just FYI not sure if anyone has seen this douche bag. appears he is making a nice living off of your guys' hard work. i think this user should be made an example of. anyone with any ideas?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=250421549454
yeah he is making a killing selling those.
Probably hasn't sold any, but I reported.
derekwilkinson said:
Probably hasn't sold any, but I reported.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Check his feedback profile..
You'll weep when you see how many CDs he sold for 50 pop EACH!!!
derekwilkinson said:
Probably hasn't sold any, but I reported.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ya nearly all his feedback ratings are from $50 a pop on that cd. he's got over 150 positive feedbacks. i also reported prior to the original thread posting cuz thats just wrong imo.
yes Im danielmex_83
jajaja i sent him a message wanna see it? hahaha just for fun you know!
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there are many people that loves everything easy... even if it cost 50 bucks.
Thats insane. I can't even begin to imagine the people that have been scammed out of 50 bucks for stuff that is completely free. And no credit to those that developed the software. Shame
He answers me!
HAHAHAHAH well I ask him if he can shipp the cd to the bermudas triangle!
he answers...
hahaha didnt you live on Mexico? hahahaha god damn! this guy is so funny!
I sent a question as to why he sells things that are free to find, he replied with:
"I charge mainly for the tutorial and personal assistance. I throw in all the apps, etc. in as a bonus. I have donated to the programmers and it took hours and hours of how to figure this stuff out and what to install first, etc."
I don't think there's much wrong with this, although AUD$60 is a bit much and I disagree with "All of these games, apps and themes are easily worth over $800" as they are (mostly) free.
I think we need some of the opinions of the devs who's software is on this CD.
^^^ Well he is not lying, he is NOT scamming anyone. I mean, yea he makes money off this, but he has just taken all the effort we enjoy, playing around with stuff... some users just want to have everything handed to them, and with support AU$60 is pretty good if I were non-geek.
He is noy doing anything illegal, I think some ppl are jealous? report? for what?
I've seen ppl sell freeware before, it is not illegal if he is adding something beneficial to the sale (his tuts and support).
I don't hate, but that's just me!
Is it over priced.. YES, is it a scam... NO! Is it wrong.. Maybe... Is it illegal... NO!
But it goes against an unwritten code, but thats it.
If i offered a service to install MS Office 2007 and tech support it for 3mths for 50 bucks, nothing wrong with that... right? Software vendors LIVE off this 'support'.
Anyway, it has broken a code and I see where you guys are pissed, but reporting? c'mon get over it.
aaron11193 said:
I sent a question as to why he sells things that are free to find, he replied with:
"I charge mainly for the tutorial and personal assistance. I throw in all the apps, etc. in as a bonus. I have donated to the programmers and it took hours and hours of how to figure this stuff out and what to install first, etc."
I don't think there's much wrong with this, although AUD$60 is a bit much and I disagree with "All of these games, apps and themes are easily worth over $800" as they are (mostly) free.
I think we need some of the opinions of the devs who's software is on this CD.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think what he is doing is partly illegal, at least in reference to s2u, on the page of A_C it's stated directly under freeware licence "You are NOT allowed to make a charge for distributing this Software whether as a stand-alone product, or as part of a compilation or anthology, without explicit prior written permission." Probably there is something similar about other apps/games on the CD, at least I could imagine Microsoft and google are providing something similar. Whether he donated to the programmers or not don't changes anything about his permissions applying there software.
x86 said:
^^^ Well he is not lying, he is NOT scamming anyone. I mean, yea he makes money off this, but he has just taken all the effort we enjoy, playing around with stuff... some users just want to have everything handed to them, and with support AU$60 is pretty good if I were non-geek.
He is noy doing anything illegal, I think some ppl are jealous? report? for what?
I've seen ppl sell freeware before, it is not illegal if he is adding something beneficial to the sale (his tuts and support).
I don't hate, but that's just me!
Is it over priced.. YES, is it a scam... NO! Is it wrong.. Maybe... Is it illegal... NO!
But it goes against an unwritten code, but thats it.
If i offered a service to install MS Office 2007 and tech support it for 3mths for 50 bucks, nothing wrong with that... right? Software vendors LIVE off this 'support'.
Anyway, it has broken a code and I see where you guys are pissed, but reporting? c'mon get over it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi everybody, and thanks x86 for not posting like drdrew and Que. I have been selling these disks and guess what? I am not the first or the last to do it. I bought an HTC phone and wanted to make it cool like the stuff I found on the internet for FREE. However, I had NO clue of how to do it. I didn't know you had to install NETCFsetup35 first. I didn't know you had to install Batteryand Performance Hack, then SDKcerts, then finix, etc in THAT order. These are things that took a while to learn how to do. I couldn't find a thread on what, how or when to do these things and I am pretty computer literate. Someone else was selling the phones with the programs on them first and I decided I would write an easy to understand tutorial and sell my own disks so others could enjoy. This is called free enterprise.
I don't and never have taken credit for anyone's work and have donated to the sites I have gone to and talked with a few of the programmers. Bongsu has awesome themes and I have donated to vicotts site after he said that's where the money should go. I donated to XDA. PPCgeeks as well. Have I talked to all of them? No. I could take ALL the apps, themes and games off and the tutorial I created is worth it alone. Not only that, but many of my customers have had to call me and ask for support. I have spent hours on the phone helping some people who are completely computer illiterate step by step to make their phones so fun and cool. I offer the disks at $50 with a Best Offer option as well. Some people buy for $40 and some for $35. x86, It's not overpriced when you consider the support. Just like you said, companies make a TON of money on support. I was just offered the great deal of $129.99 from Dell to help me resolve a ONE-time issue with my computer. Support costs money.
I guarantee if you ask any of the people who have bought the disk, not a one of them feels scammed. Why would they? I talk them through it to help them. The tutorial is very easy to understand but some people are not savvy. Actually, I have had many of my customers tell me I am not charging enough! That's no joke. I started at $24.99 and was told over and over I was charging too LITTLE! Why would any programmer be upset as there programs are on more phones? That's why they are created; to have fun and make phones look cool. But there was nobody to help me and many others understand HOW to do it!
The people buying these disks have seen many of the programs on the internet and know they are out there for free, yet they still buy my tutorial. I include the urls to PPCgeeks and XDA in my tutorial as well as other sites. That way they can then do it for themselves after they learn how to do it from me the FIRST time.
I simply sold what most people like, the easy route. And I just thought it would be cool to put a bunch of programs on the disk to get these people started! All the things I have put on that disk are found on the internet for FREE, Except for TWO things; my tutorial and phone support. I charge for that. If you have a problem with that, you are free to feel that way. If you want to pay my cell phone bill, let me know. But the fact is, nobody who has purchased this disk has come back to say they want their money back. I have 100% feedback. That should tell you something.
Edit: If someone wants to contact me, feel free to do so but name calling and insults are childish.
Want to Clear Things Up said:
Edit: If someone wants to contact me, feel free to do so but name calling and insults are childish.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This account has been banned for being a sock-puppet.
Please use your real account "Sho'nuff" for replying to questions like these Roy.
EqX
Thanks Equinox
Its been a while since i have see you on wizard forums, jejeje long time ago i think since manilla 2d comes to town, thanks for let us know that this guy, maybe a memeber from here makes a new user saying want to clear thinks up... want? or wish i could? moron!
Im so angry about this! Really. but what can i win? nothing but healty decrease so lets over this situation.
Well this guy contacts me telling me ebay has some policy's and dont allow to post the logo! well i will edit only... my... Screenshots... and post the screenshot of his PM to me.
