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[Discussion] Improve Camera Quality

Hello. So, there has been a confusion on how to capture better photos and videos on Nexus 5. With the introduction of Android Lollipop we have the option to shoot RAW photos (which is basically the same as before, with the difference being that the image is not compressed or processed), and also we got a great app which is called L Camera..
L Camera was a great alternative for those who wanted to squeeze out as much as Nexus 5's camera has to offer. We even got to shoot at 1080p/60fps(although it was never fixed to work properly) and a resolution very close to 4K.
I hoped that since Google unlocked all this power for us with Lollipop, Marshmallow was going to bring even better stuff on the table. This does not seem to be the case though.
So, right now we are basically stuck in terms of camera options. The L Camera has been outdated, problematic and unsupported for quite some while now and Google's stock camera is still really bad.
How do you feel about all this guys? Have you found any better camera app than L Camera that works on Marshmallow? Are you building something yourselves? (maybe and improved version of L Camera)
Let's discuss this!

There is this "Manual Camera", "Camera FV-5", and "Open Camera"

This may sound strange, but the Marshmallow stock camera app (which has been updated via the play store after M was released) is far better than that of Lollipop. I have found that it is far faster to respond (both focusing and the shutter), and handles low light much better (including with HDR). The auto white balance is much improved, too. The controls are more convenient than they were on Lollipop. This was a big surprise. One day, after routine updates, the camera just became much better!
True, it is no SLR, but whereas the photos I got from the Nexus 5 on Lollipop were mostly unusable except for viewing on another phone, now I get decent shots that I am not embarrassed to post online.

I use Proshot, really great camera app.
Skickat från min Nexus 5 via Tapatalk

jshames said:
This may sound strange, but the Marshmallow stock camera app (which has been updated via the play store after M was released) is far better than that of Lollipop. I have found that it is far faster to respond (both focusing and the shutter), and handles low light much better (including with HDR). The auto white balance is much improved, too. The controls are more convenient than they were on Lollipop. This was a big surprise. One day, after routine updates, the camera just became much better!
True, it is no SLR, but whereas the photos I got from the Nexus 5 on Lollipop were mostly unusable except for viewing on another phone, now I get decent shots that I am not embarrassed to post online.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Got to agree. I notice especially low light performance has improved greatly on the stock camera app on marshmallow. Not sure what Google has done but good job on them for doing it. It still responses like crap and lags some times but if the pictures are better I am all for it.

Stock app is much better its what I call serviceable now. I always knew the Nexus 5s camera was capable but poor software always held it back. Sad to see it took almost 3 years after it launched to become capable.
Open camera is also a great app and 100% free and open source

The best choice is to shoot DNG and then use lightroom for android
I'm a Brazilian without English Course, sorry and be comprehensive

The lens is prone to gather grease from you fingers causing a hazy streaky look. I always bring a microfiber cloth to clean it off before shooting.
There isnt a proper RAW color profile available so it takes work to get images to pop like the JPEGs do. One of these days I'l generate one, it requires shooting a colorchecker chart outside in clear mid-day.

I haven't taken much pictures with it but this one.
I have a 6S and iPhone 5, I had lost my iPhone 5 out of stupidity. I wanted a cheap replacement and heard good things about the nexus, I had already tried the Galaxy s5 and htc one m8 so might as well kill 2 birds with one stone a good cheap phone and a chance to try out the nexus 5. Very impressed so far, very smooth. Runs much smoother then the galaxies I had. Ran me $160 CAD and it's unlocked
I decided to take a picture last night with the nexus. Came out amazing, took some other low lighting shots in my room and compared it to my 6s and it isn't that bad to be completely honest much better then my s5, Note edge and htc in low lighting.

The N5 is terrible for general photography esp low-light. Only my iPhone 5S is worse in low-light situations lol.

RazorMC said:
The N5 is terrible for general photography esp low-light. Only my iPhone 5S is worse in low-light situations lol.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's even worse than a dedicated camera. But you can improve things by processing RAWs:
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---------- Post added at 07:15 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:07 PM ----------
Here's a daylight example of a processed RAW:

RoadToNever said:
It's even worse than a dedicated camera. But you can improve things by processing RAWs:
---------- Post added at 07:15 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:07 PM ----------
Here's a daylight example of a processed RAW:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
RAW and post-editing kind of defeats the entire purpose of point-and-shoot. The first pic is really amazing with the amount of detail and clarity. The second one has too much grain for my liking. Takes me back to those Nokia cameraphones from yesteryears lol
But MM has really improved cam quality if the user knows how to use the manual settings. I've got better results with Camera FV-5 than with any other app.

RazorMC said:
RAW and post-editing kind of defeats the entire purpose of point-and-shoot. The first pic is really amazing with the amount of detail and clarity. The second one has too much grain for my liking. Takes me back to those Nokia cameraphones from yesteryears lol
But MM has really improved cam quality if the user knows how to use the manual settings. I've got better results with Camera FV-5 than with any other app.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, RAW isn't user friendly, but this is thread about camera quality The second pic is really pushing it. It was a very dimly lit venue, a challenge for any camera. But offline processing allows much more sophisticated algorithms. Normally that shot would either be underexposed or at best a smoothed out, waxy-looking mess.

RoadToNever said:
Yes, RAW isn't user friendly, but this is thread about camera quality The second pic is really pushing it. It was a very dimly lit venue, a challenge for any camera. But offline processing allows much more sophisticated algorithms. Normally that shot would either be underexposed or at best a smoothed out, waxy-looking mess.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
True, but that means instant sharing is out of the question. And many people would be uncomfortable processing pics just so some distant grandma "Likes" it on Fb.
Everytime i take low-light shots, I remember my trusty N73 with its huge LED flash and N82 with xenon.
How would you say we can make the best use of HDR on our N5 with 3rd party apps? And does it really work?

