Related
In theory based on the platitudes fed to and accepted by the media, surprised no, "Is it here yet?" posts
On a more "cereal" note, if the point it works with lower resources is true, it would be a reason for me to update and start from scratch.
After I peak out of my from a bunker 20 fathoms below sea level.... I will let others test first!
rushless said:
In theory based on the platitudes fed to and accepted by the media, surprised no, "Is it here yet?" posts
On a more "cereal" note, if the point it works with lower resources is true, it would be a reason for me to update and start from scratch.
After I peak out of my from a bunker 20 fathoms below sea level.... I will let others test first!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Check the OP of the CARBON thread.
Unless a serious bug is identified, these early November builds will be the final updates for the 4.3 branch, as the Carbon Team has started working on 4.4
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Be patient, it's coming!
Indeed, yes. It's true that KitKat will run on lower specification devices, however, that doesn't mean EOL devices will be resurrected. The lower specification "thing" is more of OEMs to consider, so they can push budget devices with the latest version of Android, KitKat; instead of still producing Gingerbread devices.
Of course, away from that subject. It should effectively mean, our devices currently on ICS/4.0.x+ should see an increase in performance, including our Nooks.
So when will we receive 4.4 KitKat on our Nooks? The general rule is never to ask for ETAs, but CyanogenMod has provided for us. CM10.1 is complete and finalised. They're trying to complete work on CM10.2, instead of jettisoning all of the current developers efforts. So they/CyanogenMod will be working on CM10.2 for some time, until they can finish it. That doesn't mean to say CM11 will come after CM10.2. No, you can expect CM11 nightly builds by the end of this month. And yes, it'll be called CM11, not CM10.3.
CM11 release date source.
Maybe someone with more knowledge (like @verygreen?) can chime in here, but I thought the fact that our Nooks (HD & HD+) are OMAP4-based means that we won't have the necessary drivers, since TI bailed out of the market. At least, that's what people have surmised, given that Google isn't releasing KitKat for the Gnex, which is OMAP 4430.
I hope I'm wrong, as the better low memory performance of 4.4 would be great to see on the HD+. Even better, it might even resurrect my old Nook Color! XD
Sent from my Nexus 4 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app
psyberian said:
Maybe someone with more knowledge (like @verygreen?) can chime in here, but I thought the fact that our Nooks (HD & HD+) are OMAP4-based means that we won't have the necessary drivers, since TI bailed out of the market. At least, that's what people have surmised, given that Google isn't releasing KitKat for the Gnex, which is OMAP 4430.
I hope I'm wrong, as the better low memory performance of 4.4 would be great to see on the HD+. Even better, it might even resurrect my old Nook Color! XD
Sent from my Nexus 4 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app
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Click to collapse
google may not have provided a rom for gnex but they have one in the xda forums already...since the nook hd+ is a supported cyanogenmod device I expect it will see CM11...probably omnirom since they are showing up in alot of places....and carbon.
famewolf said:
google may not have provided a rom for gnex but they have one in the xda forums already...since the nook hd+ is a supported cyanogenmod device I expect it will see CM11...probably omnirom since they are showing up in alot of places....and carbon.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
im so excited for 4.4 on our nooks!
CyanogenMod recently pushed out stables for CM10.2 on a select range of devices announcing that, with this, their efforts would be solely focused towards the CM11 code branches. However, they also announced that any devices which received that RC1 of CM10.2 would too continue into CM11.
My question, considering we are still unfortunate enough to be on somewhat unstable nightlies (the notification sound delay, UI issues, application crashes) is, what will be the future of CyanogenMod on the O4x? Will we even make it to stable CM10.2?
Hopefully we can! This is such a brilliant device as you all know well, and the hardware restrictions of KitKat are supposed to be lowered anyway
For clarification, this is not a complaint, the work of the CyanogenMod Team is always much appreciated. I, and so many of you, have donated and thanked them and tested their software for them. This is merely to gain an understanding of where our device is headed so as to aid everybody here in the decision of whether to stick with the device or, should worse come to worse.... look for another :-/
csfrank271 said:
CyanogenMod recently pushed out stables for CM10.2 on a select range of devices announcing that, with this, their efforts would be solely focused towards the CM11 code branches. However, they also announced that any devices which received that RC1 of CM10.2 would too continue into CM11.
