[INFO][EU] Rooting and Flashing don't void the warranty - LG Optimus Black

All Android users were or are wondering whether flashing their device will void the warranties of their devices.
This concerns European customers (EU).
In short :
The FSFE (Free Software Foundation Europe), has concluded that rooting and flashing our devices don't void their warranties. Manufacturers can't refuse to repair a device because modifying or changing system software is not a sufficient reason to void the "statutory warranty". The seller has to prove that the defect is caused by user's actions before completelly voiding the warranty. Unless that, the standard 2 years of the warranty is still valid. So the Directive 1999/44/CE dictates1 protects consummers even if they have rooted and flashed their system in order to use custom ROMs.
FSFE Legal team has analysed this issue and the answer, if the consumer bought it inside the EU, is no.
The consumer does not loose the obligatory 2-year warranty on the device just because the device is flashed.
"A good test to see if it is the software’s fault is to flash it back with stock firmware/OS and see if the problem persists. If it does, it is not a software-caused problem. If it is not possible to revert it to stock software any more, it is also not a software-caused defect. There are very few hardware defects that are caused by software".
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Full article :
Directive 1999/44/CE dictates1 that any object meeting certain criteria (incl. telephones, computers, routers etc.) that is sold to a consumer2. inside the European Union, has to carry a warranty from the seller that the device will meet the quality that you would expect for such a device for a period of 2 years.
A telephone is an example of such a device and is an object that comprises many parts, from the case to the screen to the radio, to a mini-computer, to the battery, to the software that runs it. If any of these parts3 stop working in those 2 years, the seller has to fix or replace them. What is more these repairs should not cost the consumer a single cent — the seller has to cover the expenses (Directive 1999/44/CE, §3). If the seller has any expenses for returning it to the manufacturer, this is not your problem as a consumer.
If your device becomes defective in the first 6 months, it is presumed that the defect was there all along, so you should not need to prove anything.
If your device becomes defective after the first 6 months, but before 2 years run out, you are still covered. The difference is only that if the defect arises now, the seller can claim that the defect was caused by some action that was triggered by non-normal use of the device4. But in order to avoid needing to repair or replace your device, the seller has to prove that your action caused5 the defect. It is generally recognised by courts that unless there is a sign of abuse of the device, the defect is there because the device was faulty from the beginning. That is just common sense, after all.
So, we finally come to the question of rooting, flashing and changing the software. Unless the seller can prove that modifying the software, rooting your device or flashing it with some other OS or firmware was the cause for the defect, you are still covered for defects during those 2 years. A good test to see if it is the software’s fault is to flash it back with stock firmware/OS and see if the problem persists. If it does, it is not a software-caused problem. If it is not possible to revert it stock software any more, it is also not a software-caused defect. There are very few hardware defects that are caused by software — e.g. overriding the speaker volume above the safe level could blow the speaker.
Many manufacturers of consumer devices write into their warranties a paragraph that by changing the software or “rooting” your device, you void the warranty. You have to understand that in EU we have a “statutory warranty”, which is compulsory that the seller must offer by law (Directive 1999/44/CE, §7.1) and a “voluntary warranty” which the seller or manufacturer can, but does not need to, offer as an additional service to the consumer. Usually the “voluntary warranty” covers a longer period of time or additional accidents not covered by law6. If though the seller, the manufacturer or anyone else offers a “voluntary warranty”, he is bound to it as well!
So, even if, by any chance your “voluntary warranty” got voided, by European law, you should still have the 2 year “compulsory warranty” as it is described in the Directive and which is the topic of this article.
In case the seller refuses your right to repair or replace the device, you can sue him in a civil litigation and can report the incident to the national authority. In many European countries such action does not even require hiring a lawyer and is most of the time ensured by consumers associations.
The warranty under this Directive is only applicable inside the European Union and only if you bought the device as a consumer.
[1] EU member states must have by now imported the Directive 1999/44/CE into their national laws. So you should quote also your local law on that topic.
[2] A consumer is a natural person who acts for their own private purposes and not as a professional. .
[3] Batteries can be exempt of this and usually hold only 6 months warranty.
[4] E.g. a defect power button could be caused by spreading marmalade in it or hooking it onto a robot that would continuously press the button every second 24/7 — of course that is not normal or intended use.
[5] Note that correlation is not causation — the defect has to be proven to be caused by your action, not just correlate with it.
[6] E.g. if a device manufacturer guarantees the phone is water- and shock-proof or a car manufacturer offers 7 years of warranty against rust.
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Source, article
Reference : EUR-Lex

Thank you, good info.

So if they refuse, should I print this and give it to them?

To be safe, I flashed and rooted it after my warranty expired.
It'll take time for LG to honour the warranty worldwide.

Welcome locked bootloaders.

In Italy LG warranty doesn't get voided by rooting and custom Rom installation.
I don't know why in other countries it's not the same...
Anyway thank you for sharing this information!
Sent from my LG-P970 using xda app-developers app

Navios92 said:
So if they refuse, should I print this and give it to them?
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yeah you might print the directive itself
the bad side of all of that, is that this situation only applies in Europe for now. I live in France, here the consummers are well protected already. For other countries, you can refer to UE and its related laws.
Visit EUR-Lex for more infos

Many thanks for this :victory:

Cool
Sent from my LG-P970 using xda app-developers app

Francais ? Nikel.
It's so good to read this. Every time i visit LG C. I Flash Official Rom..
Sent from my LG-P970 using xda premium

thank's for your info my bro, matur nuwun sanget

Anyway we can always unroot, I did this when I asked for screen replacement.
The problem would be with people who bricked their USB and can't unroot.

Technically it's also not allowed to lock the bootloader without giving a way of unlocking it since it restrict the software that the user can use on his phone, but theres still lots of phones with locked bootloaders with no way of unlocking it.
Also it's really easy to tell someone bringing their phone into repair that their phone is broken because they did something while having root permissions if the person involved doesn't know electronics so well. It's still a step in a better direction.

I have question from starter!
If i instal some custom rom with overclocked cpu?
And this,just for euro?
And asia?
Sent from my LG-P970 using Tapatalk 2

Night.Sky said:
I have question from starter!
And this,just for euro?
And asia?
Sent from my LG-P970 using Tapatalk 2
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I'm not sure, but if you can send your device in a center located inside EU, it might pass. But since these laws concern european customers, I don't think so...
If i instal some custom rom with overclocked cpu?
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The seller has to prove that the defect is caused by user's actions...
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Great info! Thanks for that.

Not so sure
Not entirely sure this is something to cheer too much about.
It´s nice and all but we know flashing the wrong firmware can brick your phone. I´m not sure manufacturers should be responsible for that and this might encourage them to make it really tough to root the things in the first place.

ScoopyDoopy said:
Not entirely sure this is something to cheer too much about.
It´s nice and all but we know flashing the wrong firmware can brick your phone. I´m not sure manufacturers should be responsible for that and this might encourage them to make it really tough to root the things in the first place.
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flashing is not forbidden, but it's not about that. if a flash process fails, you can consider that fact as a defect since this may be a hardware issue (even if it's software, it should not happen).
it's like formatting a hard disk drive that would fail. so yeah, the manufacturer is responsible and must apply the warranty.