To let you know how this guys operate his dirty tricks i mean is not illegal no no no i know I know if he wants to earn some bucks showing his ass on the street please make it where nobody can see you, is immoral!
well here you go (just to have truth on my words)
wanna the reply here it is...
Want to Clear Things Up said:
You know, I would appreciate you taking down your posts. I answered your questions honestly and did nothing wrong to you. eBay also has a strict policy of using their logos and posting private emails on a public thread. I think if you read my email on this thread, you will see what I offer is a tutorial and personal assistance and am not scamming or hurting anyone. You have your right to say you don't like it and that's fine, but again, I would appreciate you taking down the screen shots.
Also, if you look on eBay, you will see there have been others who have done it. There is someone else selling a disk right now and someone selling a phone with the programs on it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
OK! its fine for me, but only if you go to the forum where you saw that screenshoots and post this same words... if you dont do it i will, then, i will edit my posts, I think the administrator of this site will be happy with this agreement.
Cheers dude! see you later.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Dont support this kind of people they never will have sense of good things or bad things, be smart guys be more than this guys, learn more and more you will love this machines, really and can support the learning growing up this lazy mankind we are turning into.
+ Que PPC
+ Que PPC said:
Its been a while since i have see you on wizard forums, jejeje long time ago i think since manilla 2d comes to town, thanks for let us know that this guy, maybe a memeber from here makes a new user saying want to clear thinks up... want? or wish i could? moron!
Im so angry about this! Really. but what can i win? nothing but healty decrease so lets over this situation.
Well this guy contacts me telling me ebay has some policy's and dont allow to post the logo! well i will edit only... my... Screenshots... and post the screenshot of his PM to me.
To let you know how this guys operate his dirty tricks i mean is not illegal no no no i know I know if he wants to earn some bucks showing his ass on the street please make it where nobody can see you, is immoral!
well here you go (just to have truth on my words)
wanna the reply here it is...
Dont support this kind of people they never will have sense of good things or bad things, be smart guys be more than this guys, learn more and more you will love this machines, really and can support the learning growing up this lazy mankind we are turning into.
+ Que PPC
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I may as well write this on the public forum since it seems you are the dirty one who cannot keep a private conversation private. Also, I created the other name so people wouldn't flood my regular email so I created a new email and name for that. But guess what? Not a single email has come to me with a problem or insults. Actually, I got an email from someone on this thread telling me I did a great job explaining.
And by the way, your screenshots still show eBay licensed information. Your posting of a private email on a public forum doesn't go over well either. I will ask you to remove them again. XDA is a great site and doesn't need trouble because of your posts.
Hey Ben, I mean Equinox, you should do the right thing and take down the screenshots if Mr. Que here doesn't decide to. Or should I just contact the administrator?
I find it quite funny you come on here using words like moron and how angry this makes you when in reality you have not created any of these programs. Maybe it's possible you're jealous that you don't have the common sense to write a tutorial and offer support to folks who want their phones to have these great features and at the same time turn a little profit? Not all people who buy these phones know anything about these apps, themes and games. I was a first time Win Mo user and had NO idea about this stuff. Try to look at the positive aspect. Many more people know about these great things and HOW TO INSTALL them. That's what you're not getting. You seem to think the people who bought this disk are lazy. No, they are not as computer savvy as some of us are. They need help. And when I went to forums to find out stuff, it was SO much info to take in that I just about said forget it. And I wasn't sure about viruses or what to install or what needed to be installed, etc.
I have 13 sent messages in my outbox from March that I sent to people asking for help when I first joined this site. Guess how many answered? ZERO. I finally found someone who helped me, and it wasn't from this site, and then I took off from there. It's not lazy QUE, but I think you know that. Or maybe you don't. How did YOU come to learn how to do these things? How did most people on these forums? They are either IT's, creators, real computer savvy or got help from someone. Well, I am one who waited about a month after getting my phone to finally find someone to help me.
So I decided to offer assistance to other people which includes phone support. Do you have a cell phone QUE? Do you pay your own bill? They're not free, are they? Also, you never mentioned the fact that I have donated and talked with some of the actual programmers. No, you seem to just listen to what you want and write what will incite others.
And the fact is, people were doing this BEFORE me, selling phones with all the programs on them for $500 when I bought my phone back in March. I didn't need another phone, I just needed to learn how to get the programs. So that's what I offered to others. And to be able to actually call me and I would walk them through it step by step. Read the feedback and you will see that. There was another guy selling the disks before me and ALL he had on them was apps and themes and games and no phone support. People came to me because they needed help. Too bad you only look at the negative and try to paint me as a bad person. The people who bought my disk don't think so and love these forums.
That's a whole other realm you don't even realize. I have sold a few of these disks and that means, a whole new group of people have come to these sites, like XDA and PPCGeeks and likely have donated to get a new theme, etc. or have contributed in some other way. And it also brings in more clicks to these sites. Did you know that or even think about that?
I have been truthful and can walk away from this with my head up high as I know I have helped so many other people. I don't post private messages, I don't use childish insults. I came here to try to set the record straight. I believe I have done so. Obviously not with you Que, but that's okay. People will always disagree in this world.
What I don't understand, is why so many people without a vested interest in this, are getting so worked up about it. What this guy did was very enterprising, very illegal, but very enterprising.
It is not up to anyone but the developers of the apps, to go after this guy. If you go by the feedback alone, he has sold $7500 worth of other peoples work. That is not chump change.
The courts have been very clear on this, most recently with music sampling. If you sample someone elses music on your rap CD, be prepared to pay. Record companies have already had to pay big bucks for artists who have been caught sampling on their CDs. This is nothing more than sampling.
Being a semi-professional writer, I will also say that one does not need to professionally copyright his work in order for the court to side with the original publisher against someone trying to profit from their work. How many times do you see people suing songwriters and screenwriters for stealing ideas , thoughts and passages. Many times the courts have sided with, and movie companies have been forced to settle with, people who have proved that an idea was originally theirs, even without an " official " copyright.
Trying to prove that he wasn't selling the apps, just the instruction and support, is very shaky legal ground indeed. But it is up to the original publishers of the programs to sue for their share of the profits, I hardly think it is worthwhile for us to bicker about it.
denco7 said:
What I don't understand, is why so many people without a vested interest in this, are getting so worked up about it. What this guy did was very enterprising, very illegal, but very enterprising.
It is not up to anyone but the developers of the apps, to go after this guy. If you go by the feedback alone, he has sold $7500 worth of other peoples work. That is not chump change.
The courts have been very clear on this, most recently with music sampling. If you sample someone elses music on your rap CD, be prepared to pay. Record companies have already had to pay big bucks for artists who have been caught sampling on their CDs. This is nothing more than sampling.
Being a semi-professional writer, I will also say that one does not need to professionally copyright his work in order for the court to side with the original publisher against someone trying to profit from their work. How many times to you see people sueing songwriters and screenwriters for stealing ideas , thoughts and passages. Many times the courts have sided with, and movie companies have been forced to settle with people who have proved that an idea was origanally theirs, even without an " official " copyright.
Trying to prove that he wasn't selling the apps, just the instruction and support, is very shaky legal ground indeed. But it is up to the original publishers of the programs to sue for their share of the profits, I hardly think it is worthwhile for us to bicker about it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Dude, your math is way off. I sold some HTC phones too, so maybe that's how you added about $6,000 wrong lol. I sold maybe 40 CD's and many people didn't even pay $50. I let some go for as little as $25. You also didn't include how muh eBay and Paypal take out for their fees. As far as illegal, most of the developers say if you want to share, include the url where it came from. I also donated to those programmers.
