Database Develop

MDA Compact IV

Hi all,
Does anyone know if T-Mobile has debilitated their version of the HTC Touch Diamond, called the MDA Compact IV by removing Wi-Fi, similar to what they did with MDA Compact III and others before that?

Here’s a video of the T-Mobile variant of the HTC Touch Diamond I was talking about above along with the customised (branded) TouchFlo 3D interface.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XhrnATHTlkQ
It really worries me that they might have removed WiFi from their phone, with their unlimited Web & Walk tariffs now, what possible advantage would they have to do this?

If you look closely at the video above when the person goes into the settings menu, you are able to see under the condensed communications menu it does say WiFi.
But this is a pre-production model so it might not be accurate. Also, I noticed on the home screen there was no WiFi active icon on the title bar, but this might be because it wasn’t turned on.
Finally, if you look at the four buttons, they are reversed when compared with the HTC Diamond, the call and answer are at the top on the MDA Compact IV, whereas they are on the bottom on the HTC Touch Diamond.
Now if T-Mobile, have gone as far as switching the position of the buttons, then they might of also requested that WiFi is disabled. Then again, as it was a pre-production model, the buttons on the production version might be in the same place as the HTC version.
So many questions, and no answers!

Hey guys,
i was wondering off to the Tmobile website(dutch version) and the site says that the compact 4 is coming soon!!
gr. bram
link: Dutch T-mo Compact 4

Thanks bram_smulders,
I noticed that they don’t mention WiFi anywhere, just Web & Walk. Also notice how the buttons are still the other way round when compared to HTC’s OEM version. I hope someone can give me a definitive answer, but at the moment the signs don’t look good!

why no WIFI
imranbashir_uk said:
Thanks bram_smulders,
I noticed that they don’t mention WiFi anywhere, just Web & Walk. Also notice how the buttons are still the other way round when compared to HTC’s OEM version. I hope someone can give me a definitive answer, but at the moment the signs don’t look good!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
With the MDA compac III in NL there was GPS and WIFI on it, so why shouldn't it be on this one.

the uk and probably other places compact 3 has no wifi, wheras the exact same device on o2 in terms of the insides [the orbit 1] has wifi...

imranbashir_uk said:
It really worries me that they might have removed WiFi from their phone, with their unlimited Web & Walk tariffs now, what possible advantage would they have to do this?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That looks like the whole point to me. If their Web & Walk tariffs are unlimited, and the Touch Diamond has HSDPA, who needs wifi?

Your comment is really quite ignorant.
Wi-Fi has many advantages over 3G and HSDPA in terms of speed, and reliability to name just a few.
Businesses that have WiFi LAN’s and WAN’s setup for sharing their intranet, storage servers, exchange servers, are behind a firewall and cannot be accessed over the internet even using VPN use it with their laptops and mobile devices.
If your device has WiFi and HSDPA then using appropriate software you would be able to make your phone into a mobile WiFi router, and connect a laptop to the internet in an emergency.
At home, WiFi can be used to stream video, audio, share NAS drives, and printers, the list goes on and on.
Additionally, you might live in an area that has no 3G coverage, then you’re stuck with GPRS or nothing, but if you had a wireless router at home, then that’s not a problem.
Finally, if you’re on a legacy tariff or cannot justify the additional £7 per month for Web & Walk as it’s only for occasional use, then WiFi is a free option, assuming you have access to a WiFi network.
Do you want more reasons?

The people at T-Tobile obviously are ignorant.
But your reasons assume and ignore a lot too:
1. Wifi itself may be fast, but broadband internet connections are not necesarily faster than 3G. Ireland is a good example. Where Rory (daredking) lives is also a good example (and that's in London!).
2. If you work for a business that has such high sceurity, that's your problem. Don't get a T-Mobile phone.
3. You can connect a laptop to the internet via your phone with bluetooth too. Personally, I've never seen it done with wifi - bluetooth and USB connections for that are much more common.
4. At home, again, bluetooth and USB can be used for at least most of those things. If your house is too big, why are you getting a T-Mobile phone?
5. If you live in the middle of nowhere, you're more likely to have a bad broadband connection than lack of 3G (at least in the British Isles).
6. Wifi may be free, but it has very limited coverage. Most people don't spend their lives within a few tens of metres of a wireless router.

