Just FYI: I got off the phone with a bud of mine that works at Motorola. To be honest the reason I called him was I wanted the XML set for the Bionic and I was hoping he could slip it to me so I could get us setup.
To my dismay... he said this:
Ever since the thing with Google was announced EVERYTHING is on lockdown. There is no more swapping motorola devices back and forth between various project developers, everyone can only work on the devices they are assigned and the sensitive stuff is not allowed off site anymore.
Used to be he would come over to my house and unlock my bootloader. Not anymore.
So we can all thank Google for the tightened security at Motorola. Thanks G!
Interesting.
Sent from my DROID BIONIC using xda premium
Well that sucks. Love for Google circling the drain along with VZW and electronic freedom :-(
Sent from my DROID X2 using XDA App
I would imagine they'd fire your friend or worse for what he's doing. I'm assuming they didn't know he was going out and unlocking BL's etc?
My thoughts are, with the patent wars, Google is trying to cover their ass right now. Until the proposed deal is approved, they are wanting to make sure that nothing slips thru the cracks that could be harmful to their cause in the hands of the opposition. Not to mention, they probably have some new devices in testing along with new hardware components that would be in Google's best interest not to have leaked until they are certified by the FCC. I am going to have to give Google the benefit of the doubt, and say until the deal is approved, they are doing what they can to cover their asses.
AtLemacks said:
My thoughts are, with the patent wars, Google is trying to cover their ass right now. Until the proposed deal is approved, they are wanting to make sure that nothing slips thru the cracks that could be harmful to their cause in the hands of the opposition. Not to mention, they probably have some new devices in testing along with new hardware components that would be in Google's best interest not to have leaked until they are certified by the FCC. I am going to have to give Google the benefit of the doubt, and say until the deal is approved, they are doing what they can to cover their asses.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1, In the world of business mergers and acquisitions, things get put on lockdown during transfer of ownership....Lets hope things get better once the deal is done.
If it was Google's fault, the Nexus' and Honeycomb tablets would be locked down. Just my opinion.
AtLemacks said:
If it was Google's fault, the Nexus' and Honeycomb tablets would be locked down. Just my opinion.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1 I think this has more to do with VZW than google....
AtLemacks said:
If it was Google's fault, the Nexus' and Honeycomb tablets would be locked down. Just my opinion.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The Nexus devices are developers phones and the only Moto HC tablet is also a dev device. Not saying it is Google's fault, but it certainly still is a possibility. I personally believe it's the fascist ************s at VZW, and Moto is their lapdog.
That is the point. I would believe, Google would prefer a 'pure' experience on all devices. But, to convince manufacturers to build devices they let them skin it to personalize the experience. Expecting people to buy for their experience, not only their hardware.
I owned an Atrix (still do, but haven't been keeping up 100% lately and just switched to bionic) and if I remember correctly, the moto-google deal wasn't until a fair bit after the release of the Atrix and the unlock of the atrix came after the deal news first broke. I'm not saying this is necessarily proof of anything, but it's the opposite of what one would expect if the info in the OP is true.
Hasn't moto been kind of known for being a pain in the ass about locked bootloaders? I remember a lot of people had very little hope for the atrix being unlocked because of previous devices that never saw a full unlock.
So as it turns out, Motorola will also be locking down the bootloader for the upcoming Atrix HD....big surprise, eh?
However, something in this article is a bit noteworthy:
"...our goal is still to provide a way to unlock the bootloaders on our devices to those who wish to do so, more details to come."
http://www.androidpolice.com/2012/0...e-a-way-to-unlock-to-those-who-wish-to-do-so/
There's one guy around here that has a sig that says "Motorola lied I'm still locked" or something similar... he's got the right idea about it, and words mean nothing and neither do their broken promises so, until we see and can actually make use of a real honest to goodness unlocked bootloader, Motorola can stick their words someplace, you get to choose where.
4 words: Too little too late!
Motorola lied and I'm still locked mb865
Atrix 4G is unlocked when Atrix 2 is released
So, I hope that when Atrix HD is released, our Atrix 2 will be unlocked =))))))))
Lies all lies...
Sent from my SPH-D710 using xda premium
PhoenixNghi said:
Atrix 4G is unlocked when Atrix 2 is released
So, I hope that when Atrix HD is released, our Atrix 2 will be unlocked =))))))))
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And now they're trying to relock It with the new updates
Motorola lied and I'm still locked mb865
Those are cheap lies from motorola. They played that scenerio very well with the XT910. Don't ever buy a phone motorola with locked bootloader with the hope of it could be unlocked in the future.
+1. I for one wont ever buy a Moto phone. That's the only form of complaint that they will eventually listen to.
+1
adelvillar said:
+1. I for one wont ever buy a Moto phone. That's the only form of complaint that they will eventually listen to.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1. Totally Agreed.