But I did agree with you on the fact that it was enterprising, thanks. My tutorial is what sold. My personal assistance is what sold. If you read the feedback you will see that. These people now have the ammo to search and find more and know HOW to do it.
pablo96 said:
I think what he is doing is partly illegal, at least in reference to s2u, on the page of A_C it's stated directly under freeware licence "You are NOT allowed to make a charge for distributing this Software whether as a stand-alone product, or as part of a compilation or anthology, without explicit prior written permission." Probably there is something similar about other apps/games on the CD, at least I could imagine Microsoft and google are providing something similar. Whether he donated to the programmers or not don't changes anything about his permissions applying there software.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I completely agree. I think if a wrote a small tutorial on Firefox and packaged it with firefox 3 and sold it on ebay for $50, it would be quite an issue. This is no different. Just because you're dealing with an individual's product instead of a corporation doesn't give you the right to package it without there permission, when they intended for it to be free, and sell it for money. This would be PERFECTLY FINE if he was selling tutorials for the products, noting that they are 100% free applications, and that you are being charged for the tutorials. However, leading people to believe that they are getting a great deal on tons of apps is awful and dishonest.
Sho'nuff said:
......
As far as illegal, most of the developers say if you want to share, include the url where it came from. I also donated to those programmers.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
you said MOST, not ALL., can you see the difference?
But I did agree with you on the fact that it was enterprising, thanks. My tutorial is what sold. My personal assistance is what sold. If you read the feedback you will see that. These people now have the ammo to search and find more and know HOW to do it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You are not advertising your personal assistance, you are advertising the applications.
See the difference?
So yes, you are ILLEGALLY selling software (freeware) from which is known that the authors (like A_C) don't want to be redistributed.
As far as "personal assistance" goes, well I have read into your posts, you are far from an expert on Windows Mobile to say at least.
I am closing this thread before any valued (actually contributing) senior member is going to cross the line and have to face punitive actions.
As for you, since you obviously ignore this:
S2U2, S2P & S2V are being distributed as Freeware. It may be freely used, copied and distributed as long as it is not sold, and all original files are included, including this license. You are NOT allowed to make a charge for distributing this Software whether as a stand-alone product, or as part of a compilation or anthology, without explicit prior written permission.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
, actions against you are being taken.
Regards to the actual contributing members,
EqX
Related
I have noticed that many people ask us (that allready got the ROM) to provide download-links, and even mail it to you.
You have to understand that we cannot provide all new readers with that same info over and over.
If you read the two posts:
WM6 rom for wizard: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=289799
and
about the crossbow wwe leak: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=290277
you can easily figure out yourself how to get hold of it!
It's in your own best interest.
Even people here are helpful, all the post like "wm6 for me too plzzzzz mail it to [email protected]in" is quite irritating.
So "noobs" - please read those above posts carefully, and you wil figure out how to download it yourself!
Best regards
HansMarius
this is probably the best thread ever made
I guarantee you someone will come in here and ask for a link to it...
This is part of a big problem with mobile phone message boards I've seen across all makes and models.
Newbies come in asking hundreds of the same exacty question over and over and over again all because they're too lazy to figure it out for themselves like we all had to before them.
</rant>
I don't mind helping people out, but when it's something simple, easy, or has been discussed to extreme length here, it is extremely frustrating.
message to members and senior members:
guys be careful who you give the crossbow link to. remember that noobs rarely read threads and take the time to know what you have to do before flashing a rom. so to avoid the hundreds of threads about noobs bricking their phone lets just use our discretion on giving out those links.
I propose the opposite, give links willy nilly, let them brick, and then let them learn at cost.
Anyone who posts info about flashing Crossbow, please always pre-pend with a disclaimer to the effect that it will cause sterility and permanent flaccidity.
None of these roms are retail AFAIK. Side-effects will occur.
V
I to gave willing away links over PM a couple a days ago, but now i'm getting pretty frustrated because it takes up to much of my time tom answer.
This post was never intended as a "****ing noobs" post, but they (yes YOU) must understand that this takes up to much of our time, and we must use our precious time to set up our phones properly after we flashed the WM6 ROM;-)
Wow!
It took me a whopping 2 minutes to find the rom... Not that I actually downloaded it or anything...
But let's say that I did download the thing... And it were to happen to install just fine on my 8125... I think that I too, would rather spend time installing things like a camera proggie, and the odds and ends that a plain vanilla rom such as this probably doesn't contain... than to waste precious time responding to the non-existent requests for it's location...
I'd even bet that M$ might even put a "windows update" button in there somewhere just to tease us... Probably just tattles on ya tho... Anyone that HAS been brave enough to click on the "update" button capture what is going out? where the request goes? what the request contains? (I'll bet it just comes back with "no updates available" tho...)
Sure, it's easy to say "let the n00bs brick their phone"... Can't we all just get along? Don't be haters... Yeah, right... What the hell do I know... I'm just a n00b myself, but at least I'm a n00b that knows how to read, and tries to spend time actually reading the forums before making an @$$ out of myself...
Just my .02
PT
I Agree with vijay555 to give them the links BUT AT THEIR OWN RISK
Let them make a SmartBrick
i know it's kinda cool to have the latest and greatest, but what's the point if you are to make your super expensive machine into a mega-expensive paper-weight... doesn't really make any sense though...
Rumor has it that Microsoft secretly *WANTS* these ROMS to be leaked and tested by the phone geeks.
They allow Vista to be officially tested but it would be too difficult to go through any program like that - especially given the nature of how the OS is loaded.
Who better to test them, discover patches and fixes, and give pros and cons then the phone nerds. It also drums up interest for those who don't flash ROMS all the time. Do you realize how many major phone websites are already publishing Crossbow articles based on the leaked ROMS? You think Microsoft dislikes the publicity?
Apple went ape-**** because someone was using the pictures they provide on their website for free. Why do you think there has been ZERO comments from Microsoft when an OS is leaked 6 months early?
By the way, when you provide a link for a lossless photo of the icons on the homescreen of a yet to be released phone, people are going to download it:
http://images.apple.com/movies/us/pr/photos/iphone/iphone_home.tif.zip
I was able to turn that picture into all the icons needed in under 5 minutes. Thank God I hate Apple so much I'd never use them!
-Mc
Please send all WM6 rom requests to [email protected]! lol
McHale:
Why do you think there has been ZERO comments from Microsoft when an OS is leaked 6 months early?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That comment isn't correct. Microsoft has contacted this board and asked for the roms to be removed. Very politely I might add. I have every respect for them for that.
Regarding the rumour that Microsoft wants their roms to be leaked, well rumour has it that Kate Moss wants me to eat sushi off her naked body. As much as I would like to believe it to be true, it's unlikely and probably a self-serving reflection of my own inner desires. She probably wouldn't want me slobbering over her after enjoying Adonis, Pete Doherty, and likewise, I doubt Microsoft is short of beta testers when they have their entire body of employees to test for them.
We're just freeloaders... but resourceful and dedicated
V
vijay555 said:
That comment isn't correct. Microsoft has contacted this board and asked for the roms to be removed. Very politely I might add. I have every respect for them for that.
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Click to collapse
that's very cool. I got the rumor information from a couple Microsoft Reps who were at my company when we were discussing corporate licensing and the future of OS's (including mobile). Sales guys...
Regarding the rumour that Microsoft wants their roms to be leaked, well rumour has it that Kate Moss wants me to eat sushi off her naked body. As much as I would like to believe it to be true, it's unlikely and probably a self-serving reflection of my own inner desires. She probably wouldn't want me slobbering over her after enjoying Adonis, Pete Doherty, and likewise, I doubt Microsoft is short of beta testers when they have their entire body of employees to test for them.
