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I read some article about Vista that delaying me to bought it:
http://www.cs.auckland.ac.nz/~pgut001/pubs/vista_cost.html#functionality
What do you thing?
cornelius said:
I read some article about Vista that delaying me to bought it:
http://www.cs.auckland.ac.nz/~pgut001/pubs/vista_cost.html#functionality
What do you thing?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think just 1 thing:
DON'T BUY VISTA.....and if anyone give you Vista as a gift then throw them back or sell them away
if u like Windows, then Windows XP is the only way to stay in peace...
but i advise that Vista is only a hole...a hole in performances, a hole in our wallett (if u buy vista premium, a big hole for nothing) and a big hole in personal security...i think this is not a OS but a rootkit....
Have you seen this thread?
There is a link there to a podcast about vista. What all the security will do to speed and stability of your system.
My conclusion:
If the consumers are smart enough Vista will die.
Also:
XP and other windows versions owe their popularity in large part to the fact that there are plenty of cracked versions.
If vista doesn't get cracked (mainly cause no one bothers to put in the effort) it won't gain popularity.
lol... Vista was cracked before it was released! I agree though, I've got it installed and it's just not worth it at all... I use pc mainly for creating audio and Vista's put a huge dent in audio processing. My very expensive professional soundcard is pretty much useless as M$ now say that they've decided the way everyone's been routing sound to cards is now not in their plans and they'd like Vista to take on the responsibility - yeah, well, it's pretty poor Bill... maybe you should leave this kinda stuff up to the professionals???!!!
It's all down to Vista's supposed "Security Features", but I've read a lot of reports outlining the hole's in it, basically saying it's completely meaningless. It causes problems with Networking, Audio, and performance that just can't be justified. He's gone and released it WAY before it's ready, same as always. Users will be inundated with updates until finally it starts working like XP now does, by which time he'll have another official part-release ready on the market.
Stay clear of Vista for now if you use your PC for anything more than word processing
Anything M$ related check out http://www.mydigitallife.info/ Excellent site!
P.S.... a guy on this forum has as his signature ""Microsoft". Nice of Bill to name the company after his manhood". Thought that was quite apt
Buy a Mac and all of your security issues are solved.
Windowsrookie said:
Buy a Mac and all of your security issues are solved.
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Click to collapse
A Mac couldn't support my needs even if it wanted to
hmmmmmm
Windowsrookie said:
Buy a Mac and all of your security issues are solved.
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Click to collapse
Why is it that one of the first things that happens when someone warns about a bug in an update to something pc related, someone says get a Mac.. or Stick to Linux??
no to kick off a huge flamer between PC's, Macs & Linux freaks.. however..
Its getting old...
Juggles said:
Why is it that one of the first things that happens when someone warns about a bug in an update to something pc related, someone says get a Mac.. or Stick to Linux??
no to kick off a huge flamer between PC's, Macs & Linux freaks.. however..
Its getting old...
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I love these arguments as I use and like all three
Midget_1990 said:
I love these arguments as I use and like all three
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Click to collapse
ROFL That's just greedy...
Macs are just as misleading!
Windowsrookie said:
Buy a Mac and all of your security issues are solved.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The ad on tv with the mac and pc is misleading and I'm ticked. I tried to replace a HD on an iBook... wow! Good thing I have a COMPUTER SCIENCE degree. 2.5 hours just to get to the hard drive. Why? because they want more money from you.
Anyway, I am actually pretty excited about getting vista for one of my computers.
texasaggie1 said:
The ad on tv with the mac and pc is misleading and I'm ticked. I tried to replace a HD on an iBook... wow! Good thing I have a COMPUTER SCIENCE degree. 2.5 hours just to get to the hard drive. Why? because they want more money from you.
Anyway, I am actually pretty excited about getting vista for one of my computers.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am not sure what ad it is you are referring to, and I don't mean to sound rood but is the time it takes to replace a part relay the driving consideration in what type of computer to get?
And even if so what does that have to do with the OS?
I may not have a degree but I open my PC every 6 month or so, if not to add / change component then just to dust it out and given the amount of peripherals connected to it, it can take 10 minutes just to unplug and then plug back all the cables (two of the big non USB annoyances are UPS status and capture card IR that use serial connectors).
At any rate, I understand the whole "I am switching to Mac / Linux etc." rants. And sorry I don't want to insult anybody but lets face it: in most cases you're just gonna stick with your XP box because getting used to a new OS is not a simple matter. (We have a MAC, don't remember specific model, at work and I got to play with it a couple of times - shortage of mouse buttons drove me crazy How can you live without 'right click'???)
But seriously you may not be switching right now but the point of it all is that there are viable (if not as popular) alternatives to M$ crap regardless of hardware architecture and that is a very comforting thought.