RazorMC said:
True, but that means instant sharing is out of the question. And many people would be uncomfortable processing pics just so some distant grandma "Likes" it on Fb.
Everytime i take low-light shots, I remember my trusty N73 with its huge LED flash and N82 with xenon.
How would you say we can make the best use of HDR on our N5 with 3rd party apps? And does it really work?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have a simple checklist I go through when processing raw photos: exposure, white balance and NR if needed. I rarely need anything else so for a single shot I'm normally done in less than a minute. Raw converters offer many options which can seem overwhelming for the novice, but there's nothing to it if you stick to the most important ones. OTOH if you are working on an uncalibrated monitor there's a small chance are you might be making things worse color-wise. I don't do HDR, sorry.

Snap camera? I threw it under system/apps, changed the name to camera2.apk and even the power button hot key works.
Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

"A better camera" super mode do the job very well in any light conditions.
But going manual pays it in certain situations.
https://flic.kr/p/v3nAd3
I'm a Brazilian without English Course, sorry and be comprehensive

prog19 said:
"A better camera" super mode do the job very well in any light conditions.
But going manual pays it in certain situations.
https://flic.kr/p/v3nAd3
I'm a Brazilian without English Course, sorry and be comprehensive
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm enjoying "A Better Camera" too. It's really simple to use and produces nice photos. But I still prefer Camera FV-5 over it when I need manual setings.

prog19 said:
The best choice is to shoot DNG and then use lightroom for android
I'm a Brazilian without English Course, sorry and be comprehensive
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
lightroom can now take raw pictures with our N5

onesolo said:
lightroom can now take raw pictures with our N5
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And output any dng to full resolution.
The sad thing about LR is the import picture method
I'm a Brazilian without English Course, sorry and be comprehensive

About camera?

Hi to all
I have several questions about P20 Pro camera:
1. Did x3 optical zoom and x5 hybrid zoo. Have OIS? (Are they stable like optical zoom on S9+?)
2. Did it recording in 1080p 60fps?
3. Can "light fusion technology " be use for 40mp or just dor 10mp?
4. They didn't tell us so much about video recording. Is video recording better then S9+ or not? (I don't believe to DXO mark, but theysey that P20 Pro have better video recording)
5. Did P20 Pro have better HDR like Pixel Xl 2 and S9?
6. Can I use panorama on RGB sensors (40mp)?
7. I see on Youtube that in Pro mode they have just 3200 ISO, but they show us a 102400 ISO. So the camera is not with last software update?
8. Main camera (40mp) dont have OIS? And is AIS like EIS?

Zoom sensor has OIS. The other two don’t.
Light fusion is 10mp Output.
Dxomark rated the video equal to the Pixel 2 scoring overall. They did say it was one of the best at video.
Yes, hence the 114 dxomark photo score. It doesn’t need the Pixel way of making photos using HDR+.
The ISO might be in Auto Mode at that level, but it can do it.
AIS uses some EIS and then AI to correct photo. Huawei say it’s better than OIS which wouldn’t surprise me if true.

gavinfabl said:
Zoom sensor has OIS. The other two don’t.
Light fusion is 10mp Output.
Dxomark rated the video equal to the Pixel 2 scoring overall. They did say it was one of the best at video.
Yes, hence the 114 dxomark photo score. It doesn’t need the Pixel way of making photos using HDR+.
The ISO might be in Auto Mode at that level, but it can do it.
AIS uses some EIS and then AI to correct photo. Huawei say it’s better than OIS which wouldn’t surprise me if true.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thx a lot for your answer i have two more question:
Can I use camera manual mode with 40mp and diffrent ISO?
And, I never usw Huawei, did it have manual video mod like LG V30?

isko01 said:
Thx a lot for your answer i have two more question:
Can I use camera manual mode with 40mp and diffrent ISO?
And, I never usw Huawei, did it have manual video mod like LG V30?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes and yes.

gavinfabl said:
Yes and yes.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thx and thx thx a lot

Camera samples from the devices at the launch.

All the 10MP samples I've seen look excellent. Certainly better than anything currently on the market.
Even in good light, the 40MP shots appear to be poorly lit and also lacking contrast .. I suspect due to both the huge amount of data being read by the camera software, and the very large resulting image, both metering and post processing are highly suspect. I'm sure it will improve with time, but I suspect that it would benefit from Huawei's next-gen SoC.
Zoom lens / sensor photos are surprisingly decent, as is the hybrid zoom.
What I'm most interested in seeing is image stacking / HDR on the main sensor's 10MP output, if it can do that. Huawei's image stacking / HDR has been a lot weaker than Samsung / Google / Open Camera etc previously.
P.S. For anyone wondering, from what I've been told the main 1/1.7" sensor is a Panasonic one.

I have S8 and S9 os not big difference in camera. SO I would like to buy P20 Pro, BUT it really need to be very good camera much better then S8. But what I see from Forbes I was very sad... The P20 Pro is not big improvement from s8, S9 and Iphon x...
https://www.forbes.com/sites/bensin...tout-huawei-p20-pro-vs-iphone-x/#bfc5e745d33b
And if the 40mp camera dark in good light, and you can use it for good photo, why then buy this phone? Why did they put 40mp if they dont have "Renesansa" pgoro and video?
P.S. lets meka a Group in telegram about P20 Pro...