Ilko said:
flashing is not forbidden, but it's not about that. if a flash process fails, you can consider that fact as a defect since this may be a hardware issue (even if it's software, it should not happen).
it's like formatting a hard disk drive that would fail. so yeah, the manufacturer is responsible and must apply the warranty.
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Flashing wrong firmware can damage the phone. If the bootloader tries to initialize the phone with a higher voltage or clock and it stops somewhere in the process it stays with that clock speed and voltage until the phone is switched off again provided it doesn't crash before setting clock and voltages.
If it failed because of hardware then doesn't matter what software you had on it. Then your right, but wrong firmware can damage your phone. Remember the tools thats used for flashing isn't meant for us, it's for software developers or service centers and we shouldn't have access to it. The tools that are meant for us can't flash wrong firmware without there being wrong firmware on it in the first place so if you flash the wrong firmware then it's your fault and thats not hard to prove that theres wrong firmware on it or that the CPU was damaged due to wrong clock or voltage.
Yes this will lead to manufacturers making it harder to root and flash or they will (like HTC) allow unlocking the bootloader through them and explicitly voiding your warranty.
They can have a license agreement when the firmware is run fresh that you have to accept. Which might contain this sneaky line somewhere in small print.
"Running any software on the device that we don't approve voids your warrenty." (And I'm pretty sure that will include rooting software)

xonar_ said:
Flashing wrong firmware can damage the phone. If the bootloader tries to initialize the phone with a higher voltage or clock and it stops somewhere in the process it stays with that clock speed and voltage until the phone is switched off again provided it doesn't crash before setting clock and voltages.
If it failed because of hardware then doesn't matter what software you had on it. Then your right, but wrong firmware can damage your phone. Remember the tools thats used for flashing isn't meant for us, it's for software developers or service centers and we shouldn't have access to it. The tools that are meant for us can't flash wrong firmware without there being wrong firmware on it in the first place so if you flash the wrong firmware then it's your fault and thats not hard to prove that theres wrong firmware on it or that the CPU was damaged due to wrong clock or voltage.
Yes this will lead to manufacturers making it harder to root and flash or they will (like HTC) allow unlocking the bootloader through them and explicitly voiding your warranty.
They can have a license agreement when the firmware is run fresh that you have to accept. Which might contain this sneaky line somewhere in small print.
"Running any software on the device that we don't approve voids your warrenty." (And I'm pretty sure that will include rooting software)
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Click to collapse
yes, but if such programs are leaked, it's their problem, not ours. there is no any law or rule that explicitly forbid software modification. It's open source... and the european directive protects us. I'll even say, that the ability of flashing wrong firmware could be considered as a default. This should not be possible.
people must understand that rooting and flashing are only restricted, not forbidden. I think they simply can't do that legally.

Related

HTC = No warranty?