Dark Fire said:
The people at T-Tobile obviously are ignorant.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I’m glad we agree that T-Mobile is wrong to disable WiFi, or at least I think that’s what you mean. To answer the rest of your points:
Dark Fire said:
1. Wifi itself may be fast, but broadband internet connections are not necesarily faster than 3G. Ireland is a good example. Where Rory (daredking) lives is also a good example (and that's in London!).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I never said broadband is always faster than 3G I said WiFi is faster that 3G and HSDPA. Never the less in most cases broadband is still faster than 3G, but possibly not HSDPA depending on who your ISP is and what your local exchange supports.
Dark Fire said:
2. If you work for a business that has such high sceurity, that's your problem. Don't get a T-Mobile phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That’s my point exactly I shouldn’t have to be forced away from T-Mobile or forced to by an unsubsidised phone.
Dark Fire said:
3. You can connect a laptop to the internet via your phone with bluetooth too. Personally, I've never seen it done with wifi - bluetooth and USB connections for that are much more common.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why on earth would you want to connect your laptop over Bluetooth thereby limiting your connection speed to 2Mbps or 1Mbps with 1.0, and limit your range to a few meters. Even that assumes you have Bluetooth on your laptop which may not be the case. To use USB, you got to have your cable with you take out your phone, and have a desk handy to put everything. More info on WiFi to HSDPA router here, once you do it you will never look back at Bluetooth, give it a go! http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=341398
Dark Fire said:
4. At home, again, bluetooth and USB can be used for at least most of those things. If your house is too big, why are you getting a T-Mobile phone?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
LOL I’m not even going to both responding to the comment that if my house is to big I shouldn’t be getting a T-mobile phone! I didn’t know T-mobile was only marketing their phones to people with small houses! All my equipment runs and streams over WiFi, this give me better range, and more bandwidth there is no point or advantage in doing it over Bluetooth.
Dark Fire said:
5. If you live in the middle of nowhere, you're more likely to have a bad broadband connection than lack of 3G (at least in the British Isles).
6. Wifi may be free, but it has very limited coverage. Most people don't spend their lives within a few tens of metres of a wireless router.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
[/QUOTE]
What’s that got to do with anything? The point I was trying to make is that when available it’s better to use WiFi over 3G. i.e. at home and work I connect over WiFi, anywhere else I use GPRS or 3G.
At the end of the day, it comes down to choice, T-Mobile have chosen to disable WiFi. I and many others who do use WiFi are forced to choose between a subsidised handset from T-Mobile, or moving to a different service provider, or buying an unbranded phone. If T-Mobile didn’t disable the WiFi like O2 and Orange, well then this thread would not exist!

imranbashir_uk said:
I’m glad we agree that T-Mobile is wrong to disable WiFi, or at least I think that’s what you mean.
At the end of the day, it comes down to choice, T-Mobile have chosen to disable WiFi. I and many others who do use WiFi are forced to choose between a subsidised handset from T-Mobile, or moving to a different service provider, or buying an unbranded phone. If T-Mobile didn’t disable the WiFi like O2 and Orange, well then this thread would not exist!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I actually agree with you totally. Having known Mark (Dark Fire) for 7 years, i argue with him every day, but youve got him beat in my view here. im sure hes going to stab me or something now, but anyways, i think youre right.
On a side note, I dont think they have actually disabled it. If anyone can point me somewhere it says they have done, then please do, but i thought this was a thread firstly asking if they would, then slowly moving on to why tmobile are stupid if they disable it, then onto why it doesnt matter if its disabled.
Anyway, like I said, if somebody can show me somewhere it says it is disabled on the diamond, please do
Rory

This could obviously go on for ages. I am not supporting T-Mobile at all - I just said that their flawed reasoning was obvious.
"I’m glad we agree that T-Mobile is wrong to disable WiFi, or at least I think that’s what you mean." - Clearly that's what I mean.
"I never said broadband is always faster than 3G I said WiFi is faster that 3G and HSDPA." - How else is a wireless router going to connect to the internet?
"That’s my point exactly I shouldn’t have to be forced away from T-Mobile or forced to by an unsubsidised phone." - O2 forced me away through their lack of mobile internet. These things happen all of the time. Get used to it.
"Why on earth would you want to connect your laptop over Bluetooth thereby limiting your connection speed to 2Mbps or 1Mbps with 1.0, and limit your range to a few meters." - If you're on your laptop, connecting to the internet via your phone, your phone is obviously going to be within that range. Most servers have such slow connections or are used by so many people that a connection faster than 2Mbps doesn't make a difference (my broadband connection is 13Mbps, and I really don't notice the difference over 2Mbps). BTW, I only have a Touch, so doing wifi stuff with it is a bit pointless.
"I’m not even going to both responding to the comment that if my house is to big I shouldn’t be getting a T-mobile phone!" - You're completely misinterpreting that point, as I knew you would. My point is that most people don't have houses that are so large that the majority of the house is going to be outside bluetooth range - the distances over which I've achieved bluetooth connections have been surprising, and they can also undoubtedly be improved using several techniques.
"The point I was trying to make is that when available it’s better to use WiFi over 3G. i.e. at home and work I connect over WiFi, anywhere else I use GPRS or 3G." - No, you've missed my point again. My point is that, at least in the British Isles (I really don't know about other places), 3G is going to perform better due to lack of good broadband speeds at exchanges and distance from exchanges. As I said before, wifi may be fast, but it's the broadband speed that matters (unless you're accessing the local network, which you will not be most of the time).
Oh, and Rory, you always think I'm beaten, but you know that I kill people on details.

