I've been checking out batteries for the Kaiser and I noticed something that I've never seen with other phones and pdas, the battery used in the Kaiser is a Lithium Polymer. If you're not familiar with that type of battery, its a battery commonly used for its lightweight properties and high current discharge rate (rate is based on battery of course). Most phones, pdas, electronics used Lithium Ion. For RC helis, Lithium Polymers or Lipos are very common and are treated with much care and respect. There have been a few accidents where Lipos have caused fires whether used in RC or being charged in the car and home. Lipos do not like being discharged pass a certain voltage, usually 3.0v and require balancing between cells which helps promote longevity. Since the battery used is only one cell 3.7 nominal (4.2 charged) balancing is not an issue, however complete discharge maybe another one.
Just thought I'd share a bit of information with everyone.
My old Sony Ericsson T68i used Li-Polymer also.
Many/most of the LiIon batteries in circultation for electronic devices today are LiIon Polymer batteries. The two types have nearly identical characteristics and performance properties. Both types of batteries can be extremely sensitive to heat and can produce a great deal. Both also have safety circuits when manufactured by a reputable company to prevent overcharging and the associated heat buildup and over use to prevent lithium plating which will effectively kill the battery. It's not at all uncommon for LiIon to be used to refer to both unless one is being extremely precise.
I wasn't aware about Lipos being used in other phones, good to know. I don't doubt manufacturers with proper safety devices as far as charging. Though I wish I could say the same about incidences from Lipo fires where reputable equipment was used to charge Lipos. My experience with Lipos have been with larger discharges and faster charging so I wouldn't think that we would have much to worry about. LiIons and Lipos are far as my hobby with RC helis and other vehicles stand as different as night and day, one being as safe as jello when abused and one being as dangerous as destroying a garage when neglected.
It's more a matter of degree. I've had a LiIon go "poof" in a cheap charger once. Luckily, I was sitting in the room where it happened so I could put it out before there was any real damage to anything other than the charger and battery. The polymers are more sensitive to heat, and have had a rash of manufacturing defects that have gotten lots of press.
If it's a quality battery and a quality charger, there shouldn't be many issues.
I was looking for a cheap spare battery for my Captivate and I found this one.
I was just wondering if I would get a significant battery life improvement since the standard battery is 1500mAh.
Thanks in advance for your answers!
mathematically you would get about 10% more run time. Not much else information.
what he said.
say your 1500 mah gets you say, 15 hours, 100% to 0% during "normal usage" rate
if you get a 1600 mah, with the same "normal usage" rate, you'd only get 16 hours.
mah = milliamp/hour
[stock battery] / [hours used] = [new battery] / [hours used] = [ma]/[hours]
[1500 ma] / [15hours] = [1600 ma] / [(x) hours]
x= 16 hours.
if you want real improvement, get a 3200 mah, that should more than double it; although i'm not sure if that battery size is the "DOUBLE WIDE" one that needs a new battery cover.
waikuk said:
although i'm not sure if that battery size is the "DOUBLE WIDE" one that needs a new battery cover.
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It is considerably thicker.
waikuk said:
what he said.
say your 1500 mah gets you say, 15 hours, 100% to 0% during "normal usage" rate
if you get a 1600 mah, with the same "normal usage" rate, you'd only get 16 hours.
mah = milliamp/hour
[stock battery] / [hours used] = [new battery] / [hours used] = [ma]/[hours]
[1500 ma] / [15hours] = [1600 ma] / [(x) hours]
x= 16 hours.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So I better get another 1550mAh for less than 10$ and swap batteries when the first is dead... I don't want to pay that much for a bad looking 3200mAh battery...
Thanks for your answers guys, I appriciate!
Just don't keep the spare battery loose in your pocket with anything that's conductive like coins or keys. LiPo batteries can catch fire if short circuited.
Thanks for the advice!