We're just freeloaders... but resourceful and dedicated
V
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
you know, I heard that second rumor as well but I could have sworn it was me and not you and it wasn't Sushi... it was sausage pizza.
Man that would burn...
-Mc
that's very cool. I got the rumor information from a couple Microsoft Reps who were at my company when we were discussing corporate licensing and the future of OS's (including mobile). Sales guys...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Man if we'd known that, we could have "facilitated" a leak quite some time back! A lot of people have been sitting on the roms for a while AFAIK.
sausage pizza
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Chipolata or Cumberland?!
V
I will say it again though. I think Microsoft has been very cool about us playing with the WM6 ROM and not getting Apple-sue happy. They've also been cool about us cooking custom ROMS with bits and pieces from all of them.
With as often as many of us upgrade Windows Mobile devices, this only encourages most of us to buy the next device that has it pre-installed. It won't keep many of us from upgrading because we have the new OS.
If it would make MS happy, I'm sure most of us would be happy to take part in a Beta program and report our findings as well as fixes (though they are all here on XDA if they take the time to read).
And as I stated days ago, let's not do anything that jeopardizes this fine forum or any of us on here. If MS says stop, we should take it someplace else.
-Mc
I entirely agree with you.
I was doing some work with some obscure Microsoft APIs yesterday, and as much as people love to shoot them down and whatever, we reap the rewards of the incredible amount of work that goes into supporting functions that we may never even get to use!
I specifically chose to use the phone I do because I can rip it apart software/ROM wise.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=287178#post1082343
Keep up the good work, one and all. Hack away!
V
True that
I don't do much posting but I have to agree with you guys. M$ can put the hurt on the board/forum really fast. Why not have a semi-approving Uncle and not create another "Napster" situation. M$ wants all the info they can get without the attitudes. Agree ????
Dear dissatisfied HTC Customer,
Before reading this, remember I am NOT encouraging you to boycott HTC. But I think most of you, who are going to do that, are really knowing what your reasons are.
As For me it really seems that we paid for something that HTC did not provide, I think we all have seen great dissatisfaction and complaints here on the forums, which some of us are unable not to agree with. Some people even culminate the dissatisfaction simply by ending the customer relation with HTC.
I figured it would be nice to see how badly did their Kaiser backfire, and the way they handled their customers with this. So please, if you feel that you have had enough and are going separate ways with HTC, use the below link to inform HTC about your decision. Also remember to tell them why you chose to do so. Remember to add that you are talking about Kaiser. And also remember to tell them that you most likely won’t be recommending HTC devices to anyone, and will probably do your best that no-one gets screwed like you did, if you feel like that. That should teach them a lesson!
Also after doing that report back on this thread! So we get to see how it affected their customer base in this forum and hopefully even more widely, a bigger picture. With some math we can speculate what was the damage for them. Hopefully this will help them also to see what they did, and see it would have been everybodys benefit if they did things right at the first place.
Below are the links to inform HTC about your decision. You probably best to aim the e-mail to their "customer service"!
European ex-customers:
http://www.htc.com/europe/CS_Mail.aspx
North American ex-customers:
http://www.htc.com/us/CS_Mail.aspx
Latin American ex-customers:
http://www.htc.com/la/CS_Mail.aspx
Asian ex-customers:
http://www.htc.com/tw/CS_Mail.aspx
Middle-East and African ex-customers:
http://www.htc.com/mea-en/CS_Mail.aspx
The reason why I find this really important is that, we really need to get the information on their face. That is where petition signing and things like that fail! I bet after receiving few thousand of this kind of e-mails the information will be passed to the persons concerned. That will not probably help us, but prevent them repeating what they did. Link to this thread would also be good on any other HTC/Kaiser related forum, so we get a collection of all dissatisfied ex-customers overall.
Sincerely Yours,
Henry
Ultimately dissatisfied HTC-EX-customer
ps.
you are still "allowed" to use your current HTC devices the best way you can imagine, since most of us paid a good price for it! For me that would be a paperweight or as a "viviparous lizard's tail".
I just informed HTC-europe that I will never be their customer again! I WONT!
Edit.
Actually, what I did say was, I will boycott them until the justice has happened in this case. Too bad it seems that will never happen. But that will give them at least a little reason to do back the bad things they did to us. They would get me back!
Done.
I am in charge of mobile devices and syncing with Exchange for a 2500+ employee company. I had started migrating people to s620's but have since moved them to HP iPAQ Messengers until a non-HTC device comes out that fits our needs.
So, while I'm not buying any more, I'm making sure nobody at the company (even personal purchases) are HTC.
-Mc
sent to http://www.htc.com/sea/CS_Mail.aspx
hope others will follow........
Sent message to the North American link.
Boycott? Wow.. dunno but I'm very happy with my phone, ATT Tilt, it's an upgrade from my last smartphone/ppc (VOQ Professional Phone) which actually I still have and would still be using had the company not gone out of business, and well the phone doesn't have bluetooth, wifi or a camera either... if it did have those three things I've still be using it now really even if the company went under...
I don't get the Boycott though.. are people REALLY that unhappy with their phones? sure I see lots of complaints about things but I see that with EVERY phone on the market today, there IS NO perfect phone out there and never will be because someone will find something wrong no matter what...
dampeal said:
Boycott? Wow.. dunno but I'm very happy with my phone...
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Please do not go offtopic too much! I understand that there are A LOT of arguments why the Kaiser could be alright as a mobile device, but that is not the point here. The point is that any person has the right to boycott what ever company for any reason he/she finds worth it. I'm collecting that info here NOT DISCUSSING whether the device is worthy or not. Made up my mind already.
I admire the resolve of all that are willing to stand by thier principles. Personnaly, the choice of my next phone is limited to what my carrier has to offer as by buying from them, I get a large discount.
As my carrier is T-Mobile UK, that means my next upgrade will probably be a HTC device (maybe vario 4) for around 100gbp as opposed to a none HTC device from a store for around 400gbp.
When I first signed up for this forum I thought it was for developers and people who knew a lot about ppc's. I soon learned that this forum contains more friggin whiners than a daycare. Everyday someone posts something regarding video drivers, hating htc, or just writing stupid ****. To the OP, I am not directing this towards you, but I don't think developers or people who joined this forum for learning purposes want to hear about emailing HTC with others decision to boycott.
Hmmm, maybe I should start a thread "Email HTC your reasons why you love their devices here!"
Get a clue and understand these threads are not needed but we appreciate your participation and do not take anything personal because its directed at many people.
redbandana said:
When I first signed up for this forum I thought it was for developers and people who knew a lot about ppc's. I soon learned that this forum contains more friggin whiners than a daycare. Everyday someone posts something regarding video drivers, hating htc, or just writing stupid ****. To the OP, I am not directing this towards you, but I don't think developers or people who joined this forum for learning purposes want to hear about emailing HTC with others decision to boycott.
Hmmm, maybe I should start a thread "Email HTC your reasons why you love their devices here!"
Get a clue and understand these threads are not needed but we appreciate your participation and do not take anything personal because its directed at many people.
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Lol... I agree...I will never say never... If HTC launched a TyTN II killer I'd probably get it..If will never buy a Kaiser again though if it helps
redbandana said:
When I first signed up for this forum I thought it was for developers and people who knew a lot about ppc's. I soon learned that this forum contains more friggin whiners than a daycare. Everyday someone posts something regarding video drivers, hating htc, or just writing stupid ****.
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That's strange. Because when I visit http://forum.xda-developers.com/forumdisplay.php?f=376, I see that there are four sections: one for discussion about accessories, one for discussion about software, one for discussion about ROMs, and this one for general discussion.
