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Let me start by saying I love Android. I love Google. Not only is Android an extremely powerful OS with a wonderful interface but I love the whole open ethos behind it, led by Google, the good guys.
But I just can't for the life of my understand why GPU support is not being introduced, or at least acknowledged that it's missing and it's coming.
I'm running Froyo, and whilst it may well be 500 gazillion times faster crunching numbers and performing data intensive tasks and whatever, it doesn't feel it as I use the phone next to an iphone 3gs.
Manipulating every single screen, every single swipe, window, everything including menus and web browsing just doesn't feel as good as on the iphone. Even if it is is technically faster, what good is it when the thing just doesn't feel as good? It might as well be slower, because how something feels has the bigger impact on people's perceptions.
I understand it's not as easy to accomplish as apple did it being as they only have one phone etc, but surely there's got to be some way?
Why is this issue not bigger within the Android community? Everybody knows the iphone is more fluid to use no matter how much we might want to deny it to ourselves.
It's easy to be smoother when you can't do more than one thing at a time.
Apple moves basically a wallpaper with icons, which is just a picture.
Android moves widgets and live wallpaper. Tons of CPU used for that. Turn off your live wallpaper, disable widgets - get the same scrolling as iPhone.
GPU is there and has nothing to do with it.
Search would have helped avoiding useless complaints in capital letters with tons of "?"s.
If the visuals are so important to you - get an iPhone. System limitations - there's only so much that can be done between battery life, multitasking and graphics. iPhone uses graphics at the expense of multitasking, Android does otherwise.
shrub said:
Let me start by saying I love Android. I love Google. Not only is Android an extremely powerful OS with a wonderful interface but I love the whole open ethos behind it, led by Google, the good guys.
But I just can't for the life of my understand why GPU support is not being introduced, or at least acknowledged that it's missing and it's coming.
I'm running Froyo, and whilst it may well be 500 gazillion times faster crunching numbers and performing data intensive tasks and whatever, it doesn't feel it as I use the phone next to an iphone 3gs.
Manipulating every single screen, every single swipe, window, everything including menus and web browsing just doesn't feel as good as on the iphone. Even if it is is technically faster, what good is it when the thing just doesn't feel as good? It might as well be slower, because how something feels has the bigger impact on people's perceptions.
I understand it's not as easy to accomplish as apple did it being as they only have one phone etc, but surely there's got to be some way?
Why is this issue not bigger within the Android community? Everybody knows the iphone is more fluid to use no matter how much we might want to deny it to ourselves.
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I am the most unbiased person I've ever met and I will honestly tell you that the response on my phone is as fast and smooth as I have ever seen on any phone. I don't think it can get better. I do not like the grid popping in the Nexus Launcher though. I wish it would just scroll like the old versions.
You don't have a real question in all honesty. Your question is, why is it not like the iPhone and why is it not "smooth" to you personally. That's just the way one person feels. I like the way the N1 feels across the entire OS. They're two different OS's and Phones so they're never going to be the same. I think you really just prefer one over the other in your own opinion. Neither of them can be called better outside of an opinion so nothing will change.
I will sacrifice fluidity any day for functionality.
Also, do you have any idea of what Android has come from, in the sense of versioning? I am certain that this is almost identical the iPhone OS/Hardware Saga from version 1 and up.
I have a question. Why is there so much comparison to iphone. I think android Smashes them but why post topic after topic about that... where's that one mod. He should delete this.
temperbad said:
I have a question. Why is there so much comparison to iphone. I think android Smashes them but why post topic after topic about that... where's that one mod. He should delete this.
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There is always a comparison of the top two of anything. Android and iPhone are very similar and they're they top devices so they're going to get compared. 99.999% of the comparisons are biased in some way but the fact is that neither of them are factually better than the other. They both have amazing features that the other doesn't and the word "better" and your decision come down to your personal preferences. I don't like iTunes, I think widgets are a MUST for me and I enjoy modding my phone without going through hell to do it or getting the cops called on me so I chose Android. Also I have been behind everything Google has done for many years and I will continue to love the company but biased attitudes are something I try to avoid. Not only do you not learn anything but you look foolish acting that way [I'm not talking about you personally I'm speaking in general].
Wow, I'm surprised to see that I'm one of the only people who completely agree with the original poster.
This isn't limited to the launcher. As the OP stated, literally every on screen motion is smoother on the iPhone.
This isn't because of the lack of multitasking on the iPhone because iOS 4 looks just as smooth.
It is either a consequence of the threading used in gui programs and/or better use of the GPU for animations and scrolling. It seems to me on my Nexus that in most cases scrolling and animations are slower when the CPU is processing something where as on an iPhone the scrolling seems smooth regardless of the processes involved.
One of my complaints along these lines is scrolling in the Android web browser isn't nearly as nice as even the slower iPhone 3G, much less an iPhone 3GS.
dalingrin said:
Wow, I'm surprised to see that I'm one of the only people who completely agree with the original poster.
This isn't limited to the launcher. As the OP stated, literally every on screen motion is smoother on the iPhone.
This isn't because of the lack of multitasking on the iPhone because iOS 4 looks just as smooth.
It is either a consequence of the threading used in gui programs and/or better use of the GPU for animations and scrolling. It seems to me on my Nexus that in most cases scrolling and animations are slower when the CPU is processing something where as on an iPhone the scrolling seems smooth regardless of the processes involved.
One of my complaints along these lines is scrolling in the Android web browser isn't nearly as nice as even the slower iPhone 3G, much less an iPhone 3GS.
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Agreed, Ill take Android's greater capabilities over Iphone's fluidity any day but both would be sweet.
DMaverick50 said:
Agreed, Ill take Android's greater capabilities over Iphone's fluidity any day but both would be sweet.