P.S. Here is what I can tell you about my experience with Vista:
We put a Beta on one of the stations at work (it came with our MSDN subscription). The Pentium 4 2.4GHz 258 MB machine ran at a tolerable speed (though I now know it wasn't quite up to specs for this OS), but after a week we needed it for doing real work so it was formatted back to XP.
I have tested on AthlonXP 2500+, 1 Gb ram DDR 400 MHz, Geforce FX5600 Ultra, and after a week of testing I've determined that it works 2-3 times slower than XP, i will not sacrifice performance over crappy security, silly GUI effects and poor compatiblity
My mother in law (a non technical person) just bought a new laptop pre loaded with vista. She complained that it works much worse than her old xp laptop and decided to just take it back for a refund.
I hope the same thing happens a million times and all those refunds will out weight the gains they are hoping for in cornering the drm video market.
The evil in vista is just a sign of the wider decay in American civil liberties. I normally would not care but now thanks to America pushing wipo onto Australia in order to get a trade deal, all that American evil is heading my way.
I do not think copyright crimes should be criminal offenses. Vista, DRM, DMCA, RIAA and so call anti terror laws are crushing ordinary people. They use copyright as a door into peoples lives to persecute them for any other thing they can find along the way.
I would like to see an open source p2p searchable anonymous adhoc wireless network program. That way free people around the world could create and grow an alternate network to rival the internet that no one could use to slam someone in jail. Each users copy of the program could be compiled with a unique identifier that lets it be addressed over the network but in no way ties in to their real identity. If enough people used it it could work, some with enough protection could set up gateways into the real internet to join the two networks.
This may sound stupid now but IMO lack of anonymity in ip based networks will eventually spell the end of them.
what kind of world do we live in where a person needs to run oftware from an encrypted volume within a virtual pc on a pc with ip blocking software and software and hardware firewalls just to feel that big brother won't be able to get at your stuff when they secretly break into your house and ransack it while your at work (as they are allowed to do in Aus under anti terror laws). Seriously!
xplode said:
I have tested on AthlonXP 2500+, 1 Gb ram DDR 400 MHz, Geforce FX5600 Ultra, and after a week of testing I've determined that it works 2-3 times slower than XP, i will not sacrifice performance over crappy security, silly GUI effects and poor compatiblity
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
lol... freaky! I've got the same specs just another .5 Gb of RAM. I've actually gone back to XP too.
I think Vista has great potential overall, but it's just not ready... give it a year and people will be raving about it (by then it should have two or three service packs )
full of crap
Windowsrookie said:
Buy a Mac and all of your security issues are solved.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How about os2
and now...
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vista on my old C64
to break his rock-solid security
May be it's not time for go to VISTA, wait for SP maybe 6th will fix this, and I tested it with Vista on PC, core 2 duo (errr forgot the speed coz it's office PC), than other PC with same spec run on XP, who the XP performance far better...
Weird, I have 3 machines running Windows Vista Ultimate and are working great, 1 Dell Inspiron(Intel Centrino, 1GB ram), 1 Sony VAIO(Pentium 4 512Mb ram) and 1 PC (AMD, 1Gb ram), all of you, did you change the performance in control panel? Maybe that is your slow Vista....All my drivers are OK...
And all are Vista Cra**ed.....
Speaking of drivers... Microsoft have recommended to device manufacturers/driver writers to avoid creating unified device drivers while at the same time shipping vista with unified drivers. What hypocrisy. They reserve the right to automatically revoke your drivers at any time, with the potential of bricking your machine but don't even follow their own guidelines set out to avoid large scale simultaneous revocations.
One reason it runs slow is that once every millisecond (1000th of a second) vista checks every component to see if it is secure (for drm). This is a lot to be doing on a permanent basis. Its not the only reason it runs slow, because vista is over time learning the patterns of usage for an individual it starts to try and keep a lot of stuff loaded in memory. This is not a bad thing but unless you have 3-4 gig it dose not function as well leading to a slow down.
I just don't like the direction all this drm is going. For me it has little to do with piracy and more to do with freedom. I do not want to be living in a time where a book can be revoked so that it can no longer be read because a government or dictator has decided to use drm to control public opinion. I want to live in a time where competition decides what survives in the market place and not drm/dmca monopolies.
XP works very well there is no reason to change (to vista).
Be Free
OdeeanRDeathshead said:
Speaking of drivers... Microsoft have recommended to device manufacturers/driver writers to avoid creating unified device drivers while at the same time shipping vista with unified drivers. What hypocrisy. They reserve the right to automatically revoke your drivers at any time, with the potential of bricking your machine but don't even follow their own guidelines set out to avoid large scale simultaneous revocations.