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I896 using XDA App
well the math above is not accurate. i mean the assumtion is too simple. and the rated mah is probably even less accurate. 1500mah is a rating measured with certain test criteria. say maximum charge or a specific voltage drained down to another specific voltage regarded as zero. also the battery never actually reaches zero in the phone. the battery meter scales batery use to the minimum voltage that the phone can safely operate determined by the manufacturer and is likely a different value than the minimum used to rate the battery mah. testing standards may differ from battery manufacturers as well. all in all a 1600 mah battery may have negligable effect or it might increase battery life by 20%+ especially if the voltage considered 0% by the phone is significantly higher than the voltage used to rate the battery.
the extended double thick bateries unless specifically designed for the captivate will not work without modification to the phone. it is the simple fact that the lock slider to the battery door wont close unless there is a cutaway in the battery to clear it. the i9000 and vibrant batteries wouldnt allow you to close the lock slider so it's not as simple as making a battery door. this is why we dont have a battery door available. the easiest way is to leave the lock open and create a molded slip cover that wraps around most of the phone as a batery door but this will increse the length of the phone and leave the slider vulnerable to impact if dropped. other options include permanently modifying the slider or dissembling the phone and removing the slider. most consumers are not about to take a screwdriver or blade to there phone so thats out as a comercial option unless it is a service offered at cell phone/accessory stores. but for the diyer the phone is easy to take apart, traditional philips screws are used and the plastic is not fragile, the slider can be extended further to expose the hidden screws if you use your fingers to pull upward on it as if to just rip it off, it will flex and you might fear breaking it but it is tough, once it is bent up in the middle 2mm or so it can be slid down enough to expose the last two screws. it can then be slid back into place with no damage. once the back of the phone is separated from the screen assembly the slider can be slid right out. i think this type of mod could work if someone fabricated the new door and lock but it would be hard to sell.
i am a machinist and could produce something if requested but i feel like its not the kind of thing that would make money. too few have this phone and want an extended battery. and i feel like id have to do a large number of the installs as well. how many people are willing to send an expensive phone in the mail to some dude that has a mill in his basement to have a mod done while they wait phoneless in the mean time? just not realistic.
i have heard that the embedded batteries which are found in HTC One and Iphone last longer since they are shielded from humidity due tot he zero gap construction of these phones
So is that true?
it does last longer but reason for that battery is Lİ-polymer
I highly doubt there is less humidity or that it could affect battery longevity.
Most mobiles have come with LiPo batteries for years.
I'd be surprised if they last appreciably longer than batteries in other phones.
Keeping the temperature down, charging more slowly and not deep cycling them are likely to have the most benefit.
in my expereince removable batteries actually wear out faster.
I purchased the Zerolemon battery case for the Note 9. The updated one for $40 on Amazon. Mostly with one use in mind (due to its large size making it not practical for daily use for me), and that's for when I use the phone as a hot spot to connect my Chromebook Pro to my Verizon LTE connection. I purchased the AccuBattery app to make an effort to only charge my phone up to 80% to avoid heat and stressing the battery. An alarm will sound when you hit 80% and I disconnect the cord. This will potentially double the longevity of the battery. So Under normal operation without the battery case the Note 9 is at 80 degrees Fahrenheit (no hot spot). With the battery case charging the phone it's running at 105 degrees while hot spotting. The app registers this as in the "red zone". That can't be good for the battery. Without the battery case running the hot spot the temperature is at 89 to 99 degrees.. still in the green zone and the phone only feels warm not hot like with the case on.
I don't recall the battery running this hot when I used extended batteries on my LG V20 to run the hot spot Wifi. When I picked up the phone it wasn't nearly this hot to the touch like when using the battery case. When I used an external power bank like my Anker 10 mAh PowerCore+ 3.0 quick charge, no heat issues either.
If recharging the battery causes heat in the battery case's own battery is the close proximity to the Note 9's internal battery likely to cause more damage than simply letting the battery run down to the recommended 30% (or when heat starts to pick up on the app) without a battery case? Then use the battery case to recharge when the phone is no longer in use?
I think it's safe to say that recharging the battery in the battery case while running the phone in a high output/discharge function like streaming, facetime or hot spot is really detrimental to the Note 9's non removable battery. The whole environment is too heated up. When I had the user replaceable batteries on my V10 and V20 this wasn't an issue because those batteries are very inexpensive compared to the cost of replacing a Note 9 battery. Reason #234 why phones should have user replaceable batteries.
I will post the battery temps when using an external power bank that's at least six inches away from the phone so that heat is not spilling into the internal battery.