So on these phones that had wifi disabled, was it a hardware modification or just disabled in software?
I know the usual way to disable Wifi through software is to delete calibration and setup data in the WiFi chip. This can be reinstated if you have a path to direct connect to the wifi chip - either through OS or via baseband.
Was any effort made at all to try to enable wifi in those phones?

I don't really know, but from the way people have such strong feelings about it, I'd guess that it's a hardware modification. That does seem a bit extreme, but T-Mobile will have their reasons. Personally, I'd say that wifi disabled through software modification is a good feature - it would certainly provide many more hours of fun than having working wifi to begin with.

it was hardware, much like the disabled gps in the hermes.
disabled wifi by soft would be solved by a rom update
and yes, they tried to fix it [come on, its xda-developers, not xda-users lol]
Rory

Thats interesting, so they probably completly removed the WiFi chip itself.
I guess you could solder a new one in place, but thats alot of work

http://forum.xda-developers.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=35879&d=1174679272
that pic is of a mda compact III, and shows why theres no wifi, its because the antenna is missing...

Hmm, but you would still be able to enable it (after flashing the right rom/bootloader), but would probably get a really weak signal.
But i guess from that its not just the antenna, but the main chip too. It wouldnt be dificult (costly) in production to run a set of boards without that one chip.

exactly, but i think tmob prob lost a lot of custom to o2,seeing as msot palces have all the phone shops [at least here in the uk] so its easy enough to walk down the road to an o2 shop and get the exact same phone but with wifi...
so im saying its not gona have crippled wifi...
ill look around for proof
having looked for proof, i havet found any, but the tmobile netherlands site doesnt say wifi in specs, btu does say hsdpa, bluetooth 3mp cam and 4gb flash memory.
but....... when paul from modaco "stumbled upon the compact 4 specs at the mobile world congress" it had wifi in the specs
so still inconclusive
Rory

Battery life?

Dear all,
With a small 900mAh battery, What is the real world usage time? I mean making up to 2 hours of calls per day does it last at least 12hours before the need to recharge battery and this is assuming that 3G is on all the time. Thanks.

French network technical support say 60 hours with GPS on !!!!
I think it's joke.

Well, I've been watching the battery life on mine for a couple of days now in a reasonably scientific way and here are the early rather speculative results:
With just GPRS and nothing else on and very light use the battery drops from 100% to 80% very fast - less than an hour of light use.
Leaving it running on these settings will run it down to about 20% by the end of the working day - the drain seems to ease off aftert he first sharp drop
Powering up wifi and music for short time doesn't seem to make much difference.
Turning 3G on also doesn't seem to make the difference you would expect either.
So basically I would feel the need to take a charger with me if I left the house for the day, which will probably mean that I have to send the thing back. I've seen the coolsmartphone video review and mine isn't performing anything like that one - I would say I am loosing charge at about twice the rate.
Now the only issues that could be at work here is that I live in a lousy reception area. But could this really make such a difference?
What I would find really useful is a list of other tweaks you can make to cut power use so I can try them out. But at the end of the day it's looking like too many compromises would be needed to make this thing practical for me.

Reception would make a reasonable difference if normal network messages are being sent/received (general scans of BCCH channels, authentication with the network) - i.e. the radio isnt being used for data/voice, and only to keep registered to the network. But during those times the rest of the phone would also be in low power mode, so i would say an absolute max of 5 to 10%.
It would make a significant difference if you are transmiting data/making calls in a low reception area. I would say easily upto 20%.
It sounds to me like if you plan to use the phone much at all during the day you need a second battery. Then that turns into the hassle of how to charge the second battery every night, and i bet the desktop stand can't charge a second battery

My conclusions exactly. Impractical to say the least.
The puzzle then is why my last phone, a Nokia E51 with a 1050 mAh battery, under the same conditions, managed to last 2-3 days?
Is WM6 really that much of a power grabber compared to S60?

moonlanding said:
My conclusions exactly. Impractical to say the least.
The puzzle then is why my last phone, a Nokia E51 with a 1050 mAh battery, under the same conditions, managed to last 2-3 days?
Is WM6 really that much of a power grabber compared to S60?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Short answer - yes.
There's all these power saving features in new app processors like being able to leave the screen on while powering down the main CPU. You can use an interupt from the radio to wake up the processor etc.
Windows doesnt support half of these features, thats why find windows phones save all their power by turning the screen off. Other phones with screens just as big are alot less regimental about turning the screen off at any opertunity.
I was involved in a project once to design a smartphone and it was a really surprising how much difference there was between the windows version they suplied and an ARM version of linux.