The 10MP output looks a lot better than anything on the market, including your S8 and S9.
It has 40MP because that's the sensor's native resolution. This sensor is used in cameras usually, not phones ... and they have far more sophisticated metering, lenses and dedicated image processing hardware, and can make some use of the 40MP - albeit even then the images usually look far better at a lower multiple of the native resolution, or downscaled. Dynamic range is far better - also seen on the P20 Pro.
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But we're not going to get anything that compares even vaguely well to a half decent camera until we go to larger sensors still, or multi sensor arrays. As I said elsewhere, at least one major smartphone maker is working on a prototype of a phone with a 1" sensor ... whether it sees the light of day will possibly depend on how many units the P20 Pro sells.

mudnightoil said:
The 10MP output looks a lot better than anything on the market, including your S8 and S9.
It has 40MP because that's the sensor's native resolution. This sensor is used in cameras usually, not phones ... and they have far more sophisticated metering, lenses and dedicated image processing hardware, and can make some use of the 40MP - albeit even then the images usually look far better at a lower multiple of the native resolution, or downscaled. Dynamic range is far better - also seen on the P20 Pro.
But we're not going to get anything that compares even vaguely well to a half decent camera until we go to larger sensors still, or multi sensor arrays. As I said elsewhere, at least one major smartphone maker is working on a prototype of a phone with a 1" sensor ... whether it sees the light of day will possibly depend on how many units the P20 Pro sells.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thx for you a answer
So they are not possibility to make with update 40mp much better, or good like 10 mp?
I think if they put better pixel, better sensors like they put and 40mp camera then we can take big photo with very good details when zoom in photo, and very good quality photo. I aspect to see much much much better photo then S9+, pixel xl 2, iphon x... with so much better shadows, lights, and etc...
So 40mp is jusy marketing trick?

What do you want 40MP output for? It's highly unlikely you need 10MP.
You realise 4K is 8MP? Assuming you don't have an 8K TV or monitor yet (33MP)?
How many people do large, super high DPI prints of mobile phone photos ... not many I'd wager.

40mp images. Shot in raw. Say no more. These are amazing.
https://twitter.com/UmihitoTV/status/978969506679853056
10mp is excellent for nearly everything. When you want more, go raw and you’ve got best of both worlds.
---------- Post added at 07:49 ---------- Previous post was at 07:42 ----------
I currently have a Samsung S9+ and have been taking some amazing shots with it. Epic shots. See this post
https://gavinsgadgets.com/2018/03/26/soussons-forest-dartmoor-national-park-shot-on-the-samsung-s9/
and https://gavinsgadgets.com/2018/03/2...om-the-samsung-galaxy-s9-featuring-snow-dogs/
So as far as I’m concerned, the P20 Pro has to be better than all of these types of shots. I did have the Huawei Mate 10 Pro that took some amazing pics too. So what I have decided to do, is to focus heavily on the Huawei P20 Pro when it arrives and create very specific and detailed posts on it , including the camera with lots of tips too.
I am fairly confident the P20 Pro will be better from the samples already shared that I’m selling my S9+, even though I actually really like it.

gavinfabl said:
40mp images. Shot in raw. Say no more. These are amazing.
https://twitter.com/UmihitoTV/status/978969506679853056
10mp is excellent for nearly everything. When you want more, go raw and you’ve got best of both worlds.
---------- Post added at 07:49 ---------- Previous post was at 07:42 ----------
I currently have a Samsung S9+ and have been taking some amazing shots with it. Epic shots. See this post
https://gavinsgadgets.com/2018/03/26/soussons-forest-dartmoor-national-park-shot-on-the-samsung-s9/
and https://gavinsgadgets.com/2018/03/2...om-the-samsung-galaxy-s9-featuring-snow-dogs/
So as far as I’m concerned, the P20 Pro has to be better than all of these types of shots. I did have the Huawei Mate 10 Pro that took some amazing pics too. So what I have decided to do, is to focus heavily on the Huawei P20 Pro when it arrives and create very specific and detailed posts on it , including the camera with lots of tips too.
I am fairly confident the P20 Pro will be better from the samples already shared that I’m selling my S9+, even though I actually really like it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Waooo you got very good photo. Did you make all in RAW rhen edit or?

The shots shown in the linked posts were shot all in auto.

gavinfabl said:
The shots shown in the linked posts were shot all in auto.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Waooo even with same sensors and all camera hardwer like S8, S9 make much better photos then S8.
P20 Pro have much batter senzor nmand pixel from today competition, did this mean P20Pro will have better photos (take better photos) then S9+, pixel Xl2 and etc? With more light, shadows, details and etc?

isko01 said:
Waooo even with same sensors and all camera hardwer like S8, S9 make much better photos then S8.
P20 Pro have much batter senzor nmand pixel from today competition, did this mean P20Pro will have better photos (take better photos) then S9+, pixel Xl2 and etc? With more light, shadows, details and etc?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I’m expecting the P20 Pro to be a lot better. And the creative options are huge.

does anyone here knows which camera sensor huawei is using for the pro? is it sony imx or a different one?

dyepnoodle said:
does anyone here knows which camera sensor huawei is using for the pro? is it sony imx or a different one?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Someone earlier mentioned it is a Panasonic sensor

isko01 said:
So 40mp is jusy marketing trick?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Think back to the PureView tech. On that I believe the camera produced a 5 or 8MP image. In most cases that's the mode you used, even though you could go for the full-sized image. That often had a lot more noise, as the whole point of the 40MP is to use the data from 4 pixels to produce a cleaner 10MP image.
I took a few 40MP images but Google scales it down to 16MP on high-resolution mode (the mode I've chosen as otherwise I'd quickly use up all my storage) so at some point, I'll take a few more and host them elsewhere to share.
Frankly, we've moved on from playing the numbers game where more pixels is anything people cared about. 40MP here is purely to allow Huawei to do its clever stuff (especially the AI assisted night mode) and not just to sound better than the competition, even though I'm sure that's a rather good side-effect for the marketing department!
There are a lot more photos added to the gallery today, including some more from other people who attended the launch.
I am yet to experiment with RAW and the pro mode, and I do wonder if I'll need to as it is such a good phone for just picking up and shooting, letting the phone do its work. The scene detection works very well, although occasionally it may pick a mode you think isn't what you wanted to capture (e.g. a building where it goes for 'blue sky mode' to boost the colour of the sky) although it doesn't ruin the photo. Plus you can turn it off if you prefer. I don't see any need to yet.

hey @jonmorris,
How's the dynamic range compared with the pixel 2/galaxy s9? Maybe, if you own one of them you could post some comparison pictures .

