery before recharging it or just plug it on the power outlet whenever needed?
Also, do you guys believe that recharging it at any % level does not affect battery performance?
Thanks a lot!
Modern batteries have a finite number of charging cycles before they being to lose performance. Generally speaking, 100%-0% is one discharge cycle, so if you want to maximize battery longevity you should do your best to minimize the number of discharge cycles you subject the battery to. It is not strictly speaking a direct relationship, but the battery should last longer if you charge it when it reaches 50% as opposed to 0% (that would qualify as "half" a discharge cycle).
When I'm using my device heavily and I have access to an outlet, I leave it plugged in. That saves on discharge cycles. Also, when I am sitting at my desk at work I generally keep it plugged in.
The following link is an excellent source of information regarding batteries:
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/
right now with my current phone i'll usually just top it off after work from a wall outlet, or top it off in the morning when i wake up and get ready for work. i also have a usb cable at work to top off whenever needed throughout the day. i try to keep the battery over 50% most of the time, just because, but i rarely leave it plugged in throughout the entire night, and this is even with running sleep tracking apps. i imagine battery use/charging will be the same with the nexus 5 -- topping off in the morning while getting ready for work, maybe charge a bit while at work via usb cable, and topping off after work via wall outlet.
i guess i charge my battery in intervals throughout the day, instead of the daily 8 hour overnight charge. however, i usually keep it at least half full
Plug it in at night before I go to sleep.
If i'm using it heavily and it gets below 50%, I'll plug it in.
Some days at the office I'll plug it in about an hour before I leave so it'll be almost 100% after work.
If i'm going somewhere and feel I may run the battery down before I get home, I'll carry my portable charger with me (Anker 5600mAh).
matthewr87 said:
Modern batteries have a finite number of charging cycles before they being to lose performance. Generally speaking, 100%-0% is one discharge cycle, so if you want to maximize battery longevity you should do your best to minimize the number of discharge cycles you subject the battery to. It is not strictly speaking a direct relationship, but the battery should last longer if you charge it when it reaches 50% as opposed to 0% (that would qualify as "half" a discharge cycle).
When I'm using my device heavily and I have access to an outlet, I leave it plugged in. That saves on discharge cycles. Also, when I am sitting at my desk at work I generally keep it plugged in.
The following link is an excellent source of information regarding batteries:
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wouldn't heavy usage while its charging put too much heat on the battery? Which is worse for it then worrying about charge cycles?
I do a backflip spin 360 before charging my phone...
thfreedumb said:
Wouldn't heavy usage while its charging put too much heat on the battery? Which is worse for it then worrying about charge cycles?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It depends whether/how much heat is generated during heavy usage. On my N7 while browsing the net or watching videos the heat is non-existent. Certain games cause more heat than others. If the device starts to become "hot" then yeah, keeping it plugged in will only exacerbate the problem.
Also, having a case on the device can increase heat soak.
It depends on the situation.
You are right though that heat is the enemy when it comes to batteries. About an hour in my back-back on a beach on Oahu killed my GNex battery, and it was in the shade too.
I plug mine into a wall charger or my laptop...
At the end of the day though, if you don't bake or freeze your phone, the battery should last at least a couple of years without losing too much capacity I think.
The battery longevity discussion with mobile devices is similar to the oil change debate in automotive circles. Some people swear by certain brands and oil change intervals, whilst others just buy what is on sale and change the oil when the car tells them too. It probably makes very little difference in the end.
Yakandu said:
I do a backflip spin 360 before charging my phone...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Mr.Mischief said:
I plug mine into a wall charger or my laptop...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Smart alecks. Granted, I got a chuckle.
To OP:
Today's lithium ion batteries are way better than what they were 10 years ago. As posted above, go to battery university and learn all about it. My advice? Don't worry about special ways to charge your phone. You'll break, sell, or permanently store this phone long before your battery gives out due to charge cycles.
matthewr87 said:
Modern batteries have a finite number of charging cycles before they being to lose performance. Generally speaking, 100%-0% is one discharge cycle, so if you want to maximize battery longevity you should do your best to minimize the number of discharge cycles you subject the battery to. It is not strictly speaking a direct relationship, but the battery should last longer if you charge it when it reaches 50% as opposed to 0% (that would qualify as "half" a discharge cycle).
When I'm using my device heavily and I have access to an outlet, I leave it plugged in. That saves on discharge cycles. Also, when I am sitting at my desk at work I generally keep it plugged in.
The following link is an excellent source of information regarding batteries:
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This!
Once upon a time I used to wait till my phone drained to 0-5% before I charged it. But I quickly realized that doing so turned my battery into trash.