I bought a HTC One on April.
I am a student so this is important to me:
Cost: 660€ with urBeats headset. Paid 60€ and then I must pay 25€ each month for 2 years. Also 20€ per month for 2 years for Internet + unlimited calls in germany -> 45€/month
K.
On May I unlocked Bootloader. Then put a recovery. Then flashed a custom ROM.
I didn't like it so I flashed the original ROM back within 1-2 days
Ok.
Then 1 week ago the ONE died. It had original ROM on it and ofc unrooted.
Today they phoned me. Due to custom ROMS: No warranty.
I can pay 30€ to get the phone back unrepaired or they suggest me a amount of € I must pay to repair. This suggestion should be at my home in 1-2 days.
Nice eh? Never HTC for me.. No warranty with original ROM, yay!
where did you send it in for repair?
it is right that HTC behaves very rude if it comes to such topics, honestly i would have discussed with them, that in german law they have the need to proof that your custom rom/kernel... damaged the phone a way it would void the warranty (that is also the reason the HTC disclaimer has to say, that unlocking MAY void the warranty ...)
but in germany i never would send a phone to the manufacturer because the shop itself has to deliver a 2 year warranty. for example @ t-mobile store they remove all that can be removed (back cover, sd card if existant), send it in for repair and 24 hours later you already get your spare phone, your phone will not get analyzed until you try to switch it the third time, then they will make a test certificate.
Or did you really send it to O² and they said this to you? then i really would discuss this with the hotline and threaten them that you will change the carrier if they won´t behave like every other carrier ...
hlenforcer said:
where did you send it in for repair?
it is right that HTC behaves very rude if it comes to such topics, honestly i would have discussed with them, that in german law they have the need to proof that your custom rom/kernel... damaged the phone a way it would void the warranty (that is also the reason the HTC disclaimer has to say, that unlocking MAY void the warranty ...)
but in germany i never would send a phone to the manufacturer because the shop itself has to deliver a 2 year warranty. for example @ t-mobile store they remove all that can be removed (back cover, sd card if existant), send it in for repair and 24 hours later you already get your spare phone, your phone will not get analyzed until you try to switch it the third time, then they will make a test certificate.
Or did you really send it to O² and they said this to you? then i really would discuss this with the hotline and threaten them that you will change the carrier if they won´t behave like every other carrier ...
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I sent it to Arvato with some paper like warranty and stuff which o2 gave me to print and such...
I will go to o2 tomorrow and maybe I can get them giving me a new one...
Now I must use the freaking HTC wildfire.......
mmh if o² generally outsourced its repair service to this company and you signed this with your phone contract, then there would be nothing you can do about it besides to discuss german law with arvato ... if this is the case i just got a new reason to keep my more expansive t-mobile contract
edit: just checked it, they indeed outsourced their repairs to arvato and like i read it is the worst repair service available, so you have to discuss it with them
i only can give you the advice to dscuss the terms of german law regarding warranty and device modification and whish you good luck.
i read that it may help to request the boss if your concerns will be ignored (like it seems to happen more than often at this company ...)
uZzY94 said:
I bought a HTC One on April.
I am a student so this is important to me:
Cost: 660€ with urBeats headset. Paid 60€ and then I must pay 25€ each month for 2 years. Also 20€ per month for 2 years for Internet + unlimited calls in germany -> 45€/month
K.
On May I unlocked Bootloader. Then put a recovery. Then flashed a custom ROM.
I didn't like it so I flashed the original ROM back within 1-2 days
Ok.
Then 1 week ago the ONE died. It had original ROM on it and ofc unrooted.
Today they phoned me. Due to custom ROMS: No warranty.
I can pay 30€ to get the phone back unrepaired or they suggest me a amount of € I must pay to repair. This suggestion should be at my home in 1-2 days.
Nice eh? Never HTC for me.. No warranty with original ROM, yay!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You mean you went through all that trouble and didn't read the part on HTCDEV that your warranty will be void should you unlock the phone? That's why people use their phones for a bit to make sure everythings alright, everythings working for a period of time and to wait for S-Off before doing any unlocking.
Regardless of what ROM you have on it, the bootloader will tell all if you are not S-Offed.
ArmedandDangerous said:
You mean you went through all that trouble and didn't read the part on HTCDEV that your warranty will be void should you unlock the phone? That's why people use their phones for a bit to make sure everythings alright, everythings working for a period of time and to wait for S-Off before doing any unlocking.
Regardless of what ROM you have on it, the bootloader will tell all if you are not S-Offed.
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You mean you have Posts: 1,112 and you still are spreading basic mis information. How do you belong to this forum and post so much without knowing the most basic information?
nullkill said:
You mean you have Posts: 1,112 and you still are spreading basic mis information. How do you belong to this forum and post so much without knowing the most basic information?
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What misinformation? It says right there on HTCDEV when you want to unlock your phone.
ArmedandDangerous said:
What misinformation? It says right there on HTCDEV when you want to unlock your phone.
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You can't sign away statutory rights. They can invalidate their warranty if they like, but they are still bound by consumer law.
BenPope said:
You can't sign away statutory rights. They can invalidate their warranty if they like, but they are still bound by consumer law.
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Depends on where you are, and where I'm from an unlocked bootloader is an instant reject. And if the damage caused from the unlocked bootloader, they have every right to reject your claim.
ArmedandDangerous said:
Depends on where you are, and where I'm from an unlocked bootloader is an instant reject. And if the damage caused from the unlocked bootloader, they have every right to reject your claim.
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The OP is in Germany, he's protected by consumer law.
ArmedandDangerous said:
What misinformation? It says right there on HTCDEV when you want to unlock your phone.
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Warranties are not voided by unlocking bootloaders flashing ROMs or kernels. Manufacturers can say whatever BS they wish but most of the world has consumer protections laws that specifically protect people from this sort of insanity. You own the device. It is a computer capable of doing more than what the manufactures will let you. It is your right to alter tinker and unlock the device in any way you like. Consumer protection laws protect us from manufacturers saying that would void our warranty. According to the law in his country and mine manufactures have to prove that the damage was caused by the user. Now we know for 100% software does not cause hardware to fail in our situations. You can say well he overclocked the CPU well in order for the CPU to die the hardware thermal monitoring would have to be broken which could not be caused by software. Considering we can not access the bootloader partitions or the kernel partition without a hardware failure it would be impossible to brick a device and could only happen with hardware failure.
Does it void the warranty of a Mac if I load windows. What about if I take a windows pc and I load a old version of windows or a custom modded version of windows??? What if I take a windows PC and load linux? My warranty is still intact and has to be honored as the computer were made to do all this just as our phones were made to run android both sense stock and custom. Running a OS on a computer or phone that was made for it or even one that isn't has no bearing on hardware failure and has been proven extensively.
nullkill said:
Warranties are not voided by unlocking bootloaders flashing ROMs or kernels. Manufacturers can say whatever BS they wish but most of the world has consumer protections laws that specifically protect people from this sort of insanity. You own the device. It is a computer capable of doing more than what the manufactures will let you. It is your right to alter tinker and unlock the device in any way you like. Consumer protection laws protect us from manufacturers saying that would void our warranty. According to the law in his country and mine manufactures have to prove that the damage was caused by the user. Now we know for 100% software does not cause hardware to fail in our situations. You can say well he overclocked the CPU well in order for the CPU to die the hardware thermal monitoring would have to be broken which could not be caused by software. Considering we can not access the bootloader partitions or the kernel partition without a hardware failure it would be impossible to brick a device and could only happen with hardware failure.
Does it void the warranty of a Mac if I load windows. What about if I take a windows pc and I load a old version of windows or a custom modded version of windows??? What if I take a windows PC and load linux? My warranty is still intact and has to be honored as the computer were made to do all this just as our phones were made to run android both sense stock and custom. Running a OS on a computer or phone that was made for it or even one that isn't has no bearing on hardware failure and has been proven extensively.
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Click to collapse
The hardware thermal monitoring may not break, but with kernels like ElementalX with specific options to allow the phone to run hotter than allowed on stock, there is always a risk of damage.
