Database Develop

[Q] Bootloader and Rooting - which one does what?

Hello,
I just got my new Xperia Z having used my ancient Iphone 1G for the last 4 years and I have no experience with Android and anything related to it what so ever. I've spent the last 2 days tirelessly working my way through various forums, guides, wikis to get an idea what I'm dealing with here and where to start, but there's an important decision that I could really use your thoughts and tips on.
After reading up on it, I decided I want to root my phone and this seems to be somehow connected to unlocking the bootloader and this is where I'm worried. I read the guide on how to unlock the bootloader and the warning about losing DRM Keys and the consequences of this scared me away from it. Now I'm left wondering, and this is my actual question here:
What is the difference between unlocking the bootloader and rooting my phone and simply rooting without unlocking the bootloader?
And in case the things I want to do are only available with an unlocked bootloader: how damaging is it to lose DRM keys and therefore the bravia engine and gracenote? What made you decided for or against unlocking the bootloader?
Thanks!

Hi,
maybe I can help you.
Bootloader is like the BIOS of a PC. It checks everything at start up.
Locked Bootloader only allows to run the Stock FW and in this case the DRM-Keys are working (everything is checked and safe)
Unlock the Bootloader means you were able to install an modified / other FW and then you loose the DRM-Keys (the manufacturer hasn´t checked the FW and it is in the eyes of an manufacturer "not safe". You will also loose your warranty.
If you unlock the bootloader Root is always possible as I know.
In this case the system is not from the manufacturer and unofficial modification could be done to the system. Normally all modified Systems have Root access. So you were able to do things that the manufacturer has normally not allowed. Modify system files or something like that. Also it could be possible to copy for example a downloaded and payed movie to another device. This is why you were not able to download a movie on the Play Store if you have root. On a locked bootloader the FW (system) does not give you the possibility to copy the movie to an other device and everything is "safe" (from the view of companies). No illegal copies are possible. (DRM-Keys)
Since some days Root is also possible on a locked bootloader.
The bootloader is checking the status (locked) .. then checking the FW (stock) ... DRM-Keys still valid.
But due to the root access you were also able to modify system files and apps can recognize that you have root access. So you can still use the bravia engine for example (DRM-Keys are ok). But the Google Play Store will still recognize that you have root and will not let you download movies.
This is my experience with Root ... If something is not correct, please correct me

UserX10 said:
Hi,
maybe I can help you.
Bootloader is like the BIOS of a PC. It checks everything at start up.
Locked Bootloader only allows to run the Stock FW and in this case the DRM-Keys are working (everything is checked and safe)
Unlock the Bootloader means you were able to install an modified / other FW and then you loose the DRM-Keys (the manufacturer hasn´t checked the FW and it is in the eyes of an manufacturer "not safe". You will also loose your warranty.
If you unlock the bootloader Root is always possible as I know.
In this case the system is not from the manufacturer and unofficial modification could be done to the system. Normally all modified Systems have Root access. So you were able to do things that the manufacturer has normally not allowed. Modify system files or something like that. Also it could be possible to copy for example a downloaded and payed movie to another device. This is why you were not able to download a movie on the Play Store if you have root. On a locked bootloader the FW (system) does not give you the possibility to copy the movie to an other device and everything is "safe" (from the view of companies). No illegal copies are possible. (DRM-Keys)
Since some days Root is also possible on a locked bootloader.
The bootloader is checking the status (locked) .. then checking the FW (stock) ... DRM-Keys still valid.
But due to the root access you were also able to modify system files and apps can recognize that you have root access. So you can still use the bravia engine for example (DRM-Keys are ok). But the Google Play Store will still recognize that you have root and will not let you download movies.
This is my experience with Root ... If something is not correct, please correct me
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi and thanks a lot for your reply, helped me understand the difference of both better!
If I only root but do not unlock my bootloader will I be able to do anything other than using custom firmware (ROMs)? Will I be able to install Apps that require root or install custom modification like the ones offered on this forum that need to be "flashed in recovery" if I only root not unlock my bootloader?
Also, still looking for some pros and cons (my second question in the original post).
Appreciate all your help!