I have HTC Touch Crouse and i have problems with battery (GPRS always on and Bluetooth) ... now with Diamond i have VERY BIG Problem. Battery Keeps less than one day ...

The experiment continues.
Disabling "GPRS auto attach" in Advanced Configuration Tool has made a big difference - still 90% after 6 hours now.
Now this is a surprise to me because I thought that you did this when you set the network seek to GSM only and not hunt for 3G. Or maybe I'm getting my GPRSs and GSMs mixed up...
Next step - leave this setting in place and turn push back on. Watch this space.

GSM digitises your voice and slots it into a time divided channel on a frequency, and marks it as voice. On the network side, it converts this back to voice and sends it on the PSTN network (for a landline call).
GPRS takes data you want to send and inserts it directly in the same time divided channel and marks it as data. On the network side the network transfers this onto the internet (or other network) through the GGSN (its essentially a router).
So GSM and GPRS use the same technology. Setting the phone to GSM only, just stops it connecting to 3g networks.
Anyway, when you turn your phone on, the tower tells it its capabilities eg GPRS. This give you a GPRS available icon. When you actually want to send data, you need to 'attach'. This is like logging into the network.
To do that you need to open a data channel and send your login details.
Normal phones will do that i.e. attach, and then go idle. The network will only log them off if they move to a new cell and do not reauthenticate.
Anyway, if you are not attached:
- When you send data, the phone will need to attach first (milliseconds delay) - unoticable.
- You will NOT have an IP address so incoming data can not reach you.
If you use pop3 with regular pull of email, it'll make less difference the more frequently you pull your email - because every time you do, the phone will attach.
If you use PUSH email, it'll make no difference because you have to remain attached (have an ip address) for push to work.
I'm sure most people didn't care to know all that but i'm sure some did!

Wow. Thanks. Impressive.
Let me try to summarise. With auto attach off the phone isn't trying to attach to the 3G network all the time which saves power. But it is also disconnected from GPRS and data networks. However this won't affect push email because it will attach when it needs to, ie when the network tells it that there is mail or I send something out. Is this right?
What about internet? Will the phone automatically attach to the data netowrks when I fire up Opera? Presumably to attach to 3G I will need to reset to automatically seek WCDMA.

moonlanding said:
Wow. Thanks. Impressive.
Let me try to summarise. With auto attach off the phone isn't trying to attach to the 3G network all the time which saves power. But it is also disconnected from GPRS and data networks. However this won't affect push email because it will attach when it needs to, ie when the network tells it that there is mail or I send something out. Is this right?
What about internet? Will the phone automatically attach to the data netowrks when I fire up Opera? Presumably to attach to 3G I will need to reset to automatically seek WCDMA.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're still a bit confused i think. Ok on a phone you have voice or data. Data covers mail, internet, weather updates etc etc, voice covers phone calls.
There are two distinct protocols here, and we need to talk about them diferently...
GSM:
With GSM calls are sent over 1 timeslot and singalled as voice.
To make a call you need to have a signal, that takes a very short few messages which are sent every 20 minutes or so, or if you move around between towers. The Radio in the phone can do this all by itself without waking the phone up.
If you want to send ANY data (emails, internet, anything) you need to use GPRS. GPRS uses the same channels but inserts data into them instead of voice. Before you can send or receive any data you need to 'login' to the network. To login you need to actually open the channel and make a connection. Logging in is called 'ataching'. When you attach you get an IP address and the network can send stuff to you and u can send stuff to the network. Attaching needs to wake up the phone.
Once attached the phone can go into a sleep mode saving power, but any data send or received will wake up the phone.
UMTS/3G
UMTS is different in that everything is sent code divided. There is no 'login' or attach as such. In this mode all your voice gets converted to data and sent across.
---
With auto attach on:
If you use 3G mode, every time you switch between a 3G and GPRS area the phone will atach (GPRS) again, this will drain power.
Every time you move out of GPRS and come back into GPRS the phone will attach, even if you have nothing to send.
With autoattach off:
The phone will only attach if it has something to send AND is on GPRS (no 3G available or 3g turned off)
The upside is that you save power when you move between cells. The downside is that you can't receive any data from the network untill you decide to attach.
For push email for example you would never end up detaching as it would hold the connection open.
Anyway i hope that clear, but i'm quite sleepy so it might not make any sense lol

That makes sense to me. When I get my Touch Diamond, I'm definitely turning 'GPRS auto attach' off, because I don't think I need it on.

someone1234 that`s really useful info.I guess autoattach off is the best option for me too. WHEN the phone arrives.