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Without a doubt. I'm just not convinced the two are mutually exclusive.
Paul22000 said:
It's easy to be smoother when you can't do more than one thing at a time.
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Once I saw this post I knew I didn't have to look at the rest of the thread since this answered it all
I disable screen animations. I have no need for worthless eye-candy. Just give me whatever I tapped on as fast as possible.
Love it.
mortzz said:
I disable screen animations. I have no need for worthless eye-candy. Just give me whatever I tapped on as fast as possible.
Love it.
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I either turn the animations off or turn their speed up. IMO scrolling is more of an issue than animations.
Example:
Goto www.androidcentral.com or www.anandtech.com on a Nexus One and with the page zoomed all the way out try scrolling. At the top of the page my frame rate is <15.
Now do the same on a wee iPhone(even first gen) and see how smooth the scrolling is.
Is it end of the world? No, of course not. I am very satisfied with my phone compared to my previous iPhone 3GS and 3G. That said, considering my main use of my phone(beyond being a phone) is web browsing, I would still love to have the scrolling of my "crap" iPhone.
Its a genuine complaint.
The lack of smooth visuals is getting silly. I think Google bringing in the guy from Palm/Danger is an ackowledgment of this.
Its not cpu , its not ram, its not multitasking. Its Apple that has some if not the best UI guys in the business in terms of visuals. Id say WebOS guys were the tops but they were mostly old Apple guys so go figure.
Apple spends a ton of time and offort making sure everything looks fluid across the entire experience. Android does not. Its simply not something theyve taken seriously until 2.1. They are the best engineers in the world..not GUI designers. The fact the Gallery still has 16 bit depth is a tell tale sign they arent emphasizing visuals.
Anyways the GPU is underused. UI , Games , Codecs theres a alot of room for improvement. Androids UI is "better"...but lets not kid ourselves..the animations and fluidity are heavily in Apples corner. Loks are important; otherwise go date a fat hairy girl.
I thought I was quite picky but I don't notice any problems with my nexus
Maybe I haven't spent that much time playing with iPhones but when I have seen people using them they press something and have to wait for it to load, they get a grey checker pattern when they scroll too fast in the browser. Sometimes their swipes didn't register either.
xManMythLegend said:
Its a genuine complaint.
The lack of smooth visuals is getting silly. I think Google bringing in the guy from Palm/Danger is an ackowledgment of this.
Its not cpu , its not ram, its not multitasking. Its Apple that has some if not the best UI guys in the business in terms of visuals. Id say WebOS guys were the tops but they were mostly old Apple guys so go figure.
Apple spends a ton of time and offort making sure everything looks fluid across the entire experience. Android does not. Its simply not something theyve taken seriously until 2.1. They are the best engineers in the world..not GUI designers. The fact the Gallery still has 16 bit depth is a tell tale sign they arent emphasizing visuals.
Anyways the GPU is underused. UI , Games , Codecs theres a alot of room for improvement. Androids UI is "better"...but lets not kid ourselves..the animations and fluidity are heavily in Apples corner. Loks are important; otherwise go date a fat hairy girl.
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I agree with this wholeheartedly. Android really just isn't the most aesthetically pleasing user interface around, I've never owned an iPhone - and don't plan to, but Apple simply knows their stuff when it comes graphic design..
There's been some info on this issue on the android-platform groups and the skia rendering engine group (Skia acutally has an experimental OpenGL rendering branch).
From what I understand, hardware acceleration can't be implemented in older devices (ex: G1) because they only support one OpenGL instance at a time, meaning the launcher could be in conflit with apps. It also seems as if the stuttering we feel is actually caused by Android's garbage colletor because it blocks the UI thread when it kicks in and not because the phone's cpu cant keep up with scrolling. If you watched some of the Google I/O 2010 videos, they said they know of the issues with the garbage collector and they are working on it.
My guess is that hardware acceleration will come sooner or later (specially with the Tegra 2 chips and tablet format ) but if you want to make things move a bit you can always go to code.google.com/p/android/issues/detail?id=6914 and star the issue (consider it a vote ).
New here btw, hello all
dalingrin said:
I either turn the animations off or turn their speed up. IMO scrolling is more of an issue than animations.
Example:
Goto www.androidcentral.com or www.anandtech.com on a Nexus One and with the page zoomed all the way out try scrolling. At the top of the page my frame rate is <15.
Now do the same on a wee iPhone(even first gen) and see how smooth the scrolling is.
Is it end of the world? No, of course not. I am very satisfied with my phone compared to my previous iPhone 3GS and 3G. That said, considering my main use of my phone(beyond being a phone) is web browsing, I would still love to have the scrolling of my "crap" iPhone.
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I just tested anandtech.com on my N1 using Dolphin HD and have Froyo installed. The page was pretty much butter smooth except the top which had a flash banner ad and a flash "news reel". Of course the iPhone is going to be smoother at the top of that page since it doesn't show any flash elements. Not to say I don't want smoother scrolling when there are flash elements, but I'd rather have them showing with a little choppy frame rate than not at all.
RE: GPU Support
It's a common misconception that Android is slow changing windows and stuff- just go to Spare Parts and turn the window animations off.
my nexus next to the iphone, the nexus is just as smooth and fast to my eyes. the nexus is actually buttery smooth. using launcher pro. maybe that is what makes the difference i bet.
Original post here: http://googleblog.blogspot.com/2012/10/nexus-best-of-google-now-in-three-sizes.html
I love my Incredible S. But damn you Google, that offer is unbeatable.
@Mod: if it is not allow to post here, then I am sorry. Plz delete this thread. I don't mean to spam the forum.
thuanle said:
Original post here: http://googleblog.blogspot.com/2012/10/nexus-best-of-google-now-in-three-sizes.html
I love my Incredible S. But damn you Google, that offer is unbeatable.