Continuous message "sharpening your photo please steady the device"

This is really frustrating but most of the time when I'm taking a photo I'm getting this message "sharpening your photo please steady the device". I thought it might be the Master AI so in turned that off... Still happens. Especially with low light shots or zoomed in shots even in bright light.
How the heck do I stop this from happening?? It's so frustrating!

It's when the camera combining the monochrome data to increase detail.
Sent from my CLT-L29 using Tapatalk

Is there no way of stopping this from happening?

quaium said:
Is there no way of stopping this from happening?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Use a different camera app or shoot RAW.
It's a baked in part of Huawei multi sensor processing.
Sent from my CLT-L29 using Tapatalk

Basically you can use another app, lose detail and lose the message.

It seems to be a bug in the camera software. It does not handle the telephoto zoom correctly and applies sharpening algorithms when not necessary.
Have a look at the report from Android Authority https://www.androidauthority.com/huawei-camera-software-867702/

paul678 said:
It seems to be a bug in the camera software. It does not handle the telephoto zoom correctly and applies sharpening algorithms when not necessary.
Have a look at the report from Android Authority https://www.androidauthority.com/huawei-camera-software-867702/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's not a bug, it's a separate process from the unsharp mask algorithm in the jpg processing.
Sent from my CLT-L29 using Tapatalk

orangecroc said:
It's not a bug, it's a separate process from the unsharp mask algorithm in the jpg processing.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm saying it's a bug because it should not run all processes when zooming with the telephoto. In Android Authority's samples you can see that the post processing seems to run like it is in digital zoom mode even if it's optical.

It's a totaly normal process, and you see the messages when the camera apllies HDR color correction to the photo. Other smartphones just say HDR during the photo saving, this one says this message. It's not a bug, and there's no way of disabling it. It's just NORMAL.
Sent from my Huawei P20 PRO

I understand this message to mean "Please wait while I ruin your photo."
I always get it (literally 100% of the time) when I'm using the 3x zoom and the result is always an absolutely hideous photo in which all detail has been completely destroyed. For some reason the resulting image is always 10MP, which makes me think it was taken using the 40MP sensor and binned down, however it's shot at f2.4 and the phone reports an 80mm equivalent focal length, which suggests the 3x zoom lens but that's an 8MP sensor... So just what the hell is going on? Here's an imgur album of a photo supposedly taken using the zoom lens in ideal photography conditions this morning. The light was very good. I used the Photo mode with AI master turned off, resolution set to 10MP in the settings, standard color setting, 4D predictive focus on.
Unfortunately I can't post links but go to imgur.com album /a/JEMOtHG.
It looked fine on the phone's screen but it looks hideous on a larger screen. Just look at the 100% crop - it would make a lovely watercolor painting. The photo has been sharpened to oblivion and completely ruined. The camera has retained highlights in the clouds to create an unrealistic, though beautiful IMO, cloudscape while blowing away highlights on the ships. The shadows on the trees in the foreground are mangled to the point that it looks like a single mass. This photo is unequivocally garbage.
In fact, 70% of the photos this phone takes look like total garbage. They're not just mediocre, they're bad. They look like enlarged and sharpened photos taken with an ancient, low-resolution digital camera. Maybe it's because I have no idea what the phone's actually doing with its hardware when I'm using it because the software is so bad? It just does stuff contrary to what I might expect based on the information provided at the time of the exposure and the result is invariably bad. I've tried every mode and had zero success in any mode.
Even when using the main sensor, if the lighting is slightly dim, out comes the sharpening and noise-reduction algorithm and out go your details. Even in situations where it's not really necessary, like in good indoor light, the phone goes mental with its post-processing. It even does it in broad daylight when there's a big difference in highlights and/or in the scene. If you have harsh, directional sunlight in one part of the scene, expect it to be sharpened to death.
I read all the glowing reviews and they leave me wondering whether everyone's crazy or whether I am. I really want to like this phone but the camera is 3 or 4 out of 10 so far. It makes me wonder whether Huawei's engineers have ever seen a photo before.
I'm inclined to return this phone. The camera is so bad that I'd rather go back to my Nexus 6P, which is 2.5 years old and takes effortlessly, consistently and predictably superior photos.

It keeps the detail when it says it on mine with 3x zoom.
I think maybe your technique is off?
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orangecroc said:
It keeps the detail when it says it on mine with 3x zoom.
I think maybe your technique is off? View attachment 4536191
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Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What technique do you propose? I don't see any options or means to remedy the problem. It seems to me that no matter what mode I shoot or what settings I toggle, I get images that are post-processed to oblivion when using the 3x zoom, and usually when using the main sensor too.
I'd love to hear what you're doing that's giving you results you're happy with. My guess is that you're also on a newer build - I've got the North American variant CLT-L04 8.1.0.109(C792).
Incidentally, your attachment is scaled down to a small fraction of its original size so it doesn't really demonstrate much.