PhoenixNghi said:
Atrix 4G is unlocked when Atrix 2 is released
So, I hope that when Atrix HD is released, our Atrix 2 will be unlocked =))))))))
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The 4G wasn't officially unlocked when the Atrix 2 was released. We got lucky on that one...hence the cheesecake checking for the Atrix 2 in hopes that lightning strikes twice.
This is a tough one:
I REALLY wanna upgrade my phone, but I'm not sure if I want to wait to be able to do what I can now..
Its bull we heard it all with the defy and the atrix and then the razr
Don't forget when they said that about the razr they then released the dev version so you had to buy another phone.
I'm done with moto, their excellent hardware cant make up for their bad software hence why I brought a Samsung GS3 the only thing I can hope for this device is that they stick to their word(not gonna happen) or that if your lucky devs like quarx and eppy from the defy get helping here.
Sent from my MB525 using xda app-developers app
I have never seen Moto as a anything more than the gimmick device provider for Verizon so to me this is business as usual....
Moto dropped the ball long ago....quality? In what? Superior Screens? To who? HTC has done some dumb crap too but have way out built Moto in the quality field....Samsung has leveled the entire industry with their technology. Moto does nothing except pack into their devices COMPARABLE hardware to other manufacturers....innovate nowhere....they amaze no one....from form to the most terrible UI....Atrix line? Fail.....Razr....I will give them battery on the Max but lose points for a sub par OMAP....sure its just my opinion but I can't see people being upset anymore over this BS entity.......Moto and Apple need to attend some courses on innovation because they are both all out of it.
Google should employ some good XDA devs to turn that dying rat platform into something good again....Moto has lost the will to out do.
Sent from........Somewhere In Time
tylerdurdin said:
I have never seen Moto as a anything more than the gimmick device provider for Verizon so to me this is business as usual....
Moto dropped the ball long ago....quality? In what? Superior Screens? To who? HTC has done some dumb crap too but have way out built Moto in the quality field....Samsung has leveled the entire industry with their technology. Moto does nothing except pack into their devices COMPARABLE hardware to other manufacturers....innovate nowhere....they amaze no one....from form to the most terrible UI....Atrix line? Fail.....Razr....I will give them battery on the Max but lose points for a sub par OMAP....sure its just my opinion but I can't see people being upset anymore over this BS entity.......Moto and Apple need to attend some courses on innovation because they are both all out of it.
Google should employ some good XDA devs to turn that dying rat platform into something good again....Moto has lost the will to out do.
Sent from........Somewhere In Time
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't feel like arguing with a troll but you're wrong plain and simple. Don't like them, don't buy them.
Back on topic, don't ever buy a device expecting future functionality, you'll always end up disappointed.
Son et Lumiere said:
I don't feel like arguing with a troll but you're wrong plain and simple. Don't like them, don't buy them.
Back on topic, don't ever buy a device expecting future functionality, you'll always end up disappointed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am an adult and know that only name calling causes arguments.....so you should not call people trolls who actually are device fanatics and know what they are talking about.
Also an opinion can't be wrong....you should know this if you are old enough to use a keyboard.
Also replying to an opinion with no rebuttal other than your wrong and not even singling out one superior feature, makes your comment a complete fail.....
Last, a reply to the stupidest thing I have EVER read ....."don't buy a device expecting future functionality"....????????....are you serious?....granted five years down the road I would expect nothing.....but buying devices that can hold its own for a few years is called being a smart consumer
Sent from........Somewhere In Time
tylerdurdin said:
I am an adult and know that only name calling causes arguments.....so you should not call people trolls who actually are device fanatics and know what they are talking about.
Also an opinion can't be wrong....you should know this if you are old enough to use a keyboard.
Also replying to an opinion with no rebuttal other than your wrong and not even singling out one superior feature, makes your comment a complete fail.....
Last, a reply to the stupidest thing I have EVER read ....."don't buy a device expecting future functionality"....????????....are you serious?....granted five years down the road I would expect nothing.....but buying devices that can hold its own for a few years is called being a smart consumer
Sent from........Somewhere In Time
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You don't act like an adult.....at all.
adelvillar said:
+1. I for one wont ever buy a Moto phone. That's the only form of complaint that they will eventually listen to.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
osan441 said:
+1. Totally Agreed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1 for not buying a phone because it has a locked bootloader.
-1 for thinking motorola (or any major OEM) cares about or listens to people like us. For every person who will not buy an atrix hd because of the bootloader, there are twenty people who will be somewhat annoyed but still buy one, and 1,000 people who will say "what's a locked bootloader?"
Moto knew this would create backlash but they did it anyway. The GS3 is unlocked on at&t, so I don't necessarily believe it was at&t's fault. Moto's message is loud and clear: "Android hobbyists and developers: We DO NOT care about you."