@Mod: if it is not allow to post here, then I am sorry. Plz delete this thread. I don't mean to spam the forum.
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AWESOME! Gf is getting me the Nexus 10 for Xmas, and I'll buy myself a Nexus 4 around the same time! 2560x1600 10" display, here I come! :highfive:
Never thought that the price would be so unbeatable! Maaan, why did I buy a Galaxy Nexus?
Oh for the love of god! What is with the lack of expandable storage in Nexus devices? I mean, this looks like the perfect device for me, but that lack of an SD Card is a real killer. 16 gig maximum storage, and no option to upgrade? What is this, an iPhone?
CyanideJack said:
Oh for the love of god! What is with the lack of expandable storage in Nexus devices? I mean, this looks like the perfect device for me, but that lack of an SD Card is a real killer. 16 gig maximum storage, and no option to upgrade? What is this, an iPhone?
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Yeah, I know. My 32GB SD card has only 10GB free.
I only ever use around 6gb I clean up my stuff a lot.
Sent from my vivo using Tapatalk 2
ZaySk said:
AWESOME! Gf is getting me the Nexus 10 for Xmas, and I'll buy myself a Nexus 4 around the same time! 2560x1600 10" display, here I come! :highfive:
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No offence but having a Nexus 7 now, I think it would be a bit boring to have two AOSP devices. Especially coming from sense I used to have AOSP before my N7, but now I only use sense on my IncS
vizzy said:
I only ever use around 6gb I clean up my stuff a lot.
Sent from my vivo using Tapatalk 2
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Same here, I used an 8GB for about half a year before upgrading to 16GB. Never had a problem with space, I just delete apps I don't use and clean out junk folders. I also backup important stuff on my SD card, and then format it every couple of months to keep it clean.
markj338 said:
No offence but having a Nexus 7 now, I think it would be a bit boring to have two AOSP devices. Especially coming from sense I used to have AOSP before my N7, but now I only use sense on my IncS
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While you do have a good point, I've never liked Sense or other skins anyways. Given the choice, I'd always choose an AOSP ROM over a Sense ROM. Pretty much the only reason I'm using a Sense ROM is because it's stable. Sense ROM's are fun to play around with for something new, but I quickly get bored of the limited options available in Rosie and uninstall it and replace it with Apex Launcher. Even tweaked Sense bores me, plus Sense is pretty heavy and I always feel like AOSP is noticeably smoother.
Plus, with a Nexus, I wouldn't have to put up with half-assed, hacked together AOSP ROM's. No offense to any devs! It's just stupid that some things related to a device (drivers, company proprietary libs etc) are never available and have to be hacked to work. I hate that, it's very annoying. With a Nexus, I don't have to worry about that. (I think?...)
ZaySk said:
Same here, I used an 8GB for about half a year before upgrading to 16GB. Never had a problem with space, I just delete apps I don't use and clean out junk folders. I also backup important stuff on my SD card, and then format it every couple of months to keep it clean.
While you do have a good point, I've never liked Sense or other skins anyways. Given the choice, I'd always choose an AOSP ROM over a Sense ROM. Pretty much the only reason I'm using a Sense ROM is because it's stable. Sense ROM's are fun to play around with for something new, but I quickly get bored of the limited options available in Rosie and uninstall it and replace it with Apex Launcher. Even tweaked Sense bores me, plus Sense is pretty heavy and I always feel like AOSP is noticeably smoother.
Plus, with a Nexus, I wouldn't have to put up with half-assed, hacked together AOSP ROM's. No offense to any devs! It's just stupid that some things related to a device (drivers, company proprietary libs etc) are never available and have to be hacked to work. I hate that, it's very annoying. With a Nexus, I don't have to worry about that. (I think?...)
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I have a 16gb N7 and 16gb card in my phone, they get filled with backups of roms lol
I use dropbox and I have a USB OTG cable for all the haevy stuff like movies
I completely agree with your statement on AOSP roms and their stability. While some roms are quite good and fast, none can match a proper AOSP device, like a nexus. None. My N7 is super fast and I underclock it to 1.15GHz to save battery
This is the reason I might be going Sony next: their roms are quite AOSP-like and their source is similar to AOSP, no big changes like Samsung and HTC
Most AOSP and other JB roms for other devices (I mean custom roms) do not have proper project butter working, eg. CM10 on the exynos devices because there is no proper source for drivers and stuff. Although this might change with the Nexus 10
markj338 said:
I have a 16gb N7 and 16gb card in my phone, they get filled with backups of roms lol
I use dropbox and I have a USB OTG cable for all the haevy stuff like movies
I completely agree with your statement on AOSP roms and their stability. While some roms are quite good and fast, none can match a proper AOSP device, like a nexus. None. My N7 is super fast and I underclock it to 1.15GHz to save battery
This is the reason I might be going Sony next: their roms are quite AOSP-like and their source is similar to AOSP, no big changes like Samsung and HTC
Most AOSP and other JB roms for other devices (I mean custom roms) do not have proper project butter working, eg. CM10 on the exynos devices because there is no proper source for drivers and stuff. Although this might change with the Nexus 10
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I used to have a crapload of backups as well, but I realized it would be more efficient to simply keep one backup of my favorite ROM at the time. I try to keep that one backup as current as possible. I gotta get an external HDD to store my music and movies as well
Yes we did have some great devs working on AOSP for our device, and they did a damn great job IMO. It's just the company that limits how good AOSP ROM's are due to not releasing sources for certain components, forcing the community to resort to hacks and other trickery to get it working properly. Damn it must be nice to be able to actually underclock without creating a laggy device. I feel like it's absolutely necessary to OC the Inc S to 1.3 GHz on AOSP, and 1.4-5GHz on Sense, in order to get a decent experience. Not that big of a deal, seeing as there were quite a few phones released with the same SoC as ours, but ran at 1.4GHz stock so the SoC can obviously handle the OC, luckily.