The 109 firmware is pretty old by now, things got better with the camera when you run firmware 128 or the latest 131. Still things could be improved but it is now better than in the early days of firmware releases.
/ Magnus

This is taken with 5x zoom by hand on auto. I see no problem at all. In fact it's outstanding if consider its taken by hand.
Sent from my Huawei P20 PRO

I definitely think it's your firmware. Things have improved pretty dramatically since your version.

Well that sucks, since no newer firmware is available to me yet. I find it hard to believe Huawei would ship a premium photography-centric device with software that's so defective it can hardly take a photo worth keeping, or that it's selling functionally defective devices with this firmware 2 months after launch. Then again, maybe I shouldn't be too surprised.
I guess I'm at the right place if I want to solve this problem myself but I think I might just take it back and not void my warranty or trouble myself any further. This is an excellent phone and I want to keep it but I'm disappointed - photography should have been the first thing they got right and they fumbled.
Too bad because the specs are brilliant and the cameras are awesome in terms of the hardware. In practice, though, it always comes down to software. Thanks for your help, all.

Build 110
Natural colours and AI off to reduce the amount of processing.
When using zoom, make sure you wait for the stabilisation to start and tuck your elbows in. Where possible use the software shutter button over the volume rocker as it causes less movement.
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inepty, I second your remarks. That's what I have experienced, too, so far, and I don't think it got much better on .128 which I am using.
A few things to keep in mind:
- The 3x zoom only kicks in if you do not focus to anything closer to 1-1.5 metres. If you do, it will use the digital zoom which looks crappy.
- If you use Auto, Portrait or HDR mode, the images WILL be heavily processed
- If you use Aperture or Pro mode, they will NOT. I am so far happy with the results of these two modes.
- The monochrome mode seems not to suffer from the watercolor effects and the overprocessed look, even though the sensor is smaller
- Turn off the AI. It's pointless. It's optimized for poppy instagram style pictures. If you want this, go ahead. If you want more natural pictures, turn it off.
- Try different camera apps like Open Camera. You will of course lose fancy stuff like HDR, Zoom etc., but the resulting images are much more natural without any oversharpening or watercolor effects. You will have some grain, tho (because no noise reduction).
- The Zoom is a bit finicky. Sometimes, it gives me really good, clear and beautiful results, sometimes it looks like a crappy digital zoom picture, even though the exifs state that the zoom lens was used. Not sure what's the problem behind this.
- The night mode is a bit of a tech gimmick. Yep, it shoots photos at night but they are really blurry and lack details. If you resize them to 1000px, they will look great, but they are not made for larger resolutions or big screens. I know, a blurry picture is better than no picture at all, but I wouldn't use it the way Huawei seems to advertise it (Hey, take stunning city photos at night!) because the results are messy, unless resized to a stamp.
- And finally: The raw files are quite good most of the time. For pictures that are important (Aka: Photography instead of documentation), it's probably best to use the raw file and develop this.

all the pugs said:
inepty, I second your remarks. That's what I have experienced, too, so far, and I don't think it got much better on .128 which I am using.
A few things to keep in mind:
- The 3x zoom only kicks in if you do not focus to anything closer to 1-1.5 metres. If you do, it will use the digital zoom which looks crappy.
- If you use Auto, Portrait or HDR mode, the images WILL be heavily processed
- If you use Aperture or Pro mode, they will NOT. I am so far happy with the results of these two modes.
- The monochrome mode seems not to suffer from the watercolor effects and the overprocessed look, even though the sensor is smaller
- Turn off the AI. It's pointless. It's optimized for poppy instagram style pictures. If you want this, go ahead. If you want more natural pictures, turn it off.
- Try different camera apps like Open Camera. You will of course lose fancy stuff like HDR, Zoom etc., but the resulting images are much more natural without any oversharpening or watercolor effects. You will have some grain, tho (because no noise reduction).
- The Zoom is a bit finicky. Sometimes, it gives me really good, clear and beautiful results, sometimes it looks like a crappy digital zoom picture, even though the exifs state that the zoom lens was used. Not sure what's the problem behind this.
- The night mode is a bit of a tech gimmick. Yep, it shoots photos at night but they are really blurry and lack details. If you resize them to 1000px, they will look great, but they are not made for larger resolutions or big screens. I know, a blurry picture is better than no picture at all, but I wouldn't use it the way Huawei seems to advertise it (Hey, take stunning city photos at night!) because the results are messy, unless resized to a stamp.
- And finally: The raw files are quite good most of the time. For pictures that are important (Aka: Photography instead of documentation), it's probably best to use the raw file and develop this.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you select 3x zoom it uses that lens.
It doesn't use digital zoom just because you're close to the subject.
The stabilisation struggles to engage on close subject, so this may be the issue you're encountering.
These are 1x then 3x then 5x then 10x
Even the 10x digital zoom doesn't look as bad as people seem to be making out.
All are auto, standard colour, no AI in poor light.
Build 110
Sent from my CLT-L29 using Tapatalk

orangecroc said:
If you select 3x zoom it uses that lens.
It doesn't use digital zoom just because you're close to the subject.
The stabilisation struggles to engage on close subject, so this may be the issue you're encountering.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nope, it doesn't work that easily, at least on my device. You can select 3x zoom and still get a digital zoom image not shot with the tele lens. Try it! Try close distance and fast burts, you will see it yourself.
And please do post full resolutions of your images. Anything moderately sharp can look good at this small size.