No it does not void the warranty of a Mac if you install Windows, as bootcamp is provided for by Apple. Kernels and ROMS are NOT provided by HTC. Your warranty would be void should you overclock your GPU/RAM/CPU over long enough periods of time to cause damage unless the manufacturer you purchased those parts from explicitly says that it will cover those damage like EVGA and Intel with their K series chips. Just running a custom rom and installing kernels does not void your warranty, but if they can prove that it WAS caused by these factors, consider your warranty well and truly void.
I'm not advocating HTC's point of view, nor am I on the modder's side. Heck, my HoX has a dead NFC chip from BEFORE I unlocked my phone. Warranty got rejected, and consumer law isn't strong enough here that I can fight for it to be fixed. I'm just giving a different point of view so that everyone understands what HTC/local distributor/customers will and have faced.
Just out of curiosity (haven't rooted yet), is there any possibility of a root method that won't void warranty? That would mean not unlocking the bootloader, right? If bootloader is locked, could custom kernels still be flashed?
BenPope said:
The OP is in Germany, he's protected by consumer law.
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But wouldn't the clause on HTC about "you may void your warranty when you unlock the bootloader" take precedent first? I'm just asking.
---------- Post added at 04:12 AM ---------- Previous post was at 04:11 AM ----------
vokkE said:
Just out of curiosity (haven't rooted yet), is there any possibility of a root method that won't void warranty? That would mean not unlocking the bootloader, right? If bootloader is locked, could custom kernels still be flashed?
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Click to collapse
Yes if we have S-OFF
---------- Post added at 04:17 AM ---------- Previous post was at 04:12 AM ----------
nullkill said:
Warranties are not voided by unlocking bootloaders flashing ROMs or kernels. Manufacturers can say whatever BS they wish but most of the world has consumer protections laws that specifically protect people from this sort of insanity. You own the device. It is a computer capable of doing more than what the manufactures will let you. It is your right to alter tinker and unlock the device in any way you like. Consumer protection laws protect us from manufacturers saying that would void our warranty. According to the law in his country and mine manufactures have to prove that the damage was caused by the user. Now we know for 100% software does not cause hardware to fail in our situations. You can say well he overclocked the CPU well in order for the CPU to die the hardware thermal monitoring would have to be broken which could not be caused by software. Considering we can not access the bootloader partitions or the kernel partition without a hardware failure it would be impossible to brick a device and could only happen with hardware failure.
Does it void the warranty of a Mac if I load windows. What about if I take a windows pc and I load a old version of windows or a custom modded version of windows??? What if I take a windows PC and load linux? My warranty is still intact and has to be honored as the computer were made to do all this just as our phones were made to run android both sense stock and custom. Running a OS on a computer or phone that was made for it or even one that isn't has no bearing on hardware failure and has been proven extensively.
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Click to collapse
HTC specifically mentioned that you may void your warranty by unlocking it. That protects them from people flashing their phones. And the consumer should read the terms and conditions of owning any device. I'm not siding with HTC but they made it clear that you may void your warranty when you unlocked your bootloader. So basically they can decide whether or not it is covered under warranty for unlocked bootloaders.
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ArmedandDangerous said:
The hardware thermal monitoring may not break, but with kernels like ElementalX with specific options to allow the phone to run hotter than allowed on stock, there is always a risk of damage.
No it does not void the warranty of a Mac if you install Windows, as bootcamp is provided for by Apple. Kernels and ROMS are NOT provided by HTC. Your warranty would be void should you overclock your GPU/RAM/CPU over long enough periods of time to cause damage unless the manufacturer you purchased those parts from explicitly says that it will cover those damage like EVGA and Intel with their K series chips. Just running a custom rom and installing kernels does not void your warranty, but if they can prove that it WAS caused by these factors, consider your warranty well and truly void.
I'm not advocating HTC's point of view, nor am I on the modder's side. Heck, my HoX has a dead NFC chip from BEFORE I unlocked my phone. Warranty got rejected, and consumer law isn't strong enough here that I can fight for it to be fixed. I'm just giving a different point of view so that everyone understands what HTC/local distributor/customers will and have faced.
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Click to collapse
Sorry I do not support your point of view. Your POV is that we can't do anything and that you shouldn't be informed. Your rights mean nothing unless you know them. The more people who know their rights and exercise them the less we will see companies behave in this way. I will not spread false information like rooting or unlocking voids warranties which is contrary to the LAW. I will not tell people well the company said this and you have to take it. I will tell people the truth and their rights and hope they use that knowledge to exercise their rights and make the companies behave in accordance with the law. Having people such as yourself who are only trying to help (the companies) by spreading false information that isn't true making the people feel like it's not possible and there fore helping the companies take advantage of people and break the law. That plain pisses me off.
As for thermal throttling you are not 100% correct. Yes you can adjust where thermal throttling kicks in you can not disable it. The SOC will straight shutdown when the phone hits a certain temperature and will not turn back on until the device has cooled. This is a thermal shutdown that would have to malfunction in order to damage a SoC.
I understand you had a bad experience but that was due to your lack of knowledge about the laws and how to deal with companies/manufacturers and I would prefer you didn't share that kind of info with people allowing the manufactures to continue to screw us over. Good JOB!!!
And last Kernels and ROMS are provided by HTC (not well as they have some problems complying with open source). HTC and ever other manufactuer is required to provide complete source code for kernels and ROMS.
I am not trying to be mean but you need to do some research based on facts before you start telling people how it is. Of course HTC will deny as many warranty request as possible this is not new info to anyone. Every single person knows manufacturers will try and screw us over.
I am done on this topic as I am so tired of all the wrong information and people who support the companies that screw them over.
@nullkill the video about rooting will not void warranty doesn't talk about unlocking the bootloader. You can root a device without unlocking the BL.
Does the united states have consumer protection laws like this?
Sent from my HTC One
I got warranty rejected due to bootloader, called them up, told them the number of htc phones i have ( one from all generations since G1) n played dumb on bootloader and tey honoured my warranty. try that
shadowboy23 said:
But wouldn't the clause on HTC about "you may void your warranty when you unlock the bootloader" take precedent first? I'm just asking.
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Click to collapse
Like I said, the warranty can be voided, they are not obliged to provide a warranty.
However, consumer protection law in Europe is far stronger than a warranty, and you can't sign that away.
An important note is that consumer protection law is with the retailer, not the manufacturer. The implication is that you need to deal with the retailer, not HTC.
ECEXCURSION said:
Does the united states have consumer protection laws like this?
Sent from my HTC One
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Click to collapse
I have always assumed here in the US that unlocking an HTC device opens up the possibility that a warranty claim may be rejected. I know that many auto manufacturers, for example, have successfully denied warranty claims because the owner could not prove the oil changes were done properly. How you treat your product does make a difference; a manufacturer can reject a claim if you have abused your product outside of it's design limits (provided they warn you), be it a radio, TV, or automobile.
I think HTC has been pretty good about fixing the hardware. However, I have a different opinion than some posted here. In particular, HTC devices tend to run hot. If a bad ROM or other OS level software caused motherboard failure due to prolonged heat, I could see that HTC could take the position that they designed the hardware for a certain set of circumstances, and apparently the ROM over ran those circumstances. Even a hardware thermal cutoff may be too high over time. HTC designs the phones to last; ROM modifiers don't necessarily have the same information or inclination.
When we unlock, we essentially acknowledge that HTC is modifying the warranty in response - as they clearly state.
This stuff is my opinion; you'd have to ask a lawyer about US consumer law.
---------- Post added at 11:47 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:43 PM ----------
shadowboy23 said:
@nullkill the video about rooting will not void warranty doesn't talk about unlocking the bootloader. You can root a device without unlocking the BL.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How would one go about doing this? All the root methods I've seen require flashing a different recovery.
---------- Post added at 11:48 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:47 PM ----------
ArmedandDangerous said:
You mean you went through all that trouble and didn't read the part on HTCDEV that your warranty will be void should you unlock the phone? That's why people use their phones for a bit to make sure everythings alright, everythings working for a period of time and to wait for S-Off before doing any unlocking.
Regardless of what ROM you have on it, the bootloader will tell all if you are not S-Offed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually, S-Off would not matter in this case; the phone was dead, and the user could not take advantage of S-Off to reset to stock...