I notice that the developers tend to hang out in the software and ROMs sections, and that this general discussion forum is for general discussion.
Do you not have access to all four sections?
redbandana said:
When I first signed up for this forum I thought it was for developers and people who knew a lot about ppc's. I soon learned that this forum contains more friggin whiners than a daycare. ..
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Damn, don't know how to say this, remaining my relaxed tone.. but..
Don't you honestly think that this is the single BIGGEST community online using our beloved kaiser devices. Hopefully this does not come out of the blue for you, but there is something frikkin' wrong with the device we have bought.
There was 2 reasons for you why this kind of a threads easily pop out in GENERAL forums like this. Some people still want to get something in exchange for their money, not just crap.
Boycotting is useful, and it's the most powerful tool that single user can do against a company, which screwed him up without doing anything illeagal. This is where this forum could be helpful, here we have the people together. And if we complain together, maybe one day something gets done. Compare this to the situation between damn yankies and north korea for example. "Let's not give them what they want until they do what we want." Expect no nukes for the korea. You get it?
I feel sad that most of the people just accept the **** that big companies throw at you. I don't, A LOT of people won't accept that. Also, I'm completely sorry that I distracted you from your development work. Made you open this thread and whine about me whining.
And remember, this is nothing personal, there are a lot of you wankers out there whose fav hobby is to complain to n000bs and anything that.. that happens to annoy them at the time being. Then comes the bigger whiner, who whines about the whiner who whines about the whiner and that one is whining to whiner by the way.
You get the point? That there is a difference whining to other users and whining to wrong doers, who steal you money and feed you mouthful of poopi.
My message ... Europe Customer.
Drivers for Kaiser? No?
Then thank You, I will find my next device somewhere else, where I will really get what I paid for.
rakdoll said:
Damn, don't know how to say this, remaining my relaxed tone.. but..
Don't you honestly think that this is the single BIGGEST community online using our beloved kaiser devices. Hopefully this does not come out of the blue for you, but there is something frikkin' wrong with the device we have bought.
There was 2 reasons for you why this kind of a threads easily pop out in GENERAL forums like this. Some people still want to get something in exchange for their money, not just crap.
Boycotting is useful, and it's the most powerful tool that single user can do against a company, which screwed him up without doing anything illeagal. This is where this forum could be helpful, here we have the people together. And if we complain together, maybe one day something gets done. Compare this to the situation between damn yankies and north korea for example. "Let's not give them what they want until they do what we want." Expect no nukes for the korea. You get it?
I feel sad that most of the people just accept the **** that big companies throw at you. I don't, A LOT of people won't accept that. Also, I'm completely sorry that I distracted you from your development work. Made you open this thread and whine about me whining.
And remember, this is nothing personal, there are a lot of you wankers out there whose fav hobby is to complain to n000bs and anything that.. that happens to annoy them at the time being. Then comes the bigger whiner, who whines about the whiner who whines about the whiner and that one is whining to whiner by the way.
You get the point? That there is a difference whining to other users and whining to wrong doers, who steal you money and feed you mouthful of poopi.
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Well i certainly dont complain to n00bs unless there are threads similar to this. I should just ignore it for this point forward because we both have our opinions and neither is right nor wrong. Here is just a sample of what I do for n00bs:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=394543&highlight=stuck+bootloader
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=2228402&highlight=redbandana#post2228402
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=2228280&highlight=redbandana#post2228280
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=394657&page=2
and then some.
However, I do bash n00bs when there are posts bashing HTC. Sorry to offend you in anyway.
^^ I understand your frustration and i share similar sentiments with you. A similar thread was posted yesterday(you can find it on page 2) and the day before yesterday on the ROM dev. forum. It gets annoying after a while, thats all.
redbandana said:
Well i certainly dont complain to n00bs unless there are threads similar to this. I should just ignore it for this point forward because we both have our opinions and neither is right nor wrong. Here is just a sample of what I do for n00bs. ... . .
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Alright, It seems really we just happen to have our personal opinions, which we are completely righteous. I must admit I totally see your initial point, how this forum is built over the dedication of people who simply love to learn new things. It is totally frustrating nowadays to see people just complaining, without doing a **** about the real issues. I hope I didn't do exactly that, by starting this thread. The real reason to that is just, I would love to scare the **** out of HTC, make them see that they will go down if they don't respect us the way they should.
I do recognize what you stand for, and I must say there must not be anything that I wouldn't share with you. The thing that started this, must be that I have always been a man who stands behind his words, at least most of the time, and I assume the same from others. That includes all the big companies, groups and individuals. It really makes me sad to see where this world is going just because the only thing that matters to people is money. Huge corporations, sucking all the money they can, that's the end of people trying to provide just themselves.. no.. they want all that they can get. In the end, the one who pays the costs is dudes like us.
I honestly also didn't mean to offend anyone, and if it seemed so, I truly apologize. So in the end of the day, it seems like we are alone, with our Kaisers, trying to get the best out of it. So let's just keep on tuning it, until we are happy. That seems to be the initial purpose of this whole place's existence.
really sorry for my funny use of english, you native speakers must be laughing your asses off. But me not native, me from land of the barb-backed fishes. :|
I'm sure this awesome online community only makes up about less then half (if even) of tilt/kaiser/etc owners. There are many people that own this phone because they need it and never go online to mod it. Out of that assumed half I would say a 10th read what is posted or understand a single thing about this phone. That leaves a large number of people who think their phone is "crap" because you tell them it is. Yes I would like to see the phone be faster but I don't think it's crap nor do I think HTC has screwed me over. I don't seem to remember any stats that they released in regards to video or any other performance. Do you? Where are their benchmarks they advertised that weren't acheived by our lovely devices? If you can show them to me then I, and all of my friends will sign your wish list, but until I see them I will just think that everyone is butt hurt over an assumed performance loss.
HTC in my opinion has done something about this. Is it good enough to truely unlock the power of the Kaiser? No, but was it something rather then nothing? Do any of you know the cost of the video driver per unit? No, then how can people claim they paid for something they didn't get. How do you know it wouldn't have been another $50 that would have been tagged on. From what was advertised I will say I got 100% of what this phone was supposed to do.
ChumleyEX said:
From what was advertised I will say I got 100% of what this phone was supposed to do.
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This is strange opinion ..
because: when I bought the phone, I was thinkin buying the BEST phone in the market. Multimedia experience with keyboard.... Check the price and compare it to other older models if you know what I mean!
If I know it sooner I'd rather choose MWG, or iULTIMATE.. FOR SURE
I don't really care about support after market
But this laggy thing gives me s*it..... the fact that THIS THING DOESN'T have this BEFORE MARKET and they are HIDING THIS FACT!!!!
No multimedia experience only headache if you used it almost every time WITH touch screen... if... u know what I mean... do you??? or u just using it for modem only????
...bump
rajmagi said:
This is strange opinion ..
because: when I bought the phone, I was thinkin buying the BEST phone in the market. Multimedia experience with keyboard.... Check the price and compare it to other older models if you know what I mean!
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+1 Chumley I also go alot on the support forums for the iPhone, because my wife has an iPhone. If you were new to the iPhone you would think that it was the biggest piece of crap around. Thats all that is there is whining and complaining about how it doesn't work, Apple sold us a piece of crap . Here is a petition, let's put Apple out of business. As with all other forums a very vocal MINORITY of people who for whatever reason are having trouble with there phones.
Don't even get me started with the " Check the price, I thought I was getting the best " consumer strategy. I am just glad you don't buy my groceries.