root will give you access to recovery (in time - still in development) and you can install apps that require root access
custom mods - yes you can install them via recovery and some can be installed with root access and without recovery
if u unlock bootloader you will lose bravia engine not sure bout gracenote as i dont use it
you can check this thread http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2154310 too see what have people wrote bout
rooting with unlocked bootloader

The main thing pointing me towards unlocking bootloader (I'm already rooted on locked bootloader) is being able to install kernels and major roms.
For example, you could flash Doomlords kernel and over clock the processor a bit, but you could also reduce power and save battery
The major roms I speak of are the ones that are kinda cross device: CyanogenMod and Paranoid Android to name 2. CM is based on pure android, no Sony changes so we can't flash that on locked bootloaders as it requires changing kernel. PA is same.
As for the downsides. I'm not too bothered about DRM keys. I use Spotify for music so don't think I need gracenote. Never watched a movie on my phone. BE2 isn't my cup of tea... Over saturates everything.
I'm going to look into DRM keys more tomorrow, but if someone can correct anything I've written then please do
Not being able to restore via Sony tools... Isn't that bad as you're going to be using flash tool a lot so you'll be used to that. Just keep a generic stick firmware .ftf around in case something goes horrendously wrong (usually recovery backup is enough I think).
Sent from my C6603 using Tapatalk 2

Nice thread, I had this question too
It's my first android and I guess I should unlock the bootloader and then root, this way I won't have to wipe my data later when I decide to try cyanogenmod or something else?
Also what happens if sony release 4.2? Will I lose my bootloader unlock and root?

Al Gore said:
Nice thread, I had this question too
It's my first android and I guess I should unlock the bootloader and then root, this way I won't have to wipe my data later when I decide to try cyanogenmod or something else?
Also what happens if sony release 4.2? Will I lose my bootloader unlock and root?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would say root without unlock for now.
When you want to try cyanogenmod or others. Just backup everything using titanium backup and then u can restore after unlocking.
Rooting with a locked bootloader means sony are not aware your bootloader is unlocked
Sent from my C6603 using xda premium

Thanks for all your replies, helped me out a ton!
I think Im gonna root without unlocking bootloader for now to get my feet wet and get a grasp of it's capabilities and limits. Can always restore the phone if I screw up and can always unlock bootloader later if I need it.

Al Gore said:
Nice thread, I had this question too
It's my first android and I guess I should unlock the bootloader and then root, this way I won't have to wipe my data later when I decide to try cyanogenmod or something else?
Also what happens if sony release 4.2? Will I lose my bootloader unlock and root?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you unlock Bootloader, you shouldn't update from Sony. Since you've (hypothetically) already unlocked, you already have 4.2 avaliable from FXP and if you really want the Sony Update maybe you could flash it via flash tool. Bootloader unlock will never be lost (until someone can create an explicit relock file, but customs roms won't relock it). Root maybe lost if you flash a rom without it but you should be able to get it back easy.
With locked bootloader, we have to wait for Sony to bring 4.2 as we can't access the kernel, but we retain the ability to use the official updates. If we're rooted and we update, we are no longer rooted and we may be unable to use the same exploit.
Sent from my C6603 using Tapatalk 2

[Q] Rooting and OTA updates on moto X (xt1052)

I have a Moto X -Xt1052 in India. I would like to root it and install Xposed framework. I am running kitkat 4.4.4
I would like to know is there any rooting method that wont affect OTA upadtes Because some people say thay if you unlock bootloader and You try OTA you brick your device. is it true???
and is there any way to reverse all this : Bootloader unlocking> getting back stock recovery> unroot complely so that there is no harm when you Update via OTA.
M really confused as there are mixed view over internet..