One reason it runs slow is that once every millisecond (1000th of a second) vista checks every component to see if it is secure (for drm). This is a lot to be doing on a permanent basis. Its not the only reason it runs slow, because vista is over time learning the patterns of usage for an individual it starts to try and keep a lot of stuff loaded in memory. This is not a bad thing but unless you have 3-4 gig it dose not function as well leading to a slow down.
I just don't like the direction all this drm is going. For me it has little to do with piracy and more to do with freedom. I do not want to be living in a time where a book can be revoked so that it can no longer be read because a government or dictator has decided to use drm to control public opinion. I want to live in a time where competition decides what survives in the market place and not drm/dmca monopolies.
XP works very well there is no reason to change (to vista).
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Click to collapse
DRM important but it doesn't mean lock our freedom to get info etc, and ofcource they souldn't control costumer!!!!
I have seen a similar question posted elsewhere but there was only one reply, I thought I would pose the same here instead. Since the Zune runs on Win CE, I was wondering if anyone has given any serious consideration into extracting and modifying the firmware. It would be great if xda-developers could branch out to this side as well.
The Zune def. needs some help, I have one now with about a half inch of dust on it. I would rather use my phone then the Zune haha
Officially we try to keep this forum on HTC produced devices only (with occasional exception due to XDA brand use).
So no special sub forum for Zune.
But since we don't beat with a stick people who come here looking for help with other devices (just look at all the threads about WM 6 on Dell) it is possible someone here will do some work on it and publish the results a some point.
It mainly depends on the popularity and availability of the device.
g35driver said:
The Zune def. needs some help, I have one now with about a half inch of dust on it. I would rather use my phone then the Zune haha
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Click to collapse
I fancy owning a Zune myself. I'm not really an apple fanboy, but my iPod does everything I want it to. How is it usability wise? When I got my iPod I never needed to read the manual because the interface is so intuitive. I've got the 30GB model, bought it for slimness
pasan said:
I fancy owning a Zune myself. I'm not really an apple fanboy, but my iPod does everything I want it to. How is it usability wise? When I got my iPod I never needed to read the manual because the interface is so intuitive. I've got the 30GB model, bought it for slimness
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Click to collapse
It works fine except the software is a joke. Its worse then iTunes.
What ever happened to simply dragging and dropping what ever songs you want into the device and be done with it. Now it has all this sync sh!t
Microsoft just opened up Windows 7.... Just when Vista is even more screwed up. Either way it looks cool.
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windows-7/beta-videos.aspx
Check it out.
What about compatibility with programs and games? Did u try it?
I never really had any issues with Vista but from what i've played with in Windows 7 it's fantastic.
Hyden121 said:
Microsoft just opened up Windows Mbile 7.... Just when Vista is even more screwed up. Either way it looks cool.
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windows-7/beta-videos.aspx
Check it out.
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Click to collapse
i take you really mean just windows 7....as your links states and not mobile
i have windows 7 x64 and i must say its really impressed me
7 is so cool
Im on Windows 7 x64 too and its the dogs, really loving it.
All those still on Vista, I suggest you burn your hard drive and get Windows 7, its everything Vista should of been
On a side note - anyone know when HTC devices are going to be supported on Device Stage???
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windows-7/devices.aspx
duncstar said:
Im on Windows 7 x64 too and its the dogs, really loving it.
All those still on Vista, I suggest you burn your hard drive and get Windows 7, its everything Vista should of been
On a side note - anyone know when HTC devices are going to be supported on Device Stage???
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windows-7/devices.aspx
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I suspect we'll at the very least see the Diamond, Touch Pro and maybe the Blackstone (depending if the guys at MS have one I guess), I'm also not seeing any PPC powered devices on this list so they could still be seperate?
Do you know if this includes devices connected via a network share? On one of my networks I have a brother MFC that's connected to one of my switches and it's a bit of a PITA to manage.
windows 7 x64 rocks
i really like the new interface of windows 7 especially the new task bar....and its works like a charm....
hidden_hunter said:
I suspect we'll at the very least see the Diamond, Touch Pro and maybe the Blackstone (depending if the guys at MS have one I guess), I'm also not seeing any PPC powered devices on this list so they could still be seperate?
Do you know if this includes devices connected via a network share? On one of my networks I have a brother MFC that's connected to one of my switches and it's a bit of a PITA to manage.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I dont mate sorry
I just downloaded it finally but will try it when I get home close to my restoral CD's. I am interesting in the newer device center. Other than that my major questions were pertaining to games and graphics. We all know how the majority of us got jacked over with Vista when it was released with KNOWN graphics problems. If Microsoft ignores the gaming community they will find that many loyal fans who have not left yet will go towards Linux or Apple. I have always loved Linux over MS anyway but have gained a newer resect for apple.... Well kind of.