I love my phone ,it does everything they told me it would do.It makes phone
calls, it schedules, MS Office is great, web access is great, I have push email, My gps works great etc... etc.....etc. Do I care that it doesn't have a Nikon D40 inside, do I care that I can't play WoW on it , do I care that I can't watch you tube all day at 3G on a battery charge? No ! This isn't what they promised me and this isn't what I bought my phone for.
Bottom line is, there are a million people out there that are perfectly satisfied with their HTC product. But we never hear from them. They are the silent majority. We here have to put up with thread after thread after thread because the vocal minority thinks we care that they bought a phone they don't like
STOP *****ing about Video Drivers. Who care. The phone is fine. You are forgetting that it's a PHONE! Be glad they added alot of extra stuff you can't find in a majority of phones. I have never had a problem watching videos and movies on my phone. Seriously.. geez
Today, when I went to Sakajati's website to check the release of his new WM6.5 ROM, I was totally depressed and completely lost the mood to flash this brand new ROM, after I read this brief intro:
sakajati
May 4th, 2009 at 5:59 am
Sorry guys for being away, I’ve been under stress due to financial problem. The business is getting worse and worse, I’m afraid I won’t be able to support this website anymore and may also have to sell my device (God I hope this won’t happend). To all hyperdragon users, please consider to support/donate, it may help me so I don’t have to sell this crapy device. Thanks in advance! Enjoy this new rom and let me know for any bugs you found!
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It was exactly the same feeling when yesterday I passed by Mirko Schenk's website and read this:
I aten't ded (12/05/2008, 10:00 PM)
Yeah, I know, I'm a bit slow with updates recently. Somehow, when I wasn't missing free time, all too often I was missing motivation (no, that's not begging for donations) to struggly with the pitfalls of programming after I struggled with them in my job before. And this even though there's currently no girl friend that threadens me when I'd spend more time on my PC than with her. (But admitted, she'd probably wouldn't need to threaden me... )
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Sakajati, a famouse ROM cooker for Kaiser, his Hyperdragon ROM thread in this forum has received 11,178 repplies and 1,574,596 views up to now. Yes, not mistaken, it's more than 1.5 milllion views. Is he brilliant? The numbers speak for themselves.
Mirko Schenk, the name may not much known to public. But if I talk about Mort, every chefs here knows who he is. One of his small programs named 'Mortscript' is now cooked in many of the custom ROMs on this site. Is he brilliant? You can ask every chef here, I guess you'll get the same answer:'Yes, he is VERY brillant.'
These two guys are only examples of many of the brilliant stars here. They all have these two same characters as I know: First, their softwares are all FREE. I.e, they supply free service to pubic without asking any material support from users. Second, I am regret to say, they are all VERY POOR now.
Well, I believe, that the initial puppose of their developing these wares are not for money. I also believe that they would like to continue this cause even if they can not receive one single coin from it, even if they maintain a poor living condition for his own life, they just enjoy it.
On the other hand, have to say this: It is ULTIMATE FORTUNE for a man, that in his life he can find something he likes, he is good at, he did it, and finally he fighted to clime to top of the line. BUT, it is an ULTIMATE UNFORTUNE for him that after he did this, he only found his life is 'worsen and worsen'.
Yes a man's value is not only reallize his own joy, he also has to be responsible for his beloves, his family, his girlfiend, or even his pet. This is the reason they may decide to drop this loved cause and find something else to do. And finally they may be driven out from this society.
Now the question comes: Can we do something to rescue them out of this situation?
Yes, we can donate to their PayPal account.
BUT, to donate to a paypal account is not always convienient for everybody that want to help them.
Actually, there are other much better ways, but the forum rules here does not support it. Like this: Why not allow them to put a simple advertisement on their signature?
Like this one (I found in this thread):
iPhone ... its a maxipad without wings!
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So that viewers can support them by a simple click of their mouse, which will bring a small money for them? Say in Sakajati's case, he has 1.5 million viewers, onlyif 10% of viewers would make a click on the ad, and only if each click can just bring $0.1 for them. That will collect to an amount of $15,000. Which will greatly enhance their life, at lest let them keep the 'crapy device'.
Don't tell me this is impossible for this forum. We have so many super-smart brains here. Actually can set some rules or systems to avoid any 'side effects' of it, like rules on the size, layout, postion, etc of the ad. Who can use it, who can not etc.
Yes, this great forum place should become a worm home for all telents in this line.
MODs: Can you discuss on this issue?
First let me say this is all very sad. Though I never use MortScript, I do sometimes run Sakajati's ROM.
There are unfortunately some issues with what you propose.
While I love XDA-Developers.com (primarily for its people and community), the board owners are not exactly known for 'making things happen'.
Second, clicking ads to "support someone" is a surefire way to get booted from the ad network. This is a definite no in the ad-world and against all regulations. Besides, all this does is move money from businesses who pay for those advertisements to freeware developers, while the users skimp on the cash again, and those who pay for advert gain nothing - you just click to support, not because you are interested in the ad product. So you rise prices for businesses trying to sell something. In turn this will make their products more expensive, you hurt the business and their consumers, and you have gained nothing. Its frowned upon for good reason.
Right now the best and quickest solution is probably still a PayPal rally. Frequent users should simply just donate a few bucks (remember when PayPal'ing, donate at least $2.50 or so or so much will be lost by the money they take, it's hardly worth donating at all). I have been thinking of a solution for this for years, even before I joined the WM community. I may have thought of something but unfortunately right now do not have the time to set up - however it will remain on my to-do list.
Chainfire said:
First let me say this is all very sad. Though I never use MortScript, I do sometimes run Sakajati's ROM.
There are unfortunately some issues with what you propose.
While I love XDA-Developers.com (primarily for its people and community), the board owners are not exactly known for 'making things happen'.
Second, clicking ads to "support someone" is a surefire way to get booted from the ad network. This is a definite no in the ad-world and against all regulations. Besides, all this does is move money from businesses who pay for those advertisements to freeware developers, while the users skimp on the cash again, and those who pay for advert gain nothing - you just click to support, not because you are interested in the ad product. So you rise prices for businesses trying to sell something. In turn this will make their products more expensive, you hurt the business and their consumers, and you have gained nothing. Its frowned upon for good reason.
Right now the best and quickest solution is probably still a PayPal rally. Frequent users should simply just donate a few bucks (remember when PayPal'ing, donate at least $2.50 or so or so much will be lost by the money they take, it's hardly worth donating at all). I have been thinking of a solution for this for years, even before I joined the WM community. I may have thought of something but unfortunately right now do not have the time to set up - however it will remain on my to-do list.
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Thank for your attention on tjis issue. There must be a solution for that, at least not 'completely impossible.
But the circut of money in 'ads' industry. Is just like 'everybody follow the rules here'.
Since the activities concerning 'advertising' may become a key factor in judgement of this issue. Here I add some more info. There are books about 'advertisement', or lots of internet materials available, but probably not everyone has time to read it. Let me just tell what is advertisement in this simple way:
The major target of ads is not to reach people who want the product, because people wants it already knows it. It is targeted to those people who doesn't want it, or even doesn't know it. Advertisement will let them know the product, and MAKE (sorry I use this word) them reallize that they want it.
This is why ads sponsors would be glad to pay even for a mouse click and a slight glance at what they are advertising. At least this make the clicker have a short memery about their brand name, or their product idea.
After read this, you may feel somehow uncomfortble about 'ads'. But sorry, this is just the prevailing commercial activity.
Please Post Your Comments on This Issue!
Anybody pass by here and reading this, if you have some opinion, comments, or different idea about this issue, please post here.