Thanks again senior1234. I'm getting there. But this is more complex that I thought so I've gone back and checked what really makes a difference to the battery life.
The big difference for me is having the phone band set to GSM only (phone, options). Disabling auto attach makes a difference but not as much as I thought. I had changed both of them at the same time, thinking that they were more or less the same thing. Sorry folks. Very unscientific.
But if you feel like trying these bear in mind that I don't move between cells very much and have awful reception. I'll leave it to others to explain whether this is important.

HTC told me that with the screen on full brightness and phone turned on the GPS would only last about 2 hours befre the battery died, looks like we'll need the extended battery or several normal ones!

moonlanding said:
Thanks again senior1234. I'm getting there. But this is more complex that I thought so I've gone back and checked what really makes a difference to the battery life.
The big difference for me is having the phone band set to GSM only (phone, options). Disabling auto attach makes a difference but not as much as I thought. I had changed both of them at the same time, thinking that they were more or less the same thing. Sorry folks. Very unscientific.
But if you feel like trying these bear in mind that I don't move between cells very much and have awful reception. I'll leave it to others to explain whether this is important.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
GSM will use alot less power, so that is whats definatly making the difference
Why? Well.. GSM uses time division, which means the phones in an area take turns 'speaks'/'listening' with the tower. This ensures that no two phones are talking at the same time, and the tower can 'hear' what was sent. Because of this the power the phone transmits with can be controlled to be just high enough for the tower to listen, but not too high as to waste battery.
The down side of this scheme is that even if a phone has nothing to 'say', the other phones will wait in case it does. This means you're wasting bandwidth - or time that could be used by another phone to send data. Bottom line, data throughput is slower!
With 3G, all phones can talk at the same time. The data they send is tagged with a code, so that the data doesnt get mixed up. The advantage here is no time is wasted waiting for phones that may have nothing to send. The down side is that you need to be 'talking' loud enough to 'talk' over other people sending. This is why the data rate over 3G drops off really rapidly as you move away from the tower.
The disadvantages are a phone far from the tower using 3G will use more power than one using GSM because its having to 'talk' louder to get over other phones 'talking'.
Also, signals that get lost because they were drowned out by other phones have to be retransmited, which doesnt happen with GSM as much.
Yeah 3G or CDMA based channel access methods are a real power hog!
As for Auto attach you would expect it to only make a real difference if you have programs holding channels open.
With regards to low reception, it will make a significant difference because power disipation is not linear. Like all radiation it follows the inverse square law. For every meter distance the power drops of by a square of the distance.

Don't forget, when comparing uptime with other phones, with the diamond you have 4x the amount of pixels. VGA (640 x 480) devices will always chew up more Battery that QVGA (320 x 240) . This is one of the main reasons that HTC and the others delayed shipping VGA devices until now.
If you want longer battery life, you are going to have to stop using the display so often.
There is no way a vga machine can compete with a qvga machine on battery life... when all other factors are equal.

I think if you discount 3G, the battery is a little too small for the phone. With 3G its wholy inadequate.
The screen does make a huge difference, but these screens are more efficient, and HTC have used every opertunity to turn the screen off - a bit excessivly if you look at how fast it turns off when you make a call.
I don't understand why they don't use the iphone method of turning it off when the light sensor shows its dark (in a call).. i.e. the earpiece is next to your head!

moonlanding said:
The experiment continues.
Disabling "GPRS auto attach" in Advanced Configuration Tool has made a big difference - still 90% after 6 hours now.
Now this is a surprise to me because I thought that you did this when you set the network seek to GSM only and not hunt for 3G. Or maybe I'm getting my GPRSs and GSMs mixed up...
Next step - leave this setting in place and turn push back on. Watch this space.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've disabled gprs auto attach and set my band to GSM. When i connect to net with opera will it still turn on 3G etc?

nokmond said:
I've disabled gprs auto attach and set my band to GSM. When i connect to net with opera will it still turn on 3G etc?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
good question.
i only use my phone for normal phone stuff ans sometimes for some internet browsing.
should i turn anything on or off?

Worried!!

Hi Peeps,
i use the internet quite frequently on my diamond... but i'm always worried about the data connection still being on after i finished surfing...
how do i make sure that the data connection is completely off once i finish surfing the net? i dont want to occur data charges for hours and hours??
thanks

????
If you can afford it get a unlimited data plan....or put on schap's advanced config tool and you can set up a timer....pm me if you more help.
Peace
Mike

I believe the data connection can be on 24/7 and its OK. As long as its not 'active' i.e. not transferring data to or from the device.
The whole idea of GPRS, 3G, HSDPA is that they are always on... but not charging unless being used.
When active you have the animated double arrows showing data transfer... check the manual for the task bar icons to see. This is the same with all connection types (except bluetooth).

joemax said:
I believe the data connection can be on 24/7 and its OK. As long as its not 'active' i.e. not transferring data to or from the device.
The whole idea of GPRS, 3G, HSDPA is that they are always on... but not charging unless being used.
When active you have the animated double arrows showing data transfer... check the manual for the task bar icons to see. This is the same with all connection types (except bluetooth).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Correct.
It gets a bit tricky with newer devices, however, if you don't have an unlimited plan because there's almost always something running in the background (weather updates, email polling, GPS download etc) unless you make an effort to stop each of them from initiating a connection. The best way to enjoy what a device like the Diamond has to offer is with an unlimited data package.