So now with my 2 latest phones I usually charge it when they are at 30-40% or higher if possible and not only do I get excellent battery time but also its lifespan & performance doesn't deteriorate over time.
Sent from my C6903 using Tapatalk
The only advice you need: DO NOT FULLY DISCHARGE LI-ION BATTERIES. These aren't NiCads, you do not need to power-cycle them periodically.
For best Li-ion life, try and avoid discharging below 20% or above 80%. Manufacturers will often add some 'headroom' to the 100% level (so that a battery that reads 100% is actually only charged to 80%-90% of capacity) in order to maximise longevity. within that range, charging and discharing will have little effect on battery life. charge and discharge rates do have an effect, but again ythe battery controller will limit these to prevent damage to the battery, so this is not something you need to worry about yourself.
Keep the battery topped up and avoid discharging it completely. Anything else is hocus-pocus or incorrect advice for the wrong battery chemistry.
i replace my phone once a year so i dont bother with saving the battery etc.. ive never had any measurable degradation to the battery the way i charge in less than a year. I usually charge it from what ever % its at to full. Most of the day at work it stays on my wireless charger, but it stops charging it after its full.
Thanks everyone for the feedback this far, in just a couple of minutes I already learned a lot.
Please let's continue the talk and vote if you can!
Thanks again.
On the charger before reaching 10%, around 20% or higher if it's possible.
EdZ said:
The only advice you need: DO NOT FULLY DISCHARGE LI-ION BATTERIES. These aren't NiCads, you do not need to power-cycle them periodically.
For best Li-ion life, try and avoid discharging below 20% or above 80%. Manufacturers will often add some 'headroom' to the 100% level (so that a battery that reads 100% is actually only charged to 80%-90% of capacity) in order to maximise longevity. within that range, charging and discharing will have little effect on battery life. charge and discharge rates do have an effect, but again ythe battery controller will limit these to prevent damage to the battery, so this is not something you need to worry about yourself.
Keep the battery topped up and avoid discharging it completely. Anything else is hocus-pocus or incorrect advice for the wrong battery chemistry.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
this +1.
I put emphasis on 'so this is not something you need to worry about yourself'.
EdZ said:
The only advice you need: DO NOT FULLY DISCHARGE LI-ION BATTERIES. These aren't NiCads, you do not need to power-cycle them periodically.
For best Li-ion life, try and avoid discharging below 20% or above 80%. Manufacturers will often add some 'headroom' to the 100% level (so that a battery that reads 100% is actually only charged to 80%-90% of capacity) in order to maximise longevity. within that range, charging and discharing will have little effect on battery life. charge and discharge rates do have an effect, but again ythe battery controller will limit these to prevent damage to the battery, so this is not something you need to worry about yourself.
Keep the battery topped up and avoid discharging it completely. Anything else is hocus-pocus or incorrect advice for the wrong battery chemistry.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
BoneXDA said:
On the charger before reaching 10%, around 20% or higher if it's possible.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks to this two people.
Before i read this, me always charge the @ 10% or below.
+1 :good:
I just discharge to 20%-40%, then charge it with the included charger overnight...
I've tried using slow chargers but didn't really make the battery any better.
I agree that discharging it fully is bad. Very bad.
I just charge it how it's mean to be charged and I don't have any problems
Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk
I've been charging wrong this whole time! Will start charging before I hit 10% from now on. Glad I saw this, just got a new phone and am hoping to keep it for as long as possible...
I charge it every night because I have to use it all day.
Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk
Hello,
i've recently purchased a new Samsung Galaxy Tab S2. It looks like the tablet had been lying in stock for quite some time, as it only had 28% battery left when i powered it up. The first readings from the monitoring app i use (AccuBattery) estimated an effective capacity of around 5600 mAh out of the 5870 mAh design capacity (95% health). After one full charge cycle, i've been doing small cycles as is advised pretty much everywhere when dealing with Li-Ion batteries, never dropping below 20% and never going above 70%. A 50% charge cycle, from 20% to 70%, is worth 10% of a full cycle, according to the app.
Now here's the catch, in just 2 weeks of use, and what must have been 3 cycles' worth of charging tops, the battery health already dropped from 95% to 92%, and is now resting at 5421 mAh estimated capacity. The amount of mAh gained from a 50% charge also reflects this. It's also worth noting that the built in battery indicator shows the same percentages as the app, which would lead me to believe the readings are accurate, or at least that both are either right or wrong.
I find it highly unlikely a barely used battery could lose 3% of its capacity over the span of 2 weeks, so what gives? Could it be the infamous "memory effect" at work, even though Li-Ion batteries are supposed to not be affected by it? Or is the battery bad?
I'd like to shed some light on this topic, as there's a lot of contrasting opinions about it.