Maybe you are freeware developer, or commercial software developer, or common user, or moderator, it doesn't matter. What I'm thinking about is not trying to persuade the forum board to issue a new advertising policy, really need to be concerned is how to help those GREAT freeware developers OUT. Avertisement is just the best way that I can figure out by myself. But maybe you guys have better idea about this issue.
Here appeal to everybody:
If you are using a freeware, and find it's really helpful, or may bring additional conveineince and joy to your life. Please think about the life of the developer of the freeware. And first please consider a DONATION to them, if you can not, please think about what else you can do.
Everybody please leave your voice here, maybe we can work out a way together!
Also put a post about up on myblog (spam, not finished yet). Who knows maybe it will even help.
I'll be making a serious donation myself. I hope others will do the same.
Chainfire said:
Also put a post about up on myblog (spam, not finished yet). Who knows maybe it will even help.
I'll be making a serious donation myself. I hope others will do the same.
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Certainly yours will be a nice place with lots of chef want to take a look. I went there and found some projects not known to me in the past. Before I only know WMWifiRouter's from you, later WMLongLife, but that's already enough to call you a Master. Now you're master++.
Also noted that you already sent donation confirmation code on Sakajati's site.
You built a nice blog.
androidplayground (link removed to comply with forum rules, google and take the first result, it's the ****hole in question)
This actually disgusts me.
I won't lie, I'm pro-piracy, and don't mind sites that host apps for free download, but profiting off someone else's work is frankly, sickening.
They do have a contact page, why not let them know how much you appreciate your hard work being stolen?
Looks pretty shady anyway, I'd much rather use the Android Market.
I agree. Charging people do get software you stole is worse than stealing it in the first place IMO.
I feel like I just took a trip back to a 1997 Geocities website
this is pretty much a site that leads to warez and shouldnt be posted. i am just saying.
brian_v3ntura said:
this is pretty much a site that leads to warez and shouldnt be posted. i am just saying.
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And changed.
It's being hosted by hostedsolutions, their contact info is here:
http://www.hostedsolutions.com/contact/
I'm sure they'd like to know what's on their servers.
Wow that's ballsy.
They even link back to the xda forums for formatting and rooting info.
And Dev's they are taking paypal payments. File a complaint with Paypal too.
They used a privacy company to hide who they are.
And then they used Tucows address as their domain registration address?
The whois phone number rings to a looped recording telling you to go to the privacy companies website. Which does not seem to work.
To bad these A$$munchs didn't also make the stupid Android7 Flash Player. We could have killed 2 birds with one stone.
If the site ever starts 'offering' SetCPU, I will do whatever is in my legal power to take them down. I can't do anything about those Chinese or Russian websites, but if it's hosted in the USA, they're going down.
ThrashWolf said:
This actually disgusts me.
I won't lie, I'm pro-piracy, and don't mind sites that host apps for free download, but profiting off someone else's work is frankly, sickening.
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Piracy is piracy. Don't think somehow a for-free piracy distribution site is any more justified than a paid one. If anything, for-free distribution sites hurt developers more than paid sites: which one do you think attracts more pirates? (Note: Don't somehow come to the twisted conclusion that I support piracy of any kind; I don't.)
The difference between the two jashsu is that there is a large contingent of the "try before you buy" type of pirates out there. They'll get a warez version of an app, and if they like it, they'll often uninstall it and pay for the market version. However, if they pay for it through a third party website, the original developer never sees that profit.
Thats not to say I support piracy, because I dont. I fully believe that people should be compensated for hard work. I'm more than willing to pay for an app up front, and if it sucks, the dev will find out by reading the refund notice when i uninstall it within 24 hours.
kusotare said:
The difference between the two jashsu is that there is a large contingent of the "try before you buy" type of pirates out there.
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Please show me some numbers. To get the ball rolling, i'll post a link.
http://arstechnica.com/apple/news/2...-more-serious-than-first-though-on-iphone.ars
"The numbers that developers might find most interesting are the ones that show "conversion rates" from "lite" versions to full. Only one out of every 14 average users tends to purchase the paid version of an app after using the lite version, which is just under 7.5 percent. For pirates, the conversion rate is less than half a percent, or one out of every 233."
I download apps. If I like 'em, I pay for them. I'll usually go for a "lite" version if one exists. Anyway, rather than have this thread derailed into a debate about piracy, can we get back to the topic at hand?
I've notified the host, lets see if that does anything.
Sigh. Nothing like a little bit of piracy to set a forum on fire. Doesn't matter what forum you're visiting, could be a forum for food - and the first mention of piracy is bound to bring up what I like to call the forum nazis. Everyone is entitled to their own opinions, and no amount of gestapo trolling will change that. I find it interesting that people break various laws of various countries / cities / states daily and of course, it's overlooked. Someone makes mention of piracy and all of a sudden you've got the ePolice regime banging on your every post as if it were going to change something. What's my point? None, really. (But there again, there's also no point in bashing piracy, it's not going to make it any less existent.)
DarkNytefire said:
Someone makes mention of piracy and all of a sudden you've got the ePolice regime banging on your every post as if it were going to change something.
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I hope you don't think that I assumed my post would change ThrashWolf's perception on piracy. I was merely pointing out how humorously sad this statement is:
This actually disgusts me.
I won't lie, I'm pro-piracy, and don't mind sites that host apps for free download, but profiting off someone else's work is frankly, sickening.
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I mean.. maybe i'm the only one who finds that just a bit hypocritical? I would have been completely okay if he/she just said "hey dudes, theres a paid piracy site, lets get it shut down" or "I like piracy". But to go and say "I am a pirate, but these other pirates disgust me".. idk.. maybe it's just me, but that's just ridiculous.
Then again what do I know?
Also they spam the android market with there links so make sure if you see it report it as spam.
Doesn't anyone pay for their apps anymore ...
I'll admit it, I pirate apps too, but only to either try it or if I have no other way to even purchase the application.
The thing is, being a high-schooler, I have a cheap, prepaid credit card that only allows transactions in USD. Many apps aren't available in the Market in currency other than Euros or Pounds so I have no other choice to use the apps than to pirate them.
This kind of behavior where people are selling pirated copies instead of just making it available for people who otherwise can't even buy them is really annoying though... anybody thought of a way to get them shut down?
I'm honestly debating to pay for a membership and email every dev that has an app on their. The other known site I've already found 6 apps from me on their and they were removed. But since this place charges just to get a peak I'm very tempted to pay and make sure every company knows and can write C&D's to them and the host.
Piracy is always going to be an issue. Always. I have pirated apps before, usually to test out an app update I have already downloaded and refunded from the marketplace. If the update fixes things I had issues with, I will buy it. If not, then I delete it. I have bought and kept 21 apps from the marketplace so far. I believe my use of pirated apps is fair.
I am not trying to justify piracy, but merely stating it is a great tool for me. I am aware that a lot of people pirate apps just so they don't have to pay for them. I believe that is wrong. However when comparing those who distribute an app for free to those that charge for an app that is not theirs, I believe that the one who distributes for free is the lesser of the two evils. The one who distributes for free is going to reach out to more of the potential market yes, but the scumbags who actually charge for apps that someone worked hard on are the true thieves IMO. They affect a lesser share of the potential market, but keep in mind their "share" is willing to make a purchase in the first place, while the freeloaders "share" is questionable in that department.
Just my 2 cents.
Read it and post your opinions on the matter.
http://piratemw.blogspot.com/
I feel it covers ground and is fair to all sides.
2 spelling mistakes in the first sentence alone makes me think it's the gibbering of an idiot.
Didn't bother reading the rest.