Which unlimited plan do you use in Egypt, mkhattab?

it take more battery life like this if it stell on guys !
rafter_01:
if you want to stop it completely jast prass the E or H icons on the upper bar and then press disconnect
it will stop the connection completely

joemax said:
The whole idea of GPRS, 3G, HSDPA is that they are always on... but not charging unless being used.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not always. There are quite a few ****ty networks in europe and other places that still use the old 'per minute' charging model on GPRS networks as well.
For people stuck with these bastards, it is worth having a timer somewhere to automatically kill the connection. but mkhattab is right. When i had the diamond from work, even with the timer set, it never disconnected even with push mail turned off, so it seems that they send out some sort of keep alive maybe?

Use Skschema to setup a script (they have examples you can copy/use as a tutorial - quite easy) to run an auto shutdown of 3G/GPRS every x minutes of the day, every xth day of the week/month etc.
link http://s-k-tools.com/?skschema/m_skschema.html.
I've tested it with Activesync and it appeared to work very well for the week's trial, I had.

MaroO said:
Which unlimited plan do you use in Egypt, mkhattab?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
MaroO-> I actually live in Dubai (from Egypt though)

You could try modaco NoData:
Hope It's ok to post this here, I know it is often included in roms. I have not used it at all on my Diamond, but it worked well for me in the past.

mkhattab said:
MaroO-> I actually live in Dubai (from Egypt though)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hey mkhattab, which data plan do you use in Dubai though cause i am too based in Dubai.... Cheers...

whitefalcon said:
Hey mkhattab, which data plan do you use in Dubai though cause i am too based in Dubai.... Cheers...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I work for the operator (du) and am on the employee plan so...

EDGE/GPRS/3G Questions/Issues/Info

This might be a silly question, but does anyone know if the G1 will be able to access the web if you live in an area where 3G is not available yet? I live north of Los Angeles (who has 3G) in Bakersfield and we don't have it yet. I am hoping that I was not an idiot to preorder the phone and then not be able to use all the cool web features.
Thanks in advance,
Jamie

it should still work on the EDGE network

From my understanding it will work with GPRS, Edge, and 3g so you shouldn't have any problems bro by the way I understand the concern.

With a 1150ma battery, GPS, "big" screen etc, 3G will just drain the battery even quicker.
I will not worry about 3G until an extended battery is released- and the fact that 3G will not be in my market for a year of so.

aad4321 said:
Hey guys i have a htc wing now, and it does not have a gps. It looks like the gps for this phone is one of the main highlights, because it uses it for a lot of applications. Does anyone know what the gps strength will be like? Will it work will in a building, it do i have the be in direct light for like ten minuites to get a signal?
Anyone with a htc device with a gps already, does it work well?
I hear the android is a-gps, so mabye it will have the ability to somewhat work well when in a pocket, or building.....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Time for a lesson on GPS... It uses satellites in the sky, and you need a view of a certain amount of satellites to find your location (4 will find you but not very accurately, the more the better). If you're in a building, and not right next to a window, no GPS will ever find your location, ever. That's like asking if your internet will work if the ethernet cable is unplugged from the back of your computer and you don't have wifi, it goes against the entire idea of how it functions.
Now, as for the quality of the HTC GPS receiver... People have complained about GPS lag, but I maintain my opinion that it's completely software related, my Fuze had none whatsoever. You don't need to be in sunlight, just have enough clear sky that it can get a reading from the satellites. I've taken trips with the Fuze even on very cloudy days and it took a little longer to get a lock (5-10 mins, it locks in like 30 seconds to a minute with clear skies) but once it had my position, it stayed true. All of the upcoming HTC devices use A-GPS, by the way. Diamond, Touch Pro, Xperia, G1...

aad4321 said:
WHAAAT? you dont want to use 3g? lol in my opinion thats 50 percent of the phones features.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
He's using the battery draining as an excuse, something to keep him from pulling his hair out because he won't have 3G for another year. Anyone who's used a phone for data features on both networks knows EDGE doesn't hold a candle to 3G.
As for the original post, yes, it will give you all of the same data features on EDGE as on 3G.

The big thing with A-GPS is that it's mainly used to increase the startup speed of your GPS. Instead of waiting 10 minutes to download the almanac of the satellites in the sky from the GPS sats, it downloads the data over your data connection, using the basis of which cell site you're connected to for determining your rough location. This way it only takes about 30 seconds to get a fix instead of much longer.
The sensitivity of the GPS on phones has been fairly good as far as i've seen on devices like the Tilt and such, so I don't see why a phone with such a heavy emphasis on location-based apps would have a sub-par GPS setup. Here's hoping things work well.