My question, considering we are still unfortunate enough to be on somewhat unstable nightlies (the notification sound delay, UI issues, application crashes) is, what will be the future of CyanogenMod on the O4x? Will we even make it to stable CM10.2?
Hopefully we can! This is such a brilliant device as you all know well, and the hardware restrictions of KitKat are supposed to be lowered anyway
For clarification, this is not a complaint, the work of the CyanogenMod Team is always much appreciated. I, and so many of you, have donated and thanked them and tested their software for them. This is merely to gain an understanding of where our device is headed so as to aid everybody here in the decision of whether to stick with the device or, should worse come to worse.... look for another :-/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
probably no official CM11 for us, or 10.2 stable/rc, atleast in forseeable future. thankfully, we have some very skilled devs working on unofficial version of CM, & Vanir&Omni.
Flying_Bear said:
probably no official CM11 for us, or 10.2 stable/rc, atleast in forseeable future. thankfully, we have some very skilled devs working on unofficial version of CM, & Vanir&Omni.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you, I was just wondering about the state of the official ROMs, it seems like the P880 has been forgotten about by CM
But, as you say, we are very lucky to have these fantastic devs building even better custom ROMs
Flying_Bear said:
probably no official CM11 for us, or 10.2 stable/rc, atleast in forseeable future. thankfully, we have some very skilled devs working on unofficial version of CM, & Vanir&Omni.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If everything is working right we should be able to submit it to cyanogenmod to get our nightlies back, but im not 100% sure
JoinTheRealms said:
If everything is working right we should be able to submit it to cyanogenmod to get our nightlies back, but im not 100% sure
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hopefully we can have the issues fixed
Can't wait to see the community development though, the new Android RunTime looks very fascinating :3
why dont u enter cyanogenmod and see with your eyes ? anyway. of course we dont see any support. its a miracle that we had that much support too. who will support a phone which doesnt even has the support of the official company ? LG only had 4.0.3 and 4.1.2 and thats all. isnt it already a miracle that we have 4.3.1 ? and we have also so many good developers that work for 4.4 ?
I don't understand why people want 4.4 so bad when it's one of the worst upgrades from Google i have ever seen. They had to launch 4.4.1 updates right away. You want a better software I agree thats needed but 4.4 isn't a solution.
Sent from my OptimusX4HD using xda app-developers app
Zhus06 said:
I don't understand why people want 4.4 so bad when it's one of the worst upgrades from Google i have ever seen. They had to launch 4.4.1 updates right away. You want a better software I agree thats needed but 4.4 isn't a solution.
Sent from my OptimusX4HD using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Everyone wants KitKat because... Well, because it's new! Why not? I believe that pushing one's expectations beyond what is already achieved represents a strong impulse to improvement. Experimenting, trying new solutions, feeling the awesomeness of something that did not exist before is a powerful spring to the change, the change in itself is something that animates the developers and makes them work with no reward as if this was their job.
It has happened with all Android versions, and always there had been someone who felt amazed and wondered why should we need a new version.
kK can be (and probably is, but who am I to judge) one of the worst Android versions, but I am happy to see people trying to overcome all the problems related with making it work on a relatively old device, and I am happy if by testing what is being developed, and by giving my opinion I can be of some help to somebody.
Want to call it a game? Why not! Want to consider people like me as grown up kids that need something to play with? Well, yes, I am, and will always cheer a new Android version working on one of my devices with grateful heart.
Ricardo Cerqueira is no longer the maintainer of our device?
there is no one who will replace him?
It should be possible to join the CM team, if the 4.4 is running.
The tegra3 problems will hopefully not be a trap for it.
If there is a maintainer who can update CM once, there will be no real reason not to get official support.
Good news everybody!
On the CyanogenMod website, the P880 has been listed officially as one the devices to receive support further than the CM10.2 nightlies, which will be a win-win for everyone
Bye Bye CM !
DarkFantasy6 said:
Bye Bye CM !