root and warranty in the EU/UK

Hi,
I am sorry if this common knowledge around here, but it took me a while to find so I thought it might be worth posting this info here.
I am considering rooting just so that I can save large files from games to my sd card, I was worried about this knox thing (never had a Samsung before) and voiding my warranty just so I can do this.
I have found the following post that seems to confirm that rooting alone DOES NOT void your warranty if you are in the UK, regardless of what happens to Knox...
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1998801
This forum is obviously international and this just applies to the EU, but I thought it worth posting if it helps others like it helped me.
WARNING!!!
Before you unknowingly get people into bad situation you might want to consider this post as-well. Your link is very old and has been refused on several instances. Basically has not created any useful precedence to my knowledge.
Also KNOX put a whole new spin on the issue.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=45570695&postcount=4
I posted it before in one of the topic, but Im gonna repost again.
Regarding this topic discussed and this EU directive, I contacted both, Samsung Latvia, aswell as Consumer Rights Protection Centre.
In short - Samsung still stands on its warranty card, saying that rooting will void the warranty.
CRPC States, that they take sides with Samsung. Because they have such point in warranty, they cannot "protect me".
So only way something would change in Latvia (its in EU) is, if I would take Samsung to court telling that, the "rooting voids warranty" point in their warranty card is against EU rules (or w/e rules) and court would agree on me. No way Im doing that
Whats unofficial way of dealing against KNOX 0x1 when you take your phone to warranty service center is different story. Sometimes they might just fix your phone under warranty and reset the fuse (Like it was sayd in different post). Just dont count on that.
Hmmm, thanks,
This looks to be a very complex area, I was not meaning to mislead and I apologise if that's what has happened.
There looks to be a lot of concussion over who the warranty is actually with, either EE (in my case) or Samsung. I have to admit I don't understand the difference, if there is some law that states that the phone should be covered by the warranty, then what does it matter who it is with?
Has there been no precedent of someone having their phone rooted and still having it covered under warranty?
i also don't understand why Knox changed things? My understanding from reading some Samsung press is that Knox is designed for business platforms where the 'one device for work and home' idea can be supported by corporations it departments to make sure the devices are safe. It's disappointing that this same technology prevents personal users from doing what we want with our phones.
i appreciate that all I am trying to do is save large files (in this case for games) is a google policy change, not Samsung, but if rooting is the only way that I can utilise the expansion that the SD offers then it's also disappointing that this would void my warranty?!
I understand the 'root voids warranty' that is plastered all over can, but am just asking...
btw
I do not understand why even the warranty is lost just because I got root??? whether it is this or that Samsung or HTC or some other mobile.
I find it this is an old primitive law.
For me it means: root = admin
Fo example: I'm admin on my PC with Win7 and I still do have warranty for all my coponents or?
Just try to imagine you loose warranty for your motherboard or graphik card cos you have admin rights. lol
A S5 is for me like an PC that I can use how I want it to.
In Sweden we have a nice law for the consumer.
Warranty is totally optional. Samsung voids the warranty when rooting but we have something called "reklamationsrätt".
This forces the seller (not Samsung) to fix the phone (factory faults) within 3 years from purchase. The store has to solve the problem with Samsung (not our problem).
http://www.hallakonsument.se/other-languages/other-languages/english-engelska1/consumer-sales-act/
"During the first six months after the purchase, it is up to the seller to prove that the fault did not exist when the good was first purchased. When more than six months have passed after the purchase, the onus is upon you as the purchaser, to prove that the fault existed from the very beginning.
According to the Consumer Sales Act, your right to complain expires three years after you received the good. This applies to goods and services you purchased on that day or later. The product may have a guarantee period shorter than three years, but this does not shorten the complaint period according to the act."
Burden of proof is much higher for businesses compared to the consumer.
We really don't need the warranty here.
It is always optional for the seller to provide guarantees. They can't negotiate their way around "reklamationsrätten" regulated in the consumer purchases act. IT'S THE LAW!
Read about warranty here:
http://www.hallakonsument.se/other-languages/other-languages/english-engelska1/warranties/
So, if they can't prove that the fault is caused by root, they can't deny us to get it fixes. After the six months they will still fix obvious errors that can not be explained by root or bad use. As I said, the burden of proof is much lower for the consumer.
Other countries could have laws like this? At least within EU?
Edit:
I understand why Samsung voids the warranty. Samsung can't be held responsible for problems with the software on the phone if you have modified it. Then it is not something that Samsung want's to waste money on to fix. It's your problem.
Orka82 said:
In Sweden we have a nice law for the consumer.
Warranty is totally optional. Samsung voids the warranty when rooting but we have something called "reklamationsrätt".
This forces the seller (not Samsung) to fix the phone (factory faults) within 3 years from purchase. The store has to solve the problem with Samsung (not our problem).
http://www.konsumentverket.se/otherlanguages/English/Consumer-rights/Defective-goodsComplaint-/
"During the first six months after the purchase, it is up to the seller to prove that the fault did not exist when the good was first purchased. When more than six months have passed after the purchase, the onus is upon you as the purchaser, to prove that the fault existed from the very beginning.
According to the Consumer Purchases Act, your right to complain expires three years after you received the good. This applies to goods and services you purchased on that day or later. The product may have a guarantee period shorter than three years, but this does not shorten the complaint period according to the act."
Burden of proof is much higher for businesses compared to the consumer.
We really don't need the warranty here.
It is always optional for the seller to provide guarantees. They can't negotiate their way around "reklamationsrätten" regulated in the consumer purchases act. IT'S THE LAW!
Read about warranty here:
http://www.konsumentverket.se/otherlanguages/English/Consumer-rights/Guarantee/
So, if they can't prove that the fault is caused by root, they can't deny us to get it fixes. After the six months they will still fix obvious errors that can not be explained by root or bad use. As I said, the burden of proof is much lower for the consumer.
Other countries could have laws like this? At least within EU?
Edit:
I understand why Samsung voids the warranty. Samsung can't be held responsible for problems with the software on the phone if you have modified it. Then it is not something that Samsung want's to waste money on to fix. It's your problem.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nice post. I can't understand why they can't just void the software side of warranty...
craigcrawford1988 said:
Nice post. I can't understand why they can't just void the software side of warranty...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I rooted my Galaxy S 5 the second day I got it but that was my choice and whenever you root your device you must realise the minute something goes wrong it is your own responsibility to fix it. The software in an android phone is responsible for a lot of aspects considering hardware like managing how hot and fast the cpu is, how your light works, your file system etc. The hardware is designed in a very specific manner and is set to run in a specific manner, when you root your phone you can change all that. You can force the hardware to run in "untested" ways so Samsung and other mobile manufacturers will not support when things go wrong because you use the phone in the way it wasn't designed to do.
I wouldn't go jumping on the rooting bandwagon if you're unsure about anything. I'd say do your research first and ask yourself why you want to root and also ask yourself are you going to be able to afford to fix it when things go wrong? I rooted my phone to change how my phone looks and get rid of things I don't need. Just remember when you root you cannot expect to receive help from the manufacturer when it goes wrong.
gareth261987 said:
I rooted my Galaxy S 5 the second day I got it but that was my choice and whenever you root your device you must realise the minute something goes wrong it is your own responsibility to fix it. The software in an android phone is responsible for a lot of aspects considering hardware like managing how hot and fast the cpu is, how your light works, your file system etc. The hardware is designed in a very specific manner and is set to run in a specific manner, when you root your phone you can change all that. You can force the hardware to run in "untested" ways so Samsung and other mobile manufacturers will not support when things go wrong because you use the phone in the way it wasn't designed to do.
I wouldn't go jumping on the rooting bandwagon if you're unsure about anything. I'd say do your research first and ask yourself why you want to root and also ask yourself are you going to be able to afford to fix it when things go wrong? I rooted my phone to change how my phone looks and get rid of things I don't need. Just remember when you root you cannot expect to receive help from the manufacturer when it goes wrong.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Im thinking about PC and Windows. Its responsible for the same stuff. If you want, you can cook your PC in breakfeast... But still - I have full access on my computer, I want same things on my phone. And it shouldnt void the warranty...
Stiflerlv said:
Im thinking about PC and Windows. Its responsible for the same stuff. If you want, you can cook your PC in breakfeast... But still - I have full access on my computer, I want same things on my phone. And it shouldnt void the warranty...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
the computer is still more robust in that sense, also if you deleted files from windows which you shouldn't delete then the manufacturer would not fix it for free. If you fried the motherboard due to over clocking your computer that too wouldn't be covered by warranty. Now am not defending the manufacturers but with the amount of people that brick phones or root without knowing what they're doing would cost a lot of money to rectify.
Stiflerlv said:
Im thinking about PC and Windows. Its responsible for the same stuff. If you want, you can cook your PC in breakfeast... But still - I have full access on my computer, I want same things on my phone. And it shouldnt void the warranty...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
:good: :good: :good: :good: :good:
gareth261987 said:
the computer is still more robust in that sense, also if you deleted files from windows which you shouldn't delete then the manufacturer would not fix it for free. If you fried the motherboard due to over clocking your computer that too wouldn't be covered by warranty. Now am not defending the manufacturers but with the amount of people that brick phones or root without knowing what they're doing would cost a lot of money to rectify.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
and I would never go for service center just because of software glitch... Reinstall and move on. Same goes for Phones. Its normal if they wouldnt cover software problems with rooted phones, and approch same way you can apporch computers - reinstall -> test -> give back.