Bogus
Original post indicates it is win mob 7. WRONG!!!
It is actually Windows 7 OS beta release which is probably what Vista should have been.
4 days of 7 x64...it's amazing. About Device Stage, I think there was something on MSDN about that. I'll go dig it up, I guess. In the end, it's all XML and *should* be pretty easy to do.
I've been running Win7 x64 since Sunday with no issues whatsoever. So far, I love it. It's great. The redesigned taskbar is very intuitive and easy to use. I love the new network manager applet; it behaves like network-manager in Linux. That is, a single click shows a menu-style list of available networks, and another click will get you connected. Win7 also (finally) includes native support for burning ISO images, which makes me thrilled.
I'm not so thrilled that it inherited UAC (running UAC is like always wearing a condom in case you trip, slip, and fall on a prostitute in the shady back room of a hotel in a bad neighborhood), but it's at least got better controls for it via msconfig. Still, I straight-up disable that crap.
Also, the Action Center does a great job alerting the user about potential hardware issues, and it gave me direct download links for getting the proper drivers for my HP dv6700 notebook's card and fingerprint readers.
Additionally, it seems much snappier than Vista. I'm sure that will change in the final release, especially once OEMs get to bog it down with their bloatware, but it's nice for now.
Only complaint is that Chrome won't run on Win7
Other than that, way to go MS!
I've had Win 7 of my laptop for a few months, the only issue I have is it doesn't really work when browsing my network.
I installed the leaked build 6801 back then, since the public release I ran windows update and nothing happened. Does that mean I need to clean install the new release?
I´ll wait for a stable version, just geting used to vista and I´m not an expert so I prefer to wait a few months
What do you mean? This version is stable?
Many people are saying they think really it's past beta and about ready to be launched...
orb3000 said:
I´ll wait for a stable version, just geting used to vista and I´m not an expert so I prefer to wait a few months
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AndyCr15 said:
What do you mean? This version is stable?
Many people are saying they think really it's past beta and about ready to be launched...
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Click to collapse
It is EXTREMELY stable. I haven't been able to crash it yet, and believe me, I've been trying.
And it dual (or triple, in my case) boots quite well, so you've got nothing to lose if you want to give it a 20GB partition just to play with it. The current licenses are only good til 1 August anyway, so I'm not looking to use it as a permanent solution.
And it's really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, easy to use. So dive in
liamhere said:
i take you really mean just windows 7....as your links states and not mobile
Yes, Windows 7 was the correct title of the thread but I did catch that I states windows 7 mobile in opening thread box. Sorry about that everyone. I was rading articles on Windows Mobile 7 and looking at Windows 7 at the same time. I have high expectations for both. I will be installing Windows 7 tonight and I will let you know how it runs on my laptop. Hopefully it better manages video memory than Vista does...
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Click to collapse
codesplice said:
Only complaint is that Chrome won't run on Win7
Other than that, way to go MS!
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Click to collapse
crome doesn't (I don't use it though, because their security is abysmal it's on the same level as safari on windows. but to every man his own) but it does work, you have to run the exe with a certain argument. search at live.com or google.com to find it. I saw it today in my RSS reader.
I'll try to find it for you.
EDIT: here you go http://i.gizmodo.com/5130150/how-to-run-chrome-on-64+bit-windows-7
lennie said:
crome doesn't (I don't use it though) but it does work, you have to run the exe with a certain argument. search at live.com or google.com to find it. I saw it today in my RSS reader.
I'll try to find it for you.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Found it!
Thanks for letting me know there is a fix
For the rest of yous, you need to add –in-process-plugins to the shortcut launcher command.
Off to go try it.
EDIT: IT WORKS!
Source: http://www.blogsdna.com/1900/how-to-run-google-chrome-on-windows-7-64-bit-version.htm
I didn't check to see if this was in Vista but I just seen in 7 that I can set my background to change in intervals. I set my windows color to clear, so when my backgournd changes its like the window color changes too. I'm gonna check if its in Vista.
Hello XDA-Developers,
I have to write something about Bill Gates & Steve Jobs.
For that I need some Polls
Would be nice if you could help me, just vote
First Poll:
[22.01 Which Microsoft OS' you like most?]
I made my vote...but if you had windows 7 as a choice it would've been my pick.
Windows for Workgroups 3.11
My vote goes to XP, the best OS i have ever seen, vista and W-Se7en are the biggest POS ever built
xp for me.....well x64 xp
but having to use vista at home....i miss xp
What about Windows 7 ?! It's the best OS ever made.
Should of had WinNT in that list.