a few items to clear up....
The ability to root, and how you root vary depending on if you have unlocked your bootloader (or can you) or not, and what rom you have.
Being rooted itself does not impact the ability or inability to take an OTA. Its additional mods like custom recovery (you need to flash stock recovery back on before taking an OTA or you'll be stuck in a boot loop), deleting bloat (common in the USA where carriers like Verizon install a lot of extra apps and stuff as part of their rom), etc. The OTA performs a validation check before it installs. Modify too much on your phone and you will probably touch something that will cause the validation check to fail, and the OTA wont install.
Xposed gets in the way of OTA updates. You need to disable it or un-install it before taking an OTA.
I have never seen an unlocked bootloader be the cause of bricking a phone, taking an OTA or otherwise.
Attempting to down grade your ROM then later taking an OTA can/will brick your phone. But if you've never tried to downgrade your rom, there is nothing to worry about.
Once you unlock your bootloader, there is no need to re-lock it. It wont get in the way of an OTA. There is a process re-lock your bootloader if you want, but there is no reason to. Also keep in mind there are 3 states of the Moto X bootloader. 1. Locked - as it ships from the factory, 2. Unlocked - after you get your bootloader unlock code and use it, 3. Re-Locked - after you follow the process to relock the bootloader. And Once unlocked, we can only toggle it to RELOCKED. We can't set it back to LOCKED.
There are many ways to get back to "stock" after rooting and modifying your phone. I've outlined a few HERE

[Q] 5.0 and rooting on locked device

Hey,
So as mentioned in the large "How to root" thread, any update after 4.4.3 will essentially make your device unrootable (or unwritable).
I have the xt1058, which is one of the devices with a locked bootloader. This device is also compatible with Android 5.0, so I was wondering if I flash a captured OTA of 5.0 for the xt1058, will that lock out my bootloader and ensure that I can never root again?
Thanks!

5.0 > 4.4.3 so logic would lead me to say yes, you're stuck running stock.

If you are locked, you will not be able to Root on 5.0 for now, or for awhile.... If ever.
---------- Post added at 10:26 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:26 AM ----------
Once it comes out of course.
---------- Post added at 10:27 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:26 AM ----------
if you really want to Root.... Best to not update, as they may figure out how to Root kit Kat and not Lollipop. Usually how it goes.

themsftcpu said:
Hey,
So as mentioned in the large "How to root" thread, any update after 4.4.3 will essentially make your device unrootable (or unwritable).
I have the xt1058, which is one of the devices with a locked bootloader. This device is also compatible with Android 5.0, so I was wondering if I flash a captured OTA of 5.0 for the xt1058, will that lock out my bootloader and ensure that I can never root again?
Thanks!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not sure what you mean by "flash a captured OTA" but with a locked bootloader all you can flash is a ROM or OTA which is digitally signed by Moto and meant for your phone and its CID value. In other words, you can't capture an OTA zip file, modify, repack it and flash it to include Root, if you have a locked bootloader.
If you want usable root on the X you need two parts 1. Root Exploit, and 2. An Exploit that allows for disabling Write Protection.
If you have a locked bootloader you need someone to find these exploits and create a repeatable process to use them to gain root and disabling write protection. You basically need to find and exploit a flaw or vulnerability in the phone, or its software. i.e. Hack It.
When Write Protection is enabled (the phone's default state with locked bootloader, or the state you are in after you install 4.4.2), any changes made to /system, or the like, (including, but not limited to, App installs, file modifications, deletions, renames, etc) are not permanent and are lost at power off/on.
On a locked bootloader you are relying on someone finding vulnerabilities in the phone or its software to both root and disable write protection. Period. No way around that.
As it stands right now, no one has released info on any vulnerabilities which could gain root on a locked bootloader 2013 X which have been upgraded to 4.4.4. So there is no process for rooting those locked bootloader phones.
While JCASE's Sunshine tool can exploit a vulnerability to unlock the bootloader (disabling write protection), it needs to be able to ROOT, or Temp Root, the phone first, which leaves out phones on 4.4.4 (unless I've missed a change recently). (and before you ask, no, you can NOT safely downgrade from 4.4.4 to 4.4.2 or lower, nor can you get to a state where Sunshine will work once you have 4.4.4 on your phone.)
With further security enhancements as android evolves, its only going to get more difficult finding vulnerabilities to exploit and creating repeatable processes for those with locked bootloaders. In other words while there might be a chance someone comes up with something for locked bootloader 2013 X's on Lollipop, I wouldn't count on it happening, nor would I "bet the farm" that it will ever happen.