Photo quality

Say "cheese", then rate this thread to express how photos taken with the Razer Phone 2 come out. A higher rating indicates that photos offer rich color (without over-saturating), sharp detail (with all subjects in-focus), and appropriate exposure (with even lighting).
Then, drop a comment if you have anything to add!

i found the stock camera app to be pretty poor coming from a pixel 2 like it was almost dealbreaking. I also have an essential phone that needed a google cam port to be usable. So i went to the gcam repo and spent a good hour trying all the versions from arnova, cstark etc. and i found that the only one that actually works is from BSG for the Mi 8 and the quality is night and day. i posted on reddit about it. https://www.reddit.com/r/razerphone/comments/9rv2ed/google_cam_port_quality_vs_stock_app_vs_pixel_2/

meh
There is no 60 frames-per-second 1080p video nor is there 16 by 9 aspect ratio for photos they are also blurry, the zoom is okay though I guess.

https://imgur.com/gallery/5tkoGjG
Picture taken with it, does an amazing job at medium-low lighting

Razer's photo app does pretty good, minus not having slow motion, beating all my previous phones in clarity, quality and ability to take photos of an always moving 2 year old with very minimal, if any, motion blur, and in low light without flash and no visible grainyness. But to boost your cameras performance, Gcam works wonders (slow motion still does not work) Beware of file sizes of videos, though... An 8 minute 4k video of my daughter was a whopping 2.5gb... and when you take photos at the same time you're recording, they come out much darker than just taking a photo by itself. Photo quality is outstanding, taking bright, clear photos in low light with no motion blur what so ever, and with no visible grainyness or loss of color accuracy. People with high end iPhones and Samsung devices were amazed at the photo quality of the Razer 2 compared to their phones...so a big plus for this phone. I have NO idea what people we're talking about when they said the camera was crap... As far as the photo album app, I think the one that comes with the phone totally sucks, it's the Google albums app, which for me is over complicated, I have no idea how to browse it, or organize it, or create folders, or move them to folders...so, I downloaded a very simple, easy to use gallery app that fits all my needs. VERY simple to understand, I can move things around, create new folders, etc. If you're interested in it, here's the link.
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.simplemobiletools.gallery.pro
It reminds me of the simpler album apps that came with earlier versions of Android Galaxy phones, which is what I'm used to.
EDIT- 10/16/19
Finally found a camera app that makes full use of the camera. Gcam
Version 6.2.030. greatly increased clarity, amazing low light performance, night mode, multiple resolutions to choose from, hdr, hdr+, 4k video, bokke effect in portrait mode, which makes a HUGE improvement in photo dramatic effect when taking pictures of people, and most importantly, to me at least, VERIFIED WORKING SLOW MOTION AND TIME LAPSE... Which for some STUPID REASON Razer has OMITTED from even their latest software update, posted only a couple days ago. Link below for the gcam mod.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1rAgBKJ9ZixrsfP2_29HHJabm-2g9etLY/view?usp=drivesdk
I cannot recommend you use this gcam mod enough! It's EXACTLY what this phone was missing all along
Not my work, BTW. Simply pointing a link at someone else's work.

mmfnsmith said:
Razer's photo app does pretty good, minus not having slow motion, beating all my previous phones in clarity, quality and ability to take photos of an always moving 2 year old with very minimal, if any, motion blur, and in low light without flash and no visible grainyness. But to boost your cameras performance, Gcam works wonders (slow motion still does not work) Beware of file sizes of videos, though... An 8 minute 4k video of my daughter was a whopping 2.5gb... and when you take photos at the same time you're recording, they come out much darker than just taking a photo by itself. Photo quality is outstanding, taking bright, clear photos in low light with no motion blur what so ever, and with no visible grainyness or loss of color accuracy. People with high end iPhones and Samsung devices were amazed at the photo quality of the Razer 2 compared to their phones...so a big plus for this phone. I have NO idea what people we're talking about when they said the camera was crap... The only problem I have is audio quality issues. Sounds like they have a background noise suppression setting turned on by default.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Try this. https://drive.google.com/file/d/1p9wTQKDUWFDrOMX2zAofWl7G2ULpTdRn/view?usp=drivesdk

I'm pretty blown away with this camera, especially in very low light. I downloaded the gcam app. And just wow!
This is a picture in my hobby room with just the light from my computer monitor no other lights or flash
{
"lightbox_close": "Close",
"lightbox_next": "Next",
"lightbox_previous": "Previous",
"lightbox_error": "The requested content cannot be loaded. Please try again later.",
"lightbox_start_slideshow": "Start slideshow",
"lightbox_stop_slideshow": "Stop slideshow",
"lightbox_full_screen": "Full screen",
"lightbox_thumbnails": "Thumbnails",
"lightbox_download": "Download",
"lightbox_share": "Share",
"lightbox_zoom": "Zoom",
"lightbox_new_window": "New window",
"lightbox_toggle_sidebar": "Toggle sidebar"
}
Sent from my Phone 2 using Tapatalk

Warrior1988 said:
Try this. https://drive.google.com/file/d/1p9wTQKDUWFDrOMX2zAofWl7G2ULpTdRn/view?usp=drivesdk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hey man, I tried this app you linked to and here are some comparison shots.
In our play room with low light currently.
Stock camera app
You linked camera app
Sent from my Phone 2 using Tapatalk

Hey, a Razer Phone 2-specific version of GCam was uploaded to https://www.celsoazevedo.com/files/android/google-camera/ the other day. I downloaded it, and it's so much faster than the MI8 version. It's bloody quick. No more loading ring when I'm taking a picture. Just a flash as the picture is taken.

The quality is "okay" but not that good
I hope they'll do better in the future .
Mini Militia App Lock

cs88 said:
i found the stock camera app to be pretty poor coming from a pixel 2 like it was almost dealbreaking. I also have an essential phone that needed a google cam port to be usable. So i went to the gcam repo and spent a good hour trying all the versions from arnova, cstark etc. and i found that the only one that actually works is from BSG for the Mi 8 and the quality is night and day. i posted on reddit about it. https://www.reddit.com/r/razerphone/comments/9rv2ed/google_cam_port_quality_vs_stock_app_vs_pixel_2/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How do you like the Razer 2 w/gcam compared to the Pixel 2?