GWelker62 said:
Should of had WinNT in that list.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
which version, there were several?
but dos was the best os. nice and stable.. and plenty fast.
liamhere said:
but having to use vista at home....i miss xp
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Click to collapse
if you miss it then dual boot, that should give you your "xp-fix".
but if you have a core2 duo or above with 2gb or more memory and a sensible video card vista will run petty nice.
I've gotten so used to vista so when I go over to my friend's house I get pissed because I have to use xp. it's the truth, so I think I know what you're going through but in reverse.
on my rig I wouldn't dear desecrate it's inner tubes with xp. I don't mean to start a flame war but I had to say it.
vista is good on up to date hardware, well actually the only things that really needs to upgrade in the system is the video card and memory, even an old p4 would run it well.
I setup my brother's rig with a 939 socket athlon 3500, 2gb mem and an nvidia 8600gt and vista ran smoothly. (and this isn't even up to date hardware)
the key for better vista performance is: add more memory!
does anyone remember when xp just came out and OEMs shipped it with 256mb memory and it ran like molases? and how there was a huge hoopla about it until they started shipping them with 512mb? but in reality the sweet spot for xp was 1gb memory or more. it's the same thing with vista now, people try to run it on 1gb memory when the sweet spot is 2gb or more.
the driver issues was the manufacturers' fault because they sat on their asses until the last minute, but that issue has been ironed out for a while now so that shouldn't be a problem anymore.
I know others have a lot to say about the reason they prefer xp. but it all boils down to a user's preference.
PS: I know there are passionate people here so if anyone is going go reply to my post please leave the flame-throwers at home.
worst thing with old nt4 was that one could not reinstall it without a format
so if it required a reinstall you'd best have a full backup of your data
Another vote for Vista. Currently running 64 and 32 versions at home (gaming PC and HTPC), as well as XP (Laptop) and W2K (photoframe) so have lots of experience of each.
Just as Lennie said, so long as Vista has enough RAM to operate it's lovely. I've gotten so used to it's new little shortcuts that I find XP cumbersome now sometimes. Please don't take this as dissing XP, it's still a lovely system, but Vista was built as an improvement on XP and I personally think they succeeded.
Haven't tried W7 yet, guess I probably will if it starts gaming better than Vista.
Again - this is my own opinion and not a salvo in a flame war. If you love XP over Vista, so long as you're talking from experience and not prejudice then fair play to you.
Thank you for your post and answers
I will open a new thread in the day.
But first I need a idea for a poll about Apple Products
scilor said:
But first I need a idea for a poll about Apple Products
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Does the hype surrounding all Apple products make you more likely to buy them, or less?
Who do you feel has the control at Apple:
- The engineers
- The consumer research dept
- The marketing dept
Or simply, in your experience did your Apple product live up to your expectations?
I'd be interested to see the answers to those personally.
scilor said:
But first I need a idea for a poll about Apple Products
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Now that Steve Jobs has taken a medical leave of absence, soon to retire ( pancreatic cancer ) , what will become of Apple?
1). Apple will keep on it's current path, because it's products are superior in quality and design, no matter who runs the company.
2). Apple will lose it's lustre because the product quality and design will go down hill under new management
3).The products have always been crap, Steve Jobs is just the ultimate salesman, so goodbye Apple market share.
4). The Apple mystique is ingrained , it is not about Steve Jobs or the quality and design, the Apple fanbois will continue to buy no matter what.
Or something like that.
denco7 said:
Now that Steve Jobs has taken a medical leave of absence, soon to retire ( pancreatic cancer ) , what will become of Apple?
3).The products have always been crap, Steve Jobs is just the ultimate salesman, so goodbye Apple market share.
4). The Apple mystique is ingrained , it is not about Steve Jobs or the quality and design, the Apple fanbois will continue to buy no matter what.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I second this
5) on the desktop market apart from fancy games more and more tasks are moved
to the browser and google is having a field day apple vs. ms is becoming less and less
and issue apart from on the mobile platform where browsers are less easy to access then dedicated apps
so it's iphone vs. wm rather then macosx vs. windows now
This is the closest forum I found to ask this question...
It's supposed to be priced at $400. Which makes it $150 more than, the Nook Color.
If this is true, you gain dual-core processors, 1GB RAM, 10.1" IPS display, and a removable keyboard (Assuming- it's factored into the $400).
Smashing good deal, I'd say.
However- my main complaint of all tablets (at least in this price range)... Is they don't run a full OS. The hardware on the Eee Pad Transformer suggest to me, it could viably run Windows on it in a dual-boot situation... I was just wondering if anyone had heard anything on doing this?
If so- it makes this an amazing device.