I'm strongly considering Sony as well, if they release a device by Xmas that has at least an S4 Pro SoC, preferably a true Cortex A-15 based SoC. They seem to be one of few companies that really do open up their phones completely for the community, and that's pretty much the #1 most important decision that will decide what phone I get.
ZaySk said:
I used to have a crapload of backups as well, but I realized it would be more efficient to simply keep one backup of my favorite ROM at the time. I try to keep that one backup as current as possible. I gotta get an external HDD to store my music and movies as well
Yes we did have some great devs working on AOSP for our device, and they did a damn great job IMO. It's just the company that limits how good AOSP ROM's are due to not releasing sources for certain components, forcing the community to resort to hacks and other trickery to get it working properly. Damn it must be nice to be able to actually underclock without creating a laggy device. I feel like it's absolutely necessary to OC the Inc S to 1.3 GHz on AOSP, and 1.4-5GHz on Sense, in order to get a decent experience. Not that big of a deal, seeing as there were quite a few phones released with the same SoC as ours, but ran at 1.4GHz stock so the SoC can obviously handle the OC, luckily.
I'm strongly considering Sony as well, if they release a device by Xmas that has at least an S4 Pro SoC, preferably a true Cortex A-15 based SoC. They seem to be one of few companies that really do open up their phones completely for the community, and that's pretty much the #1 most important decision that will decide what phone I get.
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Wow I keep mine at 1024MHz all the time. I overclock it to 1.4 sometimes when I play heavy games but that is it. I don't think my N7 has ever seen past 1.4GHz, when I was testing one of faux123's kernels
I think Sony might wait until MWC next year in Jan or whenever it is, because they just released new phones. But I don't need top performance on my phone anymore, I use it for calling, texting, xda-ing and a bit of internet. I play games and do more processor-intensive things on my Nexus 7
Did you guys see this video? It makes me want to buy one next
http://www.engadget.com/2012/10/29/google-nexus-4-hands-on/
I like the look of it, and the hardware. And of course the charger *drools*
I hope they'll release a 32gb model :/
Sent from my HTC Incredible S using xda premium
Ihad considered this but in England LG does not have the best reputation so I tend to stay away. Also, the HOX+ is meant to have one of the better cameras around and I don't know how is feel if the N4 cam isn't as good. I've also became a fan of sense .....
However, I am deffo getting the N10 device. I'll probs get it after Xmas when the initial rush has gone. Then I can read my magazines, books and general browsing easyier than on a phone.
Sent from my vivo using Tapatalk 2
I worry that these Nexus devices may start a president with regards to lack of removable storage. I understand Google's thinking behind using the Cloud as a portable storage medium, but my 500mb a month contract means downloading/streaming anything over data is pretty much out of the question. And living in the sticks means my data connection is flaky most of the time anyway. Until the price of truly 'unlimited' data plans drops considerably, and until coverage becomes better for non-built up areas, cloud storage is pointless for me.
I also notice there's no support for LTE on this device, but given the price that's hardly an issue.
Think I'll be waiting for the 32gb model to.
For me 16GB is totally enough. I had 8GB for a year and it was a bit too less but now I have 16GB on my GNex and I never get it even close to full So no Cloud stuff for me
WILLI120 said:
For me 16GB is totally enough. I had 8GB for a year and it was a bit too less but now I have 16GB on my GNex and I never get it even close to full So no Cloud stuff for me
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Well for me, I like to download videos like anime and comedy sketches, I guess that's why I need lots of space. And maybe because I have The Dark Knight Rises, Order & Chaos Online in my phone :/
Sent from my HTC Incredible S using xda premium
markj338 said:
Wow I keep mine at 1024MHz all the time. I overclock it to 1.4 sometimes when I play heavy games but that is it. I don't think my N7 has ever seen past 1.4GHz, when I was testing one of faux123's kernels
I think Sony might wait until MWC next year in Jan or whenever it is, because they just released new phones. But I don't need top performance on my phone anymore, I use it for calling, texting, xda-ing and a bit of internet. I play games and do more processor-intensive things on my Nexus 7
Did you guys see this video? It makes me want to buy one next
http://www.engadget.com/2012/10/29/google-nexus-4-hands-on/
I like the look of it, and the hardware. And of course the charger *drools*
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I hate it when there's noticeable lag, and I've always been picky about the performance of all my technological devices lol. I'm actually running my CPU at 1.5GHz right now on smartassv2. I still get good battery life despite the big OC, and I haven't noticed any instability at all. Also helps that I UV'ed 50mv I've always preferred performance over battery life. I'd rather have a snappy device that dies an hour quicker, than a slightly laggy device that lasts longer.
Yea, that's what I was thinking. Unfortunate. But I really want that Nexus 4, especially at that price! I'll be honest, I love google right now. They're pushing the boundaries(in a good way) on pricing for top end devices, and I f**king love it!
Dat S4 Pro Quad....WANT
ZaySk said:
I hate it when there's noticeable lag, and I've always been picky about the performance of all my technological devices lol. I'm actually running my CPU at 1.5GHz right now on smartassv2. I still get good battery life despite the big OC, and I haven't noticed any instability at all. Also helps that I UV'ed 50mv I've always preferred performance over battery life. I'd rather have a snappy device that dies an hour quicker, than a slightly laggy device that lasts longer.
Yea, that's what I was thinking. Unfortunate. But I really want that Nexus 4, especially at that price! I'll be honest, I love google right now. They're pushing the boundaries(in a good way) on pricing for top end devices, and I f**king love it!