That said, I DO think we can get motorola to change, but missing sales from the open bootloader crowd simply isn't enough. Bad publicity on social networks, petitions, and hopefully an article about the bad publicity and petition on an android news site. How do we get the numbers? Get people who hate locked bootloaders, at&t, and/or motorola to sign. Then get some casual users involved, by describing the bootloader in overly simplified terms. Invoke carrier IQ and privacy, invoke freedom, etc.
There doesn't seem to be a lot of buzz around the atrix HD, so this may be easier said than done, but it would be nice because the atrix HD seems like it has the potential to be a truly great phone, I would suggest it over the Nexus in a heartbeat if it was totally unlocked and easy to install stock AOSP like ROM.
Ya you are right
+1 for not buying a locked bootloader phone.
Sent from my MB865 using xda app-developers app
I once bought a Motorola Android (Atrix 4g), they make great build quality devices, and I'd buy a product of theirs again if they actually decided to ship their devices unlocked...they did this with the Atrix 4g people clamored for it to be unlocked...they said they would provide a solution they never did officially, it was only by luck that a leaked HK firmware for the phone pointed Devs in the direction on how to unlock the BL, fast forward some months and they have been releasing updates that relock the BL with no way to SBF back..Take a look on the verizon side, moto makes flagship phone for them, what did they do ship a Droid Razr with locked BL, their solution release a Dev device with unlocked BL and no warranty...So if we look at their track record on how to deal with BLs I dont put much faith in them, if anything their solution will be to release another Atrix HD Dev edition...too bad too cuz for 99 bux the Atrix HD seems like a solid deal...but I for one will not support them for shipping with a locked BL.
Sorry to be confusing locked bootlocker and locked phone. Can the phone be used for travelling to other countries? That is, using prepaid Simcard to countries that I will be travelling to.
So I work at Sprint and we finally had a Motorola Representative come down and speak to use (we sell the Photon Q which is like the droid 4 with a bigger screen). I told him about my experiences with the Droid 3 and what we were doing here. I told him about XDA's shared hatred towards Sanjay and he said he understood. He basically admitted that the Droid 3 should have never happened and that the Droid 4 was already practically made when the Droid 3 was being sold, basically because they already dumped money in to the droid 3 so they had to unload it on the consumer (Sanjay's fault). Some of the positive things he mentioned was that with the new leadership, updates are going to happen much more often and that flagship phones won't have 59 variations. Motorola will also start keeping it's promise to keep phone's up to date for 18 months as well.
I asked him about the bootloader blog debacle and he basically said that Verizon came in and put their foot down, which made them not follow through on what they said was going to happen. Actually in the end he said 90% of things are Verizon's fault (I wouldn't doubt it). They do have a huge advertising campaign that is practically paid for by Verizon, Verizon uses that to their advantage and blackmails them to do their bidding. He also mentioned that alot of his fellow employees are hoping that Google can strong arm Verizon into sitting the %#@& down and getting over themselves, allowing them to do a signed bootloader unlocking. He says that it should allow you to register your phone's ESN to MotoDev and it would then send a message back to the Verizon that the warranty is void but it would allow people to unlock the bootloader. Hardware warranty will still be covered by Moto, just not through Verizon and Asurion (unless you pay a deposit) There are a lot of angry sales people who do not like to sell Motorola phones due to their bloatware and locked boot-loader practices and Motorola knows that it isn't good for sales. He says the most common notes he sends back to HQ usually contain something about the bootloader, less motoblur, and death to Sanjay.
If you have any questions I can try to get in contact with him and see what else he has to say or if I asked him a question I forgot to put it in this post I can answer it. I grilled him for an hour.
Holy crap thanks. I hope they update us.
Sent from my DROID3 using xda app-developers app
Wow. So does this mean there is still hope yet?
Nope. It means that this phone is forgotten but future devices starting next quarter will be supported much better. Sorry.
This seems to confirm what we've believed all along - that the D3 was awkwardly released, from a point of view of timing; that Verizon had the contractual ability to prevent Moto from unlocking bootloaders on these phones.
"Death to Sanjay" seems silly at this point - the guy's been gone for more than 6 months.
Well, poo. Guess I better be saving money for an S3. Or maybe the S4.
doogald said:
This seems to confirm what we've believed all along - that the D3 was awkwardly released, from a point of view of timing; that Verizon had the contractual ability to prevent Moto from unlocking bootloaders on these phones.