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why do you say that? :-/
csfrank271 said:
On the CyanogenMod website, the P880 has been listed officially as one the devices to receive support further than the CM10.2 nightlies, which will be a win-win for everyone
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I saw the latest list the have revealed now, this is great!!
Noticed though that they said MOST of the devices that have CM10.2 builds will move into CM11 nightly during the next weeks.. "Most" hopefully means the P880 as well!
faabak said:
I saw the latest list the have revealed now, this is great!!
Noticed though that they said MOST of the devices that have CM10.2 builds will move into CM11 nightly during the next weeks.. "Most" hopefully means the P880 as well!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, hopefully!
But hey, a stable CM10.2 would even be fantastic, the community devs would appreciate it surely
We never got the m1 and stable so i hardly belive it that we get cm11. And without a good 3.4 kernel source from lg we wont feeo many adventafes of 4.4. but the awesome awesome optic would be nice Maybe im going to buy a Nexus 5. Im so frustrated of my lg optimus 2x and 4x. ONE update -.-
is official cyanogenmod support coming to Asus tf701 ???
im really looking forward to this tablet, but the only thing that is holding me back is that it doesnt have any cyanogenmod support yet
hope it comes really soon, this tablet is awesome and alot of people besides me want to have stock google expeience on it
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2615196
hassanman1997 said:
is official cyanogenmod support coming to Asus tf701 ???
im really looking forward to this tablet, but the only thing that is holding me back is that it doesnt have any cyanogenmod support yet
hope it comes really soon, this tablet is awesome and alot of people besides me want to have stock google expeience on it
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Cyanogen is not the stock Google experience.
Asus is much closer to stock than CM. Anyway CM is out for you to try
hassanman1997 said:
is official cyanogenmod support coming to Asus tf701 ???
im really looking forward to this tablet, but the only thing that is holding me back is that it doesnt have any cyanogenmod support yet
hope it comes really soon, this tablet is awesome and alot of people besides me want to have stock google expeience on it
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There is no official cyanogenmod out but in thread named above a dev made a cyanogenmod version and is still working on it but nothing official.
who needs official if the rom is updated one or twice a week :laugh:
Proxy thread available here http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2621028
Sent from my Note II using XDA Premium 4 mobile app
How soon do you guys think a ROM will be made for Nook HD/HD+ after Android L releases? Any guesses? Cyanogen have done a great job with 4.4
That's just going to be a lot of assumptions
sandsofmyst said:
That's just going to be a lot of assumptions
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Probably why you were the only one to reply xD Thanks man
Just don't like to see 0 replies. That said, there's one now and then that I won't reply to. However, L is of much interest to me and some of the supposed improvements will hopefully be great. Plus L on the nooks would hopefully be even better. So I share your enthusiasm.
The release time could be shorter or longer depending on the amount of porting work to be done. There's other variables too. But someone else might also before cyanogenmod which would be fun.
Thanks for the reply, I agree on L being even better on the Nook varieties. Can't wait!
I was finally starting to look into bumping stock off og my HD9 and saw this... guess I can wait 4-6 months for this to all take shape... I wouldn't want to lose my progress in PvZ2 at this point anyhow
My question is whether or not upgrading to L will be a performance boost or if it'll just be bloat on the hardwwre. Won't know til it gets here though.
Goggles2114 said:
My question is whether or not upgrading to L will be a performance boost or if it'll just be bloat on the hardwwre. Won't know til it gets here though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
With the nook being the nook... you could be right. The latest tech really makes android smooth, not android on the older tech.
OSs don't tend to get faster as they get fancier and the latest tablets and phones have much faster hardware (and more RAM).
Well I mean take a look at the iPhone 4S, it used to be able to run IOS 5 and now it's up to IOS 8 and it's still pretty fast. These companies need to focus as well on making the newer OS work well with older devices. I mean the HD/HD+ is only 2 years old...
Corkerman said:
the HD/HD+ is only 2 years old...
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Click to collapse
It might be 2 years old but the hardware was never really all that great as it wasn't a top-of-the-line tablet when it came out.