Dat S4 Pro Quad....WANT
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I hardly have any lag with my settings now
Mine can't handle any UV at 1.4GHz I noticed that while playing shadowgun, it kept freezing and not responding to anything but a battery pull
The only other thing that might keep me away is no 4G Hopefully the camera is a beast
Yeah the S4 quad looks really good. I can get the same performance with my N7 running at those speeds, but no way near the efficiency. I am also interested in the audio chip, because the S4 one is supposed to be really good, compared to the Tegra 3 one.
l0st.prophet has been very active in the N4 forums, I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of us end up there. There is already an ex-desire S user off topic thread lol
markj338 said:
I hardly have any lag with my settings now
Mine can't handle any UV at 1.4GHz I noticed that while playing shadowgun, it kept freezing and not responding to anything but a battery pull
The only other thing that might keep me away is no 4G Hopefully the camera is a beast
Yeah the S4 quad looks really good. I can get the same performance with my N7 running at those speeds, but no way near the efficiency. I am also interested in the audio chip, because the S4 one is supposed to be really good, compared to the Tegra 3 one.
l0st.prophet has been very active in the N4 forums, I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of us end up there. There is already an ex-desire S user off topic thread lol
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I still notice lag even at 1.5GHz sometimes. Annoying. Hmm that's strange, even at 1.5GHz I don't have any instabilities with UV. I really want to upgrade, to me the Inc S is showing its age internally. Especially in RAM, 2GB of RAM will be heaven. Still in love with the gorgeous color saturation in the screen though!
Meh, 4G isn't to big a deal for me. I have it available in Whitehorse, but HSPA+ is good enough for when I don't have wifi. I just can't resist the price, and I'm thinking about going on pay-as-you-go instead of the ass-rapingly expensive contracts. I practically never call anyone (who does these days?) so I only need data.
The S4 Pro's GPU especially looks very promising. Much better than the Mali 400 in the Exynos 4 series, according to early reports. Plus it's as close as I'll get to a Cortex A15 cpu That's great news, I was hoping the N4 would have a decent audio chip.
Hehe, let's all conspire to take over the N4 forums. All Inc S user's at once abandon this device, and move full force into the N4 forums! :silly::victory: Seriously though, the more people that come from this great community to the N4 forums, the better. :good:
ZaySk said:
I still notice lag even at 1.5GHz sometimes. Annoying. Hmm that's strange, even at 1.5GHz I don't have any instabilities with UV. I really want to upgrade, to me the Inc S is showing its age internally. Especially in RAM, 2GB of RAM will be heaven. Still in love with the gorgeous color saturation in the screen though!
Meh, 4G isn't to big a deal for me. I have it available in Whitehorse, but HSPA+ is good enough for when I don't have wifi. I just can't resist the price, and I'm thinking about going on pay-as-you-go instead of the ass-rapingly expensive contracts. I practically never call anyone (who does these days?) so I only need data.
The S4 Pro's GPU especially looks very promising. Much better than the Mali 400 in the Exynos 4 series, according to early reports. Plus it's as close as I'll get to a Cortex A15 cpu That's great news, I was hoping the N4 would have a decent audio chip.
Hehe, let's all conspire to take over the N4 forums. All Inc S user's at once abandon this device, and move full force into the N4 forums! :silly::victory: Seriously though, the more people that come from this great community to the N4 forums, the better. :good:
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That's not fair Oh well, you use 1.5 more than I do I think its processor is showing its age. Some things I am used to using my N7 for, and the IncS is THAT much slower at doing things. But on Venom, everything is super smooth Same with your rom actually, although I used the ultra smooth rosie (I am too on Venom)
I am thinking about getting off a contract too, and buying the phone outright. But, when you add both up it would probably be cheaper still to go on a plan here, for maybe $50 a month or whatever they will give the N4 away free on
Yes, the GPU is a monster, apparently it smashes the Tegra 3 which has a massive GPU, super powered. The Tegra 3 is soo powerful, even at the underclocked speeds I have it at now, I can't actually imagine what you could do with more power at this time.
Don't abandon this device because I am staying here until May next year!
I was under the impression that encryption was supposed to be a good thing. Can someone explain why everyone wants it disabled?
It apparently slows the device down significantly since they did the encryption with software instead of hardware. Doing the mod simply makes it optional like it was before. Most people won't have that kind of sensitive info on their phones to really worry about it.
i dont notice any slow down thus far and i applaud the encryption.
Most people would choose faster performance over encryption. Almost ANYONE would choose to have encryption if it didn't affect performance...there's no arguing that encryption is a bad thing...it's just that performance is king for most people who don't consider their phone data to be extremely sensitive.
I think Google should have done one of two things: 1) make it optional so everyone could choose encryption or performance 2) make it so the encryption has little to no effect on performance.
Since it does strongly affect performance, the fact that it's FORCED on us is definitely a point of contention.
> i dont notice any slow down thus far and i applaud the encryption.
if you didn't then good for you. don't bother comparing your Nexus 6 with how a hated touchwizd Note4 behaves. Heck don't compare it even with the year old Nexus 5.
People don't notice any slowdowns, its only a problem for those benchmark geeks.
Yet, in all full hardware benchmarks, even a fully encrypted Nexus 6 outperforms every other phone.
Antutu is still 50k+ for example. Lol
chrisjcks said:
People don't notice any slowdowns, its only a problem for those benchmark geeks.
Yet, in all full hardware benchmarks, even a fully encrypted Nexus 6 outperforms every other phone.
Antutu is still 50k+ for example. Lol
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
People have said the phone is significantly snappier after disabling it. Some may say it's placebo, but the read/write speeds are increased quite a lot, so it is believable. I personally didn't even use the phone with encryption and compared to the video reviews I've seen, mine seems to perform a whole lot better. In some vids there were noticeable delays when opening apps.