"Death to Sanjay" seems silly at this point - the guy's been gone for more than 6 months.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well Death to Sanjay was the most common note this year, and I still hold him accountable for our droid 3's.
cobravnm13 said:
Well, poo. Guess I better be saving money for an S3. Or maybe the S4.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wait for the S4. The S4 will be out sometime in April and will have a 1080p screen, rumored to have no bezel (edge to edge display), quadcore and the unbreakable flex display, and a 13mp camera. Samsung is seriously going after the iphone with this one. This is the one I am saving for but I will end up going to Sprint due to Verizon's data plans.
Yeah, I was thinking that as well. But I'd be buying full retail.
cobravnm13 said:
Yeah, I was thinking that as well. But I'd be buying full retail.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ugh I know how that is. It's why I got a job with Sprint. Likely you can get the S3 for 200 somewhere after Christmas.
Sent from my Rezound using xda premium
jesusishere said:
Ugh I know how that is. It's why I got a job with Sprint. Likely you can get the S3 for 200 somewhere after Christmas.
Sent from my Rezound using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That would be awesome.
It sounds like the future at Motorola will be a lot better. We've already seen the fast updates for the Razr HD and M, hopefully Motorola gets the update out to their late 2011 phones as well.
I'm looking at getting the Razr M as my phone when I can upgrade in early 2013 unless something better comes out, since its one of the few phones without a huge screen. Its already got JB and Hash has safestrap working on it, so there will be some dev support. I'll keep my Droid 3 as a spare VZW phone and to mess around with ROMs on.
An article on my phone popped up (sorry forgot source) but it really looked bad.
Top Execs leaving.
Their Market share has dropped so low (under 4%) that some sites put them now in the "Other" Category (along with RIM etc.).
The HTC One is hoped to save them and most agree it's a fantastic phone, but now there are parts shortages and if you don't get that first wave you won't have a winner despite being better hardware.
Profits are down 98% from last year.
Profits are like in the Millions for HTC and Billions for Samsung (not sure if that is just for phones though).
Google HTC it's is all over the place.
I sure hope they can turn things around but now they are losing key people. I've had a new HTC phone every year since the Mogul (maybe earlier, been too long).
I don't think I've ever had to replace one (except one I bricked). Sold every one as working.
By the way I think this thread does belong here because the HTC One is Key and Folks Considering Buying one should know what's going on. I had no idea.
Sad that it popped up on my HTC Phone.
I too have a HTCONE and love the quality of HTC phones. But I also have a Samsung Note II. As for HTC going down hill, it serves them right for them locking down their bootloaders. First with the Evo 3D, and now the HTCONE. Yeah, I know they gave us htcdev.com but like with samsung devices, its so easy unlocking the bootloaders because Samsung supports our beloved developers. HTC just wants control, or some control, like our parents. Htc wants to say, "no no, you cant do that with your phone, it might hurt it". Htc doesn't want to give us "users" the choice to break our phones if we want, which is why they lock the bootloaders.
Htc thinks their slick too. With the evo 3d they allowed us to unlock our bootloaders but they wouldn't allow us to flash kernels, or downgrade our bootloaders. Which is why our developers found a way to hack into our bootloaders with the evo 3d to gain s-off. But with the HTCONE they also allowed us to unlock our bootloaders, only now they made it possible to flash kernels, their thinking if they gave us access to flash kernels, maybe our developers wouldn't worry about hacking the htcone's bootloader to gain s-off. But little do they know that where ever there's a rule, there's always someone who will find a way to break that rule.
As far as im concerned, htc is getting what they deserve. Htc had some serious followers until they released the evo 3d with a locked bootloader. I alone know of a couple dozen htc fans who stopped buying htc phones just because of that actoin of theirs. So I still bought the htcone thinking they might have learned their lesson, but NOPE, instead they release a dev addition, asking for more money for it. Htc is starting to remind me of Apple, lmao...
Sent from my SPH-L900 using Tapatalk 2
mswlogo said:
An article on my phone popped up (sorry forgot source) but it really looked bad.
Top Execs leaving.
Their Market share has dropped so low (under 4%) that some sites put them now in the "Other" Category (along with RIM etc.).
The HTC One is hoped to save them and most agree it's a fantastic phone, but now there are parts shortages and if you don't get that first wave you won't have a winner despite being better hardware.
Profits are down 98% from last year.
Profits are like in the Millions for HTC and Billions for Samsung (not sure if that is just for phones though).
Google HTC it's is all over the place.
I sure hope they can turn things around but now they are losing key people. I've had a new HTC phone every year since the Mogul (maybe earlier, been too long).
I don't think I've ever had to replace one (except one I bricked). Sold every one as working.
By the way I think this thread does belong here because the HTC One is Key and Folks Considering Buying one should know what's going on. I had no idea.
Sad that it popped up on my HTC Phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
LOL, looking at it all wrong.