Black93300ZX said:
He's using the battery draining as an excuse, something to keep him from pulling his hair out because he won't have 3G for another year. Anyone who's used a phone for data features on both networks knows EDGE doesn't hold a candle to 3G.
As for the original post, yes, it will give you all of the same data features on EDGE as on 3G.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks to one and all!!! I am looking forward to my G1 and retiring my Wing.

Black93300ZX said:
He's using the battery draining as an excuse, something to keep him from pulling his hair out because he won't have 3G for another year. Anyone who's used a phone for data features on both networks knows EDGE doesn't hold a candle to 3G.
As for the original post, yes, it will give you all of the same data features on EDGE as on 3G.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
3g doesnt burn that much battery unless your using it constantly like as a primary internet for your computer. also when you put your phone in sleep mode it isnt runnig in the background

haitiankid4lyf said:
3g doesnt burn that much battery unless your using it constantly like as a primary internet for your computer. also when you put your phone in sleep mode it isnt runnig in the background
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Exactly... But when you're without 3G, I guess you try to justify why it's not as good, and that's what he came up with. It's like everything though, people on here try to justify why the iPhone isn't as good as the Diamond/Touch Pro, truth be told it's better in many aspects but comes short in many as well.

3g data transfer?
ok i currently have the tmo wing.. and i can connect my lappy to the tmo data network via usb port.. will i be able to do this with the g1?yes/no maybe?

iife_aint_easy said:
ok i currently have the tmo wing.. and i can connect my lappy to the tmo data network via usb port.. will i be able to do this with the g1?yes/no maybe?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I choose D... all of the above
No... it will not work out of the box.
Yes/maybe... it should work someday soon unless HTC/T-Mobile have somehow disabled that ability in hardware.
As soon as I get the phone I will be working on it on the Linux side (not an actual internet sharing app... more of a route/iptables script) and I am sure someone will work on a java solution (although a kernel solution would be faster). There was an application for the iPhone that provided internet sharing but it was banned from apple store and Google has said they won't do that so I think it should be here soon.

problems with Wireless (3g and wifi)
does anybody else have problems with the 3g?
i have tmobile and i didnt select the option for only 2g but my 3g keeps going in and out even when im in the same spot it'll go from 3g to Edge for no reason.
also does anybody have problem conecting to wifi?
i have a linksys wireless n (WRT300N) router, the ssid is visible and uts using wep security but when ever i try to connect to it it says out of range or it just stops trying to connect Please Help

haitiankid4lyf said:
does anybody else have problems with the 3g?
i have tmobile and i didnt select the option for only 2g but my 3g keeps going in and out even when im in the same spot it'll go from 3g to Edge for no reason.
also does anybody have problem conecting to wifi?
i have a linksys wireless n (WRT300N) router, the ssid is visible and uts using wep security but when ever i try to connect to it it says out of range or it just stops trying to connect Please Help
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have an issue with my G1 WIFI connection. If i broadcast my SSID I connect with no problems. but if i disable the broadcast it will not connect, and this is with me manually putting in the connections into the phone.
I called TMobile but they said i needed to call HTC. they didn't have a solution.
BTW, I have no WEP enabled. I just disable the SSID broadcast.

I just connected to my Linksys router with WPA2 and had 3G running, connected no problem.

Haitiankid: try entering the details of your network manually and seeing if it will connect then. Also, as for the 3G fading in and out, are you in a week signal area for 3G?

wifi working
I got my wifi to work. It was my routers fault. What I did was in went into my routers settings by typing 192.168.1.1 and entered 'admin' (no quotes) and no password. Once in my settings I changed my brocasting type from b&g mixed to all mixed changed frequency to auto, changed network key from shared to open and wifi started working. I don't know if all those steps were neccesary but it worked for me. Hope it works for some else.
As for the 3g it seems to be getting better

for those of you with the 3g/edge switching problem...
Hey, if uve got the 3g switching to edge back and forth continuously, its likely because you didnt get a new SIM card when u got the g1. It simply means you have an old SIM card that doesnt support 3g well, call tmobile up tell them your situation, theyve given most people a free new SIM card thats more compatible.