The problem with Windows is that the GUI and applications are designed around mouse usage. This will be an issue with any OS GUI not designed around touch. So it won't be as amazing as you think. Consider how difficult it will be to use toolbars with tiny buttons, use the taskbar (tiny icons), select things in dropdown menus, etc. You'd really need a stylus to get anywhere.
I suggest you look at netbooks if you want Windows. I have an EeePC 900 that I've been using for years and frankly it is vastly more usable than tablets thus far for a number of reasons.
There's no way to run Windows on a Tegra 2 or any other ARM-based platform except maybe through emulation. Also, the $400 price point for the Transformer would not include the keyboard.
Actually Windows 7 was designed with touch input in mind so while your statement might hold true to XP and earlier, you obviously haven't used Windows 7
I'm not worried about if Windows will work on a touch device as much as... Hardware support and if it's even possible (how it'd boot from a flash drive, for example)
AZImmortal said:
There's no way to run Windows on a Tegra 2 or any other ARM-based platform except maybe through emulation. Also, the $400 price point for the Transformer would not include the keyboard.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
OK- this is what I was looking for. So it won't run on Tegra 2...... Answers my question.
I am with you: I wouldn't assume the $400 included it but I've seen some product pages to suggest otherwise, I'm waiting to see. Even if the keyboard cost $100... Putting it the same price as the iPad... A tablet with no keyboard or a tablet with a keyboard: no brainer- the Eee Pad still gets the edge.
TexUs said:
Actually Windows 7 was designed with touch input in mind so while your statement might hold true to XP and earlier, you obviously haven't used Windows 7
I'm not worried about if Windows will work on a touch device as much as... Hardware support and if it's even possible (how it'd boot from a flash drive, for example)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I use Windows XP, Vista and 7 every day, but I haven't touched a Win7 tablet PC. Windows 7 might be designed for touch but the applications, the whole reason to use Windows over another OS, will still be a problem. Not many apps are designed with touch in mind.
My EeePC 900 uses "flash drives" to boot Windows. it has a 4GB and 16GB SSD. It's pretty quick even though the SSDs are slow. It's that instant access time and relatively quick read speed, but the write speed is awful. Or are you referring to booting from SD? Which would probably entail some sort of fancy bootloader.... It is possible to boot Windows from USB so SD may be possible.
swaaye said:
I use Windows XP, Vista and 7 every day, but I haven't touched a Win7 tablet PC. Windows 7 might be designed for touch but the applications, the whole reason to use Windows over another OS, will still be a problem. Not many apps are designed with touch in mind.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's true but that's where the keyboard and touchpad picks up the slack.....
For 95% of people- Microsoft products (IE: designed with the touch in mind now) are fine.
swaaye said:
My EeePC 900 uses "flash drives" to boot Windows. it has a 4GB and 16GB SSD. It's pretty quick even though the SSDs are slow. It's that instant access time and relatively quick read speed, but the write speed is awful. Or are you referring to booting from SD? Which would probably entail some sort of fancy bootloader.... It is possible to boot Windows from USB so SD may be possible.
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I'm not sure how this device works (the bootloader) which is why I questioned the possibility anyway. Kindof a moot point if Windows won't run on a Tegra 2.
TexUs said:
Kindof a moot point if Windows won't run on a Tegra 2.
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I guess so.
Personally I've been hoping for a new 9" netbook with better hardware than my EeePC 900. Unfortunately none of the companies seems to want to build anything smaller than 10" now.
swaaye said:
I guess so.
Personally I've been hoping for a new 9" netbook with better hardware than my EeePC 900. Unfortunately none of the companies seems to want to build anything smaller than 10" now.
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I think 10" is a good size, myself.
7" is fantastic size as well, but it's too big for one handed typing and too small for two handed so... It's an awkward size. 10" is perfect IMO.
I have an EEE 1005HA and had a EEE 900? There is a big diffrence in size. IMHO the 1005 form factor is the best ballance for useabillity and portability.
Dell has a flip screen netbook / tablet that looks intersting but the price point is high, the reviews are low, so I have not considered it.
TexUs said:
Actually Windows 7 was designed with touch input in mind so while your statement might hold true to XP and earlier, you obviously haven't used Windows 7
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What about Windows 7 is significantly different from XP in the context of touch input?
I'm certainly intrigued by the Asus tab. However, considering that I work on Windows PCs and Servers for a living, I don't like the idea of trying to navigate that OS with my blunt sausage-fingers.
I'd just be happy with an Android OS that supports running apps in resizable, movable windows. Drag and drop file maniuplation would be nice too. Functionally, the Android interface feels like Windows 3.1. I'd like to have folders on the "desktop" and navigate to a document/media file to launch it that way. Basically, I'd like to see some Windows-esque functionality without it actually needing to be Windows..