For the past few years people were complaining about HTC's marketing strategies, design, and other things. HTC is taking the power from those people who were directly responsible for those things people were complaining about, and giving it to new people with fresh ideas, new strategies and new direction. Its call change, and to me its a change for the better. You can already see the difference in strategy and its working. Those guys seem bitter that they are getting phased out. HTC is evolving and I give them kudos rather than keep the same people and be status quo.
I read that story too. While I agree that HTC has suffered I believe that story is hyperbolic. Some execs left, they all seemed to have other jobs lined up pretty quickly. The fact is things weren't going great. The fact that they left might be a good thing as they might be part of the problem.
Another fact is the HTC One has been and will continue to be a success at least through the summer. It needs the 4.2 update to compete. If it launched with 4.2 there really would be no place to complain.
I don't know what the future has for HTC but they are doing better than BlackBerry and Nokia if that means anything. As for the bootloader, you heard of Motorola?
Sent from my LG-LS970 using xda premium
I agree with the better off comments. The guy who is telling his friends to leave we have no idea if he is a disgruntled employee trying to blow the low numbers into a sensationalized story, or if he was legit employee that was valued at the company.
One truth we know, these guys that are leaving are the ones who drove the company downward, so yeah better off without them
Sent from my HTCONE using Tapatalk 2
well I figure no matter what the devs we have here will still keep the one updated even if htc goes under.
sniperkill said:
I too have a HTCONE and love the quality of HTC phones. But I also have a Samsung Note II. As for HTC going down hill, it serves them right for them locking down their bootloaders. First with the Evo 3D, and now the HTCONE. Yeah, I know they gave us htcdev.com but like with samsung devices, its so easy unlocking the bootloaders because Samsung supports our beloved developers. HTC just wants control, or some control, like our parents. Htc wants to say, "no no, you cant do that with your phone, it might hurt it". Htc doesn't want to give us "users" the choice to break our phones if we want, which is why they lock the bootloaders.
Htc thinks their slick too. With the evo 3d they allowed us to unlock our bootloaders but they wouldn't allow us to flash kernels, or downgrade our bootloaders. Which is why our developers found a way to hack into our bootloaders with the evo 3d to gain s-off. But with the HTCONE they also allowed us to unlock our bootloaders, only now they made it possible to flash kernels, their thinking if they gave us access to flash kernels, maybe our developers wouldn't worry about hacking the htcone's bootloader to gain s-off. But little do they know that where ever there's a rule, there's always someone who will find a way to break that rule.
As far as im concerned, htc is getting what they deserve. Htc had some serious followers until they released the evo 3d with a locked bootloader. I alone know of a couple dozen htc fans who stopped buying htc phones just because of that actoin of theirs. So I still bought the htcone thinking they might have learned their lesson, but NOPE, instead they release a dev addition, asking for more money for it. Htc is starting to remind me of Apple, lmao...
Sent from my SPH-L900 using Tapatalk 2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hmm I'm not calling you a liar, but I am skeptical of your "couple dozen fans" story. Even if it was true, it's only a minor amount.
Facts are facts and one fact is the android community that actually hacks, roots, installs custom software or even knows those options are available, is very small. The majority of android users have no idea or care less and it's not even close. Even smaller is the part of the android community that hacks and needs s-off on a phone like the One. I flash custom roms/kernels. S-off would be pretty cool, but it isn't really gonna offer me anything more than I already have. While it's a *bleep* move for HTC to do that, it is hardly the reason they are losing money.
HTC is simply falling off because they don't know how to market. They are doing a better job with the One, but it's almost too little too late. Samsung is the new Apple and the war between Android and Apple consists of Samsung and Iphone/Ipad products thanks to huge, clever marketing. That's pretty much what it boils down to. There is a reason why advertising is so expensive.
---------- Post added at 02:05 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:59 PM ----------
kc_exactly said:
I read that story too. While I agree that HTC has suffered I believe that story is hyperbolic. Some execs left, they all seemed to have other jobs lined up pretty quickly. The fact is things weren't going great. The fact that they left might be a good thing as they might be part of the problem.
Another fact is the HTC One has been and will continue to be a success at least through the summer. It needs the 4.2 update to compete. If it launched with 4.2 there really would be no place to complain.
I don't know what the future has for HTC but they are doing better than BlackBerry and Nokia if that means anything. As for the bootloader, you heard of Motorola?
Sent from my LG-LS970 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Again, the 4.2 update will be nice, but nobody pays attention to that outside of the hacking community.
Samsung s4= Android Jelly Bean
Htc One= Android Jelly Bean.
What's the real difference, the real selling point to an average android user of 4.2 over 4.1 ? They aren't going to care.
You know what they see? They see Samsung commercials banging on Apple, they see software gimmicks like "smart scroll' and other "shinys"
Cool camera features, IR blasters and other goodies to show their friends. They aren't looking for better bluetooth stacks and the like. Heck even windows is getting in on the marketing ploy, showing commercials of android and phone users fighting each other, it's all marketing.