drewernxc said:
Hey, if uve got the 3g switching to edge back and forth continuously, its likely because you didnt get a new SIM card when u got the g1. It simply means you have an old SIM card that doesnt support 3g well, call tmobile up tell them your situation, theyve given most people a free new SIM card thats more compatible.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't think that's the case. I've had the same SIM card since 2000, no problems like this. If any SIM is too old to support 3G, I'd think one made 8 years ago would definitely be the case.
It sounds like he's in a bad coverage area, which could be lots of things. There is a coverage map on the T-Mo website, don't know if it shows 3G. Or it could be the building he's in. My phones have never worked at my grandmother's house. I get full bars on the front porch, and full bars the second I get out the back door, but no signal in the house itself. Even relatives on other networks get little to no coverage inside the house. Probably the really really old insulation and building materials are blocking the signal. At my last apartment I only had a good signal on the corner of my bed, and that disappeared when new neighbors moved in upstairs.
These are radio waves, which aren't foolproof or perfect, they encounter all kinds of interference. Nothings going to be as secure and consistant as a wired connection. Nature of the beast, unfortunately.

haitiankid4lyf said:
I got my wifi to work. It was my routers fault. What I did was in went into my routers settings by typing 192.168.1.1 and entered 'admin' (no quotes) and no password. Once in my settings I changed my brocasting type from b&g mixed to all mixed changed frequency to auto, changed network key from shared to open and wifi started working. I don't know if all those steps were neccesary but it worked for me. Hope it works for some else.
As for the 3g it seems to be getting better
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Careful dude, with the security set to open anyone within range (neighbors, wardrivers, etc.) can use your wifi to get on the internet. Try using WPA or WPA2 security, but leaving it all mixed and frequency at auto.

[Q][UPDATED] Big issues on ATT's network?

Now, you may know me for having immense troubles with my network connection speed, reaching .06Mbps (60Kbps) down and rendering my phone's wireless internet unusable, regardless of ROM, modem, or any real variables.
After a new SIM card from ATT and a few lucky Master Clears (where it worked after each session for roughly one hour before locking up again), I think I may have found the cause...Or so I thought. IP addresses weren't the culprit.
What is awkward, however, is that my EDGE service now works, and it's faster than my 3G service. On EDGE, my internet is 3 times faster than that of 3G, again still poor, but an improvement nonetheless. Thus, I've concluded that it's an issue with 3G and either my cell network or my phone's 3G cell chip.
How could I go about diagnosing this issue? I want my 3G service back... I have changed modems several times, and switching ROMs doesn't do anything. Anything I can flash, use Service Mode, etc, I'm game for. I don't want to keep throwing money at ATT if I can't use the service.
EDIT: Signature is showing my current internet speeds over HSUPA. HELP!

Aus_Azn said:
Now, you may know me for having immense troubles with my network connection speed, reaching .06Mbps (60Kbps) down and rendering my phone's wireless internet unusable, regardless of ROM, modem, or any real variables.
After a new SIM card from ATT and a few lucky Master Clears (where it worked after each session for roughly one hour before locking up again), I think I may have found the cause.
On ATT's network, one is authenticated with an IP address, as you may know. This is reflected in SpeedTest.net's plank for "External IP" in the results browser.
When I was getting real download speeds (my standard HSUPA rated 5.1Mbps down, 1.7Mbps up), my phone is connected to an IPv4 address beginning with "166.199.xxx.xxx". On UMTS (where I would get anywhere between 1.6-3.4Mbps down, 1.6Mbps up), the phone is also connected to "166.199.xxx.xxx". On 2G with decent speeds, I would get the same results yet again.
However, over the past week or so (since the 16th of January), I have gotten craptastic download speeds of .06Mbps and equally lousy upload speeds of .11Mbps. I just realised that in these cases (which happen after using the phone for roughly 45 minutes after a Master Clear and permanently stay that way), my phone is connected through a "32.16x.xxx.xxx" IP address.
What does this mean? How can I force it to stay on the "166" IP/network? ATT has been of no assistance, whatsoever, so I call for your help, XDA community!
EDIT: Sometimes, I think I'm being too technical in detail because nobody ever responds, but I just don't see this going in the Android Development board.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You are assuming that all of those IP addresses are routable through whatever network you are connected to. Perhaps there are some "crappy" towers connected to a piece of the network that sucks and you happen to hop around onto them?
Either way, why not just set the adapter manually using ifconfig to test your theory?
http://www.manpagez.com/man/8/ifconfig/
( Yes, I am a crusty unix administrator that would prefer for you to RTFM )

z28james said:
You are assuming that all of those IP addresses are routable through whatever network you are connected to. Perhaps there are some "crappy" towers connected to a piece of the network that sucks and you happen to hop around onto them?
Either way, why not just set the adapter manually using ifconfig to test your theory?
http://www.manpagez.com/man/8/ifconfig/
( Yes, I am a crusty unix administrator that would prefer for you to RTFM )
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hm, this didn't work, speeds didn't change and I found that it's band-dependent; 32.xxx.xxx.xxx is just the 850 band for my area, while 166.xxx.xxx.xxx is the 1900 one. However, using EDGE now works since meddling with it, so I can at least reduce this to a 3G specific issue. Any pointers?