Database Develop

[Q] Bootloader and Rooting - which one does what?

Hello,
I just got my new Xperia Z having used my ancient Iphone 1G for the last 4 years and I have no experience with Android and anything related to it what so ever. I've spent the last 2 days tirelessly working my way through various forums, guides, wikis to get an idea what I'm dealing with here and where to start, but there's an important decision that I could really use your thoughts and tips on.
After reading up on it, I decided I want to root my phone and this seems to be somehow connected to unlocking the bootloader and this is where I'm worried. I read the guide on how to unlock the bootloader and the warning about losing DRM Keys and the consequences of this scared me away from it. Now I'm left wondering, and this is my actual question here:
What is the difference between unlocking the bootloader and rooting my phone and simply rooting without unlocking the bootloader?
And in case the things I want to do are only available with an unlocked bootloader: how damaging is it to lose DRM keys and therefore the bravia engine and gracenote? What made you decided for or against unlocking the bootloader?
Thanks!

Hi,
maybe I can help you.
Bootloader is like the BIOS of a PC. It checks everything at start up.
Locked Bootloader only allows to run the Stock FW and in this case the DRM-Keys are working (everything is checked and safe)
Unlock the Bootloader means you were able to install an modified / other FW and then you loose the DRM-Keys (the manufacturer hasn´t checked the FW and it is in the eyes of an manufacturer "not safe". You will also loose your warranty.
If you unlock the bootloader Root is always possible as I know.
In this case the system is not from the manufacturer and unofficial modification could be done to the system. Normally all modified Systems have Root access. So you were able to do things that the manufacturer has normally not allowed. Modify system files or something like that. Also it could be possible to copy for example a downloaded and payed movie to another device. This is why you were not able to download a movie on the Play Store if you have root. On a locked bootloader the FW (system) does not give you the possibility to copy the movie to an other device and everything is "safe" (from the view of companies). No illegal copies are possible. (DRM-Keys)
Since some days Root is also possible on a locked bootloader.
The bootloader is checking the status (locked) .. then checking the FW (stock) ... DRM-Keys still valid.
But due to the root access you were also able to modify system files and apps can recognize that you have root access. So you can still use the bravia engine for example (DRM-Keys are ok). But the Google Play Store will still recognize that you have root and will not let you download movies.
This is my experience with Root ... If something is not correct, please correct me

UserX10 said:
Hi,
maybe I can help you.
Bootloader is like the BIOS of a PC. It checks everything at start up.
Locked Bootloader only allows to run the Stock FW and in this case the DRM-Keys are working (everything is checked and safe)
Unlock the Bootloader means you were able to install an modified / other FW and then you loose the DRM-Keys (the manufacturer hasn´t checked the FW and it is in the eyes of an manufacturer "not safe". You will also loose your warranty.
If you unlock the bootloader Root is always possible as I know.
In this case the system is not from the manufacturer and unofficial modification could be done to the system. Normally all modified Systems have Root access. So you were able to do things that the manufacturer has normally not allowed. Modify system files or something like that. Also it could be possible to copy for example a downloaded and payed movie to another device. This is why you were not able to download a movie on the Play Store if you have root. On a locked bootloader the FW (system) does not give you the possibility to copy the movie to an other device and everything is "safe" (from the view of companies). No illegal copies are possible. (DRM-Keys)
Since some days Root is also possible on a locked bootloader.
The bootloader is checking the status (locked) .. then checking the FW (stock) ... DRM-Keys still valid.
But due to the root access you were also able to modify system files and apps can recognize that you have root access. So you can still use the bravia engine for example (DRM-Keys are ok). But the Google Play Store will still recognize that you have root and will not let you download movies.
This is my experience with Root ... If something is not correct, please correct me
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi and thanks a lot for your reply, helped me understand the difference of both better!
If I only root but do not unlock my bootloader will I be able to do anything other than using custom firmware (ROMs)? Will I be able to install Apps that require root or install custom modification like the ones offered on this forum that need to be "flashed in recovery" if I only root not unlock my bootloader?
Also, still looking for some pros and cons (my second question in the original post).
Appreciate all your help!

root will give you access to recovery (in time - still in development) and you can install apps that require root access
custom mods - yes you can install them via recovery and some can be installed with root access and without recovery
if u unlock bootloader you will lose bravia engine not sure bout gracenote as i dont use it
you can check this thread http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2154310 too see what have people wrote bout
rooting with unlocked bootloader