[Q] HTC Denying a warranty repair - advice

Hi all,
HTC have been denying me a warranty repair on my HTC One because I installed a custom rom (android revolution).
Now, the phone died in it's stock state. It had software errors (random car mode launching, going into landscape on the homescreen, rebooting apps) so I installed android revolution to see if it would fix it. It didn't, and it turns out the PCB Main board needs replacing. By this point, I couldn't revert to stock, so I checked the warranty info thoroughly which doesn't explicitly prohibit the unlocking of the bootloader.
3 months later, they are still refusing to repair my handset simply because it has a custom bootloader on. I've done my research and posted on their Facebook pages (can't link as I'm a new user).
And I got a call just telling me I was wrong, essentially. I posted another one today (can't get the link to it for some reason) but it's on HTC's and HTC Australia's main page.
Any thoughts or advice?
Cheers
gabjam said:
so I checked the warranty info thoroughly which doesn't explicitly prohibit the unlocking of the bootloader.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
See in red.
In orange is their explanation why they might void your warranty.
HTC is committed to listening to users and delivering customer satisfaction. We have heard your voice and starting now, we will allow our bootloader to be unlocked for 2011 models going forward. Please keep an eye on this website for more details on which devices will be adding this feature. We are extremely pleased to see the energy and enthusiasm from our fans and loyal customers, and we are excited to see what you are capable of. HTC eagerly anticipates your innovations.
It is our responsibility to caution you that not all claims resulting or caused by or from the unlocking of the bootloader may be covered under warranty. Please note that unlocking your bootloader does not mean that you will be able to unlock the SIM lock. Unlocking your SIM lock is at the discretion of your operator/carrier and is not part of the bootloader unlocking scope.
Our devices have been designed with our hardware and software specifications in mind and unlocking the bootloader will change the software and may cause unexpected side effects. It is impossible for HTC to ensure the proper functioning of your device after this. In the worst case scenario, it is possible that your device may be physically damaged due to overheating or the behavior of your device might be altered including, but not limited to, hearing aid compatibility (HAC) and specific absorption rate (SAR) values.
Some content on your device may also be invalidated and cannot be accessed any more because of invalid DRM security keys. This includes content that you may have purchased through a 3rd party vendor and through HTC. Furthermore, although you will still be able to receive updates to your device via FOTA (“firmware over the air”), we do not guarantee that updating your device via FOTA will not render your device unusable. Please understand that you will not be able to return your device to the original state and going forward your device may not be held covered under the warranty for all claims resulting from the unlocking of the bootloader. HTC bears no responsibility if your device is no longer usable afterwards.
HTC is committed to assisting customers in unlocking bootloaders for HTC devices. However, due to some of our carrier customers concerns, certain models with specific restrictions may not be able to be unlocked. Please refer to our list of supported devices to see if your device is eligible for unlocking the bootloader.
We strongly suggest that you do not unlock the bootloader unless you are confident that you understand the risks involved. This is a technical procedure and the side effects could possibly necessitate repairs to your device not covered under warranty. If you are still interested in unlocking the bootloader, and you understand the consequences both to your device and to your warranty, then you may refer to the following pages where we have provided the unlocking instructions.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
http://www.htcdev.com/bootloader
Its a well known fact that you must return your phone back to stock before sending your phone to repair under warranty. Also you shouldn't try to troubleshoot it yourself and take the risk to void the warranty if you still have one.
Its like opening a computer case to try to fix it yourself, then bringing back the computer to the store and asking them to repair it under warranty. They will see that little "void if removed" stickers is torn and will refuse to repair it, same for the "UNLOCKED" flag in the bootloader.
Sorry
Awesome thanks for your detailed reply!
I feel I'm a little in a grey area here as the hardware broke before I installed the ROM and much of their information relates to the warranty being voided if the ROM causes the damage. By the time I went to revert to stock the phone had deteriorated and wouldn't charge or connect to anything so I couldn't get it back in Stock condition.
The phrase 'resulting from or caused by' unlocking the bootloader seems to apply to damage caused by unlocking the phone, whereas mine broke under stock conditions. I was aware of the risks of unlocking the bootloader but as the problems initially manifested as software bugs my first thought was to change the software, by which point I couldn't revert back...
gabjam said:
Awesome thanks for your detailed reply!
I feel I'm a little in a grey area here as the hardware broke before I installed the ROM
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
but you can't prove them that the problem started before unlocking the bootloader but they can prove that you have unlocked it so the warning above apply. Sad story but its how big corporations protect themselves. Hardware damage can really happen when using custom software (e.g. overclocking the cpu too much using a custom rom/kernel) so they need a way to invalid the warranty in these cases.
---------- Post added at 07:37 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:33 PM ----------
gabjam said:
but as the problems initially manifested as software bugs
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But unfortunately this issue was probably caused by a defective usb port, most likely the ID pin shorted somewhere and triggering car mode, like if the phone was inserted in a car dock or something like this.
Yeah it was caused by a defective USB port - but it was still charging and connecting at the time so I initially thought buggy software. The USB port then deteriorated.
It would be easier for all parties involved if they simply stated that while they allow unlocking the bootloader, it will automatically void your warranty. Rather than all the ifs and mays around their disclaimers at the moment which are open to interpretation.
Thanks for your replies guys. I appreciate your time.
alray said:
but you can't prove them that the problem started before unlocking the bootloader but they can prove that you have unlocked it so the warning above apply. Sad story but its how big corporations protect themselves. Hardware damage can really happen when using custom software (e.g. overclocking the cpu too much using a custom rom/kernel) so they need a way to invalid the warranty in these cases.
---------- Post added at 07:37 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:33 PM ----------
But unfortunately this issue was probably caused by a defective usb port, most likely the ID pin shorted somewhere and triggering car mode, like if the phone was inserted in a car dock or something like this.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just a thought - its easy to see how overclocking can damage the processing components or memory components etc, but realistically could they claim a custom rom could somehow damage the USB port?
gabjam said:
Just a thought - its easy to see how overclocking can damage the processing components or memory components etc, but realistically could they claim a custom rom could somehow damage the USB port?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Overheating can damage any components including ports.
Make your phone full stock
Remove tempered
Lock bootloader not relock
For all of this you need S Off which may cost you $25
gabjam said:
Hi all,
HTC have been denying me a warranty repair on my HTC One because I installed a custom rom (android revolution).
Now, the phone died in it's stock state. It had software errors (random car mode launching, going into landscape on the homescreen, rebooting apps) so I installed android revolution to see if it would fix it. It didn't, and it turns out the PCB Main board needs replacing. By this point, I couldn't revert to stock, so I checked the warranty info thoroughly which doesn't explicitly prohibit the unlocking of the bootloader.
3 months later, they are still refusing to repair my handset simply because it has a custom bootloader on. I've done my research and posted on their Facebook pages (can't link as I'm a new user).
And I got a call just telling me I was wrong, essentially. I posted another one today (can't get the link to it for some reason) but it's on HTC's and HTC Australia's main page.
Any thoughts or advice?
Cheers
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi,
I have a good track record for complaining and winning so this is how I would approach the issue.
Firstly find the CEO for your regional office's name and email.
When you have nothing to lose go straight to the top it normally gets the quickest response!
Firstly explain (in an email to CEO) how you are a loyal customer to HTC and love the brand because of the flexibility and customisation acheived through this brand like no other.
You have followed the unlocking process exactly as described on the HTC dev site in an attempt to resolve an issue with your phone that developed earlier while still stock.
You realise this was a mistake now but feel let down by the brand that is technically more foward thinking than any other on the market.
You accept liability that your problem could be affiliated to the modifications you have made and may have jepordised your warranty but feel in some way HTC are partly accountable.
You could use this scenario,HTC gave you the keys to the candy store for you to browse and sample at your own convienience,however if you over step the mark in the shop you could be arrested.
No where in their T+C's does it provide an acceptable line to cross which seems a bit unfair.
They have waved a carrot in front of your nose,but snatched it away when it suited them when in their opinion you over stepped their threshold...which do no know is!
Could the company compromise on this occasion and perhaps meet you half way with the repair and take some accountability?
You really love the product and want to remain loyal but truly hoped their customer service would mirror their 1st class product.
Quite often companies like this will waiver bills and repair costs if they think you will remain a loyal customer and spread their name around.
Just think if they wasted a few hundred £'s on you you might influence several people to buy their brand by reputation which is the best marketing tool for any up and coming company.
As i say i have taken this route before and been honest but also expressed my dissapointment in a mature way and had positive results in less than 24hrs.
you could get a good discount which is better than nothing at all and you have nothing to lose at the moment!
Shepps