Rippley05 said:
Hmm I'm not calling you a liar, but I am skeptical of your "couple dozen fans" story. Even if it was true, it's only a minor amount.
Facts are facts and one fact is the android community that actually hacks, roots, installs custom software or even knows those options are available, is very small. The majority of android users have no idea or care less and it's not even close. Even smaller is the part of the android community that hacks and needs s-off on a phone like the One. I flash custom roms/kernels. S-off would be pretty cool, but it isn't really gonna offer me anything more than I already have. While it's a *bleep* move for HTC to do that, it is hardly the reason they are losing money.
HTC is simply falling off because they don't know how to market. They are doing a better job with the One, but it's almost too little too late. Samsung is the new Apple and the war between Android and Apple consists of Samsung and Iphone/Ipad products thanks to huge, clever marketing. That's pretty much what it boils down to. There is a reason why advertising is so expensive.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Couldn't have said it better myself. XDA has what... 5 million members world wide... World population is estimated at 7 billions (in 2012)... assume only 1/4 of those own cell phones and lets double the 5 million number... so 1.75 billion potential cellphone users... lets just use the 50% marketshare for android... so 875 million android handsets out there...
10 million / 875 million = 1.1% ... Yes these numbes are 100% pulled out of my behind but we can get even more liberal and says 1/32nd of the total population own cell phones... that would equal roughly 9% of the cellphone population would care about unlocked bootloaders...
Well I don't know the story about unlocked Bootloaders w.r.t. other brands, except I do know it's extremely difficult on iPhones to Jailbreak (if not impossible on iPhone5). But I don't blame HTC at all. I'm sure a lot comes from carriers. They don't want unlocked devices on their network. Sprint/AT&T/T-Mobile etc. is their customer.
I also agree many don't know what a bootloader is, but it's really surprising to see things like RootExplorer, Titanium Backup, ROM Manager etc. as top downloads on Google Play. Although the stats might be skewed with all the "Wiping" and Reflashing
Interesting some see it as a positive move. Well one of the lead technical guys responsible for the HTC One just left. And the CEO said he'll step down if HTC One fails.
Yeah the new direction might be more plastic to compete with Samsung.
sniperkill said:
I too have a HTCONE and love the quality of HTC phones. But I also have a Samsung Note II. As for HTC going down hill, it serves them right for them locking down their bootloaders. First with the Evo 3D, and now the HTCONE. Yeah, I know they gave us htcdev.com but like with samsung devices, its so easy unlocking the bootloaders because Samsung supports our beloved developers. HTC just wants control, or some control, like our parents. Htc wants to say, "no no, you cant do that with your phone, it might hurt it". Htc doesn't want to give us "users" the choice to break our phones if we want, which is why they lock the bootloaders.
Htc thinks their slick too. With the evo 3d they allowed us to unlock our bootloaders but they wouldn't allow us to flash kernels, or downgrade our bootloaders. Which is why our developers found a way to hack into our bootloaders with the evo 3d to gain s-off. But with the HTCONE they also allowed us to unlock our bootloaders, only now they made it possible to flash kernels, their thinking if they gave us access to flash kernels, maybe our developers wouldn't worry about hacking the htcone's bootloader to gain s-off. But little do they know that where ever there's a rule, there's always someone who will find a way to break that rule.
As far as im concerned, htc is getting what they deserve. Htc had some serious followers until they released the evo 3d with a locked bootloader. I alone know of a couple dozen htc fans who stopped buying htc phones just because of that actoin of theirs. So I still bought the htcone thinking they might have learned their lesson, but NOPE, instead they release a dev addition, asking for more money for it. Htc is starting to remind me of Apple, lmao...
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Just so everyone's clear, this is not as big of a reason as this person has made it out to be. The amount of people who care about the bootloader or rooting the phone when buying an HTC phone is probably less than 2%. The problem is they were crushed with Samsung's huge spending on advertising. They even got a little bit of free advertisement for those who just pay attention because of their problems with Apple. That being said, HTC is putting more into advertisement, but they are having a hard time delivering their products. With them now being a B-List consumer for parts, it's hard to deliver the products to the demand. People now have to say "Well, I either settle with a Samsung phone, or wait for an HTC One to become available." I believe they'll bounce back, but it's going to be a tough year if they can't produce more of these phones and get them into the hands of the customers that want them.
sniperkill said:
I too have a HTCONE and love the quality of HTC phones. But I also have a Samsung Note II. As for HTC going down hill, it serves them right for them locking down their bootloaders. First with the Evo 3D, and now the HTCONE. Yeah, I know they gave us htcdev.com but like with samsung devices, its so easy unlocking the bootloaders because Samsung supports our beloved developers. HTC just wants control, or some control, like our parents. Htc wants to say, "no no, you cant do that with your phone, it might hurt it". Htc doesn't want to give us "users" the choice to break our phones if we want, which is why they lock the bootloaders.