KidJoe said:
Not sure what you mean by "flash a captured OTA" but with a locked bootloader all you can flash is a ROM or OTA which is digitally signed by Moto and meant for your phone and its CID value. In other words, you can't capture an OTA zip file, modify, repack it and flash it to include Root, if you have a locked bootloader.
If you want usable root on the X you need two parts 1. Root Exploit, and 2. An Exploit that allows for disabling Write Protection.
If you have a locked bootloader you need someone to find these exploits and create a repeatable process to use them to gain root and disabling write protection. You basically need to find and exploit a flaw or vulnerability in the phone, or its software. i.e. Hack It.
When Write Protection is enabled (the phone's default state with locked bootloader, or the state you are in after you install 4.4.2), any changes made to /system, or the like, (including, but not limited to, App installs, file modifications, deletions, renames, etc) are not permanent and are lost at power off/on.
On a locked bootloader you are relying on someone finding vulnerabilities in the phone or its software to both root and disable write protection. Period. No way around that.
As it stands right now, no one has released info on any vulnerabilities which could gain root on a locked bootloader 2013 X which have been upgraded to 4.4.4. So there is no process for rooting those locked bootloader phones.
While JCASE's Sunshine tool can exploit a vulnerability to unlock the bootloader (disabling write protection), it needs to be able to ROOT, or Temp Root, the phone first, which leaves out phones on 4.4.4 (unless I've missed a change recently). (and before you ask, no, you can NOT safely downgrade from 4.4.4 to 4.4.2 or lower, nor can you get to a state where Sunshine will work once you have 4.4.4 on your phone.)
With further security enhancements as android evolves, its only going to get more difficult finding vulnerabilities to exploit and creating repeatable processes for those with locked bootloaders. In other words while there might be a chance someone comes up with something for locked bootloader 2013 X's on Lollipop, I wouldn't count on it happening, nor would I "bet the farm" that it will ever happen.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What about using safestrap? I also own a locked moto x and am currently running a rooted 4.4.4 ROM via safestrap.
Would this be possible to do with lollipop while retaining root?

frenchie007 said:
What about using safestrap? I also own a locked moto x and am currently running a rooted 4.4.4 ROM via safestrap.
Would this be possible to do with lollipop while retaining root?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You'll likely still need to find a software vulnerability to exploit to gain root. And if Lillipop uses a new Kernel (which is does) it may not be compatible with the current Safestrap. And Hash stopped developing Safestrap.
That being said.. Safe strap requires the host phone/os be rooted with write protection disabled. So if you are running Safestrap on a 2013 X, you likely have Android 4.4 or lower as your host OS and have used something like SlapMyMoto/RockMyMoto along with MotoWpNoMo to root and disable write protection on your host OS. If this is the case, use Sunshine to unlock your bootloader. It will be much easier.

KidJoe said:
You'll likely still need to find a software vulnerability to exploit to gain root. And if Lillipop uses a new Kernel (which is does) it may not be compatible with the current Safestrap. And Hash stopped developing Safestrap.
That being said.. Safe strap requires the host phone/os be rooted with write protection disabled. So if you are running Safestrap on a 2013 X, you likely have Android 4.4 or lower as your host OS and have used something like SlapMyMoto/RockMyMoto along with MotoWpNoMo to root and disable write protection on your host OS. If this is the case, use Sunshine to unlock your bootloader. It will be much easier.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yep, I was holding out on unlocking with sunshine but seems like its necessary to keep root for lollipop. Thanks!

frenchie007 said:
Yep, I was holding out on unlocking with sunshine but seems like its necessary to keep root for lollipop. Thanks!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why would you ever wait to unlock your bootloader if you're able to? You wouldn't have to worry about any of this with an unlocked bootloader.

nhizzat said:
Why would you ever wait to unlock your bootloader if you're able to? You wouldn't have to worry about any of this with an unlocked bootloader.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My only guess would be.... he is still under warranty and isn't in a hurry to void it?

nhizzat said:
Why would you ever wait to unlock your bootloader if you're able to? You wouldn't have to worry about any of this with an unlocked bootloader.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
KidJoe said:
My only guess would be.... he is still under warranty and isn't in a hurry to void it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Because sunshine costs money and yes, I'm in no hurry to unlock it (until lollipop comes along that is)

frenchie007 said:
Because sunshine costs money and yes, I'm in no hurry to unlock it (until lollipop comes along that is)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just keep in mind.... As soon as you update to 4.4.4 or Lollipop, There's no guarantee you'll ever be able to unlock with Sunshine.
You likely know this... But just checking. ?