It is faster at saving files and opening my photos app without encryption. I have 3000+ pictures on my phone from that I took on my G3 and its much faster and there is almost 0 scroll lag now.
P1 Wookie said:
It apparently slows the device down significantly since they did the encryption with software instead of hardware. Doing the mod simply makes it optional like it was before. Most people won't have that kind of sensitive info on their phones to really worry about it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Have any developers actually dug in to the kernel to validate that it's using software encryption only? It could be that the Snapdragon 805's crypto module is just slow. Surely there has to be a way to enable hardware encryption if it's not available.
phekno said:
Have any developers actually dug in to the kernel to validate that it's using software encryption only? It could be that the Snapdragon 805's crypto module is just slow. Surely there has to be a way to enable hardware encryption if it's not available.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't have time to go look because I'm about to go into work, but I believe the person that made the modded boot image was the one that figured it out.
I feel I don't need it. I have used a smartphone for years now and they could have been encrypted at any time but I chose to rely on my lock screen and the ability to remotely wipe my device. I don't want to give up the performance for something I don't feel I need. If there was dedicated hardware, which it looks like there isn't, I'd leave it encrypted. Apple, for example, uses dedicated hardware so that the encryption doesn't impact performance which means they can use encryption and still get speeds equivelant to or faster than most phones out there now.
---------- Post added at 09:03 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:00 AM ----------
chrisjcks said:
People don't notice any slowdowns, its only a problem for those benchmark geeks.
Yet, in all full hardware benchmarks, even a fully encrypted Nexus 6 outperforms every other phone.
Antutu is still 50k+ for example. Lol
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But there are videos showing the Nexus 6 performing operations slower than a Nexus 5 or did you mean it outperforms every other encrypted phone?.
The slow down is not noticeable by any significant margin. It's purely in benchmarks and possibly when installing some larger apps, you might notice it taking a bit longer than it should. After disabling encryption, it's most likely placebo that it feels faster, but the phone did not feel "slow" by any means with encryption enabled.
I just don't care enough to have my data encrypted, I don't keep anything of vital importance on my phone, so I just decided to get rid of it anyway.
Berzerker7 said:
The slow down is not noticeable by any significant margin. It's purely in benchmarks and possibly when installing some larger apps, you might notice it taking a bit longer than it should. After disabling encryption, it's most likely placebo that it feels faster, but the phone did not feel "slow" by any means with encryption enabled.
I just don't care enough to have my data encrypted, I don't keep anything of vital importance on my phone, so I just decided to get rid of it anyway.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not sure it is just benchmarks. Not based on the video at http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2014...premium-price-still-comes-with-compromises/2/ anyway. App launch, boot everything seems to be slower on the encrypted device (vs an un-encrypted N5).
Maybe it was pre-release software, so dunno if the issue is still as bad
jj14 said:
I'm not sure it is just benchmarks. Not based on the video at http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2014...premium-price-still-comes-with-compromises/2/ anyway. App launch, boot everything seems to be slower on the encrypted device (vs an un-encrypted N5).
Maybe it was pre-release software, so dunno if the issue is still as bad
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
At least personally, I haven't noticed any real difference and the phone felt plenty quick while I was encrypted. I just wanted the piece-of-mind and wiped early so that I wouldn't be bothered later when the phone was more used and it would have been more of a hassle to wipe.
Another issue to keep in mind is the hit to battery life. If encryption is taking place in software, that's going to tax the CPU much more than if it was being done via dedicated hardware. Removing encryption will reduce CPU load, thus increasing battery life. So even if the device "feels" the same with and without encryption, you still benefit from disabling encryption.
Anecdotally, yesterday I experienced better battery life than what the reviewers were getting (about 5-6 hours of SOT). We already know that the I/O speeds are objectively faster with encryption disabled, so I'd love to see some objective tests done on battery life.
I may opt out then. I'm not a criminal or part of a sleeper cell of any kind.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N900A using XDA Free mobile app
i don't even have a lock screen.
do i need encryption?
bradputt said:
i don't even have a lock screen.
do i need encryption?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Encryption is just another barricade protecting your data beyond a lock screen. As far as I know it basically means that even if someone manages to pull data off your phone, they won't be able to view it. Could be wrong though.
Xileforce said:
Encryption is just another barricade protecting your data beyond a lock screen. As far as I know it basically means that even if someone manages to pull data off your phone, they won't be able to view it. Could be wrong though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In simple terms without being all technical, it is pretty much the process where you (Point A) is communicating with a user or server (Point B). A unknown identity (government, adversary) is possible to take the data you sent to Point B but then they will have a difficult time to "decrypting" the jibberish to translate it into something that is useful.
E.G. I send the following string "Hello"
The unknown identity would receive the encrypted text as "A45K1K1JKNN" (just a example)
Read more about cryptography if you're interested.
zephiK said:
In simple terms without being all technical, it is pretty much the process where you (Point A) is communicating with a user or server (Point B). A unknown identity (government, adversary) is possible to take the data you sent to Point B but then they will have a difficult time to "decrypting" the jibberish to translate it into something that is useful.
E.G. I send the following string "Hello"
The unknown identity would receive the encrypted text as "A45K1K1JKNN" (just a example)
Read more about cryptography if you're interested.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for clarifying it further, that's pretty much what I thought the general idea was.
I've had my Tab S 10.5 for quite a while now and have been less than pleased with its performance. Stock, Bliss, and down the list, no matter what I've put on it- it seemed something was inherently wrong with the Tab S. It has always been a bit sluggish considering the specs. My Note 3 and Nexus 10 seemed more responsive. I've been rather disappointed until today. I've been running the Slim build and noticed today F2FS was now supported. Flashed it with F2FS and its pretty unbelievable what a difference it has made. I've tried F2FS on other devices and seen little if any noticeable difference until now. No lag, smooth, responsive, and benchmarks are great. Highly suggest trying it and truly encourage further development on this.