Htc thinks their slick too. With the evo 3d they allowed us to unlock our bootloaders but they wouldn't allow us to flash kernels, or downgrade our bootloaders. Which is why our developers found a way to hack into our bootloaders with the evo 3d to gain s-off. But with the HTCONE they also allowed us to unlock our bootloaders, only now they made it possible to flash kernels, their thinking if they gave us access to flash kernels, maybe our developers wouldn't worry about hacking the htcone's bootloader to gain s-off. But little do they know that where ever there's a rule, there's always someone who will find a way to break that rule.
As far as im concerned, htc is getting what they deserve. Htc had some serious followers until they released the evo 3d with a locked bootloader. I alone know of a couple dozen htc fans who stopped buying htc phones just because of that actoin of theirs. So I still bought the htcone thinking they might have learned their lesson, but NOPE, instead they release a dev addition, asking for more money for it. Htc is starting to remind me of Apple, lmao...
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As others have said, it's a very small minority that care about unlocked bootloaders, etc. Companies aren't making huge profits because of the number of people buying the phone for root, S-OFF, etc. Profit margins are based on the masses.
The real problem is the G3 was a helluva phone that was the best android phone at the time, far beating out the Evo3d, which was a crap "upgrade" to the badass Evo. And Samsuck had a helluva marketing scheme. It appears Samsung is now following Apple's lead in putting out new phones without much substance, but people "have to have them" just like iPhone users have to have the latest inconsequential update. The One is a great phone, but there's a reason I didn't renew my contract when I bought the phone. Hopefully HTC can right the ship, cause I love this phone and HTC, but you have to keep up in technology (especially wireless) not just in hardware but also in customers' perception of your products. (marketing)
I will say, I was putzing with my phone this weekend and a friend asked if it was The One, saying he was jealous after I said yep.
eXplicit815 said:
Just so everyone's clear, this is not as big of a reason as this person has made it out to be. The amount of people who care about the bootloader or rooting the phone when buying an HTC phone is probably less than 2%. The problem is they were crushed with Samsung's huge spending on advertising. They even got a little bit of free advertisement for those who just pay attention because of their problems with Apple. That being said, HTC is putting more into advertisement, but they are having a hard time delivering their products. With them now being a B-List consumer for parts, it's hard to deliver the products to the demand. People now have to say "Well, I either settle with a Samsung phone, or wait for an HTC One to become available." I believe they'll bounce back, but it's going to be a tough year if they can't produce more of these phones and get them into the hands of the customers that want them.
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http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=41720350&postcount=8 Did some basic assumptions on that percent.
terrel_b said:
As others have said, it's a very small minority that care about unlocked bootloaders, etc. Companies aren't making huge profits because of the number of people buying the phone for root, S-OFF, etc. Profit margins are based on the masses.
The real problem is the G3 was a helluva phone that was the best android phone at the time, far beating out the Evo3d, which was a crap "upgrade" to the badass Evo. And Samsuck had a helluva marketing scheme. It appears Samsung is now following Apple's lead in putting out new phones without much substance, but people "have to have them" just like iPhone users have to have the latest inconsequential update. The One is a great phone, but there's a reason I didn't renew my contract when I bought the phone. Hopefully HTC can right the ship, cause I love this phone and HTC, but you have to keep up in technology (especially wireless) not just in hardware but also in customers' perception of your products. (marketing)
I will say, I was putzing with my phone this weekend and a friend asked if it was The One, saying he was jealous after I said yep.
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As for the GS3 vs Evo3d... it was actually the GS2 (Epic 4g Touch) vs the EVO3d... GS3 came out later.
numus said:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=41720350&postcount=8 Did some basic assumptions on that percent.
As for the GS3 vs Evo3d... it was actually the GS2 (Epic 4g Touch) vs the EVO3d... GS3 came out later.
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I'm sure that percentage is much less than that even.
HTC hurt itself with Sense 3 as beautiful as it was, it lagged. Sg2 was smooth, a lot of employees at radioshack, best buy and sprint were recommending Samsung over htc because of the lag.
I met a radioshack employee who told me he had the og and got the 3D and then sold it for the sg2. He said he was happy with the move. Hi showed him my 3D at the time and yeah it lagged big time. Interestingly enough the guy told me to check out themikmik for some faster roms than the ones on xda for the 3D.
I don't want to discredit the guy with 12 friends who bailed on htc, they could have been mobile kiosk employees at the mall who recommended Samsung over htc.