The main thing pointing me towards unlocking bootloader (I'm already rooted on locked bootloader) is being able to install kernels and major roms.
For example, you could flash Doomlords kernel and over clock the processor a bit, but you could also reduce power and save battery
The major roms I speak of are the ones that are kinda cross device: CyanogenMod and Paranoid Android to name 2. CM is based on pure android, no Sony changes so we can't flash that on locked bootloaders as it requires changing kernel. PA is same.
As for the downsides. I'm not too bothered about DRM keys. I use Spotify for music so don't think I need gracenote. Never watched a movie on my phone. BE2 isn't my cup of tea... Over saturates everything.
I'm going to look into DRM keys more tomorrow, but if someone can correct anything I've written then please do
Not being able to restore via Sony tools... Isn't that bad as you're going to be using flash tool a lot so you'll be used to that. Just keep a generic stick firmware .ftf around in case something goes horrendously wrong (usually recovery backup is enough I think).
Sent from my C6603 using Tapatalk 2

Nice thread, I had this question too
It's my first android and I guess I should unlock the bootloader and then root, this way I won't have to wipe my data later when I decide to try cyanogenmod or something else?
Also what happens if sony release 4.2? Will I lose my bootloader unlock and root?

Al Gore said:
Nice thread, I had this question too
It's my first android and I guess I should unlock the bootloader and then root, this way I won't have to wipe my data later when I decide to try cyanogenmod or something else?
Also what happens if sony release 4.2? Will I lose my bootloader unlock and root?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would say root without unlock for now.
When you want to try cyanogenmod or others. Just backup everything using titanium backup and then u can restore after unlocking.
Rooting with a locked bootloader means sony are not aware your bootloader is unlocked
Sent from my C6603 using xda premium

Thanks for all your replies, helped me out a ton!
I think Im gonna root without unlocking bootloader for now to get my feet wet and get a grasp of it's capabilities and limits. Can always restore the phone if I screw up and can always unlock bootloader later if I need it.

Al Gore said:
Nice thread, I had this question too
It's my first android and I guess I should unlock the bootloader and then root, this way I won't have to wipe my data later when I decide to try cyanogenmod or something else?
Also what happens if sony release 4.2? Will I lose my bootloader unlock and root?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you unlock Bootloader, you shouldn't update from Sony. Since you've (hypothetically) already unlocked, you already have 4.2 avaliable from FXP and if you really want the Sony Update maybe you could flash it via flash tool. Bootloader unlock will never be lost (until someone can create an explicit relock file, but customs roms won't relock it). Root maybe lost if you flash a rom without it but you should be able to get it back easy.
With locked bootloader, we have to wait for Sony to bring 4.2 as we can't access the kernel, but we retain the ability to use the official updates. If we're rooted and we update, we are no longer rooted and we may be unable to use the same exploit.
Sent from my C6603 using Tapatalk 2

[Q]difference root with unlocked/locked bootloader

Hey guys/gals
i have a quick question.
what exactly is the difference (featurewise) when it comes to rooting with an unlocked bootloader and rooting with a locked one?
i'm pretty new to android (iOS user until last saturday), did some research today, but didn't really find much usefull information.
main reason i want to root (at least for now. i'm sure i would find more after spending more time with my xperia), is because i want to format my 64gb SD to exfat and move apps over to it.
thanks guys
edit: and no, i'm currently not thinking about getting a different theme/loader on it (this is one of the things you can only do with an unlocked one, right?)
edit2: and yes, my bootloader can be unlocked

dottore. said:
Hey guys/gals
i have a quick question.
what exactly is the difference (featurewise) when it comes to rooting with an unlocked bootloader and rooting with a locked one?
i'm pretty new to android (iOS user until last saturday), did some research today, but didn't really find much usefull information.
main reason i want to root (at least for now. i'm sure i would find more after spending more time with my xperia), is because i want to format my 64gb SD to exfat and move apps over to it.
thanks guys
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ok unlocked bootloaders = you lose DRM keys forever and Bravia Engine doesn't work. Relocking won't get them back. You can also overclock/underclock CPU with unlocked bootloader. You can also flash custom ROMs/kernels with unlocked bootloader.
Now with locked bootloader you can still have root but you don't lose your DRM keys. You can't flash custom ROMs/kernels or do any overclocking/underclocking.
That's all I can think of.