Anyway, that's why I'm hoping 5.0 does something to improve performance, but wouldn't expect miracles from it if anything at all. Android just does better on newer hardware.
_________________________
Looks like cm11 m12 improved responsiveness a noticeable amount and finally too. Still not the same amount newer hardware would cause but a welcome improvement.
Goggles2114 said:
My question is whether or not upgrading to L will be a performance boost or if it'll just be bloat on the hardwwre. Won't know til it gets here though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I upgraded my Nexus 7 2013 to 5.0.0_r2, and it is noticeably faster than 4.4.4_r2. With kitkat, art sped up menus and navigation, but not really much else. Lollipop is all art - no dalvik option - and not only are menus and navigation faster, but it seems to speed up apps as well, mainly the Chrome browser. I've been using Lollipop for a couple of weeks now, compiled 5.0.0_r2 with 4.4.4 blobs, and I've been pretty impressed. I just built 5.0.0_r5 from source yesterday with the new 5.0 blobs they released. I haven't had time to install it, but I would imagine the performance to be the same as 5.0.0_r2.
Unfortunately, the Nook HD depends heavily on CM source, and quite frankly, it's a little above my expertise. So I'll just have to wait for verygreen, bokbokan, and leapinlar to give us a lollipop build for the Nook HD and HD+.
cahrens said:
I upgraded my Nexus 7 2013 to 5.0.0_r2, and it is noticeably faster
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's great to hear it's indeed faster even though it's on a Nexus! Great job and hopefully the three guys can work some magic into the HD's
Corkerman said:
I mean the HD/HD+ is only 2 years old...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In consumer products, that's an eternity.
I've been working with Lollipop builds for a few weeks now, so I have a fairly decent idea of what is involved.
1) sensors.c (touchscreen) requires a minor rewrite.
2) hdmi_audio.c requires a symbol to be dropped (or qcom hardware specified, either/or)
3) selinux rewrites... blehch!
4) hwc, domx ... dunno yet, there's apparently working lollipop compatible source available
5) Changes to build/core/Makefile cause most builds to hang on imgdiff, some reversions are required to get around this.
OK, even with all this, I've only had one build boot enough to get some logs. Ironically it was my very first build.
http://pastebin.com/CNBrENWD
I did end up adding libcorkscrew. Anyway every subsequent build I've done reboots even before being able to get a last_kmsg. I'm at the point now where I believe our kernel will need to be patched to handle gcc 4.8. Changing the build to use gcc 4.7 is doable, but isn't very pretty or nice (too many headers have changed).
Anyone have any other hints or suggestions?
Jon Lee said:
I've been working with Lollipop builds for a few weeks now, so I have a fairly decent idea of what is involved.
1) sensors.c (touchscreen) requires a minor rewrite.
2) hdmi_audio.c requires a symbol to be dropped (or qcom hardware specified, either/or)
3) selinux rewrites... blehch!
4) hwc, domx ... dunno yet, there's apparently working lollipop compatible source available
5) Changes to build/core/Makefile cause most builds to hang on imgdiff, some reversions are required to get around this.
OK, even with all this, I've only had one build boot enough to get some logs. Ironically it was my very first build.
http://pastebin.com/CNBrENWD
I did end up adding libcorkscrew. Anyway every subsequent build I've done reboots even before being able to get a last_kmsg. I'm at the point now where I believe our kernel will need to be patched to handle gcc 4.8. Changing the build to use gcc 4.7 is doable, but isn't very pretty or nice (too many headers have changed).
Anyone have any other hints or suggestions?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If it were me, I'd look here http://forum.xda-developers.com/kindle-fire/development/rom-kernel-unofficial-cm12-0-otterx-t2958155 or here http://forum.xda-developers.com/kindle-fire/development/slimpop-otterx-t2957450 for some guidance.
Hashcode is a legend on XDA and he has almost single-handedly kept the very old, TI OMAP 4430 Kindle Fire alive. As for lovejoy777, currently, he has been the most active, hard working dev for that same KF. Hashcode has CM12 working and lovejoy777 has Slimpop.
Since our device is so similar to the KF and Hashcode has contributed to the Nook in the past, looks to be a good resource??? Then again, verygreen could also pop in sometime down the road.