Back on the current generation of phones, the one is better, sg4 lags. Might be too late if Samsung developed some brand loyalty over the last 2 yrs. As for the storagr/lack of sd, regular people don't care about it. Only here on xda people care so they can carry entire music collection and/or their pron. I'll be honest I would carry more pron with me lol
Its not the end of htc, someone will buy them to get into the mobile game, give them some cash and breathe life into the brand. I'm thinking HP would be a great company to take over htc.
Again the blame for htc downward trend lies with these guys that are leaving the company
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numus said:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=41720350&postcount=8 Did some basic assumptions on that percent.
As for the GS3 vs Evo3d... it was actually the GS2 (Epic 4g Touch) vs the EVO3d... GS3 came out later.
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Very true and it was the evo lte vs gs3. I think another major issue that plagued the lte was the fact that the form factor is different than the one x.... Samsung made the gs3 the same form factor across the carriers. I believe this helped boost their rep with consumers. Because if I'm not mistaken HTC and sammy were pretty closely tied prior to the gs3 release ( and I know they marketed the **** out of the phone but again they only needed to advertise one device where HTC had what like 17 variants of the one last year?)
As for et4g vs 3d I had both... Twice actually and both times I preferred my 3d by a looooong shot. Battery life was so much better, beats, I liked the development better and as for speed they were close but I'll take a Qualcomm over an exynos anyday. The only reason j kept switching was because I was in a wimax area so refused to upgrade to lte and wanted to play with something else.
Another thing that hurt them was the numerous release of so many different models after the HTC evo all with different names, there was no market branding to it. think of htc sensation htc rhyme htc insert name here. Samsung chose the different route release on all carriers distinguished their brand with a common name "galaxy" series name. Every day users will see a Samsung and go oh that's a galaxy device.
HTC should have stuck to the evo brand as that was the one phone that people recognized and just used that name across the board, they are trying to do this now with the "One" series but it has been a little late.
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My whole thing about sd card is not for more storage to store music and such. It's the damn games that take up all the spaces. Games like Gameloft, gta and such 3d games uses a lot of storage space. I bought a bunch of gameloft games for a buck a piece back then and my son and i loved to play them. I'd be damn if i can't install all the games i have on a such flagship device.
Who knows, maybe just my family who play these games on these capable powerful devices.
sniperkill said:
I too have a HTCONE and love the quality of HTC phones. But I also have a Samsung Note II. As for HTC going down hill, it serves them right for them locking down their bootloaders. First with the Evo 3D, and now the HTCONE. Yeah, I know they gave us htcdev.com but like with samsung devices, its so easy unlocking the bootloaders because Samsung supports our beloved developers. HTC just wants control, or some control, like our parents. Htc wants to say, "no no, you cant do that with your phone, it might hurt it". Htc doesn't want to give us "users" the choice to break our phones if we want, which is why they lock the bootloaders.
Htc thinks their slick too. With the evo 3d they allowed us to unlock our bootloaders but they wouldn't allow us to flash kernels, or downgrade our bootloaders. Which is why our developers found a way to hack into our bootloaders with the evo 3d to gain s-off. But with the HTCONE they also allowed us to unlock our bootloaders, only now they made it possible to flash kernels, their thinking if they gave us access to flash kernels, maybe our developers wouldn't worry about hacking the htcone's bootloader to gain s-off. But little do they know that where ever there's a rule, there's always someone who will find a way to break that rule.
As far as im concerned, htc is getting what they deserve. Htc had some serious followers until they released the evo 3d with a locked bootloader. I alone know of a couple dozen htc fans who stopped buying htc phones just because of that actoin of theirs. So I still bought the htcone thinking they might have learned their lesson, but NOPE, instead they release a dev addition, asking for more money for it. Htc is starting to remind me of Apple, lmao...
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You can't really say that bc apple is locked down tight as far as development goes and they're the most profitable phone developers
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A few years ago, there were a lot less people with smartphones and were rockin phones like Rumor touches because texting was the hot thing. At that time, phones made by HTC were high end and distinct from others so people got to know the HTC brand as awesome! HTC lost that touch at some point and failed to continue that connection with customers by getting a little greedy (imo), trying to fast produce all these different phones at the same time which imo, some of them were soso quality and people started saying bad things about HTC. If they would have stuck with awesome, unique, distinct, and innovative devices, that's what they would be known for today. But instead, now people only see Samsung and Apple as top dogs. The " Quitely Brilliant" slogan fit them very well at one time because HTC was small (compared to Sami/Apple) but had a big punch when they brought a new phone out. Anyhow...I hope HTC can turn this around and if not, hopefully Google will buy them. I absolutely love my ONE btw.....
via phONE.
Chou needs to go. The beats investment, bloated sense 3 and a continuous dive in revenue have all been under his watch . Any other ceo would have been fired long ago.
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