yeah, i read about that whole DRM thing. i don't care so much about the Bravia Engine and DRM, but i wouldn't mind it staying (first time i said that about DRM), so thats one of the main reason i didn't just went on with unlocking.
is flashing a custom kernel something more or less common when using a rooted android? could i get the things mentioned done without doing it? (i think i read moving apps only needs root, but then again: the xperia z seems to be a bit special when it comes to extSD)
thanks for the fast reply
shadowboy23 said:
Ok unlocked bootloaders = you lose DRM keys forever and Bravia Engine doesn't work. Relocking won't get them back. You can also overclock/underclock CPU with unlocked bootloader. You can also flash custom ROMs/kernels with unlocked bootloader.
Now with locked bootloader you can still have root but you don't lose your DRM keys. You can't flash custom ROMs/kernels or do any overclocking/underclocking.
That's all I can think of.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

is flashing a custom kernel something more or less common when using a rooted android? could i get the things mentioned done without doing it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well it's up to you. You can either flash custom ROMs/kernels if you want but you will need to unlock the bootloader to do that. Locked bootloader you can only have root and that's it sad to say. But you don't have to flash a custom ROM or kernel if you have root. because you can't anyway with a locked bootloader. Having root just means you can use apps that need root access.

shadowboy23 said:
Well it's up to you. You can either flash custom ROMs/kernels if you want but you will need to unlock the bootloader to do that. Locked bootloader you can only have root and that's it sad to say.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ok, thanks. i think i'll stay with the locked one for now...let's see for how long

[Q] Unlock bootloader vs root

Hi,
I'm about to jump on the wagon and get a Z3 Compact to replace my Nexus S. My Nexus S is long overdue and the Z3C would be a significant upgrade.
My Nexus S is rooted and the bootloader is unlocked. Of course, I have found the appropriate rooting procedures and unlocking bootloader topics for the Z3C. I would like to at least root the device to get Titanium Backup and the Xposed Framework. I have some questions however :
Are there any issue to just root the Z3C without unlocking the bootloader ?
I understand the unlocking the bootloader will cause issues to some functions due to DRMs security keys. Is rooting causing any issue on the Z3C ?
Is it possible to still receive Sony's firmwares updates OTA after rooting ?
Thanks
Neo.

spookyneo said:
Hi,
I'm about to jump on the wagon and get a Z3 Compact to replace my Nexus S. My Nexus S is long overdue and the Z3C would be a significant upgrade.
My Nexus S is rooted and the bootloader is unlocked. Of course, I have found the appropriate rooting procedures and unlocking bootloader topics for the Z3C. I would like to at least root the device to get Titanium Backup and the Xposed Framework. I have some questions however :
Are there any issue to just root the Z3C without unlocking the bootloader ?
I understand the unlocking the bootloader will cause issues to some functions due to DRMs security keys. Is rooting causing any issue on the Z3C ?
Is it possible to still receive Sony's firmwares updates OTA after rooting ?
Thanks
Neo.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Are there any issue to just root the Z3C without unlocking the bootloader ?
Nope.
I understand the unlocking the bootloader will cause issues to some functions due to DRMs security keys. Is rooting causing any issue on the Z3C ?
Nope. There is a way to root Z3 compact without losing DRM keys.
Is it possible to still receive Sony's firmwares updates OTA after rooting ?
Yes. You will still get the updates. However if you have a custom recovery installed or something modified in the system folder, the update verification will fail. Thus, rendering the update function useless.

rradix said:
Are there any issue to just root the Z3C without unlocking the bootloader ?
Nope.
I understand the unlocking the bootloader will cause issues to some functions due to DRMs security keys. Is rooting causing any issue on the Z3C ?
Nope. There is a way to root Z3 compact without losing DRM keys.
Is it possible to still receive Sony's firmwares updates OTA after rooting ?
Yes. You will still get the updates. However if you have a custom recovery installed or something modified in the system folder, the update verification will fail. Thus, rendering the update function useless.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you sir. I have unlocked my bootloader on my Nexus S, however I am installing custom ROMs on it in order to have KitKat. But I don't see any benefit into unlocking the bootloader of the Z3C at the moment, since it should be supported for some time. Unlocking the bootloader just gives the ability to install custom roms, correct ?
Could something like Xposed Framework (which does not require bootloader unlocked, but requires root) cause an Android update to fail ? I do think it is modifying stuff in the system folder, however I don't have a lot of knowledge into the Android architecture. I guess I could just revert every Xposed plugins, upgrade and put them back (if supported by latest firmware).
Again, thank you