I disagree that 10" is better with a netbook but I'm not surprised to see it said. I'd rather move up to a 12" slim subnote with much faster hardware that point (which I've had too). The 9" is exceptionally portable and I actually wish I could find a notebook that's even smaller. Unfortunately they don't exist outside of some severely limited PDAs.
This is the reason I grabbed a Nook Color. I've wanted a 7" tablet because it's smaller than the 9" EeePC. I've had a Droid to play with but it is just too small. Unfortunately touch screen input is far inferior to a keyboard/touchpad in some situations.
Jgrimoldy said:
What about Windows 7 is significantly different from XP in the context of touch input?
I'm certainly intrigued by the Asus tab. However, considering that I work on Windows PCs and Servers for a living, I don't like the idea of trying to navigate that OS with my blunt sausage-fingers.
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Go look up some videos of it on Youtube. Basically MS's GUI and their apps are usable with touch but obviously when it comes to 3rd party apps you are going to have a very hard time without a stylus or KB/touchpad.
The whole reason the tablet revolution is happening is because enough people are learning to live without Windows.
Wherever there is Windows there is x86, and that means HUGE CPU die sizes and terrible battery life.
I don't expect to see Windows on a tablet until we get to quad-core models that have enough raw power to run Windows in a virtual machine. Tablets are the end of the WinTel monopoly....
swaaye said:
Go look up some videos of it on Youtube. Basically MS's GUI and their apps are usable with touch but obviously when it comes to 3rd party apps you are going to have a very hard time without a stylus or KB/touchpad.
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No, I won't go look up some videos. If he, or you, want to make the contention, which is specious at best, that Windows 7 was designed with touch in mind, feel free to explain your stance. Otherwise, I'm not buying. I work with Windows XP and Windows 7 every day. The Windows 7 interface is like lipstick on a pig relative to XP.
In Windows 7, when you select Shut Down, there's no confirmation or prompt that asks if you'd like to log off, restart, hibernate, etc. No, it just initiates the shutdown immediately. If you want to hibernate or suspend, you need to precisely click on the little triangle right next to shutdown. Yeah. If you mis-click, then the device will shutdown, which isn't what you want. This was designed with touch in mind?
Windows 7, just like every other version of Windows since 95 involves context-sensitive menus available thru right-clicking. How exactly do you right click on a tablet?
Look, I like my Nook. I'm very interested in the Asus tablet if the price is right. I'm just not letting some clown get off with some lame contention that Windows 7 was designed with touch in mind all that easily.
Jgrimoldy said:
What about Windows 7 is significantly different from XP in the context of touch input?
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Everything.
http://windows.microsoft.com/en-US/windows7/products/features/touch
It was designed with touch in mind. Microsoft saw this tablet thing coming and was proactive... People don't give them enough credit sometimes.
Jgrimoldy said:
I'm certainly intrigued by the Asus tab. However, considering that I work on Windows PCs and Servers for a living, I don't like the idea of trying to navigate that OS with my blunt sausage-fingers.
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IMO the future of computing is with a STYLUS and not fingers.
Why? Handwriting. Have you used Windows 7 + OneNote? That's the future. Write ideas, notes, whatever you want to down... And then you can freaking SEARCH them later on (handwriting recognition). That is immensely more useful and practical than typing stuff in or inaccurately penning something with a fat finger- as you say.
Jgrimoldy said:
I'd just be happy with an Android OS that supports running apps in resizable, movable windows. Drag and drop file maniuplation would be nice too. Functionally, the Android interface feels like Windows 3.1. I'd like to have folders on the "desktop" and navigate to a document/media file to launch it that way. Basically, I'd like to see some Windows-esque functionality without it actually needing to be Windows..
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Excellent points, but you'd then have to have a taskbar of some sort and then it starts becoming "too complicated" for people. I'm not sure if the added complications would outweigh drag and drop benefit. (Window switching is already there via long-press on home button).
swaaye said:
I disagree that 10" is better with a netbook but I'm not surprised to see it said. I'd rather move up to a 12" slim subnote with much faster hardware that point (which I've had too).
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I've personally got a 13" as you said- much beefier hardware.
However. After thinking about it, I don't do video editing, really. Or anything intensive. I have no need for that beefier hardware so then the question to me is... Why don't I get something smaller/more portable?
poofyhairguy said:
The whole reason the tablet revolution is happening is because enough people are learning to live without Windows.
Wherever there is Windows there is x86, and that means HUGE CPU die sizes and terrible battery life.
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I expect Microsoft to start killing x86 off in Windows 9. That said, I've heard rumors they are already going to drop x86 in Windows 8.
Again, believe it or not: Microsoft is fairly proactive here and knows what direction they need to move in.
poofyhairguy said:
I don't expect to see Windows on a tablet until we get to quad-core models that have enough raw power to run Windows in a virtual machine. Tablets are the end of the WinTel monopoly....