Here is a screenshot of the AccuBattery app where I monitor battery heat under the discharge tab at the bottom right. Heat is the enemy.
This link for original mi 10 ultra charger from Aliexpress
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005002604501386.html?spm=a2g0s.9042311.0.0.e8774c4d0wuJu6
Think about it. Do you really think a battery of that type and size could safely absorb that magnitude of energy? Picture yourself holding a 100 watt incandescent light bulb with bare hands.
blackhawk said:
Think about it. Do you really think a battery of that type and size could safely absorb that magnitude of energy? Picture yourself holding a 100 watt incandescent light bulb with bare hands.
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You right, but mean this not safe !!
I used it for a long time no any problems it's amazing.
hsona said:
You right, but mean this not safe !!
I used it for a long time no any problems it's amazing.
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Click to collapse
So how fast does it charge from 20 to 100%?
blackhawk said:
Think about it. Do you really think a battery of that type and size could safely absorb that magnitude of energy? Picture yourself holding a 100 watt incandescent light bulb with bare hands.
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Click to collapse
Are you serious? A battery is storing energy, not using it which would generate heat, as an incandescent light bulb is! Think about that!
Full disclosure - I own a Mi 10 Ultra and when I charge it at 120 Watts it doesn't get hot!
kiwiindo said:
Are you serious? A battery is storing energy, not using it which would generate heat, as an incandescent light bulb is! Think about that!
Full disclosure - I own a Mi 10 Ultra and when I charge it at 120 Watts it doesn't get hot!
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Electricity/energy is never 100% conversion into electricity/energy in between anything. It always generates heat.
It doesn't get hot because you don't feel it. Your hands are not a thermometer. It's subjective.
Use built in apps like Ampere from Google play to check about battery status.
It should show you the temperature measure by the device itself of the battery and the charging speed in milliampere.
pl1992aw said:
Electricity/energy is never 100% conversion into electricity/energy in between anything. It always generates heat.
It doesn't get hot because you don't feel it. Your hands are not a thermometer. It's subjective.
Use built in apps like Ampere from Google play to check about battery status.
It should show you the temperature measure by the device itself of the battery and the charging speed in milliampere.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Let's see you put your hand in boiling water! of course, my hands respond to temperature.
Or how about holding a turned on incandescent bulb?
Correct charging is not 100% efficient and that's the part that makes heat, whereas an incandescent light is 100% heat, so really not comparable.
Measuring amps into a phone or battery will NOT give you the battery status on its own, you also need the voltage of the battery. In Xiaomi mi10 Ultra case the charger supplies 20V @ 6amps which is split into 2 batteries and converted to the charging voltage of the battery (around 4.2-4.7Volts). Doing a balance of the power input and the heat generated will give you the conversion or charging efficiency (Physics 101). The same with temperature, you need the mass of what you are heating to know the heat input, which also needs to know the losses and isolate the device from the environment. Temperature is not a measure of energy on its own.
I do not believe an app from wherever gives you this, it just can't physically measure it. Even the Amps indicated come from a sensor, which uses what to measure? Hall effect? what is the accuracy and losses.
There is a chip inside the charger and another inside the phone that adjusts the charging according to the capacity of the charger and the phone battery status as well as the ability of the phone to take the charging voltage and current. This is defined as part of the quick charge specifications.
An Engineer has designed, calculated, tested and modified these devices over a long development cycle. they work and don't get hot.
It's a graphene cell, a smartphone first.
It's very energy efficient and charges faster then a bat out of a Wuhan lab, with very little heat.
I want a graphene retrofit for my 10+
Bad behind the curve Samsung... what's wrong did the Note 7 baked your balls?
kiwiindo said:
Let's see you put your hand in boiling water! of course, my hands respond to temperature.
Or how about holding a turned on incandescent bulb?
Correct charging is not 100% efficient and that's the part that makes heat, whereas an incandescent light is 100% heat, so really not comparable.
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Click to collapse
Having a fever now. Come and measure the temperature. 36°C ? 37.5°C ? 38°C ? 39°C? 40°C?
Can you distinguish it? When you want to say you can, the scene is you are also having a fever. Can you still distinguish?