I just installed the RP 2 gcam from the link and only saw a lowlight/indoors performance difference while indoors. Once I went outside there was a bit of a split decision. On one hand the dynamic range of gcam was a lot better and maintained clear details in the image. There were a couple of occassions where the stock camera app took a more appealing picture. Most of the pics while outside in good natural light were almost identical; only zooming in all the way and searching would you see the difference. Again, that goes back to the dynamic range and how the apps process the images once you take the picture. At some point we need to stop splitting hairs on the most minor detail that really isn't discernable unless you zoom in 300% an search vice when you look at the normal zoom image. I have noticed however, the RP2 does over process more often than not, leading to it softening the image way too much causing a slight blur in the details. But other times it takes really good pictures.

I just uninstalled the gcam app now. I don't know what happened but was using the camera a few hours after installing and testing it out and I noticed major artifacts, color distortion and image distortion when I am looking at the screen and moving the phone around to different subjects. I also notice it having a real hard time adjusting the exposure and balance. The removal of the gcam app hasn't seemed to fix anything. I may have to reset the phone to get it functioning again.

lamamafia said:
There is no 60 frames-per-second 1080p video nor is there 16 by 9 aspect ratio for photos they are also blurry, the zoom is okay though I guess.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not bad...

I just got the phone, and knew going into it the camera was going to be bad (doubly bad considering I was coming from an LG V20!). What I didn't expect was just how bad HDR is on the stock app. It's rather laughable. The first image is a normal photo on the telephoto lens. The second photo is an HDR shot on the same lens. I plan to play around with Gcam, but HDR will never see the light of day on my stock app. Lol

Not as good as my motorola z2 force. Really, very bad! I can only play games now. . . . Maybe gaming phones can only play games.

Can the Sony IMX586 produce true 48MP Images?

Hi All
I've been reading around this for a while and can't quite decide what this sensor can do. I appreciate it's a Quad Bayer arrangement which is very effective for grouping pixels together which allows for good performance in low light and produces 12MP images.
I notice the spec sheet says "48 effective pixels" but I understand this means there are a few extra pixels round the edge used to discover brightness etc, or does effective mean not really?
This could be a dense question, but can this sensor produce true 48MP images? I notice the RAW output on the Mi9 is only 12MP so is probably 48MP pixel binned.
What I'm really looking for 48MP RAW. I'm guessing the output would be very soft and unsharp, but then I can do my own post processing to suit my taste.
Edit: The issues seems to be an incorrect implementation of Camera2 Api which reports max resolution of 3000x4000 for the 48MP camera. It's been reported below so if you'd like to see 48MP jpegs and RAW for 3rd party apps, please visit the link and confirm the issue in a post below.
http://en.miui.com/thread-6249265-1-1.html
Thanks for reading.....
Steve

picitup said:
Hi All
I've been reading around this for a while and can't quite decide what this sensor can do. I appreciate it's a Quad Bayer arrangement which is very effective for grouping pixels together which allows for good performance in low light and produces 12MP images.
I notice the spec sheet says "48 effective pixels" but I understand this means there are a few extra pixels round the edge used to discover brightness etc, or does effective mean not really?
This could be a dense question, but can this sensor produce true 48MP images? I notice the RAW output on the Mi9 is only 12MP so is probably 48MP pixel binned.
What I'm really looking for 48MP RAW. I'm guessing the output would be very soft and unsharp, but then I can do my own post processing to suit my taste.
Thanks for reading.....
Steve
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
my mi9 hasnt arrived yet, but from what I read, it CAN output 48mp in an manual mode (not auto). Regarding RAW instead of Jpeg: i don't know if stock app can do it at 48mp, but gcam most probably will (at least when the port is finalized). But using 48mp will disable HDR because its somehow Chipset limited.

Hi Mine has arrived and can confirm the stock camera will take 48MP jpegs. Th RAW output is only 12MP.
But I wonder is it really 48MP? If the sensor is quad bayer, meaning that 4 green pixels are grouped together, then 4 red etc. how can you possibly get full res out of that arrangement?
It looks like this:
{
"lightbox_close": "Close",
"lightbox_next": "Next",
"lightbox_previous": "Previous",
"lightbox_error": "The requested content cannot be loaded. Please try again later.",
"lightbox_start_slideshow": "Start slideshow",
"lightbox_stop_slideshow": "Stop slideshow",
"lightbox_full_screen": "Full screen",
"lightbox_thumbnails": "Thumbnails",
"lightbox_download": "Download",
"lightbox_share": "Share",
"lightbox_zoom": "Zoom",
"lightbox_new_window": "New window",
"lightbox_toggle_sidebar": "Toggle sidebar"
}
Cheers
Steve

Well I think I've answered my own question and it seems to be yes; it can output true 48MP images;
If you slip one pixel right and down, you can group pixels into a traditional RGGB Bayer arrangement. Now that's clever!
If you look at the attached image, I've drawn white boxes around each group of 4 pixels, ignoring the 1st row and column. You can see in each box, there is an RGGB combination, so it's job done!
My brain hurts.....
Steve

picitup said:
Well I think I've answered my own question and it seems to be yes; it can output true 48MP images;
If you slip one pixel right and down, you can group pixels into a traditional RGGB Bayer arrangement. Now that's clever!
If you look at the attached image, I've drawn white boxes around each group of 4 pixels, ignoring the 1st row and column. You can see in each box, there is an RGGB combination, so it's job done!
My brain hurts.....
Steve
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's like a Pentile Amoled so? It's not a real 48mp like a RGB Amoled would be.