Denied warranty on rooted oneplus 3

Hello guys, i recently made a post on reddit oneplus subreddit about how i was denied warranty for my oneplus 3 phone since i was rooted and i was told i should share it here so here it goes.
So I went to the oneplus service center today since my display had some issues. My phone was in the warranty period. Right on checking the phone the guy says that since this is a rooted phone they don't provide hardware warranty. I argued with him saying that oneplus advertises quite proudly that rooting does not infact void your warranty so how can they claim otherwise. On this I was told that they have officially been given in mail that hardware warranty will be void on rooted phone and it will only get software warranty. After arguing with him for quite some time he threatened me that if he marks this phone as rooted in the system I will never ever be able to claim warranty on the phone. I literally had to pleade and beg him for several hours to change the display did he finally agree. Even in this he said he is doing a big favor to me and warned me not to ever root the device again if I want warranty.
Now I want to ask has oneplus officially changed their policy on rooting? If so why does their website still say that rooting does not void your warranty if the service center claims otherwise.
The technical process of rooting or unlocking the bootloader does not void the warranty of a OnePlus device. However, we strongly suggest for you to only root or unlock the bootloader of your OnePlus device if you are confident in your understanding of the risks involved.
By accessing resources regularly unavailable to the software, you may damage your hardware during or after the procedure. Such damage is not covered under warranty. In warranty handling, we will first need to verify that any faulty behavior is unrelated to rooting / unlocking.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is what the website tells us about rooting and warranty. (source: https://oneplus.net/nl/support/answer/will-rooting-or-unlocking-the-bootloader-void-my-warranty)
As far as I know the policy didn't change. I can understand the confusion from the service center point of view, but there is no such thing as hardware or software warranty. Only hardware damage caused by software related hacks/tweaks (which can be used after unlocking/rooting), is not covered under warranty. I assume your screen damage does not fall under that category and it is caused by fall damage for example.
Bobbika said:
This is what the website tells us about rooting and warranty. (source: https://oneplus.net/nl/support/answer/will-rooting-or-unlocking-the-bootloader-void-my-warranty)
As far as I know the policy didn't change. I can understand the confusion from the service center point of view, but there is no such thing as hardware or software warranty. Only hardware damage caused by software related hacks/tweaks (which can be used after unlocking/rooting), is not covered under warranty. I assume your screen damage does not fall under that category and it is caused by fall damage for example.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I did not have a screen damage, my phone screen had lost sensitivity and was registering swipe motion as touch . This started happening even before I was rooted and in no way connected to the process of rooting. They tried to deny me warranty on this.
i_rock098 said:
I did not have a screen damage, my phone screen had lost sensitivity and was registering swipe motion as touch . This started happening even before I was rooted and in no way connected to the process of rooting. They tried to deny me warranty on this.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
May i ask in what country this happend? It's not only Oneplus that does this stuff btw. Next time show him what is on the site. If he denies you simply ask his name and send Oneplus a email about it.. I can work at a service center too and say this stuff.. Its not only Oneplus..
i_rock098 said:
I did not have a screen damage, my phone screen had lost sensitivity and was registering swipe motion as touch . This started happening even before I was rooted and in no way connected to the process of rooting. They tried to deny me warranty on this.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In that case I'd say it was your own risk to start rooting your device after you knew there were issues with it.
The problem with the current warranty policy is that it's hard to prove what damage rooting could cause. In your case the repair shop could say that you might have overclocked your device with the acquired root. With that the device can overheat and the digitizer (which handles the touchscreen input) could be overheated as well and starts to fail. Not saying that is the case here, but it would be hard to prove otherwise.
In other words, when you have to deal with warranty and repair, it's a good advice to give them no reasons to deny the warranty.
TLDR: Repair your device before rooting
At least here in Germany this is illegal and NOT possible. At least the given by law warranty has to be given even with root unless they can prove it caused the defect, so they have to prove their claim and not you. Any extened warranty from the company itself can be waaay different though.
Puddi_Puddin said:
May i ask in what country this happend? It's not only Oneplus that does this stuff btw. Next time show him what is on the site. If he denies you simply ask his name and send Oneplus a email about it.. I can work at a service center too and say this stuff.. Its not only Oneplus..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is in India. we have one of the worst consumer policies in the world where often service centers treat customers like ****. He was pretty confident in telling me to go talk to oneplus if i want it wont help and that if he ever marks the phone as rooted in the system i would never ever be able to claim warranty on the phone.
Bobbika said:
In that case I'd say it was your own risk to start rooting your device after you knew there were issues with it.
The problem with the current warranty policy is that it's hard to prove what damage rooting could cause. In your case the repair shop could say that you might have overclocked your device with the acquired root. With that the device can overheat and the digitizer (which handles the touchscreen input) could be overheated as well and starts to fail. Not saying that is the case here, but it would be hard to prove otherwise.
In other words, when you have to deal with warranty and repair, it's a good advice to give them no reasons to deny the warranty.
TLDR: Repair your device before rooting
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree that I should have gone to fix it before rooting but then again if they had not mentioned on their site clearly that rooting does not void your warranty I would have not rooted at all in the first place till my warranty period got over. I dont mind taking a brunt for a fault of mine due to flashing like getting stuck in a bootlop or something but this clearly was a manufacturing defect and not mine.
emuandco said:
At least here in Germany this is illegal and NOT possible. At least the given by law warranty has to be given even with root unless they can prove it caused the defect, so they have to prove their claim and not you. Any extened warranty from the company itself can be waaay different though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah unfortunately I am in India and here like i mentioned in the post earlier we have very weak consumer laws, even if i would sue them the case would drag on for like 5 years with no guaranty that it would still get resolved.
@i_rock098
I have no local stores in my country, everything must be shipped. When facing a problem you need to get some repair ticket from the website. That would mean you don't need the ... local support store. Also it should be possible to simply restore the phone's software to stock before sending it to OnePlus. Have you tried bringing itr back to stock or is the phone freaking out in a way making it impossible?
LS.xD said:
@i_rock098
I have no local stores in my country, everything must be shipped. When facing a problem you need to get some repair ticket from the website. That would mean you don't need the ... local support store. Also it should be possible to simply restore the phone's software to stock before sending it to OnePlus. Have you tried bringing itr back to stock or is the phone freaking out in a way making it impossible?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And to add to this.
If you have an issue with your phone feel free to make a post. As long as you provide decent information I'm pretty sure people including me are here to you help you.
Repeat after me, the store is in INDIA. I don't do business with India. I did business with OnePlus China and OnePlus US and received superior assistance, including a free replacement phone when my rooted phone could not be repaired.
These are topics where OnePlus customer service could (and should) step in and make a name for themselves, or at least start to.
OP, send a support ticket to OnePlus, add the e-mail address of the service centre to the cc and when you get a response from OnePlus, go back and politely ask them to repair the phone according to the OnePlus warranty terms.
Forget these repair shops in India. These are probably not official OnePlus service centers, as I don't think they have stores set up anywhere. According to the YouTube video that they OnePlus made, they only offer repair services through their website, OnePlus.net/support. You need to contact them via phone (It is listed on their website), and they will then determine if it needs to be sent to them for repair via RMA. https://youtu.be/KCdu8VhleVM
jim262 said:
Forget these repair shops in India. These are probably not official OnePlus service centers, as I don't think they have stores set up anywhere. According to the YouTube video that they OnePlus made, they only offer repair services through their website, OnePlus.net/support. You need to contact them via phone (It is listed on their website), and they will then determine if it needs to be sent to them for repair via RMA. https://youtu.be/KCdu8VhleVM
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There are official repair centres (approved by OnePlus but not run by them) for OnePlus in India. But I don't know whether the OP went to an official centre or not.
As with almost all official repair centres of any manufacturer, there are two ways of asking for repair during warranty. One is what is mentioned by you ie. contact OnePlus directly, they will issue a ticket number and then armed with that, you approach the repair centre. The other way is directly walking into the repair centre and asking for warranty repair. I think the OP adopted this and as is likely in most such situations, the repair centre tried to outsmart him. IMO, if the OP had contacted OnePlus first, this issue might not have arisen at all.
I am speaking on the authority of my experience of approaching Acer directly the first time and going to the repair centre directly the second time. Ofcourse the second time I was given a run around which I ultimately overcame.