Darth said:
Just keep in mind.... As soon as you update to 4.4.4 or Lollipop, There's no guarantee you'll ever be able to unlock with Sunshine.
You likely know this... But just checking. ��
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
using safestrap to flash only parts of 4.4.4 (excluding bootloader if I'm not mistaken) allows me to retain full root even on 4.4.4 even with a locked bootloader. however from what I understand you're right this won't be possible for lollipop :/

frenchie007 said:
using safestrap to flash only parts of 4.4.4 (excluding bootloader if I'm not mistaken) allows me to retain full root even on 4.4.4. however from what I understand you're right this won't be possible for lollipop
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Maybe it could..... But based on the issues I've seen in the N5 section, likely not. Lollipop probably won't play well with anything kit Kat or earlier.
Pretty hard to test too... Who knows what would happen if you tried. Also, who knows when or if SBF files will turn up.
---------- Post added at 05:15 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:13 PM ----------
Off topic.... But I will feel bad for anyone who has Lollipop complaints and tries downgrading. Could be the end of their device.
Unless moto changes that quirk with their bootloader.

How to Root Z3C after unlocking bootloader?

I would appreciate your help. Z3C unlocked bootlooader..
Bootloader*
Hi everyone,
I know the information is somewhere out there online, I just need some feedback please .
After installing 5.1.1. I deicided that I wanted to unlock my bootloader and possibly return to kitkat. I've installed Andriod Studio and Flash Tools. I managed to unlock my bootloader, however I'm feeling as though I regret it. Reasons being because I don't fully understand the entire process of rooting and ensuring I have a backup. I have read many forums and dealt with the issue for the past week. I tried sony bridge and they no longer want to update or reset my device. I'm guessing because i've lost my DRM key...
Does this mean that I have lost all firmware updates in the future. Including that specifically from sony, and furthermore google firmware updates because they came as a bundle in 5.1.1?
The way I understand it, is that I have unlocked my bootloader although I havn't rooted my phone. And rooting means you flash with something. with a rom? or a FTF file. Which is an alternative operating system.
Could someone please give me some advice as to what I should do? I rather just leave everything alone and not worry about it, but it seems now that I'm unsigned from Sony that I have to manaually manage my firmware .

How to root Z3+ single SIM

Hello,
I find the rooting thing very confusing.
I have a locked bootloader, is there any way to root my device without unlocking the bootloader? (for example with oneclickroot)
If I unlock the bootloader, what functionality do I lose?
If I understand it clearly, I need to unlock the bootloader, then fastboot the TWRP recovery and then within the recovery I can flash the supersu.zip package?
Also, do I need a kernel with the Sony security disabled if I just want to root the stock ROM? (SONY RIC, SELinux)
I hope someone can clear these things up for me....
Thanks in advance.

By unlocking BL you lose X-reality,Bionz and some sound fuctions if I'm not mistaken but I think there is a way to restore them

josephnero said:
By unlocking BL you lose X-reality,Bionz and some sound fuctions if I'm not mistaken but I think there is a way to restore them
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I unlocked my BL long time ago just because I needed root, I wanted so bad because I need to install cerberus antithief app and some other features.
Then noticed that camera was so slow, video is so lag, so better don't use it and record videos, somethimes color has a lot of contrastbut automatically goes normal, in sound quality and calls I really didn't notice anything bad.
Now that I upgrade to the last firmware, ther is no safe way to root it again, untill now I think I should never unlock my BL...
I have the dual version E6533.

With galaxy and htc I could play around with Sony z3 and plus no root without sacrifying basic functionality... Next phone will be a galaxy s7 or iPhone 7... If possible both... Galaxy for sports iPhone for business and non sports

Basically, there's no way to root any Xperia devices since the Z3+ generation with BL locked. Beacuse Sony update their BL so that you can't replace the kernel even if you rooted the system.