Mine was lagging pretty badly as well but then I did a factory reset and reflashed it with the same rom I had (IronRom) and it was like night and day difference. Plus I found out the kernel didn't work without busybox being installed so it was pretty bad.
Now with the new 2.4.1 version, it's so smooth, it's smoother than my ipad air 2 on webpages when navigating. (Granted, I did force the GPU to be at 300mhz instead of 144)
Can someone explain what f2fs means please and what you do to get iy
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=3139716
So I'm fairly new to the Nexus 6, but I have had a Nexus 5 in the past (More recently coming from a Zenfone 2)..I've noticed that while applications open fairly quick on Marshmallow (Even the system UI is fairly smooth), I get a lot lag and jank in scrolling, and applications that work well on my girlfriend's 5x have poor performance on my 6.
Can anyone else relate to this? Apps like Pintrest, Instagram, Tumblr, Ebay, Amazon all aren't as smooth as they should be, and sometimes web browsing can be horrendous (Almost like a touch delay when scrolling).
I've tried clean wipes, flashed the stock images, tried non-stock roms, different kernels, everything I can think of, but to me, the phone just isnt as smooth as I thought it would be. I get that it's over a year old, but I still expected a bit more.
Am I alone here? Again, the UI itself is fine, its more application based \ scrolling based.
Well, the 6 and 5x have the same GPU, more or less. The 5x GPU is miniaturized, but otherwise identical.
The 5x has a 1920x1080 display, or roughly 2 million pixels.
The 6 has a 2560x1440 display..... 3.7 million pixels.
So, why would you possibly imagine that with the SAME GPU, but nearly TWICE the number of pixels, that the 6 would be able to produce the same graphical performance as the 5x?
*** UNREASONABLE EXPECTATIONS!!!
smokinjoe2122 said:
So I'm fairly new to the Nexus 6, but I have had a Nexus 5 in the past (More recently coming from a Zenfone 2)..I've noticed that while applications open fairly quick on Marshmallow (Even the system UI is fairly smooth), I get a lot lag and jank in scrolling, and applications that work well on my girlfriend's 5x have poor performance on my 6.
Can anyone else relate to this? Apps like Pintrest, Instagram, Tumblr, Ebay, Amazon all aren't as smooth as they should be, and sometimes web browsing can be horrendous (Almost like a touch delay when scrolling).
I've tried clean wipes, flashed the stock images, tried non-stock roms, different kernels, everything I can think of, but to me, the phone just isnt as smooth as I thought it would be. I get that it's over a year old, but I still expected a bit more.
Am I alone here? Again, the UI itself is fine, its more application based \ scrolling based.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Have you tried turning off the encryption? When I came from the N5 I noticed the phone was not as smooth as the N5 until I turned the encryption off. Early on it made a big difference as they did not have NEON encryption optimizations enabled. Was that was enabled the difference was small but it is still noticeable to me between haveing the encryption running and not. It is not night and day but I think you will notice it.
doitright said:
Well, the 6 and 5x have the same GPU, more or less. The 5x GPU is miniaturized, but otherwise identical.
The 5x has a 1920x1080 display, or roughly 2 million pixels.
The 6 has a 2560x1440 display..... 3.7 million pixels.
So, why would you possibly imagine that with the SAME GPU, but nearly TWICE the number of pixels, that the 6 would be able to produce the same graphical performance as the 5x?
*** UNREASONABLE EXPECTATIONS!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't think expecting a phone that's a little over a year old, (That was a flagship mind you), to run smoothly is unreasonable. While it's pushing more pixels than the 5x, the processor should be quite similar, along with an extra GB of ram.
eman5oh said:
Have you tried turning off the encryption? When I came from the N5 I noticed the phone was not as smooth as the N5 until I turned the encryption off. Early on it made a big difference as they did not have NEON encryption optimizations enabled. Was that was enabled the difference was small but it is still noticeable to me between haveing the encryption running and not. It is not night and day but I think you will notice it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am running a modified stock ROM now that has encryption turned off, and it is a little better, but unfortunately you're right, it's not night and day.
smokinjoe2122 said:
So I'm fairly new to the Nexus 6, but I have had a Nexus 5 in the past (More recently coming from a Zenfone 2)..I've noticed that while applications open fairly quick on Marshmallow (Even the system UI is fairly smooth), I get a lot lag and jank in scrolling, and applications that work well on my girlfriend's 5x have poor performance on my 6.
Can anyone else relate to this? Apps like Pintrest, Instagram, Tumblr, Ebay, Amazon all aren't as smooth as they should be, and sometimes web browsing can be horrendous (Almost like a touch delay when scrolling).
I've tried clean wipes, flashed the stock images, tried non-stock roms, different kernels, everything I can think of, but to me, the phone just isnt as smooth as I thought it would be. I get that it's over a year old, but I still expected a bit more.
Am I alone here? Again, the UI itself is fine, its more application based \ scrolling based.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have none of these issues on my 6
Go in developer options and try to turn off all animation transitions, that improved speed for me
smokinjoe2122 said:
So I'm fairly new to the Nexus 6, but I have had a Nexus 5 in the past (More recently coming from a Zenfone 2)..I've noticed that while applications open fairly quick on Marshmallow (Even the system UI is fairly smooth), I get a lot lag and jank in scrolling, and applications that work well on my girlfriend's 5x have poor performance on my 6.
Can anyone else relate to this? Apps like Pintrest, Instagram, Tumblr, Ebay, Amazon all aren't as smooth as they should be, and sometimes web browsing can be horrendous (Almost like a touch delay when scrolling).