Samsung Galaxy S20 FE 5G Cloudy / Distorted/ Pixelated Display when black

Hi there,
I've recently bought the Samsung Galaxy S20 FE 5G ( SM-G781B) and I've noticed part of the display is cloudy/distorted when black.
It's most noticeable on the lock screen, or whenever the background is black.
It looks like some sort of defect. Does anyone have any ideas?
I noticed some cloudiness (to a lesser degree) on my Samsung Galaxy S8.
I bought the S20 FE brand new from Samsung.
I've attached some images for reference.
Any help would be greatly appreciated!
If you just bought it, what's the point of making a thread? Just bring it back to the shop and show defect.
bladez said:
If you just bought it, what's the point of making a thread? Just bring it back to the shop and show defect.
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Because a similar effect happened on the S8 so not sure if it's just Samsung displays or something else. Mostly visible when the room is dark so it's hard to show when the room is lit.
This is the lottery of OLED screens. Some are perfect and some are (defective) like this.
Mine has a uniformity issue, too. It's only visible in low brightness dark gray when in a dark room, so I decided to keep mine. I've seen similar issues in other oled panels of Galaxy and Pixel phones as well before. There is no guarantee you get a better panel for a replacement as mentioned in the comment above. If the un-uniformity is too bad, I would just return it and get another one because I heard Samsung is tough on exchange or repair for this kind of display issue.
tkshk said:
There is no guarantee you get a better panel for a replacement as mentioned in the comment above. If the un-uniformity is too bad, I would just return it and get another one because I heard Samsung is tough on exchange or repair for this kind of display issue.
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Is it possible to get a replacement (UK) if the phone is rooted and the bootloader is unlocked?
My fear is that if I don't get it repaired/replaced, it may get worse over time, and then I'm stuck with it.
Not sure about the exchange policy in the UK. The display uniformity didn't get worse over time in my old phones.
Only problem is the Samsung stores are closed in the UK at the moment.
user128494 said:
Is it possible to get a replacement (UK) if the phone is rooted and the bootloader is unlocked?
My fear is that if I don't get it repaired/replaced, it may get worse over time, and then I'm stuck with it.
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Click to collapse
EU law set a president years ago that even if the phone is rooted Samsung have to honor the hardware warranty. But if your that worried back up your data and flash the stock rom back to the phone via ODIN before you send it off to Samsung. Clearly there is something wring with the display on your unit.
tkshk said:
There is no guarantee you get a better panel for a replacement as mentioned in the comment above. If the un-uniformity is too bad
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The issue is the S20FE has an AMOLED screen so there is NO backlight, you should not being seeing any kind of 'glow' on put black backgrounds. Also my S20FE 5G shows no such defect.
b1k3rdude said:
EU law set a president years ago that even if the phone is rooted Samsung have to honor the hardware warranty. But if your that worried back up your data and flash the stock rom back to the phone via ODIN before you send it off to Samsung. Clearly there is something wring with the display on your unit.
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Click to collapse
The problem is, if I do send it off, they may just reject replacement of the item, as in download mode it says Warranty Void: 0x01
On the Samsung Forum a Samsung Mod talks about the warranty being voided in a similar thing:
Re: S10e flashing and warranty question.
So you're saying that by using Samsung's official firmware and tool I voided my warranty? Even tho I never rooted my phone or modified it in any way. I've mot installed any custom roms or anything? Just official stuff. And my warranty void counter on the phone remains at 0. Even tho this still...
eu.community.samsung.com
Thats the KNOX warranty only! Not the hardware warranty, don't let Samsung bully you into believing otherwise.
Of course the mods/admins on a manufacturers forum are going to tow the company line, but its just a community forum. Actual law is what you should pay head to, in this case EU law -
-https://www.piana.eu/root/ - see below
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" Does rooting your device (e.g. an Android phone) and replacing its operating system with something else void your statutory warranty, if you are a consumer?
In short: No. Just the fact that you modified or changed the software of your device, is not a sufficient reason to void your statutory warranty. As long as you have bought the device as a consumer in the European Union.
A bit longer: Directive 1999/44/CE dictates¹ that any object meeting certain criteria (including telephones, computers, routers etc.) being sold to a consumer² inside the European Union, has to carry a warranty from the seller that the device will meet the quality that you would expect for such a device for a period of 2 years. A telephone is an example of such a device and is an object that comprises many parts, from the case to the screen to the radio, to a mini-computer, to the battery, to the software that runs it. If any of these parts³ stop working in those 2 years, the seller has to fix or replace them. What is more these repairs should not cost the consumer a single cent — the seller has to cover the expenses (Directive 1999/44/CE, §3). If the seller has any expenses for returning it to the manufacturer, this is not your problem as a consumer.
If your device becomes defective in the first 6 months, it is presumed that the defect was there all along, so you should not need to prove anything. If your device becomes defective after the first 6 months, but before 2 years run out, you are still covered. The difference is only that if the defect arises now, the seller can claim that the defect was caused by some action that was triggered by non-normal use of the device.
But in order to avoid needing to repair or replace your device, the seller has to prove that your action caused⁵ the defect. It is generally recognised by courts that unless there is a sign of abuse of the device, the defect is there because the device was faulty from the beginning. That is just common sense, after all.
So, we finally come to the question of rooting, flashing and changing the software. Unless the seller can prove that modifying the software, rooting your device or flashing it with some other OS or firmware was the cause for the defect, you are still covered for defects during those 2 years. A good test to see if it is the software’s fault is to flash it back with stock firmware/OS and see if the problem persists. If it does, it is not a software- caused problem. If it is not possible to revert it stock software any more, it is also not a software-caused defect (unless you have “bricked” the phone while flashing it, un-bricking is not covered by any statutory warranty). There are very few hardware defects that are caused by software — e.g. overriding the speaker volume above the safe level could blow the speaker. Many manufacturers of consumer devices write into their warranties a paragraph that by changing the software or “rooting” your device, you void the warranty.
You have to understand that in EU we have a “statutory warranty”, which is compulsory that the seller must offer by law (Directive 1999/44/CE, §7.1) and a “voluntary warranty” which the seller or manufacturer can, but does not need to, offer as an additional service to the consumer. Usually the “voluntary warranty” covers a longer period of time or additional accidents not covered by law.⁶ If though the seller, the manufacturer or anyone else offers a “voluntary warranty”, he is bound to it as well! So, even if, by any chance your “voluntary warranty” got voided, by European law, you should still have the 2 year “compulsory warranty” as it is described in the Directive and which is the topic of this article. In case the seller refuses your right to repair or replace the device, you can sue him in a civil litigation and can report the incident to the national authority. In many European countries such action does not even require hiring a lawyer and is most of the time ensured by consumers associations.
The warranty under this Directive¹ is only applicable inside the European Union and only if you bought the device as a consumer.² "

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