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There's already some intel-powered Windows tablets coming out that'll be fairly decently spec'd. The downside is I've not seen one under $1000. Which makes sense considering the hardware. However- my point is that they're already coming.
Microsoft has talked of Windows 8 supporting some kind of windows-on-a-chip thing as well...... Again- they know what's coming and where they need to take it
Jgrimoldy said:
In Windows 7, when you select Shut Down, there's no confirmation or prompt that asks if you'd like to log off, restart, hibernate, etc. No, it just initiates the shutdown immediately.
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Preaching to the choir. I have no idea the justification for that one. Even on a desktop PC it makes no sense what with the strides in hibernation/sleep.
Keep in mind this setting can be changed (and it might even be changed upon detection of a touch screen device, who knows... Windows 7 installs differently based upon detected hardware like SSDs, etc).
Considering you've admitted you haven't used Windows 7 in a touch environment I'm not sure why you expect anyone to put much stock in what you say.
Jgrimoldy said:
Windows 7, just like every other version of Windows since 95 involves context-sensitive menus available thru right-clicking. How exactly do you right click on a tablet?
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How do you do it on Android? Get real.
TexUs,
You and I just disagree.
I don't consider the inclusion of multi-touch in Windows 7 as being significant enough to give them a pass on designing the OS for touch. There are too many things about Windows that are just too tablet unfriendly. You consider multi-touch to change "everything" (your word) about the interface relative to XP. I do not.
On the topic of stylus-based tablet computing, this was tried about 6 or 7 years ago. That didn't work out very well. Styluses are a pain in the ass. They get lost, etc. The Palm Pilot was a stylus based device that really caught on for several years. The stylus, however, did not.
I never suggested that you could right-click on Android. My point was that right-clicking is just further evidence that Windows 7 is not all *that* tablet friendly. No need to get real. I'm already there.
Jgrimoldy said:
I don't consider the inclusion of multi-touch in Windows 7 as being significant enough to give them a pass on designing the OS for touch. There are too many things about Windows that are just too tablet unfriendly. You consider multi-touch to change "everything" (your word) about the interface relative to XP. I do not.
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You said relative to XP. Everything DID change in contrast to XP. XP sucked from a touch perspective. It was pretty much just tap this or tap that... Windows 7 made huge leaps and bounds.
Touch gestures in the OS, High DPI support, the Taskbar was huge in multi-window management in a touch environment, Aero Snap- again- more window management made easier in a touch environment, IE- touch support added - along with most all Microsoft products
Tons of improvement over XP. Again- the OS as a whole is now ready for touch- XP can't say that.
And your singular example of the shutdown button (which I already admitted is retarded regardless of setup) is hardly a damning point.
Jgrimoldy said:
On the topic of stylus-based tablet computing, this was tried about 6 or 7 years ago. That didn't work out very well. Styluses are a pain in the ass. They get lost, etc. The Palm Pilot was a stylus based device that really caught on for several years. The stylus, however, did not.
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Yes because stylus tech and handwriting recognition is exactly the same as it was 10 years ago.
Jgrimoldy said:
I never suggested that you could right-click on Android. My point was that right-clicking is just further evidence that Windows 7 is not all *that* tablet friendly. No need to get real. I'm already there.
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By that token, Android isn't tablet friendly since it relies on long-presses to gain additional options (IE: context menu) either.
Your logic just doesn't stack up.
You're complaining that a full blown OS has more features than a phone OS. Really? Where else do you suppose they stick all those options? All over the screen? Or with menus and long presses to pull them up only when needed? You also act, like people will constantly be using these functions on a tablet anyway. Tablets are for the foreseeable future, additions. Only things like the Eee Pad Transformer that have easily attachable keyboards- have any hope of replacing "real" computers.
I have a windows based tablet and I am incredibly happy with it
I have every intention of getting another one very soon (probably the asus ep121 or the hp slate 500)
I don't know why everyone's arguing about stylus input here, but if you haven't tried an active digitizer, you have no idea what you're talking about.
there's no way you can compare a windows tablet to a palm pilot which had a crappy resistive touch screen
it's like night and day
and the hand writing recognition in windows 7 is really, really good
I use it all the time and I never have any problems with it
also, I've been using my stylus nearly every day for 2 years and I haven't lost it..
I really don't see that being a problem
but anyway, I find it strange that no one has bothered to mention windows 8 in this thread. it will most likely be out fairly soon and it will support arm( not to mention the fact that it will be more touch friendly). I doubt it will be easy to port to something like the transformer, but it will be a hell of a lot easier than porting win7.
one more thing, you can long press to right click in windows, exactly the same as you do in android.