I've tried clean wipes, flashed the stock images, tried non-stock roms, different kernels, everything I can think of, but to me, the phone just isnt as smooth as I thought it would be. I get that it's over a year old, but I still expected a bit more.
Am I alone here? Again, the UI itself is fine, its more application based \ scrolling based.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've had my Nexus for 13 months. (Purchased in February 2015). I've rooted and run various ROMs on the device over the last year. Since I have the Next plan with AT&T I've been planning on upgrading soon so a couple weeks ago I went back to unrooted stock. Since then I've been having the same issues you mention. I don't have a 5x to compare to, but it is definitely lagging a lot more than before. Last night I was trying to view something on Amazon, and it just sat there with a white screen. Many times my keyboard stays floating above the homescreen when I press the "home" softkey, or stays floating after I am done typing in Facebook, messenger etc. It just LAGS big time. Also the battery drain has been horrendous. I've been getting so PO'd at it I've been tempted to go get a Note (GASP!) Last night was the last straw I uninstalled swiftkey (been a avid user for years never an issue) and the CM Locker I had installed so I could have a different lock screen photo (since I'm no longer rooted). I'm giving it 24 hours, and if it is still acting up, I am either re-rooting or upgrading (although there's like NOTHING that I like right now for devices).
---------- Post added at 12:29 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:26 PM ----------
grgana said:
Go in developer options and try to turn off all animation transitions, that improved speed for me
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I just did that. Hopefully that helps with my issue too.
Well, mine is mostly related to the jank when scrolling through applications. The UI, keyboard, ect all works fine. However, The worst is browsing web sites with chrome - I can flick to scroll up and there almost seems to be a second delay sometimes. I've never experienced anything like that before. Also when when using apps such as twitter, amazon, ebay, ect, the scrolling is really bad - Worse than my Zenfone 2.
Again, I've fastboot flash'd the complete stock rom multiple times, tried various kernels\modded roms, ect. They all display this behavior, some worse than others.
I love the size, screen quality, and build of this phone, but for a phone that's last year's Google flagship, I find the performance horrible.
Try turn off animations anyway, you don't have to be rooted, unlocked, yust tap build number 7 times, back to settings/ developer options and put to 0 trazitions, animations,animator..and optionally reboot.
smokinjoe2122 said:
Well, mine is mostly related to the jank when scrolling through applications. The UI, keyboard, ect all works fine. However, The worst is browsing web sites with chrome - I can flick to scroll up and there almost seems to be a second delay sometimes. I've never experienced anything like that before. Also when when using apps such as twitter, amazon, ebay, ect, the scrolling is really bad - Worse than my Zenfone 2.
Again, I've fastboot flash'd the complete stock rom multiple times, tried various kernels\modded roms, ect. They all display this behavior, some worse than others.
I love the size, screen quality, and build of this phone, but for a phone that's last year's Google flagship, I find the performance horrible.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Have to say, I have none of those issues as someone else also stated. If it does the same on stock, it might be hardware related. How does the phone behave in recovery? Is scrolling as normal? What recovery are you using? And when you say you went back to stock, did you do a complete factory reset including deleting all your personal data? If so, you can also try re-locking your bootloader and unlocking it and then flash factory image from Google. That will also erase everything off your device, including personal data.
With thousands of people here on XDA using a Nexus 6, your issue seems to be specific to you and your device. Maybe it is a screen/digitizer issue.
Seemed to me the February build was slow and janky but the the March was back to normal performance for me, op didn't state what build you were on. Might be an option
holeindalip said:
Seemed to me the February build was slow and janky but the the March was back to normal performance for me, op didn't state what build you were on. Might be an option
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm on the March build. I usually fastboot flash every img myself, then do a factory reset in recovery when trying to get back to stock..This time I just used the Flash-All.bat for the March image and I'll do some testing. I doubt this method is the difference, I'm grasping at straws. I'm semi concerned now if no one else is having these issues...Or maybe my expectations are just too high.
Perhaps I'll try a screen recording app and see if I can capture what I'm running into. It's not all apps, and it's not all the time, but its definitely noticeable.
you're not alone. i recently picked up a ZTE zmax 2 and did a side by side app load speed test. the ZTE zmax 2 loaded up youtube noticeably faster, had thumbnails faster, and played faster when clicking play. the zmax 2 is a midrange ATT phone with Snapdragon 410, 2gb ram, 720p screen. it costs $99 at best buy today..
I've noticed this too between my Nexus 6 (purchased 4/2015) and my wife's Nexus 6 (purchased 10/2015). Hers is noticeably smoother.
I do have occasional screen tearing on mine when I use certain kernel/ROMs, so maybe it's janky hardware.
Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk
I know the frustration, for me it is kernel related, but we cant do nothing, we need new device tree by google. I'm really disappointed that g3 has QHD screen with 801 and is smoother than nexus 6 with 805
fedef12evo said:
I know the frustration, for me it is kernel related, but we cant do nothing, we need new device tree by google. I'm really disappointed that g3 has QHD screen with 801 and is smoother than nexus 6 with 805
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My wifey has a G3 and I can't agree. When she is using my phone, she is always amazed how fluid it is.
derdjango said:
My wifey has a G3 and I can't agree. When she is using my phone, she is always amazed how fluid it is.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Is your wife g3 on 6.0 marshmellow?
Flashing stock over again really didn't do much for performance. I Did however root it, and increase the GPU clock (Actually set it to performance idles at 300mhz then shoots to 600hmz), and that does seem to help. I can sacrifice battery for better performance in this instance.
Have to agree, at around the end of the day (by 40% battery) my phone slows down. I went pure stock. A quick reboot fixes it. But a tad frustrating