Well I think it's similar as there are twice as many green pixels as red or blue (the same as all Bayer sensors), but I think you can get real 48MP out of it by slipping the matrix by 1 pixel as shown above.
Is that that what you were asking?
Cheers
Steve

Just a quick update on this.
The Camera2 API is Level 3, but the max photo resolutions of the front and rear cameras are misreported for 3rd party apps. Using Camera2 API Probe from here:
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.airbeat.device.inspector
Shows that the rear camera is 4000x3000 (12MP) and should be 8000x6000 (48MP). The front camera is reported as 2592x1940 (5MP) and should be 5184x3880 (20MP).
The upshot of this is that 3rd party apps produce 12MP images from the rear camera and 5MP images from the front camera.
I've just unlocked my phone and installed xiaomi.eu rom 9.3.28 from here:
https://sourceforge.net/projects/xi.../files/xiaomi.eu/MIUI-WEEKLY-RELEASES/9.3.28/
But no improvement, it's just the same.
I'll report this as a bug and report back. What I'm really looking for is 48MP RAW for 3rd parties.
Wish me luck....
Steve

picitup said:
Just a quick update on this.
The Camera2 API is Level 3, but the max photo resolutions of the front and rear cameras are misreported for 3rd party apps. Using Camera2 API Probe from here:
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.airbeat.device.inspector
Shows that the rear camera is 4000x3000 (12MP) and should be 8000x6000 (48MP). The front camera is reported as 2592x1940 (5MP) and should be 5184x3880 (20MP).
The upshot of this is that 3rd party apps produce 12MP images from the rear camera and 5MP images from the front camera.
I've just unlocked my phone and installed xiaomi.eu rom 9.3.28 from here:
https://sourceforge.net/projects/xi.../files/xiaomi.eu/MIUI-WEEKLY-RELEASES/9.3.28/
But no improvement, it's just the same.
I'll report this as a bug and report back. What I'm really looking for is 48MP RAW for 3rd parties.
Wish me luck....
Steve
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The Sony sensor is not a real 48mp sensor. That's only marketing.
It's a 12mp sensor with real-time HDR
Gesendet von meinem MI 9 mit Tapatalk

Hi thanks for your reply. Do you have the data sheet for the sensor? I've scoured the Internet but only found a news release.
I'd really like to understand this if I can. So the 48MP photos in the stock cam are just upscaled 12MP?
Cheers
Steve

I've reported this as a bug to Xiaomi here:
http://en.miui.com/thread-6249265-1-1.html
So if you want 48MP for 3rd party apps, please verify it on the link above and maybe we can get it!
Cheers
Steve

Check datasheet, it's 48Mpix sensor, but won't produce 48Mpix images without array conversion.
Pretty nice article about it:
https://www.androidpit.com/48-mp-or-not-look-at-sony-new-camera-sensor

Hi
Thanks yes I did read that article, but think in my 4th post I explained how to get true 48MP from it. I'm at the limits of my knowledge here, so could be very wrong
The Sony news release says:
When shooting bright scenes such as daytime outdoors, the built-in, original signal processing function performs array conversion, making it possible to obtain high-definition 48 effective megapixel images in real time
https://www.sony.net/SonyInfo/News/Press/201807/18-060E/index.html
what do you think?

This article:
https://www.quora.com/Why-aren-t-all-48MP-sensors-born-equal
Compares the IMX586 and the Samsung GM1, both 48MP sensors. It says the difference is that the IMX586 has integrated array conversion and can produce true 48MP images, whereas the GM1 does not and can offer only 12MP pixel binned images.
When shooting bright scenes, such as an outdoor environment during daytime, the built-in, original signal processing function performs array conversion (see diagram below), making it possible to obtain high-definition 48 effective megapixel images in real time. Thus, the Sony IMX586 can produce true 48MP photos.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sounds promising....

I can only imagine how amazing photos it will be possible to output with Lightroom using 48mpx raws. From what I can read here, it really sounds it will be possible to achieve as hardware-wise everything on paper says it is producing real 48mpx. I just wonder if it's possible to "unlock" this with gcam. Probably I can feel that root will be needed ...

brainscollector said:
I can only imagine how amazing photos it will be possible to output with Lightroom using 48mpx raws. From what I can read here, it really sounds it will be possible to achieve as hardware-wise everything on paper says it is producing real 48mpx. I just wonder if it's possible to "unlock" this with gcam. Probably I can feel that root will be needed ...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes I think the potential is there. I've reported it as a bug to Xiaomi higher up, so please click the link and comment and maybe Xiaomi will fix it!

picitup said:
Yes I think the potential is there. I've reported it as a bug to Xiaomi higher up, so please click the link and comment and maybe Xiaomi will fix it!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What we need from xiaomi is RAW 48 mp, higher bitrate of the mic, maybe a few other little things and we have the perfect phone. How can we SPAM xioami to do that ?!!

Well 48MP RAW is reported, if you follow the link I reported above, you enter your own bug and hopefully they will fix it. I'm new to Xiaomi so I don't know how much notice they take of bug reports, but they say the more users that confirm the bug, the more likely they will fix it.

Just a quick bump.
If you want to see 48MP RAW on the Mi9, please follow the link on the first post and confirm the issue then hopefully Xiaomi will take note.
Cheers

Please ignore the link on the first post as it keeps getting changed. Here's the link:
http://en.miui.com/thread-6249265-1-1.html
Cheers

picitup said:
Please ignore the link on the first post as it keeps getting changed. Here's the link:
http://en.miui.com/thread-6249265-1-1.html
Cheers
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Your screenshoot shows 8000*6000 on the last row for photo size, so not a good proof.