To be honest, I don't think "the best article" on anything "to date" will ever appear on a blogspot site.
Moved as not software release.
elyl said:
2 spelling mistakes in the first sentence alone makes me think it's the gibbering of an idiot.
Didn't bother reading the rest.
To be honest, I don't think "the best article" on anything "to date" will ever appear on a blogspot site.
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it may not be the best but it may worth be reading.everybody is not fluent in english
dummy
elyl said:
2 spelling mistakes in the first sentence alone makes me think it's the gibbering of an idiot.
Didn't bother reading the rest.
To be honest, I don't think "the best article" on anything "to date" will ever appear on a blogspot site.
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What spelling mistakes? You dont even know english and your talking about me. Stupid mofo hahahaha
No need to throw insults about like that
EDIT: Just read it. The ultimate truth? No. I see A LOT of 'good' software that has been pirated, that has come from big developers and the little guy just starting out. They crack for fun/addiction/because they think they are rebels etc, whatever the reason they will do it because THEY CAN, not because there are ethics involved. Seriously, which major company went "Hey guys, our software got pirated on the first day and we didn't make any money from it, let's release something truly innovative so they won't pirate it." Sorry, that is NOT the 'ultimate truth'.
What a pointless article (IMO).
this is bull ****. there are lots of apps cracked that cost only like $10 made by some developer that only has this tiny simple but cool app that most find usefull. So this developer gets 1000 apps sold over 1.000.000 cracked downloads.
Now lets just steel that new Toyota car because it's only a little design change from the last model and some minor changes to the breaks system.
zarpy said:
What spelling mistakes? You dont even know english and your talking about me. Stupid +++ hahahaha
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Please refrain from using bad lenguage and insulting your fellow members
the response
Ok
1) If you read the whole summary of the truth about piracy Iam not saying piracy is good on a whole level. But if there was no piracy , the games made would be old rehashed garbage. Look at Gameloft games for windows mobile. They basically make the same game over and over with different graphics. That to me is theft selling us non-sense with pretty package.
I know people from both sides of this war. Developers from xda-developers,ppc geeks, and pirates like ppcwarez . Iam not going to sit here and say lets take the developers side on all issues. Thats non-sense , Iam a freeware developer myself , with commercial software too. One-sided thinking will just continue the war. I do support the independent developers , for they make truely innovative original software.
As far as the insult...the man called me out 1st...I just responded.
zarpy said:
Ok
1) If you read the whole summary of the truth about piracy Iam not saying piracy is good on a whole level. But if there was no piracy , the games made would be old rehashed garbage. Look at Gameloft games for windows mobile. They basically make the same game over and over with different graphics. That to me is theft selling us non-sense with pretty package.
I know people from both sides of this war. Developers from xda-developers,ppc geeks, and pirates like ppcwarez . Iam not going to sit here and say lets take the developers side on all issues. Thats non-sense , Iam a freeware developer myself , with commercial software too. One-sided thinking will just continue the war. I do support the independent developers , for they make truely innovative original software.
As far as the insult...the man called me out 1st...I just responded.
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Very interesting
Just make donateware
I immediately think that you're trying to get traffic to your own website rather than discuss the matter here. So rather than go there and read it, I'll discuss it here at XDA, where I'd rather keep my attention and loyalty.
Any law that basically says making a mixed tape for someone else is illegal is complete garbage and media companies can take it and shove it up their a**.
Any law that says I cannot "loan" a movie to someone else, even a complete stranger, and that I have to be responsible for the actions of the person I loaned it to is complete garbage and media companies can take it and shove it up their a**.
Any law that says I'm responsible for what happens to something I loaned someone else is complete garbage and media companies can take that law and shove it up their a**.
Any law that tells me what I can or cannot do with my own property is complete garbage and media companies can take it and shove it up their a**.
Stop enforcing 100-year-old copyright law for media medium that doesn't fit into the law.
Donate to the EFF
http://www.eff.org/
Rorymeadows
Ok rorymeadows
1) The link i provided is not to my website but to my blog. All you do is read blogs not join them. My website is www.krenisiswinmobilegamesapps.com and I didnt direct anyone there
2) You blame me saying Iam redirecting people and your loyal to xda-developers? If your so loyal to xda , why are you posting a redirect and telling people to donate to another website? Before you call someone out, check yourself.
Everything else you said , I agree with.
zarpy said:
Ok rorymeadows
1) The link i provided is not to my website but to my blog. All you do is read blogs not join them. My website is www.krenisiswinmobilegamesapps.com and I didnt direct anyone there
2) You blame me saying Iam redirecting people and your loyal to xda-developers? If your so loyal to xda , why are you posting a redirect and telling people to donate to another website? Before you call someone out, check yourself.
Everything else you said , I agree with.
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EFF is a professional organization. Yours is a shameless plug for a teen online journal. Please stay on topic.
OP's blog said:
Its you who forces companies to make better and innovative software hoping if they make great software, then people will buy them.
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Sorry, but that makes no sense whatsoever. By the same reasoning, stealing televisions should force the manufacturers to make better ones. That is simply wrong.
Not to offend, but to be clear, I find your arguments blinkered and naive. Piracy has very little to do with sticking it to big companies. 99% of the time it's about getting something for free.
johncmolyneux said:
Sorry, but that makes no sense whatsoever. By the same reasoning, stealing televisions should force the manufacturers to make better ones. That is simply wrong.
Not to offend, but to be clear, I find your arguments blinkered and naive. Piracy has very little to do with sticking it to big companies. 99% of the time it's about getting something for free.
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I agree. It's not about sticking it to big companies. It should be about revolution with digital media and laws, and electronic freedom.
fairness
So judging by the comments so far , both of you believe hacking and cracking software only hurt companies and developers. Also you believe is there was no more software pirates, that would benefit the consumer. The major companies say the same , cracked software leads to high priced games.
1)False= cracked software does not lead to high priced games. I remember super nintendo was charging $40-$60 a game. So that is false statement.
2)Facted= Cracked and pirated software has been around since early 80's,90's . People were happy around that time period with quality of thier software, so people didnt look for free downloads or cracked software. This isnt just about games Iam including the industry as a whole. This includes movies,music,and video games.
Opinion= I believe once those 3 industries started to make rehashed and low quality products, people started looking toward pirated software. If this isnt true, then this issue would have come up a long time ago.
Now to rorymeadows , no Iam not a teen and I dont sound or act like one.
I have absolutely no idea how you got any of what you said from my post, but you're wrong. That's not what I'm saying at all. You're just assuming things.
I wonder what this post will be about!
Incidentally, you should look at the technological and social changes that have taken place over the last 30 years and factor that into your opinions. Piracy is a bigger issue now simply because it's in your face, in your living room, on the internet and on your PC. 30 years ago it was kids copying tapes with games on them, but no mass forums to make it publicly available. Music was copied, but it was time consuming so not done as quickly as it is today - the same goes for movies (tape-to-tape VHS recorders for example). Times have changed, but the essence of piracy hasn't. Lots of people like stuff that costs nothing. That is the only fact you can state.
Well there's another thing going on, too.
I was browsing the Microsoft Mobile Marketplace last night. One of the programs I found up there was Resco Photo Manager. $60. $60!!!!!!! For THAT?!?!?! A program that I'd probably use 10 times a year is $60??!?!?!?!
I used to work at the college dining hall back in undergrad. People used to steal and steal, pocking pop-tarts, walking out with drinks and subs without paying. It drove the price up more. Yes, stealing jumps the overhead and makes things costlier. But did that stop the stealing? No, in fact, it made it much worse.
johncmolyneux and rorytmeadows both are correct.
/end thread.