Mike T
It was because of installing CM on a Kindle Fire 2 for a friend that I decided to purchase a Nook (wanted an OMAP).
I checked both threads over but didn't immediately find any lollipop android_device source available.
I was right about the kernel (arm/lib/memset.S?). Only took me a week to figure it out.
I'm not quite sure yet what to make of the second set of logs, but this is where I'm at now.
http://pastebin.com/EXnJpp3L
Jon Lee said:
It was because of installing CM on a Kindle Fire 2 for a friend that I decided to purchase a Nook (wanted an OMAP).
I checked both threads over but didn't immediately find any lollipop android_device source available.
I was right about the kernel (arm/lib/memset.S?). Only took me a week to figure it out.
I'm not quite sure yet what to make of the second set of logs, but this is where I'm at now.
http://pastebin.com/EXnJpp3L
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
One of my first android devices was the 1st gen KF and Hashcode helped make an inexpensive E-reader a very viable android tablet. I would PM Hashcode and/or lovejoy777. Hashcode is usually very busy but he has always been helpful towards other devs, I know he gave some assistance to lovejoy777 with SlimPop.
As for lovejoy777, he's fairly new at development but seems to be very helpful. I think he also may have gotten some help/guidance from MwisBest who built a LP rom for the OMAP 4460 Galaxy Nexus. I mention this because I believe he knows the importance of cooperation among devs. As an aside, while reading his thread I think I read that he was in the process of "cleaning up" his github. So, he could be a good source.
Maybe also PM killersloth. He built quite a few nice roms for our Nooks last year and just recently expressed some interest in trying to get LP on our device. Maybe if you contact him, you guys can make something happen. I'm an old fashioned XDA'er that believes cooperation amongst devs and end users is essential in the community. Every little bit can help.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=57255968&postcount=14
Anyway, you seem to be a very sharp guy. I wish you luck in getting LP to the Nook. I wish I could contribute more but I'm more of a file swapper and modder of existing work than a dev. :laugh:
Mike T
Moving to Texas in three days, been hectic around here lol.
I had major issues with hwc, selinux, and our old configs. Hashcode must have plowed through it if its running on otter. I'd check his commit history for some tips.
We needed this for prebuilt boot image before
http://review.cyanogenmod.org/#/c/36813/1
I needed it a few weeks back when attempting to build. They might have brought up their own method since then.
I wish they would have called it SlimPop instead of SlimLP ??
A 5.0 build for hummingbird would be nice. Hopefully it won't be hard to modify an ovation build since all the devel appears to be on ovation.
Hey Everyone,
I'm fairly new to the Android community. I got an R1 and have since rooted it and de-bloated it. But I was wondering what the state of Cyanogenmod is. I've heard they've stopped development on it. Is there any chance they (or someone) will add support for the Blu R1 HD?
I'm interested in getting a full AOSP experience without the closed source google services kit software.
-Jeff
Don't hold me to this, but I personally believe CM13 support will not be too difficult. It'll be later versions of Android that will pose a problem.
Also, CM13 for the R1 HD is being worked on. It's just a matter of time.
ss2man44 said:
Don't hold me to this, but I personally believe CM13 support will not be too difficult. It'll be later versions of Android that will pose a problem.
Also, CM13 for the R1 HD is being worked on. It's just a matter of time.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oh, it is? Thats great. I have plenty of patience
I'm in the same exact boat, have rooted/de-bloated and installed trebuchet and other features, but really would like to see CM support.
jeffburg said:
Hey Everyone,
I'm fairly new to the Android community. I got an R1 and have since rooted it and de-bloated it. But I was wondering what the state of Cyanogenmod is. I've heard they've stopped development on it. Is there any chance they (or someone) will add support for the Blu R1 HD?
I'm interested in getting a full AOSP experience without the closed source google services kit software.
-Jeff
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ss2man44 said:
Don't hold me to this, but I personally believe CM13 support will not be too difficult. It'll be later versions of Android that will pose a problem.