spookyneo said:
Thank you sir. I have unlocked my bootloader on my Nexus S, however I am installing custom ROMs on it in order to have KitKat. But I don't see any benefit into unlocking the bootloader of the Z3C at the moment, since it should be supported for some time. Unlocking the bootloader just gives the ability to install custom roms, correct ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes.
Could something like Xposed Framework (which does not require bootloader unlocked, but requires root) cause an Android update to fail ? I do think it is modifying stuff in the system folder, however I don't have a lot of knowledge into the Android architecture. I guess I could just revert every Xposed plugins, upgrade and put them back (if supported by latest firmware).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes. It could also be the reason why. I am not 100% sure on the technical details but based on my reading, OTA performs integrity checks (could be hash checks) on the system files before applying the update. Meaning if one system file fails to match an item, the OTA will not install itself. Also, I read that custom recoveries are one of the causes for failed OTA installation. In my experience, after I downgraded to KitKat and root it using Giefroot, I successfully installed OTA for the .77 firmware. However, during this case, I still don't have Xposed and custom recovery installed.

New Z3c Has No Unlockable BootLoader .. HELP??

Hi all, probably been asked and answered many times but Id like an up to date answer please..
New Z3 Compact arrived today (secondhand off ebay UK), it was Vodafone but I unlocked it and to my surprise, it has a locked Boot Loader that "can't" be unlocked as I really want ROOT and always had a rooted Android since I can remember! Sony seems to be different in this sector and might have to sell it otherwise which would be a shame!...
Any fixes for this issue, being September 2015? Cheers in advance.

ds980x said:
Hi all, probably been asked and answered many times but Id like an up to date answer please..
New Z3 Compact arrived today (secondhand off ebay UK), it was Vodafone but I unlocked it and to my surprise, it has a locked Boot Loader that "can't" be unlocked as I really want ROOT and always had a rooted Android since I can remember! Sony seems to be different in this sector and might have to sell it otherwise which would be a shame!...
Any fixes for this issue, being September 2015? Cheers in advance.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I got mine from O2 and it can't be bootloader unlocked, but I still managed to root it. Followed the steps here
http://forum.xda-developers.com/z3-compact/general/how-to-root-backup-drm-keys-t3013343
Which lets you root and take a copy of the DRM keys, you should not bootloader unlock it first as it wipes the DRM keys permanently, resulting in the loss of the camera low light algorithms and Bravia engine software.

LondonMpee said:
I got mine from O2 and it can't be bootloader unlocked, but I still managed to root it. Followed the steps here
http://forum.xda-developers.com/z3-compact/general/how-to-root-backup-drm-keys-t3013343
Which lets you root and take a copy of the DRM keys, you should not bootloader unlock it first as it wipes the DRM keys permanently, resulting in the loss of the camera low light algorithms and Bravia engine software.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks mate I will give that a go! Found the Vibration doesn't work either so might go back anyway if Root doesn't work lol...

Regarding root with locked bootloader, need some help

Hello, i have a retail xt1097, its already updated to marshmallow, dont really need to be root forever but i need at least temporal root to do some one-time minor changes, such as install my desired launcher as system, led for battery, hostfile and such.
The problem is i dont want to unlock the bootloader untill warranty expires (still 7 months of warranty) so the question is if any app/exploit, can temp root this device, under MM.
*Tryed searching and i found kingoroot does the trick but im not sure if it will work on MM, i cant mess up bricking phones now because im not be able to repair them since weather its hot, people overload powerlines and electricity drops all the time and makes my pc suddently power off.
Any advice? Thanks guys

As far as I know root isn't possible with locked bootloader.
There has been quite a bit of discussion (I think most of what I read was on other forums) about Motorola's warranty policy for unlocked bootloaders: it seems that from what people have experienced they will still honor the warranty if it is strictly a hardware problem. I bought my phone used but with over a year of Moto Care remaining, which the original owner transferred to me. He (the original owner) had already unlocked the bootloader, but the Moto Care is still shown as active and valid on my account, even though I don't even have stock rom anymore. Just to be safe I would definitely (if possible) re-flash stock rom prior to making any warranty claim.

Hmm makes sense, then can i unlock BL, root, do my things, then unroot, flash stock recovery and relock? is that posible? does it need a custom kernel too? im ok with the stock rom just need few one-time tweaks...

Unless you really use Moto Voice a lot I would just install the newly released CM14.1, and if you ever need warranty work try to reflash stock beforehand. Otherwise, flash twrp, root, etc.... That is covered in the general section, probably linked to some of the stickies at the top of the page. I'm not sure if it will work for you to make system modifications and then try to relock bootloader. I think part of relocking the bootloader includes flashing the stock rom, which would undo any changes you have made.