That value is measured by the phone itself. You don't feel it when it is behind a cover, a glass, because Engineer work hard to not let you feel it. You are not touching the battery itself. How do you know it's not hot? Can you distinguish that way?
At least take out an Infrared thermometer and measure it, to be better objective.
First tell if your phone can work properly at the temperature of boiling water or incandescent bulb.
So really not comparable back at you.
kiwiindo said:
Measuring amps into a phone or battery will NOT give you the battery status on its own, you also need the voltage of the battery
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Click to collapse
Of course voltage and current. Battery status was measured by the phone itself.
Observing current to know what state it is, fast charge or normal charge, along with battery percentage.
Look on the 33W charger, normal charge is 5V⎓3A
At normal charge, for sure the voltage is 5V, so current is the thing matters of the charging at that state. (This is for energy efficiency, high voltage low current has lower energy loss than low voltage high current.)
Fast charge is dynamic, so it's not easy to know, but on the charger, it's 3⎓1.35A.
Just observe the battery percentage and current, you can know if it's in fast charge or normal charge.
If current measured by the phone is below 3A, but the percentage is rising fast, like 40%~70% in 30minutes, it's fast charge obviously.
If current measured by the phone is below 3A, but the percentage is not rising as you can feel, it's normal charging.
kiwiindo said:
Even the Amps indicated come from a sensor, which uses what to measure? Hall effect? what is the accuracy and losses.
There is a chip inside the charger and another inside the phone that adjusts the charging according to the capacity of the charger and the phone battery status as well as the ability of the phone to take the charging voltage and current.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Aren't you answering your own question already?
Which uses what to measure?
There is a chip inside the charger and another inside the phone that adjusts the charging.
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Click to collapse
Phone need to know itself what percentage, voltage, current it is charging, and base on that to adjust charging.
App just took that measured value out and show it to you dynamically. Even if you don't use the app, you can still check for those current, voltage and temperature on your own. It's designed in the system.
kiwiindo said:
An Engineer has designed, calculated, tested and modified these devices over a long development cycle. they work and don't get hot.
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Click to collapse
Agreed Engineer had adjust them, but it ALWAYS gets hot.
They are only adjust to the point you don't really feel it under the case or glass.
Take Infrared thermometer and make Video to show it don't get hot. Then will believe it.
Remember, measure the naked battery, not over the glass.
Internal resistance causes the heating. That's a lot of watts flowing through the relatively small copper buses. Graphene is a better conductor than copper but still offers some resistance. These batteries are cool and could easily last the life of the phone.
Graphene is 1.4 times as conductive as copper by volume, but if you factor in density, it is 5.8 times more conductive (if a given sample of copper can carry 1 kA with a 1 V drop in voltage, the same weight, and length, of graphene, could carry 5.8 kA with with a 1 V drop in voltage - in theory).
Maybe you are right, but my engineering training and 40 years of experience says no that's not correct.
How about you proving that the battery gets hot on your mi 10 pro.
Give us a video and thermal camera video of the temperature rise as surely that is proof that it's worse than a mi 10 ultra.
Looking forward to your proof.
kiwiindo said:
Maybe you are right, but my engineering training and 40 years of experience says no that's not correct.
How about you proving that the battery gets hot on your mi 10 pro.
Give us a video and thermal camera video of the temperature rise as surely that is proof that it's worse than a mi 10 ultra.
Looking forward to your proof.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm still waiting for your proof.
I don't even need video to proof.
You accuse what he said is fake:
120W charging tested: How hot does your phone get?
We tested the charge time and temperature of the Xiaomi Mi 10 Ultra's 120W charging plug. Here is what we found.
www.androidauthority.com
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He had given the proof in place for me.
Same as this website:
Battery charging test shows Mi 10 Ultra charges at 80W and not 120W - Gizmochina
The Mi 10 Ultra by Xiaomi is one of few phones that supports 120W fast charging. It is also one of the few phones that support Quick Charge 5 which brings 100W+ fast charging. Xiaomi ships the Mi 10 Ultra with a 120W GaN charger in the box, unlike some manufacturers that include a slower …
www.gizmochina.com
The exact same phone model you said and you have, as well as the charger.
Now it's your time to demonstrate.
Testing environment shall follow ISO standard.
Charge from 0% to 100%.
Bet up your phone.
40 years...