Also, CM13 for the R1 HD is being worked on. It's just a matter of time.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't understand too much about android ROM development, but what would prevent CM14 development/future versions from being developed?
contacted Blu and they told me that they are looking forward to working on updating as many devices as they can to the new platform as soon as possible!......righhtttt!!!
Once the dev. on the kernel is in line for a cm13 port , cm14 (which is already being worked on) hopefully might be a possibility.
Fullmetal99012 said:
I don't understand too much about android ROM development, but what would prevent CM14 development/future versions from being developed?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Me either, but I think it would be the drivers. I would suspect with CM13 they can use it's current drivers but with anything Android 7.0 they would need new drivers.
Blu has updated a few devices haven't they? They have to develop the drivers and then run it through the carriers approval I believe? I'm sure they are looking at how much money they expect to make from the R1 HD in 4-6 months. Some of this might depend on their plans of a new phone they plan to release. R1 HD is a big seller.... but what about in 6 months?
A device tree is very likely being compiled for this device now that the kernel source has been released. A CM 13 build I'd imagine is also in the works with other custom roms likely to follow. I would just sit back and keep your eye out. As soon as customs ROMs are released you should easily find them in R1 HD Forums on XDA. I wouldnt hold your breath for anything beyond android 6.0 on this device tho! Marshmallow ROMs will be more then sufficient for these devices and most devs really don't like to hear when this or that will be updated or released.
Jstame said:
I wouldnt hold your breath for anything beyond android 6.0 on this device tho! Marshmallow ROMs will be more then sufficient for these devices and most devs really don't like to hear when this or that will be updated or released.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, I'm pretty sure once devs can build AOSP 6.0 for this device, it'll get 7.0, even if BLU abandons it. I mean, you do realize that you're on a website famous for, among other things, providing unofficial updates to unsupported devices, right?
cmason37 said:
No, I'm pretty sure once devs can build AOSP 6.0 for this device, it'll get 7.0, even if BLU abandons it. I mean, you do realize that you're on a website famous for, among other things, providing unofficial updates to unsupported devices, right?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah I know exactly where I am bro. The fact that its such a low cost device and the unlikely hood of Blu updating the kernel source to 7.0 makes it very very unlikely there will ever be any kind of 7.0 update on these phones. Plenty of unofficial updates of ROMs are released but not many are above the "official" releases like going from 5.0 to 6.0 or 6.0 to 7.0. Were still waiting to see how Devs react to the R1 HD now since its not a big name mainstream device. So like I was saying if we don't see Blu update to 7.0 which is doubtful, we prob won't see any kind of Nuaget. Not saying its impossible without a Blu update just wouldn't hold my breath waiting on a Dev to take on that task on this particular device....
Jstame said:
Yeah I know exactly where I am bro. The fact that its such a low cost device and the unlikely hood of Blu updating the kernel source to 7.0 makes it very very unlikely there will ever be any kind of 7.0 update on these phones. Plenty of unofficial updates of ROMs are released but not many are above the "official" releases like going from 5.0 to 6.0 or 6.0 to 7.0. Were still waiting to see how Devs react to the R1 HD now since its not a big name mainstream device. So like I was saying if we don't see Blu update to 7.0 which is doubtful, we prob won't see any kind of Nuaget. Not saying its impossible without a Blu update just wouldn't hold my breath waiting on a Dev to take on that task on this particular device....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
"Not a big name mainstream device"
Totally man. The number 1 selling phone on Amazon isn't a "big name, mainstream device." If anything this phone is proving how Android development is dwindling.
There was a article that said Blu would release Android 7.0 for the R1 HD. I don't know how reliable or legitimate it is.
dba415 said:
There was a article that said Blu would release Android 7.0 for the R1 HD. I don't know how reliable or legitimate it is.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They probably did say it, BLU has a history of promising upgrades, they rarely deliver. I don't know if the blame is theirs or their Chinese partners, not delivering. But even at that if BLU was smart they would hire a team of developers to actually develop roms instead of just simple branding tweaks on the manufacturer supplied firmware. BLU needs to tweak their sales routine, currently they sell flashy looking phones on the cheap, but if they would change their focus to selling entry to mid level phones with better support, they could really make a name for themselves.